WINDOWS 8.1

On 2013-10-21, Paul wrote:
generic name wrote:
On 2013-10-20, charlie wrote:
On 10/20/2013 6:27 PM, Keith Nuttle wrote:
"Since Windows must be reinstalled frequently"
News to me!
I have seldom had to reinstall.
Now there was an HP Vista Laptop that gave me fits due to the HP
"bloatware". I ended up installing a generic Vista Ultimate "upgrade"
just to get rid of the HP *&^%. That was only because, the Vista
ultimate copy was a promo freebe.



"Frequently" is what a person claims; no number specified; for one
person once is too much; another twice is too frequent.

I installed win8 about 4 weeks ago, "cleanly"; win7 crashed because
of a new video driver. How to fix if the computer won't boot & just
shows a blank screen? Cannot get to "safe mode" as never got that
far.

"Never" reinstall is just lying. I might have to reinstall win8;
"update" to 8.1 if the ****ty ms usb3 driver don't work again
like it doesn't show up with the usb3 connection to the motherboard's
usb3 port. Strange that it powered up then win8.1 lost the 2 TB drive.

Was working when connected to the pcie adapter; BOTH usb3 chipsets
are from renasas. Had encounter problem with win8 when it became
available; just had to try with win8.1.........

The pcie has a connection to a power cord; don't know about the
motherboard. I connected the pcie board to a power line as the docs
say windows "sometimes" looses the usb connections if usb3 pcie board
is not connected.

Had reinstalled win7 a few times including when win8 messed up the
dual/tripple boot. Same with winxp. Lots depend on how you really
use a computer.

The PCI Express slot has +3.3V and +12V as power sources.
A designer could take the +12V signal, use a linear regulator,
and make a +5V supply for the USB3 bus power. A linear would
be thermally limited, and to be practical, a switching
regulator placed on the card, could do what is necessary
from the +12V source (50W to 60W or so, max). I seriously
doubt anyone would do this, but, it's an option. That
means, if you want USB3 bus power, you'd kinda want that
internal power connector to be used.

If a power connection is available on one end of the
PCI Express card, the idea might be to draw power for the
+5V from there. A SATA wafer connector, I think that is
rated at 3A, whereas if you had four USB3 ports, that
would be 3.6A max load (more, without overcurrent protection
of some sort). A Molex 1x4 power connector, can carry
more current than that and if I was purchasing a card,
would be my preferred solution. Perhaps 6 to 8 amps or so
on +5V for the Molex power connector. At least, until
the 5V @ 20A on the power supply becomes an issue, if you
were to run enough USB3 cards :-)

USB3 chips come in duals and quads, and at 900mA a port,
a quad would want a 3.6A power source for the USB3 bus.
And then I'd want that Molex, rather than the flat SATA
15 pin power connector, which is a bit wimpy.

"Does USB 3 offer more power than USB 2 ("High-Speed USB")?

Yes, USB 3 devices can use up to 900mA of power (compared
to 500mA used by USB 2 devices). You'll need to use a USB 3
cable to use the 900mA of power available. USB 2 cables
don't support 900mA."

*******

The NEC/Renesas chip was the first USB3 chip to ship.
Just like in USB2 days, the NEC chip was the first shipped,
and the Microsoft driver was modeled and tested against
the NEC one. If any chip is to work "out of the box",
that's the brand I expect would work.

Paul

I did a google search with "win8 usb3" & came up with some interesting
info regarding the ms drivers. Looks like ms changed from the usb3
stack method to the xhcl where some devices can't do/use. But the
short time win8 & win8.1 see the 2 TB hdd, it claims that it had to be
"initialized" before it can be used! I'v got over 1 TB on the hdd.

Then, on one of your valuable info posts, the idea that ntfs got
changed by "extending" whatever & is "backward" compitable (not).

Have reconnected from the msi z77a-gd65 mb's usb3 back to the
siig's pcie card & so far everything is accessible again. Used
richcopy to backup 4 CDs from the wd's nas to the usb3 hitachi hdd.

Everyone wants to say that the problem is hitachi fault.

generic name wrote:
On 2013-10-21, Paul wrote:
generic name wrote:
On 2013-10-20, charlie wrote:
On 10/20/2013 6:27 PM, Keith Nuttle wrote:
"Since Windows must be reinstalled frequently"
News to me!
I have seldom had to reinstall.
Now there was an HP Vista Laptop that gave me fits due to the HP
"bloatware". I ended up installing a generic Vista Ultimate "upgrade"
just to get rid of the HP *&^%. That was only because, the Vista
ultimate copy was a promo freebe.


"Frequently" is what a person claims; no number specified; for one
person once is too much; another twice is too frequent.

I installed win8 about 4 weeks ago, "cleanly"; win7 crashed because
of a new video driver. How to fix if the computer won't boot & just
shows a blank screen? Cannot get to "safe mode" as never got that
far.

"Never" reinstall is just lying. I might have to reinstall win8;
"update" to 8.1 if the ****ty ms usb3 driver don't work again
like it doesn't show up with the usb3 connection to the motherboard's
usb3 port. Strange that it powered up then win8.1 lost the 2 TB drive.

Was working when connected to the pcie adapter; BOTH usb3 chipsets
are from renasas. Had encounter problem with win8 when it became
available; just had to try with win8.1.........

The pcie has a connection to a power cord; don't know about the
motherboard. I connected the pcie board to a power line as the docs
say windows "sometimes" looses the usb connections if usb3 pcie board
is not connected.

Had reinstalled win7 a few times including when win8 messed up the
dual/tripple boot. Same with winxp. Lots depend on how you really
use a computer.
The PCI Express slot has +3.3V and +12V as power sources.
A designer could take the +12V signal, use a linear regulator,
and make a +5V supply for the USB3 bus power. A linear would
be thermally limited, and to be practical, a switching
regulator placed on the card, could do what is necessary
from the +12V source (50W to 60W or so, max). I seriously
doubt anyone would do this, but, it's an option. That
means, if you want USB3 bus power, you'd kinda want that
internal power connector to be used.

If a power connection is available on one end of the
PCI Express card, the idea might be to draw power for the
+5V from there. A SATA wafer connector, I think that is
rated at 3A, whereas if you had four USB3 ports, that
would be 3.6A max load (more, without overcurrent protection
of some sort). A Molex 1x4 power connector, can carry
more current than that and if I was purchasing a card,
would be my preferred solution. Perhaps 6 to 8 amps or so
on +5V for the Molex power connector. At least, until
the 5V @ 20A on the power supply becomes an issue, if you
were to run enough USB3 cards :-)

USB3 chips come in duals and quads, and at 900mA a port,
a quad would want a 3.6A power source for the USB3 bus.
And then I'd want that Molex, rather than the flat SATA
15 pin power connector, which is a bit wimpy.

"Does USB 3 offer more power than USB 2 ("High-Speed USB")?

Yes, USB 3 devices can use up to 900mA of power (compared
to 500mA used by USB 2 devices). You'll need to use a USB 3
cable to use the 900mA of power available. USB 2 cables
don't support 900mA."

*******

The NEC/Renesas chip was the first USB3 chip to ship.
Just like in USB2 days, the NEC chip was the first shipped,
and the Microsoft driver was modeled and tested against
the NEC one. If any chip is to work "out of the box",
that's the brand I expect would work.

Paul

I did a google search with "win8 usb3" & came up with some interesting
info regarding the ms drivers. Looks like ms changed from the usb3
stack method to the xhcl where some devices can't do/use. But the
short time win8 & win8.1 see the 2 TB hdd, it claims that it had to be
"initialized" before it can be used! I'v got over 1 TB on the hdd.

Then, on one of your valuable info posts, the idea that ntfs got
changed by "extending" whatever & is "backward" compitable (not).

Have reconnected from the msi z77a-gd65 mb's usb3 back to the
siig's pcie card & so far everything is accessible again. Used
richcopy to backup 4 CDs from the wd's nas to the usb3 hitachi hdd.

Everyone wants to say that the problem is hitachi fault.

I haven't read any tidbits on the construction of the Microsoft
USB3 driver.

The only manufacturer-provided driver that had a few bad
comments, were the early E-Tron drivers.

In terms of how the USB talks to the drive, there
is the MSC (Mass Storage Class). And that is a bit
slower than UAS (USB Attached SCSI). That would be
somewhere in the layer above the driver that's causing
you some problems. I don't think initially, there
were any UAS drivers, and the first chips, a
connected hard drive would have used MSC, which is
the same thing as USB2 uses for hard drives.

You could have tried a USB2 cable between the duff USB3
port and the disk, and see whether "forcing" them to
use USB2 protocol, makes any difference to detecting
the drive properly. It would give an opportunity for
slightly different software to be used (barring issues
caused by having less bus power available).

If I was testing the drive, and I had a failure like
that ("do you want to initialize" on a disk that
already has data), I would test with "dd", attempt
to read sector 0 (MBR) and see whether it has
data in it or not. Just to see why Disk Management
concludes there is no info it likes in Sector 0.

If I thought you could "Safely Remove" then "Rescan for
changes", and get the drive picked up that way, I would
have suggested that. But I don't think USB will rescan
hardware that is in the Safely Remove state. (There might
have been a utility that claims to do that, but I don't
know if it works.) I don't recollect right off hand
whether anyone got that to work or not.

Paul

On Tue, 22 Oct 2013 13:10:56 -0600, Ken Springer
wrote:

On 10/20/13 5:46 PM, Ken Blake wrote:

Why do you want to reformat and reinstall? In my view, it's usually a
mistake. With a modicum of care, it should never be necessary to
reinstall Windows (any version). I've run Windows 2.0, 3.0, 3.1, 3.11,
WFWG 3.11, Windows 95, Windows 98, Windows 2000, Windows XP, Windows
Vista, Windows 7, Windows 8, and now Windows 8.1, each for the period
of time before the next version came out, and each on two or more
machines here. I never reinstalled any of them (with a single
exception--a problem that I worked on for weeks unsuccessfully), and I
have never had anything more than an occasional minor problem.

I would add a caveat here, Ken. It all depends on the knowledge of the
user. For many of today's users, with their limited knowledge of
computers in general, this may be the only answer they are aware of. We
sadly have a poor system for computer education.


If it's seen simply as a caveat, OK. As far as I'm concerned, it's
still the wrong answer almost all the time. But if you can't find any
other answer, there's no other choice.


For these folks, it may be the quicker thing to do. Most will not have
the time to spend that you did, and I did once when I had a similar
situation with XP.


True, most will not have the time to spend that I spent. But that's
because it was a particularly knotty problem.

It may be the quicker thing for some people, but many people do it
because they think it will be the quicker thing, and then when they
find out what all the problems it caused were, realize that it was
nowhere near as quick and easy as they thought it would be.


It's my belief that this mistaken notion stems from the technical
support people at many of the larger OEMs. Their solution to almost
any problem they don't quickly know the answer to is "reformat and
reinstall." That's the perfect solution for them. It gets you off the
phone quickly, it almost always works, and it doesn't require them to
do any real troubleshooting (a skill that most of them obviously don't
possess in any great degree).

But it leaves you with all the work and all the problems. You have to
restore all your data backups, you have to reinstall all your
programs, you have to reinstall all the Windows and application
updates, you have to locate and install all the needed drivers for
your system, you have to recustomize Windows and all your apps to work
the way you're comfortable with.

I go back to my statement above about computer ignorance. If the user
has the basic knowledge available, he/she should have a system image, or
series of images, to restore from. And if Windows has been set up
correctly, data restore is a nonplayer, assuming we aren't dealing with
some kind of hardware failure.

Besides all those things being time-consuming and troublesome, you may
have trouble with some of them: do you have or can you find all the
drivers you need? Can you find all your application CDs? Can you find
all the needed installation codes? Do you have data backups to
restore? Do you even remember all the customizations and tweaks you
may have installed to make everything work the way you like?

If they can't find their CD's, or registration numbers, there's no
sympathy from me. I don't even have sympathy for myself, in this case.
LOL


There are many things I can't find. Many are computer-related, but not
all. Sometimes I can't remember where I put my glasses.

It's because I suffer from CRS syndrome. g


As I mentioned above, if the computer is set up correctly, IMO, and not
the way MS does things, data and tweaks are nonplayers.

Occasionally there are problems that are so difficult to solve that
Windows should be reinstalled cleanly. But they are few and far
between; reinstallation should not be a substitute for
troubleshooting; it should be a last resort, to be done only after all
other attempts at troubleshooting by a qualified person have failed.

Agreed on the troubleshooting, until the troubleshooting involves too
much time with no resolution.


Yes. I didn't say it should never be done. I said it should be a last
resort. And we all assess differently when it's time for a last
resort.


And perhaps most important: if you reformat and reinstall without
finding out what caused your problem, you will very likely repeat the
behavior that caused it, and quickly find yourself back in exactly the
same situation.

And, if you can't find the problem? In my XP reference, even MS tech
support in New Delhi couldn't find the problem, and gave up.


If you can't, you can't. I couldn't in the situation I mentioned
earlier.

Personally, I have the same view as a technet article out there,
regarding malware, etc. The only 100%, positively, absolutely sure way
to know all problems are removed is a reinstall,


No argument from me. That's absolutely correct. However 99 & 44/100%
correct is good enough for most people in most circumstances.


--
Ken Blake

On 10/22/13 1:48 PM, Ken Blake wrote:
On Tue, 22 Oct 2013 13:10:56 -0600, Ken Springer
wrote:

On 10/20/13 5:46 PM, Ken Blake wrote:

Why do you want to reformat and reinstall? In my view, it's usually a
mistake. With a modicum of care, it should never be necessary to
reinstall Windows (any version). I've run Windows 2.0, 3.0, 3.1, 3.11,
WFWG 3.11, Windows 95, Windows 98, Windows 2000, Windows XP, Windows
Vista, Windows 7, Windows 8, and now Windows 8.1, each for the period
of time before the next version came out, and each on two or more
machines here. I never reinstalled any of them (with a single
exception--a problem that I worked on for weeks unsuccessfully), and I
have never had anything more than an occasional minor problem.

I would add a caveat here, Ken. It all depends on the knowledge of the
user. For many of today's users, with their limited knowledge of
computers in general, this may be the only answer they are aware of. We
sadly have a poor system for computer education.


If it's seen simply as a caveat, OK. As far as I'm concerned, it's
still the wrong answer almost all the time. But if you can't find any
other answer, there's no other choice.


For these folks, it may be the quicker thing to do. Most will not have
the time to spend that you did, and I did once when I had a similar
situation with XP.


True, most will not have the time to spend that I spent. But that's
because it was a particularly knotty problem.

It may be the quicker thing for some people, but many people do it
because they think it will be the quicker thing, and then when they
find out what all the problems it caused were, realize that it was
nowhere near as quick and easy as they thought it would be.


It's my belief that this mistaken notion stems from the technical
support people at many of the larger OEMs. Their solution to almost
any problem they don't quickly know the answer to is "reformat and
reinstall." That's the perfect solution for them. It gets you off the
phone quickly, it almost always works, and it doesn't require them to
do any real troubleshooting (a skill that most of them obviously don't
possess in any great degree).

But it leaves you with all the work and all the problems. You have to
restore all your data backups, you have to reinstall all your
programs, you have to reinstall all the Windows and application
updates, you have to locate and install all the needed drivers for
your system, you have to recustomize Windows and all your apps to work
the way you're comfortable with.

I go back to my statement above about computer ignorance. If the user
has the basic knowledge available, he/she should have a system image, or
series of images, to restore from. And if Windows has been set up
correctly, data restore is a nonplayer, assuming we aren't dealing with
some kind of hardware failure.

Besides all those things being time-consuming and troublesome, you may
have trouble with some of them: do you have or can you find all the
drivers you need? Can you find all your application CDs? Can you find
all the needed installation codes? Do you have data backups to
restore? Do you even remember all the customizations and tweaks you
may have installed to make everything work the way you like?

If they can't find their CD's, or registration numbers, there's no
sympathy from me. I don't even have sympathy for myself, in this case.
LOL


There are many things I can't find. Many are computer-related, but not
all. Sometimes I can't remember where I put my glasses.

It's because I suffer from CRS syndrome. g


As I mentioned above, if the computer is set up correctly, IMO, and not
the way MS does things, data and tweaks are nonplayers.

Occasionally there are problems that are so difficult to solve that
Windows should be reinstalled cleanly. But they are few and far
between; reinstallation should not be a substitute for
troubleshooting; it should be a last resort, to be done only after all
other attempts at troubleshooting by a qualified person have failed.

Agreed on the troubleshooting, until the troubleshooting involves too
much time with no resolution.


Yes. I didn't say it should never be done. I said it should be a last
resort. And we all assess differently when it's time for a last
resort.


And perhaps most important: if you reformat and reinstall without
finding out what caused your problem, you will very likely repeat the
behavior that caused it, and quickly find yourself back in exactly the
same situation.

And, if you can't find the problem? In my XP reference, even MS tech
support in New Delhi couldn't find the problem, and gave up.


If you can't, you can't. I couldn't in the situation I mentioned
earlier.

Depending on what you call a "fix", I solved my problem. I'd been
watching what was going on with the router's lights. When New Delhi
gave up, I "pondered" what I was seeing, changed the Ethernet card, and
all was well! LOL

Personally, I have the same view as a technet article out there,
regarding malware, etc. The only 100%, positively, absolutely sure way
to know all problems are removed is a reinstall,


No argument from me. That's absolutely correct. However 99 & 44/100%
correct is good enough for most people in most circumstances.

For me, 99 & 44/100% isn't good enough. For the times I fix the
occasional computer, everything must work, because my name is associated
with it. I don't like accepting anything else.

Other than most of the readers of this newsgroup, I wonder how many
people recognize the 99 & 44/100% phrase.


--
Ken

Mac OS X 10.8.5
Firefox 24.0
Thunderbird 17.0.8
LibreOffice 4.1.1.2

On 10/22/2013 6:19 PM, Ken Springer wrote:
he readers of this newsgroup, I wonder how many people recognize the 99
& 44/100% phrase.

When I read it I thought it was 99-4A the first computer that came into
my life.

On Tue, 22 Oct 2013 16:19:36 -0600, Ken Springer
wrote:

For me, 99 & 44/100% isn't good enough. For the times I fix the
occasional computer, everything must work, because my name is associated
with it. I don't like accepting anything else.

Other than most of the readers of this newsgroup, I wonder how many
people recognize the 99 & 44/100% phrase.


LOL! I was wondering whether you would. That's why I chose it.

--
Ken Blake

On 10/22/2013 5:49 PM, Ken Blake wrote:
On Tue, 22 Oct 2013 16:19:36 -0600, Ken Springer
wrote:

For me, 99 & 44/100% isn't good enough. For the times I fix the
occasional computer, everything must work, because my name is associated
with it. I don't like accepting anything else.

Other than most of the readers of this newsgroup, I wonder how many
people recognize the 99 & 44/100% phrase.


LOL! I was wondering whether you would. That's why I chose it.



Yep, Ivory soap, I remember the Slogan from hearing it on The Procter
and gamble show on the Radio About 1939/1940

Regards, Rene

On Tue, 22 Oct 2013 17:56:14 -0500, Rene Lamontagne
wrote:

On 10/22/2013 5:49 PM, Ken Blake wrote:
On Tue, 22 Oct 2013 16:19:36 -0600, Ken Springer
wrote:

For me, 99 & 44/100% isn't good enough. For the times I fix the
occasional computer, everything must work, because my name is associated
with it. I don't like accepting anything else.

Other than most of the readers of this newsgroup, I wonder how many
people recognize the 99 & 44/100% phrase.


LOL! I was wondering whether you would. That's why I chose it.



Yep, Ivory soap, I remember the Slogan from hearing it on The Procter
and gamble show on the Radio About 1939/1940


I became two years old near the end of 1939. I remember nothing from
that far back. g

The slogan stayed around for a while, though.

--
Ken Blake

On 10/22/13 4:49 PM, Ken Blake wrote:
On Tue, 22 Oct 2013 16:19:36 -0600, Ken Springer
wrote:

For me, 99 & 44/100% isn't good enough. For the times I fix the
occasional computer, everything must work, because my name is associated
with it. I don't like accepting anything else.

Other than most of the readers of this newsgroup, I wonder how many
people recognize the 99 & 44/100% phrase.


LOL! I was wondering whether you would. That's why I chose it.

LOL!

--
Ken

Mac OS X 10.8.5
Firefox 24.0
Thunderbird 17.0.8
LibreOffice 4.1.1.2

Ken Springer wrote:
On 10/22/13 1:48 PM, Ken Blake wrote:
On Tue, 22 Oct 2013 13:10:56 -0600, Ken Springer
wrote:

On 10/20/13 5:46 PM, Ken Blake wrote:

Why do you want to reformat and reinstall? In my view, it's usually a
mistake. With a modicum of care, it should never be necessary to
reinstall Windows (any version). I've run Windows 2.0, 3.0, 3.1, 3.11,
WFWG 3.11, Windows 95, Windows 98, Windows 2000, Windows XP, Windows
Vista, Windows 7, Windows 8, and now Windows 8.1, each for the period
of time before the next version came out, and each on two or more
machines here. I never reinstalled any of them (with a single
exception--a problem that I worked on for weeks unsuccessfully), and I
have never had anything more than an occasional minor problem.

I would add a caveat here, Ken. It all depends on the knowledge of the
user. For many of today's users, with their limited knowledge of
computers in general, this may be the only answer they are aware of. We
sadly have a poor system for computer education.


If it's seen simply as a caveat, OK. As far as I'm concerned, it's
still the wrong answer almost all the time. But if you can't find any
other answer, there's no other choice.


For these folks, it may be the quicker thing to do. Most will not have
the time to spend that you did, and I did once when I had a similar
situation with XP.


True, most will not have the time to spend that I spent. But that's
because it was a particularly knotty problem.

It may be the quicker thing for some people, but many people do it
because they think it will be the quicker thing, and then when they
find out what all the problems it caused were, realize that it was
nowhere near as quick and easy as they thought it would be.


It's my belief that this mistaken notion stems from the technical
support people at many of the larger OEMs. Their solution to almost
any problem they don't quickly know the answer to is "reformat and
reinstall." That's the perfect solution for them. It gets you off the
phone quickly, it almost always works, and it doesn't require them to
do any real troubleshooting (a skill that most of them obviously don't
possess in any great degree).

But it leaves you with all the work and all the problems. You have to
restore all your data backups, you have to reinstall all your
programs, you have to reinstall all the Windows and application
updates, you have to locate and install all the needed drivers for
your system, you have to recustomize Windows and all your apps to work
the way you're comfortable with.

I go back to my statement above about computer ignorance. If the user
has the basic knowledge available, he/she should have a system image, or
series of images, to restore from. And if Windows has been set up
correctly, data restore is a nonplayer, assuming we aren't dealing with
some kind of hardware failure.

Besides all those things being time-consuming and troublesome, you may
have trouble with some of them: do you have or can you find all the
drivers you need? Can you find all your application CDs? Can you find
all the needed installation codes? Do you have data backups to
restore? Do you even remember all the customizations and tweaks you
may have installed to make everything work the way you like?

If they can't find their CD's, or registration numbers, there's no
sympathy from me. I don't even have sympathy for myself, in this case.
LOL


There are many things I can't find. Many are computer-related, but not
all. Sometimes I can't remember where I put my glasses.

It's because I suffer from CRS syndrome. g


As I mentioned above, if the computer is set up correctly, IMO, and not
the way MS does things, data and tweaks are nonplayers.

Occasionally there are problems that are so difficult to solve that
Windows should be reinstalled cleanly. But they are few and far
between; reinstallation should not be a substitute for
troubleshooting; it should be a last resort, to be done only after all
other attempts at troubleshooting by a qualified person have failed.

Agreed on the troubleshooting, until the troubleshooting involves too
much time with no resolution.


Yes. I didn't say it should never be done. I said it should be a last
resort. And we all assess differently when it's time for a last
resort.


And perhaps most important: if you reformat and reinstall without
finding out what caused your problem, you will very likely repeat the
behavior that caused it, and quickly find yourself back in exactly the
same situation.

And, if you can't find the problem? In my XP reference, even MS tech
support in New Delhi couldn't find the problem, and gave up.


If you can't, you can't. I couldn't in the situation I mentioned
earlier.

Depending on what you call a "fix", I solved my problem. I'd been
watching what was going on with the router's lights. When New Delhi
gave up, I "pondered" what I was seeing, changed the Ethernet card, and
all was well! LOL

Personally, I have the same view as a technet article out there,
regarding malware, etc. The only 100%, positively, absolutely sure way
to know all problems are removed is a reinstall,


No argument from me. That's absolutely correct. However 99 & 44/100%
correct is good enough for most people in most circumstances.

For me, 99 & 44/100% isn't good enough. For the times I fix the
occasional computer, everything must work, because my name is associated
with it. I don't like accepting anything else.

Other than most of the readers of this newsgroup, I wonder how many
people recognize the 99 & 44/100% phrase.


0.56 (56/100%)
5600 per million
- with a billion pcs on the planet that equates to 5,600,000 times
when it might not be good enough

99 and 44/100%
- Ivory Soap
- 56/100% ingredients that were not soap (Harley Procter circa 1800's)
- Movie - '99 and 44/100% Dead' (1974 Action film)
- Movie - 'Behind the Green Door' - advertising slogan
- Willy Wonka and the Chocolate Factory (spoken in the film)
- TV Episode - '99 and 44/100% Pure Horror' - Tales of the Crypt

A better number (not as quotable) explaining how often is probably
99.73% (which still yields quite a few million outliers)

--
...winston
msft mvp consumer apps

On Tue, 22 Oct 2013 17:56:14 -0500, Rene Lamontagne wrote:

On 10/22/2013 5:49 PM, Ken Blake wrote:
On Tue, 22 Oct 2013 16:19:36 -0600, Ken Springer
wrote:

For me, 99 & 44/100% isn't good enough. For the times I fix the
occasional computer, everything must work, because my name is associated
with it. I don't like accepting anything else.

Other than most of the readers of this newsgroup, I wonder how many
people recognize the 99 & 44/100% phrase.


LOL! I was wondering whether you would. That's why I chose it.


Yep, Ivory soap, I remember the Slogan from hearing it on The Procter
and gamble show on the Radio About 1939/1940

Regards, Rene

Also, it floats.

--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)

On 10/23/2013 6:19 PM, Gene E. Bloch wrote:
On Tue, 22 Oct 2013 17:56:14 -0500, Rene Lamontagne wrote:

On 10/22/2013 5:49 PM, Ken Blake wrote:
On Tue, 22 Oct 2013 16:19:36 -0600, Ken Springer
wrote:

For me, 99 & 44/100% isn't good enough. For the times I fix the
occasional computer, everything must work, because my name is associated
with it. I don't like accepting anything else.

Other than most of the readers of this newsgroup, I wonder how many
people recognize the 99 & 44/100% phrase.


LOL! I was wondering whether you would. That's why I chose it.


Yep, Ivory soap, I remember the Slogan from hearing it on The Procter
and gamble show on the Radio About 1939/1940

Regards, Rene

Also, it floats.


Good thing if you have one of those real deep bathtubs.

Regards, Rene

On 2013-10-20 6:27 PM, Keith Nuttle wrote:

When I had XP, I maintained a copy of the SP3 updates on a CD.

Does Windows put a copy of the 8.1 update in the recovery partition that


Setup Windows 8.1 the way you want it, all programs installed,
configured and activated. Do not add your personal files yet.

CREATE a SYSTEM IMAGE on external storage device e.g. USB harddrive.

Now add your personal files.

Backup personal files to external storage device.

Done.

If your computer bellies-up, boot from DVD or USB and just apply the
image, run a manual Windows Update, and then restore the personal files
from regular backup.

If you think you've been compromised or some such, you can be back up
and running with confidence with in an hour or so .. instead of the
hours and hours if you were to install from scratch or some from basic
unconfigured image.

NOTE: You can use Windows 8.1 to create a system image. Go to Control
Panel, then File History, then and at the bottom left corner click on
System Image Backup.

NOTE: You can use Control Panel Recovery to create a USB recovery drive.

WireTalk

--

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--

And every man that hath this hope in
Him purifieth himself, even as He is pure.

1 John 3 : 3
--