If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below. |
|
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
#1
|
|||
|
|||
UPS battery options
Found this. What do you think ?
I am wondering how the internal charger would react to seeing a 110 CCA battery as opposed to the internal 9 Ah battery? My UPS uses an external battery. It's not of a make that anyone here would recognize. It's very basic, rather poor in external finish and internal construction but it does the job and has been doing it for some 13 years. I use a small car battery of 35Ah capacity which gives me a good backup time. I've never tested the backup time to its limit but it's more than 1 hour when the battery's new. I used the first battery for about 10 years by which time the backup time had dropped to about a minute. The replacement cost around $50 and is still going strong after 3 years. |
Ads |
#2
|
|||
|
|||
UPS battery options
Andy wrote:
Found this. What do you think ? I am wondering how the internal charger would react to seeing a 110 CCA battery as opposed to the internal 9 Ah battery? My UPS uses an external battery. It's not of a make that anyone here would recognize. It's very basic, rather poor in external finish and internal construction but it does the job and has been doing it for some 13 years. I use a small car battery of 35Ah capacity which gives me a good backup time. I've never tested the backup time to its limit but it's more than 1 hour when the battery's new. I used the first battery for about 10 years by which time the backup time had dropped to about a minute. The replacement cost around $50 and is still going strong after 3 years. The battery that comes with the UPS is called SLA. Sealed Lead Acid. It doesn't give off hydrogen. Not unless the battery is abused (something the UPS won't be doing to it). ******* Car batteries on the other hand, the ones with the vent hole on each cap, those give off hydrogen gas. If the hydrogen collects in a room, and a little static electricity sets it off, there will be an explosion. My next door neighbor did that once. Left a car battery on the charger overnight, and *closed* the garage door. When he turned on the lights the next day, "kablooie". Battery acid everywhere. The garage looked like a ****hole :-) Take a careful look at the battery, and see if is a flush surface, maintenance free type. No vents. That's a bit safer, but not quite as safe as an SLA. A car battery would not be my first choice. I've been burned by hydrogen before, and that stuff makes me a "bit nervous" so to speak. I can guarantee you'll have a story to tell, if it happens. I don't mind using car batteries if they're stored outdoors while charging (which could be any time), and heavy cables lead back to the house. That would be OK. Treat it like a BBQ cylinder. We don't bring propane into the house either. For safety. The SLA is pretty safe. The one that came with the UPS. And Chinese replacement SLA are pretty cheap (compared to what we used to pay for replacement UPS batteries). Even the UPS manufacturer ships new gear with Chinese batteries in it now. The Chinese battery has the original brand on it, and the UPS maker just "puts a sticker on the battery" to make it theirs. Paul |
#3
|
|||
|
|||
UPS battery options
On 01/17/2018 07:56 PM, Paul wrote:
Andy wrote: Found this. What do you think ? I am wondering how the internal charger would react to seeing a 110 CCA battery as opposed to the internal 9 Ah battery? My UPS uses an external battery. It's not of a make that anyone here would recognize. It's very basic, rather poor in external finish and internal construction but it does the job and has been doing it for some 13 years. I use a small car battery of 35Ah capacity which gives me a good backup time. I've never tested the backup time to its limit but it's more than 1 hour when the battery's new. I used the first battery for about 10 years by which time the backup time had dropped to about a minute. The replacement cost around $50 and is still going strong after 3 years. The battery that comes with the UPS is called SLA. Sealed Lead Acid. It doesn't give off hydrogen. Not unless the battery is abused (something the UPS won't be doing to it). ******* Car batteries on the other hand, the ones with the vent hole on each cap, those give off hydrogen gas. If the hydrogen collects in a room, and a little static electricity sets it off, there will be an explosion. My next door neighbor did that once. Left a car battery on the charger overnight, and *closed* the garage door. When he turned on the lights the next day, "kablooie". Battery acid everywhere. The garage looked like a ****hole :-) Take a careful look at the battery, and see if is a flush surface, maintenance free type. No vents. That's a bit safer, but not quite as safe as an SLA. A car battery would not be my first choice. I've been burned by hydrogen before, and that stuff makes me a "bit nervous" so to speak. I can guarantee you'll have a story to tell, if it happens. I don't mind using car batteries if they're stored outdoors while charging (which could be any time), and heavy cables lead back to the house. That would be OK. Treat it like a BBQ cylinder. We don't bring propane into the house either. For safety. The SLA is pretty safe. The one that came with the UPS. And Chinese replacement SLA are pretty cheap (compared to what we used to pay for replacement UPS batteries). Even the UPS manufacturer ships new gear with Chinese batteries in it now. The Chinese battery has the original brand on it, and the UPS maker just "puts a sticker on the battery" to make it theirs. Â*Â* Paul Paul: I was in the industrial battery business for 38 year. When I retired I was the Senior Service engineer for Enersys-Delaware. In all those years I only blew up a battery once. I shorted a cell on a stationary battery. There were no injuries but my ears rang for 24 hours. Most of the UPS's would float charge the batteries, but I really like the ones manufactured by Best. Thye used hysteresis loop charging which I thought was very wise. The charger would turn off entirely then kick back in when the voltage dropped near open-circuit voltage. Batteries lasted a long time. |
#4
|
|||
|
|||
UPS battery options
On Wednesday, January 17, 2018 at 8:26:08 PM UTC-6, philo wrote:
On 01/17/2018 07:56 PM, Paul wrote: Andy wrote: Found this. What do you think ? I am wondering how the internal charger would react to seeing a 110 CCA battery as opposed to the internal 9 Ah battery? My UPS uses an external battery. It's not of a make that anyone here would recognize. It's very basic, rather poor in external finish and internal construction but it does the job and has been doing it for some 13 years. I use a small car battery of 35Ah capacity which gives me a good backup time. I've never tested the backup time to its limit but it's more than 1 hour when the battery's new. I used the first battery for about 10 years by which time the backup time had dropped to about a minute. The replacement cost around $50 and is still going strong after 3 years. The battery that comes with the UPS is called SLA. Sealed Lead Acid. It doesn't give off hydrogen. Not unless the battery is abused (something the UPS won't be doing to it). ******* Car batteries on the other hand, the ones with the vent hole on each cap, those give off hydrogen gas. If the hydrogen collects in a room, and a little static electricity sets it off, there will be an explosion. My next door neighbor did that once. Left a car battery on the charger overnight, and *closed* the garage door. When he turned on the lights the next day, "kablooie". Battery acid everywhere. The garage looked like a ****hole :-) Take a careful look at the battery, and see if is a flush surface, maintenance free type. No vents. That's a bit safer, but not quite as safe as an SLA. A car battery would not be my first choice. I've been burned by hydrogen before, and that stuff makes me a "bit nervous" so to speak. I can guarantee you'll have a story to tell, if it happens. I don't mind using car batteries if they're stored outdoors while charging (which could be any time), and heavy cables lead back to the house. That would be OK. Treat it like a BBQ cylinder. We don't bring propane into the house either. For safety. The SLA is pretty safe. The one that came with the UPS. And Chinese replacement SLA are pretty cheap (compared to what we used to pay for replacement UPS batteries). Even the UPS manufacturer ships new gear with Chinese batteries in it now. The Chinese battery has the original brand on it, and the UPS maker just "puts a sticker on the battery" to make it theirs. Â*Â* Paul Paul: I was in the industrial battery business for 38 year. When I retired I was the Senior Service engineer for Enersys-Delaware. In all those years I only blew up a battery once. I shorted a cell on a stationary battery. There were no injuries but my ears rang for 24 hours. Most of the UPS's would float charge the batteries, but I really like the ones manufactured by Best. Thye used hysteresis loop charging which I thought was very wise. The charger would turn off entirely then kick back in when the voltage dropped near open-circuit voltage. Batteries lasted a long time. I could not find a Best brand? Andy |
#5
|
|||
|
|||
UPS battery options
On 1/17/2018 2:31 PM, Andy wrote:
Found this. What do you think ? I am wondering how the internal charger would react to seeing a 110 CCA battery as opposed to the internal 9 Ah battery? My UPS uses an external battery. It's not of a make that anyone here would recognize. It's very basic, rather poor in external finish and internal construction but it does the job and has been doing it for some 13 years. I use a small car battery of 35Ah capacity which gives me a good backup time. I've never tested the backup time to its limit but it's more than 1 hour when the battery's new. I used the first battery for about 10 years by which time the backup time had dropped to about a minute. The replacement cost around $50 and is still going strong after 3 years. Do you have experience that suggest the need for long backup time in your location? How long is long? Utilities publish outage statistics. I can't provide a link, but google should find something. In the US, the overwhelming number of power outages last fractions of a second. A few last a few seconds while a breaker resets. The rest last a very long time...far longer than you could economically backup. So, a UPS that lasts for a minute will save you from a huge percentage of outages. Unless you have life support issues, it's not economical for an ordinary home user to have enough capacity for a day of operation. There are few outages where the real-world difference between 10 minutes and two hours backup time would make any practical difference at all. A power outage is a great opportunity to take a nap. There may be heat issues with smaller backup systems. The heat sinks may not be big enough to support continuous operation for hours. Sure, if you live in the third world, you can have different statistics. YMMV. |
#6
|
|||
|
|||
UPS battery options
On Wed, 17 Jan 2018 22:13:06 -0800, mike wrote:
Do you have experience that suggest the need for long backup time in your location? How long is long? Utilities publish outage statistics. I can't provide a link, but google should find something. In the US, the overwhelming number of power outages last fractions of a second. A few last a few seconds while a breaker resets. The rest last a very long time...far longer than you could economically backup. So, a UPS that lasts for a minute will save you from a huge percentage of outages. Unless you have life support issues, it's not economical for an ordinary home user to have enough capacity for a day of operation. There are few outages where the real-world difference between 10 minutes and two hours backup time would make any practical difference at all. Many years back, one of my sons was completing a university assignment when the power went off. We get three types of outage here - seconds, minutes, or several hours. After waiting about twenty minutes, I grabbed a pair of 100Ah AGM batteries and a 1000VA inverter (24V input) and hooked the pooter system up to that. An hour or two later he finished. Power came back on about 8 hours later while we were all tucked up in bed. The issue here was that a SOHO UPS would probably have suffered a thermal failure after a lot less than an hour's running - they are really intended to enable orderly shutdown, not continuous operation. In relation to the original query, the UPS charging circuits I have seen (and I service a lot of them) are invariably pretty crude. They are optimised for fast recovery at the expense of battery lifetime. Their only good aspect is that they seem to be continuously rated, and can keep up this mistreatment with a huge external battery bank. |
#7
|
|||
|
|||
UPS battery options
On Thursday, January 18, 2018 at 12:13:26 AM UTC-6, mike wrote:
On 1/17/2018 2:31 PM, Andy wrote: Found this. What do you think ? I am wondering how the internal charger would react to seeing a 110 CCA battery as opposed to the internal 9 Ah battery? My UPS uses an external battery. It's not of a make that anyone here would recognize. It's very basic, rather poor in external finish and internal construction but it does the job and has been doing it for some 13 years. I use a small car battery of 35Ah capacity which gives me a good backup time. I've never tested the backup time to its limit but it's more than 1 hour when the battery's new. I used the first battery for about 10 years by which time the backup time had dropped to about a minute. The replacement cost around $50 and is still going strong after 3 years. Do you have experience that suggest the need for long backup time in your location? How long is long? Utilities publish outage statistics. I can't provide a link, but google should find something. In the US, the overwhelming number of power outages last fractions of a second. A few last a few seconds while a breaker resets. The rest last a very long time...far longer than you could economically backup. So, a UPS that lasts for a minute will save you from a huge percentage of outages. Unless you have life support issues, it's not economical for an ordinary home user to have enough capacity for a day of operation. There are few outages where the real-world difference between 10 minutes and two hours backup time would make any practical difference at all. A power outage is a great opportunity to take a nap. There may be heat issues with smaller backup systems. The heat sinks may not be big enough to support continuous operation for hours. Sure, if you live in the third world, you can have different statistics. YMMV. Most of my outages are in minutes. Andy |
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | |
|
|