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“Microsoft to end updates to Windows 7’s free AV software, Security Essentials”



 
 
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  #46  
Old December 28th 19, 12:09 PM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Bill[_49_]
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Posts: 84
Default “Microsoft to end updates to Windows 7’s free AV software, Security Essentials”

Andy Burns wrote:
Bill wrote:

I upgraded two computers from Windows 7 to Windows 10. [snip]
with "classic start"


If ever you need to ask here about "why doesn't X, Y or Z work with
Win10?" be sure to make it clear you've installed a 3rd party shell
replacement ...



I've already found some minor short-comings of the "classic start"
menu/interface/shell. But the "original" Windows 10 one is still
accessible via a link on the classic start program menu. Someone who
knows what they are doing can locate executable files directly by
navigating the C:/ drive and using the command line interface. I found
doing that handy. For instance, I don't think that the registry editor
appears on either menu (admittedly I didn't look for it there). I don't
require a drop down menu, or even a mouse on a computer--they are merely
conveniences. Honestly, Windows 10 has alot more conveniences than one
needs.
Only 2 applications did not work immediately after the "upgrade". One
was the SeaMonkey web browser and news reader. The second was the
program for my (smart) MS keyboard and I only had to restart it (it
remembered my settings). The rest of the hardware continued to work
without a hitch, which I found rather impressive.

But to go full circle, I did not appreciate needing to do this upgrade
in the first place. But I dealt with the circumstances the best I was
able to. I.e. I took the opportunity for the opportunity to download the
software for free while it was still available! Otherwise, "upgrading"
two computers might easily cost me a coupla-hundred bucks...

Bill
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  #47  
Old December 28th 19, 02:22 PM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Char Jackson
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Posts: 10,449
Default Microsoft to end updates to Windows 7s free AV software, Security Essentials

On Sat, 28 Dec 2019 10:34:20 +0000, Andy Burns wrote:

Bill wrote:

I upgraded two computers from Windows 7 to Windows 10. [snip]
with "classic start"


If ever you need to ask here about "why doesn't X, Y or Z work with
Win10?" be sure to make it clear you've installed a 3rd party shell
replacement ...


In the end, it very rarely matters, though.

  #48  
Old December 28th 19, 06:52 PM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-10
VanguardLH[_2_]
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Posts: 10,881
Default Microsoft to end updates to Windows 7s free AV software, Security Essentials

Bill wrote:

Still at issue is that I haven't found any ad-block software that will
work with the latest version of SeaMonkey (web browser). If I am
unable to resolve that, I may have to switch to Mozilla Firefox.


Doesn't Seamonkey use the old XCOM/XUL scheme for extensions? If so,
most adblockers moved to the WE (Web Extension) model when Mozilla moved
to it as of their Quantum release (v57) which is a similar model to the
one use in Google Chrome.

https://blog.seamonkey-project.org/2...amonkey-union/
"XUL, one of the key technologies of SeaMonkey, is also on the chopping
block and will be discontinued in the near future."

That forecast says XUL extensions were likely to get discontinued "in
the near future" for Seamonkey, too. I don't use Seamonkey to know if
they switched from XUL to WE. "near future" is too vague to know when.
I guess you get whatever extensions it takes you to for a web site, and
those are all you get for now.

By the way, the Classic Shell program was abandoned 2 years ago. That
means if there are problems with it, they won't get fixed. Since
Windows 10 is a constantly changing OS (Microsoft claims "10" is the
last version, but that's just in the OS name, and every major update is
a new version), Classic Shell will get more out of sync. Read the red-
colored text at http://classicshell.net/. I haven't bothered to keep up
with its incarnation, Open Shell, other than it's latest release is
dated under 2 months ago.
  #49  
Old December 29th 19, 12:21 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Ant[_3_]
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Posts: 873
Default ???Microsoft to end updates to Windows 7???s free AV software, Security Essentials???

In alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt Bill wrote:
....
Still at issue is that I haven't found any ad-block software that will
work with the latest version of SeaMonkey (web browser). If I am unable
to resolve that, I may have to switch to Mozilla Firefox.


https://github.com/gorhill/uBlock/releases for legacy uBlock extension for old
Firefox and SeaMonkey versions. I also still use old stuff like 64-bit W7 HPE SP1,
SeaMonkey v2.49.5, etc. on my decade old PCs.

Be warned that many web sites don't like old SeaMonkey versions (still uses Firefox
v52's engine) due to being very slow, unsupported, etc. So, please have updated
Firefox and Chrome just in case (IE11 is bad as SeaMonkey too ). It will be a very
long time before we get updated SeaMonkey with newer engines. Also, hang out in
Mozilla's news.mozilla.org usenet server with its SeaMonkey newsgroups (e.g.,
mozilla.support.seamonkey) in your SeaMonkey's newsgroup reader.

https://blog.seamonkey-project.org/ is an official blog to see what's up with
SeaMonkey. They do need help.
--
"..., you ready for a little dumpster diving?" "Um... okay." "You know I
don't mind getting my hands dirty." "I mean, maggots, wet trash, I am
the first one in." "Okay, so what are you waiting for?" "Ants."
(Chuckles) "Ants?" "Yes, I have got a problem with ants." "They are
sneaky, and they are mobile, and when they get on you, even if you get
them off..." "Okay, Calleigh, chill." --CSI: Miami (Wannabe episode;
#218)
Note: A fixed width font (Courier, Monospace, etc.) is required to see this signature correctly.
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/ /\ /\ \ http://antfarm.ma.cx. Please nuke ANT if replying by e-mail.
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  #50  
Old December 29th 19, 04:55 AM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Bill[_49_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 84
Default “Microsoft to end updates to Windows 7’s free AV software, Security Essentials”

VanguardLH wrote:
Bill wrote:

Still at issue is that I haven't found any ad-block software that will
work with the latest version of SeaMonkey (web browser). If I am
unable to resolve that, I may have to switch to Mozilla Firefox.


Doesn't Seamonkey use the old XCOM/XUL scheme for extensions? If so,
most adblockers moved to the WE (Web Extension) model when Mozilla moved
to it as of their Quantum release (v57) which is a similar model to the
one use in Google Chrome.

https://blog.seamonkey-project.org/2...amonkey-union/
"XUL, one of the key technologies of SeaMonkey, is also on the chopping
block and will be discontinued in the near future."

That forecast says XUL extensions were likely to get discontinued "in
the near future" for Seamonkey, too. I don't use Seamonkey to know if
they switched from XUL to WE. "near future" is too vague to know when.
I guess you get whatever extensions it takes you to for a web site, and
those are all you get for now.

By the way, the Classic Shell program was abandoned 2 years ago. That
means if there are problems with it, they won't get fixed. Since
Windows 10 is a constantly changing OS (Microsoft claims "10" is the
last version, but that's just in the OS name, and every major update is
a new version), Classic Shell will get more out of sync. Read the red-
colored text at http://classicshell.net/. I haven't bothered to keep up
with its incarnation, Open Shell, other than it's latest release is
dated under 2 months ago.



Thank you for the information about SeaMonkey. I don't know the meaning
of many of the "words" (standards) involved, but I can see the apparent
writing on the way. I downloaded Firefox last night, so I have 4 or 5
browsers on my machine now (full coverage..lol).

As far as the shell, I mainly use it to log off, switch users, or shut
down. A short-cut to virtually every application I use regularly is on
the desktop. So the drop down shell is not a big issue, and as I
mentioned earlier, the Windows 10 shell is just a click away (on the
class shell menu). I will be watching the future of SeaMonkey with
some interest.

The main thing I don't like is the "big guys" having their noses in
everyone's data/business. It seems like a version of socialism. so far,
I haven't ever backed-up into anyone's "cloud", that's not to say that
one can navigate the Internet without leaving some form of trail (maybe
particularly at YouTube, which also seems to wish to be up close and
personal). I suspect Microsoft "took notes" while it was doing my
upgrade; after all, why not...

Bill
  #51  
Old December 29th 19, 03:19 PM posted to alt.comp.hardware.pc-homebuilt,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Larc[_2_]
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Posts: 32
Default Microsoft to end updates to Windows 7s free AV software, Security Essentials

On Sat, 28 Dec 2019 11:52:34 -0600, VanguardLH wrote:

| By the way, the Classic Shell program was abandoned 2 years ago. That
| means if there are problems with it, they won't get fixed. Since
| Windows 10 is a constantly changing OS (Microsoft claims "10" is the
| last version, but that's just in the OS name, and every major update is
| a new version), Classic Shell will get more out of sync. Read the red-
| colored text at http://classicshell.net/. I haven't bothered to keep up
| with its incarnation, Open Shell, other than it's latest release is
| dated under 2 months ago.

Open Shell is installed on all my systems and reliably provides my main menu . It's
as good as Classic Shell. Far, far more customizable and better than the current
Windows menu.

https://github.com/Open-Shell/Open-Shell-Menu

Larc
  #52  
Old December 30th 19, 09:57 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Lynn McGuire[_2_]
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Posts: 65
Default ?Microsoft to end updates to Windows 7?s free AV software,Security Essentials?

On 12/16/2019 11:20 PM, Roger Blake wrote:
On 2019-12-16, Stan Brown wrote:
It was a joke -- the identified "source" was a giveaway.


Didn't catch that, and it has the ring of a typical Microsoft press release.

I take it seriously since as a system administrator I have a fair
amount of dissatisfaction with Windows 10. Dealing with it in a business
environment is like playing whack-a-mole with a plethora of obnoxious
"features", and just for fun a fresh new hell is unleashed to add to the
mix every six months.


You are scaring me. I am considering upgrading my shop of 15 PCs from
Windows 7 x64 Pro to Windows 10 x64 Pro. I rarely have problems now,
usually just hardware problems.

Lynn


  #53  
Old December 31st 19, 12:57 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul[_32_]
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Posts: 11,873
Default ?Microsoft to end updates to Windows 7?s free AV software, SecurityEssentials?

Lynn McGuire wrote:
On 12/16/2019 11:20 PM, Roger Blake wrote:
On 2019-12-16, Stan Brown wrote:
It was a joke -- the identified "source" was a giveaway.


Didn't catch that, and it has the ring of a typical Microsoft press
release.

I take it seriously since as a system administrator I have a fair
amount of dissatisfaction with Windows 10. Dealing with it in a business
environment is like playing whack-a-mole with a plethora of obnoxious
"features", and just for fun a fresh new hell is unleashed to add to the
mix every six months.


You are scaring me. I am considering upgrading my shop of 15 PCs from
Windows 7 x64 Pro to Windows 10 x64 Pro. I rarely have problems now,
usually just hardware problems.

Lynn


I can't believe you left this to now.

You should have been practicing.
Practicing your installs.
Doing the planning.
Making excuses to the staff (pre-greasing expectations).

I hope you have a "long weekend" lined up for this.
You'll need it. You'll need an assistant to bring
you coffee.

Paul

  #54  
Old December 31st 19, 02:09 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Roger Blake[_2_]
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Posts: 536
Default ?Microsoft to end updates to Windows 7?s free AV software,Security Essentials?

On 2019-12-30, Lynn McGuire wrote:
You are scaring me. I am considering upgrading my shop of 15 PCs from
Windows 7 x64 Pro to Windows 10 x64 Pro. I rarely have problems now,
usually just hardware problems.


Really you should upgrade especially if there is any customer, employee,
or other sensitive information on your network. If there is a data breach
and you are running an unsupported, unpatched operating system that is where
all fingers will point whether that was a factor or not. (For home users
I'd say as long as you are using up-to-date antivirus and web browser you'd
be OK.)

If your PCs are on a domain you should familiarize yourself with installing
and using the administrative templates for Windows 10. New ones are released
for each new version of Windows 10 and, to give the devil his due, it makes
for less work in maintaining some semblance of control.

When setting up new Windows 10 PCs do not connect to the network until
you have created a local user. On recent versions you need to click on
"I don't have internet" and then "Continue with limited setup" - stumbling
blocks Microsoft puts in place to fake the rubes into creating and using
a Microsoft account.

Also - go into Control Panel (use search if needed), View Network Status
and Tasks, then Change Advanced Sharing Settings. Open up the "Private"
section and uncheck "Turn on automatic setup of network connected devices."
If you do not do this, by default on a private network Windows 10 will
flood your network with broadcasts and add every device and printer it finds
whether you want it or not. (One of my favorite Windows 10 "features".)

During intial setup, turn all options off. After logging in for the first
time go through the privacy settings and turn all options off unless there's
something you specifically want or need to leave enabled. (If on a domain
this can be done via group policy.)

Go into the advanced update settings and delay "feature updates" (that is,
new versions of Windows 10) for the maximum of 365 days. That way you'll
have a somewhat more stable environment instead of having to put up with
new hell being unleased from the mothership at 6 month intervals.

If you want a "classic" style start menu there are a number of programs that
will provide that. I usually use "Open Shell".

Always bear in mind that the majority of Windows 10 features are there
for Microsoft's benefit, not yours. When in doubt - DISABLE.

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Roger Blake (Posts from Google Groups killfiled due to excess spam.)

The US Census vs. privacy -- http://censusfacts.info
Don't talk to cops! -- http://www.DontTalkToCops.com
Badges don't grant extra rights -- http://www.CopBlock.org
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
  #55  
Old December 31st 19, 03:10 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Lynn McGuire[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 65
Default ?Microsoft to end updates to Windows 7?s free AV software,Security Essentials?

On 12/30/2019 7:09 PM, Roger Blake wrote:
On 2019-12-30, Lynn McGuire wrote:
You are scaring me. I am considering upgrading my shop of 15 PCs from
Windows 7 x64 Pro to Windows 10 x64 Pro. I rarely have problems now,
usually just hardware problems.


Really you should upgrade especially if there is any customer, employee,
or other sensitive information on your network. If there is a data breach
and you are running an unsupported, unpatched operating system that is where
all fingers will point whether that was a factor or not. (For home users
I'd say as long as you are using up-to-date antivirus and web browser you'd
be OK.)

If your PCs are on a domain you should familiarize yourself with installing
and using the administrative templates for Windows 10. New ones are released
for each new version of Windows 10 and, to give the devil his due, it makes
for less work in maintaining some semblance of control.

When setting up new Windows 10 PCs do not connect to the network until
you have created a local user. On recent versions you need to click on
"I don't have internet" and then "Continue with limited setup" - stumbling
blocks Microsoft puts in place to fake the rubes into creating and using
a Microsoft account.

Also - go into Control Panel (use search if needed), View Network Status
and Tasks, then Change Advanced Sharing Settings. Open up the "Private"
section and uncheck "Turn on automatic setup of network connected devices."
If you do not do this, by default on a private network Windows 10 will
flood your network with broadcasts and add every device and printer it finds
whether you want it or not. (One of my favorite Windows 10 "features".)

During intial setup, turn all options off. After logging in for the first
time go through the privacy settings and turn all options off unless there's
something you specifically want or need to leave enabled. (If on a domain
this can be done via group policy.)

Go into the advanced update settings and delay "feature updates" (that is,
new versions of Windows 10) for the maximum of 365 days. That way you'll
have a somewhat more stable environment instead of having to put up with
new hell being unleased from the mothership at 6 month intervals.

If you want a "classic" style start menu there are a number of programs that
will provide that. I usually use "Open Shell".

Always bear in mind that the majority of Windows 10 features are there
for Microsoft's benefit, not yours. When in doubt - DISABLE.


BTW, I have 10 PCs, not 15. I cannot count anymore.

We use peer to peer networking, no domain. We are double NATted for
security. No IPv6, yet.

I have two file servers, one for our customer database, the other for
our source code and development sandbox. All machines have a user
except for the two file servers.

I was a beta tester for Windows 10. I verified that our software worked
and then nuked from orbit, reformatting and reinstalling Windows 7 x64
Pro. Just too different.

Lynn
  #56  
Old December 31st 19, 03:44 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Roger Blake[_2_]
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Posts: 536
Default ?Microsoft to end updates to Windows 7?s free AV software, Security Essentials?

On 2019-12-31, Lynn McGuire wrote:
We use peer to peer networking, no domain. We are double NATted for
security. No IPv6, yet.


NAT is not a security technology. (It was actually a grotesque hack that
was never meant to become a permanent fixture, but that's another story.)

A huge number of threats are delivered via email, compromised web sites,
and compromised advertising streams. NAT will not help with this and for
that matter neither will most router firewalls. Antivirus of course
is not 100% effective either, and an OS with unpatched security flaws
is going to be more vulnerable. It just seems like an unacceptable risk
for a business.

Currently I unbind IPV6 from active network adapters on networks where
it is not needed.

I was a beta tester for Windows 10. I verified that our software worked
and then nuked from orbit, reformatting and reinstalling Windows 7 x64
Pro. Just too different.


Windows 10 is a PITA, no argument there. Windows 7 was a lot easier to
deal with and wasn't so insistent on drawing you into Microsoft's "cloud"
at every turn. But without security updates, as I said, not a good platform
for business use.

You should probably test your software againt a current Windows 10 release
before migrating en masse since there have been a lot of changes since
it was in beta test. You may also have older commercial applications
that won't be compatible such as Adobe and Quickbooks products. All that
needs to be sorted out ahead of time.

--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Roger Blake (Posts from Google Groups killfiled due to excess spam.)

The US Census vs. privacy -- http://censusfacts.info
Don't talk to cops! -- http://www.DontTalkToCops.com
Badges don't grant extra rights -- http://www.CopBlock.org
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
  #57  
Old December 31st 19, 07:07 AM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Char Jackson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,449
Default ?Microsoft to end updates to Windows 7?s free AV software, Security Essentials?

On Tue, 31 Dec 2019 02:44:19 -0000 (UTC), Roger Blake
wrote:

On 2019-12-31, Lynn McGuire wrote:
We use peer to peer networking, no domain. We are double NATted for
security. No IPv6, yet.


NAT is not a security technology. (It was actually a grotesque hack that
was never meant to become a permanent fixture, but that's another story.)


Thanks. I was going to point out that NAT is not a security measure but you
beat me to it.

snip


--

Char Jackson
  #58  
Old December 31st 19, 05:13 PM posted to alt.windows7.general,alt.comp.os.windows-10
Ken Blake[_7_]
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Posts: 569
Default ?Microsoft to end updates to Windows 7?s free AV software,Security Essentials?

On 12/30/2019 1:57 PM, Lynn McGuire wrote:
On 12/16/2019 11:20 PM, Roger Blake wrote:
On 2019-12-16, Stan Brown wrote:
It was a joke -- the identified "source" was a giveaway.


Didn't catch that, and it has the ring of a typical Microsoft press release.

I take it seriously since as a system administrator I have a fair
amount of dissatisfaction with Windows 10. Dealing with it in a business
environment is like playing whack-a-mole with a plethora of obnoxious
"features", and just for fun a fresh new hell is unleashed to add to the
mix every six months.


You are scaring me. I am considering upgrading my shop of 15 PCs from
Windows 7 x64 Pro to Windows 10 x64 Pro. I rarely have problems now,
usually just hardware problems.



Several points:

1. I run two Windows 10 machines here, and support Windows 10 on several
other computers of my family and friends. I've had no problems with any
of them.

2. Despite my experienec, I'm aware that many other people have had
problems. Most of those problems have been in machines with older hardware.

3. If you are running Windows 7 computers, there's a good chance that
some of them may not be compatible with Windows 10, or that they are
marginally compatible, and you might experience problems.

4. Even if everything is compatible, there's a good chance that some
computers may need Windows 10 drivers that are not available for them.

5. There's no need to upgrade just because Microsoft is dropping support
for Windows 7. That just means there will no longer be any updates to
it. You can continue to run Windows 7; just be sure you run third-party
security software that is kept up to date.

5. If you've been having hardware problems, there's a good chance that
they may worsen with Windows 10. I recommend that you stay with 7.






--
Ken
 




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