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Let's attempt Frank Slootweg's freeware solution for backing up Android to Windows



 
 
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  #31  
Old November 20th 18, 05:34 PM posted to comp.mobile.android,alt.comp.freeware,alt.windows7.general
Frank Slootweg
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Posts: 1,226
Default Let's attempt Frank Slootweg's freeware solution for backing up Android to Windows

Paul wrote:
Alek wrote:
Frank Slootweg wrote on 11/17/2018 9:48 AM:
You apparently missed - or don't remember - my recent (October 22)
response to you about what I use to backup my Android devices, so here's
the news URL of my post. And yes, it ticks all your boxes. Have fun.

news


Not sure how to use this link.


Another way to do it:

Enter this URL in Seamonkey browser (which is a suite and
includes a news reader).

news://news.aioe.org:119/pql56t.8k8....individual.net

That syntax would work in Thunderbird... if we could figure
out a way to enter a URL :-) I haven't figured out where that
is hiding on TBird.

Maybe you could call TBird from the command line and do it
or something.


This *used* to work 'in' Thunderbird as well, but - as I mentioned in
another response -, currently Thunderbird seems (is?) broken and
probably has been broken for years. (The last time I checked (and
documented) this was in June 2008.)

I say 'in' (Thunderbird), because you couldn't *enter* such a URL in
TB, because it doesn't have a box to enter it in.

The 'trick' was to enter the URL into your (web)*browser*, i.e. mostly
IE and then IE would know that it should pass the URL to TB, which would
then execute it and - in this case - show the article.

The News server part of the URL was not needed, because it would
default to whichever server was configured in TB, i.e. just

news
exactly like in my first post about this.

But - as I said -, currently 'news:' URLs don't work anymore in TB, at
least not for me, also not after several hours Googling numerous
dead-ends.

The only - totally useless - part which I now have 'working' (on
Windows 8.1) is that if I enter a 'news:' URL - *any* 'news:' URL, also
a wrong one - in Chrome (the browser), Chrome will start Thunderbird (if
it wasn't already running). But it does not even go to the News part of
TB, let alone that it executes any specific part of the URL, i.e. for
the above example, it does *not* open/show the desired article.

Did I already mention "totall useless"!? I probably did. Sigh!
Ads
  #32  
Old November 20th 18, 05:44 PM posted to comp.mobile.android,alt.comp.freeware,alt.windows7.general
Frank Slootweg
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,226
Default [OT] How to use a 'news:' URL

Yesterday, I wrote:

[Lots deleted.]

Now we 'only' need someone who can show us how to teach TB to do a
direct lookup of a news URL.


For more useless information about my further fruitless attempts to
get TB to behave, see my response to Paul.

For (non-)easy reference, I'll give the news URL :-) of my post:

news
Or, for wimps :-),:

%3E
  #33  
Old November 21st 18, 02:59 PM posted to comp.mobile.android,alt.comp.freeware,alt.windows7.general
Carlos E.R.[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,356
Default [OT] How to use a 'news:' URL

On 20/11/2018 15.04, nospam wrote:
In article , Carlos E.R.
wrote:

As nospam wrote, clicking on the news URL should work.

It doesn't here.

Right click offers to open in browser, then a dialog ask to say what
application to open it with (choose other application). And it does not
suggest any by default, just the entire disk tree.

normal click, not contextual click, and the problem appears to be
thunderbird.


Yes, but the point is that not every NNTP client supports locating
"news://..." URLS. And it is demonstrated.


that just means you're using a broken news client. replace it with a
better one.


That's your opinion. Better one? Such as...? On Linux, remember.

--
Cheers, Carlos.
  #34  
Old November 21st 18, 03:04 PM posted to comp.mobile.android,alt.comp.freeware,alt.windows7.general
Carlos E.R.[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,356
Default Let's attempt Frank Slootweg's freeware solution for backing upAndroid to Windows

On 20/11/2018 17.34, Frank Slootweg wrote:

But - as I said -, currently 'news:' URLs don't work anymore in TB, at
least not for me, also not after several hours Googling numerous
dead-ends.


You have to enter the messageid in "search messages" (ctrl-shift-F)
instead (it works fast, there is probably an index). I don't know if
there is a way to call this from outside.

--
Cheers, Carlos.
  #35  
Old November 21st 18, 03:30 PM posted to comp.mobile.android,alt.comp.freeware,alt.windows7.general
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11,873
Default [OT] How to use a 'news:' URL

Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 20/11/2018 15.04, nospam wrote:
In article , Carlos E.R.
wrote:

As nospam wrote, clicking on the news URL should work.
It doesn't here.

Right click offers to open in browser, then a dialog ask to say what
application to open it with (choose other application). And it does not
suggest any by default, just the entire disk tree.
normal click, not contextual click, and the problem appears to be
thunderbird.
Yes, but the point is that not every NNTP client supports locating
"news://..." URLS. And it is demonstrated.

that just means you're using a broken news client. replace it with a
better one.


That's your opinion. Better one? Such as...? On Linux, remember.


I did some experiments on a modern copy of Firefox and Thunderbird.

In Firefox, I tried "news://12345678abcdef". A MID URI.

I see the network LED flash a tiny bit (only a few flashes).

Then Thunderbird pops to the front. And it stops.

If I were to enter "news://nntp.aioe.org" then Thunderbird
can pop to the front, and maybe a new account entry ends up
added to Thunderbird. This isn't a MID based search, so a
separate code path is being followed.

OK, in the first case, in Thunderbird, if I use the
Config Editor (otherwise known as about:config if I was
in Firefox), I see one entry in there for "messageid".

The string stored in the entry, is a groups google com search.

http://groups.google.com/blahblah%mid

It would seem that Thunderbird is not "arranged by MID" internally.
If you look at various search options within Thunderbird, the MID
is never an option in the searches. This is also why you end up reading
messages cross-posted to three groups, three times. Reading a message
with a particular MID, doesn't remove it from all groups it is crossposted to.

Thunderbird, when there's a handoff using news://URI in Firefox,
seems to be calling groups.google.com to look up a MID. Rather
than handle the MID with its own client-entered server details.
Since there's no MID engine, it bails and cheats by doing an HTTP
call instead.

Something is broken about that handling. It actually worked
in Seamonkey, which is a suite. But something in Thunderbird
is botching the information returned by the attempt
to access http://groups.google.com.

If you were to modify the messageid string in the Config Editor
in Thunderbird, you might get it working. I've run out of
things to try myself.

When I look in Seamonkey right now, it's set up the same way
as the Firefox/Thunderbird duo. Maybe this should be changed
to https, but it might not matter.

mailnews.messageid_browser.url string http://groups.google.com/search?as_umsgid=%mid

A bug report suggests the search string might have been intended to be

http://groups.google.com/search?as_umsgid=%mid&rnum=1

and yet another thread participant said the rnum was unnecessary.

So, the steps that seem to happen:

1) Firefox realizes it doesn't have a URI handler for news://
It knows there is a protocol binding for Thunderbird for that.
Maybe Thunderbird is registered as the email/news handler.
2) Thunderbird examines the incoming URI.
It successfully recognizes non-MID URIs and handles them as usual.
(In the same broken way it always had :-) )
3) When Thunderbird sees one with a MID (no angle brackets, no quotes),
it seems to resort to http. The LED for the NIC blinks a few times.
A manual test of the URL above, shows it can work. A result comes back.
4) But Thunderbird doesn't seem to be doing anything with the result.
I suspected a "popup preventer" entry in Config Editor, was preventing
the groups.google.com web page from being presented. That's what
would have happened in Seamonkey. My attempts to modify that, did not help.

There are two areas of experimentation:

1) Improve the messageid search command.
2) Remove whatever popup blocker prevents the gg page from displaying in TB.

As for the approach, it's kinda dumb. Not all newsgroups are
in Google Groups. The only reason the MID being used in this
thread was searchable, was because it was crossposted. A post
to only the Windows7 group, would not be held by Google. But
since the message went to three groups, the test message is
stored in groups.google.com because of some group other than
the windows7 one.

Paul
  #36  
Old November 21st 18, 03:41 PM posted to comp.mobile.android,alt.comp.freeware,alt.windows7.general
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,718
Default [OT] How to use a 'news:' URL

In article , Carlos E.R.
wrote:

As nospam wrote, clicking on the news URL should work.

It doesn't here.

Right click offers to open in browser, then a dialog ask to say what
application to open it with (choose other application). And it does not
suggest any by default, just the entire disk tree.

normal click, not contextual click, and the problem appears to be
thunderbird.

Yes, but the point is that not every NNTP client supports locating
"news://..." URLS. And it is demonstrated.


that just means you're using a broken news client. replace it with a
better one.


That's your opinion.


it's not an opinion.

when something does not work, it's broken. very simple.

Better one? Such as...? On Linux, remember.


i don't keep track of every newsreader that's available for linux (or
other platforms for that matter). try them all and see what works and
what doesn't.
  #37  
Old November 21st 18, 04:07 PM posted to comp.mobile.android,alt.comp.freeware,alt.windows7.general
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,718
Default [OT] How to use a 'news:' URL

In article , Wolf K
wrote:

Yes, but the point is that not every NNTP client supports locating
"news://..." URLS. And it is demonstrated.

that just means you're using a broken news client. replace it with a
better one.

That's your opinion.


it's not an opinion.

when something does not work, it's broken. very simple.

Better one? Such as...? On Linux, remember.


i don't keep track of every newsreader that's available for linux (or
other platforms for that matter). try them all and see what works and
what doesn't.


"Better" and similar words are ascriptive, not descriptive adjectives.
They signal opinions. It may be a well founded opinion, but it's still
an opinion.


except when it isn't.

something that works will always be better than something that doesn't
work.
  #38  
Old November 21st 18, 04:25 PM posted to comp.mobile.android,alt.comp.freeware,alt.windows7.general
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,718
Default [OT] How to use a 'news:' URL

In article , Wolf K
wrote:

"Better" and similar words are ascriptive, not descriptive adjectives.
They signal opinions. It may be a well founded opinion, but it's still
an opinion.


except when it isn't.

something that works will always be better than something that doesn't
work.


a) If a program lacks a feature which I never use, it works.

b) If a program has a buggy version of a feature which I never use, it
works.


no. it's still broken.

it's also a feature he is actually trying to use.

c) Many people use obsolete or non/no-longer working objects for other
purposes, such as interior decoration.

d) A non-working or broken example of an artefact is better than nothing
from a museum's POV.


this isn't about interior decoration or museum exhibits.

not even a good attempt at diversion.
  #39  
Old November 21st 18, 09:10 PM posted to comp.mobile.android,alt.comp.freeware,alt.windows7.general
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,718
Default [OT] How to use a 'news:' URL

In article , Wolf K
wrote:


Hey, you snipped context-providing material. Tsk, tsk, naughty!


nope. i snipped excess text that is no longer relevant, but those who
wish to review it can *easily* do so with a single click.

"Better" and similar words are ascriptive, not descriptive adjectives.
They signal opinions. It may be a well founded opinion, but it's still
an opinion.

except when it isn't.

something that works will always be better than something that doesn't
work.

a) If a program lacks a feature which I never use, it works.

b) If a program has a buggy version of a feature which I never use, it
works.


no. it's still broken.


So what? It still works as expected or desired by me.


you aren't the final arbiter.

windows 10 1809 had a broken feature that deleted user data, which
according to microsoft, only affected 1/100th of 1% of users.

in other words, most people did not encounter it, yet it was broken
enough to be major news, forcing microsot to pull it and rerelease it
several weeks later.

it's also a feature he is actually trying to use.


Yes, and in that context, your opinion may be useful. But it's still an
opinion.


it's not an opinion. the feature is broken.

c) Many people use obsolete or non/no-longer working objects for other
purposes, such as interior decoration.

d) A non-working or broken example of an artefact is better than nothing
from a museum's POV.


this isn't about interior decoration or museum exhibits.


Ah, but it is relevant to your claim something that works is "always
better" than something that doesn't.


you're arguing just to argue.

not even a good attempt at diversion.


Oh, I wouldn't have bothered, but you used "always", and I was bored.
Don't use "always" when you are expressing an opinion.


you're deliberately taking things out of context.

It may comfort you to know that I agree with your advice to get a
newsreader that does what he wants.


further proof that you're arguing just to argue.
  #40  
Old November 21st 18, 09:47 PM posted to comp.mobile.android,alt.comp.freeware,alt.windows7.general
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,718
Default [OT] How to use a 'news:' URL

In article , Wolf K
wrote:

a) If a program lacks a feature which I never use, it works.

b) If a program has a buggy version of a feature which I never use, it
works.
no. it's still broken.
So what? It still works as expected or desired by me.

you aren't the final arbiter.


Pointless remark. No one is "the final arbiter".


wrong. the manufacturer of the product decides that.

However, I am the arbiter for whatever decides I decide to use.


for you, but not for the product itself.
  #41  
Old November 21st 18, 10:43 PM posted to comp.mobile.android,alt.comp.freeware,alt.windows7.general
Frank Slootweg
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,226
Default [OT] How to use a 'news:' URL

Wolf K wrote:
On 2018-11-21 15:10, nospam wrote:
[...] you're arguing just to argue.[...]

Self-satire is a pleasure to observe.


Yup. As a famous poster once said "He's just a compulsive arguer."
  #42  
Old November 21st 18, 11:08 PM posted to comp.mobile.android,alt.comp.freeware,alt.windows7.general
Carlos E.R.[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,356
Default [OT] How to use a 'news:' URL

On 21/11/2018 15.30, Paul wrote:
Carlos E.R. wrote:



I did some experiments on a modern copy of Firefox and Thunderbird.

In Firefox, I tried "news://12345678abcdef". A MID URI.

I see the network LED flash a tiny bit (only a few flashes).

Then Thunderbird pops to the front. And it stops.

If I were to enter "news://nntp.aioe.org" then Thunderbird
can pop to the front, and maybe a new account entry ends up
added to Thunderbird. This isn't a MID based search, so a
separate code path is being followed.

OK, in the first case, in Thunderbird, if I use the
Config Editor (otherwise known as about:config if I was
in Firefox), I see one entry in there for "messageid".

The string stored in the entry, is a groups google com search.

Â*Â* http://groups.google.com/blahblah%mid


That link works. I concocted:

https://groups.google.com/search?as_umsgid=%mid

replace %mid with the actual mid, and finally I got




It would seem that Thunderbird is not "arranged by MID" internally.
If you look at various search options within Thunderbird, the MID
is never an option in the searches. This is also why you end up reading
messages cross-posted to three groups, three times. Reading a message
with a particular MID, doesn't remove it from all groups it is
crossposted to.


It is, in Edit/Find/search messages. You can tick "search on server" and
select "Message-ID" as a field to search on. Here it is instant, but the
server is local (leafnode). But I just tried "no search on server" and
it also was instant, thus it keeps an index.

Indeed, file
"/home/cer/.thunderbird/random.default/News/server.name/comp.mobile.android.msf
contains the messageid I seek for:

(123B3=66c0)(13DCC=26321)(12390=5bcdfc05)(12391
)(12392
)


Maybe "12391" is the message item. Humm... leafnode has it in
"/var/spool/news/comp/mobile/android/26322".



Thunderbird, when there's a handoff using news://URI in Firefox,
seems to be calling groups.google.com to look up a MID. Rather
than handle the MID with its own client-entered server details.
Since there's no MID engine, it bails and cheats by doing an HTTP
call instead.

Something is broken about that handling. It actually worked
in Seamonkey, which is a suite. But something in Thunderbird
is botching the information returned by the attempt
to access http://groups.google.com.


Maybe that page changed the format of the result and Thunderbird fails
to parse it.


If you were to modify the messageid string in the Config Editor
in Thunderbird, you might get it working. I've run out of
things to try myself.

When I look in Seamonkey right now, it's set up the same way
as the Firefox/Thunderbird duo. Maybe this should be changed
to https, but it might not matter.

mailnews.messageid_browser.urlÂ*Â*Â* stringÂ*Â*Â*
http://groups.google.com/search?as_umsgid=%mid

A bug report suggests the search string might have been intended to be

Â*Â* http://groups.google.com/search?as_umsgid=%mid&rnum=1

and yet another thread participant said the rnum was unnecessary.

So, the steps that seem to happen:

1) Firefox realizes it doesn't have a URI handler for news://
Â*Â* It knows there is a protocol binding for Thunderbird for that.
Â*Â* Maybe Thunderbird is registered as the email/news handler.
2) Thunderbird examines the incoming URI.
Â*Â* It successfully recognizes non-MID URIs and handles them as usual.
Â*Â* (In the same broken way it always had :-) )
3) When Thunderbird sees one with a MID (no angle brackets, no quotes),
Â*Â* it seems to resort to http. The LED for the NIC blinks a few times.
Â*Â* A manual test of the URL above, shows it can work. A result comes back.
4) But Thunderbird doesn't seem to be doing anything with the result.
Â*Â* I suspected a "popup preventer" entry in Config Editor, was preventing
Â*Â* the groups.google.com web page from being presented. That's what
Â*Â* would have happened in Seamonkey. My attempts to modify that, did not
help.

There are two areas of experimentation:

1) Improve the messageid search command.
2) Remove whatever popup blocker prevents the gg page from displaying in
TB.

As for the approach, it's kinda dumb. Not all newsgroups are
in Google Groups. The only reason the MID being used in this
thread was searchable, was because it was crossposted. A post
to only the Windows7 group, would not be held by Google. But
since the message went to three groups, the test message is
stored in groups.google.com because of some group other than
the windows7 one.

Â*Â* Paul



--
Cheers, Carlos.
  #43  
Old November 21st 18, 11:12 PM posted to comp.mobile.android,alt.comp.freeware,alt.windows7.general
Carlos E.R.[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,356
Default [OT] How to use a 'news:' URL

On 21/11/2018 21.10, nospam wrote:
In article , Wolf K
wrote:


....


it's also a feature he is actually trying to use.


Yes, and in that context, your opinion may be useful. But it's still an
opinion.


it's not an opinion. the feature is broken.


Ah, finally! The feature is broken, not the entire program :-)
I can agree with that.

--
Cheers, Carlos.
  #44  
Old November 22nd 18, 01:09 PM posted to comp.mobile.android,alt.comp.freeware,alt.windows7.general
Carlos E. R.[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 219
Default Let's attempt Frank Slootweg's freeware solution for backing upAndroid to Windows

On 21/11/2018 15.04, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 20/11/2018 17.34, Frank Slootweg wrote:

But - as I said -, currently 'news:' URLs don't work anymore in TB, at
least not for me, also not after several hours Googling numerous
dead-ends.


You have to enter the messageid in "search messages" (ctrl-shift-F)
instead (it works fast, there is probably an index). I don't know if
there is a way to call this from outside.


I tried on another machine, and there I had to Customize the search
field and add another header, Message-Id. And it worked.

--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.
 




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