On 05/11/2014 10:52 AM, Paul wrote:
Remember that USENET is an unreliable medium. One post can take five
seconds to propagate, the next can take 24 hours. It's easy for two
posters to be seeing different (incomplete) thread contents.
At one time, we could count on Google Groups, to have a "third opinion"
on what posts were there or not, but the newer alt.* groups aren't
visible on Google Groups*
So are you saying that Ken1943 posts using Google groups? If Ken1943
were I wouldn't see any of his posts.
I have checked the thread a couple of times. And not in the same
session. And just did this session.
If he posted another time let him prove it.
Without attempting to reproduce and study what is seen in the original
post, I'd make these observations.
1) Internet Explorer consists of a "visible part" (a traditional browser
window) and in "invisible part" (HTML engine).
2) When you "remove" Internet Explorer, you cannot remove all of it.
To satisfy EU requirements, removing the visible part, is sufficient
to give the user "choice" in a browser. Perhaps removing a
single file, such as iexplore.exe, achieves this result.
This has nothing to do with EU requirements. Look at mt previous post;
as to my and Microsoft's
comments on that. There are no iexplore.exe in my file system now. I
look through the whole file system myself, yesit took some time, after
doinga search for it turned up nothing. I did a search for the file
specifically and for just Internet Explorer generally.
3) When a user clicks a .chm file, that's something like Compressed HTML.
The "iehtml.dll" engine, parses the file and renders a help window on
the screen. Thus, a core set of files from IE, remain on the computer.
If you removed all of IE, certain help windows would not work. Maybe
Windows 7 gadgets wouldn't work, or a myriad of other things coded in
Javascript and HTML. I would expect some remnant of the software to
remain, even if the engine files are not stored in a folder labeled
Internet Explorer.
I only disable it the way Microsoft said to. No removal of all of IE
happened. If I did remove IE completely how is it still starting up when
a link is clicked? The only way you can delete IE completely is to go
into your file system and delete all of IE manually. I doubt that
Windows would allow you to do that, unless maybe as the built in Admin
and in my version of 8.1I don't have the capability of making myself
that. And IE 11 is not in Programs and Features in the uninstall program
part of it.
4) In terms of file removal, Windows 8 is like a book keeper who retains
two sets of books. When the OS is initially installed, files are added
to the "Store". The files have very long file names, capturing version
information, or a CLSID or a GUID, that sort of thing.
To activate a file, Windows creates a hard link in the Windows folder.
Two hard links can point to the same set of data clusters on the disk
(this is an NTFS feature, and why a modern OS can't install on FAT32).
If there are two hard links to a file, and you delete one of the hard
links, it has no effect on the data clusters on the disk. Only when
all hard links pointing to the data clusters are removed, is the file
truly deleted.
So when you see iexplore.exe go missing, it doesn't really mean it
is deleted. You would have to look in the store, and see if something
with a similar name "iexplore" plus version information, some sort
of identifier, is also removed or not.
Take a look at what Microsoft says about disabling IE and what happens
when you do. I already did a search for ieplore.exe, Internet Explorer
and variations of them. Windows did not find any other links to IE.
For things that are Windows Features, they could even be stored in
other places for all I know. So they can be restored when the
tick box in Programs and Features is ticked again. Something has
to keep a file manifest, of what needs to be hard linked in.
That's exactly what Microsoft states. The files that they hide are in a
folder somewhere in the system that can't be seen so IE cannot startup,
but will be restored if IE is reenabled. I don't remember off hand what
type of file Microsoft said it would be.
5) When you untick the box, to remove Internet Explorer, it doesn't
remove it.
The iehtml engine in this case, will remain at version IE11.
I never said remove. I said disable.
6) If you unistall the program, it takes the version down a notch, to
IE10.
I don't think you can uninstall IE 11 as there is no reference to IE 11
in Program and Settings in the uninstall programs part. Also IE 11 was
built for Windows 8. Will IE 10 work in 8 I don't know. Microsoft also
stated that they would be offering IE 11 to Windows 7 users in the
future sometime.
You would then have iexplore.exe. If you untick the box to remove
Internet
Explorer, the iehtml engine would remain at IE10.
Can't uninstall IE 11. Can only disable it. So no there would be no
iexplore.exe for IE 10 there., as you wouldn't be going down a "notch"
to IE 10.
7) You can keep removing versions of Internet Explorer, until you get to
the version distributed with the OS, whatever that is. That one cannot
be removed. Unticking the box for IE as a browser, removes the
linkage for iexplore.exe but leaves the iehtml engine to render
.chm files or other things.
I know that. You can only remove IE 11 manually if Window's will let
you. I doubt that it would let you remove the files it needs. When you
disable IE it only hides certain files from the system so they can be
restored if the want arises sometime.
You keep repeating yourself.
For a reference to iexplore.exe to exist, all it would take is
for a registry entry, to point to the "store" version of the file,
rather than the iexplore.exe hard link stored elsewhere. They should
not do that. That would break the maintenance features of the OS,
and why the store exists in the first place.
If the "store" version of the file was hidden or moved, moved and hidden
are both done. If the file is moved, hidden, or renamed the registry key
would not be able to find it and so could do nothing.
If Microsoft says you can disable IE without breaking anything and tells
you how to do it, then you can do it. Microsoft says that when disabling
certain files are moved and others are kept so nothing breaks. So am I
to believe you or Microsoft.
Microsoft is not going to tell you, or let you, do something that breaks
the system.
Now, do I want to tear my copy of Windows 8 apart to verify all
of the above ? Not really. Sure, I could do a backup, tear it up,
and do a restore, but that's a lot of work. I would need to make
a file manifest both before and after using the tick box, and
notice what got removed. And from Linux, attempt to use the
fake inode numbers, to see what file pointers are hard linked together.
So you are saying that you don't believe what Microsoft says can and
will be done if you do it?
*******
Perhaps it would be better, to use Process Explorer when the "missing"
copy of iexplore.exe seems to be running, check the path claimed for
the executable, and see if such a file exists. That might be
easier than researching how the whole thing works.
I'm not trying to research the way the whole thing works, except to find
out why it's not working.
Or even use Process Monitor, to catch the Windows loader, loading up
the executable. Stop the trace, after the IE windows finishes rendering.
Process Explorer and Process Monitor, are here.
http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/s...rnals/bb545027
Now you are actually mentioning something helpful. Thanks.
Paul
--
Caver1