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Simplest way to get WinXP-style sliding cascading menu on Win10 (without MS Update bricking the system)?



 
 
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  #1  
Old February 19th 18, 03:41 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
ultred ragnusen
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Default Simplest way to get WinXP-style sliding cascading menu on Win10 (without MS Update bricking the system)?

I lost my entire HDD due to Microsoft Update bricking my AMD system, where
only God knows why and only God knows how to recover the data.

After buying a new HDD and installing Windows 10 on it, I'm trying really
hard to not tweak the system (except for the barest of minimum tweaks that
are necessary for efficiency).

I suspect all my tweaks are things Microsoft Update hated, so I'm trying
/not/ to tweak the new setup but Lord knows, I need a KISS cascading menu
because that stupid Cortana thing just sucks for too many reasons to
elucidate here.

Without resorting to Classic Shell or Winaero, what's the easiest way to
create a very simple working cascading menu of the style that we're all
used to, which, in words is something like:

Start menu
archiver [list of archival program shortcuts, e.g., 7-zip]
browser [list of browser program shortcuts, e.g., Opera]
cleaner [list of cleaner program shortcuts, e.g., Ccleaner]
database [list of database program shortcuts,. e.g., Google Earth]
editor pic [list of picture editor shortcuts, e.g., Pinta]
editor pdf [list of PS/PDF editor shortcuts, e.g., Foxit]
editor txt [list of text editor shortcuts, e.g., GVim]
editor vid [list of video editor shortcuts, e.g., Shotcut]
finance [list of finance program shortcuts, e.g., TurboTax]
game [list of game program shortcuts, e.g., Steam]
etc.

Must I resort to the Classic Shell or WinAero?

Or does Windows 10, by now, so many years after the release, finally have a
way to implement a basic KISS cascading shortcut like that which worked
just fine in Windows XP?
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  #2  
Old February 19th 18, 08:22 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Auric__
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Default Simplest way to get WinXP-style sliding cascading menu on Win10 (without MS Update bricking the system)?

ultred ragnusen wrote:

I lost my entire HDD due to Microsoft Update bricking my AMD system, where
only God knows why and only God knows how to recover the data.


So, you're saying that Microsoft Update magically destroyed your hard drive?
I'd be interested in knowing exactly what happened.

[snip]

Must I resort to the Classic Shell or WinAero?


To my knowledge, yes.

--
Can you hear the silence?
Can you see the dark?
Can you fix the broken?
Can you feel my heart?
  #3  
Old February 19th 18, 08:18 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
ultred ragnusen
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Posts: 248
Default Simplest way to get WinXP-style sliding cascading menu on Win10 (without MS Update bricking the system)?

wrote:

I lost my entire HDD due to Microsoft Update bricking my AMD system, where
only God knows why and only God knows how to recover the data.


So, you're saying that Microsoft Update magically destroyed your hard drive?
I'd be interested in knowing exactly what happened.


You have no idea if you even ask that question, of the hell that the
Microsoft Update put me through, and which I'm still living.

Nonetheless, despite your naivety (you're only naive because you haven't
been burned yet - I'm not saying you're naive overall - just on the fact
that MS update hates customized sysems, apparently) to explain to you the
horror that I went through and am going through would be the topic of an
entirely different and very long thread.

Must I resort to the Classic Shell or WinAero?


To my knowledge, yes.


That's what I was afraid of. Let's hope we are both wrong.

BTW, I already have organized a folder hierarchy for the menus, which is
simply named folders with named links (aka shortcuts) inside of them.
menu editor {pic,txt,pdf} [associated shortcuts]

So all I need is a mechanism to turn that into a cascaded menu that can be
/added/ to the existing Win 10 interface (which I'll call the Cortana GUI
for lack of knowledge of the official name for it).

To be clear, I no longer wish to /replace/ the Cortana GUI, but just to
augment it with a single addition of a cascaded menu, in a way that won't
brick my system with every Microsoft Update (which I've been dealing with
for a year now).
  #4  
Old February 19th 18, 08:47 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
ultred ragnusen
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Posts: 248
Default Simplest way to get WinXP-style sliding cascading menu on Win10 (without MS Update bricking the system)?

wrote:

I lost my entire HDD due to Microsoft Update bricking my AMD system, where
only God knows why and only God knows how to recover the data.


Too bad. You may be able to recover data from it if you install it in
ana external case. Good luck.


Here is a picture of my attempt at mounting the HDD using a 3.5" IDE
connector in the classic PATA/SATA/IDE adapter to the USB port of the now
working computer.
http://wetakepic.com/images/2018/02/...sb_adapter.jpg

Mounting that HDD is not the topic of this thread, as whatever MS Update
did to brick my system, makes it such that an external system doesn't "see"
anything but a drive that needs to be formatted.

I must state that MS Update has failed so many times on my Win 10 system
that I "ass-u-me" that the reason is that Microsoft hates customizations,
where I admit I customized with WinAero and the Classic Shell, which I
admit is probably my sin against the Gods at Redmond.

Nonetheless, this thread is only about how to get what MANY people want,
which is a simple cascaded menu, but without having to offend the Gods at
Redmond.

Since Microsoft is certainly aware that many people want a cascaded menu,
this thread is only to ask if we can get that WITHOUT having to resort to
using the Classic Shell method of customization.
  #5  
Old February 19th 18, 09:13 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
ultred ragnusen
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Posts: 248
Default Simplest way to get WinXP-style sliding cascading menu on Win10 (without MS Update bricking the system)?

wrote:

Works for me.


That Orwellian approach would work for you since it's designed for the hoi
polloi who have absolutely no idea how a computer interface should work, so
they let Redmond decide what menus to present.

The top 6 programs are displayed in front of me


I'm sure that Redmond-defined almost meaningless display of the prior half
dozen programs works just fine for both you and for the unwashed masses,
but it doesn't work for someone who simply wishes for a statically defined
cascaded menu of their choice.

I'm OK if the answer to the basic question asked is that there is no known
way to obtain the classic statically user-defined cascaded menu from
Microsoft.

I'm just asking if there is any way yet, after all these years of user
complaints, to get user-defined cascaded menus to work in Windows 10
(latest version) without having to resort to the 3rd-party Classic Shell
customizations.
  #6  
Old February 19th 18, 09:47 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul[_32_]
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Default Simplest way to get WinXP-style sliding cascading menu on Win10(without MS Update bricking the system)?

ultred ragnusen wrote:


Mounting that HDD is not the topic of this thread, as whatever MS Update
did to brick my system, makes it such that an external system doesn't "see"
anything but a drive that needs to be formatted.


I had a partition report RAW after a failed CHKDSK run.
But I didn't panic, and the partition is now fully repaired.

The partition was Windows 10 Insider, one of the upgrades within
the last week. The damage was to the Volume Bitmap, and something
called Extended Attributes. But the condition was not fatal and
it was recoverable. I've used neither DISM nor SFC to post-process
the volume, leaving that until the next upgrade install comes in
some time in the next two weeks (if it doesn't complain, then
the damage cannot be that bad).

To fix it, I used commands like this, being careful not to
rely on the OS itself for these commands (just in case the
Win10 NTFS stack has a problem). From the volume I was booted
from, the C: partitions were M: and N: .

chkdsk /offlinescanandfix M:
chkdsk /F M:

And that stopped the chkdsk program from claiming it couldn't
fix the problem, and would I like to schedule it for a
reboot (which wouldn't fix it). Those two were enough.
Running the /F command twice in a row achieved nothing.
But a one-two punch worked for some reason. It's the first
time I'd ever heard of "offlinescanandfix" being on CHKDSK.
Normally the flags have shorter names.

If you're in a rush, I can see giving up on something and
just reinstalling. If you have the time, you never know what
you can fix. I thought for sure at the time, I was screwed
and I'd never fix it.

Paul
  #7  
Old February 21st 18, 06:00 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
ultred ragnusen
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Posts: 248
Default Simplest way to get WinXP-style sliding cascading menu on Win10 (without MS Update bricking the system)?

James Wilkinson Sword wrote:

The 6 most used applications are the ones you will be most likely to use,
so it's only fitting they are shown first. Typing the name of any others
takes seconds.


It's a dumb default that assumes the next program you want to use is one of
the six previous ones, when I have scores upon scores of programs
installed, and where I know exactly where to find them in a cascaded menu
since the cascaded menu matches in the install hierarchy which matches the
software archive hierarchy.

For example:
Archive =
C:\archive\editor\pic\{irfanview,photoscape,imbatc h,fastone,pinta,etc.}

Install =
C:\install\editor\pic\{irfanview,photoscape,imbatc h,fastone,pinta,etc.}

Menu =
menu editor pic {irfanview,photoscape,imbatch,fastone,pinta,etc.}

Of course you can always go back to the dark ages and use desktop
icons like a Mac user.


That is a bad idea.

The right idea is a cascaded menu as shown above, which mirrors the archive
and installation hierarchy, and which is exactly the same on all systems in
use.
  #8  
Old February 21st 18, 12:00 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
mechanic
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Posts: 1,064
Default Simplest way to get WinXP-style sliding cascading menu on Win10 (without MS Update bricking the system)?

On Tue, 20 Feb 2018 21:00:50 -0800, ultred ragnusen wrote:

The right idea is a cascaded menu as shown above, which mirrors
the archive and installation hierarchy, and which is exactly the
same on all systems in use.


There are some bright boys/girls at Microsoft who have given this a
lot more thought than you have. The decision to move to a
search-based system was not taken lightly. Some might not like it
but they are in a minority.
  #9  
Old February 21st 18, 12:20 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
John Doe[_8_]
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Posts: 2,378
Default Simplest way to get WinXP-style sliding cascading menu on Win10 (without MS Update bricking the system)?

ultred ragnusen wrote:

I lost my entire HDD due to Microsoft Update bricking my
AMD system, where only God knows why and only God knows how
to recover the data.

After buying a new HDD and installing Windows 10 on it, I'm
trying really hard to not tweak the system (except for the
barest of minimum tweaks that are necessary for
efficiency).

I suspect all my tweaks are things Microsoft Update hated,
so I'm trying /not/ to tweak the new setup but Lord knows,
I need a KISS cascading menu because that stupid Cortana
thing just sucks for too many reasons to elucidate here.


That concern is one reason why I try to work with Microsoft
operating system programs. From the earliest versions of
Windows, I loved to mess with the operating system. After
being smacked down so many times for doing so, nowadays I try
to cope.

If you are concerned about data, the first thing you do is
make a backup copy of the drive. Then you try fixing it.
  #10  
Old February 22nd 18, 07:42 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
ultred ragnusen
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Posts: 248
Default Simplest way to get WinXP-style sliding cascading menu on Win10 (without MS Update bricking the system)?

mechanic wrote:

The right idea is a cascaded menu as shown above, which mirrors
the archive and installation hierarchy, and which is exactly the
same on all systems in use.


There are some bright boys/girls at Microsoft who have given this a
lot more thought than you have. The decision to move to a
search-based system was not taken lightly. Some might not like it
but they are in a minority.


I don't disagree with you that /most/ of the changes between various
Windows versions appears to be to cater to the hoi polloi who can't find a
file that they just downloaded seconds before.

Given that, I understand that Microsoft caters to the proletariat by
supplying a search-based way to find their stuff, but, being a reasonable
person, I can't even figure out what ALGORITHM Microsoft uses.

For example, every time I open the "File Explorer" I see a /different/ set
of folders, where I haven't been able to figure out what on earth Microsoft
uses to decide what goes in the unpinned "Quick Access" section versus what
goes in the "Recent Folders" section, and where the last thing I ever want
to see is the entire wasted section called "Recent Files". Why?

Or, for example, I install a program, where I /know/ where I want the
program to go, but when I hit the installer's "Browse" button, it's always
a crap shoot as to where the starting point in the file-system browser will
be (most default to an arbitrary program-file hierarchy but others default
to C: while others default to the top level where you have to click just to
get to C: itself). Why?

As an even worse example, I installed Pinta, which, by default, takes
multiple clicks to open a file in, but then I installed Paint.NET, which
takes far fewer clicks.

What on earth is the rationale for that difference?

Look at how many steps it takes to open Pinta using the OpenWith defaults:
Step 1 & Step 2: http://wetakepic.com/images/2018/02/22/Clipboard01.jpg
Step 3: http://wetakepic.com/images/2018/02/22/Clipboard02.jpg
Step 4: http://wetakepic.com/images/2018/02/22/Clipboard03.jpg
Step 5: http://wetakepic.com/images/2018/02/22/Clipboard06.jpg
Step 6 & Step 7: http://wetakepic.com/images/2018/02/22/Clipboard07.jpg
Step 8:

While it takes 8 steps, by default, to use the OpenWith menu with Pinta,
why does it only take 2 steps, by default, with Paint.NET?
Step 1 & Step 2: http://wetakepic.com/images/2018/02/22/Clipboard0a.jpg

What is the default algorithm that puts Paint.net conveniently in the
OpenWith menu but not Pinta?
http://wetakepic.com/images/2018/02/22/Clipboard0b.jpg

It can't be that Windows doesn't have enough space in the menu for two
editing programs because they pop up this idiotic "Featured in Windows 10"
advertising blurb in the same menu.
http://wetakepic.com/images/2018/02/22/Clipboard0c.jpg

And yet, when you click enough wasteful selections, you find both Pinta and
Paint.net next to each other after all...
http://wetakepic.com/images/2018/02/22/Clipboard0e.jpg

Given these are all defaults, what on earth is the logic in such tremendous
almost incomprehensible inconsistency in almost every way the user
interfaces with the operating system?


  #11  
Old February 22nd 18, 07:49 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
ultred ragnusen
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Posts: 248
Default Simplest way to get WinXP-style sliding cascading menu on Win10 (without MS Update bricking the system)?

John Doe wrote:

That concern is one reason why I try to work with Microsoft
operating system programs. From the earliest versions of
Windows, I loved to mess with the operating system. After
being smacked down so many times for doing so, nowadays I try
to cope.


I, like you, used to try to "fight" Microsoft pollution by "cleaning up"
the mess that happened in each of the menus and folders that are known to
the world (e.g., the start menu and the program files hierarchies, and the
user data hierarchies such as "My Documents").

The almost incomprehensible litter and inconsistency is sort of like what
you'd see on a busy NYC street as the hoi polloi walk by your stoop,
littering as they see fit and acting as they feel, all of which is
extremely inconsistent and meaningless, in the end, as you can't make any
decent sense of it all.

So what I did was CUSTOMIZE the system to use folders outside the Microsoft
well-known ones and to make my own menus, and to change the default temp
and "my pictures" to what I wanted them to be, etc.,

But something in my myriad customizations is what Microsoft utterly hates.
They f*ked up the Microsoft Update for at least two years, where the good
news is that nothing installed (which was fine by me) as they all failed to
install, but they didn't brick the system.

Finally, with this latest update, they bricked the system.
Lesson learned.

If you are concerned about data, the first thing you do is
make a backup copy of the drive. Then you try fixing it.


The safest way I know to make a backup is dd but that doesn't work on
Windows and the entire drive refuses to be mounted in an SATA/PATA/IDE
adapter to USB, so how am I supposed to back up the hard drive when the
commands don't exist to do that backup and when the drive won't be mounted?
  #12  
Old February 22nd 18, 02:54 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Auric__
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Default Simplest way to get WinXP-style sliding cascading menu on Win10 (without MS Update bricking the system)?

James Wilkinson Sword wrote:

On Wed, 21 Feb 2018 05:00:50 -0000, ultred ragnusen
wrote:

James Wilkinson Sword wrote:

[snip]
Of course you can always go back to the dark ages and use desktop
icons like a Mac user.


That is a bad idea.

The right idea is a cascaded menu as shown above, which mirrors the
archive and installation hierarchy, and which is exactly the same on all
systems in use.


You sound like a linux user.


No, he doesn't. Nothing he said has anything to do with using Linux. It
sounds more like he's saying "My way is the only right way, and everyone else
is WRONG!"

--
The threshold for disproving something is higher than the threshold
for saying it, which is a recipe for the accumulation of bull****.
-- Dr. Bill Softky [Caltech]
  #13  
Old February 22nd 18, 05:25 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
ultred ragnusen
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Posts: 248
Default Simplest way to get WinXP-style sliding cascading menu on Win10 (without MS Update bricking the system)?

Auric__ wrote:

No, he doesn't. Nothing he said has anything to do with using Linux. It
sounds more like he's saying "My way is the only right way, and everyone else
is WRONG!"


Actually, I'm an old hand at UNIX where I have used more UNIX-like
operating systems than most people, although probably not any more than
anyone here who predates all of them.

And you're also wrong that the basics are "out of style", since there's
nothing wrong with knowing where your data goes, even if you don't.
  #14  
Old February 23rd 18, 02:58 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
ultred ragnusen
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Posts: 248
Default Simplest way to get WinXP-style sliding cascading menu on Win10 (without MS Update bricking the system)?

James Wilkinson Sword wrote:

It's the way he wants to know how all the folders are arranged
that makes me think of him as a linux user.


I've used as many operating systems as anyone here, including all the early
and late variants of UNIX and Linux.

But it's not only UNIX old hands that maintain a clean hierarchy.

There are only two choices:
a. Organization
b. Anarchy

Pick one.
  #15  
Old February 23rd 18, 03:19 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
ultred ragnusen
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Posts: 248
Default Simplest way to get WinXP-style sliding cascading menu on Win10 (without MS Update bricking the system)?

James Wilkinson Sword wrote:

You don't often need to know where your program is installed,
anyway it should be under program files. If you don't know where
it is, a simple right click of the icon in the start menu will tell you.


There's a reason well written programs provide an option to put them where
you want them put.

And, you /do/ need to know where the program is installed since an "Open
With" requires knowing it down to the very executable.

In addition, by never installing into Program Files, you will only see the
badly written programs go there, which helps you identify the poorly
designed programs.

Lastly, by maintaining the same hierarchy for menus as for saving your
installers as for installing your programs, you maintain control over your
system in that every has a place, and everything stays in its place.

The only other option is anarchy where you can't find anything without
giving up and running a hail-mary search.
 




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