When A means B

Hi All,

I just got off a remove assist with a customer.
I could not make heads of tail of what she was
complaining about. Then I realizes that

Windows 7 = Windows Live Mail
Windows 10 = gMail

I have a headache.

:-(

-T

On 6/4/2018 5:29 PM, T wrote:
Hi All,

I just got off a remove assist with a customer.
I could not make heads of tail of what she was
complaining about. Then I realizes that

Windows 7 = Windows Live Mail
Windows 10 = gMail

I have a headache.

:-(

-T


I often get similar information when dealing with customer support.

--
David E. Ross
http://www.rossde.com/

First you say you do, and then you don't.
And then you say you will, but then won't.
You're undecided now, so what're you goin' to do?
From a 1950s song
That should be Donald Trump's theme song. He obviously
does not understand "commitment", whether it is about
policy or marriage.

On Mon, 4 Jun 2018 17:29:41 -0700, T wrote:

Hi All,

I just got off a remove assist with a customer.
I could not make heads of tail of what she was
complaining about. Then I realizes that

Windows 7 = Windows Live Mail
Windows 10 = gMail

I have a headache.

:-(

It happens. I was replacing a battery on a security system panel
today. The customer did not know the difference between a keypad and
the panel. Hey, they have other things to do.

Sincerely,

Gene Wirchenko

On 06/04/2018 05:46 PM, David E. Ross wrote:
On 6/4/2018 5:29 PM, T wrote:
Hi All,

I just got off a remove assist with a customer.
I could not make heads of tail of what she was
complaining about. Then I realizes that

Windows 7 = Windows Live Mail
Windows 10 = gMail

I have a headache.

:-(

-T


I often get similar information when dealing with customer support.


Do they freak out that you erased all their eMail
if you bring up another program and the new windows
covers up their eMail program?

T wrote:

I just got off a remove assist with a customer. I could not make heads
of tail of what she was complaining about. Then I realizes that

Windows 7 = Windows Live Mail
Windows 10 = gMail

I have a headache.

Windows 7 did not come with an e-mail client. If Windows Live Mail
(WLM), formerly named Windows Live Mail Desktop, is on that computer
then the user installed it. Windows Mail came with Windows Vista. WLM
was the successor to Vista's Mail (that version of it since Microsoft
has reused the name "Mail" in Windows 8 but for a different client). On
a clean install of Windows 7, if you wanted to locally do e-mail (and
not get stuck using a web browser to connect to a webmail client) then
you had to install an e-mail program. Outlook, Thunderbird, em Client,
or something including WLM.

Windows 10 comes with Mail, not gMail (which is an online service, not a
local client).

Windows XP: Outlook Express (part of IE which came bundled in XP).
Windows Vista: Mail (different than the prior Microsoft Mail).
Windows 7: No e-mail client (you have to install one).
Windows 8: Windows Mail (different than Vista's Mail), no POP (only
IMAP and Exchange).
Windows 10: Mail (the local client, not the gMail service). (*)

(*) I found no app named "gMail" in Microsoft's store. Maybe someone
somewhere else has a Windows 10 app called "gMail" (who mustn't be
afraid of Google for trademark infringment). Whether from
Microsoft's store or elsewhere, the user would have to install it.

Does "Mail" mean Microsoft Mail, Mail (Vista 8), or Mail (Windows 10)?
Does "Outlook" mean Outlook Express or Outlook or Outlook.com?
Distinguishable naming is not a forte of Microsoft. Neither is sticking
with a name.

https://www.howtogeek.com/338120/mic...ming-products/
https://www.pcworld.com/article/1616..._ms_names.html
and more at
https://www.google.com/search?q=conf...+product+names

On 6/4/2018 6:05 PM, T wrote:
On 06/04/2018 05:46 PM, David E. Ross wrote:
On 6/4/2018 5:29 PM, T wrote:
Hi All,

I just got off a remove assist with a customer.
I could not make heads of tail of what she was
complaining about. Then I realizes that

Windows 7 = Windows Live Mail
Windows 10 = gMail

I have a headache.

:-(

-T


I often get similar information when dealing with customer support.


Do they freak out that you erased all their eMail
if you bring up another program and the new windows
covers up their eMail program?


That has never happened to me. But they do freak out if I (a customer)
have a problem that is not covered by their script. When I need
customer support and use the correct terminology to describe my problem,
the script-readers become confused.

Note that I do not make the mistake of "When A means B". My entire 40+
year career was with software. More than 30 of those years was as a
tester of software used by the US Department of Defense to operate its
unmanned, earth-orbiting satellites. During that time, I also performed
customer support, mostly for the US Air Force. Only the most senior
personnel in our organization were allowed to field customer-support
phone calls. We had no scripts. We did have user manuals, system and
program specifications, error reports, and even the source code of the
software. We usually knew exactly where to look to answer the
customer's questions. The customer not only had our office phone
numbers but also our home phone numbers. Just an hour or two before the
launch of one satellite, I got called out of the shower to provide
customer support -- successfully -- entirely from memory. That level of
customer support is very hard to find today.

--
David E. Ross
http://www.rossde.com/

First you say you do, and then you don't.
And then you say you will, but then won't.
You're undecided now, so what're you goin' to do?
From a 1950s song
That should be Donald Trump's theme song. He obviously
does not understand "commitment", whether it is about
policy or marriage.

On 06/04/2018 08:13 PM, David E. Ross wrote:
On 6/4/2018 6:05 PM, T wrote:
On 06/04/2018 05:46 PM, David E. Ross wrote:
On 6/4/2018 5:29 PM, T wrote:
Hi All,

I just got off a remove assist with a customer.
I could not make heads of tail of what she was
complaining about. Then I realizes that

Windows 7 = Windows Live Mail
Windows 10 = gMail

I have a headache.

:-(

-T


I often get similar information when dealing with customer support.


Do they freak out that you erased all their eMail
if you bring up another program and the new windows
covers up their eMail program?


That has never happened to me. But they do freak out if I (a customer)
have a problem that is not covered by their script. When I need
customer support and use the correct terminology to describe my problem,
the script-readers become confused.

Note that I do not make the mistake of "When A means B". My entire 40+
year career was with software. More than 30 of those years was as a
tester of software used by the US Department of Defense to operate its
unmanned, earth-orbiting satellites. During that time, I also performed
customer support, mostly for the US Air Force. Only the most senior
personnel in our organization were allowed to field customer-support
phone calls. We had no scripts. We did have user manuals, system and
program specifications, error reports, and even the source code of the
software. We usually knew exactly where to look to answer the
customer's questions. The customer not only had our office phone
numbers but also our home phone numbers. Just an hour or two before the
launch of one satellite, I got called out of the shower to provide
customer support -- successfully -- entirely from memory. That level of
customer support is very hard to find today.


I hate arguing with scritpers" "May I just ask my question!?!?!"

On 06/04/2018 08:09 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
T wrote:

I just got off a remove assist with a customer. I could not make heads
of tail of what she was complaining about. Then I realizes that

Windows 7 = Windows Live Mail
Windows 10 = gMail

I have a headache.

Windows 7 did not come with an e-mail client. If Windows Live Mail
(WLM), formerly named Windows Live Mail Desktop, is on that computer
then the user installed it. Windows Mail came with Windows Vista. WLM
was the successor to Vista's Mail (that version of it since Microsoft
has reused the name "Mail" in Windows 8 but for a different client). On
a clean install of Windows 7, if you wanted to locally do e-mail (and
not get stuck using a web browser to connect to a webmail client) then
you had to install an e-mail program. Outlook, Thunderbird, em Client,
or something including WLM.

Windows 10 comes with Mail, not gMail (which is an online service, not a
local client).

Windows XP: Outlook Express (part of IE which came bundled in XP).
Windows Vista: Mail (different than the prior Microsoft Mail).
Windows 7: No e-mail client (you have to install one).
Windows 8: Windows Mail (different than Vista's Mail), no POP (only
IMAP and Exchange).
Windows 10: Mail (the local client, not the gMail service). (*)

(*) I found no app named "gMail" in Microsoft's store. Maybe someone
somewhere else has a Windows 10 app called "gMail" (who mustn't be
afraid of Google for trademark infringment). Whether from
Microsoft's store or elsewhere, the user would have to install it.

Does "Mail" mean Microsoft Mail, Mail (Vista 8), or Mail (Windows 10)?
Does "Outlook" mean Outlook Express or Outlook or Outlook.com?
Distinguishable naming is not a forte of Microsoft. Neither is sticking
with a name.

https://www.howtogeek.com/338120/mic...ming-products/
https://www.pcworld.com/article/1616..._ms_names.html
and more at
https://www.google.com/search?q=conf...+product+names


It is usually pretty easy to figure out the wrong descriptions
(Hard Drive = computer case, "The Picture" = Desktop, screen
saver = desktop), but today was a real head ache.

On Mon, 4 Jun 2018 20:13:48 -0700, "David E. Ross"
wrote:

Note that I do not make the mistake of "When A means B". My entire 40+
year career was with software. More than 30 of those years was as a
tester of software used by the US Department of Defense to operate its
unmanned, earth-orbiting satellites.

It's funny that you have to specify that those satellites were unmanned,
but if you don't, some people might assume that we have people up there,
and that's where they were calling from. ;-)


--

Char Jackson

"David E. Ross" on Mon, 4 Jun 2018 20:13:48
-0700 typed in alt.windows7.general the following:
We had no scripts. We did have user manuals, system and
program specifications, error reports, and even the source code of the
software. We usually knew exactly where to look to answer the
customer's questions. The customer not only had our office phone
numbers but also our home phone numbers. Just an hour or two before the
launch of one satellite, I got called out of the shower to provide
customer support -- successfully -- entirely from memory. That level of
customer support is very hard to find today.

That level of knowledge is often lacking, on both ends of the
call. But "RTFM!" presumes that there is a manual to be read. Far
too often there is not.

The scrip readers are capable of dealing with the 90% of questions
- the "FAQ"s. The problem is, what do I do when I have a question
the FAQs don't address? E.g., I wanted to know if WordPerfect had a
"signature" option, that is, to break up a large booklet into smaller
subbooklets ("signatures") for printing and binding. I had to explain
that 1) I know how to double sided printing 2) print a booklet and 3)
I wanted to know if the new release had that capacity.
Likewise when trying to find out if a printer will handle
"automatic duplex printing on legal size paper". not automatic duplex
print, not printing on legal size paper, not automatic printing on
legal size paper, but all three "automatic"+"duplex"+"legal size".
Arggh.

Enough venting. Time for coffee.

--
pyotr filipivich
Next month's Panel: Graft - Boon or blessing?

On 06/04/2018 10:07 PM, T wrote:
On 06/04/2018 08:09 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
T wrote:

I just got off a remove assist with a customer. I could not make heads
of tail of what she was complaining about.Â* Then I realizes that

Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Windows 7Â*Â* =Â*Â* Windows Live Mail
Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Windows 10Â* =Â*Â* gMail

I have a headache.

Windows 7 did not come with an e-mail client.Â* If Windows Live Mail
(WLM), formerly named Windows Live Mail Desktop, is on that computer
then the user installed it.Â* Windows Mail came with Windows Vista.Â* WLM
was the successor to Vista's Mail (that version of it since Microsoft
has reused the name "Mail" in Windows 8 but for a different client).Â* On
a clean install of Windows 7, if you wanted to locally do e-mail (and
not get stuck using a web browser to connect to a webmail client) then
you had to install an e-mail program.Â* Outlook, Thunderbird, em Client,
or something including WLM.

Windows 10 comes with Mail, not gMail (which is an online service, not a
local client).

Windows XP:Â*Â*Â* Outlook Express (part of IE which came bundled in XP).
Windows Vista: Mail (different than the prior Microsoft Mail).
Windows 7:Â*Â*Â*Â* No e-mail client (you have to install one).
Windows 8:Â*Â*Â*Â* Windows Mail (different than Vista's Mail), no POP (only
Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* IMAP and Exchange).
Windows 10:Â*Â*Â* Mail (the local client, not the gMail service). (*)

(*) I found no app named "gMail" in Microsoft's store.Â* Maybe someone
Â*Â*Â*Â* somewhere else has a Windows 10 app called "gMail" (who mustn't be
Â*Â*Â*Â* afraid of Google for trademark infringment).Â* Whether from
Â*Â*Â*Â* Microsoft's store or elsewhere, the user would have to install it.

Does "Mail" mean Microsoft Mail, Mail (Vista 8), or Mail (Windows 10)?
Does "Outlook" mean Outlook Express or Outlook or Outlook.com?
Distinguishable naming is not a forte of Microsoft.Â* Neither is sticking
with a name.

https://www.howtogeek.com/338120/mic...ming-products/
https://www.pcworld.com/article/1616..._ms_names.html
and more at
https://www.google.com/search?q=conf...+product+names


It is usually pretty easy to figure out the wrong descriptions
(Hard Drive = computer case, "The Picture" = Desktop, screen
saver = desktop), but today was a real head ache.


The latest: "every time I walk away from the computer,
it turns off and I have to power it back up again".

Okay, that means overheat. Probably the CPU fan went out.

Got to the computer, moved stuff away from the case,
including the mouse so I could look at the fans.

Well now, moving the mouse caused the screen to come back
on at the log in prompt. The customer points and
says "see!".

That is not powering it back up! Configured her power
settings to never suspend and she was happy.

AAAA HHHHHHH !!!!!

On 06/05/2018 12:05 AM, T wrote:

Just an hour or two before the
launch of one satellite, I got called out of the shower to provide
customer support -- successfully -- entirely from memory.Â* That level of
customer support is very hard to find today.


I hate arguing with scritpers"Â* "May I just ask my question!?!?!"

Thinking of customer support, once I called a satellite TV company to
ask about a HDTV DVR, and was asked "How many mushrooms to you have on
your dish?".

On 06/05/2018 10:31 AM, Char Jackson wrote:

[snip]

It's funny that you have to specify that those satellites were unmanned,
but if you don't, some people might assume that we have people up there,
and that's where they were calling from. ;-)

Once I read a story about a future (that didn't happen) where all
satellites had to be manned, because the electron tubes kept burning out.

--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"The best defense against Christianity is a good Christian Education"
[Psycho Dave]

In message , George J
writes:
On 06/05/2018 12:05 AM, T wrote:

Just an hour or two before the
launch of one satellite, I got called out of the shower to provide
customer support -- successfully -- entirely from memory.* That level of
customer support is very hard to find today.

I hate arguing with scritpers"* "May I just ask my question!?!?!"

Thinking of customer support, once I called a satellite TV company to
ask about a HDTV DVR, and was asked "How many mushrooms to you have on
your dish?".

I remember hearing (this is OT) about when the Aleutian islands (that
string of islands that sort of goes from Alaska to Siberia) first got
radio dishes (not sure whether it was for direct or satellite), the
natives found the dishes a good place to use for drying fish ...
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Eddie [Waring] underook elocution lessons in Leeds. After four weeks he was
asked to leave - all members in his class had begun to speak like him.
Stuart Hall, RT 7-13 August 2010

In message , Mark Lloyd
writes:
On 06/05/2018 10:31 AM, Char Jackson wrote:

[snip]

It's funny that you have to specify that those satellites were unmanned,
but if you don't, some people might assume that we have people up there,
and that's where they were calling from. ;-)

Once I read a story about a future (that didn't happen) where all
satellites had to be manned, because the electron tubes kept burning
out.

Was that Arthur C. Clarke's original paper (in Wireless World), 194x I
think, about communications satellites?

What struck me on reading it wasn't the manned status, but that they
involved steam power to drive the generators! I think when that paper
was written, photovoltaics as a source of energy were just a novelty,
certainly not capable of generating enough power to power the valves
(toobs) then current.
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Eddie [Waring] underook elocution lessons in Leeds. After four weeks he was
asked to leave - all members in his class had begun to speak like him.
Stuart Hall, RT 7-13 August 2010