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  #1  
Old May 5th 15, 04:04 PM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.help_and_support
Snuffy \Hub Cap\ McKinney
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Posts: 37
Default Browser for Older OS and Older Users

Sorry, I know this is for XP -- can't find any other groups on older OS's.

Anyone recommend a browser for Win 2000 more functional than IE6 or Firefox 12. Those are the latest versions available for Win 2000 and several issues browsing with both of them. Upgrading OS is not possible in this particular situation -- dealing with elderly folks in another city.

It's important that these folks keep internet access because it's the only outside resource many of them have. But upgrading to a newer OS is not something they can do without help.

I have search online and no luck so far.

Thanks in advance.
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  #2  
Old May 5th 15, 08:53 PM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.help_and_support
VanguardLH[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,881
Default Browser for Older OS and Older Users

Snuffy McKinney wrote:

Sorry, I know this is for XP -- can't find any other groups on older
OS's.


microsoft.public.win2000.general
alt.os.windows2000

Anyone recommend a browser for Win 2000 more functional than IE6 or
Firefox 12.


Google Chrome
https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/95346?hl=en
Only goes back to Windows XP, and only until the end of this year when
Google will discard support for Windows XP. I suspect when Google drops
Windows XP that other web browsers will, too.

https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb...s-windows-2000
Yep, Mozilla dropped support for Windows 2000 so all you can use are
their really old versions. Firefox 12 is about 2-1/2 years old. Of
course, Windows 2000 is over 15 years old with mainstream support dead
10 years ago and extended support dead 5 years ago.

As to finding web browsers that claim they still support Windows 2000:

http://www.seamonkey-project.org/doc...m-requirements
That says Seamonkey still supports Windows 2000.

http://www.softpedia.com/get/Interne...axthon-3.shtml
Could not find system requirements for Maxthon Cloud or even their older
versions at the Maxthon site other than supports [all] versions of
Windows (which is not true since 9x-based versions of Windows are not
included). There is a wiki for Maxthon but it has not been updated for
6 years. The following download site says Windows 2000 is supported:
http://www.softpedia.com/get/Interne...axthon-3.shtml.

http://www.avantbrowser.com/support.aspx#systemreq
Says it supports all the way back to Windows NT (probably means NT 4).

Just because web browsers support Windows 2000 doesn't mean sites will
accept connections from those web browsers. Rather than test a web
browsing client for its capabilities, many sites still use the User
Agent string sent by the web browser to determine if the site will work
with that web browser. Sites will often list only a certain range of
web browsers and their versions by looking at the UA string sent by the
client. If the client's UA string isn't in their list, they may limit
or restrict access to their site. I don't know what UA string is sent
by Maxthon or Avant Browser. Those clients might have their own UA
string or they might send a UA string representing an old version of IE
or Firefox (or for whichever rendering engine is in use at the time).
There are add-ons (for some web browsers) that lets you send a different
UA string to lie to sites that use the UA string to determine if they
allow your web browser to [fully] use their site; however, lying about
which web browser connected to them will not magically create functions
that are missing in your client that a site may rely upon.
  #3  
Old May 6th 15, 01:21 AM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.help_and_support,alt.windows7.general
Snuffy \Hub Cap\ McKinney
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 37
Default Browser for Older OS and Older Users

"VanguardLH" wrote in message ...
Snuffy McKinney wrote:

Sorry, I know this is for XP -- can't find any other groups on older
OS's.


microsoft.public.win2000.general
alt.os.windows2000

Anyone recommend a browser for Win 2000 more functional than IE6 or
Firefox 12.


Google Chrome
https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/95346?hl=en
Only goes back to Windows XP, and only until the end of this year when
Google will discard support for Windows XP. I suspect when Google drops
Windows XP that other web browsers will, too.

https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb...s-windows-2000
Yep, Mozilla dropped support for Windows 2000 so all you can use are
their really old versions. Firefox 12 is about 2-1/2 years old. Of
course, Windows 2000 is over 15 years old with mainstream support dead
10 years ago and extended support dead 5 years ago.

As to finding web browsers that claim they still support Windows 2000:

http://www.seamonkey-project.org/doc...m-requirements
That says Seamonkey still supports Windows 2000.

http://www.softpedia.com/get/Interne...axthon-3.shtml
Could not find system requirements for Maxthon Cloud or even their older
versions at the Maxthon site other than supports [all] versions of
Windows (which is not true since 9x-based versions of Windows are not
included). There is a wiki for Maxthon but it has not been updated for
6 years. The following download site says Windows 2000 is supported:
http://www.softpedia.com/get/Interne...axthon-3.shtml.

http://www.avantbrowser.com/support.aspx#systemreq
Says it supports all the way back to Windows NT (probably means NT 4).

Just because web browsers support Windows 2000 doesn't mean sites will
accept connections from those web browsers. Rather than test a web
browsing client for its capabilities, many sites still use the User
Agent string sent by the web browser to determine if the site will work
with that web browser. Sites will often list only a certain range of
web browsers and their versions by looking at the UA string sent by the
client. If the client's UA string isn't in their list, they may limit
or restrict access to their site. I don't know what UA string is sent
by Maxthon or Avant Browser. Those clients might have their own UA
string or they might send a UA string representing an old version of IE
or Firefox (or for whichever rendering engine is in use at the time).
There are add-ons (for some web browsers) that lets you send a different
UA string to lie to sites that use the UA string to determine if they
allow your web browser to [fully] use their site; however, lying about
which web browser connected to them will not magically create functions
that are missing in your client that a site may rely upon.


Thanks VLH!! Very much appreciated. This will be a stopgap measure to keep their computer going unitl I can find the simplest way to get them upgraded with only non-technical people around to help. "Put plug A into slot B", etc... This is actually the way computers should work for everyone.

Especially as times goes on, average folks are getting less and less technically savvy. In the old timey days when folks lived on farms, they could do everything themselves. Now if someone pulls a sock into the vacuum cleaner it goes to the repair shop.


  #4  
Old May 6th 15, 12:22 PM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.help_and_support,alt.windows7.general
Richard Owlett[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5
Default Browser for Older OS and Older Users

Snuffy "Hub Cap" McKinney wrote:
"VanguardLH" wrote in message ...
Snuffy McKinney wrote:

Sorry, I know this is for XP -- can't find any other groups on older
OS's.


microsoft.public.win2000.general
alt.os.windows2000

Anyone recommend a browser for Win 2000 more functional than IE6 or
Firefox 12.


Google Chrome
https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/95346?hl=en
Only goes back to Windows XP, and only until the end of this year when
Google will discard support for Windows XP. I suspect when Google drops
Windows XP that other web browsers will, too.

https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb...s-windows-2000
Yep, Mozilla dropped support for Windows 2000 so all you can use are
their really old versions. Firefox 12 is about 2-1/2 years old. Of
course, Windows 2000 is over 15 years old with mainstream support dead
10 years ago and extended support dead 5 years ago.

As to finding web browsers that claim they still support Windows 2000:

http://www.seamonkey-project.org/doc...m-requirements
That says SeaMonkey still supports Windows 2000.

http://www.softpedia.com/get/Interne...axthon-3.shtml
Could not find system requirements for Maxthon Cloud or even their older
versions at the Maxthon site other than supports [all] versions of
Windows (which is not true since 9x-based versions of Windows are not
included). There is a wiki for Maxthon but it has not been updated for
6 years. The following download site says Windows 2000 is supported:
http://www.softpedia.com/get/Interne...axthon-3.shtml.

http://www.avantbrowser.com/support.aspx#systemreq
Says it supports all the way back to Windows NT (probably means NT 4).

Just because web browsers support Windows 2000 doesn't mean sites will
accept connections from those web browsers. Rather than test a web
browsing client for its capabilities, many sites still use the User
Agent string sent by the web browser to determine if the site will work
with that web browser. Sites will often list only a certain range of
web browsers and their versions by looking at the UA string sent by the
client. If the client's UA string isn't in their list, they may limit
or restrict access to their site. I don't know what UA string is sent
by Maxthon or Avant Browser. Those clients might have their own UA
string or they might send a UA string representing an old version of IE
or Firefox (or for whichever rendering engine is in use at the time).
There are add-ons (for some web browsers) that lets you send a different
UA string to lie to sites that use the UA string to determine if they
allow your web browser to [fully] use their site; however, lying about
which web browser connected to them will not magically create functions
that are missing in your client that a site may rely upon.


Thanks VLH!! Very much appreciated. This will be a stopgap measure to keep their computer going unitl I can find the simplest way to get them upgraded with only non-technical people around to help. "Put plug A into slot B", etc... This is actually the way computers should work for everyone.

Especially as times goes on, average folks are getting less and less technically savvy. In the old timey days when folks lived on farms, they could do everything themselves. Now if someone pulls a sock into the vacuum cleaner it goes to the repair shop.



Just as a reality check.
I'm happily using SeaMonkey 2.26.1 on WinXP Pro SP3 .
I've never bothered to play with the UA string.

I recommend following discussion of the last couple of SeaMonkey
releases on mozilla.support.seamonkey (server is
news.mozilla.org). I've noticed some grumbling about glitches in
last couple of releases - I've not followed it closely as I'm
obviously not one needing the "latest and greatest" doodads

P.S. I was born when rationing was current events.



  #5  
Old May 6th 15, 06:23 PM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.help_and_support,alt.windows7.general
Mark Lloyd[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,756
Default Browser for Older OS and Older Users

On 05/05/2015 07:21 PM, Snuffy "Hub Cap" McKinney wrote:

[snip]

http://www.seamonkey-project.org/doc...m-requirements
That says Seamonkey still supports Windows 2000.


That appears to be an old page. The current version of Seamonkey does
NOT work on w2k.

As I expected, the changes (that make the new version incompatible with
w2k) are in the Gecko browser engine so would apply to any browser using it.

I just tried it to verify this. Seamonkey (latest version) puts up an
error message saying it requires at least XP SP2. The last version of
Seamonkey that supports w2k is from same time as the last version of
Firefox that supports w2k.

[snip]

--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"The worst of madmen is a saint run mad" [Alexander Pope]
  #6  
Old May 6th 15, 07:55 PM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.help_and_support,alt.windows7.general
VanguardLH[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,881
Default Browser for Older OS and Older Users

Richard Owlett wrote:

Snuffy McKinney wrote:

VanguardLH wrote ...

Snuffy McKinney wrote:

Anyone recommend a browser for Win 2000 more functional than IE6 or
Firefox 12.

http://www.seamonkey-project.org/doc...m-requirements
http://www.softpedia.com/get/Interne...axthon-3.shtml
http://www.avantbrowser.com/support.aspx#systemreq

Just because web browsers support Windows 2000 doesn't mean sites will
accept connections from those web browsers. Rather than test a web
browsing client for its capabilities, many sites still use the User
Agent string sent by the web browser to determine if the site will work
with that web browser.


This will be a stopgap measure to keep their computer going unitl I
can find the simplest way to get them upgraded with only
non-technical people around to help.


I'm happily using SeaMonkey 2.26.1 on WinXP Pro SP3 .
I've never bothered to play with the UA string.


http://www.useragentstring.com/pages/SeaMonkey/

Looks like Seamonkey reveals the OS and version on which it runs.

http://www.useragentstring.com/SeaMo...6_id_16087.php

Shows Seamonkey's UA string shows Windows 2000 as the client's OS
version. So a site can still decide whether or not to let connect a
client running on that OS. Personal experience is limited as to
ascertaining if sites will allow the OP's customers to connect or not.
  #7  
Old May 6th 15, 08:01 PM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.help_and_support,alt.windows7.general
VanguardLH[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,881
Default Browser for Older OS and Older Users

Mark Lloyd wrote:

VanguardLH (not Snuffy McKinney) wrote:

http://www.seamonkey-project.org/doc...m-requirements
That says Seamonkey still supports Windows 2000.


That appears to be an old page. The current version of Seamonkey does
NOT work on w2k.

As I expected, the changes (that make the new version incompatible with
w2k) are in the Gecko browser engine so would apply to any browser using it.

I just tried it to verify this. Seamonkey (latest version) puts up an
error message saying it requires at least XP SP2. The last version of
Seamonkey that supports w2k is from same time as the last version of
Firefox that supports w2k.


They need to update their documentation page(s); else, they mislead
their [prospective] users.

http://www.seamonkey-project.org/doc...m-requirements

That page has support starting from Windows XP SP2. So it looks like
Maxthon and Avant Browser are left for use on Windows 2000. I didn't
bother researching all the minor variants of web browsers.

  #8  
Old May 6th 15, 08:33 PM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.help_and_support,alt.windows7.general
VanguardLH[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,881
Default Browser for Older OS and Older Users

Snuffy McKinney wrote:

Especially as times goes on, average folks are getting less and less
technically savvy. In the old timey days when folks lived on farms,
they could do everything themselves. Now if someone pulls a sock into
the vacuum cleaner it goes to the repair shop.


In the old timey days, personal computers cost from $2500 to $8000. So
hobbyists with lots of spare cash were buying PCs, not boobs that think
computers are like washing machines. With that huge layout of money,
you damn well took the time to learn how to be an expert admin. Back
then, a high-end VCR cost $900 so you learned how to use it versus the
$20 DVD players of today made for simpletons.

Saturating the market means reaching ignorant consumers.
  #9  
Old May 6th 15, 10:06 PM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.help_and_support,alt.windows7.general
Roger Blake[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 536
Default Browser for Older OS and Older Users

On 2015-05-06, VanguardLH wrote:
Saturating the market means reaching ignorant consumers.


I've given up suggesting that people should know what the hell they
are doing, it's just met with squawking about elitism, etc. Idiocracy
is our future.

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Roger Blake (Change "invalid" to "com" for email. Google Groups killfiled.)

NSA sedition and treason -- http://www.DeathToNSAthugs.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
  #10  
Old May 7th 15, 04:59 AM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.help_and_support,alt.windows7.general
VanguardLH[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,881
Default Browser for Older OS and Older Users

Roger Blake wrote:

VanguardLH wrote:

Saturating the market means reaching ignorant consumers.


I've given up suggesting that people should know what the hell they
are doing, it's just met with squawking about elitism, etc. Idiocracy
is our future.


Texting and social sites are destroying content. No contemplation, no
review before send, nothing much important but just a bunch of short
inane scribbles, and the Pavlov response of having to immediately reply.
Ooh, got a text, have to reply now while ignoring everyone around them
with whom they're supposed to be socializing. They're becoming isolated
anti-socials despite the pretense that they're communicationg with
someone. They won't call the other party and actually talk with them
because their speech and cognitive abilities are horrible.

Father Guido Sarducci's "5 Minute University"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLAd4NzuqYM

Sad is that he wasn't that far off.
  #11  
Old May 7th 15, 01:12 PM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.help_and_support,alt.windows7.general
Rene Lamontagne
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,549
Default Browser for Older OS and Older Users

On 5/6/2015 10:59 PM, VanguardLH wrote:
Roger Blake wrote:

VanguardLH wrote:

Saturating the market means reaching ignorant consumers.


I've given up suggesting that people should know what the hell they
are doing, it's just met with squawking about elitism, etc. Idiocracy
is our future.


Texting and social sites are destroying content. No contemplation, no
review before send, nothing much important but just a bunch of short
inane scribbles, and the Pavlov response of having to immediately reply.
Ooh, got a text, have to reply now while ignoring everyone around them
with whom they're supposed to be socializing. They're becoming isolated
anti-socials despite the pretense that they're communicationg with
someone. They won't call the other party and actually talk with them
because their speech and cognitive abilities are horrible.

Father Guido Sarducci's "5 Minute University"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLAd4NzuqYM

Sad is that he wasn't that far off.



You're so right VangurdLH, The cellphone and texting are the most Stupid
antyisocial things ever invented.


Regards, Rene

  #12  
Old May 10th 15, 01:25 AM posted to microsoft.public.windowsxp.help_and_support
masonc
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 152
Default Browser for Older OS and Older Users

On Tue, 5 May 2015 14:53:55 -0500, VanguardLH wrote:

Snuffy McKinney wrote:

Sorry, I know this is for XP -- can't find any other groups on older
OS's.


microsoft.public.win2000.general
alt.os.windows2000

Anyone recommend a browser for Win 2000 more functional than IE6 or
Firefox 12.


Google Chrome
https://support.google.com/chrome/answer/95346?hl=en
Only goes back to Windows XP, and only until the end of this year when
Google will discard support for Windows XP. I suspect when Google drops
Windows XP that other web browsers will, too.


Time now for class-action to protect $$MM investments in XP

Must wait for the damage to be real -- for the case to be "ripe"

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
http://www.avast.com

 




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