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Questions about the "end of Windows 7"



 
 
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  #1  
Old February 28th 19, 02:13 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Art Todesco
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 330
Default Questions about the "end of Windows 7"

Hi All,
When Windows 7 support ends, what are you all going to do? Pay for
additional support? Or what?

Can we still go to Windows 10 free?

Also, what's the best way to make Windows 10 better? I have a laptop
that came with 10. I've added several "improvements" like Classic
Shell, but it still isn't always good. Is there anything better?

Sorry for all the questions.
Ads
  #2  
Old February 28th 19, 02:56 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Big Al[_5_]
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Posts: 1,588
Default Questions about the "end of Windows 7"

On 2/28/19 9:13 AM, Art Todesco wrote:
Hi All,
When Windows 7 support ends, what are you all going to do?* Pay for
additional support?* Or what?

Can we still go to Windows 10 free?

Also, what's the best way to make Windows 10 better?* I have a laptop
that came with 10.* I've added several "improvements" like Classic
Shell, but it still isn't always good.* Is there anything better?

Sorry for all the questions.

You got it! Live with 7 and no updates, or pay for them till they stop
letting you. Not much else.

Some people are reporting that the upgrade to 10 is still working. A
good backup image of your entire HD before a test would be advised.

There is a thread on alt.comp.os.windows-10 group that just started,
about the 10's menu and making it look like XP.

The basics of the first 10 or so replies is: Classic shell is no longer
developed. And: Learn to live with the current menu since 3rd party
programs may/will come and go.

It's easy to just unpin everything on the menu and then pin the programs
you use the most. The once a month/year apps you use can be found in
the alpha listing. A few shortcuts on the desktop maybe, a few on the
taskbar and you can get to your programs with 1 or 2 clicks.

You probably had an issue with moving to windows 7 but you learned it
after a while, well windows 10 is about the same. Use it for 6 months
and you won't have major issues. But you have to use it, not just have
it somewhere to glance at now and then.




  #3  
Old February 28th 19, 03:52 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Mayayana
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Posts: 6,438
Default Questions about the "end of Windows 7"

"Art Todesco" wrote

| When Windows 7 support ends, what are you all going to do? Pay for
| additional support? Or what?
|

There is no paid support. Nothing has changed
from past versions. If you're a corporate customer
with "enterprise" licensing, you can pay through
the nose for security updates. In other words,
if you're the British navy or General Motors, you
m,ight consider it cheaper to pay Microsoft extortion
rates to get patches rather than scrap thousands
of computers. For SOHo people there's no option.

If you pretend to be running a kiosk system you
*might* be able to get updates. That works in XP
by adding a Registry setting, but may not necessarily
work in 7.

There's also the possibility that MS will extend the
support of Win7, as they did with XP. That all depends
on how much pressure there is from corporate customers.
If most are still running 7, which seems to be the case
currently, MS may not want to risk the animosity of
dumping them. On the other hand, they've pushed 10
very hard. So I don't expect that even MS execs know
what will happen at this point. They're probably waiting
to see whether the threat makes companies switch to 10.

Someone mistakenly posted an article recently
about paid support, but they had misread the source
article. Or maybe they didn't. It was posted by one
of the local MS shills, so it may have been meant to
just be more propaganda trying to sell 10. There has
never been optional paid support beyond the final
support date for SOHo customers. Their intention is
to push old product off the cliff as quickly as is
feasible. Irraitional fear of security issues is one of
the few carrots Microsoft have to get people to buy
new computers.

Personally, I'm going to keep using XP as long
as I can and use 7 for testing software or going
to risky websites that require script. 7 is my
sacrificial lamb system. XP is what I use to get
things done.



  #4  
Old February 28th 19, 04:15 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
😉 Good Guy 😉
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Posts: 1,483
Default Questions about the "end of Windows 7"

On 28/02/2019 14:13, Art Todesco wrote:
Hi All,
When Windows 7 support ends, what are you all going to do? Pay for
additional support? Or what?


No you need to buy a new machine with Windows 10. You won't be able to
pay because the subscription is for corporates only and very likely to
be very expensive per machine basis and minimum amount per month/year.

Can we still go to Windows 10 free?


Go now and get a copy. You'll be lucky to get one and your machine will
be entitled to get free updates/upgrades as long as it lasts. When you
buy a new machine, it will come with Windows 10 anyway so why worry.
How old is your current machine? there won't be many apps for that OS
like it is the case with XP and Vista.


Also, what's the best way to make Windows 10 better?

It is already better than any of the previous Windows. Just use it and
you won't notice any difference. why are you scarred of technology?
are you some mental nutter who likes to be led like a flock of sheep?

I have a laptop that came with 10. I've added several "improvements"
like Classic Shell, but it still isn't always good. Is there anything
better?


The only thing that is really better is to get rid of that crap you have
installed. It is a crap-ware and probably calls home in the
background. there is no such thing as free lunch. Get rid of that
crap and delete everything in the Metro interface and you'll have your
Windows 10 out of the box and still qualifies for all future upgrades
and applications.



Sorry for all the questions.


No problem but tell us what is "not better" in windows 10? Without
knowing the answer to this question we are going to roam around the bush
with no clear way out of this "humming mess". Read the text that
follows this text!!!!!!!.

Path: news.mixmin.net!eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!reader01.eternal-september.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail
From: Art Todesco
Newsgroups: alt.windows7.general
Subject: Questions about the "end of Windows 7"
Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2019 09:13:01 -0500
Organization: A noiseless patient Spider
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--
With over 950 million devices now running Windows 10, customer
satisfaction is higher than any previous version of windows.

  #5  
Old February 28th 19, 05:12 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Char Jackson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,449
Default Questions about the "end of Windows 7"

On Thu, 28 Feb 2019 09:13:01 -0500, Art Todesco
wrote:

Hi All,
When Windows 7 support ends, what are you all going to do? Pay for
additional support? Or what?


Nothing. Windows 7 will continue to work better than 10, just as it does
now.

Can we still go to Windows 10 free?


People are reporting that they still can.

Also, what's the best way to make Windows 10 better? I have a laptop
that came with 10. I've added several "improvements" like Classic
Shell, but it still isn't always good. Is there anything better?


At least one person around here likes and uses Start10, but Classic
Shell and Open Shell are also available. Windows Ultimate Tweaker might
also be worth a look. You have to realize, though, that those programs
are just putting polish on a turd. It's still a turd.

Sorry for all the questions.


Other people probably have the same questions.

--

Char Jackson
  #6  
Old February 28th 19, 05:24 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Kirk Bubul[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 173
Default Questions about the "end of Windows 7"

On Thu, 28 Feb 2019 11:12:29 -0600, Char Jackson
wrote:


At least one person around here likes and uses Start10, but Classic
Shell and Open Shell are also available. Windows Ultimate Tweaker might
also be worth a look. You have to realize, though, that those programs
are just putting polish on a turd. It's still a turd.

Sorry for all the questions.


Other people probably have the same questions.


I started using Start8 with Windows 8 and Start10 with Windows
10. I really like it. My wife has very limited computer skills
for her laptop, but she adjusted to Windows 7 with her first
laptop and immediately took to Start10 on her newest laptop that
came with Windows 10.
  #7  
Old February 28th 19, 05:44 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Ken Blake[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,221
Default Questions about the "end of Windows 7"

On Thu, 28 Feb 2019 11:24:01 -0600, Kirk Bubul
wrote:

On Thu, 28 Feb 2019 11:12:29 -0600, Char Jackson
wrote:


At least one person around here likes and uses Start10, but Classic
Shell and Open Shell are also available. Windows Ultimate Tweaker might
also be worth a look. You have to realize, though, that those programs
are just putting polish on a turd. It's still a turd.

Sorry for all the questions.


Other people probably have the same questions.


I started using Start8 with Windows 8 and Start10 with Windows
10. I really like it.



Same here. It's $4.99, but it comes with a 30-day free trial.

Classic Shell is good too, but in my opinion, Start 10 is even better.
I recommend to Art Todesco that he try it.


My wife has very limited computer skills
for her laptop, but she adjusted to Windows 7 with her first
laptop and immediately took to Start10 on her newest laptop that
came with Windows 10.

  #8  
Old February 28th 19, 07:12 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
VanguardLH[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,881
Default Questions about the "end of Windows 7"

Art Todesco wrote:

Hi All,
When Windows 7 support ends, what are you all going to do? Pay for
additional support? Or what?


What do YOU do when your car's warranty expires? Yep, you continue
using it.

Can we still go to Windows 10 free?


Why? What is forcing you to move?

Also, what's the best way to make Windows 10 better?


There are loads of tweaks and products (that do the tweaks for you).
It's a loaded question since "better" is highly subjective.
  #9  
Old February 28th 19, 07:53 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11,873
Default Questions about the "end of Windows 7"

Art Todesco wrote:
Hi All,
When Windows 7 support ends, what are you all going to do? Pay for
additional support? Or what?

Can we still go to Windows 10 free?

Also, what's the best way to make Windows 10 better? I have a laptop
that came with 10. I've added several "improvements" like Classic
Shell, but it still isn't always good. Is there anything better?

Sorry for all the questions.


You can go to Windows 10 free.

If you make a backup of your Windows 7 SP1 C: drive, you
can do an Upgrade over top of it using a Windows 10 1809 DVD.
That's the version available at the moment. (Just download it
and use the DVD while Windows 7 is running. Look for setup.exe
when you're ready and your backup is secured on an external disk.)

The act of making the upgrade, secures your Digital Entitlement,
good for that one machine. The SKU installed by the ISO, should
match. Win7 Pro or Win7 Ultimate go to Win10 Pro. Win7 Home Premium
would be Win10 Home. If the old OS was x64, the new OS is x64
too (due to this being an Upgrade over the top).

Then, you can restore your Win7 SP1 backup image onto the
drive, wiping out Windows 10.

Later, like two years from now, you can again either Clean
Install (nuke) the C: drive and put a clean Win10 all by itself.
At that time, you could use an x86 or x64 DVD for the job. SKU
still has to match as before, for "key" reasons.

Win7 SP1 Ultimate x64 ----------- clean install Win10 Pro x32
clean install Win10 Pro x64

Win7 SP1 Home Premium x64 ------ clean install Win10 Home x32
clean install Win10 Home x64

And, it will still "activate", because the Digital Entitlement
for it, is stored on the Microsoft server. The "key" the OS
uses on the free upgrade is a bogus key that "doesn't
prove anything". It's just the entry stored on the Microsoft
server (that we can't see), for the hardware serial numbers
on your machine, that serve to activate Windows 10 on any
subsequent installs. If the hardware changes enough, the
Digital Entitlement no longer matches and your freebie is
trashed. (On a laptop, this is unlikely to happen. If you
change out mobo/CPU/ram on a desktop, it could happen.)

*******

As to whether Windows 10 is a good deal, that remains to be
seen. What I'm noticing (if you ignore Flappy Birds or
GUI issues or "that's not my favorite color of pink" issues),
is that the OS is becoming "lethargic". I was trying
to use IrfanView to do a batch convert yesterday, and it
would not rail a CPU core and was "dawdling". Now, I've
tested IrfanView in the past, and it can malloc at
around 1-2GB/sec (i.e. it's highly optimized code). I set the
Power Schema to "High Performance" and it didn't help.
Windows Defender "real time protection" was disabled for
the test. I could have used my freakin PIII computer
running Windows 98 and got that job done faster, because
it probably took 40 minutes to convert 170 pictures. I bumped
up task priority to "above normal", still didn't help. I'm
pretty sure the PIII and an old OS, would have whizzed
through that job.

I've also noticed that my old copy of HDTune, the benchmark
numbers are slightly off. Which could be caused by these
scheduler issues with tasks.

So if they continue in this direction, I'm sorry but
I can't recommend an OS that does **** like that.

In such a case, Win7 has pretty good performance. You won't
have a free copy of Flappy Birds on Windows 7, but at least
it'll still behave like a "computer you own".

One reason for me keeping and maintaining copies of
Windows 10, is precisely for these observational reasons.

Summary: Install Win10 now, solely for the purpose of
generating a usage key. Restore your old OS image
afterwards. Then, your "valid key" can be used to
install at a later date (as far as we know) on
that same computer. You can do a Clean or an Upgrade
install at a future date, using that "valid key" on
the server. On a Clean install, it can be x32 or x64.

My Win7 laptop doesn't have a supported video driver,
so Win10 is not getting fresh WDDM drivers from ATI for
support of that machine. The Microsoft Basic Display Adapter
can be used to run such machines, but with resolution
restrictions. And this is a limitation on older computing
devices. My newest desktop has a "new" video card in it,
which is still in support for another four years.

If your laptop is from the year 2002, the Win10 installer
will do an instruction set check. If it finds certain CPU
instructions missing, the install will not proceed and
you will have your answer.

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/soft...load/windows10

The very latest version of DVD has *12* OS versions. It
won't fit on a single-layer DVD for the x64 version. It would
require a dual layer DVD to be done with an optical disc. It
can instead be put on a USB key (by MediaCreationTool, the
stub you'll be getting from the web page). I still recommend
putting the OS on a DVD, as you need it for emergencies and
such. It's harder around here, to keep a USB key "stable"
without it getting erased and some other project going on it.

*******

The Heidoc tool is a URL generator. It will generate a URL
pointing to the Microsoft server, for older copies of Windows 10.
Even if you selected a copy of 1809 from the day it was
released, using this tool, that will still fit on a single
layer DVD. What this tool does, is it uses Internet Explorer
to interact with TechBench, and find the older copies. You
use the "Copy URL to buffer" button to copy the URL, then
paste the URL into Firefox and do the download. This
will give an x64 Win10 DVD that fits on single-layer discs.
Just don't select the very last disc, as the number of
OS flavors went from 8 flavors to 12 flavors on the latest
one. And some of those flavors are not mainstream and
don't belong on the media. It doesn't matter which exact
disc you use, as long as it suits your needs.

https://www.heidoc.net/joomla/techno...-download-tool

Download: Windows-ISO-Downloader.exe
Version: 8.03
Release Date: 24 February 2019

The very first 1809 had a bug where it deleted the "old"
folder from Reparse Points that a user had moved. The "bugged"
version was available for a while on Techbench. That's the beauty
of the MS Techbench archive, is it keeps everything. Since
I had neither moved my Home Directory nor my Program Files
folder, and I didn't have a OneDrive account set up, I
was not swacked by that bug. Others were. I was lucky
in that I didn't have the ingredients to trigger the bug.

This is a map of the significant events in 1809 DVD releases.

1809 ... 1809 ... 1809
Bug on Image too big
release Needs dual layer DVD

4.4GB 4.5GB 4.7GB

Try to select something from the middle, depending on
how many versions are there. Any 1809 disc should
patch up to the most recent Patch Tuesday after installation.

Picture of the Heidoc tool, with my annotations added.

https://i.postimg.cc/bJcKk24K/heidoc...-techbench.gif

HTH,
Paul
  #10  
Old February 28th 19, 08:33 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
pyotr filipivich
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 752
Default Questions about the "end of Windows 7"

"Mayayana" on Thu, 28 Feb 2019 10:52:52
-0500 typed in alt.windows7.general the following:

Personally, I'm going to keep using XP as long
as I can and use 7 for testing software or going
to risky websites that require script. 7 is my
sacrificial lamb system. XP is what I use to get
things done.


I'd love to return to XP. My tale of woe is that I had XP-32, but
needed 64 bit for Reasons. Windows 7 on a refurbished box, and by the
end of the week, it is on my desk and running. I transfer
"essentials." Rah. Then the XP box starts flaking out, I copy
"everything" to an external drive before it dies. Full time student
(that bit about for every hour in class, expect to spend two out? I
was. I had no time for a girlfriend, let alone troubleshooting a
buggy computer).
Now that I have the time (ha! She's not my girlfriend anymore,
she's my wife. Wives are more resource intensive than girlfriends! but
I digress.) I was thinking about repairing the dead XP box. If I can
get it out of storage and set up and ...blah, blah, blah.

Which brings me to the Eternal Issue: where can I find an
"affordable" XP box which is also not on its last legs? Good Will /
Value Village both have "good" prices but caveat emptor.

--
pyotr filipivich
Next month's Panel: Graft - Boon or blessing?
  #11  
Old February 28th 19, 08:36 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Big Al[_5_]
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Posts: 1,588
Default Questions about the "end of Windows 7"

On 2/28/19 3:33 PM, pyotr filipivich wrote:
"Mayayana" on Thu, 28 Feb 2019 10:52:52
-0500 typed in alt.windows7.general the following:

Personally, I'm going to keep using XP as long
as I can and use 7 for testing software or going
to risky websites that require script. 7 is my
sacrificial lamb system. XP is what I use to get
things done.


I'd love to return to XP. My tale of woe is that I had XP-32, but
needed 64 bit for Reasons. Windows 7 on a refurbished box, and by the
end of the week, it is on my desk and running. I transfer
"essentials." Rah. Then the XP box starts flaking out, I copy
"everything" to an external drive before it dies. Full time student
(that bit about for every hour in class, expect to spend two out? I
was. I had no time for a girlfriend, let alone troubleshooting a
buggy computer).
Now that I have the time (ha! She's not my girlfriend anymore,
she's my wife. Wives are more resource intensive than girlfriends! but
I digress.) I was thinking about repairing the dead XP box. If I can
get it out of storage and set up and ...blah, blah, blah.

Which brings me to the Eternal Issue: where can I find an
"affordable" XP box which is also not on its last legs? Good Will /
Value Village both have "good" prices but caveat emptor.

Ebay?

  #12  
Old February 28th 19, 09:30 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Mayayana
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6,438
Default Questions about the "end of Windows 7"

"pyotr filipivich" wrote

| Which brings me to the Eternal Issue: where can I find an
| "affordable" XP box which is also not on its last legs? Good Will /
| Value Village both have "good" prices but caveat emptor.
|

If you have a full license you can built it, but I'm
not sure if hardware is still available. At one point
I tried to buy a backup for my AMD FX-8300. (I have
a backup motherboard.) The price had gone way up.
Now I think they may be off the market. I haven't
really been keeping up with developments, but my
sense is that no cPUs now being sold will work
with XP.

If you buy used, I'd replace the hard disk. Most other
parts will last for years. On the other hand, Vista came
out in 2007, so any existing machine woul be 12-18
years old. Not encouraging. But I know of at least
3 people still using XP machines I fixed up for them.
For a long time I was taking any computer someone
wanted to get rid of, fixing it, and giving it to someone
else. (People tend to throw them away at the first
sign of trouble, but the problem is usually minor.)
That's how I got my Win7 box.


  #13  
Old February 28th 19, 09:54 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Char Jackson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,449
Default Questions about the "end of Windows 7"

On Thu, 28 Feb 2019 12:33:29 -0800, pyotr filipivich
wrote:

Which brings me to the Eternal Issue: where can I find an
"affordable" XP box which is also not on its last legs? Good Will /
Value Village both have "good" prices but caveat emptor.


Does it have to be physical hardware? I'd recommend going virtual, if
possible. Install your choice of hypervisor, then create an XP VM (or
three). I think you'll find it to be a much better choice than running
discrete hardware for each OS.

--

Char Jackson
  #14  
Old February 28th 19, 09:59 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
😉 Good Guy 😉
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,483
Default Questions about the "end of Windows 7"

On 28/02/2019 20:33, pyotr filipivich wrote:

Which brings me to the Eternal Issue: where can I find an
"affordable" XP box which is also not on its last legs? Good Will /
Value Village both have "good" prices but caveat emptor.


The question you should be asking is which brain surgeon can repair your
defective brain. Most people would love to use new technology but in
your case, because of your defective brain, you need to use a 20 year
old technology.

I have got some old XP boxes to sell. How much are you willing to pay?
I love to get rid of these boxes and at the same time make some money
from idiots like you.

Frankly, if you are not using a computer for some serious work then why
don't you try Linux Junk? It is fr people like you. It has everything
you would need and the good thing is, as advertised, top 500 super
computers are using Linux Junk. So that is what you should be using as
you are a person of low intelligence. Nobody knows what is the purpose
of a super computer!!!!!!!!!!!!







--
With over 950 million devices now running Windows 10, customer
satisfaction is higher than any previous version of windows.

  #15  
Old February 28th 19, 10:03 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
pyotr filipivich
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 752
Default Questions about the "end of Windows 7"

"Mayayana" on Thu, 28 Feb 2019 16:30:44
-0500 typed in alt.windows7.general the following:
"pyotr filipivich" wrote

| Which brings me to the Eternal Issue: where can I find an
| "affordable" XP box which is also not on its last legs? Good Will /
| Value Village both have "good" prices but caveat emptor.
|

If you have a full license you can built it, but I'm
not sure if hardware is still available. At one point
I tried to buy a backup for my AMD FX-8300. (I have
a backup motherboard.) The price had gone way up.
Now I think they may be off the market. I haven't
really been keeping up with developments, but my
sense is that no cPUs now being sold will work
with XP.

If you buy used, I'd replace the hard disk. Most other
parts will last for years. On the other hand, Vista came
out in 2007, so any existing machine woul be 12-18
years old. Not encouraging. But I know of at least
3 people still using XP machines I fixed up for them.
For a long time I was taking any computer someone
wanted to get rid of, fixing it, and giving it to someone
else. (People tend to throw them away at the first
sign of trouble, but the problem is usually minor.)
That's how I got my Win7 box.


That's how I got the win 95 box. "The Plan" is to use it for
ripping LPs to mp3. "Someday".

--
pyotr filipivich
Next month's Panel: Graft - Boon or blessing?
 




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