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Avoid 10 !



 
 
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  #61  
Old January 14th 18, 03:48 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Neil
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Posts: 523
Default Avoid 10 !

On 1/13/2018 7:54 PM, Paul wrote:
Neil wrote:


I see. What people in the world are doing only matters if it matches
your opinion of what is worth doing. That's a ****-poor test design.


Bud, if you add too many layers to a software
stack, what are you testing exactly ? Which layer
is broken ? Which layer sucks ?

(rest snipped for irrelevance)

That's a pretty off-the-wall attempt at obfuscation to avoid the point
at hand. There are *many* things that *can* be done in Win10 that *can
not be done in Win7*. Whether you or I want or need to do those things
doesn't matter, because there are increasing numbers of people that do.

Why not just hang out in a Win7 ng rather than impose such unjustifiable
insults on people?

--
best regards,

Neil
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  #62  
Old January 14th 18, 04:28 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul[_32_]
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Posts: 4,876
Default Avoid 10 !

Neil wrote:
On 1/13/2018 7:54 PM, Paul wrote:
Neil wrote:


I see. What people in the world are doing only matters if it matches
your opinion of what is worth doing. That's a ****-poor test design.


Bud, if you add too many layers to a software
stack, what are you testing exactly ? Which layer
is broken ? Which layer sucks ?

(rest snipped for irrelevance)

That's a pretty off-the-wall attempt at obfuscation to avoid the point
at hand. There are *many* things that *can* be done in Win10 that *can
not be done in Win7*. Whether you or I want or need to do those things
doesn't matter, because there are increasing numbers of people that do.

Why not just hang out in a Win7 ng rather than impose such unjustifiable
insults on people?


I'm here to correct mis-impressions.

These OSes are mostly the same on *compute* performance.

Time and again I see claims of clever optimization
that simply don't exist.

If you have an expensive enough platform, a multi-socket
server motherboard, an Epyc, I'm willing to bet there
is a difference between Win10 and Win7. For ordinary
computers (quad core), the difference is zilch. One
*computes* with the same speed as the other. Computing
meaning numerical calculations, which the OS plays no part in.
The OS schedules and gives the process time slices, and
the process does the rest. If the OS is not generous with
time slices (it reserves cycles for itself), your
compute speed suffers. This can be solved on Windows 10
by forking more threads than virtual cores (a.k.a
over-subscription). This is a technique the Chromium
build environment uses, in spades.

for other parts, again, there can be differences.
DX12 is 30% faster than DX11. I have no games and
haven't tested that claim. But it makes sense, since
one version of DirectX managed individual "objects"
(many context switches), while a later one switched
back to game-designer-controlled display lists. If you
have a game that support both DX flavors, you can switch
between them and check for a speed difference. The difference
could be significant. As I'm not a gamer, I don't
particularly care at the moment, which DirectX version
was a mistake, but for a gamer, this does give an
incentive to move to an OS that supports the "good"
version of DirectX.

But other stuff, you'd have to craft a pretty careful
test case, to state with any authority that the new
OS is actually better. It's merely different, a few
deck chairs moved around and so on. Buttery smooth
animation is great for content consumption (copying
what smartphones look like), but unnecessary for
content creation. Or anything requiring close-to-the-iron
performance.

I'm from the club, that years ago when Apple had ZoomRects,
I and other users turned it off. That was an example of
a (not very smooth) window opening animation. The joke
at the time was "I got a second of my life back", referring
to the time it took for the animation to play, and for the
Windows to open. I'm consistent today, with the belief
that buttery animations for things aren't necessary, but I
guess somebody likes them. They don't work well on
computers that use the Basic Display Adapter driver (which
include virtual machine usage, it makes the Guest slower).

Paul
  #63  
Old January 15th 18, 02:14 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Roger Blake[_2_]
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Posts: 350
Default Avoid 10 !

On 2018-01-13, Ken Blake wrote:
You're saying it much more strongly than I would, but I generally
agree. But as far as I'm concerned, much the same is true of most
software.


In my experience most sofware by default does not try to "get to know
you" by gathering as much information as possible and forwarding it
to the mother ship. As far as I'm concerned, that alone is sufficient
reason for the harshest possible criticism. If such "features" are to
be included at all they should be opt-in rather than default.

Since I don't use Windows myself it's not an issue on my own computers,
but I deal with it in the field for others. When Cortana starts spouting
off during initial setup it makes me want to pull an Elvis and just shoot
the screen out.

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Roger Blake (Posts from Google Groups killfiled due to excess spam.)

NSA sedition and treason -- http://www.DeathToNSAthugs.com
Don't talk to cops! -- http://www.DontTalkToCops.com
Badges don't grant extra rights -- http://www.CopBlock.org
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
  #64  
Old January 15th 18, 07:49 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul[_32_]
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Posts: 4,876
Default Avoid 10 !

Roger Blake wrote:
On 2018-01-13, Ken Blake wrote:
You're saying it much more strongly than I would, but I generally
agree. But as far as I'm concerned, much the same is true of most
software.


In my experience most sofware by default does not try to "get to know
you" by gathering as much information as possible and forwarding it
to the mother ship. As far as I'm concerned, that alone is sufficient
reason for the harshest possible criticism. If such "features" are to
be included at all they should be opt-in rather than default.

Since I don't use Windows myself it's not an issue on my own computers,
but I deal with it in the field for others. When Cortana starts spouting
off during initial setup it makes me want to pull an Elvis and just shoot
the screen out.


When that happened the first time, I was not impressed.

But on my second install, I found the button to dump the
sound, and "peace returned to the valley" :-)

You can always turn the volume down, but I never
do that on the speakers themselves. I leave my speakers
at one setting, and the computer end is supposed to do
all the volume-type stuff. There's a button in the
setup screen, to mute, and that solves the problem.

*******

The problem is, for sound, the computer does not have
absolutely "bulletproof" plug and play info. On the majority
of hardware, it cannot tell the microphone is plugged in.

Proper HDaudio jacks have a side contact, which tells the computer
something is plugged in.

Most computers use the older, cheaper jacks, which lack the
side contact.

Soundmax (Analog Devices) has a patented technique, where a
25KHz stimulus is connected to *inputs* to measure the
impedance. This allows microphone detection, when side-contact
info is missing. The Soundmax product stands a better chance
of PNP on microphones. RealTek, buried deep in their datasheet,
says in effect "we don't got that".

There are also digital microphones... but nobody owns one :-)
And I'm not referring to USB either. There is an actual
serial bus style digital microphone, where the PNP should
work quite well.

I would suspect Microsoft just gave up, and had the Cortana
prompt play anyway. For Accessibility or something.

I doubt anyone would go out and buy a microphone just for Cortana,
as it has to be a *good* microphone. My logitech headset,
the mike on that is a joke, You have to rub the microphone
on sandpaper, to get a signal, it is that insensitive :-/
$39.95 wasted. Don't buy a cheesy headset like I did,
and expect to use it.

Paul
  #65  
Old January 15th 18, 03:00 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Mayayana
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Posts: 3,949
Default Avoid 10 !

"Paul" wrote

| You can always turn the volume down, but I never
| do that on the speakers themselves. I leave my speakers
| at one setting

I don't even turn the speakers on unless I'm
playing an mp3 or mp4. There's no other case where
sound is relevant, but it can be distracting or
even jarring.

Yesterday morning I woke up to find my ladyfriend
on the phone with "Microsoft tech support". She'd
let them onto her system, they showed her the
system error log and she paid them almost $500!
It all started with a malware warning popup window
when she was visiting a political news website. Part
of what fooled her was that there was also audio.
A voice told her that she needed to "call now!".

I find it hard to believe that people put up
with all this nonsense. It's bad enough to tolerate
dancing ads on a website, but prattling robots
on your computer?!

(I didn't figure out where the popup came from,
but the webpage was typical, with at least a half
dozen ad/track/datamine javascript sources. There
was also auction code connected with
amazon-adsystem.com. I'm guessing the attackers
are working by buying Amazon ads.)


  #66  
Old January 16th 18, 02:53 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul[_32_]
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Posts: 4,876
Default Avoid 10 !

Mayayana wrote:

Yesterday morning I woke up to find my ladyfriend
on the phone with "Microsoft tech support". She'd
let them onto her system, they showed her the
system error log and she paid them almost $500!


Have you done the credit card reversal yet ?

I hope there was a recent backup, to restore
over that mess. While they're not likely to leave
something nasty on the victims machine, you can't
take chances.

Paul
  #67  
Old January 16th 18, 03:12 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Mayayana
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Posts: 3,949
Default Avoid 10 !

"Paul" wrote

| Yesterday morning I woke up to find my ladyfriend
| on the phone with "Microsoft tech support". She'd
| let them onto her system, they showed her the
| system error log and she paid them almost $500!
|
| Have you done the credit card reversal yet ?
|

Yes. She called them immediately and they said
they'll block the charge as fraudulent.

| I hope there was a recent backup, to restore
| over that mess. While they're not likely to leave
| something nasty on the victims machine, you can't
| take chances.
|

I did a thorough check. The only change I could
find was a new install of Firefox. I'm not sure what
the point of that was. I removed all of it and
re-installed that fresh.

I've only dealt with this kind of thing once before,
but in both cases they seemed to be concerned only
with fooling people and getting money. In other words,
they want your computer to work well when they
get through because they don't want you to doubt
their legitimacy and cancel the payment.


 




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