Liking it?

In message , Big_Al
writes
And some programs that are not for ALL USERS falls into your start
menu. So you have to make two.
"C:\Users\yourname\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Wi ndows\Start
Menu\Programs" is the shortcut for my start menu. Just insert yourname.

Now after you build these two links and have to constantly decide which
has the link you want, I found this and it worked great. Windows 7
menu is a composite of the admin menu and the user menu, it does it on
the fly. This is the same thing. One menu and all programs.
http://www.eightforums.com/tutorials...ar-create-wind
ows-8-taskbar.html One note, I did this year or so ago, and have not
used it since as I use classic or start8 or startisback on all my
desktops now.

Hmmm, yes I've now tried that one menu thing in 10 and don't think it
helps.
Here, it shows all sorts of old junk like the "apps" and also expands
the list to dozens of entries. For example, there is a huge list in the
list here of MySQL help files, and I don't think I'll ever want to
select mysqlauditgrep(online) as an item in my start menu or (or should
it be nor?) the other 20-odd.

I can't remember all the reasons I didn't like whichever ones I tried of
ClassicShell etc, but I do remember being frustrated by the way it
covered the standard 8 Start Button that led to the metro screen. At the
time, I was playing with some audio software that required a start
process where I had to start the program in the desktop, switch to metro
for the driver interface program, then back to the desktop to start the
main program doing something.
With the tiny window covered, I had to invoke the Charms thing (which I
had to make able to be invoked from a screen icon) or hit a key. I was
mainly using a Lenovo tablet laptop convertible, so this was a huge pain
when the real keyboard was underneath.
I also "supported" a couple of people who had been forced onto Windows
8. One of them had invested in Start8, the other was fighting the
default program, so I had to be able to see what she was encountering.
--
Bill

In message , Big_Al
writes
And some programs that are not for ALL USERS falls into your start
menu. So you have to make two.
"C:\Users\yourname\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Wi ndows\Start
Menu\Programs" is the shortcut for my start menu. Just insert yourname.

Now after you build these two links and have to constantly decide which
has the link you want, I found this and it worked great. Windows 7
menu is a composite of the admin menu and the user menu, it does it on
the fly. This is the same thing. One menu and all programs.
http://www.eightforums.com/tutorials...ar-create-wind
ows-8-taskbar.html One note, I did this year or so ago, and have not
used it since as I use classic or start8 or startisback on all my
desktops now.

Hmmm, yes I've now tried that one menu thing in 10 and don't think it
helps.
Here, it shows all sorts of old junk like the "apps" and also expands
the list to dozens of entries. For example, there is a huge list in the
list here of MySQL help files, and I don't think I'll ever want to
select mysqlauditgrep(online) as an item in my start menu or (or should
it be nor?) the other 20-odd.

I can't remember all the reasons I didn't like whichever ones I tried of
ClassicShell etc, but I do remember being frustrated by the way it
covered the standard 8 Start Button that led to the metro screen. At the
time, I was playing with some audio software that required a start
process where I had to start the program in the desktop, switch to metro
for the driver interface program, then back to the desktop to start the
main program doing something.
With the tiny window covered, I had to invoke the Charms thing (which I
had to make able to be invoked from a screen icon) or hit a key. I was
mainly using a Lenovo tablet laptop convertible, so this was a huge pain
when the real keyboard was underneath.
I also "supported" a couple of people who had been forced onto Windows
8. One of them had invested in Start8, the other was fighting the
default program, so I had to be able to see what she was encountering.
--
Bill

"Roderick Stewart" wrote in message
news
On Thu, 12 Feb 2015 23:44:30 -0000, "Robert Brereton"
wrote:

some rough edges and missing stuff it seems a million times better than
windows 8. Anyone else agree or not?

Yes, it's a lot better than Windows 8.

But then, look at Windows 8.....

Seriously, I'd advise anybody who has bought a new computer with
Windows 8 to take the free upgrade when it becomes available. I don't
know how much will have changed in the final version, but the preview
version looks quite promising. Not nearly promising enough to entice
me away from Windows 7, but for those who have to accept the latest
Microsoft system because it's on a new computer, 10 is probably going
to be a big improvement over 8.

My two biggest reservations can be put under the headings of "Tiles"
and "Online Accounts".

Tiles.
The start menu is back, but it's just a start menu with tiles, so no
real progress. You can make it fill the screen (just like Windows 8)
or you can make the tiles smaller, but you can't switch them off. When
you make the tiles smaller, the labels disappear, so you are then
faced with the task of identifying things from tiny little icons on
coloured backgrounds, and I'm not even sure if it's possible to choose
the colours. What is Microsoft's obsession with these wretched tiles?
Why can't we just have a menu in the form of a list with the labels in
Plain English? If they feel obliged to cater for those who don't know
the alphabet and can only read pictures, at least they should make the
tiles an option which is switched off by default. Perhaps it could be
one of the items in the "Accessibility" section.

Online Accounts
This is another thing that should be switched off by default, and only
enabled by those who want it. During installation of 8 or 10 there is
a prompt to create an online account for what appears to be some sort
of "cloud" service, and no indication that it is possible to bypass
it. Once you've installed it a few times you know that the trick is to
accept the prompt to create an account, but reject it on the *next*
page, but so-called "cloud computing" is not something that everybody
will want, so they should not be hoodwinked into accepting it.

Rod.

Using Classic Shell, you can turn the tiles off, select a Start Menu style
you like, and customize it to your heart's content, if you so desire :-) Not
sure if the latest release version will do it (Win10TP wouldn't allow me to
install it last time I tried), but the latest Beta version will, and it
works just fine (so far).
--
SC Tom

"Roderick Stewart" wrote in message
news
On Thu, 12 Feb 2015 23:44:30 -0000, "Robert Brereton"
wrote:

some rough edges and missing stuff it seems a million times better than
windows 8. Anyone else agree or not?

Yes, it's a lot better than Windows 8.

But then, look at Windows 8.....

Seriously, I'd advise anybody who has bought a new computer with
Windows 8 to take the free upgrade when it becomes available. I don't
know how much will have changed in the final version, but the preview
version looks quite promising. Not nearly promising enough to entice
me away from Windows 7, but for those who have to accept the latest
Microsoft system because it's on a new computer, 10 is probably going
to be a big improvement over 8.

My two biggest reservations can be put under the headings of "Tiles"
and "Online Accounts".

Tiles.
The start menu is back, but it's just a start menu with tiles, so no
real progress. You can make it fill the screen (just like Windows 8)
or you can make the tiles smaller, but you can't switch them off. When
you make the tiles smaller, the labels disappear, so you are then
faced with the task of identifying things from tiny little icons on
coloured backgrounds, and I'm not even sure if it's possible to choose
the colours. What is Microsoft's obsession with these wretched tiles?
Why can't we just have a menu in the form of a list with the labels in
Plain English? If they feel obliged to cater for those who don't know
the alphabet and can only read pictures, at least they should make the
tiles an option which is switched off by default. Perhaps it could be
one of the items in the "Accessibility" section.

Online Accounts
This is another thing that should be switched off by default, and only
enabled by those who want it. During installation of 8 or 10 there is
a prompt to create an online account for what appears to be some sort
of "cloud" service, and no indication that it is possible to bypass
it. Once you've installed it a few times you know that the trick is to
accept the prompt to create an account, but reject it on the *next*
page, but so-called "cloud computing" is not something that everybody
will want, so they should not be hoodwinked into accepting it.

Rod.

Using Classic Shell, you can turn the tiles off, select a Start Menu style
you like, and customize it to your heart's content, if you so desire :-) Not
sure if the latest release version will do it (Win10TP wouldn't allow me to
install it last time I tried), but the latest Beta version will, and it
works just fine (so far).
--
SC Tom

Bill wrote on 2/14/2015 7:48 AM:
In message , Big_Al
writes
And some programs that are not for ALL USERS falls into your start
menu. So you have to make two.
"C:\Users\yourname\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Win dows\Start
Menu\Programs" is the shortcut for my start menu. Just insert yourname.

Now after you build these two links and have to constantly decide which
has the link you want, I found this and it worked great. Windows 7
menu is a composite of the admin menu and the user menu, it does it on
the fly. This is the same thing. One menu and all programs.
http://www.eightforums.com/tutorials...ar-create-wind
ows-8-taskbar.html One note, I did this year or so ago, and have not
used it since as I use classic or start8 or startisback on all my
desktops now.

Hmmm, yes I've now tried that one menu thing in 10 and don't think it
helps.
Here, it shows all sorts of old junk like the "apps" and also expands
the list to dozens of entries. For example, there is a huge list in the
list here of MySQL help files, and I don't think I'll ever want to
select mysqlauditgrep(online) as an item in my start menu or (or should
it be nor?) the other 20-odd.

I can't remember all the reasons I didn't like whichever ones I tried of
ClassicShell etc, but I do remember being frustrated by the way it
covered the standard 8 Start Button that led to the metro screen. At the
time, I was playing with some audio software that required a start
process where I had to start the program in the desktop, switch to metro
for the driver interface program, then back to the desktop to start the
main program doing something.
With the tiny window covered, I had to invoke the Charms thing (which I
had to make able to be invoked from a screen icon) or hit a key. I was
mainly using a Lenovo tablet laptop convertible, so this was a huge pain
when the real keyboard was underneath.
I also "supported" a couple of people who had been forced onto Windows
8. One of them had invested in Start8, the other was fighting the
default program, so I had to be able to see what she was encountering.

I use StartisBack. It does not seem to interfere with the logo key toggling into apps and desktop. At least the way I
have it configured. I like going in and out of the apps menu now and then, there are some things there of interest.

The only issue I have with the apps screen is if you leave all the links that installers put in the start menu for stuff
like "home page" or "online help" and especially "uninstall", they all show up on the metro screen. So I wind up
spending time purging the junk to make metro cleaner. ..and smaller.

Bill wrote on 2/14/2015 7:48 AM:
In message , Big_Al
writes
And some programs that are not for ALL USERS falls into your start
menu. So you have to make two.
"C:\Users\yourname\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Win dows\Start
Menu\Programs" is the shortcut for my start menu. Just insert yourname.

Now after you build these two links and have to constantly decide which
has the link you want, I found this and it worked great. Windows 7
menu is a composite of the admin menu and the user menu, it does it on
the fly. This is the same thing. One menu and all programs.
http://www.eightforums.com/tutorials...ar-create-wind
ows-8-taskbar.html One note, I did this year or so ago, and have not
used it since as I use classic or start8 or startisback on all my
desktops now.

Hmmm, yes I've now tried that one menu thing in 10 and don't think it
helps.
Here, it shows all sorts of old junk like the "apps" and also expands
the list to dozens of entries. For example, there is a huge list in the
list here of MySQL help files, and I don't think I'll ever want to
select mysqlauditgrep(online) as an item in my start menu or (or should
it be nor?) the other 20-odd.

I can't remember all the reasons I didn't like whichever ones I tried of
ClassicShell etc, but I do remember being frustrated by the way it
covered the standard 8 Start Button that led to the metro screen. At the
time, I was playing with some audio software that required a start
process where I had to start the program in the desktop, switch to metro
for the driver interface program, then back to the desktop to start the
main program doing something.
With the tiny window covered, I had to invoke the Charms thing (which I
had to make able to be invoked from a screen icon) or hit a key. I was
mainly using a Lenovo tablet laptop convertible, so this was a huge pain
when the real keyboard was underneath.
I also "supported" a couple of people who had been forced onto Windows
8. One of them had invested in Start8, the other was fighting the
default program, so I had to be able to see what she was encountering.

I use StartisBack. It does not seem to interfere with the logo key toggling into apps and desktop. At least the way I
have it configured. I like going in and out of the apps menu now and then, there are some things there of interest.

The only issue I have with the apps screen is if you leave all the links that installers put in the start menu for stuff
like "home page" or "online help" and especially "uninstall", they all show up on the metro screen. So I wind up
spending time purging the junk to make metro cleaner. ..and smaller.

On 2/14/2015 7:05 AM, SC Tom wrote:


"Roderick Stewart" wrote in message
news
On Thu, 12 Feb 2015 23:44:30 -0000, "Robert Brereton"
wrote:

some rough edges and missing stuff it seems a million times better than
windows 8. Anyone else agree or not?

Yes, it's a lot better than Windows 8.

But then, look at Windows 8.....

Seriously, I'd advise anybody who has bought a new computer with
Windows 8 to take the free upgrade when it becomes available. I don't
know how much will have changed in the final version, but the preview
version looks quite promising. Not nearly promising enough to entice
me away from Windows 7, but for those who have to accept the latest
Microsoft system because it's on a new computer, 10 is probably going
to be a big improvement over 8.

My two biggest reservations can be put under the headings of "Tiles"
and "Online Accounts".

Tiles.
The start menu is back, but it's just a start menu with tiles, so no
real progress. You can make it fill the screen (just like Windows 8)
or you can make the tiles smaller, but you can't switch them off. When
you make the tiles smaller, the labels disappear, so you are then
faced with the task of identifying things from tiny little icons on
coloured backgrounds, and I'm not even sure if it's possible to choose
the colours. What is Microsoft's obsession with these wretched tiles?
Why can't we just have a menu in the form of a list with the labels in
Plain English? If they feel obliged to cater for those who don't know
the alphabet and can only read pictures, at least they should make the
tiles an option which is switched off by default. Perhaps it could be
one of the items in the "Accessibility" section.

Online Accounts
This is another thing that should be switched off by default, and only
enabled by those who want it. During installation of 8 or 10 there is
a prompt to create an online account for what appears to be some sort
of "cloud" service, and no indication that it is possible to bypass
it. Once you've installed it a few times you know that the trick is to
accept the prompt to create an account, but reject it on the *next*
page, but so-called "cloud computing" is not something that everybody
will want, so they should not be hoodwinked into accepting it.

Rod.

Using Classic Shell, you can turn the tiles off, select a Start Menu
style you like, and customize it to your heart's content, if you so
desire :-) Not sure if the latest release version will do it (Win10TP
wouldn't allow me to install it last time I tried), but the latest Beta
version will, and it works just fine (so far).


Tried the start menu thing, works OK but not to my liking.
Went back to Classic Shell Beta and works like a charm.

Regards, Rene

On 2/14/2015 7:05 AM, SC Tom wrote:


"Roderick Stewart" wrote in message
news
On Thu, 12 Feb 2015 23:44:30 -0000, "Robert Brereton"
wrote:

some rough edges and missing stuff it seems a million times better than
windows 8. Anyone else agree or not?

Yes, it's a lot better than Windows 8.

But then, look at Windows 8.....

Seriously, I'd advise anybody who has bought a new computer with
Windows 8 to take the free upgrade when it becomes available. I don't
know how much will have changed in the final version, but the preview
version looks quite promising. Not nearly promising enough to entice
me away from Windows 7, but for those who have to accept the latest
Microsoft system because it's on a new computer, 10 is probably going
to be a big improvement over 8.

My two biggest reservations can be put under the headings of "Tiles"
and "Online Accounts".

Tiles.
The start menu is back, but it's just a start menu with tiles, so no
real progress. You can make it fill the screen (just like Windows 8)
or you can make the tiles smaller, but you can't switch them off. When
you make the tiles smaller, the labels disappear, so you are then
faced with the task of identifying things from tiny little icons on
coloured backgrounds, and I'm not even sure if it's possible to choose
the colours. What is Microsoft's obsession with these wretched tiles?
Why can't we just have a menu in the form of a list with the labels in
Plain English? If they feel obliged to cater for those who don't know
the alphabet and can only read pictures, at least they should make the
tiles an option which is switched off by default. Perhaps it could be
one of the items in the "Accessibility" section.

Online Accounts
This is another thing that should be switched off by default, and only
enabled by those who want it. During installation of 8 or 10 there is
a prompt to create an online account for what appears to be some sort
of "cloud" service, and no indication that it is possible to bypass
it. Once you've installed it a few times you know that the trick is to
accept the prompt to create an account, but reject it on the *next*
page, but so-called "cloud computing" is not something that everybody
will want, so they should not be hoodwinked into accepting it.

Rod.

Using Classic Shell, you can turn the tiles off, select a Start Menu
style you like, and customize it to your heart's content, if you so
desire :-) Not sure if the latest release version will do it (Win10TP
wouldn't allow me to install it last time I tried), but the latest Beta
version will, and it works just fine (so far).


Tried the start menu thing, works OK but not to my liking.
Went back to Classic Shell Beta and works like a charm.

Regards, Rene

On Fri, 13 Feb 2015 21:34:27 -0500, Big_Al wrote:

Gene E. Bloch wrote on 2/13/2015 7:40 PM:
On Fri, 13 Feb 2015 19:24:37 -0500, Big_Al wrote:

Nil wrote on 2/13/2015 12:33 PM:
On 13 Feb 2015, Big_Al wrote in
alt.comp.os.windows-10:

Either it's one odd ball
editor or it's a lot of editors and the chances of happening are
so low that it seems like it's just one editor doing it. Either
way it's an odd happening.

Two spaces after a sentence is pretty much obsolete. One space is
considered to be standard form now. The justification seems to have to
with the prevalence of proportional spacing fonts and automatic
kerning. Two spaces improved readability in the days of monospace
typewriters, but not with modern computer text, or so I have read. Even
though I still sometimes fall back on my typing training and type two
spaces, I have to agree - one space or two makes little difference to
my eyes.

Thanks for that reply. I never had a good justification for one space, and not saying your answer is correct but it
sure sounds valid. Better than my "duh!!" response.

I prefer one space after a period or after a colon, but it's more like
because I'm contrary.

But I really do think it looks better.

I get to republish some info that someone else has published in a
different place, and I go through it changing all those double spaces to
single spaces. The people who originally published it never complain.
Probably never notice :-)

It's not much stuff and not very often, so it's not a big chore for me,
and I always chortle when I do it.

Some of it also comes with tabs to align text, and I change them to
spaces, since I'm sure the viewers will not all have the same default
spacing for tabs.

Tabs slay me. I use Notepad++ and then notepad does it diff, word diff, etc. It's fun.

That's what keeps us on our toes...

--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)

On 14 Feb 2015 08:44:48 GMT, Jeff Gaines wrote:

On 14/02/2015 in message Gene E.
Bloch wrote:

Well, I ever noticed until I read Bill's confession. Yep - one word,
camel case. Or do I mean CamelCase?

WellItsDefinitelyOneOrTheOther :-)

LOL

You made my mind reel :-)

--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)

On Sat, 14 Feb 2015 08:05:12 -0500, "SC Tom" wrote:


Using Classic Shell, you can turn the tiles off, select a Start Menu style
you like, and customize it to your heart's content, if you so desire :-) Not
sure if the latest release version will do it (Win10TP wouldn't allow me to
install it last time I tried), but the latest Beta version will, and it
works just fine (so far).

Tried Classic Shell with Windows 8, and although it does a nice job,
it shouldn't really be necessary to add anything to make the operating
system itself behave as it should. I thought they were going to fix
this in Windows 10, but it appears they haven't quite done it yet.

Rod.

On Sat, 14 Feb 2015 23:46:25 +0000, Roderick Stewart
wrote:

Tried Classic Shell with Windows 8, and although it does a nice job,
it shouldn't really be necessary to add anything to make the operating
system itself behave as it should


I agree with you. It shouldn't be necessary, but it is.

Classic Shell is very good, but in my view,
Start8 (which costs only $5 US) is even better.

Ken Blake, MVP wrote on 2/14/2015 7:04 PM:

Classic Shell is very good, but in my view,
Start8 (which costs only $5 US) is even better.


What do you like about Start8?

Cy Burnot wrote:
Ken Blake, MVP wrote on 2/14/2015 7:04 PM:
Classic Shell is very good, but in my view,
Start8 (which costs only $5 US) is even better.


What do you like about Start8?

You can choose classic Win 7 which is why I like it.

On Sat, 14 Feb 2015 21:14:48 -0500, Dino wrote:

Ken Blake, MVP wrote on 2/14/2015 7:04 PM:
Classic Shell is very good, but in my view,
Start8 (which costs only $5 US) is even better.


What do you like about Start8?

You can choose classic Win 7 which is why I like it.

From recollection (because I no longer have any Windows 8
installations) Classic Shell did have a mode that was very like
Windows 7, or close enough not to matter.

On the other hand, I no longer care because for the time being I'm
using something that looks even more like Windows 7. It's called
Windows 7.

I shan't even be bothering with any of these third party menu systems
while evaluating Windows 10, because as far as I'm concerned an
operating system can only be considered valid if it performs in a
suitably ergonomic fashion as supplied. Departure from defaults should
only be for personal preference, not to make essential features work.

Rod.