Network broken in Win10 again?

On 14/01/2018 05:01:45, Zaghadka wrote:
On Sat, 13 Jan 2018 14:42:17 -0500, in alt.comp.os.windows-10, EGK wrote:
Networking has always seemed like voodoo on Windows. Is there another
issue lately with build 1703 and 1709 where computers just disappear from
the network? I can still access them if I map the computers but they
simply disappear from the Network. I have three computers, all running
build 1709. I've reset the networking on all of them, rebooted one at a
time and get them to work. Then after a reboot or two, they're gone again.

I had this issue a couple of years ago with Windows 10 and looked high and
low for a fix. There are lots and lots of forums and posts online about
this issue but no one seems to have a sure-fire fix for it. It this
something Microsoft broke yet again?

If you don't use Homegroups, try disabling the HomeGroup Provider
service. The only hang-up with that is you will also have to set the
Function Discovery Resource Publication service to "automatic," because
normally the HomeGroup service triggers it, and that is how computers
advertise themselves on the network. So HomeGroups disabled, FDRP on
automatic start.

If you still get a computer that's missing, restart the Function
Discovery Resource Publication service on the missing machine and it will
usually show up.

But I have found that HomeGroup totally screws up regular SMB shares,
even when you don't have a HomeGroup. Personally, I had computers not
showing on the network until I disabled it. I had a person over at
10Forums who could not see his NAS, but he disabled HomeGroup Provider at
my recommendation and all of the sudden it showed up.

Essentially, whatever the HomeGroup Provider service is doing screws up
network discovery for LANManager/SAMBA shares, and it's best just to
disable the thing if you don't use it. Microsoft turns it back on with
every major version change, though, so you have to keep disabling it
after a "Feature Update" (e.g.: 1703 to 1709).

I hope this helps you too.

Brilliant, thanks a lot. :-)

--
mick

On 14/01/2018 17:21:06, EGK wrote:
On Sat, 13 Jan 2018 23:01:45 -0600, Zaghadka wrote:

On Sat, 13 Jan 2018 14:42:17 -0500, in alt.comp.os.windows-10, EGK wrote:
Networking has always seemed like voodoo on Windows. Is there another
issue lately with build 1703 and 1709 where computers just disappear from
the network? I can still access them if I map the computers but they
simply disappear from the Network. I have three computers, all running
build 1709. I've reset the networking on all of them, rebooted one at a
time and get them to work. Then after a reboot or two, they're gone again.

I had this issue a couple of years ago with Windows 10 and looked high and
low for a fix. There are lots and lots of forums and posts online about
this issue but no one seems to have a sure-fire fix for it. It this
something Microsoft broke yet again?

If you don't use Homegroups, try disabling the HomeGroup Provider
service. The only hang-up with that is you will also have to set the
Function Discovery Resource Publication service to "automatic," because
normally the HomeGroup service triggers it, and that is how computers
advertise themselves on the network. So HomeGroups disabled, FDRP on
automatic start.

If you still get a computer that's missing, restart the Function
Discovery Resource Publication service on the missing machine and it will
usually show up.

But I have found that HomeGroup totally screws up regular SMB shares,
even when you don't have a HomeGroup. Personally, I had computers not
showing on the network until I disabled it. I had a person over at
10Forums who could not see his NAS, but he disabled HomeGroup Provider at
my recommendation and all of the sudden it showed up.

Essentially, whatever the HomeGroup Provider service is doing screws up
network discovery for LANManager/SAMBA shares, and it's best just to
disable the thing if you don't use it. Microsoft turns it back on with
every major version change, though, so you have to keep disabling it
after a "Feature Update" (e.g.: 1703 to 1709).

I hope this helps you too.

YOU have just won the internet for today.

Thanks very much. I tried this when I had a few minutes and it worked
great. All PC's are now showing on the net, Homegroup is disabled and File
and printer sharing is all working.

Just to be certain though, you only mention homegroup Provider service and
FDRP.

I set both Function Discovery Provider Host and Function Provider Resource
Publication to automatic. Was that necessary or any reason not to set both
to auto?

I then disabled both Homegroup Listener and Homegroup Provider. Again, was
it necessary to disable both or does it even matter?

I'll save this post now and hopefully save myself some grief the next time
Microsoft upgrades to make things "better" for us.

Personally, i've never understood the point of Homegroups at all when using
workgroups seems much easier and works more reliably. I assume there's
security reasons behind it but I really dont know.

I've done what you have done.
All working here again. :-)

--
mick

KenW wrote:
Ever think of using a Work Group ? Never had as problem with it. I
have no reason to network now.

Yes. That is exactly what I am using. Workgroup should be listed under
Network. Also have a Linux Master Browser as WINS server. Used to work
for years.

--
Take care,

Jonathan
-------------------
LITTLE WORKS STUDIO
http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 11:49:05 -0500, EGK wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 09:39:53 -0700, KenW
wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 11:34:39 -0500, "Jonathan N. Little"
wrote:

Peter Johnson wrote:
On Sat, 13 Jan 2018 14:42:17 -0500, EGK wrote:

Networking has always seemed like voodoo on Windows. Is there another
issue lately with build 1703 and 1709 where computers just disappear from
the network? I can still access them if I map the computers but they
simply disappear from the Network. I have three computers, all running
build 1709. I've reset the networking on all of them, rebooted one at a
time and get them to work. Then after a reboot or two, they're gone again.

I had this issue a couple of years ago with Windows 10 and looked high and
low for a fix. There are lots and lots of forums and posts online about
this issue but no one seems to have a sure-fire fix for it. It this
something Microsoft broke yet again?


I had this issue, or something similar, and the answer given in this
link worked for me:
https://social.technet.microsoft.com...tpronetworking


I do not use Homegroup. This is my last and only Windows system left so
I tried the above. Made no difference. Still no other systems listed in
Network. I think it may be more the disabling SMBv1 protocol the cause.

Ever think of using a Work Group ? Never had as problem with it. I
have no reason to network now.

My 3 PC's are all connected via workgroup and homegroup. They still don't
appear in the network. I can see them in homegroup but it often takes a
long time to connect to the shares with multiple tries saying "not
available". Then suddenly it will work.

Like I said, Windows networking has always been like voodoo. You just
recite a chant and pray.

You can simplify your networking life greatly by forgetting about being
able to "see" the various computers on your LAN. Forget about Workgroups
and Homegroups, too. You don't need any of that. I've really never
understood why people get hung up on being able to "see" a computer that
they want to access.

Each computer has a unique IP address. Make a list of the various
computers and the IP address of each.

Next, create a shortcut to each of them. The Target of the shortcut will
be "\\1.2.3.4", where you'll replace 1.2.3.4 with the IP address of the
other PC. The Name of your shortcut should be something descriptive so
you know which computer you're accessing.

When you double click the shortcut, an Explorer window opens that
displays all of the shared folders on the other computer. If no folders
are shared, the window will be empty. If you don't have the right
credentials, you'll be prompted to enter credentials. You can elect to
save them, but it's easier to create a common set of credentials on each
PC that you use for this purpose. It doesn't have to be the user account
that you actually use.

That's the basics. It takes a couple of minutes to set up, but after
that it just works, and it survives software updates/upgrades. It
doesn't care about Workgroups, Homegroups, LLDP, or any of the other
protocols that let you "see" your computers.

If basic access seems too basic, access each computer by name by adding
entries to your hosts file, but I consider that to be excessive. IP
addressing has been 100% solid since the Win 3.1 days.

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 17:56:03 GMT, mick wrote:

On 14/01/2018 17:21:06, EGK wrote:
On Sat, 13 Jan 2018 23:01:45 -0600, Zaghadka wrote:

On Sat, 13 Jan 2018 14:42:17 -0500, in alt.comp.os.windows-10, EGK wrote:
Networking has always seemed like voodoo on Windows. Is there another
issue lately with build 1703 and 1709 where computers just disappear from
the network? I can still access them if I map the computers but they
simply disappear from the Network. I have three computers, all running
build 1709. I've reset the networking on all of them, rebooted one at a
time and get them to work. Then after a reboot or two, they're gone again.

I had this issue a couple of years ago with Windows 10 and looked high and
low for a fix. There are lots and lots of forums and posts online about
this issue but no one seems to have a sure-fire fix for it. It this
something Microsoft broke yet again?

If you don't use Homegroups, try disabling the HomeGroup Provider
service. The only hang-up with that is you will also have to set the
Function Discovery Resource Publication service to "automatic," because
normally the HomeGroup service triggers it, and that is how computers
advertise themselves on the network. So HomeGroups disabled, FDRP on
automatic start.

If you still get a computer that's missing, restart the Function
Discovery Resource Publication service on the missing machine and it will
usually show up.

But I have found that HomeGroup totally screws up regular SMB shares,
even when you don't have a HomeGroup. Personally, I had computers not
showing on the network until I disabled it. I had a person over at
10Forums who could not see his NAS, but he disabled HomeGroup Provider at
my recommendation and all of the sudden it showed up.

Essentially, whatever the HomeGroup Provider service is doing screws up
network discovery for LANManager/SAMBA shares, and it's best just to
disable the thing if you don't use it. Microsoft turns it back on with
every major version change, though, so you have to keep disabling it
after a "Feature Update" (e.g.: 1703 to 1709).

I hope this helps you too.

YOU have just won the internet for today.

Thanks very much. I tried this when I had a few minutes and it worked
great. All PC's are now showing on the net, Homegroup is disabled and File
and printer sharing is all working.

Just to be certain though, you only mention homegroup Provider service and
FDRP.

I set both Function Discovery Provider Host and Function Provider Resource
Publication to automatic. Was that necessary or any reason not to set both
to auto?

I then disabled both Homegroup Listener and Homegroup Provider. Again, was
it necessary to disable both or does it even matter?

I'll save this post now and hopefully save myself some grief the next time
Microsoft upgrades to make things "better" for us.

Personally, i've never understood the point of Homegroups at all when using
workgroups seems much easier and works more reliably. I assume there's
security reasons behind it but I really dont know.

I've done what you have done.
All working here again. :-)

Now if we could figure out a way to keep homegroup disabled instead of
waiting for the next Windows update to break it again. lol

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 13:08:52 -0500, EGK wrote:

Now if we could figure out a way to keep homegroup disabled instead of
waiting for the next Windows update to break it again. lol

Or just ignore it completely, since it's not needed for networking. ;-)

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 12:08:34 -0600, Char Jackson wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 11:49:05 -0500, EGK wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 09:39:53 -0700, KenW
wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 11:34:39 -0500, "Jonathan N. Little"
wrote:

Peter Johnson wrote:
On Sat, 13 Jan 2018 14:42:17 -0500, EGK wrote:

Networking has always seemed like voodoo on Windows. Is there another
issue lately with build 1703 and 1709 where computers just disappear from
the network? I can still access them if I map the computers but they
simply disappear from the Network. I have three computers, all running
build 1709. I've reset the networking on all of them, rebooted one at a
time and get them to work. Then after a reboot or two, they're gone again.

I had this issue a couple of years ago with Windows 10 and looked high and
low for a fix. There are lots and lots of forums and posts online about
this issue but no one seems to have a sure-fire fix for it. It this
something Microsoft broke yet again?


I had this issue, or something similar, and the answer given in this
link worked for me:
https://social.technet.microsoft.com...tpronetworking


I do not use Homegroup. This is my last and only Windows system left so
I tried the above. Made no difference. Still no other systems listed in
Network. I think it may be more the disabling SMBv1 protocol the cause.

Ever think of using a Work Group ? Never had as problem with it. I
have no reason to network now.

My 3 PC's are all connected via workgroup and homegroup. They still don't
appear in the network. I can see them in homegroup but it often takes a
long time to connect to the shares with multiple tries saying "not
available". Then suddenly it will work.

Like I said, Windows networking has always been like voodoo. You just
recite a chant and pray.

You can simplify your networking life greatly by forgetting about being
able to "see" the various computers on your LAN. Forget about Workgroups
and Homegroups, too. You don't need any of that. I've really never
understood why people get hung up on being able to "see" a computer that
they want to access.

Each computer has a unique IP address. Make a list of the various
computers and the IP address of each.

Next, create a shortcut to each of them. The Target of the shortcut will
be "\\1.2.3.4", where you'll replace 1.2.3.4 with the IP address of the
other PC. The Name of your shortcut should be something descriptive so
you know which computer you're accessing.

When you double click the shortcut, an Explorer window opens that
displays all of the shared folders on the other computer. If no folders
are shared, the window will be empty. If you don't have the right
credentials, you'll be prompted to enter credentials. You can elect to
save them, but it's easier to create a common set of credentials on each
PC that you use for this purpose. It doesn't have to be the user account
that you actually use.

That's the basics. It takes a couple of minutes to set up, but after
that it just works, and it survives software updates/upgrades. It
doesn't care about Workgroups, Homegroups, LLDP, or any of the other
protocols that let you "see" your computers.

If basic access seems too basic, access each computer by name by adding
entries to your hosts file, but I consider that to be excessive. IP
addressing has been 100% solid since the Win 3.1 days.

In my case not being able to "see" the computers was leading to other
problems as well. I do map shared folders on the other PCs or creating
shortcuts to them.

The problem was with network discovery not working reliably it was often
taking File Explorer a long time and many instances of "this computer is not
available" before the mapped drive actually let me in. If a computer I was
trying to access was turned off, using the shortcut would often lock up and
crash the file Explorer on my main computer. It was becoming a major pain
in the ass.

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 12:14:49 -0600, Char Jackson wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 13:08:52 -0500, EGK wrote:

Now if we could figure out a way to keep homegroup disabled instead of
waiting for the next Windows update to break it again. lol

Or just ignore it completely, since it's not needed for networking. ;-)

Did you read Zaghadka's post ? He was saying he believes that the homegroup
services are what's causing the problem with network discovery in the first
place. Even if you ignore Homegroup entirely, the services are still
running. If updates turn the services back on, it may cause the same
problem again.

I'm not a networking wizard by a long shot. All I know is his advice is
the first thing I've seen that actually fixed my issues.

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 13:17:47 -0500, EGK wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 12:08:34 -0600, Char Jackson wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 11:49:05 -0500, EGK wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 09:39:53 -0700, KenW
wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 11:34:39 -0500, "Jonathan N. Little"
wrote:

Peter Johnson wrote:
On Sat, 13 Jan 2018 14:42:17 -0500, EGK wrote:

Networking has always seemed like voodoo on Windows. Is there another
issue lately with build 1703 and 1709 where computers just disappear from
the network? I can still access them if I map the computers but they
simply disappear from the Network. I have three computers, all running
build 1709. I've reset the networking on all of them, rebooted one at a
time and get them to work. Then after a reboot or two, they're gone again.

I had this issue a couple of years ago with Windows 10 and looked high and
low for a fix. There are lots and lots of forums and posts online about
this issue but no one seems to have a sure-fire fix for it. It this
something Microsoft broke yet again?


I had this issue, or something similar, and the answer given in this
link worked for me:
https://social.technet.microsoft.com...tpronetworking


I do not use Homegroup. This is my last and only Windows system left so
I tried the above. Made no difference. Still no other systems listed in
Network. I think it may be more the disabling SMBv1 protocol the cause.

Ever think of using a Work Group ? Never had as problem with it. I
have no reason to network now.

My 3 PC's are all connected via workgroup and homegroup. They still don't
appear in the network. I can see them in homegroup but it often takes a
long time to connect to the shares with multiple tries saying "not
available". Then suddenly it will work.

Like I said, Windows networking has always been like voodoo. You just
recite a chant and pray.

You can simplify your networking life greatly by forgetting about being
able to "see" the various computers on your LAN. Forget about Workgroups
and Homegroups, too. You don't need any of that. I've really never
understood why people get hung up on being able to "see" a computer that
they want to access.

Each computer has a unique IP address. Make a list of the various
computers and the IP address of each.

Next, create a shortcut to each of them. The Target of the shortcut will
be "\\1.2.3.4", where you'll replace 1.2.3.4 with the IP address of the
other PC. The Name of your shortcut should be something descriptive so
you know which computer you're accessing.

When you double click the shortcut, an Explorer window opens that
displays all of the shared folders on the other computer. If no folders
are shared, the window will be empty. If you don't have the right
credentials, you'll be prompted to enter credentials. You can elect to
save them, but it's easier to create a common set of credentials on each
PC that you use for this purpose. It doesn't have to be the user account
that you actually use.

That's the basics. It takes a couple of minutes to set up, but after
that it just works, and it survives software updates/upgrades. It
doesn't care about Workgroups, Homegroups, LLDP, or any of the other
protocols that let you "see" your computers.

If basic access seems too basic, access each computer by name by adding
entries to your hosts file, but I consider that to be excessive. IP
addressing has been 100% solid since the Win 3.1 days.

In my case not being able to "see" the computers was leading to other
problems as well. I do map shared folders on the other PCs or creating
shortcuts to them.

The problem was with network discovery not working reliably it was often
taking File Explorer a long time and many instances of "this computer is not
available" before the mapped drive actually let me in. If a computer I was
trying to access was turned off, using the shortcut would often lock up and
crash the file Explorer on my main computer. It was becoming a major pain
in the ass.

I've had zero problems with networking multiple PCs since about 1991. I
completely ignore the whole concept of network discovery, Workgroups,
Homegroups, and all of that. It simply isn't required. If I try to
access a computer that isn't available, the request times out. Nothing
crashes or locks up.

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 12:25:13 -0600, Char Jackson wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 13:17:47 -0500, EGK wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 12:08:34 -0600, Char Jackson wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 11:49:05 -0500, EGK wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 09:39:53 -0700, KenW
wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 11:34:39 -0500, "Jonathan N. Little"
wrote:

Peter Johnson wrote:
On Sat, 13 Jan 2018 14:42:17 -0500, EGK wrote:

Networking has always seemed like voodoo on Windows. Is there another
issue lately with build 1703 and 1709 where computers just disappear from
the network? I can still access them if I map the computers but they
simply disappear from the Network. I have three computers, all running
build 1709. I've reset the networking on all of them, rebooted one at a
time and get them to work. Then after a reboot or two, they're gone again.

I had this issue a couple of years ago with Windows 10 and looked high and
low for a fix. There are lots and lots of forums and posts online about
this issue but no one seems to have a sure-fire fix for it. It this
something Microsoft broke yet again?


I had this issue, or something similar, and the answer given in this
link worked for me:
https://social.technet.microsoft.com...tpronetworking


I do not use Homegroup. This is my last and only Windows system left so
I tried the above. Made no difference. Still no other systems listed in
Network. I think it may be more the disabling SMBv1 protocol the cause.

Ever think of using a Work Group ? Never had as problem with it. I
have no reason to network now.

My 3 PC's are all connected via workgroup and homegroup. They still don't
appear in the network. I can see them in homegroup but it often takes a
long time to connect to the shares with multiple tries saying "not
available". Then suddenly it will work.

Like I said, Windows networking has always been like voodoo. You just
recite a chant and pray.

You can simplify your networking life greatly by forgetting about being
able to "see" the various computers on your LAN. Forget about Workgroups
and Homegroups, too. You don't need any of that. I've really never
understood why people get hung up on being able to "see" a computer that
they want to access.

Each computer has a unique IP address. Make a list of the various
computers and the IP address of each.

Next, create a shortcut to each of them. The Target of the shortcut will
be "\\1.2.3.4", where you'll replace 1.2.3.4 with the IP address of the
other PC. The Name of your shortcut should be something descriptive so
you know which computer you're accessing.

When you double click the shortcut, an Explorer window opens that
displays all of the shared folders on the other computer. If no folders
are shared, the window will be empty. If you don't have the right
credentials, you'll be prompted to enter credentials. You can elect to
save them, but it's easier to create a common set of credentials on each
PC that you use for this purpose. It doesn't have to be the user account
that you actually use.

That's the basics. It takes a couple of minutes to set up, but after
that it just works, and it survives software updates/upgrades. It
doesn't care about Workgroups, Homegroups, LLDP, or any of the other
protocols that let you "see" your computers.

If basic access seems too basic, access each computer by name by adding
entries to your hosts file, but I consider that to be excessive. IP
addressing has been 100% solid since the Win 3.1 days.

In my case not being able to "see" the computers was leading to other
problems as well. I do map shared folders on the other PCs or creating
shortcuts to them.

The problem was with network discovery not working reliably it was often
taking File Explorer a long time and many instances of "this computer is not
available" before the mapped drive actually let me in. If a computer I was
trying to access was turned off, using the shortcut would often lock up and
crash the file Explorer on my main computer. It was becoming a major pain
in the ass.

I've had zero problems with networking multiple PCs since about 1991. I
completely ignore the whole concept of network discovery, Workgroups,
Homegroups, and all of that. It simply isn't required. If I try to
access a computer that isn't available, the request times out. Nothing
crashes or locks up.

Did you leave out out a step?. To do what you're doing, don't you need to
set up all your devices with a static IP in your router or set each computer
individually with a static IP? Otherwise devices can "steal" the IP and
invalidate the shortcuts. I may try that in the future.

Char Jackson wrote:
On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 13:08:52 -0500, EGK wrote:

Now if we could figure out a way to keep homegroup disabled instead of
waiting for the next Windows update to break it again. lol

Or just ignore it completely, since it's not needed for networking. ;-)


I think the reference was, that when updates come in, they
put the HomeGroup services back online, screwing up the
fix used in this thread.

Ignoring it won't help, unless the Services can be stopped
from showing up. I expect when the OS is Upgraded, would be
a perfect time to put all the HomeGroup services back.

For example, you could rename the executable used by each
service, but I would think an OS Upgrade would put them
back again.

I saw some comment, where it was mentioned Homegroups were
going out the door anyway ? Maybe at some point, they'll
stop switching it on themselves.

Paul

KenW wrote:
On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 11:49:05 -0500, EGK wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 09:39:53 -0700, KenW
wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 11:34:39 -0500, "Jonathan N. Little"
wrote:

Peter Johnson wrote:
On Sat, 13 Jan 2018 14:42:17 -0500, EGK wrote:

Networking has always seemed like voodoo on Windows. Is there another
issue lately with build 1703 and 1709 where computers just disappear from
the network? I can still access them if I map the computers but they
simply disappear from the Network. I have three computers, all running
build 1709. I've reset the networking on all of them, rebooted one at a
time and get them to work. Then after a reboot or two, they're gone again.

I had this issue a couple of years ago with Windows 10 and looked high and
low for a fix. There are lots and lots of forums and posts online about
this issue but no one seems to have a sure-fire fix for it. It this
something Microsoft broke yet again?

I had this issue, or something similar, and the answer given in this
link worked for me:
https://social.technet.microsoft.com...tpronetworking

I do not use Homegroup. This is my last and only Windows system left so
I tried the above. Made no difference. Still no other systems listed in
Network. I think it may be more the disabling SMBv1 protocol the cause.
Ever think of using a Work Group ? Never had as problem with it. I
have no reason to network now.
My 3 PC's are all connected via workgroup and homegroup. They still don't
appear in the network. I can see them in homegroup but it often takes a
long time to connect to the shares with multiple tries saying "not
available". Then suddenly it will work.

Like I said, Windows networking has always been like voodoo. You just
recite a chant and pray.

Both at the same time. I think that would confuse both.


KenW

There was at least one article on the web, claiming
they could both co-exist. Doesn't look like it today...

Paul

On 14/01/2018 18:08:52, EGK wrote:
On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 17:56:03 GMT, mick wrote:

On 14/01/2018 17:21:06, EGK wrote:
On Sat, 13 Jan 2018 23:01:45 -0600, Zaghadka wrote:

On Sat, 13 Jan 2018 14:42:17 -0500, in alt.comp.os.windows-10, EGK wrote:
Networking has always seemed like voodoo on Windows. Is there another
issue lately with build 1703 and 1709 where computers just disappear from
the network? I can still access them if I map the computers but they
simply disappear from the Network. I have three computers, all running
build 1709. I've reset the networking on all of them, rebooted one at a
time and get them to work. Then after a reboot or two, they're gone
again.

I had this issue a couple of years ago with Windows 10 and looked high
and low for a fix. There are lots and lots of forums and posts online
about this issue but no one seems to have a sure-fire fix for it. It
this something Microsoft broke yet again?

If you don't use Homegroups, try disabling the HomeGroup Provider
service. The only hang-up with that is you will also have to set the
Function Discovery Resource Publication service to "automatic," because
normally the HomeGroup service triggers it, and that is how computers
advertise themselves on the network. So HomeGroups disabled, FDRP on
automatic start.

If you still get a computer that's missing, restart the Function
Discovery Resource Publication service on the missing machine and it will
usually show up.

But I have found that HomeGroup totally screws up regular SMB shares,
even when you don't have a HomeGroup. Personally, I had computers not
showing on the network until I disabled it. I had a person over at
10Forums who could not see his NAS, but he disabled HomeGroup Provider at
my recommendation and all of the sudden it showed up.

Essentially, whatever the HomeGroup Provider service is doing screws up
network discovery for LANManager/SAMBA shares, and it's best just to
disable the thing if you don't use it. Microsoft turns it back on with
every major version change, though, so you have to keep disabling it
after a "Feature Update" (e.g.: 1703 to 1709).

I hope this helps you too.

YOU have just won the internet for today.

Thanks very much. I tried this when I had a few minutes and it worked
great. All PC's are now showing on the net, Homegroup is disabled and File
and printer sharing is all working.

Just to be certain though, you only mention homegroup Provider service and
FDRP.

I set both Function Discovery Provider Host and Function Provider Resource
Publication to automatic. Was that necessary or any reason not to set
both to auto?

I then disabled both Homegroup Listener and Homegroup Provider. Again, was
it necessary to disable both or does it even matter?

I'll save this post now and hopefully save myself some grief the next time
Microsoft upgrades to make things "better" for us.

Personally, i've never understood the point of Homegroups at all when using
workgroups seems much easier and works more reliably. I assume there's
security reasons behind it but I really dont know.

I've done what you have done.
All working here again. :-)

Now if we could figure out a way to keep homegroup disabled instead of
waiting for the next Windows update to break it again. lol

The annoying thing is that it only broke today, ten days after the
lastest update. It only effected 2 out of 4 computers connected by
ethernet to the network. All are desktops running win10 and all of
them are near identical in specs, hardware and software. They had all
been switched off and rebooted several times since that update so it is
a mystery why it should happen so long after.
I had spent about six hours trawling through the internet finding and
trying different fixes until Zaghadka came to the rescue.

--
mick

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 13:21:21 -0500, EGK wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 12:14:49 -0600, Char Jackson wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 13:08:52 -0500, EGK wrote:

Now if we could figure out a way to keep homegroup disabled instead of
waiting for the next Windows update to break it again. lol

Or just ignore it completely, since it's not needed for networking. ;-)

Did you read Zaghadka's post ? He was saying he believes that the homegroup
services are what's causing the problem with network discovery in the first
place. Even if you ignore Homegroup entirely, the services are still
running. If updates turn the services back on, it may cause the same
problem again.

I'm not a networking wizard by a long shot. All I know is his advice is
the first thing I've seen that actually fixed my issues.

Yes, I saw that post and what I'm saying is that you actually don't need
to worry about network discovery or what a future update might do.

That's fine, though. If your way is working and you're happy, that's all
that matters.

On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 14:02:48 -0500, Paul wrote:

Char Jackson wrote:
On Sun, 14 Jan 2018 13:08:52 -0500, EGK wrote:

Now if we could figure out a way to keep homegroup disabled instead of
waiting for the next Windows update to break it again. lol

Or just ignore it completely, since it's not needed for networking. ;-)


I think the reference was, that when updates come in, they
put the HomeGroup services back online, screwing up the
fix used in this thread.

Yes, I know. That's why I said they could just ignore that 'fix', just
as they can ignore Workgroups, Homegroups, network discovery, and all of
that. Networking for the purpose of sharing folders and printers, etc.,
doesn't rely on any of that so it doesn't matter if it's configured
correctly or incorrectly, whether it's enabled or not, what a future
update might do, etc. When you access a remote PC by its IP address,
none of that other crap matters.

Ignoring it won't help, snip

Since you don't need it in order to network multiple PCs, ignoring it is
a fine approach unless you insist on having a visual display of the LAN.
I've never seen the value in that, once you get beyond curiosity.