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POP vs IMAP



 
 
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  #31  
Old April 28th 15, 09:17 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
. . .winston
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Posts: 1,345
Default POP vs IMAP

mechanic wrote:
On Tue, 28 Apr 2015 10:00:43 -0400, (PeteCresswell) wrote:

Per Char Jackson:
I never use the email service provided by an ISP because it ties me to that
ISP. I can't change ISP's without also changing my email address. So
personally, I would never base an ISP decision on the availability of their
email service.


+1


So use a separate mail provider.


I think that was implied.

--
...winston
msft mvp consumer apps
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  #32  
Old April 29th 15, 12:22 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
Gene E. Bloch[_2_]
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Posts: 7,485
Default POP vs IMAP

On Tue, 28 Apr 2015 04:28:21 -0500, Char Jackson wrote:

On Mon, 27 Apr 2015 22:40:49 -0400, Jason wrote:

Last time I looked, Verizon does not support IMAP and neither did Time
Warner. Those are my two choices for Internet service ('tho Vz is only
DSL - bah). Is anybody's experience with them different? If so, it might
be time to make a change.


I never use the email service provided by an ISP because it ties me to that
ISP. I can't change ISP's without also changing my email address. So
personally, I would never base an ISP decision on the availability of their
email service.


I did that a number of years ago for the same reason.

Then the third party e-mail provider got sick :-)

That's when - and why - I switched to a standard provider (i.e. a large
company).

The above smiley is for irony, not amusement. I was pretty ****ed...

--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)
  #33  
Old May 1st 15, 10:08 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Jason
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Posts: 878
Default POP vs IMAP

On Tue, 28 Apr 2015 04:28:21 -0500 "Char Jackson"
wrote in article
I never use the email service provided by an ISP because it ties me to that
ISP. I can't change ISP's without also changing my email address.


Same here. I have forwarding from the IEEE. I've had to switch providers
a couple times over the years but without changing my email address. My
beef with TW, now (apparently) fixed, is that they didn't offer
encryption of email credentials. I've called them every so often for
YEARS and always got either a "huh?" or "we're working on it...real soon
now." I said "apparently" because I think they've fixed that for their
POP3 service.
  #34  
Old May 1st 15, 11:03 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
(PeteCresswell)
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Posts: 1,933
Default POP vs IMAP

Per Char Jackson:
I never use the email service provided by an ISP because it ties me to that
ISP. I can't change ISP's without also changing my email address. So
personally, I would never base an ISP decision on the availability of their
email service.


And I take it a step further by registering a vanity domain name - so I
can hop from email provider to email provider without my address
changing.
--
Pete Cresswell
  #35  
Old May 2nd 15, 11:19 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
J. P. Gilliver (John)
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Posts: 5,291
Default POP vs IMAP

In message ,
"(PeteCresswell)" writes:
Per Char Jackson:
I never use the email service provided by an ISP because it ties me to that
ISP. I can't change ISP's without also changing my email address. So
personally, I would never base an ISP decision on the availability of their
email service.


And I take it a step further by registering a vanity domain name - so I
can hop from email provider to email provider without my address
changing.


I would assume that's what Char is doing too, unless he has forwarding
facilities due to membership of something (as Jason does from the IEEE).
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

This was before we knew that a laboratory rat, if experimented upon, will
develop cancer. [Quoted by] Anne ), 1997-1-29
  #36  
Old May 2nd 15, 01:36 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Maurice
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Posts: 90
Default POP vs IMAP

On Sat, 02 May 2015 11:19:54 +0100, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:

unless he has forwarding facilities due to membership of something (as
Jason does from the IEEE).


Anyone who is using such an approach (like me!) should be aware of the
increasing use of the SPF protocol by ISP's and senders that is aimed
at avoiding the use of email forwarding.

Info on SPF he http://tinyurl.com/le22osj

I first became aware of the problem when I realised that emails from
Amazon & Facebook were failing to arrive in my ISP's mailbox.
The end result is that I am having to invest in a mailbox to
use to receive my mail that was being forwarded, as the only solution.

(SPF: Sender Policy Framework)

--
/\/\aurice (Retired in U.K.)
(Replace "nomail.afraid" by "bcs" to reply by email)
  #37  
Old May 2nd 15, 02:54 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
mechanic
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Posts: 1,064
Default POP vs IMAP

On Sat, 2 May 2015 12:36:05 +0000 (UTC), Maurice wrote:

Anyone who is using such an approach (like me!) should be aware of
the increasing use of the SPF protocol by ISP's and senders that
is aimed at avoiding the use of email forwarding.


(Not sure that's the point of SPF!)
So you need to use a (separate from your ISP*) mail service provider
that handles SPF, perhaps by re-writing the envelope header stuff
using the Sender Rewriting Scheme
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sender_Rewriting_Scheme).
[*]I was howled down before for suggesting using an email service
provider, hopefully it won't happen this time!
  #38  
Old May 2nd 15, 03:33 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Mayayana
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Posts: 6,438
Default POP vs IMAP

| POP3 protocol is designed to move all your email to your local
| computer.
|
| Not true...it does not move all mail, it only moves mail from the
| account's Inbox on the server to the locally setup account Inbox.
|
| I'm obviously not grasping something here. Your use of the word "only"
| implies that there's some mail other than that in "the account's Inbox
| on the server", that would still match ...winston's description of "your
| email".

Winston is not clarifying the whole issue. He may
be using something like gmail, yahoo, or
hotmail/outlook.com and has simply forgotten that
not everyone uses webmail. Implied in his statement
is that you're using webmail that *happens to* allow
for POP3 access, such as gmail. Gmail is webmail. Google
co-owns your email. The whole thing is happening on
their server. Your email can never be entirely deleted.
Gmail just happens to also provide an option to
download it via POP3, as "real" email. But it's primarily
a freebie webmail service with all that implies.

POP3 email predates webmail
and dates to a time when storage on the server was
limited. People were expected to download email and
delete it from the server, so that it wouldn't take
up much space. In the days of free webmail POP3 has
become a way to provide a modicum of privacy
because of that history. The typical POP3 server is just
a service, not a freebie, spyware, ad-supported "cloud
app". If you use normal POP3 email you should have
only arrived email on the server and your email client
will typically be configured to delete it from the server
when it's downloaded.

So there's a distinction there between a POP3 server
and webmail that also has a POP3 option. Most POP3
now also has a webmail option. I have a number of POP3
accounts, connected to my own domain and to my ISP.
I never use webmail for any of them. I suppose those
accounts probably have a "drafts" folder and such -- insofar
as that I'd see those folders if I logged in via the web UI --
but since I never use the web version those "folders" don't
exist for all practical purposes.

An interesting variation on that is when people have
apparently POP3 email but it's actually freebie webmail
under the surface. For instance, many colleges now
cut corners by subbing out student email to the likes
of Google. Does Google reserve the right to keep, store
and spy on email belonging to
? Does Debbie get
accosted with targetted ads to save a buck for the
college? I don't know.


  #39  
Old May 2nd 15, 05:11 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Maurice
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Posts: 90
Default POP vs IMAP

On Sat, 02 May 2015 14:54:25 +0100, mechanic wrote:

need to use a (separate from your ISP*) mail service provider that
handles SPF,


Not to handle SPF (though it will check), but just to avoid any
forwarding. It is the fact that our current forwarding node is not
listed by the sender that causes our ISP receiver's SPF check to bounce
the email.

What we need is a mailbox at that forwarding node, so that no
forwarding occurs (instead, we download our emails from that
mailbox), then the SPF parameters of the sender (e.g. Amazon) will not
cause the receiving node's SPF to bounce the email that was previously
being forwarded.

--
/\/\aurice
(Replace "nomail.afraid" by "bcs" to reply by email)
  #40  
Old May 3rd 15, 03:43 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Char Jackson
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Posts: 10,449
Default POP vs IMAP

On Sat, 2 May 2015 11:19:54 +0100, "J. P. Gilliver (John)"
wrote:

In message ,
"(PeteCresswell)" writes:
Per Char Jackson:
I never use the email service provided by an ISP because it ties me to that
ISP. I can't change ISP's without also changing my email address. So
personally, I would never base an ISP decision on the availability of their
email service.


And I take it a step further by registering a vanity domain name - so I
can hop from email provider to email provider without my address
changing.


I would assume that's what Char is doing too, unless he has forwarding
facilities due to membership of something (as Jason does from the IEEE).


I have email accounts with several of the well known email providers so that
I can choose which email address to give out in specific circumstances and
so that I can change ISP's without changing email addresses. In effect, I
think I'm doing everything Pete is doing except I haven't so far bothered to
register a vanity domain. None of my email accounts are configured to
forward anything to another account.

--

Char Jackson
  #41  
Old May 5th 15, 06:13 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
Yousuf Khan[_2_]
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Posts: 2,447
Default POP vs IMAP

On 27/04/2015 12:57 PM, Mike Barnes wrote:
Yes there is. Drafts, Sent, Deleted, etc, not to mention any archive
folders that you've created.

I didn't think POP3 ever had any of that on the server.


I don't understand the idea of POP3 having anything on the server. It
took things from the server, but it didn't "have" anything there.

What I don't know - and someone might enlighten me - is whether servers
had anything other than an Inbox at the time POP3 was designed. I
suspect that they didn't (commonly, anyway) so POP3 was designed to move
all your mail, but no longer does so simply because of changes to its
operating environment.


There really isn't even an inbox in POP3, all there was was incoming
mail, completely undifferentiated. That included spam and junk mail. It
wasn't the POP3's server's job to sort your mail out for you, it just
stored it temporarily until you came and downloaded it. It was then upto
your local computer's email program to do all of that sorting.

IMAP basically took that client-side concept and implemented right on
the server side. The advantage is that it makes accessing and finding
large mail much faster, than if done on the client software.

Of course, it now means that these mail servers need to implement plenty
of local storage, whereas before they could get away with just a little.

Yousuf Khan
  #42  
Old May 5th 15, 06:22 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
Yousuf Khan[_2_]
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Posts: 2,447
Default POP vs IMAP

On 02/05/2015 8:33 PM, Mayayana wrote:
POP3 email predates webmail
and dates to a time when storage on the server was
limited. People were expected to download email and
delete it from the server, so that it wouldn't take
up much space. In the days of free webmail POP3 has
become a way to provide a modicum of privacy
because of that history. The typical POP3 server is just
a service, not a freebie, spyware, ad-supported "cloud
app". If you use normal POP3 email you should have
only arrived email on the server and your email client
will typically be configured to delete it from the server
when it's downloaded.

So there's a distinction there between a POP3 server
and webmail that also has a POP3 option. Most POP3
now also has a webmail option. I have a number of POP3
accounts, connected to my own domain and to my ISP.
I never use webmail for any of them. I suppose those
accounts probably have a "drafts" folder and such -- insofar
as that I'd see those folders if I logged in via the web UI --
but since I never use the web version those "folders" don't
exist for all practical purposes.


Yup, good explanation.

An interesting variation on that is when people have
apparently POP3 email but it's actually freebie webmail
under the surface. For instance, many colleges now
cut corners by subbing out student email to the likes
of Google. Does Google reserve the right to keep, store
and spy on email belonging to
? Does Debbie get
accosted with targetted ads to save a buck for the
college? I don't know.


Well, it's not just colleges, even entire major ISP's do that these
days, they'll subcontract out their email services to Google or Yahoo or
Microsoft. In those cases, Google, et al, won't display their typical
ads as they are being paid by the organization that is subcontracting to
them. It may come from the same hardware, but different standards are
applied here.

Yousuf Khan
 




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