Newsgroups, Windows live mail

On 27 Jan 2011 19:31:01 -0600, Jim wrote:
I would prefer to get both email and newsgroup access on the same
program.


Who?

Would you also prefer to open cans and chop vegetables with the same
tool?

Remember the proverb: "jack of all trades, master of none".

--
Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Tompkins County, New York, USA
http://OakRoadSystems.com
Shikata ga nai...

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 08:29:57 -0500, Stan Brown
wrote:

On 27 Jan 2011 19:31:01 -0600, Jim wrote:
I would prefer to get both email and newsgroup access on the same
program.


Who?

Would you also prefer to open cans and chop vegetables with the same
tool?

Remember the proverb: "jack of all trades, master of none".



I don't see it quite the same way as you do. As far as I'm concerned,
there's no advantage to having one problem do both, but there's also
nothing wrong with having one program do both.

I think one should choose whatever e-mail program works best for him
and whatever newsreader works best for him. If those are two different
programs (as they are for me--Microsoft Outlook 2010 for mail and
FortÊ Agent 6.0 for newsgroups), fine. But if they are the same
program, that's also fine.

But I completely agree with you that the two functions being in the
same program should not be considered a factor in making the choices.

On 29/01/2011 15:04, Ken Blake wrote:
On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 08:29:57 -0500, Stan Brown
wrote:

On 27 Jan 2011 19:31:01 -0600, Jim wrote:
I would prefer to get both email and newsgroup access on the same
program.


Who?

Would you also prefer to open cans and chop vegetables with the same
tool?

Remember the proverb: "jack of all trades, master of none".



I don't see it quite the same way as you do. As far as I'm concerned,
there's no advantage to having one problem do both, but there's also
nothing wrong with having one program do both.

I think one should choose whatever e-mail program works best for him
and whatever newsreader works best for him. If those are two different
programs (as they are for me--Microsoft Outlook 2010 for mail and
FortÊ Agent 6.0 for newsgroups), fine. But if they are the same
program, that's also fine.

But I completely agree with you that the two functions being in the
same program should not be considered a factor in making the choices.



On the other hand you don't want to have lots of different programs
doing a bit here and a bit there. Taken to its logical conclusion that
would create a mess.

It's been traditional to have mail and news together; right back to the
good old early days when OE was king of the roost.
I stick with Tbird for both. It does me fine, suits the way I work here
and I can see no need to change it. It causes me no problems, doesn't
hinder me in any way, and I can't see any improvement or benefit in
replacing it.

The good old days were when all the ISPs had news servers. People would
buy a computer, be hit with all the MS stuff on it, and be given Usenet
as *the* social networking technique. Oh how things have changed; and
that's why we old-timers are now the norm in these groups; all the
youngies are on Facebook and Twitter.

Ed

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 15:30:25 +0000, Ed Cryer
wrote:

On 29/01/2011 15:04, Ken Blake wrote:

I don't see it quite the same way as you do. As far as I'm concerned,
there's no advantage to having one problem do both, but there's also
nothing wrong with having one program do both.

I think one should choose whatever e-mail program works best for him
and whatever newsreader works best for him. If those are two different
programs (as they are for me--Microsoft Outlook 2010 for mail and
FortÊ Agent 6.0 for newsgroups), fine. But if they are the same
program, that's also fine.

But I completely agree with you that the two functions being in the
same program should not be considered a factor in making the choices.



On the other hand you don't want to have lots of different programs
doing a bit here and a bit there. Taken to its logical conclusion that
would create a mess.


Then we have very different views on the subject. To me, having fewer
programs is not better than having more.


It's been traditional to have mail and news together; right back to the
good old early days when OE was king of the roost.


Traditional? Yes. Desirable? No. Not to me.


I stick with Tbird for both. It does me fine, suits the way I work here
and I can see no need to change it. It causes me no problems, doesn't
hinder me in any way, and I can't see any improvement or benefit in
replacing it.


Then fine, you should stick with you use and like. Thunderbird
wouldn't be my choice, but I certainly won't try to talk you out of
what you like.

On Fri, 28 Jan 2011 19:38:50 -0600, Char Jackson wrote:

1. I can't find a way to change the fonts in Thunderbird's header pane.
I even went to their web site and searched.

This was the first hit for me in Google
http://kb.mozillazine.org/Font_settings_in_Thunderbird

If I read it right, you can change that specific font by changing the
theme. As fixes go, is a different theme too drastic? I don't have
T'bird installed so I can't check for myself at the moment.

That sounds good, but I don't like to deal with themes - see next
paragraph. Anyway, I searched the Mozilla help site and never even
thought about Googling :-)

Changing a theme seems pretty indirect. You might have to try 493 themes
before you stumble on one that solves the given problem, whereas a
direct change of font size would be easier (if available).

I guess there might be something in Thunderbird's about:config, but it's
a huge file and AFAICT is not fully documented.

Anyway, for me it's not a problem, since I have no trouble with the
Thunderbird header pane font size, and never even guessed that it could
be troublesome.

--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 15:30:25 +0000, Ed Cryer wrote:

On the other hand you don't want to have lots of different programs
doing a bit here and a bit there. Taken to its logical conclusion that
would create a mess.

Or create Unix :-)

--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 13:49:58 -0800, "Gene E. Bloch"
wrote:

Changing a theme seems pretty indirect. You might have to try 493 themes
before you stumble on one that solves the given problem, whereas a
direct change of font size would be easier (if available).

I guess there might be something in Thunderbird's about:config, but it's
a huge file and AFAICT is not fully documented.

I wouldn't be surprised if it's either there, or in one of the config
files.

Anyway, for me it's not a problem, since I have no trouble with the
Thunderbird header pane font size, and never even guessed that it could
be troublesome.

When I set up a new system, right after I install Firefox and make it
the default browser, I add my usual set of add-ons and that's when I
also change the theme (to Office 2003 Silver), so changing themes is
second nature to me. I agree, though, you might have to try a few, or
a lot, unless there's something in the description that tells you it
addresses this one aspect.

--

Char Jackson

On 29 Jan 2011, "Gene E. Bloch" wrote in
alt.windows7.general:

I guess there might be something in Thunderbird's about:config,
but it's a huge file and AFAICT is not fully documented.

I haven't been following this thread, but maybe the answer would be
found he

http://kb.mozillazine.org/Pane_and_menu_fonts

You can cusomize some of Thunderbird's visual elements, like UI fonts,
by using a customized userChrome.css file. I don't think there's one by
default, so you'd have to tweak an example or create your own.

I haven't tried it myself.

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 08:04:35 -0700, Ken Blake wrote:
On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 08:29:57 -0500, Stan Brown
wrote:

[quoted text muted]
Would you also prefer to open cans and chop vegetables with the same
tool?

Remember the proverb: "jack of all trades, master of none".

I don't see it quite the same way as you do. As far as I'm concerned,
there's no advantage to having one problem do both, but there's also
nothing wrong with having one program do both.

If there *were* a program that did an excellent job with both, I'd
agree with you. But every program I've ever tried that purported to
do both turned out to be an email program with newsgroups grafted on
and forced into the email paradigm, or vice versa.

--
Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Tompkins County, New York, USA
http://OakRoadSystems.com
Shikata ga nai...

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 15:30:25 +0000, Ed Cryer wrote:
It's been traditional to have mail and news together; right back to the
good old early days when OE was king of the roost.

Um, Ed, your "good old days" were after Usenet had been humming along
for a decade or so and em ail for even longer.

--
Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Tompkins County, New York, USA
http://OakRoadSystems.com
Shikata ga nai...

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 20:05:10 -0500, Stan Brown
wrote:

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 15:30:25 +0000, Ed Cryer wrote:
It's been traditional to have mail and news together; right back to the
good old early days when OE was king of the roost.

Um, Ed, your "good old days" were after Usenet had been humming along
for a decade or so and em ail for even longer.

Agreed, but I got thrown by the idea that OE might have ever been king
of the roost. That's completely foreign to me.

--

Char Jackson

On Sat, 29 Jan 2011 18:20:54 -0500, Nil wrote:

On 29 Jan 2011, "Gene E. Bloch" wrote in
alt.windows7.general:

I guess there might be something in Thunderbird's about:config,
but it's a huge file and AFAICT is not fully documented.

I haven't been following this thread, but maybe the answer would be
found he

http://kb.mozillazine.org/Pane_and_menu_fonts

You can cusomize some of Thunderbird's visual elements, like UI fonts,
by using a customized userChrome.css file. I don't think there's one by
default, so you'd have to tweak an example or create your own.

I haven't tried it myself.

Thanks. That looks perfect for the OP.

And your post implies something about my searching skills :-)

I'll add it to my bookmarks before I forget (the whole mozillazine, that
is)...Done.

--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)

"Jim" wrote in message ...

It's my understanding that Microsoft Live Mail will no longer provide or
facilitate access to NNTP newsgroups, and that they are gradually
eliminating access. With Windows 7, I can no longer get access to
newsgroups even though I pay a monthly fee to a commercial service for
newsgroup access. ( I have been able to get access on Thunderbird, but
not on Windows Live Mail or Yahoo mail.)

Does this mean that newsgroup access is no longer of general interest,
and that it may eventually die off? Or, am I doing something wrong when
I try to access them on Yahoo or Windows mail? - I would be interested
in what others are using and recommend for newsgroup access.

Reading some of the Microsoft pronouncements on the matter, it sounds
like they want us to shift to Microsoft discussion groups of various
kinds, which apparently have Microsoft supervision and moderation. (In
the past, I have found NNTP newsgroups, both moderated and unmoderated,
to be a great source of information on a variety of subjects. I would
hate to see them go.)

Jim


Bettablue wrote:

I am using WLM 2011 running on Windows 7 and have no problems accessing the
newsgroup servers. Cox ended their support of newsgroup access several
months ago, so I added Eternal_September to WLM for NNTP access and
everything is fine. Of course, Eternal_September doesn't support any kind
of imaging or video content, but at least it gives me access to the groups I
want/need.

On Sun, 30 Jan 2011 10:21:50 -0800, bettablue wrote:
I am using WLM 2011 running on Windows 7 and have no problems accessing the
newsgroup servers.


Except that your news software screws up the quoting. Please read the
other threads on this very topic in this very newsgroup.

--
Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Tompkins County, New York, USA
http://OakRoadSystems.com
Shikata ga nai...

On 30/01/2011 18:21, bettablue wrote:
"Jim" wrote in message ...

It's my understanding that Microsoft Live Mail will no longer provide or
facilitate access to NNTP newsgroups, and that they are gradually
eliminating access. With Windows 7, I can no longer get access to
newsgroups even though I pay a monthly fee to a commercial service for
newsgroup access. ( I have been able to get access on Thunderbird, but
not on Windows Live Mail or Yahoo mail.)

Does this mean that newsgroup access is no longer of general interest,
and that it may eventually die off? Or, am I doing something wrong when
I try to access them on Yahoo or Windows mail? - I would be interested
in what others are using and recommend for newsgroup access.

Reading some of the Microsoft pronouncements on the matter, it sounds
like they want us to shift to Microsoft discussion groups of various
kinds, which apparently have Microsoft supervision and moderation. (In
the past, I have found NNTP newsgroups, both moderated and unmoderated,
to be a great source of information on a variety of subjects. I would
hate to see them go.)

Jim


Bettablue wrote:

I am using WLM 2011 running on Windows 7 and have no problems accessing the
newsgroup servers. Cox ended their support of newsgroup access several
months ago, so I added Eternal_September to WLM for NNTP access and
everything is fine. Of course, Eternal_September doesn't support any kind
of imaging or video content, but at least it gives me access to the groups I
want/need.



It's on the wane, pal. ISPs have one after the other shut down their
news-servers, and it's lone individuals doing public service who are
keeping it alive.
There's the guy in Rome who runs Aioe; machine in the basement of his
mother's house down near the Tiber, flooded out last year and hit
trouble with his ISP, but fought nobly to resurrect it.
Then there's Ray Banana on Eternal-September; he's a delight of a man, a
modern hero.
Google Groups is still available (updated very, very late over the
weekend). I doubt they'll cut off too soon; call it Google-honour!

No, social networking is going over to the Web; and things like Facebook
and Twitter.

Ah well, c'est la vie!

Ed