View Full Version : I'd like to understand why Windows occasionally freezes
It happens only rarely (four times in as many months) and, so far at least,
I've not lost any data, so it's been little more than a nuisance.
There are no error messages. Windows reboots fine. There's nothing in the
Event logs. Checkdisk finds no errors, nor does Dr. Watson.
If there's a pattern, it has only happened upon closing IE.
Since I ran Windows 98 for five years without even one freeze-up, and since
XP is reputedly more stable than 98, I'm not inclined to suspect the OS.
What does that leave?
Device drivers, perhaps?
I can live with it, but I'd like to understand why it happens.
Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
Michael Solomon \(MS-MVP Windows Shell/User\)
March 4th 04, 04:43 AM
First, be sure your antivirus software has the latest definitions and run a
virus scan.
Second, download, install and run Ad Aware:
www.lavasoftusa.com
Note: you should always be well backed up before running an application of
this type.
If your system is clear of viruses, open Control Panel, open System, go to
the Advanced tab, click Settings under Startup and Recovery, remove the
check from "Automatically Restart" under System Failure. This will cause
the system to blue screen instead of restarting on errors and the
information on the blue screen may give a clue as to the source of the
issue.
Open Control Panel, open Administrative Tools, open Event Viewer, look for
errors corresponding to the crash, double click the error, the information
contained within may give a clue as to the
source of the problem.
Assuming you have an XP CD and not a recovery CD, place the XP CD in the
drive, when the setup screen appears, select "Check System Compatibility,"
the report it generates may point to problem hardware or software on your
system. If you do not have an XP CD, you can download this application
known as the Upgrade Advisor from the following site:
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/howtobuy/upgrading/advisor.asp
Note: If you have access to a broadband connection it might be best to
download using that as this is a rather large download.
Check for the latest drivers for your hardware, especially your graphics
card and soundcard and all peripherals connected to your system. Do not use
Windows Update for this, go to the device manufacturer's web sites and if
you install updated drivers, ignore the message about drivers being unsigned
by Microsoft.
--
Michael Solomon MS-MVP
Windows Shell/User
Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
"JD" > wrote in message
...
> It happens only rarely (four times in as many months) and, so far at
> least,
> I've not lost any data, so it's been little more than a nuisance.
> There are no error messages. Windows reboots fine. There's nothing in the
> Event logs. Checkdisk finds no errors, nor does Dr. Watson.
> If there's a pattern, it has only happened upon closing IE.
> Since I ran Windows 98 for five years without even one freeze-up, and
> since
> XP is reputedly more stable than 98, I'm not inclined to suspect the OS.
> What does that leave?
> Device drivers, perhaps?
> I can live with it, but I'd like to understand why it happens.
> Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
>
>
Michael,
Thanks for the information. However, the problem here is not errors that
might be tracked down. Nor are there any "events."
The problem is complete freeze-ups. No mouse, no keyboard, no power off
switch.
You do mention device drivers. That could be a cause of freezes of this
kind?
"Michael Solomon (MS-MVP Windows Shell/User)" > wrote in
message ...
> First, be sure your antivirus software has the latest definitions and run
a
> virus scan.
>
> Second, download, install and run Ad Aware:
> www.lavasoftusa.com
> Note: you should always be well backed up before running an application of
> this type.
>
> If your system is clear of viruses, open Control Panel, open System, go to
> the Advanced tab, click Settings under Startup and Recovery, remove the
> check from "Automatically Restart" under System Failure. This will cause
> the system to blue screen instead of restarting on errors and the
> information on the blue screen may give a clue as to the source of the
> issue.
>
> Open Control Panel, open Administrative Tools, open Event Viewer, look for
> errors corresponding to the crash, double click the error, the information
> contained within may give a clue as to the
> source of the problem.
>
> Assuming you have an XP CD and not a recovery CD, place the XP CD in the
> drive, when the setup screen appears, select "Check System Compatibility,"
> the report it generates may point to problem hardware or software on your
> system. If you do not have an XP CD, you can download this application
> known as the Upgrade Advisor from the following site:
> http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/howtobuy/upgrading/advisor.asp
> Note: If you have access to a broadband connection it might be best to
> download using that as this is a rather large download.
>
> Check for the latest drivers for your hardware, especially your graphics
> card and soundcard and all peripherals connected to your system. Do not
use
> Windows Update for this, go to the device manufacturer's web sites and if
> you install updated drivers, ignore the message about drivers being
unsigned
> by Microsoft.
>
>
> --
> Michael Solomon MS-MVP
> Windows Shell/User
> Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
> DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>
> "JD" > wrote in message
> ...
> > It happens only rarely (four times in as many months) and, so far at
> > least,
> > I've not lost any data, so it's been little more than a nuisance.
> > There are no error messages. Windows reboots fine. There's nothing in
the
> > Event logs. Checkdisk finds no errors, nor does Dr. Watson.
> > If there's a pattern, it has only happened upon closing IE.
> > Since I ran Windows 98 for five years without even one freeze-up, and
> > since
> > XP is reputedly more stable than 98, I'm not inclined to suspect the OS.
> > What does that leave?
> > Device drivers, perhaps?
> > I can live with it, but I'd like to understand why it happens.
> > Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
> >
> >
>
>
Michael Solomon \(MS-MVP Windows Shell/User\)
March 4th 04, 05:01 AM
Anything that causes a freeze is an error. I'd be quite surprised if
nothing is referenced in event viewer, did you check all sections and scroll
for errors or is anything at all being listed.
Yes, it is most likely a driver issue, you should also do as I suggested
with regard to placing the XP CD in the drive and selecting Check System
Compatibility. Even if XP came preinstalled on a system, you add things to
it, hardware, software, etc. any of which could cause issues.
--
Michael Solomon MS-MVP
Windows Shell/User
Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
"JD" > wrote in message
...
> Michael,
> Thanks for the information. However, the problem here is not errors that
> might be tracked down. Nor are there any "events."
> The problem is complete freeze-ups. No mouse, no keyboard, no power off
> switch.
> You do mention device drivers. That could be a cause of freezes of this
> kind?
> "Michael Solomon (MS-MVP Windows Shell/User)" > wrote in
> message ...
>> First, be sure your antivirus software has the latest definitions and run
> a
>> virus scan.
>>
>> Second, download, install and run Ad Aware:
>> www.lavasoftusa.com
>> Note: you should always be well backed up before running an application
>> of
>> this type.
>>
>> If your system is clear of viruses, open Control Panel, open System, go
>> to
>> the Advanced tab, click Settings under Startup and Recovery, remove the
>> check from "Automatically Restart" under System Failure. This will cause
>> the system to blue screen instead of restarting on errors and the
>> information on the blue screen may give a clue as to the source of the
>> issue.
>>
>> Open Control Panel, open Administrative Tools, open Event Viewer, look
>> for
>> errors corresponding to the crash, double click the error, the
>> information
>> contained within may give a clue as to the
>> source of the problem.
>>
>> Assuming you have an XP CD and not a recovery CD, place the XP CD in the
>> drive, when the setup screen appears, select "Check System
>> Compatibility,"
>> the report it generates may point to problem hardware or software on your
>> system. If you do not have an XP CD, you can download this application
>> known as the Upgrade Advisor from the following site:
>> http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/howtobuy/upgrading/advisor.asp
>> Note: If you have access to a broadband connection it might be best to
>> download using that as this is a rather large download.
>>
>> Check for the latest drivers for your hardware, especially your graphics
>> card and soundcard and all peripherals connected to your system. Do not
> use
>> Windows Update for this, go to the device manufacturer's web sites and if
>> you install updated drivers, ignore the message about drivers being
> unsigned
>> by Microsoft.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>> Windows Shell/User
>> Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>> DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>>
>> "JD" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > It happens only rarely (four times in as many months) and, so far at
>> > least,
>> > I've not lost any data, so it's been little more than a nuisance.
>> > There are no error messages. Windows reboots fine. There's nothing in
> the
>> > Event logs. Checkdisk finds no errors, nor does Dr. Watson.
>> > If there's a pattern, it has only happened upon closing IE.
>> > Since I ran Windows 98 for five years without even one freeze-up, and
>> > since
>> > XP is reputedly more stable than 98, I'm not inclined to suspect the
>> > OS.
>> > What does that leave?
>> > Device drivers, perhaps?
>> > I can live with it, but I'd like to understand why it happens.
>> > Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>
>
John Kerry
March 4th 04, 05:43 AM
Michael Solomon is full of SH*T! Are you trying to tell me that XP is 100% stable and could NOT be the cause of system freezes? You are a bold faced liar .
Tashtego
March 4th 04, 05:44 AM
Michael -
Strong disagreement on four points.
1.
Freezes in Win XP are fairly common in an application
such as Flight Simulator 2004... and they leave absolutely
no trace in Event Viewer. That makes it hard to run down.
2.
The latest driver is NOT necessarily the greatest driver,
any more than the latest Corvette transmission is the
right transmission for a two year old Caddy. One of
the newer ATI cards is the Radeon 9600XT. The latest
ATI driver s/w is Catalyst 4.2... yet ATI Tech support
recommends Catalyst 3.7 to reduce number of freezes in
Flight Simulator, and it helps a lot.
3.
In December, Microsoft included a new ATI driver in their
updates. I've found this driver to be even better than
the Catalyst 3.7 and highly recommend it to anyone using
an ATI card and having freezes. The statement "Use the
latest driver" is the standard mantra in too many cases.
The better answer is use the "best matched" driver for
your card, and the app that you're having the most trouble
with. Call Tech support or really STUDY their web site.
4.
Don't jump to the conclusion that it's most likely a
driver issue. All sorts of users are having freezes with
Windows XP and the cures are split almost 50-50 between
hardware problems and software problems.
With due respect to the fine efforts of MVP's, your quick
shoot-from-the-hip answer will seldom track down the real
cause of an elusive "freeze".
Freezes are often caused by a bad stick of memory.
Use Google to find "MemTest86". It's free. Download and
use it. It really helps to locate bad memory.
Heat in your computer can lead to freezes. Take the
side panel off for a while. Clean the dust off of fans
and heat-sinks.
Tash ----------------------------------------------------
>-----Original Message-----
>Anything that causes a freeze is an error. I'd be quite
surprised if
>nothing is referenced in event viewer, did you check all
sections and scroll
>for errors or is anything at all being listed.
>
>Yes, it is most likely a driver issue, you should also do
as I suggested
>with regard to placing the XP CD in the drive and
selecting Check System
>Compatibility. Even if XP came preinstalled on a system,
you add things to
>it, hardware, software, etc. any of which could cause issues.
>
>--
>Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>Windows Shell/User
>Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>
>"JD" > wrote in message
...
>> Michael,
>> Thanks for the information. However, the problem here is
not errors that
>> might be tracked down. Nor are there any "events."
>> The problem is complete freeze-ups. No mouse, no
keyboard, no power off
>> switch.
>> You do mention device drivers. That could be a cause of
freezes of this
>> kind?
>> "Michael Solomon (MS-MVP Windows Shell/User)"
> wrote in
>> message ...
>>> First, be sure your antivirus software has the latest
definitions and run
>> a
>>> virus scan.
>>>
>>> Second, download, install and run Ad Aware:
>>> www.lavasoftusa.com
>>> Note: you should always be well backed up before
running an application
>>> of
>>> this type.
>>>
>>> If your system is clear of viruses, open Control Panel,
open System, go
>>> to
>>> the Advanced tab, click Settings under Startup and
Recovery, remove the
>>> check from "Automatically Restart" under System
Failure. This will cause
>>> the system to blue screen instead of restarting on
errors and the
>>> information on the blue screen may give a clue as to
the source of the
>>> issue.
>>>
>>> Open Control Panel, open Administrative Tools, open
Event Viewer, look
>>> for
>>> errors corresponding to the crash, double click the
error, the
>>> information
>>> contained within may give a clue as to the
>>> source of the problem.
>>>
>>> Assuming you have an XP CD and not a recovery CD, place
the XP CD in the
>>> drive, when the setup screen appears, select "Check System
>>> Compatibility,"
>>> the report it generates may point to problem hardware
or software on your
>>> system. If you do not have an XP CD, you can download
this application
>>> known as the Upgrade Advisor from the following site:
>>>
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/howtobuy/upgrading/advisor.asp
>>> Note: If you have access to a broadband connection it
might be best to
>>> download using that as this is a rather large download.
>>>
>>> Check for the latest drivers for your hardware,
especially your graphics
>>> card and soundcard and all peripherals connected to
your system. Do not
>> use
>>> Windows Update for this, go to the device
manufacturer's web sites and if
>>> you install updated drivers, ignore the message about
drivers being
>> unsigned
>>> by Microsoft.
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>>> Windows Shell/User
>>> Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>>> DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>>>
>>> "JD" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>> > It happens only rarely (four times in as many months)
and, so far at
>>> > least,
>>> > I've not lost any data, so it's been little more than
a nuisance.
>>> > There are no error messages. Windows reboots fine.
There's nothing in
>> the
>>> > Event logs. Checkdisk finds no errors, nor does Dr.
Watson.
>>> > If there's a pattern, it has only happened upon
closing IE.
>>> > Since I ran Windows 98 for five years without even
one freeze-up, and
>>> > since
>>> > XP is reputedly more stable than 98, I'm not inclined
to suspect the
>>> > OS.
>>> > What does that leave?
>>> > Device drivers, perhaps?
>>> > I can live with it, but I'd like to understand why it
happens.
>>> > Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
>.
>
JAX
March 4th 04, 06:03 AM
John, I installed XP about 3 months after it was released. I have never had
a "system freeze". I've had a few application freezes but, nothing I could
ever blame on XP. The only issue I have ever had with XP was with floppies.
This is not to say XP is infallible but, most of the problems are usually
operator errors.
JAX
"John Kerry" > wrote in message
...
> Michael Solomon is full of SH*T! Are you trying to tell me that XP is 100%
stable and could NOT be the cause of system freezes? You are a bold faced
liar .
Ace / 2
March 4th 04, 06:03 AM
I agree with John K. and Tash.
That was lousy advice Mike.
What you can say positive about
Windows XP is that it freezes less
often than Windows 98. And Longhorn
will probably freeze less than Win XP,
but I promise you... it will freeze too.
Half Ace
----------------------------------------
:
>-----Original Message-----
>Michael -
>Strong disagreement on four points.
>1.
>Freezes in Win XP are fairly common in an application
>such as Flight Simulator 2004... and they leave absolutely
>no trace in Event Viewer. That makes it hard to run down.
>2.
>The latest driver is NOT necessarily the greatest driver,
>any more than the latest Corvette transmission is the
>right transmission for a two year old Caddy. One of
>the newer ATI cards is the Radeon 9600XT. The latest
>ATI driver s/w is Catalyst 4.2... yet ATI Tech support
>recommends Catalyst 3.7 to reduce number of freezes in
>Flight Simulator, and it helps a lot.
>3.
>In December, Microsoft included a new ATI driver in their
>updates. I've found this driver to be even better than
>the Catalyst 3.7 and highly recommend it to anyone using
>an ATI card and having freezes. The statement "Use the
>latest driver" is the standard mantra in too many cases.
>The better answer is use the "best matched" driver for
>your card, and the app that you're having the most trouble
>with. Call Tech support or really STUDY their web site.
>4.
>Don't jump to the conclusion that it's most likely a
>driver issue. All sorts of users are having freezes with
>Windows XP and the cures are split almost 50-50 between
>hardware problems and software problems.
>
>With due respect to the fine efforts of MVP's, your quick
>shoot-from-the-hip answer will seldom track down the real
>cause of an elusive "freeze".
>
>Freezes are often caused by a bad stick of memory.
>Use Google to find "MemTest86". It's free. Download and
>use it. It really helps to locate bad memory.
>
>Heat in your computer can lead to freezes. Take the
>side panel off for a while. Clean the dust off of fans
>and heat-sinks.
>
>Tash ----------------------------------------------------
>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>Anything that causes a freeze is an error. I'd be quite
>surprised if
>>nothing is referenced in event viewer, did you check all
>sections and scroll
>>for errors or is anything at all being listed.
>>
>>Yes, it is most likely a driver issue, you should also do
>as I suggested
>>with regard to placing the XP CD in the drive and
>selecting Check System
>>Compatibility. Even if XP came preinstalled on a system,
>you add things to
>>it, hardware, software, etc. any of which could cause issues.
>>
>>--
>>Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>>Windows Shell/User
>>Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>>DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>>
>>"JD" > wrote in message
...
>>> Michael,
>>> Thanks for the information. However, the problem here is
>not errors that
>>> might be tracked down. Nor are there any "events."
>>> The problem is complete freeze-ups. No mouse, no
>keyboard, no power off
>>> switch.
>>> You do mention device drivers. That could be a cause of
>freezes of this
>>> kind?
>>> "Michael Solomon (MS-MVP Windows Shell/User)"
> wrote in
>>> message ...
>>>> First, be sure your antivirus software has the latest
>definitions and run
>>> a
>>>> virus scan.
>>>>
>>>> Second, download, install and run Ad Aware:
>>>> www.lavasoftusa.com
>>>> Note: you should always be well backed up before
>running an application
>>>> of
>>>> this type.
>>>>
>>>> If your system is clear of viruses, open Control Panel,
>open System, go
>>>> to
>>>> the Advanced tab, click Settings under Startup and
>Recovery, remove the
>>>> check from "Automatically Restart" under System
>Failure. This will cause
>>>> the system to blue screen instead of restarting on
>errors and the
>>>> information on the blue screen may give a clue as to
>the source of the
>>>> issue.
>>>>
>>>> Open Control Panel, open Administrative Tools, open
>Event Viewer, look
>>>> for
>>>> errors corresponding to the crash, double click the
>error, the
>>>> information
>>>> contained within may give a clue as to the
>>>> source of the problem.
>>>>
>>>> Assuming you have an XP CD and not a recovery CD, place
>the XP CD in the
>>>> drive, when the setup screen appears, select "Check
System
>>>> Compatibility,"
>>>> the report it generates may point to problem hardware
>or software on your
>>>> system. If you do not have an XP CD, you can download
>this application
>>>> known as the Upgrade Advisor from the following site:
>>>>
>http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/howtobuy/upgrading/advisor.asp
>>>> Note: If you have access to a broadband connection it
>might be best to
>>>> download using that as this is a rather large download.
>>>>
>>>> Check for the latest drivers for your hardware,
>especially your graphics
>>>> card and soundcard and all peripherals connected to
>your system. Do not
>>> use
>>>> Windows Update for this, go to the device
>manufacturer's web sites and if
>>>> you install updated drivers, ignore the message about
>drivers being
>>> unsigned
>>>> by Microsoft.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>>>> Windows Shell/User
>>>> Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>>>> DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>>>>
>>>> "JD" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>> > It happens only rarely (four times in as many months)
>and, so far at
>>>> > least,
>>>> > I've not lost any data, so it's been little more than
>a nuisance.
>>>> > There are no error messages. Windows reboots fine.
>There's nothing in
>>> the
>>>> > Event logs. Checkdisk finds no errors, nor does Dr.
>Watson.
>>>> > If there's a pattern, it has only happened upon
>closing IE.
>>>> > Since I ran Windows 98 for five years without even
>one freeze-up, and
>>>> > since
>>>> > XP is reputedly more stable than 98, I'm not inclined
>to suspect the
>>>> > OS.
>>>> > What does that leave?
>>>> > Device drivers, perhaps?
>>>> > I can live with it, but I'd like to understand why it
>happens.
>>>> > Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>.
>>
>.
>
Raj
March 4th 04, 06:03 AM
Well if you ever figure that out you will become a very rich man. You would
probably have a better chance figuring out how women think, what makes them
happy, what makes them sad.... and so on
Raj
"JD" > wrote in message
...
> It happens only rarely (four times in as many months) and, so far at
least,
> I've not lost any data, so it's been little more than a nuisance.
> There are no error messages. Windows reboots fine. There's nothing in the
> Event logs. Checkdisk finds no errors, nor does Dr. Watson.
> If there's a pattern, it has only happened upon closing IE.
> Since I ran Windows 98 for five years without even one freeze-up, and
since
> XP is reputedly more stable than 98, I'm not inclined to suspect the OS.
> What does that leave?
> Device drivers, perhaps?
> I can live with it, but I'd like to understand why it happens.
> Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
>
>
John Kerry
March 4th 04, 06:03 AM
Well said, Tash.
Thanks. I will try that memory test.
BTW, this is a fairly new computer, with all OEM drivers (Gateway).
"Tashtego" > wrote in message
...
> Michael -
> Strong disagreement on four points.
> 1.
> Freezes in Win XP are fairly common in an application
> such as Flight Simulator 2004... and they leave absolutely
> no trace in Event Viewer. That makes it hard to run down.
> 2.
> The latest driver is NOT necessarily the greatest driver,
> any more than the latest Corvette transmission is the
> right transmission for a two year old Caddy. One of
> the newer ATI cards is the Radeon 9600XT. The latest
> ATI driver s/w is Catalyst 4.2... yet ATI Tech support
> recommends Catalyst 3.7 to reduce number of freezes in
> Flight Simulator, and it helps a lot.
> 3.
> In December, Microsoft included a new ATI driver in their
> updates. I've found this driver to be even better than
> the Catalyst 3.7 and highly recommend it to anyone using
> an ATI card and having freezes. The statement "Use the
> latest driver" is the standard mantra in too many cases.
> The better answer is use the "best matched" driver for
> your card, and the app that you're having the most trouble
> with. Call Tech support or really STUDY their web site.
> 4.
> Don't jump to the conclusion that it's most likely a
> driver issue. All sorts of users are having freezes with
> Windows XP and the cures are split almost 50-50 between
> hardware problems and software problems.
>
> With due respect to the fine efforts of MVP's, your quick
> shoot-from-the-hip answer will seldom track down the real
> cause of an elusive "freeze".
>
> Freezes are often caused by a bad stick of memory.
> Use Google to find "MemTest86". It's free. Download and
> use it. It really helps to locate bad memory.
>
> Heat in your computer can lead to freezes. Take the
> side panel off for a while. Clean the dust off of fans
> and heat-sinks.
>
> Tash ----------------------------------------------------
>
> >-----Original Message-----
> >Anything that causes a freeze is an error. I'd be quite
> surprised if
> >nothing is referenced in event viewer, did you check all
> sections and scroll
> >for errors or is anything at all being listed.
> >
> >Yes, it is most likely a driver issue, you should also do
> as I suggested
> >with regard to placing the XP CD in the drive and
> selecting Check System
> >Compatibility. Even if XP came preinstalled on a system,
> you add things to
> >it, hardware, software, etc. any of which could cause issues.
> >
> >--
> >Michael Solomon MS-MVP
> >Windows Shell/User
> >Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
> >DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
> >
> >"JD" > wrote in message
> ...
> >> Michael,
> >> Thanks for the information. However, the problem here is
> not errors that
> >> might be tracked down. Nor are there any "events."
> >> The problem is complete freeze-ups. No mouse, no
> keyboard, no power off
> >> switch.
> >> You do mention device drivers. That could be a cause of
> freezes of this
> >> kind?
> >> "Michael Solomon (MS-MVP Windows Shell/User)"
> > wrote in
> >> message ...
> >>> First, be sure your antivirus software has the latest
> definitions and run
> >> a
> >>> virus scan.
> >>>
> >>> Second, download, install and run Ad Aware:
> >>> www.lavasoftusa.com
> >>> Note: you should always be well backed up before
> running an application
> >>> of
> >>> this type.
> >>>
> >>> If your system is clear of viruses, open Control Panel,
> open System, go
> >>> to
> >>> the Advanced tab, click Settings under Startup and
> Recovery, remove the
> >>> check from "Automatically Restart" under System
> Failure. This will cause
> >>> the system to blue screen instead of restarting on
> errors and the
> >>> information on the blue screen may give a clue as to
> the source of the
> >>> issue.
> >>>
> >>> Open Control Panel, open Administrative Tools, open
> Event Viewer, look
> >>> for
> >>> errors corresponding to the crash, double click the
> error, the
> >>> information
> >>> contained within may give a clue as to the
> >>> source of the problem.
> >>>
> >>> Assuming you have an XP CD and not a recovery CD, place
> the XP CD in the
> >>> drive, when the setup screen appears, select "Check System
> >>> Compatibility,"
> >>> the report it generates may point to problem hardware
> or software on your
> >>> system. If you do not have an XP CD, you can download
> this application
> >>> known as the Upgrade Advisor from the following site:
> >>>
> http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/howtobuy/upgrading/advisor.asp
> >>> Note: If you have access to a broadband connection it
> might be best to
> >>> download using that as this is a rather large download.
> >>>
> >>> Check for the latest drivers for your hardware,
> especially your graphics
> >>> card and soundcard and all peripherals connected to
> your system. Do not
> >> use
> >>> Windows Update for this, go to the device
> manufacturer's web sites and if
> >>> you install updated drivers, ignore the message about
> drivers being
> >> unsigned
> >>> by Microsoft.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> Michael Solomon MS-MVP
> >>> Windows Shell/User
> >>> Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
> >>> DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
> >>>
> >>> "JD" > wrote in message
> >>> ...
> >>> > It happens only rarely (four times in as many months)
> and, so far at
> >>> > least,
> >>> > I've not lost any data, so it's been little more than
> a nuisance.
> >>> > There are no error messages. Windows reboots fine.
> There's nothing in
> >> the
> >>> > Event logs. Checkdisk finds no errors, nor does Dr.
> Watson.
> >>> > If there's a pattern, it has only happened upon
> closing IE.
> >>> > Since I ran Windows 98 for five years without even
> one freeze-up, and
> >>> > since
> >>> > XP is reputedly more stable than 98, I'm not inclined
> to suspect the
> >>> > OS.
> >>> > What does that leave?
> >>> > Device drivers, perhaps?
> >>> > I can live with it, but I'd like to understand why it
> happens.
> >>> > Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >.
> >
Michael Solomon \(MS-MVP Windows Shell/User\)
March 4th 04, 08:42 AM
Point number one is well taken though I'm surprised nothing shows in event
viewer. That said, it leads to number 2. I certainly agree the latest
isn't always the best and certainly can be the source of trouble but if you
are not using the latest and are having problems a driver, especially a
graphics driver is good place to start looking as a culprit especially with
regard to a game.
Also, if a graphics card shares memory with main system memory as opposed to
having its own memory that can be a cause.
3) The driver in the update was supplied by ATI. It may work better for
some depending upon setup. Those drivers as opposed to those that come from
the manufacturer's website are not as full featured and often don't
implement all the features of the card. Some such features might in fact be
the source of the problem.
4)Drivers are a very good place to start and again, I go back to what I said
about shared memory. Many machines today come with shared memory and they
just aren't up to gaming or anything with more intense graphics, especially
on an OS as graphics intensive as XP.
I offered up drivers as a good place to start. I assumed if that didn't
resolve it he'd be back.
I have a boilerplate response to crashing as follows that is far more
comprehensive and more likely to find software issues as well, I'm including
it below:
NOTE: the driver recommendation is last in the list:
First, be sure your antivirus software has the latest definitions and run a
virus scan.
Second, download, install and run Ad Aware:
www.lavasoftusa.com
Note: you should always be well backed up before running an application of
this type.
If your system is clear of viruses, open Control Panel, open System, go to
the Advanced tab, click Settings under Startup and Recovery, remove the
check from "Automatically Restart" under System Failure. This will cause
the system to blue screen instead of restarting on errors and the
information on the blue screen may give a clue as to the source of the
issue.
Open Control Panel, open Administrative Tools, open Event Viewer, look for
errors corresponding to the crash, double click the error, the information
contained within may give a clue as to the
source of the problem.
Assuming you have an XP CD and not a recovery CD, place the XP CD in the
drive, when the setup screen appears, select "Check System Compatibility,"
the report it generates may point to problem hardware or software on your
system. If you do not have an XP CD, you can download this application
known as the Upgrade Advisor from the following site:
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/howtobuy/upgrading/advisor.asp
Note: If you have access to a broadband connection it might be best to
download using that as this is a rather large download.
Check for the latest drivers for your hardware, especially your graphics
card and soundcard and all peripherals connected to your system. Do not use
Windows Update for this, go to the device manufacturer's web sites and if
you install updated drivers, ignore the message about drivers being unsigned
by Microsoft.
--
Michael Solomon MS-MVP
Windows Shell/User
Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
"Tashtego" > wrote in message
...
> Michael -
> Strong disagreement on four points.
> 1.
> Freezes in Win XP are fairly common in an application
> such as Flight Simulator 2004... and they leave absolutely
> no trace in Event Viewer. That makes it hard to run down.
> 2.
> The latest driver is NOT necessarily the greatest driver,
> any more than the latest Corvette transmission is the
> right transmission for a two year old Caddy. One of
> the newer ATI cards is the Radeon 9600XT. The latest
> ATI driver s/w is Catalyst 4.2... yet ATI Tech support
> recommends Catalyst 3.7 to reduce number of freezes in
> Flight Simulator, and it helps a lot.
> 3.
> In December, Microsoft included a new ATI driver in their
> updates. I've found this driver to be even better than
> the Catalyst 3.7 and highly recommend it to anyone using
> an ATI card and having freezes. The statement "Use the
> latest driver" is the standard mantra in too many cases.
> The better answer is use the "best matched" driver for
> your card, and the app that you're having the most trouble
> with. Call Tech support or really STUDY their web site.
> 4.
> Don't jump to the conclusion that it's most likely a
> driver issue. All sorts of users are having freezes with
> Windows XP and the cures are split almost 50-50 between
> hardware problems and software problems.
>
> With due respect to the fine efforts of MVP's, your quick
> shoot-from-the-hip answer will seldom track down the real
> cause of an elusive "freeze".
>
> Freezes are often caused by a bad stick of memory.
> Use Google to find "MemTest86". It's free. Download and
> use it. It really helps to locate bad memory.
>
> Heat in your computer can lead to freezes. Take the
> side panel off for a while. Clean the dust off of fans
> and heat-sinks.
>
> Tash ----------------------------------------------------
>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>Anything that causes a freeze is an error. I'd be quite
> surprised if
>>nothing is referenced in event viewer, did you check all
> sections and scroll
>>for errors or is anything at all being listed.
>>
>>Yes, it is most likely a driver issue, you should also do
> as I suggested
>>with regard to placing the XP CD in the drive and
> selecting Check System
>>Compatibility. Even if XP came preinstalled on a system,
> you add things to
>>it, hardware, software, etc. any of which could cause issues.
>>
>>--
>>Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>>Windows Shell/User
>>Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>>DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>>
>>"JD" > wrote in message
...
>>> Michael,
>>> Thanks for the information. However, the problem here is
> not errors that
>>> might be tracked down. Nor are there any "events."
>>> The problem is complete freeze-ups. No mouse, no
> keyboard, no power off
>>> switch.
>>> You do mention device drivers. That could be a cause of
> freezes of this
>>> kind?
>>> "Michael Solomon (MS-MVP Windows Shell/User)"
> > wrote in
>>> message ...
>>>> First, be sure your antivirus software has the latest
> definitions and run
>>> a
>>>> virus scan.
>>>>
>>>> Second, download, install and run Ad Aware:
>>>> www.lavasoftusa.com
>>>> Note: you should always be well backed up before
> running an application
>>>> of
>>>> this type.
>>>>
>>>> If your system is clear of viruses, open Control Panel,
> open System, go
>>>> to
>>>> the Advanced tab, click Settings under Startup and
> Recovery, remove the
>>>> check from "Automatically Restart" under System
> Failure. This will cause
>>>> the system to blue screen instead of restarting on
> errors and the
>>>> information on the blue screen may give a clue as to
> the source of the
>>>> issue.
>>>>
>>>> Open Control Panel, open Administrative Tools, open
> Event Viewer, look
>>>> for
>>>> errors corresponding to the crash, double click the
> error, the
>>>> information
>>>> contained within may give a clue as to the
>>>> source of the problem.
>>>>
>>>> Assuming you have an XP CD and not a recovery CD, place
> the XP CD in the
>>>> drive, when the setup screen appears, select "Check System
>>>> Compatibility,"
>>>> the report it generates may point to problem hardware
> or software on your
>>>> system. If you do not have an XP CD, you can download
> this application
>>>> known as the Upgrade Advisor from the following site:
>>>>
> http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/howtobuy/upgrading/advisor.asp
>>>> Note: If you have access to a broadband connection it
> might be best to
>>>> download using that as this is a rather large download.
>>>>
>>>> Check for the latest drivers for your hardware,
> especially your graphics
>>>> card and soundcard and all peripherals connected to
> your system. Do not
>>> use
>>>> Windows Update for this, go to the device
> manufacturer's web sites and if
>>>> you install updated drivers, ignore the message about
> drivers being
>>> unsigned
>>>> by Microsoft.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>>>> Windows Shell/User
>>>> Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>>>> DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>>>>
>>>> "JD" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>> > It happens only rarely (four times in as many months)
> and, so far at
>>>> > least,
>>>> > I've not lost any data, so it's been little more than
> a nuisance.
>>>> > There are no error messages. Windows reboots fine.
> There's nothing in
>>> the
>>>> > Event logs. Checkdisk finds no errors, nor does Dr.
> Watson.
>>>> > If there's a pattern, it has only happened upon
> closing IE.
>>>> > Since I ran Windows 98 for five years without even
> one freeze-up, and
>>>> > since
>>>> > XP is reputedly more stable than 98, I'm not inclined
> to suspect the
>>>> > OS.
>>>> > What does that leave?
>>>> > Device drivers, perhaps?
>>>> > I can live with it, but I'd like to understand why it
> happens.
>>>> > Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>.
>>
Michael Solomon \(MS-MVP Windows Shell/User\)
March 4th 04, 08:42 AM
I never said what you are implying and you are putting words in my mouth.
I offered up suggestions about what he might do to ferret out the problem
but you apparently didn't read my first post in this thread which contained
quite few other suggestions besides drivers as a potential source and a
means for possibly finding the source.
It always amazes me how brave people get with their language and how they
treat others when they post anonymously.
--
Michael Solomon MS-MVP
Windows Shell/User
Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
"John Kerry" > wrote in message
...
>
Michael Solomon \(MS-MVP Windows Shell/User\)
March 4th 04, 08:42 AM
Please see my first post in this thread. It points to a lot of
possibilities, not just drivers as well as ways to try to ferret out the
source of the issue.
--
Michael Solomon MS-MVP
Windows Shell/User
Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
"Ace / 2" > wrote in message
...
>
> I agree with John K. and Tash.
> That was lousy advice Mike.
> What you can say positive about
> Windows XP is that it freezes less
> often than Windows 98. And Longhorn
> will probably freeze less than Win XP,
> but I promise you... it will freeze too.
> Half Ace
> ----------------------------------------
> :
>>-----Original Message-----
>>Michael -
>>Strong disagreement on four points.
>>1.
>>Freezes in Win XP are fairly common in an application
>>such as Flight Simulator 2004... and they leave absolutely
>>no trace in Event Viewer. That makes it hard to run down.
>>2.
>>The latest driver is NOT necessarily the greatest driver,
>>any more than the latest Corvette transmission is the
>>right transmission for a two year old Caddy. One of
>>the newer ATI cards is the Radeon 9600XT. The latest
>>ATI driver s/w is Catalyst 4.2... yet ATI Tech support
>>recommends Catalyst 3.7 to reduce number of freezes in
>>Flight Simulator, and it helps a lot.
>>3.
>>In December, Microsoft included a new ATI driver in their
>>updates. I've found this driver to be even better than
>>the Catalyst 3.7 and highly recommend it to anyone using
>>an ATI card and having freezes. The statement "Use the
>>latest driver" is the standard mantra in too many cases.
>>The better answer is use the "best matched" driver for
>>your card, and the app that you're having the most trouble
>>with. Call Tech support or really STUDY their web site.
>>4.
>>Don't jump to the conclusion that it's most likely a
>>driver issue. All sorts of users are having freezes with
>>Windows XP and the cures are split almost 50-50 between
>>hardware problems and software problems.
>>
>>With due respect to the fine efforts of MVP's, your quick
>>shoot-from-the-hip answer will seldom track down the real
>>cause of an elusive "freeze".
>>
>>Freezes are often caused by a bad stick of memory.
>>Use Google to find "MemTest86". It's free. Download and
>>use it. It really helps to locate bad memory.
>>
>>Heat in your computer can lead to freezes. Take the
>>side panel off for a while. Clean the dust off of fans
>>and heat-sinks.
>>
>>Tash ----------------------------------------------------
>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>Anything that causes a freeze is an error. I'd be quite
>>surprised if
>>>nothing is referenced in event viewer, did you check all
>>sections and scroll
>>>for errors or is anything at all being listed.
>>>
>>>Yes, it is most likely a driver issue, you should also do
>>as I suggested
>>>with regard to placing the XP CD in the drive and
>>selecting Check System
>>>Compatibility. Even if XP came preinstalled on a system,
>>you add things to
>>>it, hardware, software, etc. any of which could cause issues.
>>>
>>>--
>>>Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>>>Windows Shell/User
>>>Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>>>DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>>>
>>>"JD" > wrote in message
...
>>>> Michael,
>>>> Thanks for the information. However, the problem here is
>>not errors that
>>>> might be tracked down. Nor are there any "events."
>>>> The problem is complete freeze-ups. No mouse, no
>>keyboard, no power off
>>>> switch.
>>>> You do mention device drivers. That could be a cause of
>>freezes of this
>>>> kind?
>>>> "Michael Solomon (MS-MVP Windows Shell/User)"
> wrote in
>>>> message ...
>>>>> First, be sure your antivirus software has the latest
>>definitions and run
>>>> a
>>>>> virus scan.
>>>>>
>>>>> Second, download, install and run Ad Aware:
>>>>> www.lavasoftusa.com
>>>>> Note: you should always be well backed up before
>>running an application
>>>>> of
>>>>> this type.
>>>>>
>>>>> If your system is clear of viruses, open Control Panel,
>>open System, go
>>>>> to
>>>>> the Advanced tab, click Settings under Startup and
>>Recovery, remove the
>>>>> check from "Automatically Restart" under System
>>Failure. This will cause
>>>>> the system to blue screen instead of restarting on
>>errors and the
>>>>> information on the blue screen may give a clue as to
>>the source of the
>>>>> issue.
>>>>>
>>>>> Open Control Panel, open Administrative Tools, open
>>Event Viewer, look
>>>>> for
>>>>> errors corresponding to the crash, double click the
>>error, the
>>>>> information
>>>>> contained within may give a clue as to the
>>>>> source of the problem.
>>>>>
>>>>> Assuming you have an XP CD and not a recovery CD, place
>>the XP CD in the
>>>>> drive, when the setup screen appears, select "Check
> System
>>>>> Compatibility,"
>>>>> the report it generates may point to problem hardware
>>or software on your
>>>>> system. If you do not have an XP CD, you can download
>>this application
>>>>> known as the Upgrade Advisor from the following site:
>>>>>
>>http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/howtobuy/upgrading/advisor.asp
>>>>> Note: If you have access to a broadband connection it
>>might be best to
>>>>> download using that as this is a rather large download.
>>>>>
>>>>> Check for the latest drivers for your hardware,
>>especially your graphics
>>>>> card and soundcard and all peripherals connected to
>>your system. Do not
>>>> use
>>>>> Windows Update for this, go to the device
>>manufacturer's web sites and if
>>>>> you install updated drivers, ignore the message about
>>drivers being
>>>> unsigned
>>>>> by Microsoft.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>>>>> Windows Shell/User
>>>>> Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>>>>> DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>>>>>
>>>>> "JD" > wrote in message
>>>>> ...
>>>>> > It happens only rarely (four times in as many months)
>>and, so far at
>>>>> > least,
>>>>> > I've not lost any data, so it's been little more than
>>a nuisance.
>>>>> > There are no error messages. Windows reboots fine.
>>There's nothing in
>>>> the
>>>>> > Event logs. Checkdisk finds no errors, nor does Dr.
>>Watson.
>>>>> > If there's a pattern, it has only happened upon
>>closing IE.
>>>>> > Since I ran Windows 98 for five years without even
>>one freeze-up, and
>>>>> > since
>>>>> > XP is reputedly more stable than 98, I'm not inclined
>>to suspect the
>>>>> > OS.
>>>>> > What does that leave?
>>>>> > Device drivers, perhaps?
>>>>> > I can live with it, but I'd like to understand why it
>>happens.
>>>>> > Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>.
>>>
>>.
>>
Michael Solomon \(MS-MVP Windows Shell/User\)
March 4th 04, 08:43 AM
Even with a new system, drivers change quickly and are often overlooked as a
potential source of issues because people make the mistake of believing
because the system is new, the drivers will be the most up to date. You
have no idea how long a particular device or included drivers were on the
shelf before the system was shipped.
I am in no way saying it isn't memory, that might well be the case. With a
problem such as this, it's well worth testing.
Good luck.
--
Michael Solomon MS-MVP
Windows Shell/User
Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
"JD" > wrote in message
...
> Thanks. I will try that memory test.
> BTW, this is a fairly new computer, with all OEM drivers (Gateway).
> "Tashtego" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Michael -
>> Strong disagreement on four points.
>> 1.
>> Freezes in Win XP are fairly common in an application
>> such as Flight Simulator 2004... and they leave absolutely
>> no trace in Event Viewer. That makes it hard to run down.
>> 2.
>> The latest driver is NOT necessarily the greatest driver,
>> any more than the latest Corvette transmission is the
>> right transmission for a two year old Caddy. One of
>> the newer ATI cards is the Radeon 9600XT. The latest
>> ATI driver s/w is Catalyst 4.2... yet ATI Tech support
>> recommends Catalyst 3.7 to reduce number of freezes in
>> Flight Simulator, and it helps a lot.
>> 3.
>> In December, Microsoft included a new ATI driver in their
>> updates. I've found this driver to be even better than
>> the Catalyst 3.7 and highly recommend it to anyone using
>> an ATI card and having freezes. The statement "Use the
>> latest driver" is the standard mantra in too many cases.
>> The better answer is use the "best matched" driver for
>> your card, and the app that you're having the most trouble
>> with. Call Tech support or really STUDY their web site.
>> 4.
>> Don't jump to the conclusion that it's most likely a
>> driver issue. All sorts of users are having freezes with
>> Windows XP and the cures are split almost 50-50 between
>> hardware problems and software problems.
>>
>> With due respect to the fine efforts of MVP's, your quick
>> shoot-from-the-hip answer will seldom track down the real
>> cause of an elusive "freeze".
>>
>> Freezes are often caused by a bad stick of memory.
>> Use Google to find "MemTest86". It's free. Download and
>> use it. It really helps to locate bad memory.
>>
>> Heat in your computer can lead to freezes. Take the
>> side panel off for a while. Clean the dust off of fans
>> and heat-sinks.
>>
>> Tash ----------------------------------------------------
>>
>> >-----Original Message-----
>> >Anything that causes a freeze is an error. I'd be quite
>> surprised if
>> >nothing is referenced in event viewer, did you check all
>> sections and scroll
>> >for errors or is anything at all being listed.
>> >
>> >Yes, it is most likely a driver issue, you should also do
>> as I suggested
>> >with regard to placing the XP CD in the drive and
>> selecting Check System
>> >Compatibility. Even if XP came preinstalled on a system,
>> you add things to
>> >it, hardware, software, etc. any of which could cause issues.
>> >
>> >--
>> >Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>> >Windows Shell/User
>> >Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>> >DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>> >
>> >"JD" > wrote in message
>> ...
>> >> Michael,
>> >> Thanks for the information. However, the problem here is
>> not errors that
>> >> might be tracked down. Nor are there any "events."
>> >> The problem is complete freeze-ups. No mouse, no
>> keyboard, no power off
>> >> switch.
>> >> You do mention device drivers. That could be a cause of
>> freezes of this
>> >> kind?
>> >> "Michael Solomon (MS-MVP Windows Shell/User)"
>> > wrote in
>> >> message ...
>> >>> First, be sure your antivirus software has the latest
>> definitions and run
>> >> a
>> >>> virus scan.
>> >>>
>> >>> Second, download, install and run Ad Aware:
>> >>> www.lavasoftusa.com
>> >>> Note: you should always be well backed up before
>> running an application
>> >>> of
>> >>> this type.
>> >>>
>> >>> If your system is clear of viruses, open Control Panel,
>> open System, go
>> >>> to
>> >>> the Advanced tab, click Settings under Startup and
>> Recovery, remove the
>> >>> check from "Automatically Restart" under System
>> Failure. This will cause
>> >>> the system to blue screen instead of restarting on
>> errors and the
>> >>> information on the blue screen may give a clue as to
>> the source of the
>> >>> issue.
>> >>>
>> >>> Open Control Panel, open Administrative Tools, open
>> Event Viewer, look
>> >>> for
>> >>> errors corresponding to the crash, double click the
>> error, the
>> >>> information
>> >>> contained within may give a clue as to the
>> >>> source of the problem.
>> >>>
>> >>> Assuming you have an XP CD and not a recovery CD, place
>> the XP CD in the
>> >>> drive, when the setup screen appears, select "Check System
>> >>> Compatibility,"
>> >>> the report it generates may point to problem hardware
>> or software on your
>> >>> system. If you do not have an XP CD, you can download
>> this application
>> >>> known as the Upgrade Advisor from the following site:
>> >>>
>> http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/howtobuy/upgrading/advisor.asp
>> >>> Note: If you have access to a broadband connection it
>> might be best to
>> >>> download using that as this is a rather large download.
>> >>>
>> >>> Check for the latest drivers for your hardware,
>> especially your graphics
>> >>> card and soundcard and all peripherals connected to
>> your system. Do not
>> >> use
>> >>> Windows Update for this, go to the device
>> manufacturer's web sites and if
>> >>> you install updated drivers, ignore the message about
>> drivers being
>> >> unsigned
>> >>> by Microsoft.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> --
>> >>> Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>> >>> Windows Shell/User
>> >>> Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>> >>> DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>> >>>
>> >>> "JD" > wrote in message
>> >>> ...
>> >>> > It happens only rarely (four times in as many months)
>> and, so far at
>> >>> > least,
>> >>> > I've not lost any data, so it's been little more than
>> a nuisance.
>> >>> > There are no error messages. Windows reboots fine.
>> There's nothing in
>> >> the
>> >>> > Event logs. Checkdisk finds no errors, nor does Dr.
>> Watson.
>> >>> > If there's a pattern, it has only happened upon
>> closing IE.
>> >>> > Since I ran Windows 98 for five years without even
>> one freeze-up, and
>> >>> > since
>> >>> > XP is reputedly more stable than 98, I'm not inclined
>> to suspect the
>> >>> > OS.
>> >>> > What does that leave?
>> >>> > Device drivers, perhaps?
>> >>> > I can live with it, but I'd like to understand why it
>> happens.
>> >>> > Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
>> >>> >
>> >>> >
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >.
>> >
>
>
I have been running XP on several machines for over a year at work and at
home and have never had a freeze-up. The few odd problems we have had have
all been solved by running Ad-Aware and clearing out temp files.
"JD" > wrote in message
...
> It happens only rarely (four times in as many months) and, so far at
least,
> I've not lost any data, so it's been little more than a nuisance.
> There are no error messages. Windows reboots fine. There's nothing in the
> Event logs. Checkdisk finds no errors, nor does Dr. Watson.
> If there's a pattern, it has only happened upon closing IE.
> Since I ran Windows 98 for five years without even one freeze-up, and
since
> XP is reputedly more stable than 98, I'm not inclined to suspect the OS.
> What does that leave?
> Device drivers, perhaps?
> I can live with it, but I'd like to understand why it happens.
> Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
>
>
Tashtego
March 4th 04, 03:23 PM
Fair enough Michael -
The big remaining issue regards the usual advice...
"Get the latest driver" ... that's OFTEN BAD ADVICE!!
The latest driver has been written to best fit the
latest card. Why not?
There is NO good reason to ASSUME that it is going to
be BACKWARD COMPATIBLE... Maybe it is - Maybe it's not.
If you are having trouble, try anything. But if it ain't
broke - don't try to fix it.
regards - Tash -----------------------------------------
..
>-----Original Message-----
>Even with a new system, drivers change quickly and are
often overlooked as a
>potential source of issues because people make the mistake
of believing
>because the system is new, the drivers will be the most up
to date. You
>have no idea how long a particular device or included
drivers were on the
>shelf before the system was shipped.
>
>I am in no way saying it isn't memory, that might well be
the case. With a
>problem such as this, it's well worth testing.
>
>Good luck.
>
>--
>Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>Windows Shell/User
>Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>
>"JD" > wrote in message
...
>> Thanks. I will try that memory test.
>> BTW, this is a fairly new computer, with all OEM drivers
(Gateway).
>> "Tashtego" > wrote
in message
>> ...
>>> Michael -
>>> Strong disagreement on four points.
>>> 1.
>>> Freezes in Win XP are fairly common in an application
>>> such as Flight Simulator 2004... and they leave absolutely
>>> no trace in Event Viewer. That makes it hard to run down.
>>> 2.
>>> The latest driver is NOT necessarily the greatest driver,
>>> any more than the latest Corvette transmission is the
>>> right transmission for a two year old Caddy. One of
>>> the newer ATI cards is the Radeon 9600XT. The latest
>>> ATI driver s/w is Catalyst 4.2... yet ATI Tech support
>>> recommends Catalyst 3.7 to reduce number of freezes in
>>> Flight Simulator, and it helps a lot.
>>> 3.
>>> In December, Microsoft included a new ATI driver in their
>>> updates. I've found this driver to be even better than
>>> the Catalyst 3.7 and highly recommend it to anyone using
>>> an ATI card and having freezes. The statement "Use the
>>> latest driver" is the standard mantra in too many cases.
>>> The better answer is use the "best matched" driver for
>>> your card, and the app that you're having the most trouble
>>> with. Call Tech support or really STUDY their web site.
>>> 4.
>>> Don't jump to the conclusion that it's most likely a
>>> driver issue. All sorts of users are having freezes with
>>> Windows XP and the cures are split almost 50-50 between
>>> hardware problems and software problems.
>>>
>>> With due respect to the fine efforts of MVP's, your quick
>>> shoot-from-the-hip answer will seldom track down the real
>>> cause of an elusive "freeze".
>>>
>>> Freezes are often caused by a bad stick of memory.
>>> Use Google to find "MemTest86". It's free. Download and
>>> use it. It really helps to locate bad memory.
>>>
>>> Heat in your computer can lead to freezes. Take the
>>> side panel off for a while. Clean the dust off of fans
>>> and heat-sinks.
>>>
>>> Tash ----------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> >-----Original Message-----
>>> >Anything that causes a freeze is an error. I'd be quite
>>> surprised if
>>> >nothing is referenced in event viewer, did you check all
>>> sections and scroll
>>> >for errors or is anything at all being listed.
>>> >
>>> >Yes, it is most likely a driver issue, you should also do
>>> as I suggested
>>> >with regard to placing the XP CD in the drive and
>>> selecting Check System
>>> >Compatibility. Even if XP came preinstalled on a system,
>>> you add things to
>>> >it, hardware, software, etc. any of which could cause
issues.
>>> >
>>> >--
>>> >Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>>> >Windows Shell/User
>>> >Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>>> >DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>>> >
>>> >"JD" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>> >> Michael,
>>> >> Thanks for the information. However, the problem here is
>>> not errors that
>>> >> might be tracked down. Nor are there any "events."
>>> >> The problem is complete freeze-ups. No mouse, no
>>> keyboard, no power off
>>> >> switch.
>>> >> You do mention device drivers. That could be a cause of
>>> freezes of this
>>> >> kind?
>>> >> "Michael Solomon (MS-MVP Windows Shell/User)"
>>> > wrote in
>>> >> message ...
>>> >>> First, be sure your antivirus software has the latest
>>> definitions and run
>>> >> a
>>> >>> virus scan.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Second, download, install and run Ad Aware:
>>> >>> www.lavasoftusa.com
>>> >>> Note: you should always be well backed up before
>>> running an application
>>> >>> of
>>> >>> this type.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> If your system is clear of viruses, open Control Panel,
>>> open System, go
>>> >>> to
>>> >>> the Advanced tab, click Settings under Startup and
>>> Recovery, remove the
>>> >>> check from "Automatically Restart" under System
>>> Failure. This will cause
>>> >>> the system to blue screen instead of restarting on
>>> errors and the
>>> >>> information on the blue screen may give a clue as to
>>> the source of the
>>> >>> issue.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Open Control Panel, open Administrative Tools, open
>>> Event Viewer, look
>>> >>> for
>>> >>> errors corresponding to the crash, double click the
>>> error, the
>>> >>> information
>>> >>> contained within may give a clue as to the
>>> >>> source of the problem.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Assuming you have an XP CD and not a recovery CD, place
>>> the XP CD in the
>>> >>> drive, when the setup screen appears, select "Check
System
>>> >>> Compatibility,"
>>> >>> the report it generates may point to problem hardware
>>> or software on your
>>> >>> system. If you do not have an XP CD, you can download
>>> this application
>>> >>> known as the Upgrade Advisor from the following site:
>>> >>>
>>>
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/howtobuy/upgrading/advisor.asp
>>> >>> Note: If you have access to a broadband connection it
>>> might be best to
>>> >>> download using that as this is a rather large download.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Check for the latest drivers for your hardware,
>>> especially your graphics
>>> >>> card and soundcard and all peripherals connected to
>>> your system. Do not
>>> >> use
>>> >>> Windows Update for this, go to the device
>>> manufacturer's web sites and if
>>> >>> you install updated drivers, ignore the message about
>>> drivers being
>>> >> unsigned
>>> >>> by Microsoft.
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>> --
>>> >>> Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>>> >>> Windows Shell/User
>>> >>> Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>>> >>> DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>>> >>>
>>> >>> "JD" > wrote in message
>>> >>> ...
>>> >>> > It happens only rarely (four times in as many months)
>>> and, so far at
>>> >>> > least,
>>> >>> > I've not lost any data, so it's been little more than
>>> a nuisance.
>>> >>> > There are no error messages. Windows reboots fine.
>>> There's nothing in
>>> >> the
>>> >>> > Event logs. Checkdisk finds no errors, nor does Dr.
>>> Watson.
>>> >>> > If there's a pattern, it has only happened upon
>>> closing IE.
>>> >>> > Since I ran Windows 98 for five years without even
>>> one freeze-up, and
>>> >>> > since
>>> >>> > XP is reputedly more stable than 98, I'm not inclined
>>> to suspect the
>>> >>> > OS.
>>> >>> > What does that leave?
>>> >>> > Device drivers, perhaps?
>>> >>> > I can live with it, but I'd like to understand why it
>>> happens.
>>> >>> > Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
>>> >>> >
>>> >>> >
>>> >>>
>>> >>>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >.
>>> >
>>
>>
>
>
>.
>
Papa
March 4th 04, 06:02 PM
Whatever made you so angry? Cool down and enjoy life while you can.
Michael Solomon \(MS-MVP Windows Shell/User\)
March 4th 04, 08:02 PM
Thanks Tash.
The latest drivers for ATI cards are card specific. You download the driver
file in your group or family of cards and it should find your card and
install the proper drivers, drivers specific to your card.
Understand, I'm telling them to check drivers after they've already
discovered a problem of which a graphics driver might be the cause. If they
are having no issues, then my philosophy and advice is, if it ain't broke,
don't fix it. That said and this is not a lecture but an insight into my
reasoning, as people install updates and new applications, it changes the
environment and places new demands on the card. Of course, their drivers
might simply be corrupt. In any event, I will change that part of my
suggestion in the future to first remove and reinstall the drivers for the
card and to manually create a restore point before installing new drivers in
an effort to give them a quick recovery if it only makes things worse.
That said, most people never check for updated drivers, often have the
drivers that originally shipped with the system which in themselves were
often dated when the system was purchased. I can't make the same blanket
statement with regard to drivers that others have made but you have raised a
valid issue and an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure so I will
amend my instructions in the future to include the creation of a restore
point and make sure their data files are backed up in case things go wrong.
--
Michael Solomon MS-MVP
Windows Shell/User
Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
"Tashtego" > wrote in message
...
> Fair enough Michael -
> The big remaining issue regards the usual advice...
> "Get the latest driver" ... that's OFTEN BAD ADVICE!!
> The latest driver has been written to best fit the
> latest card. Why not?
> There is NO good reason to ASSUME that it is going to
> be BACKWARD COMPATIBLE... Maybe it is - Maybe it's not.
> If you are having trouble, try anything. But if it ain't
> broke - don't try to fix it.
> regards - Tash -----------------------------------------
> .
>>-----Original Message-----
>>Even with a new system, drivers change quickly and are
> often overlooked as a
>>potential source of issues because people make the mistake
> of believing
>>because the system is new, the drivers will be the most up
> to date. You
>>have no idea how long a particular device or included
> drivers were on the
>>shelf before the system was shipped.
>>
>>I am in no way saying it isn't memory, that might well be
> the case. With a
>>problem such as this, it's well worth testing.
>>
>>Good luck.
>>
>>--
>>Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>>Windows Shell/User
>>Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>>DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>>
>>"JD" > wrote in message
...
>>> Thanks. I will try that memory test.
>>> BTW, this is a fairly new computer, with all OEM drivers
> (Gateway).
>>> "Tashtego" > wrote
> in message
>>> ...
>>>> Michael -
>>>> Strong disagreement on four points.
>>>> 1.
>>>> Freezes in Win XP are fairly common in an application
>>>> such as Flight Simulator 2004... and they leave absolutely
>>>> no trace in Event Viewer. That makes it hard to run down.
>>>> 2.
>>>> The latest driver is NOT necessarily the greatest driver,
>>>> any more than the latest Corvette transmission is the
>>>> right transmission for a two year old Caddy. One of
>>>> the newer ATI cards is the Radeon 9600XT. The latest
>>>> ATI driver s/w is Catalyst 4.2... yet ATI Tech support
>>>> recommends Catalyst 3.7 to reduce number of freezes in
>>>> Flight Simulator, and it helps a lot.
>>>> 3.
>>>> In December, Microsoft included a new ATI driver in their
>>>> updates. I've found this driver to be even better than
>>>> the Catalyst 3.7 and highly recommend it to anyone using
>>>> an ATI card and having freezes. The statement "Use the
>>>> latest driver" is the standard mantra in too many cases.
>>>> The better answer is use the "best matched" driver for
>>>> your card, and the app that you're having the most trouble
>>>> with. Call Tech support or really STUDY their web site.
>>>> 4.
>>>> Don't jump to the conclusion that it's most likely a
>>>> driver issue. All sorts of users are having freezes with
>>>> Windows XP and the cures are split almost 50-50 between
>>>> hardware problems and software problems.
>>>>
>>>> With due respect to the fine efforts of MVP's, your quick
>>>> shoot-from-the-hip answer will seldom track down the real
>>>> cause of an elusive "freeze".
>>>>
>>>> Freezes are often caused by a bad stick of memory.
>>>> Use Google to find "MemTest86". It's free. Download and
>>>> use it. It really helps to locate bad memory.
>>>>
>>>> Heat in your computer can lead to freezes. Take the
>>>> side panel off for a while. Clean the dust off of fans
>>>> and heat-sinks.
>>>>
>>>> Tash ----------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> >-----Original Message-----
>>>> >Anything that causes a freeze is an error. I'd be quite
>>>> surprised if
>>>> >nothing is referenced in event viewer, did you check all
>>>> sections and scroll
>>>> >for errors or is anything at all being listed.
>>>> >
>>>> >Yes, it is most likely a driver issue, you should also do
>>>> as I suggested
>>>> >with regard to placing the XP CD in the drive and
>>>> selecting Check System
>>>> >Compatibility. Even if XP came preinstalled on a system,
>>>> you add things to
>>>> >it, hardware, software, etc. any of which could cause
> issues.
>>>> >
>>>> >--
>>>> >Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>>>> >Windows Shell/User
>>>> >Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>>>> >DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>>>> >
>>>> >"JD" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>> >> Michael,
>>>> >> Thanks for the information. However, the problem here is
>>>> not errors that
>>>> >> might be tracked down. Nor are there any "events."
>>>> >> The problem is complete freeze-ups. No mouse, no
>>>> keyboard, no power off
>>>> >> switch.
>>>> >> You do mention device drivers. That could be a cause of
>>>> freezes of this
>>>> >> kind?
>>>> >> "Michael Solomon (MS-MVP Windows Shell/User)"
>>>> > wrote in
>>>> >> message ...
>>>> >>> First, be sure your antivirus software has the latest
>>>> definitions and run
>>>> >> a
>>>> >>> virus scan.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Second, download, install and run Ad Aware:
>>>> >>> www.lavasoftusa.com
>>>> >>> Note: you should always be well backed up before
>>>> running an application
>>>> >>> of
>>>> >>> this type.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> If your system is clear of viruses, open Control Panel,
>>>> open System, go
>>>> >>> to
>>>> >>> the Advanced tab, click Settings under Startup and
>>>> Recovery, remove the
>>>> >>> check from "Automatically Restart" under System
>>>> Failure. This will cause
>>>> >>> the system to blue screen instead of restarting on
>>>> errors and the
>>>> >>> information on the blue screen may give a clue as to
>>>> the source of the
>>>> >>> issue.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Open Control Panel, open Administrative Tools, open
>>>> Event Viewer, look
>>>> >>> for
>>>> >>> errors corresponding to the crash, double click the
>>>> error, the
>>>> >>> information
>>>> >>> contained within may give a clue as to the
>>>> >>> source of the problem.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Assuming you have an XP CD and not a recovery CD, place
>>>> the XP CD in the
>>>> >>> drive, when the setup screen appears, select "Check
> System
>>>> >>> Compatibility,"
>>>> >>> the report it generates may point to problem hardware
>>>> or software on your
>>>> >>> system. If you do not have an XP CD, you can download
>>>> this application
>>>> >>> known as the Upgrade Advisor from the following site:
>>>> >>>
>>>>
> http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/howtobuy/upgrading/advisor.asp
>>>> >>> Note: If you have access to a broadband connection it
>>>> might be best to
>>>> >>> download using that as this is a rather large download.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Check for the latest drivers for your hardware,
>>>> especially your graphics
>>>> >>> card and soundcard and all peripherals connected to
>>>> your system. Do not
>>>> >> use
>>>> >>> Windows Update for this, go to the device
>>>> manufacturer's web sites and if
>>>> >>> you install updated drivers, ignore the message about
>>>> drivers being
>>>> >> unsigned
>>>> >>> by Microsoft.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> --
>>>> >>> Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>>>> >>> Windows Shell/User
>>>> >>> Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>>>> >>> DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> "JD" > wrote in message
>>>> >>> ...
>>>> >>> > It happens only rarely (four times in as many months)
>>>> and, so far at
>>>> >>> > least,
>>>> >>> > I've not lost any data, so it's been little more than
>>>> a nuisance.
>>>> >>> > There are no error messages. Windows reboots fine.
>>>> There's nothing in
>>>> >> the
>>>> >>> > Event logs. Checkdisk finds no errors, nor does Dr.
>>>> Watson.
>>>> >>> > If there's a pattern, it has only happened upon
>>>> closing IE.
>>>> >>> > Since I ran Windows 98 for five years without even
>>>> one freeze-up, and
>>>> >>> > since
>>>> >>> > XP is reputedly more stable than 98, I'm not inclined
>>>> to suspect the
>>>> >>> > OS.
>>>> >>> > What does that leave?
>>>> >>> > Device drivers, perhaps?
>>>> >>> > I can live with it, but I'd like to understand why it
>>>> happens.
>>>> >>> > Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
>>>> >>> >
>>>> >>> >
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >.
>>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>.
>>
Michael Solomon \(MS-MVP Windows Shell/User\)
March 4th 04, 08:21 PM
One other point, Tash, please understand that the advice I'm giving is
mostly a diagnostic aid. Also, while in this case the freeze showed no
errors in the error log, crashes often do. Last in the list of my
boilerplate response is to check for updated drivers. In my amended version
I will also mention they should look for references to those drivers in
their error log as one should follow the other....look for error log
references (which in this case did no good) and then check for updated
drivers. The process could be longer in that I could also suggest, in the
case of most other drivers, remove them and see if the problem goes away, if
it does, at least the problem is sourced, then reinstall the drivers, if the
problem returns, check for updated drivers for the device.
--
Michael Solomon MS-MVP
Windows Shell/User
Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
"Tashtego" > wrote in message
...
> Fair enough Michael -
> The big remaining issue regards the usual advice...
> "Get the latest driver" ... that's OFTEN BAD ADVICE!!
> The latest driver has been written to best fit the
> latest card. Why not?
> There is NO good reason to ASSUME that it is going to
> be BACKWARD COMPATIBLE... Maybe it is - Maybe it's not.
> If you are having trouble, try anything. But if it ain't
> broke - don't try to fix it.
> regards - Tash -----------------------------------------
> .
>>-----Original Message-----
>>Even with a new system, drivers change quickly and are
> often overlooked as a
>>potential source of issues because people make the mistake
> of believing
>>because the system is new, the drivers will be the most up
> to date. You
>>have no idea how long a particular device or included
> drivers were on the
>>shelf before the system was shipped.
>>
>>I am in no way saying it isn't memory, that might well be
> the case. With a
>>problem such as this, it's well worth testing.
>>
>>Good luck.
>>
>>--
>>Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>>Windows Shell/User
>>Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>>DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>>
>>"JD" > wrote in message
...
>>> Thanks. I will try that memory test.
>>> BTW, this is a fairly new computer, with all OEM drivers
> (Gateway).
>>> "Tashtego" > wrote
> in message
>>> ...
>>>> Michael -
>>>> Strong disagreement on four points.
>>>> 1.
>>>> Freezes in Win XP are fairly common in an application
>>>> such as Flight Simulator 2004... and they leave absolutely
>>>> no trace in Event Viewer. That makes it hard to run down.
>>>> 2.
>>>> The latest driver is NOT necessarily the greatest driver,
>>>> any more than the latest Corvette transmission is the
>>>> right transmission for a two year old Caddy. One of
>>>> the newer ATI cards is the Radeon 9600XT. The latest
>>>> ATI driver s/w is Catalyst 4.2... yet ATI Tech support
>>>> recommends Catalyst 3.7 to reduce number of freezes in
>>>> Flight Simulator, and it helps a lot.
>>>> 3.
>>>> In December, Microsoft included a new ATI driver in their
>>>> updates. I've found this driver to be even better than
>>>> the Catalyst 3.7 and highly recommend it to anyone using
>>>> an ATI card and having freezes. The statement "Use the
>>>> latest driver" is the standard mantra in too many cases.
>>>> The better answer is use the "best matched" driver for
>>>> your card, and the app that you're having the most trouble
>>>> with. Call Tech support or really STUDY their web site.
>>>> 4.
>>>> Don't jump to the conclusion that it's most likely a
>>>> driver issue. All sorts of users are having freezes with
>>>> Windows XP and the cures are split almost 50-50 between
>>>> hardware problems and software problems.
>>>>
>>>> With due respect to the fine efforts of MVP's, your quick
>>>> shoot-from-the-hip answer will seldom track down the real
>>>> cause of an elusive "freeze".
>>>>
>>>> Freezes are often caused by a bad stick of memory.
>>>> Use Google to find "MemTest86". It's free. Download and
>>>> use it. It really helps to locate bad memory.
>>>>
>>>> Heat in your computer can lead to freezes. Take the
>>>> side panel off for a while. Clean the dust off of fans
>>>> and heat-sinks.
>>>>
>>>> Tash ----------------------------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> >-----Original Message-----
>>>> >Anything that causes a freeze is an error. I'd be quite
>>>> surprised if
>>>> >nothing is referenced in event viewer, did you check all
>>>> sections and scroll
>>>> >for errors or is anything at all being listed.
>>>> >
>>>> >Yes, it is most likely a driver issue, you should also do
>>>> as I suggested
>>>> >with regard to placing the XP CD in the drive and
>>>> selecting Check System
>>>> >Compatibility. Even if XP came preinstalled on a system,
>>>> you add things to
>>>> >it, hardware, software, etc. any of which could cause
> issues.
>>>> >
>>>> >--
>>>> >Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>>>> >Windows Shell/User
>>>> >Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>>>> >DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>>>> >
>>>> >"JD" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>> >> Michael,
>>>> >> Thanks for the information. However, the problem here is
>>>> not errors that
>>>> >> might be tracked down. Nor are there any "events."
>>>> >> The problem is complete freeze-ups. No mouse, no
>>>> keyboard, no power off
>>>> >> switch.
>>>> >> You do mention device drivers. That could be a cause of
>>>> freezes of this
>>>> >> kind?
>>>> >> "Michael Solomon (MS-MVP Windows Shell/User)"
>>>> > wrote in
>>>> >> message ...
>>>> >>> First, be sure your antivirus software has the latest
>>>> definitions and run
>>>> >> a
>>>> >>> virus scan.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Second, download, install and run Ad Aware:
>>>> >>> www.lavasoftusa.com
>>>> >>> Note: you should always be well backed up before
>>>> running an application
>>>> >>> of
>>>> >>> this type.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> If your system is clear of viruses, open Control Panel,
>>>> open System, go
>>>> >>> to
>>>> >>> the Advanced tab, click Settings under Startup and
>>>> Recovery, remove the
>>>> >>> check from "Automatically Restart" under System
>>>> Failure. This will cause
>>>> >>> the system to blue screen instead of restarting on
>>>> errors and the
>>>> >>> information on the blue screen may give a clue as to
>>>> the source of the
>>>> >>> issue.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Open Control Panel, open Administrative Tools, open
>>>> Event Viewer, look
>>>> >>> for
>>>> >>> errors corresponding to the crash, double click the
>>>> error, the
>>>> >>> information
>>>> >>> contained within may give a clue as to the
>>>> >>> source of the problem.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Assuming you have an XP CD and not a recovery CD, place
>>>> the XP CD in the
>>>> >>> drive, when the setup screen appears, select "Check
> System
>>>> >>> Compatibility,"
>>>> >>> the report it generates may point to problem hardware
>>>> or software on your
>>>> >>> system. If you do not have an XP CD, you can download
>>>> this application
>>>> >>> known as the Upgrade Advisor from the following site:
>>>> >>>
>>>>
> http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/pro/howtobuy/upgrading/advisor.asp
>>>> >>> Note: If you have access to a broadband connection it
>>>> might be best to
>>>> >>> download using that as this is a rather large download.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Check for the latest drivers for your hardware,
>>>> especially your graphics
>>>> >>> card and soundcard and all peripherals connected to
>>>> your system. Do not
>>>> >> use
>>>> >>> Windows Update for this, go to the device
>>>> manufacturer's web sites and if
>>>> >>> you install updated drivers, ignore the message about
>>>> drivers being
>>>> >> unsigned
>>>> >>> by Microsoft.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> --
>>>> >>> Michael Solomon MS-MVP
>>>> >>> Windows Shell/User
>>>> >>> Backup is a PC User's Best Friend
>>>> >>> DTS-L.Org: http://www.dts-l.org/
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> "JD" > wrote in message
>>>> >>> ...
>>>> >>> > It happens only rarely (four times in as many months)
>>>> and, so far at
>>>> >>> > least,
>>>> >>> > I've not lost any data, so it's been little more than
>>>> a nuisance.
>>>> >>> > There are no error messages. Windows reboots fine.
>>>> There's nothing in
>>>> >> the
>>>> >>> > Event logs. Checkdisk finds no errors, nor does Dr.
>>>> Watson.
>>>> >>> > If there's a pattern, it has only happened upon
>>>> closing IE.
>>>> >>> > Since I ran Windows 98 for five years without even
>>>> one freeze-up, and
>>>> >>> > since
>>>> >>> > XP is reputedly more stable than 98, I'm not inclined
>>>> to suspect the
>>>> >>> > OS.
>>>> >>> > What does that leave?
>>>> >>> > Device drivers, perhaps?
>>>> >>> > I can live with it, but I'd like to understand why it
>>>> happens.
>>>> >>> > Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
>>>> >>> >
>>>> >>> >
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >.
>>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>.
>>
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