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Excellent article about Linux



 
 
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  #91  
Old January 10th 19, 03:01 PM posted to alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Dan Purgert
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 107
Default Excellent article about Linux

Paul wrote:
Dan Purgert wrote:
Bobbie Sellers wrote:
On 1/9/19 5:43 PM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 30/12/2018 14.00, Nomen Nescio wrote:
[...]
It takes 1000% more work to make it approximately half as
productive as a Mac or Windows PC.
Maybe you are a less than able human? :-P


[...]
But whenever I encounter Windows and I do at large intervals
find myself dealing with my own copy of same or someone else's
Windows installation and it takes me 200% more effort to get
even the preparation for the installation of a dual-boot system
as it does to install Linux to a naked disk.


Makes sense - you do have to actually /prepare/ the system if you're
gonna be dual-booting.

It's gotten easier with GPT partitioning, but if their computer is still
using MBR, it's a right pain.

And it's nice that you have the _choice_ to dual-boot with *nix
installers. Fairly certain to this day, Win installation media has one
option - "Blow it all away and give me the entire drive".


You would be surprised how tolerant an MBR partitioning
strategy can be with multiple OSes.


Oh, it's just dealing with "oh, you're out of primary partitions,
because Windows needed the install partition, the backup partition, and
the install media partition, and your OEM decidied to make you a 'data'
partition as well ... amazing ... okay, what can we delete without too
much harm today?"

Good to hear though that the installers have gotten smarter in recent
revisions (last dual-boot I had was 7, and that never ran into "ugh,
time to format and reinstall win").


--
|_|O|_| Registered Linux user #585947
|_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert
|O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5 4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281
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  #92  
Old January 10th 19, 03:03 PM posted to alt.privacy.anon-server,alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Dan Purgert
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 107
Default Excellent article about Linux

Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 10/01/2019 12.23, Dan Purgert wrote:
[...]
And it's nice that you have the _choice_ to dual-boot with *nix
installers. Fairly certain to this day, Win installation media has one
option - "Blow it all away and give me the entire drive".


No, not true. I have installed Windows with Microsoft media taking only
part of the disk, and it was trivial to do so.


Good to hear that's changed then.


By default, the Linux installs I know also take the whole new disk for
Linux.


Dunno what distros you're running with -- Debian and children don't do
that, unless the drive's clean.

Though, admittedly, I haven't installed Debian on a drive with another
OS in some time; maybe they have changed it.



--
|_|O|_| Registered Linux user #585947
|_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert
|O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5 4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281
  #93  
Old January 10th 19, 03:46 PM posted to alt.privacy.anon-server,alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Carlos E.R.[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 317
Default Excellent article about Linux

On 10/01/2019 15.03, Dan Purgert wrote:
Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 10/01/2019 12.23, Dan Purgert wrote:
[...]
And it's nice that you have the _choice_ to dual-boot with *nix
installers. Fairly certain to this day, Win installation media has one
option - "Blow it all away and give me the entire drive".


No, not true. I have installed Windows with Microsoft media taking only
part of the disk, and it was trivial to do so.


Good to hear that's changed then.


I tried it with the server 2008 edition, and the corresponding "user"
edition, in several combinations.

By default, the Linux installs I know also take the whole new disk for
Linux.


Dunno what distros you're running with -- Debian and children don't do
that, unless the drive's clean.


I said "new disk", ie, a clean disk :-)

--
Cheers, Carlos.
  #94  
Old January 10th 19, 03:49 PM posted to alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Carlos E.R.[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 317
Default Excellent article about Linux

On 10/01/2019 15.01, Dan Purgert wrote:
Paul wrote:
Dan Purgert wrote:
Bobbie Sellers wrote:
On 1/9/19 5:43 PM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 30/12/2018 14.00, Nomen Nescio wrote:
[...]
It takes 1000% more work to make it approximately half as
productive as a Mac or Windows PC.
Maybe you are a less than able human? :-P


[...]
But whenever I encounter Windows and I do at large intervals
find myself dealing with my own copy of same or someone else's
Windows installation and it takes me 200% more effort to get
even the preparation for the installation of a dual-boot system
as it does to install Linux to a naked disk.

Makes sense - you do have to actually /prepare/ the system if you're
gonna be dual-booting.

It's gotten easier with GPT partitioning, but if their computer is still
using MBR, it's a right pain.

And it's nice that you have the _choice_ to dual-boot with *nix
installers. Fairly certain to this day, Win installation media has one
option - "Blow it all away and give me the entire drive".


You would be surprised how tolerant an MBR partitioning
strategy can be with multiple OSes.


Oh, it's just dealing with "oh, you're out of primary partitions,
because Windows needed the install partition, the backup partition, and
the install media partition, and your OEM decidied to make you a 'data'
partition as well ... amazing ... okay, what can we delete without too
much harm today?"


All that is not Microsoft doing, but the computer manufacturer or OEM.
Windows itself installs to a single partition, sometimes with a separate
small boot partition.

We have to put the blame where it is due ;-)


--
Cheers, Carlos.
  #95  
Old January 10th 19, 05:13 PM posted to alt.privacy.anon-server,alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Bobbie Sellers
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 22
Default Excellent article about Linux

On 1/10/19 6:46 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 10/01/2019 15.03, Dan Purgert wrote:
Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 10/01/2019 12.23, Dan Purgert wrote:
[...]
And it's nice that you have the _choice_ to dual-boot with *nix
installers. Fairly certain to this day, Win installation media has one
option - "Blow it all away and give me the entire drive".

No, not true. I have installed Windows with Microsoft media taking only
part of the disk, and it was trivial to do so.


Good to hear that's changed then.


I tried it with the server 2008 edition, and the corresponding "user"
edition, in several combinations.

By default, the Linux installs I know also take the whole new disk for
Linux.


Dunno what distros you're running with -- Debian and children don't do
that, unless the drive's clean.


Ubuntu? It's derivative systems such as Mate Ubuntu, Ubuntu Studio?

I said "new disk", ie, a clean disk :-)


With a Windows machine that someone wants to make
dual/multiple-boot you have to figure out how the installation
of Windows was done. I prefer UEFI to start with, I go into
Windows, a horrid experience, and find the disk management soft-
ware which the installer sometimes seems to hide away.

Then using the Windows software I reduce the size of
the Windows volume as far as possible. Once that is done
I might do a test reboot to see if the changes are solid
and that Windows will run if that is important to the user
who should have backed up the system.

Then I reboot with GPartEd Live CD and make partitions
for /boot, Swap, /(root, /usr and /home, sized according to my
intentions for use. If I want multiple boots on the test bed
I set up for the test machines about 26-30 GiB /(root) and /home.
I label the partition according to the intended use. Of course
such an elaborate scheme is hard to implement on the old
system but very easy with the GPT, using primary partitions all
the way.

On the test bed my main OS is PCLinuxOS 64 and
so the labels go PCbt, PCrt, PCur, and PCHome.

Some of the later distributions do have grabby ways
but persistence with installers may help. On Deepin which
seems to have interesting and possibly useful tools my first
attempt was a simple install it grabbed the rest of the disk
and on first attempt to use advanced installation I had
to give up, but the other day I got it to use 30 GB root and
30 GiB home partitions. After doing updates I got several
tools useful to me installed: Synaptic, Kb3, Kate and KWrite
from the Debian repositories. A lot more to play with there
and test. Nice GUI in Fashionable mode and useful in the
Efficient mode.

I do a lot of installs with different systems
for test purposes. Qubes sounds interesting and on
hard disk had no problems, but on a Flash Drive of
64 GiB it failed to copy the templates it uses for
the internal OSes of Fedora, Debian and Whonix.
It runs these in separate Virtual Machine containers
and you have to use a terminal in each to do updates.
The purpose is to isolate questionable processes.
Also it would run faster of course from an SSD with
a high end processor.

It would be far more useful in a Windows
version which is where more questionable software
is found or for developers.

Has anyone written an excellent article about
Linux yet in this thread? The article originally
referenced was a sales pitch for Windows as far as I
could see.

bliss

--
bliss dash SF 4 ever at dslextreme dot com
  #96  
Old January 11th 19, 03:00 PM posted to alt.privacy.anon-server,alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Dan Purgert
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 107
Default Excellent article about Linux

Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 10/01/2019 15.03, Dan Purgert wrote:
Carlos E.R. wrote:
[...]
By default, the Linux installs I know also take the whole new disk for
Linux.


Dunno what distros you're running with -- Debian and children don't do
that, unless the drive's clean.


I said "new disk", ie, a clean disk :-)


misread that as "whole disk"


--
|_|O|_| Registered Linux user #585947
|_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert
|O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5 4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281
 




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