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#1
May 6th 18, 01:45 AM
posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general
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Dell and their old hardware
Good Guy beat me up here a few days ago and called me names because I
said Dell was not supporting their old hardware. I just had another case today. Dell 170L, tag DWVL1B1 that was shipped with XP but they do not list any XP drivers when I look on the web site and they do not list drivers for W/7 and up either. This is simply an abandoned product. Buy a dell, in a few years they say go to hell. 
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#2
May 6th 18, 02:14 AM
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Dell and their old hardware
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#3
May 6th 18, 02:25 AM
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Dell and their old hardware
wrote:
Dell 170L Dell lists 2014 drivers for XP but none for W7. Perhaps the 2 GB ram limit figures in there somehow. http://www.dell.com/support/home/us/...x-170l/drivers It's normal. I buy components rather than assembled computers and run into the same thing. About five years of support.
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#4
May 6th 18, 02:38 AM
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Dell and their old hardware
wrote:
Good Guy beat me up here a few days ago and called me names because I said Dell was not supporting their old hardware. I just had another case today. Dell 170L, tag DWVL1B1 that was shipped with XP but they do not list any XP drivers when I look on the web site and they do not list drivers for W/7 and up either. This is simply an abandoned product. Buy a dell, in a few years they say go to hell. 1) Good Guy calls everyone names. 2) The specs for the thing, don't make it a particularly strong candidate. Any web browser or Flash video acceleration you want to do, the platform is gutless. The chipset is 865GV (graphics value), and that may be missing the AGP slot it needs. So you can't even shop Ebay for a bridged HD3450 of yesteryear and fit that. The only card I have in the house for a project like this, is an FX5200 PCI (which of course will stutter when you move pixmaps around the screen). This particular platform could be characterized as "bus-starved". https://www.cnet.com/products/dell-o...b-40-gb/specs/ That's really better off with WinXP, simply because you shouldn't spend a thin dime trying to "make that into a computer". I would at least want a processor with Hyperthreading on it, to make "two fake cores" for an OS like Windows 7, but the FSB400 of the platform tells you that's not going to happen. I love old computers, and I have a collection to match. But in terms of sticking an "unappreciative" person in front of it, no, that would be wrong. I have a perfectly good 1.1GHz platform with enough RAM to run Windows 7, but only I would "enjoy the lethargy". Others may not share my sense of humor. I bet it would make a good Solitaire machine though. WinXP Solitaire would fly on it. If they hadn't ruined web browsers in the way that they have, the project would have more value. When the graphics acceleration "falls back" on a software path, a gutless single core CPU is just the wrong thing to answer the call. Dell can't offer an 865GV driver, unless the hardware maker (Intel) offers one. Your point is still valid, that Dell doesn't support platforms forever, but this would be the wrong platform as an exemplar. The computing industry made sure the hardware would go obsolete. Intel plays quite a part in this, by offering garbage like 865GV. They should have stuck to 865G as the minimum SKU on chipsets, so the customer would at least have an AGP slot for graphics upgrades. A machine with no useful slots, is kinda a dead end even on the day you take delivery. And that's what makes it "bus starved", no upgrade-ability to speak of. Paul
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#5
May 6th 18, 02:40 AM
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Dell and their old hardware
On Sun, 6 May 2018 01:14:29 +0000 (UTC), "JT"
wrote: wrote: Good Guy beat me up here a few days ago and called me names because I said Dell was not supporting their old hardware. I just had another case today. Dell 170L, tag DWVL1B1 that was shipped with XP but they do not list any XP drivers when I look on the web site and they do not list drivers for W/7 and up either. This is simply an abandoned product. Buy a dell, in a few years they say go to hell. Dell Optiplex 170l drivers are he "http://www.dell.com/support/home/us/en/19/product-support/product/optip lex-170l/drivers" You are correct that it shows no drivers for that service tag but if you search for Optiplex 170L there are Win XP drivers JT Thanks I will give that a shot. It is strange that the service tag does not turn that up.
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#6
May 6th 18, 03:35 AM
posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general
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Dell and their old hardware
On Sun, 6 May 2018 01:14:29 +0000 (UTC), "JT"
wrote: wrote: Good Guy beat me up here a few days ago and called me names because I said Dell was not supporting their old hardware. I just had another case today. Dell 170L, tag DWVL1B1 that was shipped with XP but they do not list any XP drivers when I look on the web site and they do not list drivers for W/7 and up either. This is simply an abandoned product. Buy a dell, in a few years they say go to hell. Dell Optiplex 170l drivers are he "http://www.dell.com/support/home/us/en/19/product-support/product/optip lex-170l/drivers" You are correct that it shows no drivers for that service tag but if you search for Optiplex 170L there are Win XP drivers JT There are "drivers" but far from a complete set and the same ones appear page after page. I was about 20 pages in and still never saw the chip set drivers. I guess I will just have to do it old school and get the drivers based on what hardware reports and what I already have.
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#7
May 6th 18, 04:08 AM
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Dell and their old hardware
gfretwell wrote:
Good Guy beat me up here a few days ago and called me names because I said Dell was not supporting their old hardware. I just had another case today. No Balls (aka Good Guy) is a known troll here. Ignore his posts or create a kill filter on him. He isn't here to help. Regardless of his physical age, he has the brain of an infant and the genitals to match. Dell 170L, tag DWVL1B1 that was shipped with XP but they do not list any XP drivers when I look on the web site and they do not list drivers for W/7 and up either. This is simply an abandoned product. Buy a dell, in a few years they say go to hell. Rather then follow Dell's support navigation by entering the service tag, I did an online search on "dell introduces optiplex 170L". I had originally planned to see when Dell introduced that model to see if your claim after "a few years" had Dell removing support. Luckily I found a hit that went to: http://www.dell.com/support/home/us/...x-170l/drivers That has the Windows XP drivers. Save them this time and the URL to this page (although it could disappear later). Also hunt around for the rescue CDs that came with the computer. If none were included, there may be instructions on how to create rescue CDs. http://www.dell.com/support/home/us/...x-170l/manuals That's where is the online copy of the manual for the 170L. The advanced troubleshooting section mentions: When*the*DELL*logo*appears,*press*F12immediately .*If*you*see*a* message*stating*that*no*diagnostics*utility*partit ion*has*been*found, run*the Dell Diagnostics from your optional Drivers and Utilities CD. I didn't see mention in the online manual how to create rescue CDs. Maybe you do that with their F12 key on boot (right after the POST screen appears and *before* the OS loads) to use programs in their hidden partition to run diagnostics and perhaps include building the rescue CDs. It also mentions a "Drivers and Utilities CD" came with the computer so hunt around for that. You said Dell had no Windows XP drivers, and also mention no drivers for Windows 7, either. So which OS were you looking for drivers? Even on the page that I found, Windows 7 is not listed -- but then maybe you don't care and were just noting later OS version drivers were also not available. Quite often the pre-builts are designed for a specific Windows version. The vendor provides no drivers for later versions of Windows even if they are available at the time of product released. They aren't supporting those new Windows versions, only the Windows version for which the hardware was designed at that time. By the way, Dell sell on specs, not on specific components within a model. You could order one model today and then again in a few months and the parts within have changed. We would order one that used a daughtercard for some hardware support and a few months later the same model had the hardware feature on the motherboard, so they changed the motherboard when it was cheaper to use one that removed having to add a daughtercard. It why we could not use Dells in our Alpha Lab since we had to know exactly what hardware was inside. Pre-builts suffer component substitution so we ended up having to build our own. Back to looking for articles noting when the Optiplex 170L was introduced, I found: https://engineering.purdue.edu/ECN/S...DellModelYears Note when they say the 170L was introduced. Yep, back in 2004. That is hardly just "a few years" ago. That was *14 YEARS AGO*!!! Doesn't matter when YOU got the computer. The introduction year is from when you measure the support duration.
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#8
May 6th 18, 04:12 AM
posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general
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Dell and their old hardware
gfretwell wrote:
There are "drivers" but far from a complete set and the same ones appear page after page. I was about 20 pages in and still never saw the chip set drivers. I guess I will just have to do it old school and get the drivers based on what hardware reports and what I already have. At the page that I and others found, yes, there are chipset drivers. Select Windows XP (the only OS suitable to your situation) and in the Category selector, pick "Chipset".
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#10
May 6th 18, 05:32 AM
posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general
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Dell and their old hardware
On 5/5/2018 8:12 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
gfretwell wrote: There are "drivers" but far from a complete set and the same ones appear page after page. I was about 20 pages in and still never saw the chip set drivers. I guess I will just have to do it old school and get the drivers based on what hardware reports and what I already have. At the page that I and others found, yes, there are chipset drivers. Select Windows XP (the only OS suitable to your situation) and in the Category selector, pick "Chipset". I can understand why a vendor won't support new OS on old hardware for more than a couple of generations. But if the working drivers for the old OS on the old computer are there on Tuesday, there's no excuse for deleting them just because it's Wednesday. Move them to an archive directory. It costs less than all the bitching from abandoned (former) customers.
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#11
May 6th 18, 05:51 AM
posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general
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Dell and their old hardware
mike wrote:
On 5/5/2018 8:12 PM, VanguardLH wrote: gfretwell wrote: There are "drivers" but far from a complete set and the same ones appear page after page. I was about 20 pages in and still never saw the chip set drivers. I guess I will just have to do it old school and get the drivers based on what hardware reports and what I already have. At the page that I and others found, yes, there are chipset drivers. Select Windows XP (the only OS suitable to your situation) and in the Category selector, pick "Chipset". I can understand why a vendor won't support new OS on old hardware for more than a couple of generations. But if the working drivers for the old OS on the old computer are there on Tuesday, there's no excuse for deleting them just because it's Wednesday. Move them to an archive directory. It costs less than all the bitching from abandoned (former) customers. So did the page give you the chipset driver package you were looking for? We are trying to find solutions for you, not to listen to you complain about support policies by commercial vendors that we can do nothing about. If they provide the drivers then, to some degree, they still have to support them. Once a product is discontinued, don't expect ANY vendor to continue providing support -- and an archive of old stuff is still a form of support.
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#12
May 6th 18, 07:40 AM
posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general
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Dell and their old hardware
In message , VanguardLH
writes: [Usual good stuff (including about GG!) snipped] Back to looking for articles noting when the Optiplex 170L was introduced, I found: https://engineering.purdue.edu/ECN/S...DellModelYears Note when they say the 170L was introduced. Yep, back in 2004. That is hardly just "a few years" ago. That was *14 YEARS AGO*!!! Doesn't matter when YOU got the computer. The introduction year is from when you measure the support duration. Strictly, _I_ would measure from when they ceased selling it (as a new product at least), rather than the introduction year. (However, with the rapid evolution, those may often be the same: I don't know if Dell keep models on sale for longer than a year.) -- J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf To keep leaf vegetables clean and crisp, cook lightly, then plunge into iced water (the vegetables, that is). - manual for a Russell Hobbs electric steamer
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#13
May 6th 18, 07:55 AM
posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.general
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Dell and their old hardware
On Sat, 05 May 2018 21:38:41 -0400, Paul
wrote: wrote: Good Guy beat me up here a few days ago and called me names because I said Dell was not supporting their old hardware. I just had another case today. Dell 170L, tag DWVL1B1 that was shipped with XP but they do not list any XP drivers when I look on the web site and they do not list drivers for W/7 and up either. This is simply an abandoned product. Buy a dell, in a few years they say go to hell. 1) Good Guy calls everyone names. 2) The specs for the thing, don't make it a particularly strong candidate. Any web browser or Flash video acceleration you want to do, the platform is gutless. The chipset is 865GV (graphics value), and that may be missing the AGP slot it needs. So you can't even shop Ebay for a bridged HD3450 of yesteryear and fit that. The only card I have in the house for a project like this, is an FX5200 PCI (which of course will stutter when you move pixmaps around the screen). This particular platform could be characterized as "bus-starved". https://www.cnet.com/products/dell-o...b-40-gb/specs/ That's really better off with WinXP, simply because you shouldn't spend a thin dime trying to "make that into a computer". I would at least want a processor with Hyperthreading on it, to make "two fake cores" for an OS like Windows 7, but the FSB400 of the platform tells you that's not going to happen. I love old computers, and I have a collection to match. But in terms of sticking an "unappreciative" person in front of it, no, that would be wrong. I have a perfectly good 1.1GHz platform with enough RAM to run Windows 7, but only I would "enjoy the lethargy". Others may not share my sense of humor. I bet it would make a good Solitaire machine though. WinXP Solitaire would fly on it. If they hadn't ruined web browsers in the way that they have, the project would have more value. When the graphics acceleration "falls back" on a software path, a gutless single core CPU is just the wrong thing to answer the call. Dell can't offer an 865GV driver, unless the hardware maker (Intel) offers one. Your point is still valid, that Dell doesn't support platforms forever, but this would be the wrong platform as an exemplar. The computing industry made sure the hardware would go obsolete. Intel plays quite a part in this, by offering garbage like 865GV. They should have stuck to 865G as the minimum SKU on chipsets, so the customer would at least have an AGP slot for graphics upgrades. A machine with no useful slots, is kinda a dead end even on the day you take delivery. And that's what makes it "bus starved", no upgrade-ability to speak of. Paul It is just going to be an MP3 player, replacing a similar Dell that has developed some kind of hardware problem on the board that I haven't found (reseated CPU and swapped out SIMMs, no joy) It came to me with 7 on it but I was thinking about saving that drive in a bag and loading XP to match what I have. I may just run it on 7 for now and see how it goes.
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#14
May 6th 18, 08:06 AM
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Dell and their old hardware
J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
VanguardLH WROTE: https://engineering.purdue.edu/ECN/S...DellModelYears Note when they say the 170L was introduced. Yep, back in 2004. That is hardly just "a few years" ago. That was *14 YEARS AGO*!!! Doesn't matter when YOU got the computer. The introduction year is from when you measure the support duration. Strictly, _I_ would measure from when they ceased selling it (as a new product at least), rather than the introduction year. (However, with the rapid evolution, those may often be the same: I don't know if Dell keep models on sale for longer than a year.) They could resell almost the same hardware but with just one piddly change to make it a new model. Note that when you last can get a new (unused) model from a retailer is NOT when Dell stopped production of that model. Retailer inventory can take awhile to sell out. You can still buy refurbished but ancient models of Dell. You can still buy them with Windows XP pre-installed. I would amend my statement to "The last year of manufacture is from when you measure the support duration." From the article that I found, they claimed "Historically, Dell changed OptiPlex models every 12-18 months". Well, since the Optiplex 170L was introduced in 2004 and generously allotting 3 years for the period of manufacture, the last one rolled out of Dell's doors on, or before, 2007 which is 11 years ago. The OP's "in a few years" for support ending still isn't valid. 11 years isn't a few years. To the OP, retaining every piece of software ever produced by a vendor doesn't qualify as support hence all that software should be available forever and for free no matter the cost to the vendor. Although not found using the tag number in Dell's support site, Dell *is* still providing the downloads for Windows XP, the OS for which that model was designed and only supported, some 11+ years after end of manufacture. Remo Williams: How old are you? I mean really, you are old, now aren't you? Chiun: For an apricot, yes. For a head of lettuce, even more so. For a mountain, I have not even begun in years. For a man, I am just right. (Quote from the movie "Remo Williams: The Adventure Begins".)
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#15
May 6th 18, 08:16 AM
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Dell and their old hardware
On Sat, 5 May 2018 22:08:15 -0500, VanguardLH wrote:
gfretwell wrote: Good Guy beat me up here a few days ago and called me names because I said Dell was not supporting their old hardware. I just had another case today. No Balls (aka Good Guy) is a known troll here. Ignore his posts or create a kill filter on him. He isn't here to help. Regardless of his physical age, he has the brain of an infant and the genitals to match. Dell 170L, tag DWVL1B1 that was shipped with XP but they do not list any XP drivers when I look on the web site and they do not list drivers for W/7 and up either. This is simply an abandoned product. Buy a dell, in a few years they say go to hell. Rather then follow Dell's support navigation by entering the service tag, I did an online search on "dell introduces optiplex 170L". I had originally planned to see when Dell introduced that model to see if your claim after "a few years" had Dell removing support. Luckily I found a hit that went to: http://www.dell.com/support/home/us/...x-170l/drivers That has the Windows XP drivers. Save them this time and the URL to this page (although it could disappear later). Also hunt around for the rescue CDs that came with the computer. If none were included, there may be instructions on how to create rescue CDs. http://www.dell.com/support/home/us/...x-170l/manuals That's where is the online copy of the manual for the 170L. The advanced troubleshooting section mentions: WhenÂ*theÂ*DELLÂ*logoÂ*appears,Â*pressÂ*F12immed iately.Â*IfÂ*youÂ*seeÂ*aÂ* messageÂ*statingÂ*thatÂ*noÂ*diagnosticsÂ*utilityÂ* partitionÂ*hasÂ*beenÂ*found, runÂ*the Dell Diagnostics from your optional Drivers and Utilities CD. I didn't see mention in the online manual how to create rescue CDs. Maybe you do that with their F12 key on boot (right after the POST screen appears and *before* the OS loads) to use programs in their hidden partition to run diagnostics and perhaps include building the rescue CDs. It also mentions a "Drivers and Utilities CD" came with the computer so hunt around for that. You said Dell had no Windows XP drivers, and also mention no drivers for Windows 7, either. So which OS were you looking for drivers? Even on the page that I found, Windows 7 is not listed -- but then maybe you don't care and were just noting later OS version drivers were also not available. Quite often the pre-builts are designed for a specific Windows version. The vendor provides no drivers for later versions of Windows even if they are available at the time of product released. They aren't supporting those new Windows versions, only the Windows version for which the hardware was designed at that time. By the way, Dell sell on specs, not on specific components within a model. You could order one model today and then again in a few months and the parts within have changed. We would order one that used a daughtercard for some hardware support and a few months later the same model had the hardware feature on the motherboard, so they changed the motherboard when it was cheaper to use one that removed having to add a daughtercard. It why we could not use Dells in our Alpha Lab since we had to know exactly what hardware was inside. Pre-builts suffer component substitution so we ended up having to build our own. Back to looking for articles noting when the Optiplex 170L was introduced, I found: https://engineering.purdue.edu/ECN/S...DellModelYears Note when they say the 170L was introduced. Yep, back in 2004. That is hardly just "a few years" ago. That was *14 YEARS AGO*!!! Doesn't matter when YOU got the computer. The introduction year is from when you measure the support duration. Thanks. That was the page I was looking for and not the one Dell navigates to when you search on their site.
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