A Windows XP help forum. PCbanter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » PCbanter forum » Windows 10 » Windows 10 Help Forum
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

1903 and keyboards



 
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old July 9th 19, 06:04 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Eric Stevens
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 606
Default 1903 and keyboards

I have two computers. One a fairly recent machine I call Corsair based
on an Asus X00-AII with an i7-6800K CPU and the other being a nearly
10 year old Dell XPS something or other an i2-2600. Both are running
Windows 10 Pro with the 1903 update. Both are equipped with Logitech
USB keyboard and mouse, although not the same model. The DEll has very
recently experienced a change of keyboard and mouse.

Since the update both machines have experienced keyboard problems but
Corsair has recently lost its mouse unti after a repair install and a
reboot.

The problem with Dell is that it does not respond to text entry until
some time after the machine has started. This makes password entry
(and hence logging on) difficult. At first you can type anything you
like and get absolutely no response. After two or three minutes you
will get a response but the first two or three characters are missing
and I have to start again. I have to watch the screen like a hawk to
ensure that the machine responds to each keystroke. After some time
the machine appears to respond normally.

I have not encountered this problem if I boot in safe mode. This seems
to suggest that with a normal boot one or more of the lesser services
are tripping over something and preventing Dell from detecting the
keystrokes. However whatever it is does not seem to interfere with the
screen cursor's response to the mouse.

I could go through deleting one service at a time and then trying
rebooting to see if that solves the problem. Howevere I have only a
few more years to live and I would be grateful for any suggestions
that might speed up the testing process.

The other problem manifests itself mainly on Corsair although Dell
occasionally suffers from it also. What happens is that I will be
happily typing away and I will suddenly realise that without any
warning characters have stopped appearing on the screen in response.
All I have to do is select the starting point with the cursor,
left-click, and start typing.

All that makes me think that the two types of problems might be
connected is that the both started after 1903, both involve keyboards
and mice, both keyboards and mouse are of the same make (although not
the same model) and there could be a common factor which has arrived
with 1903.


Regards,


Eric Stevens
Ads
  #2  
Old July 9th 19, 07:01 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Peter Jason
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,163
Default 1903 and keyboards

On Tue, 09 Jul 2019 17:04:19 +1200, Eric Stevens
wrote:

I have two computers. One a fairly recent machine I call Corsair based
on an Asus X00-AII with an i7-6800K CPU and the other being a nearly
10 year old Dell XPS something or other an i2-2600. Both are running
Windows 10 Pro with the 1903 update. Both are equipped with Logitech
USB keyboard and mouse, although not the same model. The DEll has very
recently experienced a change of keyboard and mouse.

Since the update both machines have experienced keyboard problems but
Corsair has recently lost its mouse unti after a repair install and a
reboot.

The problem with Dell is that it does not respond to text entry until
some time after the machine has started. This makes password entry
(and hence logging on) difficult. At first you can type anything you
like and get absolutely no response. After two or three minutes you
will get a response but the first two or three characters are missing
and I have to start again. I have to watch the screen like a hawk to
ensure that the machine responds to each keystroke. After some time
the machine appears to respond normally.

I have not encountered this problem if I boot in safe mode. This seems
to suggest that with a normal boot one or more of the lesser services
are tripping over something and preventing Dell from detecting the
keystrokes. However whatever it is does not seem to interfere with the
screen cursor's response to the mouse.

I could go through deleting one service at a time and then trying
rebooting to see if that solves the problem. Howevere I have only a
few more years to live and I would be grateful for any suggestions
that might speed up the testing process.

The other problem manifests itself mainly on Corsair although Dell
occasionally suffers from it also. What happens is that I will be
happily typing away and I will suddenly realise that without any
warning characters have stopped appearing on the screen in response.
All I have to do is select the starting point with the cursor,
left-click, and start typing.

All that makes me think that the two types of problems might be
connected is that the both started after 1903, both involve keyboards
and mice, both keyboards and mouse are of the same make (although not
the same model) and there could be a common factor which has arrived
with 1903.


Regards,


Eric Stevens



I would try defaulting to the US keyboard & language settings because
this worked for me after weird symbols appeared when typing.
  #3  
Old July 9th 19, 10:25 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
VanguardLH[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,229
Default 1903 and keyboards

Eric Stevens wrote:

I have two computers. One a fairly recent machine I call Corsair based
on an Asus X00-AII with an i7-6800K CPU and the other being a nearly
10 year old Dell XPS something or other an i2-2600.


There's an Intel CPU family called "i2"? I remember i3, i5, and i7, but
not an i2. Are you calling the Core 2 [Duo] family as i2?

Both are running Windows 10 Pro with the 1903 update. Both are
equipped with Logitech USB keyboard and mouse, although not the same
model. The DEll has very recently experienced a change of keyboard
and mouse.


Did you leave the PCs configured to use the embedded/default drivers for
the keyboards, or did you install the Logitech software for them?

I remember back on my older PC (running Win7) that Logitech had two
different driver packages for their mice. The later one was called
Setpoint (don't remember the earlier one's name). Setpoint caused
problems with the older hardware, so I had to go back to the older
driver package (Mouseware perhaps?). As I recall, I got rid of Setpoint
on one PC and Mouseware(?) on the other PC because I didn't need any
extra features (I don't get mice with more than 3 buttons, so no need
for macro software to define the actions of them or others), and just
used the default or embedded mouse driver in Windows.

Since the update both machines have experienced keyboard problems but
Corsair has recently lost its mouse unti after a repair install and a
reboot.


You never identified the models of the keyboard an mouse? Are they
corded? Cordless? Use RF or Bluetooth? Use a unifying USB receiver to
handle both, or separate USB dongles for each device?

If cordless, have you tried replacing the batteries? While the problem
showed up after the 1903 OS update, it's possible the batteries were
getting weak just before the update and now they're too weak after the
update.

The problem with Dell is that it does not respond to text entry until
some time after the machine has started. This makes password entry
(and hence logging on) difficult. At first you can type anything you
like and get absolutely no response. After two or three minutes you
will get a response but the first two or three characters are missing
and I have to start again. I have to watch the screen like a hawk to
ensure that the machine responds to each keystroke. After some time
the machine appears to respond normally.

I have not encountered this problem if I boot in safe mode. This seems
to suggest that with a normal boot one or more of the lesser services
are tripping over something and preventing Dell from detecting the
keystrokes. However whatever it is does not seem to interfere with the
screen cursor's response to the mouse.

I could go through deleting one service at a time and then trying
rebooting to see if that solves the problem. Howevere I have only a
few more years to live and I would be grateful for any suggestions
that might speed up the testing process.


Despite your witicism, it won't take but a week of evenings to do that
isolation.

The other problem manifests itself mainly on Corsair although Dell
occasionally suffers from it also. What happens is that I will be
happily typing away and I will suddenly realise that without any
warning characters have stopped appearing on the screen in response.
All I have to do is select the starting point with the cursor,
left-click, and start typing.


Are these RF or Bluetooth cordless keyboards and mice? Both work on the
2.4GHz frequency, but so do cordless phones, microwave ovens, and
several other devices than cause interference. Bluetooth is more
susceptible. Do these cordless devices have a reset or other means of
changing which channel they use?

All that makes me think that the two types of problems might be
connected is that the both started after 1903, both involve keyboards
and mice, both keyboards and mouse are of the same make (although not
the same model) and there could be a common factor which has arrived
with 1903.


Dell packs a lot of bloatware into their software suite. I'm assuming
you bought this as a pre-built PC and didn't build it yourself. Even
then you have to be careful of what Dell-supplied drivers you install
because they could be packages of multiple component support. As I
recall, Dell had its own keyboard driver which was to add more
functionality, like define what the Fn+key combos did.

You could work from either end: disable all startup programs and
non-Microsoft services, like safe boot, and then add them back one at a
time. Some folks think a binary approach is faster where you enable
half at a time and then either cut it in half if the problem returns or
add half of the next bunch if the problem didn't appear in the first
half bunch. Problem with that is the problem could be a compounding of
conflicts between startup programs/services. You'll want to know which
one you load that causes the problem and then determine if you want to
keep it or determine with what other startup program/service it causes
problems.

You could work from the other end where you first target whatever
startup programs/services seem related to keyboard functionality (if you
can tell what each program/service does), and disable those to see if
the problem goes away. Then you don't have to bother focusing or
testing on the non-keyboard programs/services. You might get a hint at
what to first target by looking in Device Manager to see what is used as
the software/driver interface for the keyboard device(s).
  #4  
Old July 9th 19, 11:37 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Eric Stevens
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 606
Default 1903 and keyboards

On Tue, 9 Jul 2019 04:25:08 -0500, VanguardLH wrote:

Eric Stevens wrote:

I have two computers. One a fairly recent machine I call Corsair based
on an Asus X00-AII with an i7-6800K CPU and the other being a nearly
10 year old Dell XPS something or other an i2-2600.


There's an Intel CPU family called "i2"? I remember i3, i5, and i7, but
not an i2. Are you calling the Core 2 [Duo] family as i2?


Sorry. An i7-2600.

Both are running Windows 10 Pro with the 1903 update. Both are
equipped with Logitech USB keyboard and mouse, although not the same
model. The DEll has very recently experienced a change of keyboard
and mouse.


Did you leave the PCs configured to use the embedded/default drivers for
the keyboards, or did you install the Logitech software for them?


They are probably on whatever drivrs Driver Detective fished out for
them Your point is a good one. I shall try it.

I remember back on my older PC (running Win7) that Logitech had two
different driver packages for their mice. The later one was called
Setpoint (don't remember the earlier one's name). Setpoint caused
problems with the older hardware, so I had to go back to the older
driver package (Mouseware perhaps?). As I recall, I got rid of Setpoint
on one PC and Mouseware(?) on the other PC because I didn't need any
extra features (I don't get mice with more than 3 buttons, so no need
for macro software to define the actions of them or others), and just
used the default or embedded mouse driver in Windows.

Since the update both machines have experienced keyboard problems but
Corsair has recently lost its mouse unti after a repair install and a
reboot.


You never identified the models of the keyboard an mouse? Are they
corded? Cordless? Use RF or Bluetooth? Use a unifying USB receiver to
handle both, or separate USB dongles for each device?


Uniied corded. If I have identified the model correctly Corsair has a
K520R and Dell has just been fitted with a MK270R.

If cordless, have you tried replacing the batteries?


Brand new batteries in all.

While the problem
showed up after the 1903 OS update, it's possible the batteries were
getting weak just before the update and now they're too weak after the
update.


I thought that was a problem with the Dell when I found the battery in
the mouse had ruptured and oozed inside he mouse. Cleaning it didn't
restore proper functioning and didn't cure the original propblem.
Hence the new mouse and keyboard.

The problem with Dell is that it does not respond to text entry until
some time after the machine has started. This makes password entry
(and hence logging on) difficult. At first you can type anything you
like and get absolutely no response. After two or three minutes you
will get a response but the first two or three characters are missing
and I have to start again. I have to watch the screen like a hawk to
ensure that the machine responds to each keystroke. After some time
the machine appears to respond normally.

I have not encountered this problem if I boot in safe mode. This seems
to suggest that with a normal boot one or more of the lesser services
are tripping over something and preventing Dell from detecting the
keystrokes. However whatever it is does not seem to interfere with the
screen cursor's response to the mouse.

I could go through deleting one service at a time and then trying
rebooting to see if that solves the problem. Howevere I have only a
few more years to live and I would be grateful for any suggestions
that might speed up the testing process.


Despite your witicism, it won't take but a week of evenings to do that
isolation.


Oh! The Joy!


The other problem manifests itself mainly on Corsair although Dell
occasionally suffers from it also. What happens is that I will be
happily typing away and I will suddenly realise that without any
warning characters have stopped appearing on the screen in response.
All I have to do is select the starting point with the cursor,
left-click, and start typing.


Are these RF or Bluetooth cordless keyboards and mice? Both work on the
2.4GHz frequency, but so do cordless phones, microwave ovens, and
several other devices than cause interference.


I don't think that installing 1903 would have changed the general
interference field. Besides, I have experienced interference in the
past but have generally dealt with it succesfully.

Bluetooth is more
susceptible. Do these cordless devices have a reset or other means of
changing which channel they use?


Nope. Just a small buttonless dongle.

All that makes me think that the two types of problems might be
connected is that the both started after 1903, both involve keyboards
and mice, both keyboards and mouse are of the same make (although not
the same model) and there could be a common factor which has arrived
with 1903.


Dell packs a lot of bloatware into their software suite. I'm assuming
you bought this as a pre-built PC and didn't build it yourself. Even
then you have to be careful of what Dell-supplied drivers you install
because they could be packages of multiple component support. As I
recall, Dell had its own keyboard driver which was to add more
functionality, like define what the Fn+key combos did.


It had a clean install about 18 months ago but I expect it still
salvaged settings, but not the bloatware.

You could work from either end: disable all startup programs and
non-Microsoft services, like safe boot, and then add them back one at a
time. Some folks think a binary approach is faster where you enable
half at a time and then either cut it in half if the problem returns or
add half of the next bunch if the problem didn't appear in the first
half bunch. Problem with that is the problem could be a compounding of
conflicts between startup programs/services. You'll want to know which
one you load that causes the problem and then determine if you want to
keep it or determine with what other startup program/service it causes
problems.

You could work from the other end where you first target whatever
startup programs/services seem related to keyboard functionality (if you
can tell what each program/service does), and disable those to see if
the problem goes away. Then you don't have to bother focusing or
testing on the non-keyboard programs/services. You might get a hint at
what to first target by looking in Device Manager to see what is used as
the software/driver interface for the keyboard device(s).


Do you think people really can tell exactly what role the various
startup programs/services play in the swamp that is Windows 10?

In any case I will sort out the driver situation. Tomorrow.
  #5  
Old July 9th 19, 12:13 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
VanguardLH[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,229
Default 1903 and keyboards

Eric Stevens wrote:

They are probably on whatever drivrs Driver Detective fished out for
them Your point is a good one. I shall try it.


Don't know from where you are getting drivers with that software. Also,
not having the latest driver is not some serious flaw in configuration.
Sometimes older drivers work better than new one. New code = new bugs.

Did you configure Win10 to *not* update the hardware drivers? You could
roll back to the prior driver version.

https://www.windowscentral.com/how-r...ver-windows-10

Uniied corded. If I have identified the model correctly Corsair has a
K520R and Dell has just been fitted with a MK270R.


Those are wireless mice, not corded.

https://www.logitech.com/en-us/produ...ss-combo-mk520
https://www.logitech.com/en-us/product/11052?crid=1759

I thought that was a problem with the Dell when I found the battery in
the mouse had ruptured and oozed inside he mouse.


Every battery I've had leak was made by Duracell. Despite all their
advertising, I've found them to be the most destructive (other than
those really crappy cheapies that come with the hardware).

Do you think people really can tell exactly what role the various
startup programs/services play in the swamp that is Windows 10?


Yep, they can. Looking at the path for the executable can indicate what
it is for. Right-clicking on the file and looking at Properties -
Details can sometimes reveal who made the software and what it is for.
Sometimes you have to search the web.
  #6  
Old July 10th 19, 03:35 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Eric Stevens
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 606
Default 1903 and keyboards

On Tue, 9 Jul 2019 06:13:21 -0500, VanguardLH wrote:

Eric Stevens wrote:

They are probably on whatever drivrs Driver Detective fished out for
them Your point is a good one. I shall try it.


Don't know from where you are getting drivers with that software.


It seems to get them from original sources as well as whatever
Microsoft seems to offer. In many cases its possible choose from a
selection. I've used it for several years and have had no reason to be
unhappy with it.

Also,
not having the latest driver is not some serious flaw in configuration.
Sometimes older drivers work better than new one. New code = new bugs.

Did you configure Win10 to *not* update the hardware drivers? You could
roll back to the prior driver version.

https://www.windowscentral.com/how-r...ver-windows-10


I didn't think of that at the time. I just made a clean upgrade of
Dell.

Uniied corded. If I have identified the model correctly Corsair has a
K520R and Dell has just been fitted with a MK270R.


Those are wireless mice, not corded.


I don't know why I wrote 'corded'. I know it was late at night.

https://www.logitech.com/en-us/produ...ss-combo-mk520
https://www.logitech.com/en-us/product/11052?crid=1759

I thought that was a problem with the Dell when I found the battery in
the mouse had ruptured and oozed inside he mouse.


Every battery I've had leak was made by Duracell. Despite all their
advertising, I've found them to be the most destructive (other than
those really crappy cheapies that come with the hardware).


This was a 'GP Alkaline' which came with the mouse.

Do you think people really can tell exactly what role the various
startup programs/services play in the swamp that is Windows 10?


Yep, they can. Looking at the path for the executable can indicate what
it is for. Right-clicking on the file and looking at Properties -
Details can sometimes reveal who made the software and what it is for.
Sometimes you have to search the web.


Well, I don't have to go to those lengths. Somehow the problem now
seems to have gone away.

The first thing I did this morning was look for Logitech drivers. All
I can say is that their site is horrible. Eventually I found what
appeared to possibly be what I wanted and I down loaded Setpoint,
Connectivity and Unifying.

I ran Unifying, which loaded, popped up and looked at me for about
half a second, and then disappeared without any comment.

Next was Connectivity. This offered me the chance to re-pair the
keyboard with the dongle but confirmed that it was already working
correctly.

I then ran Setpoint which appeared as though it might be driver.

After all this I intended to restart Dell to see if the keyboard
problem had improved. However as I was still backing out from layers
of Logitech, my screen turned green (my choice) and a familiar "Do not
shut down your machine etc" apeared. Next thing I knew I was in about
7 minutes worth of update and restart. And when I went to log in, the
machine responded to my typing immediately.

While the change could have been due to the Logitech software, I think
it is much more likely that it was a bug in the version of 1903 I had
downloaded.
 




Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off






All times are GMT +1. The time now is 09:00 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2004-2019 PCbanter.
The comments are property of their posters.