Gregg Hill wrote:
"Alias" wrote in message
...
Gregg Hill wrote:
Copyright violation in the US is a federal offense
I don't live in the US.


I know you don't, but you said it is only a civil offense in the US. I
pointed out that it is a federal offense. I don't speak lawyerese. To me,
theft is still theft, whether punishable under civil or criminal law, or no
law at all.

What you call theft others call fair use. It's a subjective thing and
may have something to do with your upbringing. I am against theft and
all my software licenses are paid for but the prospect of buying one
license and being able to install it on the three computers I own is
appealing.




Using the software for which you have not paid is copyright violation .
A civil offense.


Whether a civil offense or criminal offense, theft is theft. It is not only
an issue of law, it is an issue of morals. Taking something that does not
belong to you is immoral.

But MS defines if you're taking something or not, not you or any higher
moral authority. If you could legally install XP or Vista on all your
home computers and only have to buy one license, you would do it and not
consider it theft.






If you did not pay for it, and you are using a copy of someone else's
software, whether illegal civilly or criminally, it is still illegal, and
it is still theft.
No, it's a civil offense. Interesting how MS' EULA gives them the right to
change the rules at any time but if you go back on your agreement, you
think they should be locked up and have their lives ruined.

If there is no profit motive, where I live, it is not a crime or a civil
offense.


But there IS a profit motive. By not paying for it, you haved PROFITED!!!
directly by saving the amount of money you SHOULD have paid for that
product, according to the EULA to which you technically agreed by your use
of the software.

No, that's MS' profit motive, not allowing someone to install something
they bought on as many computers they want to in the privacy of their home.





I define "theft" as taking something that does not belong to you and
which you have no right to use.
Who decides what belongs to whom and who has the right to use it, you?



No, not me. In this case, Microsoft's EULA, which you technically agree to
by your use of the software, defines who has the right to use it.

Thanks for confirming my point. MS is the law, eh? Interesting concept.

On a
broader scale, if I walked into your house and took your TV, would that be
theft?

If you want to copy my TV and leave me the original, be my guest.

According to your standards, it seems it would only be theft if you
could prove that you owned it. What if you could not find your receipt? I
guess you would be OK with me taking it. Cool! What's your address?

Keep trying, maybe you'll come up with a comparable analogy.





That transcends your requirement for it to be a criminal act.
No, that is your vague opinion of what theft is.


My opinion was not vague. If it does not belong to you, or you have no right
to use it, and you take it, it is theft. If I lived in a country that had no
laws of any kind, but I took another man's car that he had purchased, it
would still be theft. It is a moral issue as well as an issue of law.
Apparently, you lack the moral fortitude to understand that concept. Not
much I can do about that.

I buy XP. It belongs to me. The country I live in says I can do what I
want to with it in the privacy of my home and you call it theft.







In your country, is the Microsoft EULA written to allow use of someone
else's Volume License Key to run the Microsoft software? If not, then it
is still theft.
Not if there's no profit motive. If you copy XP and sell the copy, you're
in trouble. If you copy it and put it on another computer or give it to a
friend, you aren't. It will be really interesting to read the new EULA now
that this is law here. I'll be sure and post it ;-)


Again, there IS a profit motive. Each person who does not pay for the copy
he/she uses has PROFITED directly by not having to fork out the few bucks
for the software. That is an economic profit.

The only profit motive you're talking about comes from MS.




I would prefer to be on high moral ground than to be an underground rat
that steals from people.

Gregg
There's no reason to refer to me as an "underground rat" or "an
unscrupulous person". Can you please stick to the issues and avoid
personal attacks?


OK, I'll take back the "rat" comment, but I stand by the "unscrupulous
person" tag, for the reasons mentioned above. I pitty your neighbors when
they buy something nice and you take it. What? You would never do that? Sure
you would...you say it's OK to do it with software, why not your neighbor's
possessions?

Gregg

Casual copying is not the same as stealing a TV set. I am against
stealing. I just disagree with you regarding casual copying of software
with no profit motive (reselling the software, as whether one would buy
it or not if one had to pay is not established and speculation).

Alias





Alias



"Alias" wrote in message
...
Gregg Hill wrote:
Software piracy is no different than someone who walks into your house
and steals your computer, TV, jewels, etc. It is THEFT. I'll bet you
would be upset if someone stole YOUR belongings, but you seem to think
it is OK to do just because Bill has more money than you do.
Um, in the country where I live, sharing software is called "fair use"
and is not illegal at all as long as there is no financial gain. Oops.
In the USA, if you copy XP that you paid for, it is NOT theft but
copyright violation, a civil, not criminal, offense.

Don't be such an unscrupulous person.

Gregg
Get off your high moral horse and do some research before you stick your
hoof in your mouth again.

Alias
"Alias" wrote in message
...
Bruce Chambers wrote:
wrote:
These keys have been reported few times in June, but are still valid
up
to this moment !!

Well, we'll see. Microsoft can't do much about the contents of
Chinese
web sites, but they can, if they so desire, disable those keys.
They don't desire to do that. They are still saturating the Chinese
market.

In the meantime, let's hope that Microsoft at least prosecutes you
for
aiding and abetting in software piracy.
That'll be the day! MS take someone to court to uphold their scammy
EULA? Give me a break.

Alias