Make 12x18" signs at home on 8.5x11" B&W laser printer

Mayayana wrote:
"Eco Clean" wrote

| PowerPoint just stinks at printing to four tiles to scale a page by 1.4.
|

I don't want to throw a wrench in trhe works if this
approach is working for you, but you already had the
print working with overlap. If the "auto-tile-print"
approach doesn't work thewn just go back to that,
or make the 4 tiles yourself by making the 4 images
in PSP.



The the *proper* tool this is a snap:

http://www.littleworksstudio.com/temp/usenet/tiled-print

You can even set overlap and registration marks to facilitate the process.

Powerpoint was not the proper tool. Yes you "can" drive screws with a
hammer, but a hammer is not the proper tool for a screw...

--
Take care,

Jonathan
-------------------
LITTLE WORKS STUDIO
http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com

"Jonathan N. Little" wrote

| I don't want to throw a wrench in trhe works if this
| approach is working for you, but you already had the
| print working with overlap. If the "auto-tile-print"
| approach doesn't work thewn just go back to that,
| or make the 4 tiles yourself by making the 4 images
| in PSP.
|
|
|
| The the *proper* tool this is a snap:
|
| http://www.littleworksstudio.com/temp/usenet/tiled-print
|

I don't know what program window you're showing there
and you didn't say. Are people supposed to know? Were
you actually suggesting that one should get a vector
graphics program just to cut up an image?

If it were me I'd just make 4 quadrant images in PSP.
A couple of minutes and the job is done. But suit yourself.
Your idea was essentially my second suggestion, using
Irfan View to print quadrants, but I think Eco Clean didn't
follow what I was talking about.

Mayayana wrote:
"Jonathan N. Little" wrote

| I don't want to throw a wrench in trhe works if this
| approach is working for you, but you already had the
| print working with overlap. If the "auto-tile-print"
| approach doesn't work thewn just go back to that,
| or make the 4 tiles yourself by making the 4 images
| in PSP.
|
|
|
| The the *proper* tool this is a snap:
|
| http://www.littleworksstudio.com/temp/usenet/tiled-print
|

I don't know what program window you're showing there
and you didn't say. Are people supposed to know?

No I didn't. It was CorelDraw but that was not my point. My point was
using a program specifically for "making signs" or other such graphics
is the best (and easiest) way to get the job done. You *could* use a
word processor or spreadsheet program to do the job but it would be
neither easy, nor "best", nor even suitable for the task.

Were you actually suggesting that one should get a vector graphics
program just to cut up an image?
If you are doing a large format *graphic* (ie, hard edge non-photograph
image) project, raster (bitmaps) is a very poor choice from the start.

For example the difference clearly visible between printing a JPG image
of a document vs the original word processor document with TTF (vector)
type.

There are freeware vector graphics programs available. I listed some,
google is his friend.


If it were me I'd just make 4 quadrant images in PSP.
A couple of minutes and the job is done. But suit yourself.
Your idea was essentially my second suggestion, using
Irfan View to print quadrants, but I think Eco Clean didn't
follow what I was talking about.

You could. But if he had just used a graphic program to make the
rectangle with round corners and inset the text all to scale would yield
a better and easier results. LibreOffice Draw could have done it in 5
minutes or less.

Also as an raster image even with his modest size of 12"x18" output if
you used 300DPI bitmap would be 3600x5400 pixel image and that would not
produce as crisp and clear output as vector. The situation is even more
obvious with my 2'x3' example as raster would yield a sizable 7200x10800
bitmap image and still be inferior to the vector in output.

--
Take care,

Jonathan
-------------------
LITTLE WORKS STUDIO
http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com

In article , Mayayana
wrote:


| I don't want to throw a wrench in trhe works if this
| approach is working for you, but you already had the
| print working with overlap. If the "auto-tile-print"
| approach doesn't work thewn just go back to that,
| or make the 4 tiles yourself by making the 4 images
| in PSP.
|
|
| The the *proper* tool this is a snap:
|
| http://www.littleworksstudio.com/temp/usenet/tiled-print

I don't know what program window you're showing there
and you didn't say. Are people supposed to know? Were
you actually suggesting that one should get a vector
graphics program just to cut up an image?

vector is a requirement, unless you don't mind low quality pixelated
text.

If it were me I'd just make 4 quadrant images in PSP.
A couple of minutes and the job is done. But suit yourself.
Your idea was essentially my second suggestion, using
Irfan View to print quadrants, but I think Eco Clean didn't
follow what I was talking about.

versus a couple of seconds to just click print and let the computer
tile it for you, entirely automatically and without any loss in
quality.

why do you insist on doing things the hard way?
why do you refuse to learn easier methods?

"Jonathan N. Little" wrote

|
| Also as an raster image even with his modest size of 12"x18" output if
| you used 300DPI bitmap would be 3600x5400 pixel image and that would not
| produce as crisp and clear output as vector. The situation is even more
| obvious with my 2'x3' example as raster would yield a sizable 7200x10800
| bitmap image and still be inferior to the vector in output.

I can see your point about vector graphics for
something like basic text. Though it's not
actually necessary to enlarge an image like
this. Programs like IrfanView can resize his
1200x1800 during printing. And using a raster
image makes it easy to slice it up into pieces.

I mentioned a minimum 300 dpi as the minimum
one would want to print for a photo. That was
only an example. I'm afraid I may not have explained
it as clearly as I might have. It gets very confusing
translating between pixels and printers. And it
doesn't help that images and graphic editors often
display a dpi resolution for images, which has
nothing to do with anything.

On 01/14/2018 05:11 AM, Eco Clean wrote:
- Big Al wrote:

If you have a photo editing program of any sort that will crop then
just take your 12x18 photo and:
crop the top left quadrant to 8.5x11 and print.
Then crop the top right to 8.5x11 and print.
etc for the 4 quadrants.
They'll overlap but I think you said you didn't mind and would just
tape them together.

At least if I'm reading what you want to do right!

I got the job done nicely with Rasterbator freeware so now I only have to
make the stencil.
[http://www.fileconvoy.com/dfl.php?id...68090b3 2a7f]


Does anyone know where to get clear plastic sheets that a laser printer can
print directly onto without melting them?

Do they exist?
My wife worked in a school and the teachers had clear sheets for the
xerox printer they could put stuff on for overhead projectors. Mind you
it was the 80's. But Office Depot etc (US). Not sure if they exist
now since projectors now are made to hook directly to the PC, no need
for those clear sheets now.

On 1/14/2018 4:38 AM, Eco Clean wrote:
- Susan Bugher wrote:

Program: Printmaster Express
snip

I ended up using the rasterbator freeware, but I did try to use other
freeware, such as "posterprinter" freeware, but it failed to install on
Windows so I gave up on that approach.

https://sourceforge.net/projects/posterprinter/files/
https://sourceforge.net/projects/pos...d?source=files

Downloads poster_printer_beta_1_0.exe

I misunderstood the type of sign you wanted to print. I'll add a couple
more suggestions to your post about Rasterbator.

Susan
--
Posted to alt.comp.freeware (using WinXP-SP2, Win7professional-32 bit)
http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://www.pricelesswarehome.org

- Jonathan N. Little wrote:

With the *proper* tool this is a snap:
http://www.littleworksstudio.com/temp/usenet/tiled-print

You can even set overlap and registration marks to facilitate the process.

Powerpoint was not the proper tool. Yes you "can" drive screws with a
hammer, but a hammer is not the proper tool for a screw...

I will agree that having "registration marks" would be a good idea,
especially as there are the two fixed-distance bolt holes to consider.

I don't see the freeware at the little works studio site that they used
though. Do you know which vector-based Windows freeware they used?

The "tasks" needed we
1) [done] Easily create the score of images
2) [done] Easily print them to 8.5x11" to 12x18" size
3) [open] Create a plastic template for spray painting

Do you have helpful suggestions for that final stage of creating the
spray-painting templates with standard home equipment?

- Mayayana wrote:

I don't want to throw a wrench in trhe works if this
approach is working for you, but you already had the
print working with overlap. If the "auto-tile-print"
approach doesn't work thewn just go back to that,
or make the 4 tiles yourself by making the 4 images
in PSP.

You have been great as you've been *very helpful* with your ideas.

I tried a half dozen of the suggested approaches where with tremendous
energy, we can make any approach always eventually work.

What I wanted was a quick painless simple approach - which I've now found.
1) Create the image any way you want (we used PowerPoint because we had it)
2) Create the paper template with Rasterbator (works perfect at 1.4 ratio)
3) Create the plastic template (we don't have this yet)

I care about you because you were helpful to me, so I would like to know if
you've tried Rasterbator yet? It's great, but it takes a little getting
used to. But with Rasterbator, you can scale anything up with nothing more
than knowing the ratio.

For example, 1.4 is the ratio if I scale by width.
And 1.6 is the ratio if I scale by length.

That's the only technical thing I need to know in order to use Rasterbator.
And the dot size, where 1mm dot size works fine (but I'm not sure what it
actually is because nothing printed is 1 mm so I don't know what it means
to have 1mm dot size as the actual dots are far tinier than that).

Since I'm trying to accomplish something, I have to pick the first thing
that works well, and Rasterbator turned out to be just that.

So now I'm on the step of how to most easily make a clear plastic template
to spray paint now that I have the paper template.

Any ideas for how to get the paper transferred to plastic with common home
equipment?

- Jonathan N. Little wrote:

No, PowerPoint *can* be used to do it, but a drawing program is
*perfect* for making sign. The word is "vector".

http://www.littleworksstudio.com/temp/usenet/vector

Raster has scalabliity issues...

Sample vector programs:

Illustrator, CorelDraw, Inkscape, ... closest thing MS made was Publisher.

While PowerPoint isn't free either, the point here was not to need to buy
anything that we didn't already have (this is, after all, not a business).

Everyone has PowerPoint, but very few people who are working on this have
professional drawing programs, which is why they stuck the so-called
"computer whiz kid" with the task of figuring out how to make the signs.

I think I have the process working fine now, as I've already "printed" a
half dozen templates since last night, but the *next* step is the killer.

Cutting the smaller letters with an Exacto knife is just too difficult.
So we're going to have to forgo the smaller letters.

Is there a way to print *directly* to plastic clear sheets using a standard
laser printer? Printing to the plastic might be easier than transferring
the paper to plastic and then cutting the plastic templates.

- Mayayana wrote:

I can see your point about vector graphics for
something like basic text.

I'm all for vectors if they produce straighter lines where you'll notice we
used a freeware traffic font to make the signs look more professional.

The only problem with vectors is that we don't have all the time in the
world to test every freeware vector graphic program out there, so if
someone suggests *one* (and only one) free vector graphics program that
does what everyone says it does, then I'll try it out.

Meanwhile, I have to actually make these signs so the next step of tiling
turned out to be extremely easy once I got the hang of the Rasterbator
program and the need to know the 1.4 (by width) or 1.6 (by length) ratio.

The step I'm on now is how to make the spray-paint template so any advice
on what materials to use will be helpful, as we found out the hard way that
the small text was just too small to be cut out easily.

Though it's not
actually necessary to enlarge an image like
this. Programs like IrfanView can resize his
1200x1800 during printing. And using a raster
image makes it easy to slice it up into pieces.

If you haven't tried Rasterbator, you really should. It's very easy.

In fact, you can't say Irfanview is better until you try Rasterbator since
I have tried both and while I really love Irfanview, and while I'm sure I
can figure how to do it with Irfanview after hours of experiments,
Rasterbator worked the first time and it works even better if you know just
two things:
1) Use 1.4 and tile by width (or use 1.6 and tile by length)
2) Use a dot size around 1mm (whatever that dot size means to Rasterbator)

I mentioned a minimum 300 dpi as the minimum
one would want to print for a photo. That was
only an example. I'm afraid I may not have explained
it as clearly as I might have. It gets very confusing
translating between pixels and printers.

It's an old black and white laser printer, about 10 years or so old.
Do I really have control over the printing dots per inch?
Or is control over the DPI just theoretical?

And it
doesn't help that images and graphic editors often
display a dpi resolution for images, which has
nothing to do with anything.

When you mentioned the DPI, it confused me because it didn't have any
effect on the output so I gave up on even looking at the DPI.

Right now, we're past the creation stage and past the tiling stage.

The task now is creating spray-painting templates with standard home tools.
Any suggestions?

- Eco Clean wrote:

Rasterbator worked the first time and it works even better if you know just
two things:
1) Use 1.4 and tile by width (or use 1.6 and tile by length)
2) Use a dot size around 1mm (whatever that dot size means to Rasterbator)

Actually you need to know 3 things to use Rasterbator well.
1) Use 1.4 and tile by width (or use 1.6 and tile by length)
2) Use a dot size around 1mm (whatever that dot size means to Rasterbator)
3) Set the color and then press multi-color (this prints best it seems)

Here is a screen shot of the PDF that results from Rasterbator freeware.
[http://www.fileconvoy.com/dfl.php?id...3aae4f0 1ba9]

If you haven't tried Rasterbator yet, you won't know how easy it turned out
to be to tile any image on Windows up to any poster size (as long as you
calculate the expansion ratio ahead of time).

So the creation and tiling is now a fait accompli (although I'll still test
out a good vector based Windows program that is free and has alignment and
hole marks if someone suggests one).

If anyone can suggest a single free Windows vector program that does what
everyone says it does, I will test that suggestion and report back - so
just name the one free vector based program everyone thinks will work.

Meanwhile...

What's left is how to create a decent spray-paint template on plastic.
Any ideas using home equipment on how to do that?

- Big Al wrote:

My wife worked in a school and the teachers had clear sheets for the
xerox printer they could put stuff on for overhead projectors. Mind you
it was the 80's. But Office Depot etc (US). Not sure if they exist
now since projectors now are made to hook directly to the PC, no need
for those clear sheets now.

I remember those clear plastic 8.5x11 "transparencies" which we used to
print on a printer, so they should work.

I think I'll pick up a box of them at Office Max or Staples, if the heat of
the laser printer won't melt them and if they're not too stiff for the
bending that goes on inside a small home 10-year-old or so laser printer.

[https://www.staples.com/apollo-plain...roduct_829911]
[https://www.officemax.co.nz/Office-P...f-100-1219839]

If I can print directly to those transparencies, that eliminates the step
of printing to paper and transferring the results to those transparencies.

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 09:23:31 -0800, Eco Clean
wrote:


Everyone has PowerPoint,




An *enormous* exaggeration.

- Susan Bugher wrote:

I misunderstood the type of sign you wanted to print. I'll add a couple
more suggestions to your post about Rasterbator.

Thanks.

Based on all the helpful suggestions, and keeping in mind that it has to be
done with stuff that we already have (or with Windows freeware), here's
what I'm planning at the moment.

1) I'll test one vector-based freeware Windows sign-making program if
someone suggests one, but if not, the PowerPoint works just fine, where I
save the PowerPoint slides to any image format.

2) I use Rasterbator with a 1.4 ratio to width, with 1mm dot size (whatever
that means because no dots are anywhere that big) to create a PDF of 4
pages, each of which is "tiled" perfectly (no overlap whatsoever) with the
unprintable 1/4 inch taken care of with a thin outside alignment border
perfectly placed there by Rasterbator.

3) I print the 4-page PDF to 8.5x11 plastic transparency sheets in the old
B&W laser printer (if that works) and I cut along the Rasterbator alignment
border and tape it together (there is zero overlap in the printing though).

4) With an X-acto knife, I cut out the letters and tape the template to a
sign for spray painting.

Any suggestions for the type of paint and for how to prevent bleeding?