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#16
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Microsoft Giving Away Windows 8.1?
Hi little soft thing, Thanks, but no thanks. I'll pass. If you decide to give Windows 7 away, WITHOUT the spyware bundles, just mail me at my HOTMAIL address with the download link and serial number. TIA []'s -- Don't be evil - Google 2004 We have a new policy - Google 2012 |
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#17
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Microsoft Giving Away Windows 8.1?
Blue wrote:
"...winston‫" wrote: Stef wrote: Came across this little blurb. chuckle, chuckle http://www.theverge.com/2014/2/28/54...ing-experiment What a joke as a marketing ploy. When half your customers don't like the product, giving it away won't change that consensus. MS has already reduced licensing frees with little or no tangible results. MS is in denial. It needs to get its head out of the sand, and give their desktop customers what they want: A true desktop, mouse and keyboard version. It would also be nice if it ran on users' current hardware and a totally new system purchase wasn't necessary. But perhaps, I'm dreaming, and asking too much. This IS Windows after all. Stef Not going to happen...the OEM's are in the driver seat..and want to maintain margins by using current hardware. The future market is smart devices, not desktop pcs. For consumers, maybe. I doubt anyone that has to do heavy work with a keyboard is going want to use their thumbs. Look to the east to understand the who the target market is...it might have been you and I yesterday...it won't be us ever again. In the east they don't do spreadsheets, word processing, data base building? No authors? Philosophers? Etc? Adapt or realize later that what you continue to use (if Windows) will cease to be supported on hardware and software. Reality bites... And all the businesses that use desktops and laptops? I suppose they could put some ports on a smart phone and so you could hook up a keyboard, mouse and monitor. How long do you think it will be before "reality bites"? That bite has already been digested. The seminal change occurred a few year ago with the advent of wifi and portable devices at a variety of levels of management asking the good-old-boy IT departments why can't I do this at work when I can do it at home. That also included the management with enough horsepower (btdt) that don't ask why just instruct to make it happen and if not done just outsource the entire IT to someone who can. That bite will have bigger teeth marks in the future...workstations will replace desktops with cloud storage and tablets replacing laptops...won't happen overnight but it will happen. Desktop users just like usenet will continue to become a smaller subset of the entire user base. -- ....winston msft mvp consumer apps |
#18
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Microsoft Giving Away Windows 8.1?
CRNG wrote:
The problem is that many users, particularly businesses, have found that they can't afford the upgrade process as described above, and that their current "outdated" systems work perfectly fine and do all that they want from them. The very smart owners of current systems have started to stock spare parts from "outdated" systems to extend the life of their current systems. Not practical and with diminishing return. The 'smart owners' aren't as insightful as you portray or perceive. -- ....winston msft mvp consumer apps |
#19
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Microsoft Giving Away Windows 8.1?
"...winston‫" wrote:
Blue wrote: "...winston‫" wrote: Stef wrote: Came across this little blurb. chuckle, chuckle http://www.theverge.com/2014/2/28/54...ing-experiment What a joke as a marketing ploy. When half your customers don't like the product, giving it away won't change that consensus. MS has already reduced licensing frees with little or no tangible results. MS is in denial. It needs to get its head out of the sand, and give their desktop customers what they want: A true desktop, mouse and keyboard version. It would also be nice if it ran on users' current hardware and a totally new system purchase wasn't necessary. But perhaps, I'm dreaming, and asking too much. This IS Windows after all. Stef Not going to happen...the OEM's are in the driver seat..and want to maintain margins by using current hardware. The future market is smart devices, not desktop pcs. For consumers, maybe. I doubt anyone that has to do heavy work with a keyboard is going want to use their thumbs. Look to the east to understand the who the target market is...it might have been you and I yesterday...it won't be us ever again. In the east they don't do spreadsheets, word processing, data base building? No authors? Philosophers? Etc? Adapt or realize later that what you continue to use (if Windows) will cease to be supported on hardware and software. Reality bites... And all the businesses that use desktops and laptops? I suppose they could put some ports on a smart phone and so you could hook up a keyboard, mouse and monitor. How long do you think it will be before "reality bites"? That bite has already been digested. The seminal change occurred a few year ago with the advent of wifi and portable devices at a variety of levels of management asking the good-old-boy IT departments why can't I do this at work when I can do it at home. That also included the management with enough horsepower (btdt) that don't ask why just instruct to make it happen and if not done just outsource the entire IT to someone who can. That bite will have bigger teeth marks in the future...workstations will replace desktops with cloud storage And the cloud storage is on a smart phone? Tablet? and tablets replacing laptops...won't happen overnight but it will happen. Tablets can already be the same as a desktop if you hook a mouse, keyboard and monitor to it. Desktop users just like usenet will continue to become a smaller subset of the entire user base. Not me. I'm going to buy a new one. Smart phones, tablets and laptops have screens that are just too small for my taste. AOL killed Usenet a long time ago. MS drove in the nails. -- Blue |
#20
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Microsoft Giving Away Windows 8.1?
Neil Gould wrote:
Blue wrote: Neil Gould wrote: Blue wrote: "...winston‫" wrote: Stef wrote: Came across this little blurb. chuckle, chuckle http://www.theverge.com/2014/2/28/54...ing-experiment What a joke as a marketing ploy. When half your customers don't like the product, giving it away won't change that consensus. MS has already reduced licensing frees with little or no tangible results. MS is in denial. It needs to get its head out of the sand, and give their desktop customers what they want: A true desktop, mouse and keyboard version. It would also be nice if it ran on users' current hardware and a totally new system purchase wasn't necessary. But perhaps, I'm dreaming, and asking too much. This IS Windows after all. Stef Not going to happen...the OEM's are in the driver seat..and want to maintain margins by using current hardware. The future market is smart devices, not desktop pcs. For consumers, maybe. I doubt anyone that has to do heavy work with a keyboard is going want to use their thumbs. With the possible exception of the '80s, that is a constantly diminishing population. Watson, Siri and their ilk will be the "keyboards" of the future, accessed by Google glass and smart watches. People just don't need to work the ways they did in the last century. I can see it now. "Hey Siri, make me a web site. I sell widgets, make it groovy. While you're at it, being as you're a multitasking broad, make me a new OS without Metro". If what you say is true, I wonder why Apple made this: I certainly didn't suggest that there won't be computers with keyboards, just that the masses don't need them. The masses don't create web sites, they don't write code of any kind, and with better voice recognition, they don't even need to do their "typing" a la texting to send messages. I just tried that with Chrome. The question is how many times can you click on "try again" before you wish you had a keyboard? The rapid growth of tablets and smart phones correlated with the constantly shrinking market for desktops makes that path pretty clear. Many people have all three: a pc, a tablet and a smartphone because each can be used in different ways. Apple (more specifically, the late Steve Jobs) was one to recognize this trend years ago, which is why iOS UI has long been shared by the various iStuff. Google's Android OS is also gaining ground, mostly on devices without keyboards. M$ simply joined the club with the introduction of Win8. The only marketing question left is whether Win8.x is a better solution than Android or iStuff. Yet Apple just released their newest desktop: http://www.apple.com/mac-pro/ Again, why? -- Blue |
#21
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Microsoft Giving Away Windows 8.1?
Blue wrote:
Neil Gould wrote: Blue wrote: "...winston‫" wrote: Stef wrote: Came across this little blurb. chuckle, chuckle http://www.theverge.com/2014/2/28/54...ing-experiment What a joke as a marketing ploy. When half your customers don't like the product, giving it away won't change that consensus. MS has already reduced licensing frees with little or no tangible results. MS is in denial. It needs to get its head out of the sand, and give their desktop customers what they want: A true desktop, mouse and keyboard version. It would also be nice if it ran on users' current hardware and a totally new system purchase wasn't necessary. But perhaps, I'm dreaming, and asking too much. This IS Windows after all. Stef Not going to happen...the OEM's are in the driver seat..and want to maintain margins by using current hardware. The future market is smart devices, not desktop pcs. For consumers, maybe. I doubt anyone that has to do heavy work with a keyboard is going want to use their thumbs. With the possible exception of the '80s, that is a constantly diminishing population. Watson, Siri and their ilk will be the "keyboards" of the future, accessed by Google glass and smart watches. People just don't need to work the ways they did in the last century. I can see it now. "Hey Siri, make me a web site. I sell widgets, make it groovy. While you're at it, being as you're a multitasking broad, make me a new OS without Metro". If what you say is true, I wonder why Apple made this: I certainly didn't suggest that there won't be computers with keyboards, just that the masses don't need them. The masses don't create web sites, they don't write code of any kind, and with better voice recognition, they don't even need to do their "typing" a la texting to send messages. The rapid growth of tablets and smart phones correlated with the constantly shrinking market for desktops makes that path pretty clear. Apple (more specifically, the late Steve Jobs) was one to recognize this trend years ago, which is why iOS UI has long been shared by the various iStuff. Google's Android OS is also gaining ground, mostly on devices without keyboards. M$ simply joined the club with the introduction of Win8. The only marketing question left is whether Win8.x is a better solution than Android or iStuff. -- best regards, Neil |
#22
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Microsoft Giving Away Windows 8.1?
Blue écrivait :
"...winston‫" wrote: Stef wrote: Came across this little blurb. chuckle, chuckle http://www.theverge.com/2014/2/28/54...8-1-with-bing- experiment What a joke as a marketing ploy. When half your customers don't like the product, giving it away won't change that consensus. MS has already reduced licensing frees with little or no tangible results. MS is in denial. It needs to get its head out of the sand, and give their desktop customers what they want: A true desktop, mouse and keyboard version. It would also be nice if it ran on users' current hardware and a totally new system purchase wasn't necessary. But perhaps, I'm dreaming, and asking too much. This IS Windows after all. Stef Not going to happen...the OEM's are in the driver seat..and want to maintain margins by using current hardware. The future market is smart devices, not desktop pcs. For consumers, maybe. I doubt anyone that has to do heavy work with a keyboard is going want to use their thumbs. Look to the east to understand the who the target market is...it might have been you and I yesterday...it won't be us ever again. In the east they don't do spreadsheets, word processing, data base building? No authors? Philosophers? Etc? Adapt or realize later that what you continue to use (if Windows) will cease to be supported on hardware and software. Reality bites... And all the businesses that use desktops and laptops? I suppose they could put some ports on a smart phone and so you could hook up a keyboard, mouse and monitor. How long do you think it will be before "reality bites"? FWIW you can certainly do spreadsheets, word processing, database, CAD, music, videos, arts, etc. in Windows8, just install the programs you need and use them; they will work the same as in Win7 and maybe Vista and XP. BTW, it can be done with a desktop with mouse and keyboard. You don't do anything usefull with an OS, you do that with specialized applications. |
#23
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Microsoft Giving Away Windows 8.1?
Dominique wrote:
Blue écrivait : "...winston‫" wrote: Stef wrote: Came across this little blurb. chuckle, chuckle http://www.theverge.com/2014/2/28/54...8-1-with-bing- experiment What a joke as a marketing ploy. When half your customers don't like the product, giving it away won't change that consensus. MS has already reduced licensing frees with little or no tangible results. MS is in denial. It needs to get its head out of the sand, and give their desktop customers what they want: A true desktop, mouse and keyboard version. It would also be nice if it ran on users' current hardware and a totally new system purchase wasn't necessary. But perhaps, I'm dreaming, and asking too much. This IS Windows after all. Stef Not going to happen...the OEM's are in the driver seat..and want to maintain margins by using current hardware. The future market is smart devices, not desktop pcs. For consumers, maybe. I doubt anyone that has to do heavy work with a keyboard is going want to use their thumbs. Look to the east to understand the who the target market is...it might have been you and I yesterday...it won't be us ever again. In the east they don't do spreadsheets, word processing, data base building? No authors? Philosophers? Etc? Adapt or realize later that what you continue to use (if Windows) will cease to be supported on hardware and software. Reality bites... And all the businesses that use desktops and laptops? I suppose they could put some ports on a smart phone and so you could hook up a keyboard, mouse and monitor. How long do you think it will be before "reality bites"? FWIW you can certainly do spreadsheets, word processing, database, CAD, music, videos, arts, etc. in Windows8, just install the programs you need and use them; they will work the same as in Win7 and maybe Vista and XP. BTW, it can be done with a desktop with mouse and keyboard. I know. You don't do anything usefull with an OS, you do that with specialized applications. I know. Read the rest of the thread. -- Blue |
#24
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Microsoft Giving Away Windows 8.1?
On 3/1/2014 9:20 AM, Glenn wrote:
On Sat, 1 Mar 2014 10:02:44 -0500, "Neil Gould" wrote: Stef wrote: DevilsPGD wrote: In the last episode of , Stef said: Came across this little blurb. chuckle, chuckle http://www.theverge.com/2014/2/28/54...ing-experiment What a joke as a marketing ploy. When half your customers don't like the product, giving it away won't change that consensus. MS has already reduced licensing frees with little or no tangible results. MS is in denial. It needs to get its head out of the sand, and give their desktop customers what they want: A true desktop, mouse and keyboard version. It would also be nice if it ran on users' current hardware and a totally new system purchase wasn't necessary. But perhaps, I'm dreaming, and asking too much. This IS Windows after all. That's pretty much what Windows 8.1 is; the polish it has over Windows 8 is primarily to enable desktop users. It runs surprisingly well on low-resource systems, new hardware is far from needed if your hardware could handle any moderately recent version of Windows. Even so, 8 or 8.1 are really designed to run on a tablet. No keyboard. No mouse. It takes third-party utilities to turn either into a traditional desktop which is what the majority of Windows users want. My Windows 8.1 notebook does not have a touch screen, and I have no problem using its interface unmodified by any third-party utilities. The computer is stable, faster than the Vista or Windows 7 equivalents, and provides access to more apps via Metro. I suspect that there are some who just don't want to change, which makes me wonder why they did in the first place? I'm posting this from one of my Win2k machines, which is the OS I prefer over XP, Vista or Win7. Nobody is forcing folks to "upgrade", but I think it behooves those who do to learn the benefits of the new OS as well as the hardware that it supports, because time doesn't move in reverse in this neck of the universe. 8-D I tried upgrading win 8.0 twice. The first time image copy was used to go back to 8.0, the second time the 8.0 install disc (and image copy) was needed. I require a physical backup to blu-ray discs, it's no longer possible with 8.1, perhaps the cloud is deemed sufficient for a safe backup. I don't do external "clouds" for anything. It's easy enough to have an in-house server or network HDDs to back up all of one's systems. -- best regards, Neil |
#25
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Microsoft Giving Away Windows 8.1?
On 3/2/2014 7:41 AM, Blue wrote:
Neil Gould wrote: Blue wrote: Neil Gould wrote: Blue wrote: "...winston‫" wrote: Stef wrote: Came across this little blurb. chuckle, chuckle http://www.theverge.com/2014/2/28/54...ing-experiment What a joke as a marketing ploy. When half your customers don't like the product, giving it away won't change that consensus. MS has already reduced licensing frees with little or no tangible results. MS is in denial. It needs to get its head out of the sand, and give their desktop customers what they want: A true desktop, mouse and keyboard version. It would also be nice if it ran on users' current hardware and a totally new system purchase wasn't necessary. But perhaps, I'm dreaming, and asking too much. This IS Windows after all. Stef Not going to happen...the OEM's are in the driver seat..and want to maintain margins by using current hardware. The future market is smart devices, not desktop pcs. For consumers, maybe. I doubt anyone that has to do heavy work with a keyboard is going want to use their thumbs. With the possible exception of the '80s, that is a constantly diminishing population. Watson, Siri and their ilk will be the "keyboards" of the future, accessed by Google glass and smart watches. People just don't need to work the ways they did in the last century. I can see it now. "Hey Siri, make me a web site. I sell widgets, make it groovy. While you're at it, being as you're a multitasking broad, make me a new OS without Metro". If what you say is true, I wonder why Apple made this: I certainly didn't suggest that there won't be computers with keyboards, just that the masses don't need them. The masses don't create web sites, they don't write code of any kind, and with better voice recognition, they don't even need to do their "typing" a la texting to send messages. I just tried that with Chrome. The question is how many times can you click on "try again" before you wish you had a keyboard? Voice recognition is a lot better now than it was in the versions I tried a couple of decades ago, and it's likely to be significantly better a decade from now. So, the question becomes, when voice recognition is better than people's typing, what will users be doing? The rapid growth of tablets and smart phones correlated with the constantly shrinking market for desktops makes that path pretty clear. Many people have all three: a pc, a tablet and a smartphone because each can be used in different ways. The question is not whether that has been the case in the past, but whether that will be the case in the not-too-distant future? Apple (more specifically, the late Steve Jobs) was one to recognize this trend years ago, which is why iOS UI has long been shared by the various iStuff. Google's Android OS is also gaining ground, mostly on devices without keyboards. M$ simply joined the club with the introduction of Win8. The only marketing question left is whether Win8.x is a better solution than Android or iStuff. Yet Apple just released their newest desktop: http://www.apple.com/mac-pro/ Again, why? What do _you_ think that implies? Do you see a significant growth pattern for mac-pro computers? I don't. Considering that Macs have never had a significant market share, a new Mac is just a present-day product offered to a continually shrinking user base (as are other desktops). -- best regards, Neil |
#26
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Microsoft Giving Away Windows 8.1?
Neil wrote:
On 3/2/2014 7:41 AM, Blue wrote: Neil Gould wrote: Blue wrote: Neil Gould wrote: Blue wrote: "...winston‫" wrote: Stef wrote: Came across this little blurb. chuckle, chuckle http://www.theverge.com/2014/2/28/54...ing-experiment What a joke as a marketing ploy. When half your customers don't like the product, giving it away won't change that consensus. MS has already reduced licensing frees with little or no tangible results. MS is in denial. It needs to get its head out of the sand, and give their desktop customers what they want: A true desktop, mouse and keyboard version. It would also be nice if it ran on users' current hardware and a totally new system purchase wasn't necessary. But perhaps, I'm dreaming, and asking too much. This IS Windows after all. Stef Not going to happen...the OEM's are in the driver seat..and want to maintain margins by using current hardware. The future market is smart devices, not desktop pcs. For consumers, maybe. I doubt anyone that has to do heavy work with a keyboard is going want to use their thumbs. With the possible exception of the '80s, that is a constantly diminishing population. Watson, Siri and their ilk will be the "keyboards" of the future, accessed by Google glass and smart watches. People just don't need to work the ways they did in the last century. I can see it now. "Hey Siri, make me a web site. I sell widgets, make it groovy. While you're at it, being as you're a multitasking broad, make me a new OS without Metro". If what you say is true, I wonder why Apple made this: I certainly didn't suggest that there won't be computers with keyboards, just that the masses don't need them. The masses don't create web sites, they don't write code of any kind, and with better voice recognition, they don't even need to do their "typing" a la texting to send messages. I just tried that with Chrome. The question is how many times can you click on "try again" before you wish you had a keyboard? Voice recognition is a lot better now than it was in the versions I tried a couple of decades ago, and it's likely to be significantly better a decade from now. So, the question becomes, when voice recognition is better than people's typing, what will users be doing? The rapid growth of tablets and smart phones correlated with the constantly shrinking market for desktops makes that path pretty clear. Many people have all three: a pc, a tablet and a smartphone because each can be used in different ways. The question is not whether that has been the case in the past, but whether that will be the case in the not-too-distant future? Apple (more specifically, the late Steve Jobs) was one to recognize this trend years ago, which is why iOS UI has long been shared by the various iStuff. Google's Android OS is also gaining ground, mostly on devices without keyboards. M$ simply joined the club with the introduction of Win8. The only marketing question left is whether Win8.x is a better solution than Android or iStuff. Yet Apple just released their newest desktop: http://www.apple.com/mac-pro/ Again, why? What do _you_ think that implies? Do you see a significant growth pattern for mac-pro computers? I don't. Considering that Macs have never had a significant market share, a new Mac is just a present-day product offered to a continually shrinking user base (as are other desktops). Time will tell. -- Blue |
#27
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Microsoft Giving Away Windows 8.1?
....winston‫ wrote:
Stef wrote: Came across this little blurb. chuckle, chuckle http://www.theverge.com/2014/2/28/54...ing-experiment What a joke as a marketing ploy. When half your customers don't like the product, giving it away won't change that consensus. MS has already reduced licensing frees with little or no tangible results. MS is in denial. It needs to get its head out of the sand, and give their desktop customers what they want: A true desktop, mouse and keyboard version. It would also be nice if it ran on users' current hardware and a totally new system purchase wasn't necessary. But perhaps, I'm dreaming, and asking too much. This IS Windows after all. Stef Not going to happen...the OEM's are in the driver seat..and want to maintain margins by using current hardware. And Microsoft is riding shotgun with the gun pointed directly at the driver's head. And the ammunition? MS software licenses. Many times that license, the life blood of the PC & laptop business, and now tablets, too; has been used by threat of modification or outright revocation to coerce manufacturers to produce what MS wants to improve their marketability. And profits. If by "current hardware," you mean the latest stuff hitting the market, I agree. Manufacturers generate income by selling "new and improved" hardware. No one's going to buy new, 5 year old or even 2 year old hardware. I meant by "current hardware," the hardware the user currently owns, not what is currently being sold. Big difference. And as far as the Windows OS, unrealistic. Every major release of Windows has required hardware upgrades, sometimes, an entirely new system. The exception might be W7 to 8. The W7 hardware should run W8/8.1. Of course, there are caveats. The future market is smart devices, not desktop pcs. You make it sound as does the press like no one's making desktops and laptops anymore. Desktop sales were only down 3% last year. And a lot of that was caused by the economy -- can't afford to buy a new PC -- and the dislike of Windows 8 -- not going to buy an OS I hate; I'll wait for 9; or buy a Mac. And FYI: smart devices are just part of the market. Yes, sales are through the roof, but it's the new toy, new status symbol, and teen and 20-somethings have just GOT TO HAVE ONE! It'll settle down as soon as the newness of it wears off, and they realize you can't easily write a term paper or thesis or business report on your cellphone or tablet. I would've hated to write this reply on my cellphone with just my thumbs. ;-) Look to the east to understand the who the target market is...it might have been you and I yesterday...it won't be us ever again. A look to the past and common sense decerns the future better. Adapt or realize later that what you continue to use (if Windows) will cease to be supported on hardware and software. I have adapted. Long before there was a Windows and it was just DOS, I chose the Amiga. And when that died, I switched to Linux. Windows isn't and never has been my primary OS. I have to use it at times. I have to repeatedly repair it for clients. But I don't use it much. It wouldn't bother me in the least if Windows crashed and burned, and Microsoft went out of business. I never much cared for their Draconian business model anyway. Reality bites... Ain't it the truth! Stef |
#28
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Microsoft Giving Away Windows 8.1?
BillW50 wrote:
On 3/1/2014 12:26 AM, Stef wrote: DevilsPGD wrote: In the last episode of , Stef said: Came across this little blurb. chuckle, chuckle http://www.theverge.com/2014/2/28/54...ing-experiment What a joke as a marketing ploy. When half your customers don't like the product, giving it away won't change that consensus. MS has already reduced licensing frees with little or no tangible results. MS is in denial. It needs to get its head out of the sand, and give their desktop customers what they want: A true desktop, mouse and keyboard version. It would also be nice if it ran on users' current hardware and a totally new system purchase wasn't necessary. But perhaps, I'm dreaming, and asking too much. This IS Windows after all. That's pretty much what Windows 8.1 is; the polish it has over Windows 8 is primarily to enable desktop users. It runs surprisingly well on low-resource systems, new hardware is far from needed if your hardware could handle any moderately recent version of Windows. Even so, 8 or 8.1 are really designed to run on a tablet. No keyboard. No mouse. It takes third-party utilities to turn either into a traditional desktop which is what the majority of Windows users want. Why MS is responding so slowly to that is anybody's guess. My guess is MS wants "in" on the big profits of the tablet market, and are trying to force users in that direction. It matters not that 90% of the Windows users out there use desktops whether it is a box under the desk or a laptop. It's what they need. Why can't MS admit that? Pride? Wow! What version of Windows 8 are you running? As mine isn't like that at all. This one is Windows 8 on a laptop. No touch screen and I have it docked so I am using an external monitor, keyboard, and mouse. And Windows 8 is super easy with a keyboard/mouse. And this is my preferred method of using Windows 8. You as well as others misunderstood my statement. I didn't mean W8 wouldn't work with a keyboard and mouse, or run on a laptop or PC. I merely stated that it was designed for a tablet, which has no keyboard or mouse. MS wanted "in" on that market, once it had proven itself lucrative enough. So, a day late and a dollar short, MS developed a new OS, W8, and a tablet to go with it, The Surface, and alienated all their desktop/laptop users with the Metro GUI. Why there wasn't the option to choose either GUIs, I don't know. Probably, saved MS a nickel an OS. Pennywise, but pound foolish. I do have two Windows tablets that is also running Windows 8. One doesn't have touch, but just pen enabled and that is all. The other one has both touch and pen enabled. So I have them all covered. And even for both of them, I still prefer to have them docked and using an external monitor, keyboard, and mouse too. But I don't have to, as I could use them as a tablet too. I have no complaints about the OS itself. It's the GUI that's the "problem." And MS' stubborn arrogance. Moderately recent hardware? I'll assume that means a W7 machine. How many XP users out there with hardware that is 5 or more years old? Millions! W8/8.1 won't run on it. Many businesses in that group. Would cost millions to upgrade: new hardware, new apps, retraining, etc. Business can't afford that right now. Neither can the average user. Wow! What kind of hardware do you buy? This machine is eight years old and runs XP, Vista, 7, and 8. Yes and I have all of the drivers for all of them too. Plus it is a business class machine. Windows 8 upgrade costs me $39.95 plus $9.95 for the Media Center. Consider yourself lucky. I've read some older systems that will run 8, but not 8.1, And it seems that both 8 and 8.1 have problems with AMD CPUs. Sometimes. 8 didn't in my case. I ran the 32-bit pre-release 8 in a Virtualbox VM on a 64-bit Debian 7 (Wheezy) box with both a 3.0 GHz Ahtlon X2 Dual Core and, later, 3.0 GHz Phenom Quad Core (I upgraded) with 8GB RAM. The VM has direct access to the CPU. So, CPU is not virtual. I assigned a single core to the W8 VM. W8 had no problems with either CPU. I tested it with 1, 2 and 3GB RAM. Performances was hesistent only with 1 Gig, but still worked. Tested it for several weeks, running continuously 24/7 in its own workspace. Never crashed. Also, tested Classic Shell. I never tested 8.1. I'm not sold on 8/8.X. Going to wait and see what W9 looks like. Currently, for my Windows needs, I have 32-bit XP running in a VM with 3GB RAM assigned and 1 CPU Core. And W2k on an old Thinkpad 240X which I hardly ever use. Let's face it: Microsoft dropped the ball with W8. Of course, it's not the first time. Remember Vista? Let's face it, you have a different Windows 8 than I do. You may like 8, but I and over 50% of the Windows users out there don't. And I'm willing to wait for something I prefer. As others are. Stef |
#29
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Microsoft Giving Away Windows 8.1?
Neil Gould wrote:
Stef wrote: DevilsPGD wrote: In the last episode of , Stef said: Came across this little blurb. chuckle, chuckle http://www.theverge.com/2014/2/28/54...ing-experiment What a joke as a marketing ploy. When half your customers don't like the product, giving it away won't change that consensus. MS has already reduced licensing frees with little or no tangible results. MS is in denial. It needs to get its head out of the sand, and give their desktop customers what they want: A true desktop, mouse and keyboard version. It would also be nice if it ran on users' current hardware and a totally new system purchase wasn't necessary. But perhaps, I'm dreaming, and asking too much. This IS Windows after all. That's pretty much what Windows 8.1 is; the polish it has over Windows 8 is primarily to enable desktop users. It runs surprisingly well on low-resource systems, new hardware is far from needed if your hardware could handle any moderately recent version of Windows. Even so, 8 or 8.1 are really designed to run on a tablet. No keyboard. No mouse. It takes third-party utilities to turn either into a traditional desktop which is what the majority of Windows users want. My Windows 8.1 notebook does not have a touch screen, and I have no problem using its interface unmodified by any third-party utilities. The computer is stable, faster than the Vista or Windows 7 equivalents, and provides access to more apps via Metro. I never said W8 wouldn't work on a traditional laptop or PC, I just said it was designed to run on a tablet -- The Surface specifically.. Its sales have been dismal as well. Wonder why? W8 is faster than W7 on the same hardware. That's because it was designed to run on a tablet which has lower specs that traditional laptops or PCs. What MS had to do, what features had to be abandoned, etc. to achieve this, I don't know. But only being able to run and display two apps at a time is a pain. I suspect that there are some who just don't want to change, which makes me wonder why they did in the first place? I'm posting this from one of my Before computers? People used paper and pen, and typewriters, and their brains. Win2k machines, which is the OS I prefer over XP, Vista or Win7. Nobody is forcing folks to "upgrade", but I think it behooves those who do to learn Wrong! MS does. It has to to stay profitable. That's how it makes its money: Selling OSes and software. I read that 90% of MS' gross income comes from the sale of software. Now, that model is failing. So, MS is following Abobe's lead, and switching to leasing software instead of selling it. And, then there's the Cloud. How long before Windows becomes a Chrome-like OS? the benefits of the new OS as well as the hardware that it supports, because time doesn't move in reverse in this neck of the universe. 8-D To many people, and businesses as well, the philosphy is: "If it works, and works to my satisfaction, why upgrade?" It's a variation of the adage: "if it ain't broke, why fix it?" Stef |
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Microsoft Giving Away Windows 8.1?
On 3/2/2014 5:05 PM, Stef wrote:
BillW50 wrote: On 3/1/2014 12:26 AM, Stef wrote: DevilsPGD wrote: In the last episode of , Stef said: Came across this little blurb. chuckle, chuckle http://www.theverge.com/2014/2/28/54...ing-experiment What a joke as a marketing ploy. When half your customers don't like the product, giving it away won't change that consensus. MS has already reduced licensing frees with little or no tangible results. MS is in denial. It needs to get its head out of the sand, and give their desktop customers what they want: A true desktop, mouse and keyboard version. It would also be nice if it ran on users' current hardware and a totally new system purchase wasn't necessary. But perhaps, I'm dreaming, and asking too much. This IS Windows after all. That's pretty much what Windows 8.1 is; the polish it has over Windows 8 is primarily to enable desktop users. It runs surprisingly well on low-resource systems, new hardware is far from needed if your hardware could handle any moderately recent version of Windows. Even so, 8 or 8.1 are really designed to run on a tablet. No keyboard. No mouse. It takes third-party utilities to turn either into a traditional desktop which is what the majority of Windows users want. Why MS is responding so slowly to that is anybody's guess. My guess is MS wants "in" on the big profits of the tablet market, and are trying to force users in that direction. It matters not that 90% of the Windows users out there use desktops whether it is a box under the desk or a laptop. It's what they need. Why can't MS admit that? Pride? Wow! What version of Windows 8 are you running? As mine isn't like that at all. This one is Windows 8 on a laptop. No touch screen and I have it docked so I am using an external monitor, keyboard, and mouse. And Windows 8 is super easy with a keyboard/mouse. And this is my preferred method of using Windows 8. You as well as others misunderstood my statement. I didn't mean W8 wouldn't work with a keyboard and mouse, or run on a laptop or PC. I merely stated that it was designed for a tablet, which has no keyboard or mouse. No I got that, you miss understood me. Windows 8 works perfectly fine with a keyboard and mouse. There should be no complaints about this at all. Although Windows does have the Start Screen and Metro that not only works well with the keyboard and mouse, but with touch too. MS wanted "in" on that market, once it had proven itself lucrative enough. So, a day late and a dollar short, MS developed a new OS, W8, and a tablet to go with it, The Surface, and alienated all their desktop/laptop users with the Metro GUI. Why there wasn't the option to choose either GUIs, I don't know. Probably, saved MS a nickel an OS. Pennywise, but pound foolish. Oh come on! It is like Windows 8 has two virtual desktops. Ever use virtual desktops before? If you want to live only on the desktop side, nothing is stopping you. Maybe later versions will, but not Windows 8. I do have two Windows tablets that is also running Windows 8. One doesn't have touch, but just pen enabled and that is all. The other one has both touch and pen enabled. So I have them all covered. And even for both of them, I still prefer to have them docked and using an external monitor, keyboard, and mouse too. But I don't have to, as I could use them as a tablet too. I have no complaints about the OS itself. It's the GUI that's the "problem." And MS' stubborn arrogance. Moderately recent hardware? I'll assume that means a W7 machine. How many XP users out there with hardware that is 5 or more years old? Millions! W8/8.1 won't run on it. Many businesses in that group. Would cost millions to upgrade: new hardware, new apps, retraining, etc. Business can't afford that right now. Neither can the average user. Wow! What kind of hardware do you buy? This machine is eight years old and runs XP, Vista, 7, and 8. Yes and I have all of the drivers for all of them too. Plus it is a business class machine. Windows 8 upgrade costs me $39.95 plus $9.95 for the Media Center. Consider yourself lucky. I've read some older systems that will run 8, but not 8.1, And it seems that both 8 and 8.1 have problems with AMD CPUs. Sometimes. 8 didn't in my case. I ran the 32-bit pre-release 8 in a Virtualbox VM on a 64-bit Debian 7 (Wheezy) box with both a 3.0 GHz Ahtlon X2 Dual Core and, later, 3.0 GHz Phenom Quad Core (I upgraded) with 8GB RAM. The VM has direct access to the CPU. So, CPU is not virtual. I assigned a single core to the W8 VM. W8 had no problems with either CPU. I tested it with 1, 2 and 3GB RAM. Performances was hesistent only with 1 Gig, but still worked. Tested it for several weeks, running continuously 24/7 in its own workspace. Never crashed. Also, tested Classic Shell. I never tested 8.1. I'm not sold on 8/8.X. Going to wait and see what W9 looks like. Whoa, whoa, whoa! AMD processors? They always was the underdog and they always have had problems. Sure you buy a machine with an AMD and it works just fine. Yes I have ADMs just like that. But if you upgrade the OS or anything, all bets are off. That is just life with AMD. Currently, for my Windows needs, I have 32-bit XP running in a VM with 3GB RAM assigned and 1 CPU Core. And W2k on an old Thinkpad 240X which I hardly ever use. Sounds fine with me. Let's face it: Microsoft dropped the ball with W8. Of course, it's not the first time. Remember Vista? Let's face it, you have a different Windows 8 than I do. You may like 8, but I and over 50% of the Windows users out there don't. And I'm willing to wait for something I prefer. As others are. No, I think both Windows 7 and 8 are ok. I love XP the most out of any OS as far. Although I think most Windows 8 complaints are bogus. It is still fine, but it is just different. And some people can't deal with it. -- Bill Gateway M465e ('06 era) - Thunderbird v24.3.0 Centrino Core2 Duo T7400 2.16 GHz - 4GB - Windows 7 Home SP1 |
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