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#31
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Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10
On Thu, 30 Oct 2014 11:03:45 -0700, "Gene E. Bloch"
wrote: Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows? No, that's because most people effectively have no choice. They would if only they realised how easy it was to build a PC yourself, or shop online for something different, but most wouldn't even consider it, so they go to a computer shop to buy something ready built. Unless you want to pay Apple prices Windows is all there is. Rod. For you and me it's easy. I've built four machines. The last one was basically bolt in place and plug'n'play. But even assembling Ikea furniture is too difficult for most people. I'm not so sure that assembling Ikea furniture is easier than building a computer. I'd almost reverse your sentence above :-) I've done both successfully and never failed at either, so that's based on my own experience. Funny you should say that. I'm using a home built computer while sitting at an Ikea table. Even the chair I'm sitting on was supplied in pieces and had to be assembled. Nothing bad has happened to any of it yet, so I must have got most of it right. Rod. |
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#32
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Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10
On Thu, 30 Oct 2014 21:43:47 +0000, Roderick Stewart wrote:
On Thu, 30 Oct 2014 11:03:45 -0700, "Gene E. Bloch" wrote: Is that why about 94% of the world uses Windows? No, that's because most people effectively have no choice. They would if only they realised how easy it was to build a PC yourself, or shop online for something different, but most wouldn't even consider it, so they go to a computer shop to buy something ready built. Unless you want to pay Apple prices Windows is all there is. Rod. For you and me it's easy. I've built four machines. The last one was basically bolt in place and plug'n'play. But even assembling Ikea furniture is too difficult for most people. I'm not so sure that assembling Ikea furniture is easier than building a computer. I'd almost reverse your sentence above :-) I've done both successfully and never failed at either, so that's based on my own experience. Funny you should say that. I'm using a home built computer while sitting at an Ikea table. Even the chair I'm sitting on was supplied in pieces and had to be assembled. Nothing bad has happened to any of it yet, so I must have got most of it right. Rod. Yeah, but which was easier to put together, the computer or the furniture? Just playing - feel free not to answer :-) -- Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch) |
#33
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Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10
On 10/29/14 5:41 PM, Ken Blake, MVP wrote:
On Wed, 29 Oct 2014 15:50:03 -0400, Boolworm Cowboy wrote: snip You go to any computer retail outlet, and you cannot find a preloaded Linux computer available for sale. True, but since it's free to download and install Linux, it hardly matters. It's quick, easy, and free to change from Windows to Linux if Linux is what you want. But it does make a difference. 1. The average computer user doesn't know Linux from the polar ice cap. And since they don't, they'd never even think about installing it. I say "Linux", and they say "What's that?" 2. The average computer user can't even reinstall Windows (or even OS X) much of the time, so whey would they attempt to install something they are unfamiliar with? Even if they do know of/about Linux? 3. The average computer user isn't going do anything about changing without seeing what the other product looks like. Note that none of us here are the average computer user. snip -- Ken Mac OS X 10.8.5 Firefox 25.0 Thunderbird 24.6.0 "My brain is like lightning, a quick flash and it's gone!" |
#34
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Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10
On 2014-10-30 9:09 PM, Ken Springer wrote:
On 10/29/14 5:41 PM, Ken Blake, MVP wrote: On Wed, 29 Oct 2014 15:50:03 -0400, Boolworm Cowboy wrote: snip You go to any computer retail outlet, and you cannot find a preloaded Linux computer available for sale. True, but since it's free to download and install Linux, it hardly matters. It's quick, easy, and free to change from Windows to Linux if Linux is what you want. But it does make a difference. 1. The average computer user doesn't know Linux from the polar ice cap. And since they don't, they'd never even think about installing it. I say "Linux", and they say "What's that?" The only appropriate answer is "a mediocre product based on a collection of messy amateur code." 2. The average computer user can't even reinstall Windows (or even OS X) much of the time, so whey would they attempt to install something they are unfamiliar with? Even if they do know of/about Linux? The only ones who actually would are the more knowledgeable ones who enjoy tinkering with their machine, ****ing it up and eventually reinstalling Windows. 3. The average computer user isn't going do anything about changing without seeing what the other product looks like. Note that none of us here are the average computer user. The reality is that in the Windows 9x era, GNU/Linux had a true chance of stealing Microsoft's thunder by offering a superior, more stable and prettier operating system to replace the much-abhorred 9x series. Instead, they offered something a lot less stable which also happened to be ugly and incredibly inconsistent. Today, GNU/Linux still offers a less stable, ugly and inconsistent product to compete with very stable operating systems like Windows 7 & 8 which might not be everyone's cup of tea as far as looks go but are at least consistent. -- Silver Slimer OpenMedia Supporter www.silverlips.ca Recipient of overwhelmingly positive reviews among the GNU/Linux advocates: - "Low life at its best. But thats what you are. Worth a lot less than stinking contaminated dirt" - Peter Köhlmann - "He's a rotten POS." - Chris Ahlstrom AKA The Pee-Pee Wiper (http://bit.ly/1wg0lkd) - "He's a troll, that's his stock and trade." - RonB - "Slimer is a filthy hater, liar and fraud IMHO." - Marti Van Lin - "We know that it was the "Slimer", the shameless liar who takes pride, apparently, in being a worthless trolling asshole." - chrisv |
#35
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Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10
On 10/29/14 4:27 PM, Silver Slimer wrote:
On 2014-10-29 2:49 PM, Boolworm Cowboy wrote: Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating system blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source. ROFL! Not only is OS X slow and bloated in comparison to Windows 8 but GNU/Linux is generally a joke. You'll find dozens of programs in each category to do any imaginable task but none of them are capable of doing it properly or completely. Getting a computer to sleep & wake is a feature they STILL haven't managed to get working properly on all computers and it's fantastic how you can upgrade a CLEAN installation of Ubuntu from 14.04 to say 14.10 and have the upgrade suddenly disregard all of your settings for no good reason. I love how mine, a few days ago, no longer showed the splash screen at boot-up and made Firefox load 3 times slower after the upgrade. Yeah, Microsoft is running scared of GNU/Linux. OS X only sells because people who are too stupid and/or lazy to learn how to use their computer ends up falling into the trap set by Apple advocates who promise them that OS X is easier to use and "better" without defining "better." You fail to realize and/or acknowledge that all people are not equally capable of understanding computers and operating system, and how they work. I've a friend who continuously struggled with Windows and never did truly understand what she was doing when she used it. When her 3 month old Vista laptop was stolen, I simply told her to fork out the money for a Mac. She figured out things on that Mac faster than I did! LOL "Better" is 100% subjective. Basically, "better" is what works best for the owner/user, not according to someone else who feels/believes differently. They fall in love rather quickly but very also realize just how much of a walled garden the Apple product is. Suddenly, all of the variety of software they had no longer exists and customization is fairly non-existent. Apple essentially allows you to have whatever computer you want so long as it's exactly the one they're selling. The Apple users I see want something different from what Windows generally offers. It's only according to some that it's a bad thing to want and appreciate something different. I take what I like from both worlds. I guess some people can't accept that either. -- Ken Mac OS X 10.8.5 Firefox 25.0 Thunderbird 24.6.0 "My brain is like lightning, a quick flash and it's gone!" |
#36
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Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10
On 2014-10-30 9:45 PM, Ken Springer wrote:
On 10/29/14 4:27 PM, Silver Slimer wrote: On 2014-10-29 2:49 PM, Boolworm Cowboy wrote: Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating system blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source. ROFL! Not only is OS X slow and bloated in comparison to Windows 8 but GNU/Linux is generally a joke. You'll find dozens of programs in each category to do any imaginable task but none of them are capable of doing it properly or completely. Getting a computer to sleep & wake is a feature they STILL haven't managed to get working properly on all computers and it's fantastic how you can upgrade a CLEAN installation of Ubuntu from 14.04 to say 14.10 and have the upgrade suddenly disregard all of your settings for no good reason. I love how mine, a few days ago, no longer showed the splash screen at boot-up and made Firefox load 3 times slower after the upgrade. Yeah, Microsoft is running scared of GNU/Linux. OS X only sells because people who are too stupid and/or lazy to learn how to use their computer ends up falling into the trap set by Apple advocates who promise them that OS X is easier to use and "better" without defining "better." You fail to realize and/or acknowledge that all people are not equally capable of understanding computers and operating system, and how they work. I don't. People obviously don't know and don't WANT to know how their computer works. For those people, Apples are the best product available. However, I would rather know not only how my computer works but also how my car and television works so that I can fix it myself if ever it breaks. Knowledge is not a bad thing... except for Apple users. I've a friend who continuously struggled with Windows and never did truly understand what she was doing when she used it. When her 3 month old Vista laptop was stolen, I simply told her to fork out the money for a Mac. She figured out things on that Mac faster than I did! LOL "Better" is 100% subjective. Basically, "better" is what works best for the owner/user, not according to someone else who feels/believes differently. Agreed. If you're focused on producing and don't want to be distracted by figuring out the operation of the computer, a Mac makes sense. Admittedly. They fall in love rather quickly but very also realize just how much of a walled garden the Apple product is. Suddenly, all of the variety of software they had no longer exists and customization is fairly non-existent. Apple essentially allows you to have whatever computer you want so long as it's exactly the one they're selling. The Apple users I see want something different from what Windows generally offers. It's only according to some that it's a bad thing to want and appreciate something different. I take what I like from both worlds. I guess some people can't accept that either. Oh, I accept it. I appreciate the fact that Apple is constantly pushing the envelope and forcing PC manufacturers to follow suit. After all, I get better technology at a lower price and at a higher quality as a result of that. However, I have no reason to claim anything that isn't entirely true: Apple users simply aren't technically savvy. -- Silver Slimer OpenMedia Supporter www.silverlips.ca Recipient of overwhelmingly positive reviews among the GNU/Linux advocates: - "Low life at its best. But thats what you are. Worth a lot less than stinking contaminated dirt" - Peter Köhlmann - "He's a rotten POS." - Chris Ahlstrom AKA The Pee-Pee Wiper (http://bit.ly/1wg0lkd) - "He's a troll, that's his stock and trade." - RonB - "Slimer is a filthy hater, liar and fraud IMHO." - Marti Van Lin - "We know that it was the "Slimer", the shameless liar who takes pride, apparently, in being a worthless trolling asshole." - chrisv |
#37
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Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10
On 10/30/14 8:02 PM, Silver Slimer wrote:
On 2014-10-30 9:45 PM, Ken Springer wrote: On 10/29/14 4:27 PM, Silver Slimer wrote: On 2014-10-29 2:49 PM, Boolworm Cowboy wrote: Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10 is looking okay so far as Microsoft is concerned. . Unfortunately, Apple's operating system blows Microsoft's out of the water, as does Linux and true open source. ROFL! Not only is OS X slow and bloated in comparison to Windows 8 but GNU/Linux is generally a joke. You'll find dozens of programs in each category to do any imaginable task but none of them are capable of doing it properly or completely. Getting a computer to sleep & wake is a feature they STILL haven't managed to get working properly on all computers and it's fantastic how you can upgrade a CLEAN installation of Ubuntu from 14.04 to say 14.10 and have the upgrade suddenly disregard all of your settings for no good reason. I love how mine, a few days ago, no longer showed the splash screen at boot-up and made Firefox load 3 times slower after the upgrade. Yeah, Microsoft is running scared of GNU/Linux. OS X only sells because people who are too stupid and/or lazy to learn how to use their computer ends up falling into the trap set by Apple advocates who promise them that OS X is easier to use and "better" without defining "better." You fail to realize and/or acknowledge that all people are not equally capable of understanding computers and operating system, and how they work. I don't. People obviously don't know and don't WANT to know how their computer works. For those people, Apples are the best product available. However, I would rather know not only how my computer works but also how my car and television works so that I can fix it myself if ever it breaks. Knowledge is not a bad thing... except for Apple users. And not wanting know also applies to Windows users. And some Apple uses do want to know how they work. I've a friend who continuously struggled with Windows and never did truly understand what she was doing when she used it. When her 3 month old Vista laptop was stolen, I simply told her to fork out the money for a Mac. She figured out things on that Mac faster than I did! LOL "Better" is 100% subjective. Basically, "better" is what works best for the owner/user, not according to someone else who feels/believes differently. Agreed. If you're focused on producing and don't want to be distracted by figuring out the operation of the computer, a Mac makes sense. Admittedly. They fall in love rather quickly but very also realize just how much of a walled garden the Apple product is. Suddenly, all of the variety of software they had no longer exists and customization is fairly non-existent. Apple essentially allows you to have whatever computer you want so long as it's exactly the one they're selling. The Apple users I see want something different from what Windows generally offers. It's only according to some that it's a bad thing to want and appreciate something different. I take what I like from both worlds. I guess some people can't accept that either. Oh, I accept it. I appreciate the fact that Apple is constantly pushing the envelope and forcing PC manufacturers to follow suit. After all, I get better technology at a lower price and at a higher quality as a result of that. However, I have no reason to claim anything that isn't entirely true: Apple users simply aren't technically savvy. Once again, depends on the Apple users. I find most Windows users aren't technically savvy either. Neither situation makes one OS better than another. -- Ken Mac OS X 10.8.5 Firefox 25.0 Thunderbird 24.6.0 "My brain is like lightning, a quick flash and it's gone!" |
#38
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Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10
On Thu, 30 Oct 2014 21:21:00 -0400, Silver Slimer
wrote: 1. The average computer user doesn't know Linux from the polar ice cap. And since they don't, they'd never even think about installing it. I say "Linux", and they say "What's that?" The only appropriate answer is "a mediocre product based on a collection of messy amateur code." If a computer user wants to be able to do the usual ordinary things like browse the web, store their snapshots, send and receive emails, watch YouTube videos, buy things on Amazon and Skype the grandchildren, and a Linux installation enables them to do just that, then in what way is it mediocre? Rod. |
#39
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Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10
On 2014-10-31 5:11 AM, Roderick Stewart wrote:
On Thu, 30 Oct 2014 21:21:00 -0400, Silver Slimer wrote: 1. The average computer user doesn't know Linux from the polar ice cap. And since they don't, they'd never even think about installing it. I say "Linux", and they say "What's that?" The only appropriate answer is "a mediocre product based on a collection of messy amateur code." If a computer user wants to be able to do the usual ordinary things like browse the web, Not a problem so long as Flash is a requirement. GNU/Linux doesn't get a more recent version of Flash than 11.2 unless the user chooses to use Chrome which includes each new release. store their snapshots, Are you referring to photos? Windows and OS X will do a much better job of this as the process is generally automated through the inclusion of OneDrive and iCloud software. Both services also provide a plethora of storage whereas absolutely no GNU/Linux distribution provides cloud access at all. send and receive emails, No problem. GNU/Linux also makes it easier for users to use encryption in their e-mail communications. Evolution in particular is excellent in including GnuPG support. watch YouTube videos, See Flash. buy things on Amazon No problem. and Skype the grandchildren, This is possible so long as Microsoft provides the operating system with Skype itself. The operating system is basically in a position where if Microsoft suddenly decides to upgrade the software and block access to previous versions (as they did with OS X a short while back), that feature is essentially removed. Microsoft has no reason whatsoever to cater to the GNUslims. GNUslims will lead you to believe that it doesn't matter and that GNU/Linux has excellent Skype alternatives in the event of such an action. However, that is a complete lie. Jitsi is ridiculous unstable in every sense of the word and incredibly cumbersome to use despite being "secure" whereas Ekiga, the long referred-to software, has absolutely no users and no clients for Windows and OS X anyway. -- Silver Slimer OpenMedia Supporter www.silverlips.ca Recipient of overwhelmingly positive reviews among the GNU/Linux advocates: - "Low life at its best. But thats what you are. Worth a lot less than stinking contaminated dirt" - Peter Köhlmann - "He's a rotten POS." - Chris Ahlstrom AKA The Pee-Pee Wiper (http://bit.ly/1wg0lkd) - "He's a troll, that's his stock and trade." - RonB - "Slimer is a filthy hater, liar and fraud IMHO." - Marti Van Lin - "We know that it was the "Slimer", the shameless liar who takes pride, apparently, in being a worthless trolling asshole." - chrisv |
#40
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Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10
On 2014-10-31 1:33 PM, Steve wrote:
On Fri, 31 Oct 2014 09:11:17 +0000, Roderick Stewart wrote: On Thu, 30 Oct 2014 21:21:00 -0400, Silver Slimer wrote: 1. The average computer user doesn't know Linux from the polar ice cap. And since they don't, they'd never even think about installing it. I say "Linux", and they say "What's that?" The only appropriate answer is "a mediocre product based on a collection of messy amateur code." If a computer user wants to be able to do the usual ordinary things like browse the web, store their snapshots, send and receive emails, watch YouTube videos, buy things on Amazon and Skype the grandchildren, and a Linux installation enables them to do just that, then in what way is it mediocre? Rod. I see you talk about Linux a lot...I've never seen you use it though. You always seem to be posting using forte agent rather than pan..Why aren't you using Linux? I know you have your reasons..yeah , yeah,yeah We've all got reasons..there are lots of them.One thing I will give this group is that they are very tolerant. If you talk about Windows in a Linux group or even use Windows to post, you get told to bugger off or get called a drooling stooge or something of that nature Absolutely right, see my signature for classic examples of how I've been told off for suggesting that I faced problems in GNU/Linux. I have yet to see people get insulted and bad-mouthed in the Windows groups who didn't totally deserve it. -- Silver Slimer OpenMedia Supporter www.silverlips.ca Recipient of overwhelmingly positive reviews among the GNU/Linux advocates: - "Low life at its best. But thats what you are. Worth a lot less than stinking contaminated dirt" - Peter Köhlmann - "He's a rotten POS." - Chris Ahlstrom AKA The Pee-Pee Wiper (http://bit.ly/1wg0lkd) - "He's a troll, that's his stock and trade." - RonB - "Slimer is a filthy hater, liar and fraud IMHO." - Marti Van Lin - "We know that it was the "Slimer", the shameless liar who takes pride, apparently, in being a worthless trolling asshole." - chrisv |
#41
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Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10
On Fri, 31 Oct 2014 09:11:17 +0000, Roderick Stewart
wrote: On Thu, 30 Oct 2014 21:21:00 -0400, Silver Slimer wrote: 1. The average computer user doesn't know Linux from the polar ice cap. And since they don't, they'd never even think about installing it. I say "Linux", and they say "What's that?" The only appropriate answer is "a mediocre product based on a collection of messy amateur code." If a computer user wants to be able to do the usual ordinary things like browse the web, store their snapshots, send and receive emails, watch YouTube videos, buy things on Amazon and Skype the grandchildren, and a Linux installation enables them to do just that, then in what way is it mediocre? Rod. I see you talk about Linux a lot...I've never seen you use it though. You always seem to be posting using forte agent rather than pan..Why aren't you using Linux? I know you have your reasons..yeah , yeah,yeah We've all got reasons..there are lots of them.One thing I will give this group is that they are very tolerant. If you talk about Windows in a Linux group or even use Windows to post, you get told to bugger off or get called a drooling stooge or something of that nature |
#42
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Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10
On Thu, 30 Oct 2014 19:45:21 -0600, Ken Springer wrote:
I take what I like from both worlds. I guess some people can't accept that either. That's opportunistic! Dreadful. How could you? Of course, what I really think is that it's very sensible. Way better than getting hung up on religious issues. -- Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch) |
#43
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Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10
On Fri, 31 Oct 2014 09:33:27 -0800, Steve
wrote: 1. The average computer user doesn't know Linux from the polar ice cap. And since they don't, they'd never even think about installing it. I say "Linux", and they say "What's that?" The only appropriate answer is "a mediocre product based on a collection of messy amateur code." If a computer user wants to be able to do the usual ordinary things like browse the web, store their snapshots, send and receive emails, watch YouTube videos, buy things on Amazon and Skype the grandchildren, and a Linux installation enables them to do just that, then in what way is it mediocre? Rod. I see you talk about Linux a lot...I've never seen you use it though. You always seem to be posting using forte agent rather than pan..Why aren't you using Linux? I know you have your reasons..yeah , yeah,yeah We've all got reasons..there are lots of them. I suspect you're not really interested in my reasons, so I won't bore you with them, and they're not relevant to the point I was making anyway, which is that for many people Linux would do everything they need, if only they knew. Rod. |
#44
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Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10
On Fri, 31 Oct 2014 22:06:16 +0000, Roderick Stewart
wrote: On Fri, 31 Oct 2014 09:33:27 -0800, Steve wrote: 1. The average computer user doesn't know Linux from the polar ice cap. And since they don't, they'd never even think about installing it. I say "Linux", and they say "What's that?" The only appropriate answer is "a mediocre product based on a collection of messy amateur code." If a computer user wants to be able to do the usual ordinary things like browse the web, store their snapshots, send and receive emails, watch YouTube videos, buy things on Amazon and Skype the grandchildren, and a Linux installation enables them to do just that, then in what way is it mediocre? Rod. I see you talk about Linux a lot...I've never seen you use it though. You always seem to be posting using forte agent rather than pan..Why aren't you using Linux? I know you have your reasons..yeah , yeah,yeah We've all got reasons..there are lots of them. I suspect you're not really interested in my reasons, so I won't bore you with them, and they're not relevant to the point I was making anyway, which is that for many people Linux would do everything they need, if only they knew. Rod. Well I know and I'm using windows..I used redhat..then Fedora...back before there were any live distros. I had ubuntu-mate installed earlier this week. Seems like there is always a deal breaker though. This time it was video to dvd convertion..I know there is devede that produces jumpy videos unless you use deinterlacing..there is bombono ...jumpy too..dvd-styler that is slower than a glacier. It doesn't matter what the reasons are. Running Linux is like taking a fat girl to the prom..and she won't even do your homework right |
#45
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Windows 8 and 8.1 Sucks, but Windows 10
On 2014-10-31 9:09 PM, Steve wrote:
Well I know and I'm using windows..I used redhat..then Fedora...back before there were any live distros. I had ubuntu-mate installed earlier this week. Seems like there is always a deal breaker though. This time it was video to dvd convertion..I know there is devede that produces jumpy videos unless you use deinterlacing..there is bombono ..jumpy too..dvd-styler that is slower than a glacier. It doesn't matter what the reasons are. Running Linux is like taking a fat girl to the prom..and she won't even do your homework right I very much agree with you there. -- Silver Slimer OpenMedia Supporter www.silverlips.ca Recipient of overwhelmingly positive reviews among the GNU/Linux advocates: - "Low life at its best. But thats what you are. Worth a lot less than stinking contaminated dirt" - Peter Köhlmann - "He's a rotten POS." - Chris Ahlstrom AKA The Pee-Pee Wiper (http://bit.ly/1wg0lkd) - "He's a troll, that's his stock and trade." - RonB - "Slimer is a filthy hater, liar and fraud IMHO." - Marti Van Lin - "We know that it was the "Slimer", the shameless liar who takes pride, apparently, in being a worthless trolling asshole." - chrisv |
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