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7 Best Alternatives To Microsoft Office Suite — 2019 Edition



 
 
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  #61  
Old December 6th 19, 03:17 PM posted to alt.computer.workshop,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.freeware
Ken Springer[_2_]
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Posts: 3,817
Default 7 Best Alternatives To Microsoft Office Suite — 2019 Edition

On 12/5/19 9:50 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Thu, 5 Dec 2019 21:07:22 -0700, Ken Springer
wrote:

On 12/5/19 6:54 AM, Mayayana wrote:
So if you think MS and Adobe are going to collapse then
you'll have to start by telling millions of people who work
in offices and graphics shops what Microsoft and Adobe are.
They really don't know. Most don't even know they're using
Windows. (They do know if they're using Mac but that's only
because they paid twice what it's worth to show off the logo.)


Having the active spread across the entire widescreen monitor also dries
me up the wall.


Then why do it? I assume you're speaking of your own behavior, since
other's behavior wouldn't be up to you. If you don't like it, don't do it
that way.


I rarely do things full screen. Google Maps, or any mapping type
program, would be an exception,

Sometimes, I get close to that with a program that has various control
panels on one side or the other. Such as a styles and formatting display.

I wasn't clear, but I was referring to things like writing a document,
and that's the only thing on the screen.

As for me, almost everything gets run full screen. I find it very
distracting to have multiple windows partially overlaid atop one another,
but I wouldn't tell anyone to do it one way or another. It's an individual
decision.


Regarding multiple windows on the screen, for me it depends on the
contents of the various windows. If those windows have different tools
that come with a particular program, it doesn't bother me.

But I don't have a browser window, email window, instant messenger
window, etc. all on the same desktop. For those situations, I use
alternate/multiple desktops. Each program is assigned to run in a
specific desktop. I've not found a way to do that with W10's Task Views.

It is an individual's choice. I get frustrated with people who choose
to do it one way, without knowing what their options are.

--
Ken
MacOS 10.14.6
Firefox 70.0.1
Thunderbird 60.9
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"
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  #62  
Old December 6th 19, 03:32 PM posted to alt.computer.workshop,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.freeware
nospam
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Posts: 4,718
Default 7 Best Alternatives To Microsoft Office Suite - 2019 Edition

In article , Mayayana
wrote:


There's no need to use a long UTF-8 dash.


there is if it's the appropriate character for what's being written.

There isn't even
a keyboard button for it.


there aren't enough keyboard buttons for every character, especially
for non-roman languages.

UTF-8 is meant to handle
internationalization. It's fine for foreign languages in HTML.
But people using long dashes and curly braces restrict
adaptability for no reason. ASCII is valid UTF-8 but UTF-8
is not ASCII.


there is no restriction whatsoever with modern software.

It's exactly the same thing people are talking about
with Powerpoint. People use it because it's what they
know, and often it's all they know. They don't realize that
some others use their computer for something other than
Word and Powerpoint. If they distribute class notes, that
could be in the form of plain text, for adaptability and
editability. Why don't they? Because they don't know what
they're doing and PPT looks more official.


no, it's because plain text doesn't support what they need, including
different fonts & sizes, graphics such as charts, illustrations, etc
and much more.

And why PDF?
Again, it's idiocy born of ignorance and trying to look
official. PDF is for precise printing.


pdf is for *much* more than just printing.

pdf can even contain video content, which can't be printed.

If I get notes from a
class I'd want to be able to edit them.


editing class notes is undesirable, however, pdf supports annotation
should you want to mark up certain sections.

The first thing I'd
do would be to convert them to plain text. But many
people won't know how to do that and/or won't have
software to do it.


that won't work very well if the bulk of the presentation is charts,
graphs, illustrations, audio, video or anything else that isn't plain
text.
  #63  
Old December 6th 19, 03:32 PM posted to alt.computer.workshop,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.freeware
nospam
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Posts: 4,718
Default 7 Best Alternatives To Microsoft Office Suite 2019 Edition

In article , Ken Springer
wrote:


What else would you prefer?

a folder of pdfs from various seminars/classes/etc. rather than a stack
of paper, making it trivial to search for a specific event or a slide
within a presentation.


"class notes that are passed out" can certainly be via pdf. I'm fine with
that. I was just commenting on the fact that the thing that gets passed out
is essentially the presentation slides, whether they be in paper or
electronic form. Personally, I greatly prefer electronic form. I see that
my previous reply wasn't clear in that regard.


For many, or at least some, paper provides more options for
reading/reviewing than an electronic file.


except that it doesn't.

electronic files can *easily* be searched in a fraction of second and
can also be read on a phone or tablet just about anywhere, which can
hold and/or access an unlimited amount of presentations and other
reference material.

files can also support audio and video as well as hyperlinks to jump to
additional information.

Provide both. :-)


print it yourself if you want paper.
  #64  
Old December 6th 19, 03:34 PM posted to alt.computer.workshop,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.freeware
Ken Springer[_2_]
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Posts: 3,817
Default 7 Best Alternatives To Microsoft Office Suite - 2019 Edition

On 12/6/19 7:12 AM, Mayayana wrote:
"Ken Springer" wrote

Are you having trouble with your newsreader? You
just made 3 responses to what I wrote and I can't
decipher any connection between my words and yours.


Well... That's interesting...

No problems that I know of. And I didn't do anything different at this end.

I've no clue what happened.

--
Ken
MacOS 10.14.6
Firefox 70.0.1
Thunderbird 60.9
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"
  #65  
Old December 6th 19, 03:36 PM posted to alt.computer.workshop,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.freeware
Mayayana
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Posts: 6,438
Default 7 Best Alternatives To Microsoft Office Suite - 2019 Edition

"Ken Springer" wrote

| It is an individual's choice. I get frustrated with people who choose
| to do it one way, without knowing what their options are.
|

It's interesting how much people don't notice. But it
takes a lot of effort to learn all the options. I know
people who don't understand cut/copy/paste. I see
people who don't know they can minimize a window
and while they may not run windows fullscreen, they
think they have to close one before opening another!


  #66  
Old December 6th 19, 03:36 PM posted to alt.computer.workshop,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.freeware
Ken Springer[_2_]
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Posts: 3,817
Default 7 Best Alternatives To Microsoft Office Suite 2019 Edition

On 12/6/19 7:32 AM, nospam wrote:
In article , Ken Springer
wrote:


What else would you prefer?

a folder of pdfs from various seminars/classes/etc. rather than a stack
of paper, making it trivial to search for a specific event or a slide
within a presentation.

"class notes that are passed out" can certainly be via pdf. I'm fine with
that. I was just commenting on the fact that the thing that gets passed out
is essentially the presentation slides, whether they be in paper or
electronic form. Personally, I greatly prefer electronic form. I see that
my previous reply wasn't clear in that regard.


For many, or at least some, paper provides more options for
reading/reviewing than an electronic file.


except that it doesn't.

electronic files can *easily* be searched in a fraction of second and
can also be read on a phone or tablet just about anywhere, which can
hold and/or access an unlimited amount of presentations and other
reference material.

files can also support audio and video as well as hyperlinks to jump to
additional information.

Provide both. :-)


print it yourself if you want paper.


I just cannot believe how clueless you are, sometimes.


--
Ken
MacOS 10.14.6
Firefox 70.0.1
Thunderbird 60.9
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"
  #67  
Old December 6th 19, 03:57 PM posted to alt.computer.workshop,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.freeware
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,718
Default 7 Best Alternatives To Microsoft Office Suite 2019 Edition

In article , Ken Springer
wrote:


What else would you prefer?

a folder of pdfs from various seminars/classes/etc. rather than a stack
of paper, making it trivial to search for a specific event or a slide
within a presentation.

"class notes that are passed out" can certainly be via pdf. I'm fine with
that. I was just commenting on the fact that the thing that gets passed
out
is essentially the presentation slides, whether they be in paper or
electronic form. Personally, I greatly prefer electronic form. I see that
my previous reply wasn't clear in that regard.

For many, or at least some, paper provides more options for
reading/reviewing than an electronic file.


except that it doesn't.

electronic files can *easily* be searched in a fraction of second and
can also be read on a phone or tablet just about anywhere, which can
hold and/or access an unlimited amount of presentations and other
reference material.

files can also support audio and video as well as hyperlinks to jump to
additional information.

Provide both. :-)


print it yourself if you want paper.


I just cannot believe how clueless you are, sometimes.


resorting to ad hominem attacks, again.
  #68  
Old December 6th 19, 04:03 PM posted to alt.computer.workshop,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.freeware
Ken Blake[_7_]
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Posts: 569
Default 7 Best Alternatives To Microsoft Office Suite — 2019 Edition

On 12/6/2019 6:57 AM, Ken Springer wrote:
On 12/5/19 9:54 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Thu, 5 Dec 2019 21:08:50 -0700, Ken Springer
wrote:

On 12/5/19 7:27 AM, nospam wrote:
there's no need to print a powerpoint presentation, but if you must,
the background can be disabled to minimize ink usage.

Unfortunately, I've been to many an instructional presentation where the
class notes that are passed out are just the presentation you are
watching. :-(


I'm not sure that's in any way unfortunate. There's always someone who
missed the presentation or someone who wants to archive the topics of
discussion. The printed presentation is fine for those purposes. At a
minimum, it can serve as the basis for follow-up questions.

What else would you prefer?


So much depends on the person doing the presentation. I've been to many
where all the presenter does is read the text from the slide. If that's
all they do, then why are you there?

I would prefer the presenter use the information from the slide as a
basis, a foundation, to present additional information, as you stated.
But, many don't. :-(




A strong ditto! That's the way I've always done my presentations.


--
Ken
  #69  
Old December 6th 19, 04:16 PM posted to alt.computer.workshop,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.freeware
Ken Springer[_2_]
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Posts: 3,817
Default 7 Best Alternatives To Microsoft Office Suite - 2019 Edition

On 12/6/19 7:36 AM, Mayayana wrote:
"Ken Springer" wrote

| It is an individual's choice. I get frustrated with people who choose
| to do it one way, without knowing what their options are.
|

It's interesting how much people don't notice. But it
takes a lot of effort to learn all the options. I know
people who don't understand cut/copy/paste. I see
people who don't know they can minimize a window
and while they may not run windows fullscreen, they
think they have to close one before opening another!


Frustrating, isn't it? These things are what I call the basics, and you
found in the manuals that used to come with the systems.


--
Ken
MacOS 10.14.6
Firefox 70.0.1
Thunderbird 60.9
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"
  #70  
Old December 6th 19, 04:44 PM posted to alt.computer.workshop,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.freeware
Dan Purgert
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 281
Default 7 Best Alternatives To Microsoft Office Suite - 2019 Edition

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Mayayana wrote:
they're doing and PPT looks more official. And why PDF?
Again, it's idiocy born of ignorance and trying to look
official. PDF is for precise printing. If I get notes from a


Well, I use PDF to ensure that recipients get "paper" (i.e. uneditable)
copy. Granted, I'm not providing "notes", but rather documentation for
the team.

Short version is that said former employer loved their home-grown
"document management system" (think MS Sharepoint, but worse). So it
was either distribute text (or doc[x], etc.), and then deal with fixing
it every time one of the tier-zero guys edits the documentation in a
stupid manner ("cut" instead of "copy" was common, as was random pastes
of cthulhu-knows-what); or PDF that they couldn't break as easily.

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iQEzBAEBCAAdFiEEBcqaUD8uEzVNxUrujhHd8xJ5ooEFAl3qd1 YACgkQjhHd8xJ5
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--
|_|O|_|
|_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert
|O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5 4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281
  #71  
Old December 6th 19, 05:51 PM posted to alt.computer.workshop,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.freeware
Panthera Tigris Altaica[_2_]
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Posts: 106
Default 7 Best Alternatives To Microsoft Office Suite - 2019 Edition

On 2019-12-06 09:12, Mayayana wrote:
"Ken Springer" wrote

Are you having trouble with your newsreader? You
just made 3 responses to what I wrote and I can't
decipher any connection between my words and yours.


I only see one.
  #72  
Old December 6th 19, 06:17 PM posted to alt.computer.workshop,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.freeware
Char Jackson
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Posts: 10,449
Default 7 Best Alternatives To Microsoft Office Suite — 2019 Edition

On Fri, 6 Dec 2019 06:57:14 -0700, Ken Springer
wrote:

On 12/5/19 9:54 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Thu, 5 Dec 2019 21:08:50 -0700, Ken Springer
wrote:

On 12/5/19 7:27 AM, nospam wrote:
there's no need to print a powerpoint presentation, but if you must,
the background can be disabled to minimize ink usage.

Unfortunately, I've been to many an instructional presentation where the
class notes that are passed out are just the presentation you are
watching. :-(


I'm not sure that's in any way unfortunate. There's always someone who
missed the presentation or someone who wants to archive the topics of
discussion. The printed presentation is fine for those purposes. At a
minimum, it can serve as the basis for follow-up questions.

What else would you prefer?


So much depends on the person doing the presentation. I've been to many
where all the presenter does is read the text from the slide. If that's
all they do, then why are you there?

I would prefer the presenter use the information from the slide as a
basis, a foundation, to present additional information, as you stated.
But, many don't. :-(


I strongly agree with your last point, but you've moved the goalposts.

I thought we were talking about a case where the notes that are passed out
are essentially the presentation itself, (regardless of whether those notes
are in paper or electronic form. I prefer electronic.)

That's a good discussion tactic, though. Move from a point of disagreement
to a point of agreement and everyone ends up happy.

--

Have you been approached by David Brooks (DB, ~DB~, and 50+ other nyms)?

To prevent yourself from being a victim of cyber
stalking, it's highly recommended that you visit he

https://tekrider.net/pages/david-brooks-stalker.php
https://web.archive.org/web/20191103112509/https://tekrider.net/pages/david-brooks-stalker.php
  #73  
Old December 6th 19, 06:23 PM posted to alt.computer.workshop,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.freeware
Char Jackson
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Posts: 10,449
Default 7 Best Alternatives To Microsoft Office Suite — 2019 Edition

On Fri, 6 Dec 2019 07:17:01 -0700, Ken Springer
wrote:

On 12/5/19 9:50 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Thu, 5 Dec 2019 21:07:22 -0700, Ken Springer
wrote:

On 12/5/19 6:54 AM, Mayayana wrote:
So if you think MS and Adobe are going to collapse then
you'll have to start by telling millions of people who work
in offices and graphics shops what Microsoft and Adobe are.
They really don't know. Most don't even know they're using
Windows. (They do know if they're using Mac but that's only
because they paid twice what it's worth to show off the logo.)

Having the active spread across the entire widescreen monitor also dries
me up the wall.


Then why do it? I assume you're speaking of your own behavior, since
other's behavior wouldn't be up to you. If you don't like it, don't do it
that way.


I rarely do things full screen. Google Maps, or any mapping type
program, would be an exception,

Sometimes, I get close to that with a program that has various control
panels on one side or the other. Such as a styles and formatting display.

I wasn't clear, but I was referring to things like writing a document,
and that's the only thing on the screen.

As for me, almost everything gets run full screen. I find it very
distracting to have multiple windows partially overlaid atop one another,
but I wouldn't tell anyone to do it one way or another. It's an individual
decision.


Regarding multiple windows on the screen, for me it depends on the
contents of the various windows. If those windows have different tools
that come with a particular program, it doesn't bother me.

But I don't have a browser window, email window, instant messenger
window, etc. all on the same desktop. For those situations, I use
alternate/multiple desktops. Each program is assigned to run in a
specific desktop. I've not found a way to do that with W10's Task Views.

It is an individual's choice. I get frustrated with people who choose
to do it one way, without knowing what their options are.


That last part is what gets you into trouble. I don't know how you can look
at someone and determine whether they know what their options are. It seems
much more likely that they're doing something exactly how they want to do
it. If *they* speak up and express frustration, that's different, but
until/unless they do so, you have no reason to be frustrated.

Besides, your 'multiple desktops' approach isn't better than running an
application full screen. Those are just two different approaches that get
you the same result - an application with fewer distractions.

--

Have you been approached by David Brooks (DB, ~DB~, and 50+ other nyms)?

To prevent yourself from being a victim of cyber
stalking, it's highly recommended that you visit he

https://tekrider.net/pages/david-brooks-stalker.php
https://web.archive.org/web/20191103112509/https://tekrider.net/pages/david-brooks-stalker.php
  #74  
Old December 6th 19, 06:48 PM posted to alt.computer.workshop,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.freeware
David
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Posts: 238
Default 7 Best Alternatives To Microsoft Office Suite - 2019 Edition

On 06/12/2019 15:16, Ken Springer wrote:
On 12/6/19 7:36 AM, Mayayana wrote:
"Ken Springer" wrote

| It is an individual's choice.Â* I get frustrated with people who choose
| to do it one way, without knowing what their options are.
|

Â*Â* It's interesting how much people don't notice. But it
takes a lot of effort to learn all the options. I know
people who don't understand cut/copy/paste. I see
people who don't know they can minimize a window
and while they may not run windows fullscreen, they
think they have to close one before opening another!


Frustrating, isn't it?Â* These things are what I call the basics, and you
found in the manuals that used to come with the systems.



As I'm sure you already know, Ken, Apple does still provide LOTS of
helpful information:-

https://www.apple.com/uk/macos/catalina/

https://www.apple.com/uk/macos/catalina/features/
  #75  
Old December 6th 19, 06:56 PM posted to alt.computer.workshop,alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.comp.freeware
Ken Springer[_2_]
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Posts: 3,817
Default 7 Best Alternatives To Microsoft Office Suite - 2019 Edition

On 12/6/19 10:48 AM, David wrote:
On 06/12/2019 15:16, Ken Springer wrote:
On 12/6/19 7:36 AM, Mayayana wrote:
"Ken Springer" wrote

| It is an individual's choice.Â* I get frustrated with people who choose
| to do it one way, without knowing what their options are.
|

Â*Â* It's interesting how much people don't notice. But it
takes a lot of effort to learn all the options. I know
people who don't understand cut/copy/paste. I see
people who don't know they can minimize a window
and while they may not run windows fullscreen, they
think they have to close one before opening another!


Frustrating, isn't it?Â* These things are what I call the basics, and you
found in the manuals that used to come with the systems.



As I'm sure you already know, Ken, Apple does still provide LOTS of
helpful information:-

https://www.apple.com/uk/macos/catalina/

https://www.apple.com/uk/macos/catalina/features/


True. And Apple even has a basic manual right on the hard drive. Don't
see that from windows.

Those links are sales pitches, telling you *what* you can do, not *how*
to do it.

It's the how that I am talking about.

It should be obvious that information found online is useless, when the
user does not know how to go online.


--
Ken
MacOS 10.14.6
Firefox 70.0.1
Thunderbird 60.9
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"
 




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