Thread: XP Validation
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Old January 3rd 18, 03:37 AM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general,alt.windows7.general
Diesel
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Default XP Validation

Java Jive news Tue, 02 Jan 2018 23:31:23 GMT in alt.windows7.general, wrote:

On 02/01/2018 02:01, Diesel wrote:
Java Jive
news alt.windows7.general, wrote:

On 29/12/2017 05:53, Diesel wrote:

You have a couple of options...You can continue trying via the
browser method, but, you need to update ie6 to atleast sp1 or,
go with ie8.

Alternatively, you can try this from console to bring up the
activation window I described above and go from there. Keep in
mind, it renders in html, so if your copy of ie is foobared,
this may not work. Each line requires you to press enter after
it, naturally.

open cmd.exe via start/run
cd\windows\system32\oobe
msoobe /a

Of the options presented, online activation probably isn't
going to work.

It depends whether the key is really legit. I activated a
laptop with XP earlier this year.


Well, it's a little more complicated than that, actually. There's
several types of legit keys and they won't all activate these
days with the simple online activation option. A completely legit
key can still fail to be accepted using that method. Been there,
done it, many times.


I suspect that your failures can be classed under the heading
"Microsoft no longer activates NEW keys"!


ROFL. Actually, no. I suppose I should just save us both some time and
trouble with the ****ing contest and disclose the fact I'm actually a
certified computer technician (comptia as well as novell and a couple
of old hp certs too, oh and a long since expired ms certification that
I didn't give two ****s about when I got it; hence it's expired and has
been for over a decade or more now) with two honorary masters in
computer science and program design.

I've been doing IT professionally for a long time. What I've discussed
concerning product activation, keys, etc as well as advice I offer on
occasion comes from being in the field. Not as a home user
experimenting and playing around. I've built thousands of custom boxes,
and performed service work on thousands more. anything from a desktop
to a laptop to an embedded 'console' like system.

Just how many 'new' keys do you think are out there, anyhow? The hash
for the keys MS released years ago are already on the database the
update service references and they were before those product key
stickers ever shipped out. There's no such thing as a 'new' key in that
sense. There's some keys which weren't activated yet as a result of
customers not having them in their possession and/or not actually using
them, but, that doesn't make the key new to MS. It just makes it an
unused key. I didn't have issues with online activation on what you
call 'new' keys either, that primarily happened on machines which had
already been activated with the key on the sticker. The second online
activation option usually resolved the issue, but, on a rare occasion
I'd have to talk to a rep and explain that I was a technician who
replaced a hard disk, or replaced a mainboard under warranty and
required re-activation. MS understood perfectly well that mainboards
could be toasted for a variety of reasons, bad storms, etc, and hard
drives do fail from time to time. So they didn't run me around circles
or anything, they just forked the 'codes' the machine wanted once I
read off the codes on the screen.

I can recall only one instance where the rep wouldn't activate the key
for me, but the customer did tell me they let their kid/family member
have a copy of the key for use on their own machine, so in that
instance, I agreed with the rep and we purchased the customer a new
key. As technically, they did pirate it.

Otherwise, never had a problem. And like I said, the only times the
automated online activation failed and sent me to the computer to get
the codes was when a 'major' hardware component was changed out and the
key was already marked as activated on MS end. And rarely did that fail
and force me to speak to an understanding rep. I believe the ones that
required a rep to talk to me had been activated on more than one
occasion. Which was the case with a particular system we serviced. It
was originally sent to us because the hard disk failed. A few months
later, the mainboard took a lightning strike; so.. completely
understandable in that situation.


Wait, I lied. There's actually another option, but, it's not
exactly a legal one. That is, if you really want to keep XP
pro. You'll have to reinstall it, from scratch though.

No, not really viable, as the rebuilt installation will not get
any updates, not even the ones originally targeting XP.


Wrong answer. You've evidently never heard of WSUS.


I've certainly heard of it, but I've not tried using it an that
situation. But it's still the correct answer in that running
Windows Update won't find any updates.


Who said anything about using Windows update to get the updates? I
didn't. Updates aren't issued for XP anymore, unless something major
and drastic occurs and MS feels obligated for some reason to 'fix it'
due to the amount of XP machines still in service, not including ATM
machines still running it. Yes, I wrote ATM machines. And I'm not even
including POS (point of sale, not pile or piece of **** for
clarification although most are) machines at various retail/fast food
joints that also use it. Although some have migrated to atleast Windows
7, not all have.

If you're going to load a fresh copy of Windows XP on something that
still supports it, you're going to want updates and system drivers. It
would be foolish to assume you'll get the updates via windows update
since it's not a supported os any longer. Which means, you'll have to
get those updates another way. Windows update built into Windows XP
won't get them, but MS servers still have them available. So, you can
get them manually yourself, or use WSUS and save yourself much time and
frustration. It also significantly reduces reload time, since you don't
have to wait to download updates one by one and apply them. For a
techie (I'm guessing you aren't, or, you're new to the world of techie)
it's a real time saver. Works with later editions of Windows too.

You originally stated that the rebuilt installation will not get
updates, and, that's only partially correct. It won't, on it's own,
but, that doesn't mean it can't get them period. As, it damn well can,
via the methods I described above. So your remark is only partially
right and misleading as a result. And amusingly, advice provided in
contrast to mine because you haven't personally used WSUS to do this,
where as I have, long before XP was officially discontinued infact;
because it saves time and bandwidth. Which frees you up to work on
other machines that have more serious issues going on. Which makes you
more $$$

All of that being said, there was a time period when official support
ended but windows update from XP would still pull updates for you; I
don't know when that was shut down, or for sure if it has been since
it's been awhile since I've used it on an XP machine as I prefer to use
WSUS because it's much quicker. I could very well be wrong, but, I'm
going to assume due to the amount of time that's passed since
officially being discontinued that XP won't pull updates on it's own
anymore, but I haven't tested this theory in a long time. The next
time, mostly to humour and further educate myself, I might just do
that. Or, I might load XP in a VM and see if it can get updates.

When XP was still supported, it made no sense forcing each machine that
was reloaded or freshly built to use windows update initially chewing
up time and bandwidth as they did so when you could insert a dvd and
bring it up to the most recent updates available at the time the dvd
was created. Then you could let it do windows update (when it still
worked) and finish getting the updates you were missing. At some point
though (I forget the exact date) no more updates were forth coming so
using the updated dvd you created with WSUS (if you worked in a shop
like me) was all you needed to do, as it had them all at that point.

I didn't spend all day working on a single machine or two as a home
user or hobbyist might do; I had benches full of broken machines and
more waiting to be serviced. I didn't have the luxury of ****ing around
as a home user or hobbyist would. It wasn't uncommon for me (not even
including other techs at the same place) to be working on 8 or more
machines at once. And when one or more came off the work bench to be
checked out by another tech to make sure nothing was missed, another
machine going on the bench to replace the one (or more) that came off.
That's how it works if you know what you're doing, and your known for
your work by reputation because you have alot of stuff to work on
because people trust you to do it right, the first time. otherwise,
they wouldn't bring it to you and you wouldn't have **** to work on;
and that's bad for business.

Oh drat, I forgot about another possible option. You'll have to
do your own homework/searching for it, but, there's a program
out there that can trick it into thinking it's activated. I
personally wouldn't recommend this manner of activation as,
well, it's a bandaid approach on a good day.

Or ...

On 28/12/2017 23:32, FreeMan wrote:

Where do I look in Windows to get the product key ?

Buy via eBay a for-spares-or-repairs PC or component from a
similar model and identical make of PC that has a valid, already
activated product key but for which the original PC is known to
be dead and has not been used for quite a while. For example,
many Dell laptops have their XP and Vista Product Keys on a
cover of a compartment on the base, for which I suspect you
could just buy the cover for a few dollars or quid. You may
have to try two or three before you get one that works.


That product key isn't the one that was used to install Windows
on the machine, though. And, the key may/may not be accepted by
Microsoft, especially if it's been used before or used a certain
amount of times already by others who followed the same poorly
thought out advice you offered.


It's based on an actual test I did.



Okay, so for your test, the key on the product sticker was the one used
to load it previously, vs the SLIC key being used in it's place as it
would originally have been if it had been a name brand PC that was
preloaded from factory.

The key used during the initial preload from factory is NOT the key
visible on your sticker. That key is for you, in the event you decide
to reload from scratch and not opt for the preload it originally
shipped with; assuming you have media to do so. As in, a full blown OEM
media disc, not retail. But, it's an unmarked oem disc, has no vendor
specific information, no vendor specific jpegs, and no SLIC option.
It's plain jane. requires the key on your sticker. And will require
activation, where as the SLIC load does not, because it's mated to an
ID in the machines system BIOS.

Which is typically the 'manufacturer' string present in name brand
systems BIOS firmware.

You do realize of course, that you actually suggested piracy with your
suggestion? As technically, it's not the amount of time that's gone by
since the computer died, it's the fact the computer died and the key
technically dies with it when that happens. And, as I wrote previously,
you the would be buyer has no way of knowing how many times someone
else has already harvested and re-used that key. So you're taking a
chance on buying a key that's been activated one too many times and
may/may not be honored by the rep with MS, if both online activation
options fail to do it for you.

And you certainly don't want to tell the rep what you advised the OP to
do in so far as how you got that key. They will turn you down on the
spot if you did, politely, but turn you down non the less.

Rather than risk parting with funds for a key that may/may not still be
honored, the OP might as well seek out a VLK iso and use a VLK based
key and be done with the entire activation (prove you bought me)
nonsense for the remainder of that computers life. No matter what
hardware they swap out or how many times they change hard drives.
You'll never trip the product activation because VLK edition of XP
doesn't do product activation. It's discontinued/unsupported software
at this point and my suggestion to go with VLK and forget the ebay
business is no different from a piracy/legality perspective than yours
is. What's more, the vlk edition can be loaded on as many machines as
the OP has that run XP using the same key. And none of them will ever
complain about validation, activation, or anything else along those
lines, ever. VLK is the way to go if you're still remaining with XP. It
makes no sense to do otherwise.

If the OP needs a trusted source of VLK edition and valid key for it,
they need look no further than myself. They could even hash the iso I
offer to verify I didn't dick with it. I have VLK sp3 slipstreamed
right onto it, so you don't even need to apply a service pack. Another
time saving thing you do as a technician. And, I'd even be willing to
fork over a cherished VLK key that is valid and won't be blacklisted. I
say cherised because it's not from a keygen and it's not something
you're going to find via an online search as it hasn't been published
to the web. That's one of the benefits of being a tech for as long as I
have. You get various goodies to add to your collection over time.

That being said, you can copy the cd contents to a folder on your hard
disk, along with the boot sector, and swap out four binary files to
convert it to a manufacturer specific, SLIC enabled disc; no activation
required as long it's loaded on the manufacturer you chose equipment.
You'd then take the 'new disc' and reburn it, including the boot area;
obviously. So you could brand discs if you needed to do so, as in, a
repair shop environment. Ie, make a Dell specific disk, hp, whatever,
without actually having to have one of those in stock.

You could also convert home to pro and vise versa with those same
binary files and a single original OEM cd image. What's more, the
original OEM image can also be converted to retail branded or unbranded
with the same four files.

In case you aren't getting it, four files on the discs determines what
the disc is, and how it's going to work along with which types of keys
it'll accept and whether or not it's going to require activation,
depending on the machine you intend to load it on. If you don't have an
Hp disc but you need one and have those four files, you can make one.
Same with Dell, etc. What you don't get by doing this process is the
extras various vendors preinstalled along with windows. this just lets
you get windows and not have to keep physical media for each vendor for
reloading purposes when working on machines. Not that it applies much
these days, because, well, XP isn't a supported OS anymore.

So the aforementioned information is mostly a history lesson for techs
who didn't already know about this and non techs alike. I still make
use of it, because, well, I have to be able to work on machines that
still run older copies of Windows for various reasons. *shrug* One of
the drawbacks of being a tech, I suppose.

The electrical trade by comparison is much simpler in those respects.
Alot less crap to keep track of. Not trying to be a wiseass with you,
but, I'm an electrician well. got into the trade originally as a side
thing a little over a decade go and just couldn't walk away from it.

In other words, I can wire your house or your office or small
industrial shop and spec/build your network right down to the
individual computers which will be the network once it's completed. I'm
no carpenter or plumber though. I can do sheetrock too, but, you're
better off hiring someone else for that. It's not something I ever
claimed to be super fast at doing, although my work looks good. And
that's not because I enjoy doing sheetrock, it's because I was raised
to take pride in what you do. Your name's going on it, it better be
right kind of parental upbringing.

The laptop I activated earlier this year was part of a test I
ran, not originally intended for actual use, but as it happens I
reloaded that image a few days ago to see what would happen, and
it's still activated.


Why wouldn't it be? Did you expect it to magically deactivate or
something?


I thought it possible that Microsoft might have changed something
in their rules for OS's that are no longer supported - it
wouldn't have surprised me to find that they had.


Sure, they could do that, but, why would they bother? You already paid
for the license and you honored your end of the deal. The license
technically dies when the computer does, but, they have no way of
determining it's time of death.

Cut out the know-it-all superior tone, because two significant
mistakes in your post show that you obviously don't know it all!


I didn't have a know it all tone with you. I provided the OP sound
advice and you decided to put your two cents in without having all the
details. I accept the fact I incorrectly assumed the machine you tested
with was still factory preloaded, that you didn't wipe it out and use
another key and disc to reinstall it. That's not necessarily a mistake
on my part though as you didn't provide many specific details
concerning the computer. I simply went from experience on that one.
But, you may claim it as a mistake on my part if it makes you feel
better. After this reply, it probably would do your ego some good.

Most home users when they reload (those that do it themselves anyway),
typically use the cds that either came with the machine or the cds they
created after they got the machine home, negating any need to enter a
product key or do any sort of product activation because they are SLIC
based key loads and don't require the user entering any key or
proceeding with any product activation. It's already done during the
windows install/boot into desktop view phases for their benefit and
convenience, as well as time saver for the original vendor. Be it Dell
or HP.

However, I didn't make a mistake concerning Windows updates, despite
you incorrectly assuming I did and having to include 'using windows
update' to make your statement seem correct.

Incidently, in corp and some small business environments, you do NOT
want Windows update doing anything on it's own to any machine on your
network; you want to vet those updates before you commit them IF you
commit them, not all may/will apply to you or your situation. Down
machines due to MS **** ups is money and time lost. And please don't
pretend to tell me or anyone else reading that MS never borked a
machine with a bad update forced upon them via windows update; and it
would be forced if they had automatic updates set to on. Patch tuesday
in the It world isn't a good day. It's a '****, we're going to get an
increase in tech support calls and walk in questions, and, additional
dead/no longer booting machines if MS broke something this coming
tuesday'. It's a day we learned to dread, infact.

sorry if you got the mistaken impression I had a superior know it all
attitude with you, but, that's a case of you misunderstanding me, not
me trying to talk down to you. I don't mind this, because, well, you
knew nothing about me prior to this conversation and seemed to assume I
was a normal everyday end user, or perhaps, hobbyist. I'm neither. Now
you know.



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