Does dual boot need two Windows 10 licenses

JiiPee wrote:

VanguardLH wrote:

There is the indefinitely long-term use of the trial version, though, if
you don't mind a few gotchas (some with workarounds). Used to be
Windows gave you a 30-day trial window before it self-crippled unless
you activated before the trial expired. Windows 10 doesn't do that: no
expiration of the trial. You can continue using the trial past 30 days.
The trial version is free.

ok this might help. Is this still available? do you have the link
please? i have tried to find but cannot.

Use the Media Creation Tool to get an ISO for the install. Same place
everyone else gets the Windows 10 "download" (except for those who got
nailed by the GWX "update").

https://www.windowscentral.com/you-d...ate-windows-10

Just skip the part when the installer asks for a product key.

JiiPee wrote:

On 28/07/2017 23:55, Ken Blake wrote:
On Fri, 28 Jul 2017 21:56:05 +0100, JiiPee wrote:

If I install Windows 10 two times on my computer and make it dual
bootable do I need two Windows 10 licenses? Obviously am running only
one Windows 10 at a time.

Yes, you need two licenses. How many you are running at a time is
irrelevant. You need one license for each installation.

Just curious, why do you want to do this?


I am a computer programmer, so I need to run "dangerous" and risky
programs at times. I dont want to run them on my home-Windows10 because
if something goes wrong i get messed up Win10 and viruses etc.

I develop softwares and clients send me all kind of stuff to run. Also I
need to sometimes use their screen sharing programs which i dont trust,
so would not like to run them on my home Windows10.

For this reason I actually need multiple Wind10 settings for different
scenarios.

I also need a quick way to replace the infected Win10 (like if ite get
messed up after some testing).

Multiboot won't protect the other drives unless you don't power them up
or go into the BIOS/UEFI to disable their controller. If you multiboot
using different partitions on the same disk, you cannot protect the
other partitions from malware. Not all malware needs a drive letter
assignment to get at the contents of a partition.

In fact, you can run into Windows installations where a new install will
detect there is a prior installation and, for example, change drive
letters for the new install (and why some users report their new Windows
install is running from drive D.

In your case, and to keep other instances of an OS safe from malware
infecting one of them, swap out the disks. You can get carriers to
install in the external drive bay so you can slide in/out different
disks. With a disk sitting on a desk and if infected, it cannot do
anything outside the computer. With the other non-infected disks
sitting on the desk, the infected disk slid into the computer and
powered up cannot reach the non-infected disks sitting on the desk. The
disks are physically disconnected, not just logically disconnected.
Your computer would be a test platform with one or a set of test disks
or a product platform with the normal disks for the OS that you want to
use for yourself.

You could use virtual machines but all software runs slower on emulated
hardware. Plus some malware can detect when it is loaded inside a VM
and will remain quiescent hoping the user installs outside the VM
thinking the software is safe. With a "test" disk in a hotswap bay and
using VMs on that test platform, you could have multiple VMs used for
different testing purposes and if the malware every escapes, well, its a
physically isolated drive in the hotswap bay so your productions disks
are still safe.

VanguardLH wrote:
JiiPee wrote:

VanguardLH wrote:

There is the indefinitely long-term use of the trial version, though, if
you don't mind a few gotchas (some with workarounds). Used to be
Windows gave you a 30-day trial window before it self-crippled unless
you activated before the trial expired. Windows 10 doesn't do that: no
expiration of the trial. You can continue using the trial past 30 days.
The trial version is free.
ok this might help. Is this still available? do you have the link
please? i have tried to find but cannot.

Use the Media Creation Tool to get an ISO for the install. Same place
everyone else gets the Windows 10 "download" (except for those who got
nailed by the GWX "update").

https://www.windowscentral.com/you-d...ate-windows-10

Just skip the part when the installer asks for a product key.

There's another way to do it. As long as the System Reserved
contains your /boot and /boot/BCD, you can backup C: and then
restore it immediately next to C: as a new D: drive.

+-----+------------------+----------+-------+------------------------------+
| MBR | System Reserved | Win10 C: | ... | Win10 cloned partition as D: |
+-----+------------------+----------+-------+------------------------------+

If your disk is legacy partitioned (four primary partitions max),
then that's also a concern - you need to have enough slots
in the partition table left to do it. Normally, this would
be the case, if you were a home user, and all you'd done was
installed Win10. There should be at least one left.

Using EasyBCD, you can add the second OS to the boot menu.

While still booted in the original OS, you can label
it with this kind of command.

bcdedit /set {current} description "Win10 Original"

You would need the identifier of the other OS, to label it
during the same session of Administrator Command Prompt.
The Macrium clone operation is presumed to have changed the
identifier of the partition when it was cloned. Some other
cloning techniques, would not have changed the identifier
for you. Macrium is normally pretty good about preventing
disasters involving the disk identifiers (I've not seen
it purposely bust something).

Now comes the tough part. You need the original
partition to not be present during the first boot
of the clone partition. You can do this with PTEDIT32,
at least for legacy MSDOS pattitioned disks. I don't know
how to do it for GPT partitioned disks. With PTEDIT32, you'd
set the partition type of the original C: to 00, which makes
the partition table entry free for reuse! This trick is not
to be used lightly. You *do not dare* use Disk Management,
or any kind of disk maintenance utility while the partition
table is modified in this way. Then, you boot the clone,
wait long enough for it to stabilize (stop messing around),
then use PTEDIT32 a second time, set the partition type
back to 07 (NTFS). Make sure the value is written back,
then shut down the clone, and on the next boot, both
entries in the boot menu ("Win10 Original" and "Win10")
should both be working.

That's a way of preserving your set of installed software.

I had one disaster while doing this, but because I had
my full backup, I could start over. That's where I learned
the importance of *not using disk maintenance programs*
while the partition table has a slot purposely set to 00
as a subterfuge.

*******

PTEDIT32 used to be an easy download from Symantec FTP. It's
been removed (after sitting there for years and years). The
last known method is to use a trial copy hosted on a downloader
site. PTEDIT32 is considered a utility in this package, and
is not license encumbered. Which is why it was offered for
download. The main program in the package would be license
encumbered (it accepts a license key). PTEDIT32 is portable,
and once extracted, you can copy it all over the place.

http://www.download3k.com/System-Uti...ion-Magic.html

enpm800retaildemo.zip 23,776,770 bytes

You can use 7ZIP to burrow into the file and extract
the copy of PTEDIT32.exe.

L:\enpm800retaildemo.zip\Setup\PMagic.cab\
PTEDIT32.EXE 503,808 bytes September 16, 2002, 2:24:48 AM

PTEDIT32 is great for editing the partition table on legacy
MSDOS disks. It also allows you to see the single 0xEE partition
of a GPT disk (not that there is any good edits you can do to
such things). PTEDIT32 was invented before GPT came along,
so it doesn't know anything about modern disk partitioning.

HTH,
Paul

VanguardLH wrote:


You could use virtual machines but all software runs slower on emulated
hardware.

This is true.

X86 on X86 - runs at 0.9z of normal speed
- in other words, it's just as fast

PPC on X86 - runs at 0.1x to 0.01x of normal speed
- code which is translated and cached, runs at 0.1x
It's pretty hard to make it that good, the translation.
- dumb translators that keep translating loop structures
without caching anything, run at 0.01x.
- yes, this feels slow or very slow. I used to use
this at work, running x86-on-Sparc and it was sloooow.
- examples include PearPC and SheepShaver (both of
which I've run here).

So for homogenous cases (which this case is), there
is no penalty to speak of. X86-on-x86 runs practically
native, with only privileged instructions trapped and
emulated as appropriate. The BIOS inside the VM may
declare the processor as a "Pentium III", but any
utility that does instruction set tests, will "taste"
the Core2 instructions, see that SSE2 is present, or
whatever. Hardware detection ends up being just a
bit goofy (not normally an issue, YMMV). Hardly anything
pays attention to a BIOS declaration.

One other observation. The hosting software makes
a different. Windows Virtual PC (provided by Microsoft)
only supported one processor core. That's a previous
generation of VM host. Modern VM hosts support multiple
cores. In addition, VirtualBox has "experimental DirectX
acceleration" on the video card interface, so it is also
possible to get *some* graphics operations accelerated.
But this isn't perfect of course. If your guest OS
uses OpenGL, that might not be accelerated. So I don't
generally rely on such features myself, to bail me out.
I don't try to play games in VM guests. But for
regular computing, a VM guest is fine for that purpose.
Hell, I could even do video transcoding in there if
I wanted, just as long as I turned on all cores in
the host settings panel.

So the only host I'd stay away from is VPC2007 or
Windows Virtual PC, as those two are single core
hosting solutions. Since those don't run on Windows 10
anyway, there is nothing to worry about.

Paul

On 7/29/2017 7:47 AM, JiiPee wrote:
On 28/07/2017 23:55, Ken Blake wrote:
On Fri, 28 Jul 2017 21:56:05 +0100, JiiPee wrote:

If I install Windows 10 two times on my computer and make it dual
bootable do I need two Windows 10 licenses? Obviously am running only
one Windows 10 at a time.

Yes, you need two licenses. How many you are running at a time is
irrelevant. You need one license for each installation.

Just curious, why do you want to do this?


I am a computer programmer, so I need to run "dangerous" and risky
programs at times. I dont want to run them on my home-Windows10 because
if something goes wrong i get messed up Win10 and viruses etc.

I develop softwares and clients send me all kind of stuff to run. Also I
need to sometimes use their screen sharing programs which i dont trust,
so would not like to run them on my home Windows10.

For this reason I actually need multiple Wind10 settings for different
scenarios.

I also need a quick way to replace the infected Win10 (like if ite get
messed up after some testing).

You need a separate computer for doing risky things.
Used computers are cheaper than dirt...get a used machine.

I use plugin hard disks for this...on separate hardware.
Use Macrium reflect for backup.
Create a "Macrium recocvery disk" on a thumb drive.
Copy the backup of your baseline system to the thumb drive.
If you have a big enough thumb drive, you can copy as many different
baseline systems as you like. Make a backup system for each customer.
Only need one key for the batch.
When you trash it, boot the recovery thumb drive and restore the backup.
This, in conjunction with multiple plugin hard drives gives you a lot
of flexibility. It also removes the uncertainties of using virtual
machines. When evaluating or debugging, I want as few uncertainties
and ambiguities as possible.

There's another way that often works.
Comodo Free Ineternet security premium
gives you a sandbox.
Single click gets you a sandbox to play with.
If you trash that, just reset the sandbox it and start over.
Sometimes it has issues when installing software in the sandbox,
but mostly it just works.

On Sat, 29 Jul 2017 22:49:28 -0700, mike wrote:

On 7/29/2017 7:47 AM, JiiPee wrote:
On 28/07/2017 23:55, Ken Blake wrote:
On Fri, 28 Jul 2017 21:56:05 +0100, JiiPee wrote:

If I install Windows 10 two times on my computer and make it dual
bootable do I need two Windows 10 licenses? Obviously am running only
one Windows 10 at a time.

Yes, you need two licenses. How many you are running at a time is
irrelevant. You need one license for each installation.

Just curious, why do you want to do this?


I am a computer programmer, so I need to run "dangerous" and risky
programs at times. I dont want to run them on my home-Windows10 because
if something goes wrong i get messed up Win10 and viruses etc.

I develop softwares and clients send me all kind of stuff to run. Also I
need to sometimes use their screen sharing programs which i dont trust,
so would not like to run them on my home Windows10.

For this reason I actually need multiple Wind10 settings for different
scenarios.

I also need a quick way to replace the infected Win10 (like if ite get
messed up after some testing).

You need a separate computer for doing risky things.


Yes, as I said in my reply to his message.

On 30/07/2017 06:49, mike wrote:
On 7/29/2017 7:47 AM, JiiPee wrote:

You need a separate computer for doing risky things.
Used computers are cheaper than dirt...get a used machine.

I use plugin hard disks for this...on separate hardware.
Use Macrium reflect for backup.
Create a "Macrium recocvery disk" on a thumb drive.
Copy the backup of your baseline system to the thumb drive.
If you have a big enough thumb drive, you can copy as many different
baseline systems as you like. Make a backup system for each customer.
Only need one key for the batch.
When you trash it, boot the recovery thumb drive and restore the backup.
This, in conjunction with multiple plugin hard drives gives you a lot
of flexibility. It also removes the uncertainties of using virtual
machines. When evaluating or debugging, I want as few uncertainties
and ambiguities as possible.

thanks


There's another way that often works.
Comodo Free Ineternet security premium
gives you a sandbox.
Single click gets you a sandbox to play with.
If you trash that, just reset the sandbox it and start over.
Sometimes it has issues when installing software in the sandbox,
but mostly it just works.

yes this is exellent option, i tried it before, if it just works. But I
a bit have trust problem sometimes... can I trues Comodo.

On 7/30/2017 9:56 AM, JiiPee wrote:
On 30/07/2017 06:49, mike wrote:
On 7/29/2017 7:47 AM, JiiPee wrote:

You need a separate computer for doing risky things.
Used computers are cheaper than dirt...get a used machine.

I use plugin hard disks for this...on separate hardware.
Use Macrium reflect for backup.

Create a "Macrium recocvery disk" on a thumb drive.
Copy the backup of your baseline system to the thumb drive.
If you have a big enough thumb drive, you can copy as many different
baseline systems as you like. Make a backup system for each customer.
Only need one key for the batch.
When you trash it, boot the recovery thumb drive and restore the backup.
This, in conjunction with multiple plugin hard drives gives you a lot
of flexibility. It also removes the uncertainties of using virtual
machines. When evaluating or debugging, I want as few uncertainties
and ambiguities as possible.

thanks


There's another way that often works.
Comodo Free Ineternet security premium
gives you a sandbox.
Single click gets you a sandbox to play with.
If you trash that, just reset the sandbox it and start over.
Sometimes it has issues when installing software in the sandbox,
but mostly it just works.

yes this is exellent option, i tried it before, if it just works. But I
a bit have trust problem sometimes... can I trues Comodo.


Short answer is, "no." You can't trust anybody.
Do you fear that Comodo is malicious?
Do you fear that their sandbox is vulnerable?

Unless you're willing to turn off your computer and go play
golf, there's not much you can do.
Keep backups of everything and just do what you gotta do.
Restore points can be helpful, but I've had them fail to
restore. Seems to be a correlation between how badly you
need the restore and failure to restore. Sigh.

I've had too many issues with dual-boot systems.
Only plug in one drive/OS at a time.

On 29/07/2017 16:09, Ken Blake wrote:
On Sat, 29 Jul 2017 15:47:35 +0100, JiiPee wrote:

On 28/07/2017 23:55, Ken Blake wrote:
On Fri, 28 Jul 2017 21:56:05 +0100, JiiPee wrote:

If I install Windows 10 two times on my computer and make it dual
bootable do I need two Windows 10 licenses? Obviously am running only
one Windows 10 at a time.
Yes, you need two licenses. How many you are running at a time is
irrelevant. You need one license for each installation.

Just curious, why do you want to do this?

I am a computer programmer, so I need to run "dangerous" and risky
programs at times. I dont want to run them on my home-Windows10 because
if something goes wrong i get messed up Win10 and viruses etc.

I develop softwares and clients send me all kind of stuff to run. Also I
need to sometimes use their screen sharing programs which i dont trust,
so would not like to run them on my home Windows10.

For this reason I actually need multiple Wind10 settings for different
scenarios.

I also need a quick way to replace the infected Win10 (like if ite get
messed up after some testing).

OK, but if were me, I would use two separate computers; it would be
safer.


But even then one or both of them might get messed up by virus. Then you
loose all your programs and huge amount of work to install again.
Especially the computer where you run dangerous programs... easily can
be infected by virus. That HypeOS would solve this problem under couple
of mins by double clicking an icon you get a new fresh copy of Windows
with all the programs back and no virus. Its a very good idea, but
unfortunately Microsoft seems to be agains it , So I have to do the
hard work to install again taking many hours.

On 30/07/2017 06:49, mike wrote:
I use plugin hard disks for this...on separate hardware.
Use Macrium reflect for backup.

but, as others said, seems like this backup copy needs its own licence.
So you need 2 licences to do this, because you installed one copy on
your plugin hard disk

On 28/07/2017 23:55, Ken Blake wrote:
On Fri, 28 Jul 2017 21:56:05 +0100, JiiPee wrote:

If I install Windows 10 two times on my computer and make it dual
bootable do I need two Windows 10 licenses? Obviously am running only
one Windows 10 at a time.

Yes, you need two licenses. How many you are running at a time is
irrelevant. You need one license for each installation.

Just curious, why do you want to do this?


On microsoft website some moderator says that making a backup copy for
yourself is allowed, and no need for licence:

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/...e-e396276acde0

". You are allowed to make a backup copy for your own use only."

"JiiPee" wrote in message ...

On 29/07/2017 16:09, Ken Blake wrote:
On Sat, 29 Jul 2017 15:47:35 +0100, JiiPee wrote:

On 28/07/2017 23:55, Ken Blake wrote:
On Fri, 28 Jul 2017 21:56:05 +0100, JiiPee wrote:

If I install Windows 10 two times on my computer and make it dual
bootable do I need two Windows 10 licenses? Obviously am running only
one Windows 10 at a time.
Yes, you need two licenses. How many you are running at a time is
irrelevant. You need one license for each installation.

Just curious, why do you want to do this?

I am a computer programmer, so I need to run "dangerous" and risky
programs at times. I dont want to run them on my home-Windows10 because
if something goes wrong i get messed up Win10 and viruses etc.

I develop softwares and clients send me all kind of stuff to run. Also I
need to sometimes use their screen sharing programs which i dont trust,
so would not like to run them on my home Windows10.

For this reason I actually need multiple Wind10 settings for different
scenarios.

I also need a quick way to replace the infected Win10 (like if ite get
messed up after some testing).

OK, but if were me, I would use two separate computers; it would be
safer.


But even then one or both of them might get messed up by virus. Then you
loose all your programs and huge amount of work to install again.
Especially the computer where you run dangerous programs... easily can be
infected by virus. That HypeOS would solve this problem under couple of
mins by double clicking an icon you get a new fresh copy of Windows with
all the programs back and no virus. Its a very good idea, but unfortunately
Microsoft seems to be agains it , So I have to do the hard work to
install again taking many hours.


I'm not seeing all the responses for this post due to filters but if it
hasn't already been suggested, make a VM (VMWare or other), download and
install Win10 in the VM. You will not need a retail license (key) to run it
and it won't be activated. If I recall, you can run it for 30 days before
you get a watermark showing it's not activated and then goes into limited
functionality.. Do your testing in a VM (way safer anyway) and then reload
Win10 after 30 days.

This link may help but you can certainly search for the same kind of
articles:
https://www.howtogeek.com/244678/you...se-windows-10/

Further research shows that Microsoft's guidance on this is a grey area
https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/...3-52f34125152b



--


Bob S.

On 25/10/2018 00:42, 😉 Good Guy 😉 wrote:
Well in that case stop running dangerous programs.Â* I thought you said
you are a programmer but you don't seem to be an intelligent one. Who
is hiring an idiot like you?Â* Are they also idiots like you?


AsÂ* a programmer i constantly install clients programs -Â* I have to do
it. And I dont have time to check they are virus/trojan horse free. Any
clients program can have viruses from many reasons.


I currently run them in sandbox which works pretty well, but its slower
and not all programs run there.

On 25/10/2018 01:04, Bob_S wrote:
I'm not seeing all the responses for this post due to filters but if
it hasn't already been suggested, make a VMÂ* (VMWare or other),
download and install Win10 in the VM.Â* You will not

I have done it and tried it, but one proglem is that is very slow
running it there so does not work exatcly how I would like. Also
graphics slow and not exactly like in the real Windows.
I had many problems trying to run it there, its not like in real
Windows. But yes, one possible option to think about. But running in
HyperOS would be much better as it runs super fast.

Its painfully slow I think, and slows down the work too much.
Even sandbox I use is a little slow, but faster than VM so I prefer it
currently.


need a retail license (key) to run it and it won't be activated.Â* If I
recall, you can run it for 30 days before you get a watermark showing
it's not activated and then goes into limited functionality..Â* Do your
testing in a VM (way safer anyway) and then reload Win10 after 30 days.

Good to know, thanks

"JiiPee" wrote in message ...

On 25/10/2018 01:04, Bob_S wrote:
I'm not seeing all the responses for this post due to filters but if it
hasn't already been suggested, make a VM (VMWare or other), download and
install Win10 in the VM. You will not

I have done it and tried it, but one proglem is that is very slow running
it there so does not work exatcly how I would like. Also graphics slow and
not exactly like in the real Windows.
I had many problems trying to run it there, its not like in real Windows.
But yes, one possible option to think about. But running in HyperOS would
be much better as it runs super fast.

Its painfully slow I think, and slows down the work too much.
Even sandbox I use is a little slow, but faster than VM so I prefer it
currently.


need a retail license (key) to run it and it won't be activated. If I
recall, you can run it for 30 days before you get a watermark showing
it's not activated and then goes into limited functionality.. Do your
testing in a VM (way safer anyway) and then reload Win10 after 30 days.

Good to know, thanks



Sounds like it's time to upgrade some hardware. An SSD and more memory will
give a boost to old hardware but you still need a decent CPU if your using
on-board graphics. You don't need an expensive graphics card to make a big
difference either. How old is the system and what are some of it's spec's.
We may be able to make some suggestions on where to spend the money on an
upgrade.
--


Bob S.