Troubleshooting Enet-attached device

My home network is both wireless and wired.
Several PC's, printers, an AV receiver and UPS backup
are attached to Enet ports via 4-port switches. All of
them show up when I open Devices & Printers.

Now I have a new gadget (a Kenwood TS-890 ham transceiver)
that supports Enet but does NOT show in that listing and
I'm seeking help troubleshooting. I believe the
transceiver is "talking" to Enet; it can query a NTP
server to set its clock. That function worked properly
once I configured the server info. (I suspect there's
Linux running inside.)

I can find the device when I open up the router settings,
and I can ping it successfully, but when I try to connect
to it with Kenwood-supplied software it fails. (It also
has a USB port. That connection works fine.) The built-in
troubleshooter didn't find it.

Where should I look?

Jason wrote:

My home network is both wireless and wired.
Several PC's, printers, an AV receiver and UPS backup
are attached to Enet ports via 4-port switches. All of
them show up when I open Devices & Printers.

Now I have a new gadget (a Kenwood TS-890 ham transceiver)
that supports Enet but does NOT show in that listing and
I'm seeking help troubleshooting. I believe the
transceiver is "talking" to Enet; it can query a NTP
server to set its clock. That function worked properly
once I configured the server info. (I suspect there's
Linux running inside.)

I can find the device when I open up the router settings,
and I can ping it successfully, but when I try to connect
to it with Kenwood-supplied software it fails. (It also
has a USB port. That connection works fine.) The built-in
troubleshooter didn't find it.

Where should I look?

According to what little I saw in the manual that I downloaded from
Kenwood's site, the scenarios they show are with the TS-890 connected to
the broadband modem (with its internal router) or via a "hub" (which
might be just another router or switch in an intranet setup). Okay, but
the modem or router very likely have their own internal firewall. Did
you punch a hole in the modem/router's security to allow unsolicited
traffic to get to the TS-890, like define a port-forwarding rule in the
modem/router's firewall?

A diagram of your network setup would better help diagnose the situation
instead of assuming we know what you have. You could be using a gateway
host between segments of your intranet with its own firewalling or
rules, or you're trying to use access points between segments of your
intranet, or the host where you run the remoting software is on the
other side of a router or switch in your intranet from the network
segment where is your TS-890 and you need to punch holes in the security
settings in the router or switch.

Jason wrote:
My home network is both wireless and wired.
Several PC's, printers, an AV receiver and UPS backup
are attached to Enet ports via 4-port switches. All of
them show up when I open Devices & Printers.

Now I have a new gadget (a Kenwood TS-890 ham transceiver)
that supports Enet but does NOT show in that listing and
I'm seeking help troubleshooting. I believe the
transceiver is "talking" to Enet; it can query a NTP
server to set its clock. That function worked properly
once I configured the server info. (I suspect there's
Linux running inside.)

I can find the device when I open up the router settings,
and I can ping it successfully, but when I try to connect
to it with Kenwood-supplied software it fails. (It also
has a USB port. That connection works fine.) The built-in
troubleshooter didn't find it.

Where should I look?


https://www.kenwood.com/i/products/i...S-890S_IDM.pdf

The ARCP890 program probably needs an opened port on the
firewall. When the program is installed, it should be
setting this up itself. However, if you can find the
port requirements in the documentation, you might open
the port manually.

There is more bilge in a second manual. Page 42 or so.

https://www.kenwood.com/i/products/i...s_manual_e.pdf

They mention, for example, port forwarding 60001 for some
thru-the-router function. But only show a firewall
"permission" dialog where you're supposed to "allow"
anything the program wants to do. Since the function
claims to be VOIP, it might well be opening
multiple ports (as VOIP tends to separate the
control and data plane).

The executable is an Installshield, so I cannot quickly
check to see if there is yet another manual inside this.

https://www.kenwood.com/i/products/i...arcp890_e.html

It may be "free software" (whatever that means), but
no source is offered. A 25MB installer is big enough
for a Linux package to be packaged with QT5 for usage
on a Windows machine. It's an awfully big package
for a simple remote control.

Since it has a .NET 4.7 dependency, if that is missing,
either the program should install it by itself, or
there should be a dialog requesting that you install it.

Paul

VanguardLH and Paul, thanks for your replies. I have not
had a chance to fiddle with anything for a few days, but
will have some time later this week.

To my simple mind, locally connecting to the radio should
be about as hard as connecting a shared printer.

There is another publication that's just about networking,
https://www.kenwood.com/i/products/info/amateur/ts_
890/pdf/ts890_kns_manual_e.pdf

It shows how to configure everything both locally (simple)
and for control over the Internet. There is a diagram for
the simple case in section 3.1. That's my setup. The
router "sees" the device. Windows' Devices and Printers
page does not find it when I click Find a Device however.

More to follow.

On Mon, 16 Sep 2019 19:14:36 -0400, Jason wrote:

VanguardLH and Paul, thanks for your replies. I have not
had a chance to fiddle with anything for a few days, but
will have some time later this week.

To my simple mind, locally connecting to the radio should
be about as hard as connecting a shared printer.

There is another publication that's just about networking,
https://www.kenwood.com/i/products/i...s_manual_e.pdf

It shows how to configure everything both locally (simple)
and for control over the Internet. There is a diagram for
the simple case in section 3.1. That's my setup.

I agree with you. Connecting from within your LAN looks simple.

The router "sees" the device.

That's both irrelevant and unimportant. When you're trying to connect
from within your LAN, the router has nothing to do with it. You could
remove the router entirely, replacing it with a simple switch. That's
how unimportant the router is. Later, when connecting from within the
LAN is working properly, you can consider connecting from across the
Internet and in that case the router becomes important, from a port
forwarding perspective. Obviously, no port forwarding is required if you
stay within your LAN.

Windows' Devices and Printers
page does not find it when I click Find a Device however.

That's also irrelevant and won't affect operation.

More to follow.

In article ,
lid says...

That's both irrelevant and unimportant. When you're trying to connect
from within your LAN, the router has nothing to do with it. You could
remove the router entirely, replacing it with a simple switch.


Exactly. That's why I compared it to a shared printer.
Simple, right?

This is why I'm leaning toward something obscure(?) within
Windows - a setting somewhere I haven't found.

Tonight I'll try something I have not yet - to connect
from my laptop.

On Tue, 17 Sep 2019 21:49:56 -0400, Jason wrote:

In article ,
says...

That's both irrelevant and unimportant. When you're trying to connect
from within your LAN, the router has nothing to do with it. You could
remove the router entirely, replacing it with a simple switch.


Exactly. That's why I compared it to a shared printer.
Simple, right?

This is why I'm leaning toward something obscure(?) within
Windows - a setting somewhere I haven't found.

Tonight I'll try something I have not yet - to connect
from my laptop.

Are you trying to connect via its hostname or via its IP address? Have
you manually assigned an IP address that's within the subnet of your
LAN, or are you using DHCP? How are you supposed to connect? Is it via a
web browser, a telnet session, SSH, something else? Do you need to
explicitly try to connect to the destination on port 60000? (That's from
memory, I didn't go back and recheck.) What happens when you try to
connect? Is there an error message or does the request silently time
out?

By the way, are you familiar with network packet capture tools such as
Wireshark or Windump? Sometimes there's nothing better than being able
to see the packets as they traverse the network.

Char Jackson wrote:
On Tue, 17 Sep 2019 21:49:56 -0400, Jason wrote:

In article ,
lid says...
That's both irrelevant and unimportant. When you're trying to connect
from within your LAN, the router has nothing to do with it. You could
remove the router entirely, replacing it with a simple switch.

Exactly. That's why I compared it to a shared printer.
Simple, right?

This is why I'm leaning toward something obscure(?) within
Windows - a setting somewhere I haven't found.

Tonight I'll try something I have not yet - to connect
from my laptop.

Are you trying to connect via its hostname or via its IP address? Have
you manually assigned an IP address that's within the subnet of your
LAN, or are you using DHCP? How are you supposed to connect? Is it via a
web browser, a telnet session, SSH, something else? Do you need to
explicitly try to connect to the destination on port 60000? (That's from
memory, I didn't go back and recheck.) What happens when you try to
connect? Is there an error message or does the request silently time
out?

By the way, are you familiar with network packet capture tools such as
Wireshark or Windump? Sometimes there's nothing better than being able
to see the packets as they traverse the network.


The ARCP890 Windows program, loaded on a computer, is supposed to
connect to particular ports on the Kenwood, to perform remote control.
The ports are not named, for LAN operation. It's assumed the user
clicks the "Allow" button when the Windows Firewall complains that
ARPC890.exe is "dialing particular ports that aren't normally uses".

Paul

Char Jackson wrote:

That's both irrelevant and unimportant. When you're trying to connect
from within your LAN, the router has nothing to do with it.

For most home networks the router is most likely the DHCP server, that
would make it relevant, but doesn't look like it's causing any problem
in this case.

In article , lid says...
It's assumed the user
clicks the "Allow" button when the Windows Firewall complains that
ARPC890.exe is "dialing particular ports that aren't normally uses".

Windows is silent on the matter. I'd expect the behavior you cite, but
it doesn't happen.

In article ,
says...
For most home networks the router is most likely the DHCP server, that
would make it relevant, but doesn't look like it's causing any problem
in this case.

The fact that the radio can negotiate with ntp.pool.org to set its clock
tells me it's resolving names properly. In its setup I have the primary
DNS server set to the default - the router's address, and an external
one as secondary.

Jason wrote:
In article , lid says...
It's assumed the user
clicks the "Allow" button when the Windows Firewall complains that
ARPC890.exe is "dialing particular ports that aren't normally uses".

Windows is silent on the matter. I'd expect the behavior you cite, but
it doesn't happen.

Can you test on Windows 7 ?

As a baseline.

Paul

Paul wrote:

The ARCP890 Windows program, loaded on a computer, is supposed to
connect to particular ports on the Kenwood, to perform remote control.
The ports are not named, for LAN operation. It's assumed the user
clicks the "Allow" button when the Windows Firewall complains that
ARPC890.exe is "dialing particular ports that aren't normally uses".

Paul

But Windows Firewall doesn't monitor outbound connections. Well,
normally the Windows Firewall doesn't block outbound connections, but it
can be configured to do so yet few users would do that, especially since
the Windows Firewall won't issue an alert that lets the user allow or
block the connection. A blocked outbound connection would log an event,
and there are programs that will monitor the events to check if there
was a block and then present an Allow/Block prompt. I would not expect
outbound connections from ARPC890 to trigger the Windows Firewall (it
may with 3rd party firewalls).

Although Jason says his setup is simple and the diagram in section 3.1
of the manual is similar to his setup, we don't know what is between the
host (where he runs the ARPC890 program) and the Kenwood device. For
example, he might have a router or switch between the two instead of
directly hooking the Kenwood's RJ45 Ethernet jack straight into the
host's RJ45 Ethernet jack. If there is more than just a cable between
the two, might help to know what other devices are between them. A
router and even a switch could restrict traffic between its RJ45
Ethernet jacks. I had a DLink router that would let me do that, so I
could connect to the cable modem without allowing any of my family's
network traffic from reaching my host. The router or switch might be
configured to use different subnets on its different RJ45 ports. That
the router should see the Kenwood or any other device connected to it
doesn't mean the devices can see each other across the ports on the
router.

To test just the ARPC890 software and the Kenwood device, cable the
Kenwood directly to the host running ARPC890. That means losing
Internet connectivity on the host (unless it is also using wifi) during
the test.

Jason has never mentioned how much he paid for the Kenwood shortwave.
If he paid the $3000+ retail price, I would think he'd be talking to
Kenwood support. Likely the Kenwood is used, and maybe the prior owner
sold it off because of problems with the embedded OS inside the Kenwood.
I did not see mention of how to update the OS or burn new firmware into
the Kenwood in its manual. From:

https://www.kenwood.com/i/products/i..._download.html

there is new firmware for the TS-890S (didn't find a TS-890 listed at
Kenwood's site). There's also a newer version of the ARCP890 software.
Both are dated Jan 2019.

Testing with the Kenwood directly connected to the Windows host would
eliminate interference from the router or anything else in the network
between the two endpoints.

Jason wrote:

The fact that the radio can negotiate with ntp.pool.org to set its clock
tells me it's resolving names properly. In its setup I have the primary
DNS server set to the default - the router's address, and an external
one as secondary.

Consumer-grade routers don't do DNS lookups. They merely pass the
requests received on port 53 to whatever DNS server is upstream of them
(typically the ISP's DNS server). If your workstation is using DHCP and
uses the DNS server reported by the DHCP server, then you are likely
using the DNS server from your ISP. You can configure TCP properties in
your host to use a different DNS server than the one DHCP reports to
your host.

Routers have their own DHCP servers, but they don't have their own DNS
servers. In fact, the DHCP server in the router should simply pass the
DNS server's IP address that it got from its upstream DHCP server (what
it gets from your ISP's DHCP server to get its WAN-side IP address and
also the DNS server's IP address). Some routers do have a DNS cache,
and why specifying your router as the DNS server can result in a faster
response time than using the upstream DNS server (try GRC's DNS
Benchmark tool).

On Wed, 18 Sep 2019 08:13:36 +0100, Andy Burns
wrote:

Char Jackson wrote:

That's both irrelevant and unimportant. When you're trying to connect
from within your LAN, the router has nothing to do with it.

For most home networks the router is most likely the DHCP server, that
would make it relevant, but doesn't look like it's causing any problem
in this case.

One of the questions I asked in a follow-up was whether he's using DHCP.
I would recommend not using DHCP during this troubleshooting phase, but
you never know.

Also, the router comment was in response to others suggesting that he
might have to configure his router to allow specific port forwarding.
For intraLAN operation, that kind of router configuration would be
completely irrelevant and not applicable in the slightest. When you stay
within your LAN, there is no 'router' functionality involved.