Strange behavior of Win7/MSIE11

Win7 64-bit Home Edition.

I just discovered that my backup utility, FarStone Total Recovery, has
been failing to back up my MSIE Favorites folder, C:\Users\DB7\Favorites.
I poked around in TR and found that when it looks there, it finds a
folder named Favorites 160822. Windows Explorer shows it as simply
Favorites, so I thought TR was nuts.

But when I opened a command prompt and did a directory listing for C:
\Users\DB7, it too reported that the folder was Favorites 160822. And
when I copy that directory to another drive, it shows up there as
Favorites 160822.

I tried deleting that folder and creating a new Favorites, but when I ran
MSIE, it promptly created Favorites 160822 right alongside my Favorites,
and flagged that version as the "real" Favorites directory with its
little star icon.

Thinking that something in the Registry was telling Win7/MSIE 11 to
behave this way, I searched it for the string "Favorites 160822," but no
hits.

So I uninstalled MSIE 11 and 10 (which I was surprised to find still
there) and reinstalled a fresh copy of 11...which then promptly recreated
Favorites 160822.

At this point, I'm out of ideas. Anybody got another one?

--
--------------------------------------------
Dick Baker
(contact via http://goon.org/contact.php)

On Thu, 18 Jan 2018 00:11:56 GMT, Dick Baker wrote:

I tried deleting that folder and creating a new Favorites, but when I ran
MSIE, it promptly created Favorites 160822 right alongside my Favorites,
and flagged that version as the "real" Favorites directory with its
little star icon.

Does MSIE actually use that "Favorites 160822" folder as its favorite
storage? Check it from the Internet Options control panel. If the Internet
Options still point to the "Favorites" folder (the other one, without the
"160822"), that'd mean an MSIE addon/malware is creating that "Favorites
160822" folder.

On Thu, 18 Jan 2018 10:37:46 +0700, JJ wrote:

On Thu, 18 Jan 2018 00:11:56 GMT, Dick Baker wrote:

I tried deleting that folder and creating a new Favorites, but when I
ran MSIE, it promptly created Favorites 160822 right alongside my
Favorites, and flagged that version as the "real" Favorites directory
with its little star icon.

Does MSIE actually use that "Favorites 160822" folder as its favorite
storage? Check it from the Internet Options control panel. If the
Internet Options still point to the "Favorites" folder (the other one,
without the "160822"), that'd mean an MSIE addon/malware is creating
that "Favorites 160822" folder.

I've just combed (again) through Internet Options, and I can't find any
reference to a Favorites folder at all. Can you point me to exactly where
you seem to have found it?

--
--------------------------------------------
Dick Baker
--contact via http://goon.org/contact.php

On 18/01/2018 16:54, Dick Baker wrote:

I've just combed (again) through Internet Options, and I can't find any
reference to a Favorites folder at all. Can you point me to exactly where
you seem to have found it?

It's a shell folder. The most relevant subkeys are under ...
HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Exp lorer\
Things are a little different in W7, but what used to happen in 2k/XP is
that the values in the subkey ...
User Shell Folders
.... contained environment variable substitution formulae used at logon
for calculating the values in the subkey ...
Shell Folders
.... which contained the values actually used during a logon session.

Now in W7 things are somewhat more complex, and besides the working
values the latter key contains a dummy ...

"!Do not use this registry key"="Use the SHGetFolderPath or
SHGetKnownFolderPath function instead"

.... but the former key doesn't contain this dummy. So I think that
notwithstanding this "Keep off the grass!" message, you could try
looking in "User Shell Folders" and checking the value there, and
correcting it if it's incorrect. You would then have at least to log
off and then back on again to pick up the change, possibly even reboot,
'though I don't think the latter should be necessary.

Java Jive news Thu, 18 Jan 2018 17:38:28 GMT in alt.windows7.general, wrote:

On 18/01/2018 16:54, Dick Baker wrote:

I've just combed (again) through Internet Options, and I can't
find any reference to a Favorites folder at all. Can you point
me to exactly where you seem to have found it?

It's a shell folder. The most relevant subkeys are under ...
HKCU\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Exp lorer\
Things are a little different in W7, but what used to happen in
2k/XP is that the values in the subkey ...
User Shell Folders
... contained environment variable substitution formulae used at
logon for calculating the values in the subkey ...
Shell Folders
... which contained the values actually used during a logon
session.

Now in W7 things are somewhat more complex, and besides the
working values the latter key contains a dummy ...

"!Do not use this registry key"="Use the SHGetFolderPath or
SHGetKnownFolderPath function instead"

... but the former key doesn't contain this dummy. So I think
that notwithstanding this "Keep off the grass!" message, you could
try looking in "User Shell Folders" and checking the value there,
and correcting it if it's incorrect. You would then have at least
to log off and then back on again to pick up the change, possibly
even reboot, 'though I don't think the latter should be necessary.

Actually, you may be able to terminate the explorer process and
restart it for the changes to take effect. Without having to logoff
and login.


--
To prevent yourself from being a victim of cyber
stalking, it's highly recommended you visit he
https://tekrider.net/pages/david-brooks-stalker.php
================================================== =
A diplomat is someone who can tell you to go to hell and make you
feel happy to be on your way.

On Thu, 18 Jan 2018 16:54:35 GMT, Dick Baker wrote:

I've just combed (again) through Internet Options, and I can't find any
reference to a Favorites folder at all. Can you point me to exactly where
you seem to have found it?

Ah, sorry. My bad.
It's not in the Internet Options control panel. It's in the registry, just
like the others have mentioned.

On 01/17/2018 06:11 PM, Dick Baker wrote:
Win7 64-bit Home Edition.

I just discovered that my backup utility, FarStone Total Recovery, has
been failing to back up my MSIE Favorites folder, C:\Users\DB7\Favorites.
I poked around in TR and found that when it looks there, it finds a
folder named Favorites 160822. Windows Explorer shows it as simply
Favorites, so I thought TR was nuts.

But when I opened a command prompt and did a directory listing for C:
\Users\DB7, it too reported that the folder was Favorites 160822. And
when I copy that directory to another drive, it shows up there as
Favorites 160822.

I tried deleting that folder and creating a new Favorites, but when I ran
MSIE, it promptly created Favorites 160822 right alongside my Favorites,
and flagged that version as the "real" Favorites directory with its
little star icon.

Thinking that something in the Registry was telling Win7/MSIE 11 to
behave this way, I searched it for the string "Favorites 160822," but no
hits.

So I uninstalled MSIE 11 and 10 (which I was surprised to find still
there) and reinstalled a fresh copy of 11...which then promptly recreated
Favorites 160822.

At this point, I'm out of ideas. Anybody got another one?



If Windows Explorer does not show the folder Favorites 160822.

Then I imagine your backup program does not "see" it either.

Is it perhaps hidden?


At any rate, I would not trust IE-11

I'd use Firefox or Chrome

On Thu, 18 Jan 2018 09:24:12 -0600, philo wrote:

On 01/17/2018 06:11 PM, Dick Baker wrote:
Win7 64-bit Home Edition.

I just discovered that my backup utility, FarStone Total Recovery, has
been failing to back up my MSIE Favorites folder,
C:\Users\DB7\Favorites.
I poked around in TR and found that when it looks there, it finds a
folder named Favorites 160822. Windows Explorer shows it as simply
Favorites, so I thought TR was nuts.


If Windows Explorer does not show the folder Favorites 160822.

Then I imagine your backup program does not "see" it either.

Is it perhaps hidden?


No, read what I wrote again: My backup program sees only Favorites 160822--
that's what lead me to discover that in spite of what WinExp shows, Win7/
MSIE11 knows that folder only as Favorites 160822. And in any case, my
WinExp is set to show hidden files as well.


At any rate, I would not trust IE-11

I'd use Firefox or Chrome

I can't disagree with that. In fact, I started out using Firefox (or
actually, the Netscape/Firefox clone Sea Monkey) so I could avoid MSIE,
but I kept running into important web sites (such as my bank's) that
insisted that they only work with MSIE, so I reluctantly switched.

--
--------------------------------------------
Dick Baker
--contact via http://goon.org/contact.php

On Thu, 18 Jan 2018 17:01:13 GMT, Dick Baker
wrote:


On Thu, 18 Jan 2018 09:24:12 -0600, philo wrote:



At any rate, I would not trust IE-11

I'd use Firefox or Chrome


I can't disagree with that. In fact, I started out using Firefox (or
actually, the Netscape/Firefox clone Sea Monkey) so I could avoid MSIE,
but I kept running into important web sites (such as my bank's) that
insisted that they only work with MSIE, so I reluctantly switched.




I can disagree with that--at least in part, for two reasons:

1. I don't like IE because I find it clumsy to use. Trusting it is not
the issue.

2. I use and like FireFox very much, but I think Chrome is as poor a
choice as IE.

And one other point: I can't believe that any bank's site would only
work with IE. For example, what do they do for the many Macintosh
users out there. I'm a Windows user, not a Macintosh user, but I've
run into *very* few sites that don't work with FireFox. If you find
some, why not use IE for those sites, and FireFox for the others?

"Ken Blake" wrote

| 1. I don't like IE because I find it clumsy to use. Trusting it is not
| the issue.
|
https://www.recordedfuture.com/top-v...bilities-2016/

Top 10 vulnerabilities of 2016. Most are Flash.
Two are IE. One is Silverlight. None are other
browsers. And I can also offer a numbered list.

1) Depending on settings, IE is not as bad as it used
to be, but it's still not great, as shown above.

2) The integration with Windows is a very big security
issue. IE is basically part of the shell, linked to Explorer.
No one in their right mind would install a browser that
wanted to work that way. Yet people use IE.

3) While IE has detailed control of settings, those
settings are vast, largely undocumented, and not
used by most people. They can also be overridden
by malware. IE is designed to let your IT boss
control it without you knowing, overriding the
settings you choose. Malware can do the same.

Just under security there are dozens of settings.
If you count zones it goes into the thousands.
"Navigate subframes across different domains"?
Sounds like cross-site scripting. I'm not even sure.
How many people would ever see that? Yet CSS is
a big risk.
Active-X signed or not with certificates? Who
knows what that means? Very few. And far fewer
know there's still a risk of forged certificates.

It's simply not possible for the average person,
or even most techie people, to adjust IE settings
knowledgeably.

4) IE11 is a crippled monstrosity. It's no longer
entirely IE, but it's also not otherwise. By default,
all the IE-specific functionality is disabled. It can
only be enabled on a per-site basis. So it comes
dancing in telling the server that it's IE but it's
actually a stripped-down version.

5) IE11 has no reason to exist, except as an
update for writing HTAs. That's the only reason
it's still on Win10. Edge is basically IE with
limited functionality. IE11 in default mode is
similar.

On 01/18/2018 11:01 AM, Dick Baker wrote:
On Thu, 18 Jan 2018 09:24:12 -0600, philo wrote:

On 01/17/2018 06:11 PM, Dick Baker wrote:
Win7 64-bit Home Edition.

I just discovered that my backup utility, FarStone Total Recovery, has
been failing to back up my MSIE Favorites folder,
C:\Users\DB7\Favorites.
I poked around in TR and found that when it looks there, it finds a
folder named Favorites 160822. Windows Explorer shows it as simply
Favorites, so I thought TR was nuts.


If Windows Explorer does not show the folder Favorites 160822.

Then I imagine your backup program does not "see" it either.

Is it perhaps hidden?


No, read what I wrote again: My backup program sees only Favorites 160822--
that's what lead me to discover that in spite of what WinExp shows, Win7/
MSIE11 knows that folder only as Favorites 160822. And in any case, my
WinExp is set to show hidden files as well.


Ok I missed that

At any rate, I would not trust IE-11

I'd use Firefox or Chrome

I can't disagree with that. In fact, I started out using Firefox (or
actually, the Netscape/Firefox clone Sea Monkey) so I could avoid MSIE,
but I kept running into important web sites (such as my bank's) that
insisted that they only work with MSIE, so I reluctantly switched.



I know there is one browser that can be used for IE only websites

I think it is Brave Browser. I use it on my Linux machine for such sites
but have not needed it in quite some time. At any rate, you may want to
try the Windows version

On Thu, 18 Jan 2018 17:01:13 GMT, Dick Baker
wrote:

On Thu, 18 Jan 2018 09:24:12 -0600, philo wrote:

At any rate, I would not trust IE-11

I'd use Firefox or Chrome

I can't disagree with that. In fact, I started out using Firefox (or
actually, the Netscape/Firefox clone Sea Monkey) so I could avoid MSIE,
but I kept running into important web sites (such as my bank's) that
insisted that they only work with MSIE, so I reluctantly switched.

Did the sites actually not work with Sea Monkey, or were you only seeing
boilerplate language similar to "This site is optimized to work best
with IE", or words to that effect?

I used to see a lot of sites that said they worked best with IE, but I
don't see that anymore, and I can't remember the last time I ran into a
site that didn't work with Firefox. I'm guessing it's at least 10 years
or more.

--

Char Jackson

Char Jackson wrote:
On Thu, 18 Jan 2018 17:01:13 GMT, Dick Baker
wrote:

On Thu, 18 Jan 2018 09:24:12 -0600, philo wrote:

At any rate, I would not trust IE-11

I'd use Firefox or Chrome
I can't disagree with that. In fact, I started out using Firefox (or
actually, the Netscape/Firefox clone Sea Monkey) so I could avoid MSIE,
but I kept running into important web sites (such as my bank's) that
insisted that they only work with MSIE, so I reluctantly switched.

Did the sites actually not work with Sea Monkey, or were you only seeing
boilerplate language similar to "This site is optimized to work best
with IE", or words to that effect?

I used to see a lot of sites that said they worked best with IE, but I
don't see that anymore, and I can't remember the last time I ran into a
site that didn't work with Firefox. I'm guessing it's at least 10 years
or more.


This site seems capable of throwing up a "bad browser" result,
with just about any browser. All depends on what mood it's
in at the time.

https://www.winhelp.us/internet-expl...favorites.html

So rather than "optimized" or "we don't support this browser any more",
they pretend your browser is a space alien :-) Like you went
to all the trouble of making an Agent string they had never
seen before.

You're not actually supposed to sniff User Agent strings,
but they probably didn't get the memo. You're supposed to
sniff capability instead. And then make confusing comments
like "this browser doesn't support Javascript", when, obviously,
it does. Just the wrong version of Javascript, but no error
message ever refers to that aspect of it.

There aren't really a lot of honest responses from web browsers.
Mostly tangential references you'll never figure out in
a million years.

Paul

"Paul" wrote

| This site seems capable of throwing up a "bad browser" result,
| with just about any browser. All depends on what mood it's
| in at the time.
|
| https://www.winhelp.us/internet-expl...favorites.html
|

?? It looks fine to me, with script, cookies,
3rd-party files and frames blocked in Pale Moon.
Except for the red panel at top that warns me
I absolutely must allow script.

The source code is mostly plain vanilla with
script for Google spyware and ads. There's just
one exception: A very funky block of heavily
obfuscated script near the bottom.
Above that code, in a comment that doesn't
show, is this:

"LEGAL NOTICE: The content of this website and all
associated program code are protected under the
Digital Millennium Copyright Act. Intentionally
circumventing this code may constitute a violation
of the DMCA."

*May* constitute. So you *may* be breaking
federal law if you disable script on that page and
allow them to hack you with their grotesquely
obfuscated script.

| You're not actually supposed to sniff User Agent strings,
| but they probably didn't get the memo. You're supposed to
| sniff capability instead.

I hope that was said sarcastically. Checking
capability and not sniffing userAgents is a
bald-faced scam that Microsoft are trying to
perpetrate as the new norm. They actually
spoof their UA in Edge. I had to write new
PHP on my webpages to recognize it. They
want me to give Edge my version for Firefox.
But they're not offering to be responsible for
the results. And I can't even install Edge. It
only comes as part of Win10. That's not a
browser to consider any more than Apple's
Safari is. If they want compatibility they can
either get their act together to make a real
browser, or make sure Edge matches IE in
its rendering.... which they won't do.

Dick Baker wrote:
Win7 64-bit Home Edition.

I just discovered that my backup utility, FarStone Total Recovery, has
been failing to back up my MSIE Favorites folder, C:\Users\DB7\Favorites.
I poked around in TR and found that when it looks there, it finds a
folder named Favorites 160822. Windows Explorer shows it as simply
Favorites, so I thought TR was nuts.

But when I opened a command prompt and did a directory listing for C:
\Users\DB7, it too reported that the folder was Favorites 160822. And
when I copy that directory to another drive, it shows up there as
Favorites 160822.

I tried deleting that folder and creating a new Favorites, but when I ran
MSIE, it promptly created Favorites 160822 right alongside my Favorites,
and flagged that version as the "real" Favorites directory with its
little star icon.

Thinking that something in the Registry was telling Win7/MSIE 11 to
behave this way, I searched it for the string "Favorites 160822," but no
hits.

So I uninstalled MSIE 11 and 10 (which I was surprised to find still
there) and reinstalled a fresh copy of 11...which then promptly recreated
Favorites 160822.

At this point, I'm out of ideas. Anybody got another one?


My guess is that on the 22nd August 2016 some body or program changed
your Favourites location.
To change it back navigate to the folder in Win Explorer, right click on
it and select Properties. Click the Location tab, and then either
Restore Default or Move.

Ed