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#1
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Hard disk continuously working
Hi all,
Here on holiday we use a 9 year old laptop (Sony VIA VGN-FW51JF) with W7 pro 64b running. For years going on there is something weird with it. After being switched on, the hard disk LED is continuously on for 10 - 15 minutes. During this time the laptop is unresposive - it is too busy. Now it has been on for 45 minutes. I can work on it (sending this post) but it is still slow, and the hard disk lED is still flickering. What might be wrong with this thing? Does it make sense to replace the hard disk by a SSD? Does it make sense to install W10 pro 64b? Thanks. Fokke Nauta |
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#2
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Hard disk continuously working
Fokke Nauta wrote:
Hi all, Here on holiday we use a 9 year old laptop (Sony VIA VGN-FW51JF) with W7 pro 64b running. For years going on there is something weird with it. After being switched on, the hard disk LED is continuously on for 10 - 15 minutes. During this time the laptop is unresposive - it is too busy. Now it has been on for 45 minutes. I can work on it (sending this post) but it is still slow, and the hard disk lED is still flickering. What might be wrong with this thing? Does it make sense to replace the hard disk by a SSD? Does it make sense to install W10 pro 64b? Thanks. Fokke Nauta Can you see anything in Task Manager ? If it's a SVCHOST that is railed, you can use Sysinternals Process Explorer (Run As Administrator) and you can look inside the SVCHOST and see what it is doing. The Sysinternals Process Monitor, records ETW events from all the programs running. If some program is doing it, Process Monitor can record it. Process Monitor records to RAM by default, but for large traces, you can have it write to a disk file instead. I recorded an entire Macrium Reflect backup run with it one day, with no problem at all. The maximum number of events it can record, is something like 200 million. I've never hit that limit yet (maybe it would take a 6-7 hour trace to hit the limit). Process Monitor also has boot logging. And what I discovered, is you can use it for both shutdown (during restart) as well as reboot logging. You tell Process Monitor you want to do boot monitoring, while at the same time recording current activity. Then you select Restart. The current trace is saved, the machine restarts, the bootup sequence is saved in a second file (procmon23.sys is injected into the system folder to do the recording at startup, and is a file with the Hidden attribute set). The duration of the boot capture, is determined by when you start Process Monitor running after bootup has finished. If you were locked out of the machine for 45 minutes and couldn't get the program running, the capture process would continue to capture during those 45 minutes. You would definitely want it saving the trace to disk for something that long. When you start Process Monitor after bootup is finished, it'll prompt about saving a trace that is being captured, and you can claim to put it somewhere safe at that point. (For event tracing and boot logging...) https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/sys...nloads/procmon (As a helper for Task Manager, can burrow into SVCHOST and get some info) https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/sys...ocess-explorer For older OSes, you have to hunt down an older version of these. They didn't need to drop support, but you know how the business works. ******* I can also offer a comment on the SSD. My laptop was pretty slow. I put an SSD in it, and all that achieves is makes the CPU look like the bottleneck. The CPU holds it back. Lots and lots of laptops are gutless, so you're fighting a losing battle when it comes to speeding one up. The one nice aspect, is not having to worry about the storage device receiving a mechanical shock. The SSD is going to be a bit more shockproof than a regular drive. As an example of a cheap drive, you can get a Intel 545s 128GB for around $60, which would be able to boot up the laptop once cloned over. You might want the next size up, if you want a bit more elbow room in the thing. Paul |
#3
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Hard disk continuously working
In message , Fokke Nauta
writes: Hi all, Here on holiday we use a 9 year old laptop (Sony VIA VGN-FW51JF) with W7 pro 64b running. For years going on there is something weird with it. After being switched on, the hard disk LED is continuously on for 10 - 15 minutes. During this time the laptop is unresposive - it is too busy. Now it has been on for 45 minutes. I can work on it (sending this post) but it is still slow, and the hard disk lED is still flickering. What might be wrong with this thing? See Paul's reply - but I'd also check the SMART on the HD in it (I use DiskCheckup from https://www.passmark.com/products/diskcheckup.htm, but there are many others). Last time I encountered a machine that took 15 minutes to boot, it was indeed a dying hard disc - it gave absolutely no sign of anything being wrong, other than it was very slow for anything involving disc access; obviously the error-correcting aspect of the disc was working well! That was I think back in either XP or possibly even '98 days. Does it make sense to replace the hard disk by a SSD? Does it make See Paul's answer. sense to install W10 pro 64b? Personally I wouldn't, but that's mainly because I'm very wary of W10 anyway; I don't _think_ it requires ... hang on, 9 years old, is that single core? I don't think 10 is very happy on a single core machine. (It certainly wasn't usable on mine.) Anyway, I wouldn't install it just in the hope that it'll solve your problem: I don't _think_ it would, and if it did you'd not know why. I'd solve it first, _then_ think about the W10 question. Thanks. Fokke Nauta YW; HIH. -- J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf Radio 4 is one of the reasons being British is good. It's not a subset of Britain - it's almost as if Britain is a subset of Radio 4. - Stephen Fry, in Radio Times, 7-13 June, 2003. |
#4
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Hard disk continuously working
On 02/06/2018 09:29:49, Fokke Nauta wrote:
Hi all, Here on holiday we use a 9 year old laptop (Sony VIA VGN-FW51JF) with W7 pro 64b running. For years going on there is something weird with it. After being switched on, the hard disk LED is continuously on for 10 - 15 minutes. During this time the laptop is unresposive - it is too busy. Now it has been on for 45 minutes. I can work on it (sending this post) but it is still slow, and the hard disk lED is still flickering. What might be wrong with this thing? Does it make sense to replace the hard disk by a SSD? Does it make sense to install W10 pro 64b? Thanks. Fokke Nauta If the laptop is only switched on occasionally it could be your security software updating itself and scanning your hard drive. I have had this issue on my 13 year old HP Pavilion laptop with win10 and Norton Security. The laptop is only used a couple of times a month when away from home for internet browsing, email and newsgroups. Norton was taking forever to scan the HD which made everything else so sluggish as to be nearly unusable. Also the latest update of win10 would not install so I have now uninstalled windows and put Kubuntu on it, installed Teamviwewer, so I can log on to my desktop at home and access windows 10 from there. Someday I might treat myself to a new laptop :-) -- mick |
#5
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Hard disk continuously working
Fokke Nauta wrote:
Hi all, Here on holiday we use a 9 year old laptop (Sony VIA VGN-FW51JF) with W7 pro 64b running. For years going on there is something weird with it. After being switched on, the hard disk LED is continuously on for 10 - 15 minutes. During this time the laptop is unresposive - it is too busy. Now it has been on for 45 minutes. I can work on it (sending this post) but it is still slow, and the hard disk lED is still flickering. What might be wrong with this thing? Does it make sense to replace the hard disk by a SSD? Does it make sense to install W10 pro 64b? Thanks. Fokke Nauta My thoughts, in no special order: HDD going bad. Try running a surface scan and see what it says. HDD connections slightly corroded. Reseat the hdd. Search indexing is turned on. Turn it off and see if it changes. Something is updating. Turn off the radios and and reboot with radios off. Software is messed up. No easy fix. Try your backup or older system restore. Some other hardware problem. An SSD MAY fix the problem assuming a fresh install of o/s. Same for W10 assuming that you also install an SSD at the same time. Good luck liking W10. |
#6
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Hard disk continuously working
On Sat, 2 Jun 2018 10:29:49 +0200, Fokke Nauta wrote:
Hi all, Here on holiday we use a 9 year old laptop (Sony VIA VGN-FW51JF) with W7 pro 64b running. For years going on there is something weird with it. After being switched on, the hard disk LED is continuously on for 10 - 15 minutes. During this time the laptop is unresposive - it is too busy. Now it has been on for 45 minutes. I can work on it (sending this post) but it is still slow, and the hard disk lED is still flickering. What might be wrong with this thing? You've received a lot of good suggestions. I'll try to add one more. Check RAM usage in Task Manager. If a stick died and isn't being recognized, the system could have much less RAM than you thought and you could be running into a heavy swap condition, especially just after booting up. I've seen that bring a PC to its knees, and in fact, I can duplicate that behavior by lowering the amount of RAM in a VM. At some point, it takes forever to stabilize and be ready. Also, think about the installed programs and whether any are set to start automatically, or set to check for updates automatically, after booting. If so, tame those beasts. Does it make sense to replace the hard disk by a SSD? Weakest link in a chain theory says the slowdown will simply move somewhere else. Does it make sense to install W10 pro 64b? I can't think of a scenario where that makes sense. I'm admittedly biased, but only because I've used Win 10. -- Char Jackson |
#7
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Hard disk continuously working
Op 2-6-2018 om 10:29 schreef Fokke Nauta:
Hi all, Here on holiday we use a 9 year old laptop (Sony VIA VGN-FW51JF) with W7 pro 64b running. For years going on there is something weird with it. After being switched on, the hard disk LED is continuously on for 10 - 15 minutes. During this time the laptop is unresposive - it is too busy. Now it has been on for 45 minutes. I can work on it (sending this post) but it is still slow, and the hard disk lED is still flickering. What might be wrong with this thing?the laptop is not worth the ccosts of aa SSD anymore. Does it make sense to replace the hard disk by a SSD? Does it make sense to install W10 pro 64b? Thanks. Fokke Nauta Thank you all for your hints and suggestions. All very useful! GigaTweaker3 was installed on this laptop and I had a look into it. There was a box checked with something like "Defragment hard disk on start up" or something like that. The first thing I did was unchecking that box. That made a whole difference. Installing Procmon showed a lot of activity of Explorer.exe and scvhost, both a lot of different issues. I didn't see anything particular showing up, or something that showed up many times. One thing that came back a lot of times was something like ...\WinVT\Publisers\..., and I'll have a look into what that is. I installed Hard disk Sentinal, and that showed the disk is perfect (100%), although the temp is quite high (39 degrees Celcius) and tha max temp ever was 48 degrees C. I will defenitely not install W10, I will not replace the hard disk with a SSD either, as I've seen the laptop is not worth the costs of an SSD anymore. Fokke |
#8
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Hard disk continuously working
Fokke Nauta wrote:
Op 2-6-2018 om 10:29 schreef Fokke Nauta: Hi all, Here on holiday we use a 9 year old laptop (Sony VIA VGN-FW51JF) with W7 pro 64b running. For years going on there is something weird with it. After being switched on, the hard disk LED is continuously on for 10 - 15 minutes. During this time the laptop is unresposive - it is too busy. Now it has been on for 45 minutes. I can work on it (sending this post) but it is still slow, and the hard disk lED is still flickering. What might be wrong with this thing?the laptop is not worth the ccosts of aa SSD anymore. Does it make sense to replace the hard disk by a SSD? Does it make sense to install W10 pro 64b? Thanks. Fokke Nauta Thank you all for your hints and suggestions. All very useful! GigaTweaker3 was installed on this laptop and I had a look into it. There was a box checked with something like "Defragment hard disk on start up" or something like that. The first thing I did was unchecking that box. That made a whole difference. Installing Procmon showed a lot of activity of Explorer.exe and scvhost, both a lot of different issues. I didn't see anything particular showing up, or something that showed up many times. One thing that came back a lot of times was something like ...\WinVT\Publisers\..., and I'll have a look into what that is. I installed Hard disk Sentinal, and that showed the disk is perfect (100%), although the temp is quite high (39 degrees Celcius) and tha max temp ever was 48 degrees C. I will defenitely not install W10, I will not replace the hard disk with a SSD either, as I've seen the laptop is not worth the costs of an SSD anymore. Fokke You can use Process Explorer (use "Run As Administrator), then locate any busy SVCHOST, then you can burrow inside it and see which service is using cycles. In Process Monitor, you might have a PID to work with, then look for that PID in Process Explorer and drill in to see the busy service. But it sounds like you've made good progress. And won't need to spend a dime :-) A happy ending. Paul |
#9
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Hard disk continuously working
Fokke Nauta wrote in
: Here on holiday we use a 9 year old laptop (Sony VIA VGN-FW51JF) with W7 pro 64b running. For years going on there is something weird with it. After being switched on, the hard disk LED is continuously on for 10 - 15 minutes. During this time the laptop is unresposive - it is too busy. Now it has been on for 45 minutes. I can work on it (sending this post) but it is still slow, and the hard disk lED is still flickering. What might be wrong with this thing? Does it make sense to replace the hard disk by a SSD? Does it make sense to install W10 pro 64b? It sounds like you've already made great progress. For the benefit of others, Windows 7 includes a built in tool "Resource Monitor" (perfmon.exe) that can list running processes with high disk activity. Especially when providing remote support, I always start with the built in tools. It's under Accessories- System Tools. If you're already in Task Manager, there's a button for it on the Performance tab. |
#10
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Hard disk continuously working
In message , Fokke Nauta
writes: Op 2-6-2018 om 10:29 schreef Fokke Nauta: Hi all, Here on holiday we use a 9 year old laptop (Sony VIA VGN-FW51JF) with W7 pro 64b running. For years going on there is something weird with it. After being switched on, the hard disk LED is continuously on for 10 - 15 minutes. During this time the laptop is unresposive - it is too busy. [] GigaTweaker3 was installed on this laptop and I had a look into it. There was a box checked with something like "Defragment hard disk on start up" or something like that. The first thing I did was unchecking that box. That made a whole difference. It certainly would! There's considerable argument about how useful defragging is anyway; I still think it has some use, but I certainly wouldn't do it every startup! Depending on how much (and what for) you use the computer, I'd say once a week or month might be more than enough for most people; if you leave the computer on, the setting that does it at 3 a. m. one day a week should suffice. [] thing that came back a lot of times was something like ...\WinVT\Publisers\..., and I'll have a look into what that is. Not WinTV, is it? If so, have you ever had a TV stick in the machine? I can't see why that should be taking a lot of CPU, but it's certainly IMO worth removing it (provided you've got the install disc so you can put it back if needed!) if you _aren't_ using a TV stick. I installed Hard disk Sentinal, and that showed the disk is perfect (100%), although the temp is quite high (39 degrees Celcius) and tha max temp ever was 48 degrees C. Never assume anything about a hard disc - image it from time to time (at least the C: and hidden partitions - your data is up to you) regardless of what tools say about the disc condition (-: A couple of HDTune plots (always two or more plots so you can see if any of the spikes, which are mostly due to Windows interrupting, _don't_ move) are worth a try too. I will defenitely not install W10, I doubt it would be a good idea on a 9yo machine. Or one that isn't used often, as it'd spend a lot of time getting updates. I will not replace the hard disk with a SSD either, as I've seen the laptop is not worth the costs of an SSD anymore. Agreed. Fokke -- J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf Veni Vidi Vacuum [I came, I saw, It sucked] - , 1998 |
#11
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Hard disk continuously working
Op 4-6-2018 om 13:54 schreef Paul:
Fokke Nauta wrote: Op 2-6-2018 om 10:29 schreef Fokke Nauta: Hi all, Here on holiday we use a 9 year old laptop (Sony VIA VGN-FW51JF) with W7 pro 64b running. For years going on there is something weird with it. After being switched on, the hard disk LED is continuously on for 10 - 15 minutes. During this time the laptop is unresposive - it is too busy. Now it has been on for 45 minutes. I can work on it (sending this post) but it is still slow, and the hard disk lED is still flickering. What might be wrong with this thing?the laptop is not worth the ccosts of aa SSD anymore. Does it make sense to replace the hard disk by a SSD? Does it make sense to install W10 pro 64b? Thanks. Fokke Nauta Thank you all for your hints and suggestions. All very useful! GigaTweaker3 was installed on this laptop and I had a look into it. There was a box checked with something like "Defragment hard disk on start up" or something like that. The first thing I did was unchecking that box. That made a whole difference. Installing Procmon showed a lot of activity of Explorer.exe and scvhost, both a lot of different issues. I didn't see anything particular showing up, or something that showed up many times. One thing that came back a lot of times was something like ...\WinVT\Publisers\..., and I'll have a look into what that is. I installed Hard disk Sentinal, and that showed the disk is perfect (100%), although the temp is quite high (39 degrees Celcius) and tha max temp ever was 48 degrees C. I will defenitely not install W10, I will not replace the hard disk with a SSD either, as I've seen the laptop is not worth the costs of an SSD anymore. Fokke You can use Process Explorer (use "Run As Administrator), then locate any busy SVCHOST, then you can burrow inside it and see which service is using cycles. In Process Monitor, you might have a PID to work with, then look for that PID in Process Explorer and drill in to see the busy service. But it sounds like you've made good progress. And won't need to spend a dime :-) A happy ending. Paul Hi Paul, Thanks. I'll give it a try with Process Explorer and Process Monitor. I will also look into how to use it whilst booting up. Fokke |
#12
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Hard disk continuously working
Op 4-6-2018 om 17:49 schreef Mark Blain:
Fokke Nauta wrote in : Here on holiday we use a 9 year old laptop (Sony VIA VGN-FW51JF) with W7 pro 64b running. For years going on there is something weird with it. After being switched on, the hard disk LED is continuously on for 10 - 15 minutes. During this time the laptop is unresposive - it is too busy. Now it has been on for 45 minutes. I can work on it (sending this post) but it is still slow, and the hard disk lED is still flickering. What might be wrong with this thing? Does it make sense to replace the hard disk by a SSD? Does it make sense to install W10 pro 64b? It sounds like you've already made great progress. For the benefit of others, Windows 7 includes a built in tool "Resource Monitor" (perfmon.exe) that can list running processes with high disk activity. Especially when providing remote support, I always start with the built in tools. It's under Accessories- System Tools. If you're already in Task Manager, there's a button for it on the Performance tab. Thanks. I'll try this as well. Fokke |
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