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#16
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How do we debug a program that is constantly hanging?
On Sun, 28 Jan 2018 23:48:43 -0000 (UTC),
Mad Roger wrote: Notice two things: a. Nvidis is somehow involved, and, b. autoupdate.geo.opera.com is somehow involved. http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=5674780whatishang6.jpg I removed the line for autoupdate.geo.opera.com from the HOSTS file (which has been there for more than a year so that couldn't have been the proximate cause) and now the problem moved down a notch. Hang report for C:\apps\browser\ch-based\opera2\50.0.2762.67\opera.exe Generated by using WhatIsHang on 28-Jan-18 4:50:01 PM Web site: http://www.nirsoft.net Remarks: * The program hangs in a single system call. You can look in the call stack and stack data to find out which API function cause this hang. Strings found in the stack: 0.10K+-+APg-,H NVIDIA runtime.onMessageExternal chrome://gpu/GpuProcessTransportFactory::CreateContextCommon= Modules found in the stack: C:\WINDOWS\SYSTEM32\KERNELBASE.dll , Microsoft Corporation , Microsoft+AK4- Windows+AK4- Operating System, Windows NT BASE API Client DLL C:\apps\browser\ch-based\opera2\50.0.2762.67\opera_browser.dll ThreadID: 4788 Execute Address: 771D6C1C ntdll.dll!NtWaitForSingleObject+-0xc Call Stack: 04BDEB8C 74E8E262 KERNELBASE.dll!WaitForSingleObject+-0x12 |
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#17
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How do we debug a program that is constantly hanging?
On Mon, 29 Jan 2018 00:54:59 -0000 (UTC),
Mad Roger wrote: Strings found in the stack: 0.10K+-+APg-,H NVIDIA runtime.onMessageExternal chrome://gpu/GpuProcessTransportFactory::CreateContextCommon= This URL gives interesting information but I'm not sure what good it is: chrome://gpu/GpuProcessTransportFactory::CreateContextCommon This is the result after pasting into Opera (or any Chrome-based browser): http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=3464818whatishang7.jpg |
#18
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How do we debug a program that is constantly hanging?
On Sat, 27 Jan 2018 19:54:31 -0000 (UTC), Mad Roger
wrote: I've been using the Opera browser for a very long time but all of a sudden (after an automatic Windows update), Opera hangs within a minute or two of bringing it up. It doesn't matter what I do with Opera, it hangs within a minute or two, but it never hangs right away. Just a clarification: to debug a program is to find the code in it that is wrong, and fix it. It's almost impossible to do that with a program you didn't write. You can't even see the source code. |
#19
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How do we debug a program that is constantly hanging?
Mad Roger wrote:
2. A recent windows update is what "seems" to have started the hanging http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=4002673update1.jpg Is that an update, or an OS Upgrade ? I haven't seen that dialog, because I "force install" all my OS Upgrades as soon as they're available. Your dialog almost looks like a transition from 15063 to 16299. Running "winver" on the before and after, would tell you. Using the "revert" function within 10 days of an Upgrade, would allow you to go back to the previous release. Paul |
#20
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How do we debug a program that is constantly hanging?
Mad Roger wrote:
On Mon, 29 Jan 2018 00:54:59 -0000 (UTC), Mad Roger wrote: Strings found in the stack: 0.10K+-+APg-,H NVIDIA runtime.onMessageExternal chrome://gpu/GpuProcessTransportFactory::CreateContextCommon= This URL gives interesting information but I'm not sure what good it is: chrome://gpu/GpuProcessTransportFactory::CreateContextCommon This is the result after pasting into Opera (or any Chrome-based browser): http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=3464818whatishang7.jpg So it looks like attempts to "disable hardware acceleration" just don't work, and the damn program keeps putzing with the GPU anyway. Even though you told it not to. The 16299 OS likely uses WDM 2.3 (if available). Maybe the Opera people haven't considered all these permutations in their "GPU abuse code" ? Paul |
#21
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How do we debug a program that is constantly hanging?
On Sun, 28 Jan 2018 22:58:58 -0500,
Paul wrote: Is that an update, or an OS Upgrade ? I haven't seen that dialog, because I "force install" all my OS Upgrades as soon as they're available. Your dialog almost looks like a transition from 15063 to 16299. Running "winver" on the before and after, would tell you. Using the "revert" function within 10 days of an Upgrade, would allow you to go back to the previous release. Long sordid story. It's probably "somewhat" related, but almost certainly not completely related. It's not related because Opera has been working for about a year (or so), and only recently (days) started hanging. It's perhaps related because my Win 10 Pro has *everything* possible turned off. That means all cortana, all suggestions, all tracking, all updates, etc. So *every* Windows-forced update fails in the end, even those I let go through fruition. Start Run cmd winver Version 1511 (OS Build 10586.1106) Here's a screenshot: http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=1320968winver.jpg Note: Microsoft *says* you can't stave off an update forever - but you certainly can - as mine has *never* updated and it's a perfectly valid release (I just turned off one too many things - and I don't know what it was that finally killed *all* Windows updates - but they're dead). I'm not worried about the Windows update, nor really about Opera hanging. What I'd like to know is how to debug *any* process that hangs. We've got a good start with this Nirsoft tool - but - what next? |
#22
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How do we debug a program that is constantly hanging?
On Sun, 28 Jan 2018 23:06:09 -0500,
Paul wrote: So it looks like attempts to "disable hardware acceleration" just don't work, and the damn program keeps putzing with the GPU anyway. Even though you told it not to. I think whomever it was that suggested the graphics card hardware acceleration was on the money (was that you?). I agree with you that, "something" is holding this up, and from the looks of the results of pasting this URL into any Chrome-based browser - there are a *lot* of hacks going on with respect to the GPUs (mine is Nvidia): chrome://gpu/GpuProcessTransportFactory::CreateContextCommon The 16299 OS likely uses WDM 2.3 (if available). Maybe the Opera people haven't considered all these permutations in their "GPU abuse code" ? I have to agree with you that it's shocking to see the number of "hacks" that the chrome-based browsers seem to be undergoing when you type that URL into any Chrome-based browser. They all seem to output the same information - so it's odd that the only chrome-based browser that is hanging is Opera - but I'm going to agree with you. They probably never saw a system like mine - but - the oddity is that it was working until recently. So something changed in the past few days, but what? It's probably too late to go back so at this point, it's really just a question of how to debug Windows when a Windows app hangs. |
#23
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How do we debug a program that is constantly hanging?
Mad Roger wrote:
On Sun, 28 Jan 2018 22:58:58 -0500, Paul wrote: Is that an update, or an OS Upgrade ? I haven't seen that dialog, because I "force install" all my OS Upgrades as soon as they're available. Your dialog almost looks like a transition from 15063 to 16299. Running "winver" on the before and after, would tell you. Using the "revert" function within 10 days of an Upgrade, would allow you to go back to the previous release. Long sordid story. It's probably "somewhat" related, but almost certainly not completely related. It's not related because Opera has been working for about a year (or so), and only recently (days) started hanging. It's perhaps related because my Win 10 Pro has *everything* possible turned off. That means all cortana, all suggestions, all tracking, all updates, etc. So *every* Windows-forced update fails in the end, even those I let go through fruition. Start Run cmd winver Version 1511 (OS Build 10586.1106) Here's a screenshot: http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=1320968winver.jpg Note: Microsoft *says* you can't stave off an update forever - but you certainly can - as mine has *never* updated and it's a perfectly valid release (I just turned off one too many things - and I don't know what it was that finally killed *all* Windows updates - but they're dead). I'm not worried about the Windows update, nor really about Opera hanging. What I'd like to know is how to debug *any* process that hangs. We've got a good start with this Nirsoft tool - but - what next? But that picture is an OS upgrade coming in. That's why it says "your files are right where you left them". http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=9976681update2.jpg Part of that sequence, is pulling in a new graphics driver. If you upgrade with a DVD, it doesn't pull in a new graphics driver. If you let Windows Update do an OS upgrade, or if you use the standalone EXE, those will download a new graphics driver. ******* I think the Nifsoft one, expects the program to have opened a window. And at the same time, expects the program to be using the standard event loop. A program will go to the "Not responding" state, if the Event Loop is not eating incoming events on a timely basis. This includes your mouse touching the program window and so on. If an event sits in an OS event queue for too long, that's how the OS knows it is "not responding". That could be why my attempt to make an artificial test case failed, because I should have been using my one sample program that has the event loop in it. Now the part I don't get, is how Nir gets a stack trace out of that. If I were to TaskKill a program, the program state would be neatly cleaned up, and there'd be no log. I wonder how else you can do that ? I think the Event Loop idea, is merely to help populate the viewing window in the Nirsoft dialog. I don't know that it's essential for the trace generation step. Whatever mechanism that is being used there, should probably work with anything in Ring 3 (applications). Maybe I should have been testing with this against the Nirsoft thing: https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/sys...ads/notmyfault ******* If you run Sysinternals Process Explorer as Administrator, you can "probe" a program for a snapshot of the current stack trace. I used this against the svchost hosting wuaueng.dll (Windows Update on an earlier OS). While the result wasn't very useful, it did work, and it could have given a similar hint about your NVidia driver. Even getting the name of a DLL is better than nothing. https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/vij...cess-explorer/ I've set up the Symbol Server a number of times, and while it's nice and all, I generally ZIP it up and remove it as it's generally just a waste of space at other times. Paul |
#24
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How do we debug a program that is constantly hanging?
On Mon, 29 Jan 2018 01:52:02 -0500,
Paul wrote: But that picture is an OS upgrade coming in. That's why it says "your files are right where you left them". http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=9976681update2.jpg You know this better than I do, so I appreciate the advice. All I know is that I let microsoft do whatever it wants to do in that situation and it *never* updates the operating system. Are you saying I missed a manual step somewhere? (Because if I did, just tell me what I am supposed to do, as I'm not against Microsoft updating the OS - I'm just against losing privacy.) Part of that sequence, is pulling in a new graphics driver. If you upgrade with a DVD, it doesn't pull in a new graphics driver. If you let Windows Update do an OS upgrade, or if you use the standalone EXE, those will download a new graphics driver. Paul - what do I need to do to make the current Microsoft update just finish? It never seems to update anything (and I've been though this sequence many times). Many reboots. Many failures. Maybe I'm missing a *manual* step to updating Windows? Here's a snapshot of a *new* directory "C:\Windows10Upgrade". http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=755...owsupgrade.jpg Is there something I can manually do to *finish* that upgrade? |
#25
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How do we debug a program that is constantly hanging?
Mad Roger wrote:
On Mon, 29 Jan 2018 01:52:02 -0500, Paul wrote: But that picture is an OS upgrade coming in. That's why it says "your files are right where you left them". http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=9976681update2.jpg You know this better than I do, so I appreciate the advice. All I know is that I let microsoft do whatever it wants to do in that situation and it *never* updates the operating system. Are you saying I missed a manual step somewhere? (Because if I did, just tell me what I am supposed to do, as I'm not against Microsoft updating the OS - I'm just against losing privacy.) Part of that sequence, is pulling in a new graphics driver. If you upgrade with a DVD, it doesn't pull in a new graphics driver. If you let Windows Update do an OS upgrade, or if you use the standalone EXE, those will download a new graphics driver. Paul - what do I need to do to make the current Microsoft update just finish? It never seems to update anything (and I've been though this sequence many times). Many reboots. Many failures. Maybe I'm missing a *manual* step to updating Windows? Here's a snapshot of a *new* directory "C:\Windows10Upgrade". http://www.bild.me/bild.php?file=755...owsupgrade.jpg Is there something I can manually do to *finish* that upgrade? To do a Win10 Upgrade install: 1) Download the 16299 DVD 2) Put it in the tray while the Win10 OS is running. Double-click Setup.exe. If it still fails, after the reboot 1) dism... restorehealth thing 2) sfc /scannow thing 3) Then repeat the above attempt. ******* Two log files are created during install. The first step, the file copying one, uses one log file. The other reboot-steps use a second log file. But you won't learn all that much from the log files. Paul |
#26
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How do we debug a program that is constantly hanging?
On Mon, 29 Jan 2018 13:47:17 -0500,
Paul wrote: To do a Win10 Upgrade install: 1) Download the 16299 DVD 2) Put it in the tray while the Win10 OS is running. Double-click Setup.exe. If it still fails, after the reboot 1) dism... restorehealth thing 2) sfc /scannow thing 3) Then repeat the above attempt. Hi Paul, I should have mentioned I know how to do a *full* install (I wouldn't bother with an upgrade if I'm going to do it from an ISO file or DVD). I *already* have the ISO files, where the full install only awaits my back up of my data (which is the biggest step in *any* Windows installation). That's why I wanted to know if there was a way to make the automatic update actually work - but no need to ponder that fully as I'd just do a full install if it bothered me that Windows can't update itself. Thanks. BTW, here's how I would do a full install (if you have improvements). Overview: 1. Download the MS MediaCreationTool.exe (& run as Administrator) 2. Use that tool to download the right Windows 10 ISO file to your HDD 3. Burn that resulting ISO file to a bootable DVD disc Steps: 01) Go to https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/soft...load/windows10 02) Select the blue button labeled "Download tool now" (http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=691209) This downloads "MediaCreationTool.exe" 17,928KB 03) Run a hash on the MediaCreationTool.exe & save locally as "hash.txt" Algorithm: SHA256 Hash: 00665B36D7B75B896D3F45BB99F0FCF93461023CACC7D83113 CF5661725C1371 Path: MediaCreationTool.exe 04) Right click on "MediaCreationTool.exe" to select "Run as Administrator" 05) Select Accept to the license agreement 06) When it asks "What do you want to do?", you have only two choices ( ) Upgrade this PC now ( ) Create installation media (USB flash drive, DVD, or ISO file) for another PC 07) Select Create installation media for another PC 08) Select Next 09) Uncheck the box [ ]Use the recommended options for this PC 10) Select the language = English (United States) 11) Select the edition = Windows 10 Choices are Windows 10, Windows 10 Home Single Language, & Windows 10 N 12) Select the architecture = Both Choices are 64-bit (x64), 32-bit (x86), Both The size for "both" is 6.4GB 13) Select Next 14) Select the media = ISO file Choices are USB flash drive (it needs to be at least 8 GB) or ISO file (you'll need to burn the ISO file to a DVD later) 15) Select Next 16) Windows Explorer will ask where to save the file. Default name will be "Windows.iso" which you may rename as desired Windows_x64.iso 3,553,536 KB, or, Windows_x32-x64.iso 6,362,368 KB 17) The user interface will say "Downloading Windows 10" Progress x% 18) When done the GUI will ask "Burn the ISO file to a DVD" Where your only 3 choices a C:\path\Windows.iso (click this to open to that file) Open DVD burner (click this to bring up the DVD burner [Finish] (Disconnect the network to prevent the next step from happening.) 19) Hit Finish & Microsoft will immediately be notified over the network 20) When done, run a hash on the downloaded ISO file (save as hash.txt) 21) Burn the ISO file to DVD disc 22) Run a hash on the ISO disc (compare with the original hash.txt) 23) Set the F10 BIOS boot order to put the DVD before the HDD 24) Insert the DVD on the PC where you want to install Windows 10 Pro 25) Restart your PC 26) Press any key to boot from the DVD 27) On the Install Windows page, select your language 28) Select the time 29) Select the keyboard preferences 30) Select Next 31) Select Install Windows Note that if Win10 was previously installed on the same device no product key is required when performing a subsequent clean install. During installation choose the Skip option and the digital license stored on Microsoft's servers will be used to activate Windows 10 when installed. This seems to be for updates but not for a bootable Windows 10 Pro ISO: http://www.catalog.update.microsoft.com/Home.aspx |
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