Security Descriptors - Master File Tables' Bitmap Attribute Error?

[Dwight Stewart]

I have a few questions...

1. What is the "Master File Table's Bitmap Attribute?" I get "Security
Descriptors" errors in Norton Disk Doctor with this listed as the error
("C:" drive).

2. Is there any reason why this error would not be consistent? This error
first appeared several weeks ago and I've let NDD repair it several times,
only to have it return again. Recently, I haven't even tried to repair it,
but have tracked it instead. I've run NDD twenty times since (over a week
long period), with the error appearing 8 times and not 12 times. Strangely,
when NDD shows the error, a second scan immediately afterward will often
report no errors (though the error will occasionally show up both times).

3. When I've let NDD repair the problem, I occasionally get "Indexes"
errors following the repair. What is the connection between the "indexes"
and "security descriptors?" Why would fixing one cause problems with the
other?

4. Now, for the obvious question, what should I do about this? How can I
fix the problem? The computer is otherwise working just fine.

I've searched the internet extensively for any information relating to
this (specifically the "Master File Table's Bitmap Attribute" root issue).
The few sites I have found offer little more than the vague descriptions on
Microsoft's web site.


Dwight Stewart (W5NET)

http://www.qsl.net/w5net/

[Sharon F]

On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 15:56:25 GMT, Dwight Stewart wrote:

> I have a few questions...
>
> 1. What is the "Master File Table's Bitmap Attribute?" I get "Security
> Descriptors" errors in Norton Disk Doctor with this listed as the error
> ("C:" drive).
>
> 2. Is there any reason why this error would not be consistent? This error
> first appeared several weeks ago and I've let NDD repair it several times,
> only to have it return again. Recently, I haven't even tried to repair it,
> but have tracked it instead. I've run NDD twenty times since (over a week
> long period), with the error appearing 8 times and not 12 times. Strangely,
> when NDD shows the error, a second scan immediately afterward will often
> report no errors (though the error will occasionally show up both times).
>
> 3. When I've let NDD repair the problem, I occasionally get "Indexes"
> errors following the repair. What is the connection between the "indexes"
> and "security descriptors?" Why would fixing one cause problems with the
> other?
>
> 4. Now, for the obvious question, what should I do about this? How can I
> fix the problem? The computer is otherwise working just fine.
>
> I've searched the internet extensively for any information relating to
> this (specifically the "Master File Table's Bitmap Attribute" root issue).
> The few sites I have found offer little more than the vague descriptions on
> Microsoft's web site.
>
>
> Dwight Stewart (W5NET)
>
> http://www.qsl.net/w5net/

I don't use NDD so have no idea what it means by its terminology. When I've
used it in the past (but never on XP), I've notice that its terminology
sometimes deviates from that of Windows. Symantec's online knowledge
base may have an article that gives a detailed description of the terms
their program uses.

As for the security descriptors. The NTFS file system is a journalling file
system. It keeps an ongoing log that tracks information about your files
(location, permissions, etc). "Security descriptors" are included about
files that have permissions attached to them.

Example: If you create a document on your desktop, it has security
descriptors attached to it that say you are the owner/creator of the file
and that it is stored in your personal folders. Now move that file to
another hard drive -one that every user has access to. The old security
descriptors are no longer valid and new ones are created. When you run
the XP chkdsk program it cleans up "invalid" security descriptors.

This cleanup eventually happens during normal operations. Chkdsk is a way
to clean up those details a little sooner. The appearance and cleanup of
these invalid descriptors are normal occurrences. Have no idea why
Norton's would report them as a problem. If I had to guess, it's simply
latching unto the word "invalid" and lumping them into the problem
category.

--
Sharon F
MS MVP - Windows Shell/User

[Dwight Stewart]

Thanks for the fine explanation, Sharon. The System cleaning these up
normally would explain why the errors seem to appear and disappear at
random. At this point, I think I'm just going to leave these errors alone
and let the System take care of the problem itself. After all, nothing I or
NDD has done has really provided anything more than that.


Dwight Stewart (W5NET)

http://www.qsl.net/w5net/


"Sharon F" wrote:
> On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 15:56:25 GMT, Dwight Stewart wrote:
>
> > I have a few questions...
> >
> > 1. What is the "Master File Table's Bitmap Attribute?" I get "Security
> > Descriptors" errors in Norton Disk Doctor with this listed as the error
> > ("C:" drive).
> >
> > 2. Is there any reason why this error would not be consistent? This
error
> > first appeared several weeks ago and I've let NDD repair it several
times,
> > only to have it return again. Recently, I haven't even tried to repair
it,
> > but have tracked it instead. I've run NDD twenty times since (over a
week
> > long period), with the error appearing 8 times and not 12 times.
Strangely,
> > when NDD shows the error, a second scan immediately afterward will often
> > report no errors (though the error will occasionally show up both
times).
> >
> > 3. When I've let NDD repair the problem, I occasionally get "Indexes"
> > errors following the repair. What is the connection between the
"indexes"
> > and "security descriptors?" Why would fixing one cause problems with the
> > other?
> >
> > 4. Now, for the obvious question, what should I do about this? How can
I
> > fix the problem? The computer is otherwise working just fine.
> >
> > I've searched the internet extensively for any information relating to
> > this (specifically the "Master File Table's Bitmap Attribute" root
issue).
> > The few sites I have found offer little more than the vague descriptions
on
> > Microsoft's web site.
> >
>
> I don't use NDD so have no idea what it means by its terminology. When
I've
> used it in the past (but never on XP), I've notice that its terminology
> sometimes deviates from that of Windows. Symantec's online knowledge
> base may have an article that gives a detailed description of the terms
> their program uses.
>
> As for the security descriptors. The NTFS file system is a journalling
file
> system. It keeps an ongoing log that tracks information about your files
> (location, permissions, etc). "Security descriptors" are included about
> files that have permissions attached to them.
>
> Example: If you create a document on your desktop, it has security
> descriptors attached to it that say you are the owner/creator of the file
> and that it is stored in your personal folders. Now move that file to
> another hard drive -one that every user has access to. The old security
> descriptors are no longer valid and new ones are created. When you run
> the XP chkdsk program it cleans up "invalid" security descriptors.
>
> This cleanup eventually happens during normal operations. Chkdsk is a way
> to clean up those details a little sooner. The appearance and cleanup of
> these invalid descriptors are normal occurrences. Have no idea why
> Norton's would report them as a problem. If I had to guess, it's simply
> latching unto the word "invalid" and lumping them into the problem
> category.
>
> --
> Sharon F
> MS MVP - Windows Shell/User