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OT water cooling the cpu and graphics card, hardware?



 
 
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  #1  
Old February 20th 18, 04:04 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
Mike S[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 496
Default OT water cooling the cpu and graphics card, hardware?

My buddy wants to use a water cooler to keep his cpu and graphics card
as cool as possible. Can anyone recommend a model that works well. He's
not concerned about cost. TIA
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  #2  
Old February 20th 18, 05:25 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11,873
Default OT water cooling the cpu and graphics card, hardware?

Mike S wrote:
My buddy wants to use a water cooler to keep his cpu and graphics card
as cool as possible. Can anyone recommend a model that works well. He's
not concerned about cost. TIA


In the old days, you'd shop for all the parts, hoses, barbs, pumps,
reservoirs, rad with fans, hook it all together, fill, bleed the air out
and pray there were no leaks.

Now, the commodity liquid cooling are pre-assembled units. A
"short loop".

To match that, there are some cases with space to bolt a rad.
So maybe one rad gets bolted to the top of the case, blowing
upwards or something. You need a bigger case, to support this
kind of cooling.

If you just wanted to cool a CPU it would be pretty easy.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...rs,4181-2.html

This is an example of a huge block for a video card, that covers
GPU and memory. It obviously only covers a few video card SKUs.
You can also get water blocks just for the GPU, but then you probably
want RAM sinks and a bit of airflow for the RAM.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...ling,4975.html

This is an example of a factory water cooled Frontier Edition
card. This would probably go for $2000 used if you could find
one. This is to show an integrated solution that the manufacturer
thought was sufficient to prevent throttling. The card underneath
this, has no RAM chips showing. All the RAM is HBM stacks inside
the GPU package area. The end of the card is voltage regulator circuitry.

https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Graphi...-Cooled-Review

A site like this is good for window shopping, and will
give you additional search terms for your Googling.

http://www.frozencpu.com/

The forum on Extremesystems, had a forum per "cooling type", but
the sticky at the front looks pretty old. I don't know if
you'd find enough materials there to piece together a
solution or not.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...Liquid-Cooling

You need a lot more information to start a design, and
you still have to find some good recent comparison articles.

On older cards, the mounting holds on the cards followed
a kind of standard. You could say, make a cooling solution,
put four arms on it for the bracket, and drill three holes
in each arm. And that pattern would handle "small/medium/large"
GPU designs for one company. But with some of the recent
video cards, they could be breaking that pattern. And
satisfying designs with HBM/HBM2 memory next to the
GPU can be difficult, because the HBM coming from the
stack suppliers, aren't exactly the same height. This is
causing nightmares for even the manufacturing of air cooled
cards by the big companies. Let alone someone doing a
custom cooler.

So you'd start by taking inventory of the hardware, looking
to see how many dual-140mm-fan rads you could fit and so on.
And decide whether you're going full custom, buying components,
filling and bleeding, or alternately, using two integrated
kits that are already filled and ready to go.

Once you've removed all the fans in the case by doing that,
you have to go back and review the VCore heatsink and see if
it needs some assistance. And look around for other heat sources
or sensitive components, that will need retrofitted cooling
because you switched to water.

Just a few days ago, I saw a *power supply* with liquid cooling.
And it was expensive too. Ya talk about dippy concepts. I want
one to go with my solid gold toilet in the bathroom :-)

Paul
  #3  
Old February 20th 18, 06:22 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
Paul in Houston TX[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 999
Default OT water cooling the cpu and graphics card, hardware?

Mike S wrote:
My buddy wants to use a water cooler to keep his cpu and graphics card as cool as
possible. Can anyone recommend a model that works well. He's not concerned about cost. TIA


My only suggestion is to get ones that fit the case.
I have a Cooler Master 120 for the cpu. The cpu has never gotten above 67C.
The vid card has never gotten above 35C so does not need aux cooling.
Those numbers are with intensive graphics.

  #4  
Old February 20th 18, 07:32 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
Mike S[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 496
Default OT water cooling the cpu and graphics card, hardware?

On 2/19/2018 9:22 PM, Paul in Houston TX wrote:
Mike S wrote:
My buddy wants to use a water cooler to keep his cpu and graphics card
as cool as
possible. Can anyone recommend a model that works well. He's not
concerned about cost. TIA


My only suggestion is to get ones that fit the case.
I have a Cooler Master 120 for the cpu.Â* The cpu has never gotten above
67C.
The vid card has never gotten above 35C so does not need aux cooling.
Those numbers are with intensive graphics.


Thank Paul, I'll have him pay close attention to his video card temp
when doing intensive gaming and fwd this post to him. Might be a non-issue.

  #5  
Old February 20th 18, 07:38 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
Mike S[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 496
Default OT water cooling the cpu and graphics card, hardware?

On 2/19/2018 8:25 PM, Paul wrote:
Mike S wrote:
My buddy wants to use a water cooler to keep his cpu and graphics card
as cool as possible. Can anyone recommend a model that works well.
He's not concerned about cost. TIA


In the old days, you'd shop for all the parts, hoses, barbs, pumps,
reservoirs, rad with fans, hook it all together, fill, bleed the air out
and pray there were no leaks.

Now, the commodity liquid cooling are pre-assembled units. A
"short loop".

To match that, there are some cases with space to bolt a rad.
So maybe one rad gets bolted to the top of the case, blowing
upwards or something. You need a bigger case, to support this
kind of cooling.

If you just wanted to cool a CPU it would be pretty easy.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...rs,4181-2.html

This is an example of a huge block for a video card, that covers
GPU and memory. It obviously only covers a few video card SKUs.
You can also get water blocks just for the GPU, but then you probably
want RAM sinks and a bit of airflow for the RAM.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...ling,4975.html


This is an example of a factory water cooled Frontier Edition
card. This would probably go for $2000 used if you could find
one. This is to show an integrated solution that the manufacturer
thought was sufficient to prevent throttling. The card underneath
this, has no RAM chips showing. All the RAM is HBM stacks inside
the GPU package area. The end of the card is voltage regulator circuitry.

https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Graphi...-Cooled-Review


A site like this is good for window shopping, and will
give you additional search terms for your Googling.

http://www.frozencpu.com/

The forum on Extremesystems, had a forum per "cooling type", but
the sticky at the front looks pretty old. I don't know if
you'd find enough materials there to piece together a
solution or not.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...Liquid-Cooling

You need a lot more information to start a design, and
you still have to find some good recent comparison articles.

On older cards, the mounting holds on the cards followed
a kind of standard. You could say, make a cooling solution,
put four arms on it for the bracket, and drill three holes
in each arm. And that pattern would handle "small/medium/large"
GPU designs for one company. But with some of the recent
video cards, they could be breaking that pattern. And
satisfying designs with HBM/HBM2 memory next to the
GPU can be difficult, because the HBM coming from the
stack suppliers, aren't exactly the same height. This is
causing nightmares for even the manufacturing of air cooled
cards by the big companies. Let alone someone doing a
custom cooler.

So you'd start by taking inventory of the hardware, looking
to see how many dual-140mm-fan rads you could fit and so on.
And decide whether you're going full custom, buying components,
filling and bleeding, or alternately, using two integrated
kits that are already filled and ready to go.

Once you've removed all the fans in the case by doing that,
you have to go back and review the VCore heatsink and see if
it needs some assistance. And look around for other heat sources
or sensitive components, that will need retrofitted cooling
because you switched to water.

Just a few days ago, I saw a *power supply* with liquid cooling.
And it was expensive too. Ya talk about dippy concepts. I want
one to go with my solid gold toilet in the bathroom :-)

Â*Â* Paul


Thanks very much Paul, interesting and informative post, as always. I'll
have him do very close temperature monitoring under heavy loads and look
at the space inside the case and graphics card type (if it comes to
that) and start doing the research.
  #6  
Old February 20th 18, 01:04 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
J. P. Gilliver (John)[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,679
Default OT water cooling the cpu and graphics card, hardware?

In message , Paul
writes:
[]
Just a few days ago, I saw a *power supply* with liquid cooling.
And it was expensive too. Ya talk about dippy concepts. I want
one to go with my solid gold toilet in the bathroom :-)

Paul


I'd feel very uneasy about liquid in close proximity to the mains
voltage part of the computer (whether your 110 or our 220-240 volts)! Or
do these things use non-conductive liquids? (If so, what?)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

No sense being pessimistic. It wouldn't work anyway.
- Penny Mayes, UMRA, 2014-August
  #7  
Old February 20th 18, 07:28 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11,873
Default OT water cooling the cpu and graphics card, hardware?

J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , Paul
writes:
[]
Just a few days ago, I saw a *power supply* with liquid cooling.
And it was expensive too. Ya talk about dippy concepts. I want
one to go with my solid gold toilet in the bathroom :-)

Paul


I'd feel very uneasy about liquid in close proximity to the mains
voltage part of the computer (whether your 110 or our 220-240 volts)! Or
do these things use non-conductive liquids? (If so, what?)


You could easily use Fluorinert as the working fluid.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluorinert

However, knowing how cheap power supply companies are, you
know it's not filled with that. Fluorinert is $500 a gallon.

Our thermal people at work, did some experiments with it, and
decided it was more trouble than it was worth. I originally
learned of the existence of the stuff, at a trade show, where
a CRT TV set is "half immersed" in it. You can't allow the
"big red wire" on the TV set, to be covered with the fluid.
But it will take a good deal of high voltage without a problem.
(It has no problem with B++ voltages.) It's just not a good idea
to apply 15kV to it (might depend on how clean everything is,
whether the fluid is clean or dirty before being loaded into
the demo). You can completely immerse regular vacuum tubes in it.

*******

It could be that the liquid PSU has a "preferred orientation", in
which case if it leaks, the liquid runs away from the dangerous
bits. Or, you could always passivate the entire HV section.
In the same way that a microwave oven might receive a conformal
coating in the HV section to protect against moisture/cooking salt
effects. No matter how it's done, I cannot imagine a product
liability analyst giving that a pass.

Paul
  #8  
Old February 20th 18, 07:48 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
s|b
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,496
Default OT water cooling the cpu and graphics card, hardware?

On Mon, 19 Feb 2018 19:04:33 -0800, Mike S wrote:

My buddy wants to use a water cooler to keep his cpu and graphics card
as cool as possible. Can anyone recommend a model that works well. He's
not concerned about cost. TIA


Have you tried alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt and/or alt.comp.hardware?
It may not look like it, but there are still people subscribed to those
newsgroups.

--
s|b
  #9  
Old February 21st 18, 07:52 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
Mike S[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 496
Default OT water cooling the cpu and graphics card, hardware?

On 2/20/2018 10:48 AM, s|b wrote:
On Mon, 19 Feb 2018 19:04:33 -0800, Mike S wrote:

My buddy wants to use a water cooler to keep his cpu and graphics card
as cool as possible. Can anyone recommend a model that works well. He's
not concerned about cost. TIA


Have you tried alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt and/or alt.comp.hardware?
It may not look like it, but there are still people subscribed to those
newsgroups.


I couldn't talk the owner out of it, he has a really good job and is
learning about computers, so this is just another chapter. Even if the
whole machine blows up he could replace it without pain. It's funny
because it's not running hot, he has a great cooling scheme now, a huge
metal heat sink with a large fan on it, but he insists. So once I can
get him to analyze the graphics card temps (if that's possible) we'll
have the discussion again. Thanks for the additional newsgroup links.

  #10  
Old February 21st 18, 12:58 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
J. P. Gilliver (John)[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,679
Default OT water cooling the cpu and graphics card, hardware?

In message , Mike S
writes:
On 2/20/2018 10:48 AM, s|b wrote:
On Mon, 19 Feb 2018 19:04:33 -0800, Mike S wrote:

My buddy wants to use a water cooler to keep his cpu and graphics
card
as cool as possible. Can anyone recommend a model that works well. He's
not concerned about cost. TIA

Have you tried alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt and/or
alt.comp.hardware?
It may not look like it, but there are still people subscribed to those
newsgroups.


I couldn't talk the owner out of it, he has a really good job and is
learning about computers, so this is just another chapter. Even if the
whole machine blows up he could replace it without pain. It's funny
because it's not running hot, he has a great cooling scheme now, a huge
metal heat sink with a large fan on it, but he insists. So once I can
get him to analyze the graphics card temps (if that's possible) we'll
have the discussion again. Thanks for the additional newsgroup links.

Has he said _why_ he wants to do it - is it that he thinks it'll be
quieter than the present one, or is it just that he wants to play with
such a system (rather like steampunk)?
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

I'm the oldest woman on primetime not baking cakes.
- Anne Robinson, RT 2015/8/15-21
  #11  
Old February 22nd 18, 06:04 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
Mike S[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 496
Default OT water cooling the cpu and graphics card, hardware?

On 2/21/2018 3:58 AM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , Mike S writes:
On 2/20/2018 10:48 AM, s|b wrote:
On Mon, 19 Feb 2018 19:04:33 -0800, Mike S wrote:

My buddy wants to use a water cooler to keep his cpu and graphics card
as cool as possible. Can anyone recommend a model that works well. He's
not concerned about cost. TIA
Â*Have you tried alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt and/or alt.comp.hardware?
It may not look like it, but there are still people subscribed to those
newsgroups.


I couldn't talk the owner out of it, he has a really good job and is
learning about computers, so this is just another chapter. Even if the
whole machine blows up he could replace it without pain. It's funny
because it's not running hot, he has a great cooling scheme now, a
huge metal heat sink with a large fan on it, but he insists. So once I
can get him to analyze the graphics card temps (if that's possible)
we'll have the discussion again. Thanks for the additional newsgroup
links.

Has he said _why_ he wants to do it - is it that he thinks it'll be
quieter than the present one, or is it just that he wants to play with
such a system (rather like steampunk)?


He's having a good time building it up and learning in the process.
  #12  
Old February 22nd 18, 10:56 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
J. P. Gilliver (John)[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,679
Default OT water cooling the cpu and graphics card, hardware?

In message , Mike S
writes:
On 2/21/2018 3:58 AM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , Mike S writes:

[]
On Mon, 19 Feb 2018 19:04:33 -0800, Mike S wrote:

My buddy wants to use a water cooler to keep his cpu and graphics card
as cool as possible. Can anyone recommend a model that works well. He's
not concerned about cost. TIA

[]
I couldn't talk the owner out of it, he has a really good job and is
learning about computers, so this is just another chapter. Even if

[]
Has he said _why_ he wants to do it - is it that he thinks it'll be
quieter than the present one, or is it just that he wants to play with
such a system (rather like steampunk)?


He's having a good time building it up and learning in the process.


Fair enough; learning by experience is often the best way to learn, if
not the fastest.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Veni Vidi Visa [I came, I saw, I did a little shopping] - Mik from S+AS Limited
), 1998
  #13  
Old February 22nd 18, 09:09 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Jeff Barnett[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 298
Default OT water cooling the cpu and graphics card, hardware?

Mike S wrote on 2/19/2018 8:04 PM:
My buddy wants to use a water cooler to keep his cpu and graphics card
as cool as possible. Can anyone recommend a model that works well. He's
not concerned about cost. TIA


I would like to propose an alternative for your friend: the Cooler
Master V8 GTS available at https://www.newegg.com/ as well as other
places for about $90. It's a massive air cooler that I'm using on a
couple of installations with unlocked I7-4930K CPU's. The cases are also
rather large: the Rosewill BLACKHAWK-ULTRA. One computer is used for
games the other for PhotoShop. The ambient temperatures here vary
between 70F in the winter and 78F in the summer. I have never seen the
motherboard (ASUS X79 Deluxe) temperatures above 86F or the CPU
temperature above 92F. The higher temps have come when all 6 cores are
very busy usually with both process threads in use. I thought a lot
about water cooling and gave it up as a bad idea given so many reports
of bad experiences with liquid.

Note that the cooler is a monster and it is important to make sure it is
compatible with the height of your memory and that your PCI slots are
far enough away from the CPU. There are other combinations of air
coolers and large cases that will do the job. The recommended case comes
with a zillion relatively quite fans plus expansion room for many more.
--
Jeff Barnett

  #14  
Old February 23rd 18, 03:40 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
Bob_S[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 149
Default OT water cooling the cpu and graphics card, hardware?

"Paul" wrote in message news

Mike S wrote:
My buddy wants to use a water cooler to keep his cpu and graphics card as
cool as possible. Can anyone recommend a model that works well. He's not
concerned about cost. TIA


In the old days, you'd shop for all the parts, hoses, barbs, pumps,
reservoirs, rad with fans, hook it all together, fill, bleed the air out
and pray there were no leaks.

Now, the commodity liquid cooling are pre-assembled units. A
"short loop".

To match that, there are some cases with space to bolt a rad.
So maybe one rad gets bolted to the top of the case, blowing
upwards or something. You need a bigger case, to support this
kind of cooling.

If you just wanted to cool a CPU it would be pretty easy.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...rs,4181-2.html

This is an example of a huge block for a video card, that covers
GPU and memory. It obviously only covers a few video card SKUs.
You can also get water blocks just for the GPU, but then you probably
want RAM sinks and a bit of airflow for the RAM.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...ling,4975.html

This is an example of a factory water cooled Frontier Edition
card. This would probably go for $2000 used if you could find
one. This is to show an integrated solution that the manufacturer
thought was sufficient to prevent throttling. The card underneath
this, has no RAM chips showing. All the RAM is HBM stacks inside
the GPU package area. The end of the card is voltage regulator circuitry.

https://www.pcper.com/reviews/Graphi...-Cooled-Review

A site like this is good for window shopping, and will
give you additional search terms for your Googling.

http://www.frozencpu.com/

The forum on Extremesystems, had a forum per "cooling type", but
the sticky at the front looks pretty old. I don't know if
you'd find enough materials there to piece together a
solution or not.

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/...Liquid-Cooling

You need a lot more information to start a design, and
you still have to find some good recent comparison articles.

On older cards, the mounting holds on the cards followed
a kind of standard. You could say, make a cooling solution,
put four arms on it for the bracket, and drill three holes
in each arm. And that pattern would handle "small/medium/large"
GPU designs for one company. But with some of the recent
video cards, they could be breaking that pattern. And
satisfying designs with HBM/HBM2 memory next to the
GPU can be difficult, because the HBM coming from the
stack suppliers, aren't exactly the same height. This is
causing nightmares for even the manufacturing of air cooled
cards by the big companies. Let alone someone doing a
custom cooler.

So you'd start by taking inventory of the hardware, looking
to see how many dual-140mm-fan rads you could fit and so on.
And decide whether you're going full custom, buying components,
filling and bleeding, or alternately, using two integrated
kits that are already filled and ready to go.

Once you've removed all the fans in the case by doing that,
you have to go back and review the VCore heatsink and see if
it needs some assistance. And look around for other heat sources
or sensitive components, that will need retrofitted cooling
because you switched to water.

Just a few days ago, I saw a *power supply* with liquid cooling.
And it was expensive too. Ya talk about dippy concepts. I want
one to go with my solid gold toilet in the bathroom :-)

Paul



As usual, a long, exceptional and detailed explanation with examples of
products done to a "T".

I was just gonna post and say, "Turn the friggin water hose on it and
problem solved..."

But you have a faster keyboard than I do so I guess your answer will have to
do - this time...;-)


--
Bob S.

  #15  
Old February 23rd 18, 05:11 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
Mike S[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 496
Default OT water cooling the cpu and graphics card, hardware?

On 2/22/2018 12:09 PM, Jeff Barnett wrote:
Mike S wrote on 2/19/2018 8:04 PM:
My buddy wants to use a water cooler to keep his cpu and graphics card
as cool as possible. Can anyone recommend a model that works well.
He's not concerned about cost. TIA


I would like to propose an alternative for your friend: the Cooler
Master V8 GTS available at https://www.newegg.com/ as well as other
places for about $90. It's a massive air cooler that I'm using on a
couple of installations with unlocked I7-4930K CPU's. The cases are also
rather large: the Rosewill BLACKHAWK-ULTRA. One computer is used for
games the other for PhotoShop. The ambient temperatures here vary
between 70F in the winter and 78F in the summer. I have never seen the
motherboard (ASUS X79 Deluxe) temperatures above 86F or the CPU
temperature above 92F. The higher temps have come when all 6 cores are
very busy usually with both process threads in use. I thought a lot
about water cooling and gave it up as a bad idea given so many reports
of bad experiences with liquid.

Note that the cooler is a monster and it is important to make sure it is
compatible with the height of your memory and that your PCI slots are
far enough away from the CPU. There are other combinations of air
coolers and large cases that will do the job. The recommended case comes
with a zillion relatively quite fans plus expansion room for many more.


I'll fwd your message to the computer owner. Thanks Jeff.
 




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