Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD

[John Doe]

Anybody else consider the possibility that periodically moving the
swap file on an SSD might help prolong its life while reaping the
benefit of an SSD swapfile?

In other words... Instead of putting the swap file on a conventional
drive, keep it on your SSD. Every once in a while, but just the swap
file so that Windows moves it to another location. You can do that
easily enough by deleting the swap file and then copying files to
intrude on that former swap file space. Then you have Windows make
another swapfile in a different location.

[Rene Lamontagne[_2_]]

On 1/17/2013 11:49 AM, John Doe wrote:
> Anybody else consider the possibility that periodically moving the
> swap file on an SSD might help prolong its life while reaping the
> benefit of an SSD swapfile?
>
> In other words... Instead of putting the swap file on a conventional
> drive, keep it on your SSD. Every once in a while, but just the swap
> file so that Windows moves it to another location. You can do that
> easily enough by deleting the swap file and then copying files to
> intrude on that former swap file space. Then you have Windows make
> another swapfile in a different location.
>


My Swapfile is on my D: spin drive, Always has been, always will be.
My SSD will die one day in the future Then I will buy a new one.
Just can't waste time worrying about minor possibilities.

Rene

[John Doe]

Rene Lamontagne <klamont shaw.ca> wrote:

> John Doe wrote:

>> Anybody else consider the possibility that periodically moving
>> the swap file on an SSD might help prolong its life while
>> reaping the benefit of an SSD swapfile?
>>
>> In other words... Instead of putting the swap file on a
>> conventional drive, keep it on your SSD. Every once in a while,
>> but just the swap file so that Windows moves it to another
>> location. You can do that easily enough by deleting the swap
>> file and then copying files to intrude on that former swap file
>> space. Then you have Windows make another swapfile in a
>> different location.
>>
>
>
> My Swapfile is on my D: spin drive, Always has been, always will
> be.

And what is the benefit of that.

> My SSD will die one day in the future Then I will buy a new
> one.
> Just can't waste time worrying about minor possibilities.

Fine, but my post is meant for technically oriented users. You
know, people who enjoy making the most out of their systems. If
you are computer illiterate, you should stick to asking questions.

--









>
> Rene
>
>
>
>

> Path: eternal-september.org!mx04.eternal-september.org!
feeder.eternal-september.org!news.bbs-scene.org!
border4.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border2.nntp.dca.gig anews.com!
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newsfe02.iad.POSTED!not-for-mail
> From: Rene Lamontagne <klamont shaw.ca>
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>

[Andy Burns[_2_]]

John Doe wrote:
> Anybody else consider the possibility that periodically moving the
> swap file on an SSD might help prolong its life while reaping the
> benefit of an SSD swapfile?
>
> In other words... Instead of putting the swap file on a conventional
> drive, keep it on your SSD. Every once in a while, but just the swap
> file so that Windows moves it to another location. You can do that
> easily enough by deleting the swap file and then copying files to
> intrude on that former swap file space. Then you have Windows make
> another swapfile in a different location

There's no point to deleting and re-creating the swap file like that, as
the SSD is written to (whether for swap or for general writes) the
sectors get moved about behind the scenes anyway ... search for
wear-levelling for more information

[Rene Lamontagne[_2_]]

On 1/17/2013 1:31 PM, John Doe wrote:
> Rene Lamontagne <klamont shaw.ca> wrote:
>
>> John Doe wrote:
>
>>> Anybody else consider the possibility that periodically moving
>>> the swap file on an SSD might help prolong its life while
>>> reaping the benefit of an SSD swapfile?
>>>
>>> In other words... Instead of putting the swap file on a
>>> conventional drive, keep it on your SSD. Every once in a while,
>>> but just the swap file so that Windows moves it to another
>>> location. You can do that easily enough by deleting the swap
>>> file and then copying files to intrude on that former swap file
>>> space. Then you have Windows make another swapfile in a
>>> different location.
>>>
>>
>>
>> My Swapfile is on my D: spin drive, Always has been, always will
>> be.
>
> And what is the benefit of that.
>
>> My SSD will die one day in the future Then I will buy a new
>> one.
>> Just can't waste time worrying about minor possibilities.
>
> Fine, but my post is meant for technically oriented users. You
> know, people who enjoy making the most out of their systems. If
> you are computer illiterate, you should stick to asking questions.
>


Question? No I won't waste my time with you.

Rene

[Andy Burns[_2_]]

John Doe wrote:

> Rene Lamontagne <klamont shaw.ca> wrote:
>
>> Just can't waste time worrying about minor possibilities.
>
> Fine, but my post is meant for technically oriented users.

Quite frankly, all technically oriented users will have laughed at your
nonsense suggestion.

[John Doe]

Try finding discussion of whether (pagefile.sys) is manipulated by
SSD wear leveling, and then get back to me about being technically
oriented. Until then, consider yourself a troll...

--

Andy Burns <usenet.jan2013 adslpipe.co.uk> wrote:

> Path: eternal-september.org!mx04.eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!border3.nntp.ams.giganews.com!Xl.tag s.giganews.com!border1.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp. giganews.com!local2.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp.bri ghtview.co.uk!news.brightview.co.uk.POSTED!not-for-mail
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>
> John Doe wrote:
>
>> Rene Lamontagne <klamont shaw.ca> wrote:
>>
>>> Just can't waste time worrying about minor possibilities.
>>
>> Fine, but my post is meant for technically oriented users.
>
> Quite frankly, all technically oriented users will have laughed at your
> nonsense suggestion.
>
>
>

[John Doe]

Anybody who's done any reading about SSDs knows about wear
leveling. But as any technically inclined user knows, an algorithm
doesn't always cover every base. The (pagefile.sys) is different
from practically every other file in Windows. I have searched
hard, but not found anything conclusive or authoritative about an
SSD handling (pagefile.sys).

--

Andy Burns <usenet.jan2013 adslpipe.co.uk> wrote:

> Path: eternal-september.org!mx04.eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!border3.nntp.ams.giganews.com!Xl.tag s.giganews.com!border1.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp. giganews.com!local2.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp.bri ghtview.co.uk!news.brightview.co.uk.POSTED!not-for-mail
> NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2013 13:35:52 -0600
> Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2013 19:35:53 +0000
> From: Andy Burns <usenet.jan2013 adslpipe.co.uk>
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>
> John Doe wrote:
>> Anybody else consider the possibility that periodically moving the
>> swap file on an SSD might help prolong its life while reaping the
>> benefit of an SSD swapfile?
>>
>> In other words... Instead of putting the swap file on a conventional
>> drive, keep it on your SSD. Every once in a while, but just the swap
>> file so that Windows moves it to another location. You can do that
>> easily enough by deleting the swap file and then copying files to
>> intrude on that former swap file space. Then you have Windows make
>> another swapfile in a different location
>
> There's no point to deleting and re-creating the swap file like that, as
> the SSD is written to (whether for swap or for general writes) the
> sectors get moved about behind the scenes anyway ... search for
> wear-levelling for more information
>
>

[Zaphod Beeblebrox]

On Thu, 17 Jan 2013 20:40:48 +0000 (UTC), "John Doe"
> wrote in article <kd9nkf$u0b$1@dont-
email.me>...

Extraneous newsgroups snipped.

>
> Try finding discussion of whether (pagefile.sys) is manipulated by
> SSD wear leveling, and then get back to me about being technically
> oriented.

Any file writes are handled by wear leveling since wear leveling is
handled at the SSD firmware level so *any* file write is seen the same
by the SSD.

> Until then, consider yourself a troll...

Pot, meet kettle.

--
Zaphod

The secret of flying is to hurl yourself to the ground, and miss.

[Zaphod Beeblebrox]

On Thu, 17 Jan 2013 20:43:59 +0000 (UTC), "John Doe"
> wrote in article <kd9nqe$u0b$2@dont-
email.me>...
>
> Anybody who's done any reading about SSDs knows about wear
> leveling. But as any technically inclined user knows, an algorithm
> doesn't always cover every base. The (pagefile.sys) is different
> from practically every other file in Windows. I have searched
> hard, but not found anything conclusive or authoritative about an
> SSD handling (pagefile.sys).

That's because (as any technically inclined user knows) pagefile.sys is
a file. To the storage medium, a file is a file, no matter what
purpose the OS puts it to. Wear leveling is done in the SSD firmware,
which sees any file write the same as any other so wear leveling
applies.

--
Zaphod

"Yeah. Listen, I'm Zaphod Beeblebrox, my father was Zaphod Beeblebrox
the Second, my grandfather Zaphod Beeblebrox the Third..."

"What?"

"There was an accident with a contraceptive and a time machine. Now
concentrate!"

[Brandon Staggs]

"John Doe" wrote on Thu, 17 Jan 2013 20:43:59 +0000 (UTC):

> Anybody who's done any reading about SSDs knows about wear
> leveling. But as any technically inclined user knows, an algorithm
> doesn't always cover every base. The (pagefile.sys) is different
> from practically every other file in Windows. I have searched
> hard, but not found anything conclusive or authoritative about an
> SSD handling (pagefile.sys).

Wear leveling is done on firmware level. Your pagefile is just more
sectors on the SSD. There absolutely zero benefit to managing this
yourself. I certainly wouldn't waste time messing with the page file
on the remote possibility that my SSD is defective and not doing its
own wear leveling.

--
Brandon Staggs
http://www.brandonstaggs.com

[John Doe]

Firmware shmirmware. Back when I bought an IBM PC, using some
instruction from a Peter Norton book and the C programming
language, I wrote directly to video memory. The operating system
deals directly with hardware drivers. Just because wear leveling
is done by firmware, doesn't mean it does it all.

--

Zaphod Beeblebrox <Zaphod.Arisztid.Beeblebrox gmail.com> wrote:

> Path: eternal-september.org!mx04.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
> From: Zaphod Beeblebrox <Zaphod.Arisztid.Beeblebrox gmail.com>
> Newsgroups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-8
> Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
> Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2013 16:12:19 -0500
> Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
> Lines: 27
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>
> On Thu, 17 Jan 2013 20:43:59 +0000 (UTC), "John Doe"
> <jdoe usenetlove.invalid> wrote in article <kd9nqe$u0b$2 dont-
> email.me>...
>>
>> Anybody who's done any reading about SSDs knows about wear
>> leveling. But as any technically inclined user knows, an algorithm
>> doesn't always cover every base. The (pagefile.sys) is different
>> from practically every other file in Windows. I have searched
>> hard, but not found anything conclusive or authoritative about an
>> SSD handling (pagefile.sys).
>
> That's because (as any technically inclined user knows) pagefile.sys is
> a file. To the storage medium, a file is a file, no matter what
> purpose the OS puts it to. Wear leveling is done in the SSD firmware,
> which sees any file write the same as any other so wear leveling
> applies.
>
> --
> Zaphod
>
> "Yeah. Listen, I'm Zaphod Beeblebrox, my father was Zaphod Beeblebrox
> the Second, my grandfather Zaphod Beeblebrox the Third..."
>
> "What?"
>
> "There was an accident with a contraceptive and a time machine. Now
> concentrate!"
>

[Andy Burns[_2_]]

John Doe wrote:

> Anybody who's done any reading about SSDs knows about wear
> leveling. But as any technically inclined user knows, an algorithm
> doesn't always cover every base. The (pagefile.sys) is different
> from practically every other file in Windows.

The SSD doesn't know or care about files, all it cares about are
sectors. Whenever a sector is written, wear-levelling can happen,
regardless of whether the sector is part of a page file, a normal file,
filesystem metadata or just random raw writes to the device.

> I have searched hard, but not found anything conclusive or
> authoritative about an SSD handling (pagefile.sys).

Have fun looking, you're wasting your time.

[John Doe]

If this were a waste of time, it wouldn't generate so much
interest. I seriously doubt this thing really knows what it's
talking about...

--

Andy Burns <usenet.jan2013 adslpipe.co.uk> wrote:

> Path: eternal-september.org!mx04.eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!border3.nntp.ams.giganews.com!Xl.tag s.giganews.com!border1.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp. giganews.com!local2.nntp.ams.giganews.com!nntp.bri ghtview.co.uk!news.brightview.co.uk.POSTED!not-for-mail
> NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2013 16:00:33 -0600
> Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2013 22:00:34 +0000
> From: Andy Burns <usenet.jan2013 adslpipe.co.uk>
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> Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
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>
> John Doe wrote:
>
>> Anybody who's done any reading about SSDs knows about wear
>> leveling. But as any technically inclined user knows, an algorithm
>> doesn't always cover every base. The (pagefile.sys) is different
>> from practically every other file in Windows.
>
> The SSD doesn't know or care about files, all it cares about are
> sectors. Whenever a sector is written, wear-levelling can happen,
> regardless of whether the sector is part of a page file, a normal file,
> filesystem metadata or just random raw writes to the device.
>
>> I have searched hard, but not found anything conclusive or
>> authoritative about an SSD handling (pagefile.sys).
>
> Have fun looking, you're wasting your time.
>
>
>

[Brandon Staggs]

"John Doe" wrote on Thu, 17 Jan 2013 21:59:55 +0000 (UTC):

> Just because wear leveling
> is done by firmware, doesn't mean it does it all.

Actually that's exactly what it means. Instead of just guessing, why
not look up "static wear leveling" and read about it? Don't waste
your time deleting and moving files in hopes that you will by accident
do something better than your SSD is designed to do on purpose and by
default.

Look at it this way: let's say you have an almost-full SSD with a PE
cycle limit of 10,000 (to pick a number), how many times do you think
you have to "move" your page file to effectively handle wear leveling
on your own over, say, three years?

--
Brandon Staggs
http://www.brandonstaggs.com

[John Doe]

I did with this troll said, I searched for

"static wear leveling" "pagefile.sys"

And received a total of four results, none of them useful.

I wonder why so much interest from the UK.

--

Brandon Staggs <nospam nowhere.invalid> wrote:

> Path: eternal-september.org!mx04.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
> From: Brandon Staggs <nospam nowhere.invalid>
> Newsgroups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-8,free.UseNet,free.spam,free.spirit
> Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
> Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2013 18:21:23 -0600
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>
> "John Doe" wrote on Thu, 17 Jan 2013 21:59:55 +0000 (UTC):
>
>> Just because wear leveling
>> is done by firmware, doesn't mean it does it all.
>
> Actually that's exactly what it means. Instead of just guessing, why
> not look up "static wear leveling" and read about it? Don't waste
> your time deleting and moving files in hopes that you will by accident
> do something better than your SSD is designed to do on purpose and by
> default.
>
> Look at it this way: let's say you have an almost-full SSD with a PE
> cycle limit of 10,000 (to pick a number), how many times do you think
> you have to "move" your page file to effectively handle wear leveling
> on your own over, say, three years?
>
> --
> Brandon Staggs
> http://www.brandonstaggs.com
>
>

[Mike Tomlinson]

>On 1/17/2013 1:31 PM, John Doe wrote:
>If
>> you are computer illiterate, you should stick to asking questions.

That's why you ask so many questions, then. Even the same question in
two threads, starting the second thread because you didn't like the
answers you were given in the first. You're clueless.

--
(\_/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

[John Doe]

some troll

Mike Tomlinson <mike jasper.org.uk> wrote:

> Path: eternal-september.org!mx04.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
> From: Mike Tomlinson >
> Newsgroups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-8
> Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
> Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2013 06:40:05 +0000
> Organization: The Pub
> Lines: 13
> Message-ID: >
> References: > > > >
> Mime-Version: 1.0
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>
>
>>On 1/17/2013 1:31 PM, John Doe wrote:
>>If
>>> you are computer illiterate, you should stick to asking questions.
>
> That's why you ask so many questions, then. Even the same question in
> two threads, starting the second thread because you didn't like the
> answers you were given in the first. You're clueless.
>
> --
> (\_/)
> (='.'=)
> (")_(")
>
>

[DevilsPGD[_4_]]

In the last episode of >, John Doe
> said:

>some troll

And now you've forgotten how to quote. That's special.

--
The nice thing about standards, there is enough for everyone to have their own.

[John Doe]

Silly troll

--

DevilsPGD <boogabooga crazyhat.net> wrote:

> Path: eternal-september.org!mx04.eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!feeder.erje.net!eu.feeder.erje.net!n ews-1.dfn.de!news.dfn.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
> From: DevilsPGD <boogabooga crazyhat.net>
> Newsgroups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-8,free.UseNet,free.spam,free.spirit
> Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
> Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2013 23:56:51 -0800
> Organization: Disorganized
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>
> In the last episode of <kdasib$s0k$1 dont-email.me>, John Doe
> <jdoe usenetlove.invalid> said:
>
>>some troll
>
> And now you've forgotten how to quote. That's special.
>
> --
> The nice thing about standards, there is enough for everyone to have their own.
>
>

[Brandon Staggs]

"John Doe" wrote on Fri, 18 Jan 2013 02:22:11 +0000 (UTC):

> I did with this troll said, I searched for
>
> "static wear leveling" "pagefile.sys"

You don't get it. pagefile.sys is just more data on your drive. Why
would you expect your SSD to treat it differently than all of the
other data it automatically manages?

--
Brandon Staggs
http://www.brandonstaggs.com

[Mike Tomlinson]

En el artículo >, Brandon
Staggs > escribió:

>You don't get it.

Quite.

--
(\_/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

[Zaphod Beeblebrox]

On Thu, 17 Jan 2013 21:59:55 +0000 (UTC), "John Doe"
> wrote in article <kd9s8q$rje$1@dont-
email.me>...

Stripped extraneous newsgroups - again...

>
> Firmware shmirmware. Back when I bought an IBM PC, using some
> instruction from a Peter Norton book and the C programming
> language, I wrote directly to video memory. The operating system
> deals directly with hardware drivers. Just because wear leveling
> is done by firmware, doesn't mean it does it all.

OS talks to drivers, drivers talk to, wait for it, the firmware. In
the case of SSD wear leveling, it is all done by the firmware which is
*the only way you can write to the disk* so it handles it for *all
writes to disk*. Get a clue, man. Google SSD wear leveling *without*
throwing in your precious pagefile.sys term and read, and learn.

--
Zaphod

If I had two heads like you, Zaphod,
I could have hours of fun banging them against a wall.
-Ford Prefect

[Mark F[_3_]]

On Fri, 18 Jan 2013 06:56:27 -0600, Brandon Staggs
> wrote:

> "John Doe" wrote on Fri, 18 Jan 2013 02:22:11 +0000 (UTC):
>
> > I did with this troll said, I searched for
> >
> > "static wear leveling" "pagefile.sys"
>
> You don't get it. pagefile.sys is just more data on your drive. Why
> would you expect your SSD to treat it differently than all of the
> other data it automatically manages?
I don't think that any SSD handle page files or swap files or
hibernation files in any special way, but it is possible that an
operating system could use a TRIM operation to say that the current
contents of the file didn't matter before each time such a file
was opened for its normal use. [I'm not saying that this would
improve performance, but the idea might be used as a basis for
improved performance and it does ensure that normal access to the
SSD, even by privileged programs, couldn't see old data that was
in the various files.]

[Mark F[_3_]]

On 1/17/2013 1:31 PM, John Doe wrote in part:
> Rene Lamontagne <klamont shaw.ca> wrote:
>
>> John Doe wrote:
....
>
>>> Anybody else consider the possibility that periodically moving
>>> the swap file on an SSD might help prolong its life while
>>> reaping the benefit of an SSD swapfile?
>>>
>>> In other words... Instead of putting the swap file on a
>>> conventional drive, keep it on your SSD. Every once in a while,
>>> but just the swap file so that Windows moves it to another
>>> location...
Seems like the numbers now-a-days are such that the operating system
should schedule paging file writes in multiples of a few MB to match
the erase size ("page") of the SSD, rather than ignoring the SSD
characteristics completely or typically using sizes closer to the
write site of the SSD ("block"), which might 8KB.

If this were how the OS "paging" was handled, then the normal
garbage collection would probably be able to run faster.

[John Doe]

I think we can stop kicking a dead horse already.

Don't post something as if you knew, when in fact
yours was pure speculation.

--

Brandon Staggs <nospam nowhere.invalid> wrote:

> Path: eternal-september.org!mx04.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
> From: Brandon Staggs <nospam nowhere.invalid>
> Newsgroups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-8,free.UseNet,free.spam,free.spirit
> Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
> Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2013 06:56:27 -0600
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>
> "John Doe" wrote on Fri, 18 Jan 2013 02:22:11 +0000 (UTC):
>
>> I did with this troll said, I searched for
>>
>> "static wear leveling" "pagefile.sys"
>
> You don't get it. pagefile.sys is just more data on your drive. Why
> would you expect your SSD to treat it differently than all of the
> other data it automatically manages?
>
> --
> Brandon Staggs
> http://www.brandonstaggs.com
>
>

[John Doe]

Kicking a dead horse, as if it's Luddite speculation
was sure to be fact...

--

Zaphod Beeblebrox <Zaphod.Arisztid.Beeblebrox gmail.com> wrote:

> Path: eternal-september.org!mx04.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
> From: Zaphod Beeblebrox <Zaphod.Arisztid.Beeblebrox gmail.com>
> Newsgroups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-8
> Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
> Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2013 09:29:03 -0500
> Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
> Lines: 25
> Message-ID: <MPG.2b632636b92f15399897fd news.eternal-september.org>
> References: <kd9dje$i8m$1 dont-email.me> <caidnUDv9eUFz2XNnZ2dnUVZ8jGdnZ2d brightview.co.uk> <kd9nqe$u0b$2 dont-email.me> <MPG.2b62333ef08288969897fc news.eternal-september.org> <kd9s8q$rje$1 dont-email.me>
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>
> On Thu, 17 Jan 2013 21:59:55 +0000 (UTC), "John Doe"
> <jdoe usenetlove.invalid> wrote in article <kd9s8q$rje$1 dont-
> email.me>...
>
> Stripped extraneous newsgroups - again...
>
>>
>> Firmware shmirmware. Back when I bought an IBM PC, using some
>> instruction from a Peter Norton book and the C programming
>> language, I wrote directly to video memory. The operating system
>> deals directly with hardware drivers. Just because wear leveling
>> is done by firmware, doesn't mean it does it all.
>
> OS talks to drivers, drivers talk to, wait for it, the firmware. In
> the case of SSD wear leveling, it is all done by the firmware which is
> *the only way you can write to the disk* so it handles it for *all
> writes to disk*. Get a clue, man. Google SSD wear leveling *without*
> throwing in your precious pagefile.sys term and read, and learn.
>
> --
> Zaphod
>
> If I had two heads like you, Zaphod,
> I could have hours of fun banging them against a wall.
> -Ford Prefect
>
>

[Gene E. Bloch[_2_]]

On Fri, 18 Jan 2013 09:29:03 -0500, Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:

> On Thu, 17 Jan 2013 21:59:55 +0000 (UTC), "John Doe"
> > wrote in article <kd9s8q$rje$1@dont-
> email.me>...
>
> Stripped extraneous newsgroups - again...
>
>>
>> Firmware shmirmware. Back when I bought an IBM PC, using some
>> instruction from a Peter Norton book and the C programming
>> language, I wrote directly to video memory. The operating system
>> deals directly with hardware drivers. Just because wear leveling
>> is done by firmware, doesn't mean it does it all.
>
> OS talks to drivers, drivers talk to, wait for it, the firmware. In
> the case of SSD wear leveling, it is all done by the firmware which is
> *the only way you can write to the disk* so it handles it for *all
> writes to disk*. Get a clue, man. Google SSD wear leveling *without*
> throwing in your precious pagefile.sys term and read, and learn.

Nice try, but those last three words will not work :-)

--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)

[Zaphod Beeblebrox]

On Fri, 18 Jan 2013 11:24:00 -0800, "Gene E. Bloch" <not-
> wrote in article <31dmfk94gnsz
>...
>
> On Fri, 18 Jan 2013 09:29:03 -0500, Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:
>
> > On Thu, 17 Jan 2013 21:59:55 +0000 (UTC), "John Doe"
> > > wrote in article <kd9s8q$rje$1@dont-
> > email.me>...
> >
> > Stripped extraneous newsgroups - again...
> >
> >>
> >> Firmware shmirmware. Back when I bought an IBM PC, using some
> >> instruction from a Peter Norton book and the C programming
> >> language, I wrote directly to video memory. The operating system
> >> deals directly with hardware drivers. Just because wear leveling
> >> is done by firmware, doesn't mean it does it all.
> >
> > OS talks to drivers, drivers talk to, wait for it, the firmware. In
> > the case of SSD wear leveling, it is all done by the firmware which is
> > *the only way you can write to the disk* so it handles it for *all
> > writes to disk*. Get a clue, man. Google SSD wear leveling *without*
> > throwing in your precious pagefile.sys term and read, and learn.
>
> Nice try, but those last three words will not work :-)

Yup, got that. I'm done here.

--
Zaphod

Adventurer, ex-hippie, good-timer (crook? quite possibly),
manic self-publicist, terrible bad at personal relationships,
often thought to be completely out to lunch.

[John Doe]

Any usefulness this thing's speculation might have had is passé,
replaced with opinions from people who are much smarter and more
experienced.

--

"Gene E. Bloch" <not-me other.invalid> wrote:

> Path: eternal-september.org!mx04.eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!feeder.erje.net!eu.feeder.erje.net!n ews-1.dfn.de!news.dfn.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
> From: "Gene E. Bloch" <not-me other.invalid>
> Newsgroups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-8
> Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
> Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2013 11:24:00 -0800
> Organization: Astrolabe
> Lines: 25
> Message-ID: <31dmfk94gnsz$.dlg stumbler1907.invalid>
> References: <kd9dje$i8m$1 dont-email.me> <caidnUDv9eUFz2XNnZ2dnUVZ8jGdnZ2d brightview.co.uk> <kd9nqe$u0b$2 dont-email.me> <MPG.2b62333ef08288969897fc news.eternal-september.org> <kd9s8q$rje$1 dont-email.me> <MPG.2b632636b92f15399897fd news.eternal-september.org>
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> On Fri, 18 Jan 2013 09:29:03 -0500, Zaphod Beeblebrox wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 17 Jan 2013 21:59:55 +0000 (UTC), "John Doe"
>> <jdoe usenetlove.invalid> wrote in article <kd9s8q$rje$1 dont-
>> email.me>...
>>
>> Stripped extraneous newsgroups - again...
>>
>>>
>>> Firmware shmirmware. Back when I bought an IBM PC, using some
>>> instruction from a Peter Norton book and the C programming
>>> language, I wrote directly to video memory. The operating system
>>> deals directly with hardware drivers. Just because wear leveling
>>> is done by firmware, doesn't mean it does it all.
>>
>> OS talks to drivers, drivers talk to, wait for it, the firmware. In
>> the case of SSD wear leveling, it is all done by the firmware which is
>> *the only way you can write to the disk* so it handles it for *all
>> writes to disk*. Get a clue, man. Google SSD wear leveling *without*
>> throwing in your precious pagefile.sys term and read, and learn.
>
> Nice try, but those last three words will not work :-)
>
> --
> Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)
>

[Gene E. Bloch[_2_]]

On Sat, 19 Jan 2013 00:24:01 +0000 (UTC), John Doe wrote:

> Any usefulness this thing's speculation might have had is passé,
> replaced with opinions from people who are much smarter and more
> experienced.

This poster needs to learn how to post. He put his whole reply after his
sig delimiter, which is why it was automatically greyed out in my
newsreader and also why it automatically disappeared in my reply. He
also seems to have changed fonts to something pretty much unreadable,
but I fixed that.

I also followed ZB's lead in limiting the crossposting.

As for this poster's opinion, I smile wryly :-)

--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)

[John Doe]

"Gene E. Bloch" <not-me other.invalid> wrote:

> John Doe wrote:
>
>> Any usefulness this thing's speculation might have had is
>> pass‚, replaced with opinions from people who are much smarter
>> and more experienced.
>
> This poster needs to learn how to post.

Says a complete newbie.

> He put his whole reply after his sig delimiter,

Wrong. I put this thing's whole reply after my signature
delimiter.

> which is why it was automatically greyed out in my newsreader
> and also why it automatically disappeared in my reply.

It wasn't worth reading.

> He also seems to have changed fonts to something pretty much
> unreadable, but I fixed that.

That's just naïve. Nobody with any experience using a computer on
the Internet would suggest that. Your client determines your font.
Something like that might have to do with encoding, but it has
nothing to do with me.

If you need help with posting, or help with understanding other
people's posts, ask in an appropriate group.

--











> I also followed ZB's lead in limiting the crossposting.
>
> As for this poster's opinion, I smile wryly :-)
>
> --
> Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)
>

> Path: eternal-september.org!mx04.eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!newsfeed101.telia.com!starscream.dk. telia.net!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
> From: "Gene E. Bloch" <not-me other.invalid>
> Newsgroups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-8
> Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
> Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2013 17:05:04 -0800
> Organization: Astrolabe
> Lines: 18
> Message-ID: <1fu9l48p7iimd$.dlg stumbler1907.invalid>
> References: <kd9dje$i8m$1 dont-email.me> <caidnUDv9eUFz2XNnZ2dnUVZ8jGdnZ2d brightview.co.uk> <kd9nqe$u0b$2 dont-email.me> <MPG.2b62333ef08288969897fc news.eternal-september.org> <kd9s8q$rje$1 dont-email.me> <MPG.2b632636b92f15399897fd news.eternal-september.org> <31dmfk94gnsz$.dlg stumbler1907.invalid> <kdcp31$lp4$1 dont-email.me>
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[Gene E. Bloch[_2_]]

On Sat, 19 Jan 2013 01:51:00 +0000 (UTC), John Doe wrote:

> "Gene E. Bloch" <not-me other.invalid> wrote:
>
>> John Doe wrote:
>>
>>> Any usefulness this thing's speculation might have had is
>>> pass‚, replaced with opinions from people who are much smarter
>>> and more experienced.
>>
>> This poster needs to learn how to post.
>
> Says a complete newbie.
>
>> He put his whole reply after his sig delimiter,
>
> Wrong. I put this thing's whole reply after my signature
> delimiter.
>
>> which is why it was automatically greyed out in my newsreader
>> and also why it automatically disappeared in my reply.
>
> It wasn't worth reading.
>
>> He also seems to have changed fonts to something pretty much
>> unreadable, but I fixed that.
>
> That's just naîµ¥. Nobody with any experience using a computer on
> the Internet would suggest that. Your client determines your font.
> Something like that might have to do with encoding, but it has
> nothing to do with me.
>
> If you need help with posting, or help with understanding other
> people's posts, ask in an appropriate group.

My earlier impressions of you in this NG were not totally positive.
Finally, though, things have changed.

--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)

[Nil[_2_]]

On 18 Jan 2013, John Doe > wrote in
alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt:

> I think we can stop kicking a dead horse already.

Oh, my God - did he really say that, after what he himself said earlier
in this very thread??

> Don't post something as if you knew, when in fact
> yours was pure speculation.

Oh, my God - did he really say that, after what he himself said earlier
in this very thread??

[Nil[_2_]]

On 18 Jan 2013, "Gene E. Bloch" > wrote in
alt.comp.os.windows-8:

> My earlier impressions of you in this NG were not totally positive.
> Finally, though, things have changed.

What took you so long? I think most people realized it months or years
ago.

[John Doe]

Nil <rednoise REMOVETHIScomcast.net> wrote:

> "Gene E. Bloch" <not-me other.invalid> wrote
>
>> My earlier impressions of you in this NG were not totally
>> positive. Finally, though, things have changed.
>
> What took you so long?

Not that it matters, but... Now your impressions of me are totally
positive, Nildo?

> I think most people realized it months or years ago.

Realized that you are a regular troll, Nildo.

--











> Path: eternal-september.org!mx04.eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!feeder.erje.net!eu.feeder.erje.net!n ews-1.dfn.de!news.dfn.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
> From: Nil <rednoise REMOVETHIScomcast.net>
> Newsgroups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-8
> Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
> Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2013 21:36:22 -0500
> Organization: (?!)
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> Xref: mx04.eternal-september.org alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt:25886 alt.comp.os.windows-8:2943
>

[John Doe]

Looks like a Nildo is on a drunken trolling spree...

--

Changed the follow-up groups
Nil <rednoise REMOVETHIScomcast.net> wrote:

> Path: eternal-september.org!mx04.eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!news.unit0.net!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
> From: Nil <rednoise REMOVETHIScomcast.net>
> Newsgroups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-8
> Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
> Followup-To: alt.comp.os.windows-8
> Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2013 21:35:52 -0500
> Organization: (?!)
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> Xref: mx04.eternal-september.org alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt:25885 alt.comp.os.windows-8:2942
>
> On 18 Jan 2013, John Doe <jdoe usenetlove.invalid> wrote in
> alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt:
>
>> I think we can stop kicking a dead horse already.
>
> Oh, my God - did he really say that, after what he himself said earlier
> in this very thread??
>
>> Don't post something as if you knew, when in fact
>> yours was pure speculation.
>
> Oh, my God - did he really say that, after what he himself said earlier
> in this very thread??
>
>

[John Doe]

Zaphod Beeblebrox <Zaphod.Arisztid.Beeblebrox gmail.com> wrote:

> Get a clue, man. Google SSD wear leveling *without* throwing in
> your precious pagefile.sys term and read, and learn.

Or maybe you should get a clue, and realize that I already have a
clue, by searching the UseNet archive for my e-mail ID and (SSD
"wear leveling"). Hindsight is 20-20. Some of the speculators can
pretend that they knew it all, bolstered by looking at the more
intelligent and experienced posters' replies. My research of wear
leveling shows that at one point it was done above the firmware
level. So stop pretending that you know it all.

--










>
> --
> Zaphod
>
> If I had two heads like you, Zaphod,
> I could have hours of fun banging them against a wall.
> -Ford Prefect
>

> Path: eternal-september.org!mx04.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
> From: Zaphod Beeblebrox <Zaphod.Arisztid.Beeblebrox gmail.com>
> Newsgroups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-8
> Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
> Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2013 09:29:03 -0500
> Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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>

[Gene E. Bloch[_2_]]

On Fri, 18 Jan 2013 21:36:22 -0500, Nil wrote:

> On 18 Jan 2013, "Gene E. Bloch" > wrote in
> alt.comp.os.windows-8:
>
>> My earlier impressions of you in this NG were not totally positive.
>> Finally, though, things have changed.
>
> What took you so long? I think most people realized it months or years
> ago.

I only became aware of him recently, but mostly, I was having fun
wording my remark that way :-)

Now I get to read his reply to the above. I can wait. Oops. I meant
*hardly* wait.

--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)

[John Doe]

"Gene E. Bloch" <not-me other.invalid> wrote:

>> "Gene E. Bloch" <not-me other.invalid> wrote

>>> My earlier impressions of you in this NG were not totally
>>> positive. Finally, though, things have changed.

> I was having fun wording my remark that way :-)

It's simply gibberish, from the same half-literate troll that says
I'm responsible for how its fonts look...

--











>
> Now I get to read his reply to the above. I can wait. Oops. I meant
> *hardly* wait.
>
> --
> Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)
>
>

> Path: eternal-september.org!mx04.eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!feeder.erje.net!eu.feeder.erje.net!f u-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!individual.net!not-for-mail
> From: "Gene E. Bloch" <not-me other.invalid>
> Newsgroups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-8
> Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
> Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 13:33:13 -0800
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>

[Yousuf Khan[_2_]]

On 17/01/2013 12:49 PM, John Doe wrote:
> Anybody else consider the possibility that periodically moving the
> swap file on an SSD might help prolong its life while reaping the
> benefit of an SSD swapfile?

No, it's of no consequence.

> In other words... Instead of putting the swap file on a conventional
> drive, keep it on your SSD. Every once in a while, but just the swap
> file so that Windows moves it to another location. You can do that
> easily enough by deleting the swap file and then copying files to
> intrude on that former swap file space. Then you have Windows make
> another swapfile in a different location.

Absolutely no need. Though I agree there is no problem keeping the
swapfile on the SSD. But there is absolutely no need for you to "move"
the swapfile around, it's done automatically by the SSD itself whenever
a write happens on any portion of it. SSD's do not ever write to the
same cell consecutively. Cells that are marked dirty get put into a
reserve pool, where they are then reset in the background, ready to be
reused somewhere else at some point in the future.

Yousuf Khan

[Yousuf Khan[_2_]]

On 17/01/2013 3:43 PM, John Doe wrote:
> Anybody who's done any reading about SSDs knows about wear
> leveling. But as any technically inclined user knows, an algorithm
> doesn't always cover every base. The (pagefile.sys) is different
> from practically every other file in Windows. I have searched
> hard, but not found anything conclusive or authoritative about an
> SSD handling (pagefile.sys).

So the fact that there's no one else that's asking this question,
doesn't that clue you in that there's no issue here? You have convinced
yourself about the special "nature" of this one particular file, and
won't accept any answers that contradict your preconceived notions?

There is nothing special about the pagefile.sys below the OS level. At
the SSD hardware level this is just some more data, like anything else,
it doesn't treat it specially, in fact it doesn't even know how to treat
any files specially, that's too high-level for it to understand.

Yousuf Khan

[Yousuf Khan[_2_]]

On 17/01/2013 4:59 PM, John Doe wrote:
> Firmware shmirmware. Back when I bought an IBM PC, using some
> instruction from a Peter Norton book and the C programming
> language, I wrote directly to video memory. The operating system
> deals directly with hardware drivers. Just because wear leveling
> is done by firmware, doesn't mean it does it all.

Now you're just being a troll, believe what you want, I think you'll
find nobody will respond any further to you.

Yousuf Khan

[John Doe]

Drunk? Otherwise it might have noticed several of my posts already
acknowledging the opinions of more knowledgeable and experienced
posters...

--

Yousuf Khan <bbbl67 spammenot.yahoo.com> wrote:

> On 17/01/2013 3:43 PM, John Doe wrote:
>> Anybody who's done any reading about SSDs knows about wear
>> leveling. But as any technically inclined user knows, an algorithm
>> doesn't always cover every base. The (pagefile.sys) is different
>> from practically every other file in Windows. I have searched
>> hard, but not found anything conclusive or authoritative about an
>> SSD handling (pagefile.sys).
>
> So the fact that there's no one else that's asking this question,
> doesn't that clue you in that there's no issue here? You have convinced
> yourself about the special "nature" of this one particular file, and
> won't accept any answers that contradict your preconceived notions?
>
> There is nothing special about the pagefile.sys below the OS level. At
> the SSD hardware level this is just some more data, like anything else,
> it doesn't treat it specially, in fact it doesn't even know how to treat
> any files specially, that's too high-level for it to understand.
>
> Yousuf Khan
>

> Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2013 00:02:09 -0500
> From: Yousuf Khan <bbbl67 spammenot.yahoo.com>
> User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:9.0) Gecko/20111222 Thunderbird/9.0.1
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Newsgroups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-8
> Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
> References: <kd9dje$i8m$1 dont-email.me> <caidnUDv9eUFz2XNnZ2dnUVZ8jGdnZ2d brightview.co.uk> <kd9nqe$u0b$2 dont-email.me>
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> Xref: mx04.eternal-september.org alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt:25906 alt.comp.os.windows-8:2975
>

[John Doe]

In fact, I haven't said anything in this thread
to even suggest that my beliefs are unchangeable.
All of the posturing and chest thumping has come
from others, like this drunk...

--

Yousuf Khan <bbbl67 spammenot.yahoo.com> wrote:

> Path: eternal-september.org!mx04.eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!news.glorb.com!border3.nntp.dca.giga news.com!Xl.tags.giganews.com!border1.nntp.dca.gig anews.com!nntp.giganews.com!local2.nntp.dca.gigane ws.com!news.giganews.com.POSTED!not-for-mail
> NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 23:08:05 -0600
> Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2013 00:08:00 -0500
> From: Yousuf Khan <bbbl67 spammenot.yahoo.com>
> User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:9.0) Gecko/20111222 Thunderbird/9.0.1
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> Newsgroups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-8,free.UseNet,free.spam,free.spirit
> Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
> References: <kd9dje$i8m$1 dont-email.me> <caidnUDv9eUFz2XNnZ2dnUVZ8jGdnZ2d brightview.co.uk> <kd9nqe$u0b$2 dont-email.me> <MPG.2b62333ef08288969897fc news.eternal-september.org> <kd9s8q$rje$1 dont-email.me>
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>
> On 17/01/2013 4:59 PM, John Doe wrote:
>> Firmware shmirmware. Back when I bought an IBM PC, using some
>> instruction from a Peter Norton book and the C programming
>> language, I wrote directly to video memory. The operating system
>> deals directly with hardware drivers. Just because wear leveling
>> is done by firmware, doesn't mean it does it all.
>
> Now you're just being a troll, believe what you want, I think you'll
> find nobody will respond any further to you.
>
> Yousuf Khan
>

[Rodney Pont[_4_]]

On Sun, 20 Jan 2013 00:02:09 -0500, Yousuf Khan wrote:

>At
>the SSD hardware level this is just some more data, like anything else,
>it doesn't treat it specially, in fact it doesn't even know how to treat
>any files specially, that's too high-level for it to understand.

To put the above slightly differently:
The SSD doesn't even know it's a file, it's just data that has to be
stored and retrieved when requested. It's no different to data
describing directories to the SSD.

--
Regards - Rodney Pont
The from address exists but is mostly dumped,
please send any emails to the address below
e-mail rpont (at) gmail (dot) com

[David]

At Sun, 20 Jan 2013 00:08:00 -0500, Yousuf Khan rearranged some electrons
to write:

> On 17/01/2013 4:59 PM, John Doe wrote:
>> Firmware shmirmware.
>
> Now you're just being a troll, believe what you want, I think you'll
> find nobody will respond any further to you.
>
> Yousuf Khan

I've now got him in the same category as Skybuck.

[Mike Tomlinson]

In article >, David > writes

>I've now got him in the same category as Skybuck.

But less entertaining.

--
(\_/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

[Rene Lamontagne[_2_]]

On 1/24/2013 8:06 AM, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
> In article >, David > writes
>
>> I've now got him in the same category as Skybuck.
>
> But less entertaining.
>


They must be related,

Buck and Doe

[John Doe]

A grand total of five posts to UseNet under this ID...

--

Noarchive and/or nymshifting
Rene Lamontagne <klamont shaw.ca> wrote:

> Path: eternal-september.org!mx04.eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!feeder.erje.net!eu.feeder.erje.net!n ews1.as3257.net!feeder1-2.proxad.net!proxad.net!feeder2-2.proxad.net!nx02.iad01.newshosting.com!newshostin g.com!69.16.185.21.MISMATCH!npeer03.iad.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!post01.iad.highwinds-media.com!newsfe24.iad.POSTED!not-for-mail
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> MIME-Version: 1.0
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> Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
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>
> On 1/24/2013 8:06 AM, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
>> In article <kdr3j2$pa2$1 dont-email.me>, David <no spam.please> writes
>>
>>> I've now got him in the same category as Skybuck.
>>
>> But less entertaining.
>>
>
>
> They must be related,
>
> Buck and Doe
>
>

[John Doe]

Mike Tomlinson <mike jasper.org.uk> wrote:

> In article <kdr3j2$pa2$1 dont-email.me>, David <no spam.please>
> writes
>
>>I've now got him in the same category as Skybuck.
>
> But less entertaining.

That's right. You troll me and I'll guarantee it's not going to be
fun, unless you're a masochist...

--











>
> --
> (\_/)
> (='.'=)
> (")_(")
>

> Path: eternal-september.org!mx04.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
> From: Mike Tomlinson <mike jasper.org.uk>
> Newsgroups: alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-8,free.UseNet,free.spam,free.spirit
> Subject: Re: Increase the performance and lifespan of your SSD
> Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2013 14:06:17 +0000
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>

[John Doe]

David <no spam.please> wrote:

> At Sun, 20 Jan 2013 00:08:00 -0500, Yousuf Khan rearranged some electrons
> to write:
>
>> On 17/01/2013 4:59 PM, John Doe wrote:
>>> Firmware shmirmware.
>>
>> Now you're just being a troll, believe what you want, I think you'll
>> find nobody will respond any further to you.
>>
>> Yousuf Khan
>
> I've now got him in the same category as Skybuck.

And someday, the Luddite will learn how to stay out of my threads...

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Noarchive and/or nymshifting

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