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#31
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Why would I want to pre "register" Windows 10 anyway?
On Tue, 02 Jun 2015 16:51:02 -0400, Paul wrote:
Going from 7 -- 10 on August 1st because "oooh shiny", is not a reason... I agree, but I would make a simple change to that statement: Going from 7 -- 10 because "oooh shiny", is not a reason... The date is really irrelevant, IMHO. |
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#32
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Why would I want to pre "register" Windows 10 anyway?
On 02 Jun 2015, Char Jackson wrote in
alt.comp.os.windows-8: I no longer read Mayayana's posts unless someone quotes them, so thanks for quoting it above. Very interesting read. I have to say that he is spot on in this case, with one minor exception. I don't see MVP's as MS shills, although I admit that it frequently looks that way. It also looks like his position *is* pretty much valid across the board, despite your claims to the contrary. Not all MPVs are shills, not even many of them, but some shills are MVPs. Some of them are here. |
#33
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Why would I want to pre "register" Windows 10 anyway?
| Not all MPVs are shills, not even many of them, but some shills are
| MVPs. Some of them are here. My view exactly. I've been a regular on many of the MS groups for programming, OS, scripting, etc since about 2000. There have been many cordial and generous MVPs in those groups. There have even been some anti-MS MVPs. But there have also been a good number who make it their job to talk up whatever MS is selling. *Those* MVPs are always notable for the lack of intellectual integrity in their arguments. |
#34
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Why would I want to pre "register" Windows 10 anyway?
On Tue, 02 Jun 2015 16:51:02 -0400, Paul wrote:
Ashton Crusher wrote: Seems like it would be better for the average person to wait a month or two and let the early adopter find all the problems. *Especially* if you haven't been testing the Win10 Preview. If you've been testing the Preview, then you know what you're getting for the money. Going from 7 -- 10 on August 1st because "oooh shiny", is not a reason... I had Win 8 for a while and went back to 7, not because of a win8 problem but because of computer changes. But while I had 8 installed, which was for about a month, after the first few days I didn't have any problem with Win8 and actually liked a few things about it better then 7. I did not like the "look and feel" of it however. It's "Windows" compared to the refined look of Win7 "windows", where clunky and ill proportioned. Has Win10 improved aesthetically at all compared to Win8 or do the still use those horrible blocky, no transparency window borders with the ill fitting fonts? |
#35
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Why would I want to pre "register" Windows 10 anyway?
Ashton Crusher wrote:
On Tue, 02 Jun 2015 16:51:02 -0400, Paul wrote: Ashton Crusher wrote: Seems like it would be better for the average person to wait a month or two and let the early adopter find all the problems. *Especially* if you haven't been testing the Win10 Preview. If you've been testing the Preview, then you know what you're getting for the money. Going from 7 -- 10 on August 1st because "oooh shiny", is not a reason... I had Win 8 for a while and went back to 7, not because of a win8 problem but because of computer changes. But while I had 8 installed, which was for about a month, after the first few days I didn't have any problem with Win8 and actually liked a few things about it better then 7. I did not like the "look and feel" of it however. It's "Windows" compared to the refined look of Win7 "windows", where clunky and ill proportioned. Has Win10 improved aesthetically at all compared to Win8 or do the still use those horrible blocky, no transparency window borders with the ill fitting fonts? In the last Win10 Preview, my menu had transparency around the border of the menu. It's possible in 10130, that Microsoft is still experimenting with it. One screen shot (which I can't find now), did have transparency, while two others don't have transparency around the 10130 Windows Menu. The word Aero never seems to come up, so I don't think they're committed to it everywhere. My test machine isn't updated to 10130, so I haven't tested any of it myself. I'm waiting for a slow ring update to show up. I like to separate the download step from the install step. If I need the test machine on short notice, I want it to be available, and not in the middle of something. Which is why I prefer the ISO method, if possible. I get to choose the maintenance window. Paul |
#36
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Why would I want to pre "register" Windows 10 anyway?
On Tue, 02 Jun 2015 21:59:15 -0400, Paul wrote:
My test machine isn't updated to 10130, so I haven't tested any of it myself. I'm waiting for a slow ring update to show up. I like to separate the download step from the install step. If I need the test machine on short notice, I want it to be available, and not in the middle of something. Which is why I prefer the ISO method, if possible. I get to choose the maintenance window. I thought you were a VM kind of guy, so I'm surprised that you don't have at least a few of the builds in VMs. Upgrade one while working in another. |
#37
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Why would I want to pre "register" Windows 10 anyway?
On Tue, 02 Jun 2015 18:31:59 -0400, Nil
wrote: On 02 Jun 2015, Char Jackson wrote in alt.comp.os.windows-8: I no longer read Mayayana's posts unless someone quotes them, so thanks for quoting it above. Very interesting read. I have to say that he is spot on in this case, with one minor exception. I don't see MVP's as MS shills, although I admit that it frequently looks that way. It also looks like his position *is* pretty much valid across the board, despite your claims to the contrary. Not all MPVs are shills, not even many of them, but some shills are MVPs. Some of them are here. Nicely said. :-) |
#38
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Why would I want to pre "register" Windows 10 anyway?
Char Jackson wrote:
I no longer read Mayayana's posts unless someone quotes them, so thanks for quoting it above. Very interesting read. I have to say that he is spot on in this case, with one minor exception. I don't see MVP's as MS shills, although I admit that it frequently looks that way. It also looks like his position *is* pretty much valid across the board, despite your claims to the contrary. My replies are based on the purpose of the 'Get Windows 10' app deployed via KB 3035583. In case you haven't realized - installing or not installing the app has significance regardless of how it is interpreted as value-added, non-value added, marketing-ware, junk-ware, etc. 1. The app includes the replacement for the Upgrade Assistant (i.e. it replaces earlier versions). 2. The only route to obtain a readiness for an existing system (device and applications) is to install the app **and** Reserve Windows 10 3.The app provides the option to 'Cancel' any reservation 4. The app can easily be removed by uninstalling the KB via Programs and Features/View Installed Updates 5. Windows 7 OEM and Full version media *and* OEM Pre-built units will disappear from the marketplace(look for that to happen shortly or immediately after July 29, 2015) - Home is already gone, Pro will soon follow. There is nothing wrong with continued use of Win7 on an existing system, yet it makes sense to install the app and reserve Win10 and perform a readiness status (no matter what one decides to do in the next year). Other reasons. a. Imo, it's bad advice to listen to the proponents suggesting to not install KB 3035583 and not be able to perform that readiness check before making any decision on taking advantage of the free upgrade offer for Win7SP1/8.1. b. There are just too many people running OEM Windows 7 (on capable-ready-for-Window 10) systems without media (no media, never created restore disks, followed advice to remove the OEM recovery partition to gain storage space, don't image o/s, etc.). Upgrading to Windows 10 provides these folks an ability to obtain a retail Windows 10 license and in the future the ability to obtain media (free or a very low nominal cost) for that Win10 license. c. One year goes by fast and the sooner the better to determine the path to follow - stay with Win7, Win10 for free or a much higher penalty at a later time. Separately, two updates were released yesterday (1st Tuesday) https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/2952664 https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/kb/3050265 It would be wise to install the latter (an update to the Windows Update engine). What will I do on my two primary systems recognizing that not everyone is as fortunate or in a similar position. A. Win7 Sp1 - not upgrade even though it surpasses all Win10 requirements and reports zero (0) issues for devices and apps. This i7-4470, Asus Z87, UEFI, 1TB/2TB Sata 6, 16GB Ram unit is only two years old, but I will take advantage of upgrading from the UEFI F8 bootable Win10 Preview on the 2TB drive (either free or clean install when media is available) B. Windows 8.1 Update - will upgrade to 10 on the i3-EFI-1TB Sata3-8GB Ram laptop with zero, 0, readiness issues for devices and app - a no brainer (4 yr old unit was originally Win7Sp1 Home, upgraded $40 to Win8.0 Pro, then free to 8.1 Update, free again to 10. If I get 2 more years out of Win10 for my original laptop price of $359...that's $399 money well spent regardless if it dies or is restored to factory for donation. This was never about being an MVP - it's all about providing information to make a value-added decision. -- ...winston msft mvp consumer apps |
#39
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Why would I want to pre "register" Windows 10 anyway?
Char Jackson wrote:
On Tue, 02 Jun 2015 21:59:15 -0400, Paul wrote: My test machine isn't updated to 10130, so I haven't tested any of it myself. I'm waiting for a slow ring update to show up. I like to separate the download step from the install step. If I need the test machine on short notice, I want it to be available, and not in the middle of something. Which is why I prefer the ISO method, if possible. I get to choose the maintenance window. I thought you were a VM kind of guy, so I'm surprised that you don't have at least a few of the builds in VMs. Upgrade one while working in another. I've been running Win10 Preview on real hardware rather than a VM. Paul |
#40
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Why would I want to pre "register" Windows 10 anyway?
On 2015-06-03 9:13 AM, Wolf K wrote:
On 2015-06-03 5:56 AM, Paul wrote: Char Jackson wrote: On Tue, 02 Jun 2015 21:59:15 -0400, Paul wrote: My test machine isn't updated to 10130, so I haven't tested any of it myself. I'm waiting for a slow ring update to show up. I like to separate the download step from the install step. If I need the test machine on short notice, I want it to be available, and not in the middle of something. Which is why I prefer the ISO method, if possible. I get to choose the maintenance window. I thought you were a VM kind of guy, so I'm surprised that you don't have at least a few of the builds in VMs. Upgrade one while working in another. I've been running Win10 Preview on real hardware rather than a VM. Paul Opinions, please. I'm contemplating "getting Windows 10" per tray icon. Tell yourself that no matter whether Windows 10 ends up being the greatest OS in history or just another one, it'll always be better than Linux. I would take advantage of their offer and upgrade. -- Slimer Encrypt. - "NTFS is just slightly faster than apples HFS. And that is the slowest FS of all. EXT 4 is several times faster than NTFS, and *that* is the reason you dimbulbs now troll against EXT4." - "Like NTFS, which is at best at beta stage right now?" (Peter "the Klöwn" Köhlmann lying shamelessly about NTFS to desperately defend the fact that ext4 has been shown to corrupt data in Linux kernel 4.0.x) |
#41
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Why would I want to pre "register" Windows 10 anyway?
| 2. The only route to obtain a readiness for an existing system (device | and applications) is to install the app **and** Reserve Windows 10 | 3.The app provides the option to 'Cancel' any reservation | 4. The app can easily be removed by uninstalling the KB via Programs and | Features/View Installed Updates So the sleazy adware is required if one wants to get Win10, but it *can* be removed if one so desires. Are those supposed to be selling points for sleazy adware, *or* for Win10?! | This was never about being an MVP - it's all about providing information | to make a value-added decision. | If you could only hear yourself.... A "value-added" decision? That's pure MS marketing gobbledygook. You'd be a lot more convincing if you put it in your own words: "I look forward to Windows 10 because I love the idea that Microsoft can host my whole life online while I play with trinket apps. I'm so tired of high-functioning computers with attractive graphics. I just can't wait to be fully immersed in the land of the boring, monotone, spyware mega-buttons that lead me to games and weather reports and interesting advertisements for things I truly want to buy. And I felt this way even before the Microsoft people told me to say it. Honest." If you put it that way I'd be inclined to give you the benefit of the doubt because it would at least sound like you'd actually thought about it.... even if it still sounded like you might not be "firing on all cylinders". |
#42
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Why would I want to pre "register" Windows 10 anyway?
On Wed, 03 Jun 2015 02:41:07 -0400, ". . .winston"
wrote: Char Jackson wrote: I no longer read Mayayana's posts unless someone quotes them, so thanks for quoting it above. Very interesting read. I have to say that he is spot on in this case, with one minor exception. I don't see MVP's as MS shills, although I admit that it frequently looks that way. It also looks like his position *is* pretty much valid across the board, despite your claims to the contrary. My replies are based on the purpose of the 'Get Windows 10' app deployed via KB 3035583. In case you haven't realized - installing or not installing the app has significance regardless of how it is interpreted as value-added, non-value added, marketing-ware, junk-ware, etc. 1. The app includes the replacement for the Upgrade Assistant (i.e. it replaces earlier versions). 2. The only route to obtain a readiness for an existing system (device and applications) is to install the app **and** Reserve Windows 10 3.The app provides the option to 'Cancel' any reservation 4. The app can easily be removed by uninstalling the KB via Programs and Features/View Installed Updates 5. Windows 7 OEM and Full version media *and* OEM Pre-built units will disappear from the marketplace(look for that to happen shortly or immediately after July 29, 2015) - Home is already gone, Pro will soon follow. So far, I see no significant value in the things you've listed above. There is nothing wrong with continued use of Win7 on an existing system, yet it makes sense to install the app and reserve Win10 and perform a readiness status (no matter what one decides to do in the next year). Thanks, that's a refreshing evolution of your previous position that Win 7 is a short term solution. ;-) As for making sense to install the app, it only makes sense for people who are still on the fence regarding Win 10. Besides, for a digital product that will initially be delivered via the Internet, the concept of "reserving" anything doesn't make sense. Other reasons. a. Imo, it's bad advice to listen to the proponents suggesting to not install KB 3035583 and not be able to perform that readiness check before making any decision on taking advantage of the free upgrade offer for Win7SP1/8.1. Fair enough, but I thought we were talking about people who have already decided. b. There are just too many people running OEM Windows 7 (on capable-ready-for-Window 10) systems without media (no media, never created restore disks, followed advice to remove the OEM recovery partition to gain storage space, don't image o/s, etc.). Upgrading to Windows 10 provides these folks an ability to obtain a retail Windows 10 license and in the future the ability to obtain media (free or a very low nominal cost) for that Win10 license. Realistically speaking, I don't see how upgrading to a new OS version helps here. The people who are currently working without a safety net will be the very same people working without a safety net after the upgrade. Which aspect of human nature are you relying on when you suggest that people who upgrade will somehow change their behavior? c. One year goes by fast and the sooner the better to determine the path to follow - stay with Win7, Win10 for free or a much higher penalty at a later time. For me, the decision was rather obvious and easy. Win 8.x was a big step backwards from Win 7, which itself was a small step backwards from XP, for the way I use the OS. I've checked out a couple of Win 10 TP's and I don't see any effort toward reversing the previous damage. By the way, you left out the option to stay with 8.x, above. What will I do on my two primary systems recognizing that not everyone is as fortunate or in a similar position. A. Win7 Sp1 - not upgrade even though it surpasses all Win10 requirements and reports zero (0) issues for devices and apps. This i7-4470, Asus Z87, UEFI, 1TB/2TB Sata 6, 16GB Ram unit is only two years old, but I will take advantage of upgrading from the UEFI F8 bootable Win10 Preview on the 2TB drive (either free or clean install when media is available) "not upgrade" or "will take advantage of upgrading"? B. Windows 8.1 Update - will upgrade to 10 on the i3-EFI-1TB Sata3-8GB Ram laptop with zero, 0, readiness issues for devices and app - a no brainer (4 yr old unit was originally Win7Sp1 Home, upgraded $40 to Win8.0 Pro, then free to 8.1 Update, free again to 10. If I get 2 more years out of Win10 for my original laptop price of $359...that's $399 money well spent regardless if it dies or is restored to factory for donation. The question of whether to upgrade an existing OS should rarely be a no brainer. In your case, you obviously see a significant benefit to upgrading, hence your comment about it being a no brainer. I currently fail to see such a benefit, so my decision went the other way. This was never about being an MVP - it's all about providing information to make a value-added decision. I honestly can't tell most of the time. Your logic is frequently seriously flawed, especially on this topic, so I'm keeping you at a distance on this one. :-) |
#43
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Why would I want to pre "register" Windows 10 anyway?
Slimer wrote:
Tell yourself that no matter whether Windows 10 ends up being the greatest OS in history or just another one, it'll always be better than Linux. Since you yourself can't make Linux work while millions of others have no problem at all, that's just your opinion. Nothing more. -- -bts -This space for rent, but the price is high |
#44
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Why would I want to pre "register" Windows 10 anyway?
En el artículo , Wolf K
escribió: Opinions, please. The free upgrade offer is just to soften up the market. After the sheeple have stampeded to take the freebie during the first year and M$ have a large installed base, the charges will begin to come in. They're moving to the 'software as a service' rental model, first with Office 365. Windows 10 will be the next step. Like Apple's iCloud, you'll get a trivial amount of cloud storage free but any more will cost $$$. Win10 mandates the use of a Microsoft account and their cloud. Data saved from applications will default to being saved in the cloud rather than on local storage. You will not be able to use Win10 without an internet connection and M$ will collect as much information as they possibly can about you and what you do. This information will be sold to marketers. You will have to agree to sign up to this data collection in the licence agreement. The existing betas are no where near the quality of a release candidate. This means that on 29 July, when Win10 is released, the sheeple will be alpha-testing M$'s code for them and suffering the bugs. -- (\_/) (='.'=) (")_(") |
#45
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Why would I want to pre "register" Windows 10 anyway?
On 2015-06-03 10:58 AM, Beauregard T. Shagnasty wrote:
Slimer wrote: Tell yourself that no matter whether Windows 10 ends up being the greatest OS in history or just another one, it'll always be better than Linux. Since you yourself can't make Linux work while millions of others have no problem at all, that's just your opinion. Nothing more. I laugh as you say that, knowing that the Linux installs of one of my co-workers both failed miserably on her today, about 30 minutes ago. Use your denial superpowers and keep telling yourself that Linux is useful. -- Slimer Encrypt. - "NTFS is just slightly faster than apples HFS. And that is the slowest FS of all. EXT 4 is several times faster than NTFS, and *that* is the reason you dimbulbs now troll against EXT4." - "Like NTFS, which is at best at beta stage right now?" (Peter "the Klöwn" Köhlmann lying shamelessly about NTFS to desperately defend the fact that ext4 has been shown to corrupt data in Linux kernel 4.0.x) |
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