File permissions/ownership on XP systems
 

I'm having problems creating files from across my LAN to a shared drive
on a Win XP system. In the properties for the shared folder, the "allow
network users to change my files" box is checked.

There is no problem if I edit a file, and save the updated version. But
if I try to do a "Save as" - which creates a new file rather than
updating an existing one - it objects. I get an error message saying
"This security ID may not be assigned as the owner of this object"

I first noticed it when using RoboCopy across my network from a Win 7
laptop to the XP desktop. When we go away from home, we copy selected
folders from the XP system to the laptop in order to work on them while
away. When we return, we copy changed and new files back, using
RoboCopy. I've noticed recently that any updated files get copied back
ok, but any new ones don't - with an error which says:

"ERROR 1307 (0x0000051B) Copying File {filename} This security ID may
not be assigned as the owner of this object" [Which is obviously the
same basic problem as described above]

I'm pretty sure that it had used to work, but I can't work out what has
changed. I'm not sure whether it's an XP issue or a W7 issue. Any clues?
What and where do I need to set or change permissions to make this work
properly?
--
Cheers,
Roger
____________
Please reply to Newsgroup. Whilst email address is valid, it is seldom
checked.

File permissions/ownership on XP systems
 

Roger Mills wrote:
I'm having problems creating files from across my LAN to a shared drive
on a Win XP system. In the properties for the shared folder, the "allow
network users to change my files" box is checked.

There is no problem if I edit a file, and save the updated version. But
if I try to do a "Save as" - which creates a new file rather than
updating an existing one - it objects. I get an error message saying
"This security ID may not be assigned as the owner of this object"

I first noticed it when using RoboCopy across my network from a Win 7
laptop to the XP desktop. When we go away from home, we copy selected
folders from the XP system to the laptop in order to work on them while
away. When we return, we copy changed and new files back, using
RoboCopy. I've noticed recently that any updated files get copied back
ok, but any new ones don't - with an error which says:

"ERROR 1307 (0x0000051B) Copying File {filename} This security ID may
not be assigned as the owner of this object" [Which is obviously the
same basic problem as described above]

I'm pretty sure that it had used to work, but I can't work out what has
changed. I'm not sure whether it's an XP issue or a W7 issue. Any clues?
What and where do I need to set or change permissions to make this work
properly?

There's a suggestion here.

https://serverfault.com/questions/23...scheduled-task

"The account used to perform the copy must have the
"Restore files and directories" user right to change the owner
to anything other than itself or Administrators.

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/l...=ws.10%29.aspx

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/pre...0%28v=ws.10%29

Ownership

Ownership can be taken by the following: ...
"

I only picked this, because you're using Robocopy, and maybe you're
using Task Scheduler or something to drive it.

Paul

File permissions/ownership on XP systems
 

On 27/04/2018 15:52, Paul wrote:
Roger Mills wrote:
I'm having problems creating files from across my LAN to a shared
drive on a Win XP system. In the properties for the shared folder, the
"allow network users to change my files" box is checked.

There is no problem if I edit a file, and save the updated version.
But if I try to do a "Save as" - which creates a new file rather than
updating an existing one - it objects. I get an error message saying
"This security ID may not be assigned as the owner of this object"

I first noticed it when using RoboCopy across my network from a Win 7
laptop to the XP desktop. When we go away from home, we copy selected
folders from the XP system to the laptop in order to work on them
while away. When we return, we copy changed and new files back, using
RoboCopy. I've noticed recently that any updated files get copied back
ok, but any new ones don't - with an error which says:

"ERROR 1307 (0x0000051B) Copying File {filename} This security ID may
not be assigned as the owner of this object" [Which is obviously the
same basic problem as described above]

I'm pretty sure that it had used to work, but I can't work out what
has changed. I'm not sure whether it's an XP issue or a W7 issue. Any
clues? What and where do I need to set or change permissions to make
this work properly?

There's a suggestion here.

https://serverfault.com/questions/23...scheduled-task


"The account used to perform the copy must have the
"Restore files and directories" user right to change the owner
to anything other than itself or Administrators.

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/l...=ws.10%29.aspx

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/pre...0%28v=ws.10%29


Ownership

Ownership can be taken by the following: ...
"

I only picked this, because you're using Robocopy, and maybe you're
using Task Scheduler or something to drive it.

Paul

Thanks for your reply, Paul.

I had seen some of this stuff when Googling the problem, but don't
really understand it. Most of the stuff it refers to only applies to
Server-2003 or XP-Pro - and I am using XP-Home!

I'd also seen the bit which you quote about "The account used to perform
the copy must have the "Restore files and directories" user right to
change the owner to anything other than itself or Administrators."

But it doesn't give any clues as to how - or where (i.e. on the XP or W7
system in my case) - to set this.

Any further ideas?
--
Cheers,
Roger
____________
Please reply to Newsgroup. Whilst email address is valid, it is seldom
checked.

File permissions/ownership on XP systems
 

Roger Mills wrote:
On 27/04/2018 15:52, Paul wrote:
Roger Mills wrote:
I'm having problems creating files from across my LAN to a shared
drive on a Win XP system. In the properties for the shared folder, the
"allow network users to change my files" box is checked.

There is no problem if I edit a file, and save the updated version.
But if I try to do a "Save as" - which creates a new file rather than
updating an existing one - it objects. I get an error message saying
"This security ID may not be assigned as the owner of this object"

I first noticed it when using RoboCopy across my network from a Win 7
laptop to the XP desktop. When we go away from home, we copy selected
folders from the XP system to the laptop in order to work on them
while away. When we return, we copy changed and new files back, using
RoboCopy. I've noticed recently that any updated files get copied back
ok, but any new ones don't - with an error which says:

"ERROR 1307 (0x0000051B) Copying File {filename} This security ID may
not be assigned as the owner of this object" [Which is obviously the
same basic problem as described above]

I'm pretty sure that it had used to work, but I can't work out what
has changed. I'm not sure whether it's an XP issue or a W7 issue. Any
clues? What and where do I need to set or change permissions to make
this work properly?

There's a suggestion here.

https://serverfault.com/questions/23...scheduled-task



"The account used to perform the copy must have the
"Restore files and directories" user right to change the owner
to anything other than itself or Administrators.

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/l...=ws.10%29.aspx

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/pre...0%28v=ws.10%29



Ownership

Ownership can be taken by the following: ...
"

I only picked this, because you're using Robocopy, and maybe you're
using Task Scheduler or something to drive it.

Paul

Thanks for your reply, Paul.

I had seen some of this stuff when Googling the problem, but don't
really understand it. Most of the stuff it refers to only applies to
Server-2003 or XP-Pro - and I am using XP-Home!

I'd also seen the bit which you quote about "The account used to perform
the copy must have the "Restore files and directories" user right to
change the owner to anything other than itself or Administrators."

But it doesn't give any clues as to how - or where (i.e. on the XP or W7
system in my case) - to set this.

Any further ideas?

As Administrator I presume:

control userpasswords2

It looks like this, but I cannot vouch for which "group"
value, added to a restricted account, would give the
desired result.

https://s31.postimg.cc/mzm9a4a5n/userpasswords2.gif

The "Backup Group" is supposed to be the group that
you add so an ordinary user can run backups (which
capture files from all different accounts). So in the
example image, it's the closest thing I can think of.

And all the picture does, is illustrate the concept for
WinXP. It's not a guarantee I understand this stuff :-)

The thing is, something run from Task Scheduler is supposed
to be run with SYSTEM account privilege. Which isn't even
listed in that dialog. Usually a Task Scheduler also contains
an option to run as some other account. One of the reasons
some people (ab)use Task Scheduler, is just so a command
can run as SYSTEM. But it doesn't guarantee that Robocopy
will be doing the right thing.

Robocopy also has options for controlling what is
copied, like "datso" for NTFS. Which is supposed to
"preserve stuff".

Now, you have a metric ton of options, none of which
is "convincingly good".

The system that picture was taken from is a bit different,
in that the WinXP is installed on FAT32, and not NTFS. Whether
that affects the account items shown, is just another
variable.

Paul

File permissions/ownership on XP systems
 

On 27/04/2018 21:04, Paul wrote:
Roger Mills wrote:
On 27/04/2018 15:52, Paul wrote:
Roger Mills wrote:
I'm having problems creating files from across my LAN to a shared
drive on a Win XP system. In the properties for the shared folder, the
"allow network users to change my files" box is checked.

There is no problem if I edit a file, and save the updated version.
But if I try to do a "Save as" - which creates a new file rather than
updating an existing one - it objects. I get an error message saying
"This security ID may not be assigned as the owner of this object"

I first noticed it when using RoboCopy across my network from a Win 7
laptop to the XP desktop. When we go away from home, we copy selected
folders from the XP system to the laptop in order to work on them
while away. When we return, we copy changed and new files back, using
RoboCopy. I've noticed recently that any updated files get copied back
ok, but any new ones don't - with an error which says:

"ERROR 1307 (0x0000051B) Copying File {filename} This security ID may
not be assigned as the owner of this object" [Which is obviously the
same basic problem as described above]

I'm pretty sure that it had used to work, but I can't work out what
has changed. I'm not sure whether it's an XP issue or a W7 issue. Any
clues? What and where do I need to set or change permissions to make
this work properly?

There's a suggestion here.

https://serverfault.com/questions/23...scheduled-task



"The account used to perform the copy must have the
"Restore files and directories" user right to change the owner
to anything other than itself or Administrators.

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/l...=ws.10%29.aspx

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/pre...0%28v=ws.10%29



Ownership

Ownership can be taken by the following: ...
"

I only picked this, because you're using Robocopy, and maybe you're
using Task Scheduler or something to drive it.

Paul

Thanks for your reply, Paul.

I had seen some of this stuff when Googling the problem, but don't
really understand it. Most of the stuff it refers to only applies to
Server-2003 or XP-Pro - and I am using XP-Home!

I'd also seen the bit which you quote about "The account used to
perform the copy must have the "Restore files and directories" user
right to change the owner to anything other than itself or
Administrators."

But it doesn't give any clues as to how - or where (i.e. on the XP or
W7 system in my case) - to set this.

Any further ideas?

As Administrator I presume:

control userpasswords2

It looks like this, but I cannot vouch for which "group"
value, added to a restricted account, would give the
desired result.

https://s31.postimg.cc/mzm9a4a5n/userpasswords2.gif

The "Backup Group" is supposed to be the group that
you add so an ordinary user can run backups (which
capture files from all different accounts). So in the
example image, it's the closest thing I can think of.

And all the picture does, is illustrate the concept for
WinXP. It's not a guarantee I understand this stuff :-)

The thing is, something run from Task Scheduler is supposed
to be run with SYSTEM account privilege. Which isn't even
listed in that dialog. Usually a Task Scheduler also contains
an option to run as some other account. One of the reasons
some people (ab)use Task Scheduler, is just so a command
can run as SYSTEM. But it doesn't guarantee that Robocopy
will be doing the right thing.

Robocopy also has options for controlling what is
copied, like "datso" for NTFS. Which is supposed to
"preserve stuff".

Now, you have a metric ton of options, none of which
is "convincingly good".

The system that picture was taken from is a bit different,
in that the WinXP is installed on FAT32, and not NTFS. Whether
that affects the account items shown, is just another
variable.

Paul


Thanks again, Paul. It all sounds very complicated!

I suspect that I'm missing something simple, somewhere along the line.
To some extent, Robocopy may be a red herring. True, that's where I
first noticed the problem. But I get exactly the same error when I use
Windows Explorer et al to copy a new file, as opposed to an updated
file, to the XP system.

I'm sure that if I could make a simple copy work, the Robocopy stuff
would work, too.

Anyone else got any ideas?
--
Cheers,
Roger
____________
Please reply to Newsgroup. Whilst email address is valid, it is seldom
checked.

File permissions/ownership on XP systems
 

"Roger Mills" wrote

| Anyone else got any ideas?

If it were me I'd share everything on a FAT32
partition. I don't see any reason to fiddle with
permissions hassles outside of a system that
needs restrictions, like corporat or gov't computers.

But that may not be a useful idea for you. I
don't know who's on your LAN. For that matter,
I don't see any reason to have the security risks
of a LAN. The rare times when I want to put
a file on another computer I just walk down
the hall with a USB stick.