Windows 10 automatically installed itself.

On 3/13/2016 10:23 PM, notX wrote:
On 03/13/2016 07:23 PM, Keith Nuttle wrote:

[snip]

Remember the Bible says "Do unto others as you would have others do unto
you."

That "golden rule" does NOT originate in the bible (almost nothing of
any importance does), but was around much earlier than that.

BTW, so, if you're suicidal you should kill everybody? That's what that
[expletive deleted] rule says.


If this is an example of the logic you use in your programing it is no
wonder that today's software is so crappy.

Suicide is a personal act against one self, so there is no way you can
commit your neighbor's suicide, nor can he commit yours. If you kill
you neighbor that is murder not suicide.

I never said the the Golden Rule originated in the Bible, but that it
was in the Bible. This sounds like a you also have a reading
comprehension problem also

On 3/14/2016 6:54 AM, GlowingBlueMist's fingers rattled off:
On 3/14/2016 2:27 AM, John Doe wrote:
Albert wrote

Anyway, we talked about bumping up to Windows 10 and why she was
reluctant to do so and she explained she didn't want to have to learn
a whole new set of operating procedures.

It's not likely to bother ordinary users much. That is, unless the
system gets messed up by the upgrade. Then it's a big problem.

Now that you have migrated to W10 if you or your wife wants the look and
feel of W7 or W8 while running W10 you might want to give Start 8 or
Classic Start Menu.

You can have Start8 for $4.99 or Classic Start for Free. Both have
their followers as well as detractors and some who hate the thought of
using either.

Start8 - www.stardock.com/products/
Classic Start - www.classicshell.net

Agreed. I use Classic Shell and, with a few registry tweaks, got rid of
the stupid tiles/menu, have W10 looking just like W7. I originally did
the in-place upgrade but had too many issues so I recently did a clean
install on two systems. Things working just fine now.

--
Ed Mullen
http://edmullen.net/
Save your breath, you'll need it to blow up your date.

On 3/14/16 7:29 AM, Ed Mullen wrote:
On 3/14/2016 6:54 AM, GlowingBlueMist's fingers rattled off:
On 3/14/2016 2:27 AM, John Doe wrote:
Albert wrote

Anyway, we talked about bumping up to Windows 10 and why she was
reluctant to do so and she explained she didn't want to have to learn
a whole new set of operating procedures.

It's not likely to bother ordinary users much. That is, unless the
system gets messed up by the upgrade. Then it's a big problem.

Now that you have migrated to W10 if you or your wife wants the look and
feel of W7 or W8 while running W10 you might want to give Start 8 or
Classic Start Menu.

You can have Start8 for $4.99 or Classic Start for Free. Both have
their followers as well as detractors and some who hate the thought of
using either.

Start8 - www.stardock.com/products/
Classic Start - www.classicshell.net

Agreed. I use Classic Shell and, with a few registry tweaks, got rid of
the stupid tiles/menu, have W10 looking just like W7. I originally did
the in-place upgrade but had too many issues so I recently did a clean
install on two systems. Things working just fine now.

I'm sticking with W7 for 98% of my Windows time, but I have to say, I
like the new Start Menu. You can switch out the tiles for ones that are
useful to you.

There's a Start Menu replacement called Start Menu Reviver that is
eerily like W10, and was available before W10. One has to wonder... LOL


--
Ken
Mac OS X 10.8.5
Firefox 44.0
Thunderbird 38.0.1
"My brain is like lightning, a quick flash
and it's gone!"

| I don't think that follows. You have a license
| to use one copy of the software, just as you
| buy a single license when you buy a book or
| record album or architectural blueprints. That
| doesn't give them the right to change what
| they sold you. Nor does it give them a right
| to look at your private files. Those are *your*
| intellectual property.
|
| A very poor comparision. Rights for each of your comparisions are unique
| to each, not comparable to support a common right for each.
|

They're all intellectual property, which is what
Microsoft claims to be licensing. Arguments like yours
always hinge on a technical interpretation: People
have to click the EULA button to use their computer.
Therefore they agree to anything in the EULA. But no
one can *honestly* claim Microsoft has the right to
access your computer without permission or change
the product they sold you, just because you clicked
a button that you were required to click in order for
your computer to work.

Does Amazon have a right to watch while you
read Kindle books? Not by any normal standard of
common decency. If they do so it can only be
because it's non-confrontational and invisible. New
technology has made it possible.

Imagine that I come to your house to build a closet.
Instead of the typical 2-page building contract I
offer you a 50 page tome in tiny print. Buried in
that contract, in obscure language, are claims that
I have a right to advertise my business on your lawn,
use pictures of your house in my advertising, and
quote you in my advertising. No one can *honestly*
say you agreed to all that, even though a court
might rule otherwise. You thought you were agreeing
to pay me for some construction work.

There was an interesting related case in 2012:

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/...man-joel-glass

A woman at an Orlando Magic game ended up with
a giant closeup photo, of herself cheering, being used
in ads on the sides of buses. She sued. She'd been
photographed with a telephoto lens as she watched
the game. The team claimed they had rights to profit
from her image in accord with the fine print on the
back of the ticket! The analysis is interesting.
Among other points is that since she's not famous her
likeness is not worth much money. If she were a movie
star she'd have a better case. Movie stars have more
rights than just plain folks.
I don't know how the case ended up. The team
stopped using the ads, but I haven't found any
news about who won the case. It's an interesting
case in two ways. It demonstrates how technology
is changing how things work. It also demonstrates
how public attitudes are gradually changing to regard
private intrusion (and the ubiquity of advertising) as
normal.

| Which 'private' files does MSFT 'look at' ?
|

Which ones don't they look at?

http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/priva...t/default.aspx

If you read that page you'll see there's nothing left
out. The Win10 EULA states that you accept those
terms as defined in the privacy agreement. Some
might say that MS only processes the data for
business purposes, but that doesn't make it any less
an intrusion. Since when is it normal that one needs
to agree to a privacy contract to use one's computer?!

It's been documented that Win10 calls home even
with all privacy settings maxed, and that much of
that communication is encrypted. It's like the example
of the salesman who breaks into your house. You
come home to find a window jimmied and a man in
your office. He smiles and says not to worry because
he's only there for marketing research. Do you say,
"Okey doke. I'll be in the kitchen when you finish.
Come on in for coffee. As a Microsoft MVP I know
that breaking in for business reasons is not really
a break-in." ?

| . Like Albert, the OP. He's sort of outraged.
| On the other hand, he's not sure what to think.
|
| Looks like Albert decided that W10 on the wife's device was the
| preferred route.

Yes. Most people can't be bothered. He was taken
aback that MS was taking the liberty of changing
his computer, but in the long run he opted for
convenience. Using Win10 means he doesn't need
to remember as much. So now he'll acclimate to MS
spying and won't be taken aback so much when they
put ads for coupons on his prescriptions on the
Win10 desktop. It's easier. And heck, he can save
money!

Most people opt for convenience. That's what's
making the online services world go 'round. You
fill in a form, click a button, and then you can
share photos, talk to friends, listen to music, or
do any number of other things. Privacy intrusion
is an abstract and complex issue. The ability to
share baby pictures is an immediate, emotional
issue: "I want you to see my baby pictures.
Whaddayamean you don't use Facebook?!"

I remember seeing surveys when privacy first
became an issue talked about. The majority of
people wanted to be paid for their data. They
didn't want much. Maybe a couple of bucks. Most
really didn't care about being spied on and didn't
really care about the money. Their only
concern was that if someone was making money
with that data then they'd be suckers if they didn't
get a cut. People cared about not being suckers.

It's Albert's right to do as he pleases. (At least
within the confines of Microsoft's terms.) I don't
consider it my cause to stop Win10. I'm only trying
to make information available to people who want it.
Microsoft spends billions on marketing. Most people
have little idea of what's going on. They deserve
to be able to make informed choices.

"Good Guy" wrote in message ...
On 14/03/2016 01:10, Popkin wrote:

If you don’t have anything constructive to say, it’s best to STFU. In that way you won’t look like a horses ass.



If you don't like my posts it's best to STFU or kill filter me so that you don't get blood pressure from me insulting you. are you the same Canadian "Who is Small Boys Abuser"? We thought you got arrested but it seems you escaped. President Trump will deal with you.


“STFU”!!?? Widdle man learned a new acronym!! Goody for you

I like your posts. Of all the Horses Asses here, you are the biggest one. Quite a feather in your cap.

You are the best free entertainment on this group.

Keep up the , hehehe, babbling raves. Very amusing.








--

On 3/13/2016 8:20 PM, Paul in Houston TX wrote:
Albert wrote:

QUESTION: how can Microsoft or any other entity go into her computer
and do what they did without her knowledge or permission?

Thank you,
Albert

Because she gave them permission and let them in.
Some people have installed GWX control panel.
http://ultimateoutsider.com/downloads/
I have not. Instead I examine every update, choose the ones that I want,
and hide the rest.

That can eat up a lot of time, and some of us have work to do. It isn't
easy to choose the updates individually because MS provides very little
information about some of them. So, under the best of circumstances, one
just has hope that the update is useful to them.

--
Best regards,

Neil

"notX" wrote in message ...

On 03/13/2016 07:23 PM, Keith Nuttle wrote:

[snip]

Remember the Bible says "Do unto others as you would have others do unto
you."

That "golden rule" does NOT originate in the bible (almost nothing of any
importance does), but was around much earlier than that.

Yeah, it's an amusing fairy tale.

And the 10 commandments; rules written by the weak.

We were given free will with no conditions. God has no problems with what
we do, but society does.

Some constructive criticism here.

When you post, please don't write a thesis.

After reading a few paragraphs of drivel, I move on to another post which
gets right to the point.


I'm only trying to help.


snip the long winded drivel.

Albert wrote:

Every time that MS has queried as to whether she wants to upgrade she
or I have refused. Saturday morning she went in to do her stuff and
found out that Microsoft had summarily installed 10 and if she did not
want it she had to request to return to the previous OS (8.1) which I
did. It took about 35 to 40 minutes to get her computer back the way
it was. And so far she hasn't noticed if anything is messed up. We
have our fingers crossed.

We went through the same thing. I declined the licensing agreement,
and it went back to 8.1. BUT...later that day it was trying again.

The solution is to download GWX Control Panel
(http://ultimateoutsider.com/downloads/). Using that you can shut down
the Win10 upgrade.

--
Tim Slattery
tim at risingdove dot com

On 03/13/2016 06:09 PM, Good Guy wrote:
On 13/03/2016 22:52, philo wrote:



Sheesh

look at this

http://www.pcworld.com/article/29831...it-anyway.html


So you agree that the OP should know how to disable automatic update or
at least how to configure the machine so that no upgrades are downloaded
without express permission of the user.

One wonders when will these people learn how to control their own
machines! Mind boggles. They blame everybody except their own stupidity.





Since I had not fired up my Win10 machine in a long time, I decided to
update it today to see what would happen.


It looks like, instead of telling you there are a bunch of individual
updates, it just made the notification of cumulative updates.

I started the process, then left the house,
when I can back the machine had been shut down.

It was not in sleep or hibernate, it had simply turned itself off.


When I turned it back on, it said "reboot required to finish installing
updates"

On 3/14/2016 3:54 AM, GlowingBlueMist wrote:
On 3/14/2016 2:27 AM, John Doe wrote:
Albert wrote

Anyway, we talked about bumping up to Windows 10 and why she was
reluctant to do so and she explained she didn't want to have to learn
a whole new set of operating procedures.

It's not likely to bother ordinary users much. That is, unless the
system gets messed up by the upgrade. Then it's a big problem.

Now that you have migrated to W10 if you or your wife wants the look and
feel of W7 or W8 while running W10 you might want to give Start 8 or
Classic Start Menu.

You can have Start8 for $4.99 or Classic Start for Free. Both have
their followers as well as detractors and some who hate the thought of
using either.

Start8 - www.stardock.com/products/
Classic Start - www.classicshell.net
I don't understand what all the fuss is about.
I'd agree that win8 was constricting. The start menu fixes were
beneficial.

But win10 is not very much different from win7.

Turn off each live tile so it doesn't waste bandwidth and
never go there again.

I have a window that opens when I boot.
It has links to 99.99% of the program clicks I use.

And it looks the same as the page on my XP machine and win7 machine
and my linux machine (except the stuff linux can't do doesn't have links
and that's why it rarely gets booted).

Doesn't matter how the start menu works if you don't use it.

On 03/14/2016 07:53 AM, wrote:

[snip]

8 and 10 both suck. I'll stay with 7. It's real nice.


The best version of Windows I've had is 2000. Maybe obsolete now, but
the best in it's time. It came in between the old Windows suckiness and
the new Windows suckiness.

For a more modern version, it's 7.

--
Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.us/

"The government ought to stay out of the prayer business." -- Jimmy
Carter

Neil wrote:
On 3/13/2016 8:20 PM, Paul in Houston TX wrote:
Albert wrote:

QUESTION: how can Microsoft or any other entity go into her computer
and do what they did without her knowledge or permission?

Thank you,
Albert

Because she gave them permission and let them in.
Some people have installed GWX control panel.
http://ultimateoutsider.com/downloads/
I have not. Instead I examine every update, choose the ones that I want,
and hide the rest.

That can eat up a lot of time, and some of us have work to do. It isn't easy to choose the
updates individually because MS provides very little information about some of them. So,
under the best of circumstances, one just has hope that the update is useful to them.

I have to admit that it is time consuming. I usually play on one machine
while the others are updating. I've found that 99% of optional updates are
not worth bothering with and sometimes I just hide all of them without looking.

Mayayana wrote:
| I don't think that follows. You have a license
| to use one copy of the software, just as you
| buy a single license when you buy a book or
| record album or architectural blueprints. That
| doesn't give them the right to change what
| they sold you. Nor does it give them a right
| to look at your private files. Those are *your*
| intellectual property.
|
| A very poor comparision. Rights for each of your comparisions are unique
| to each, not comparable to support a common right for each.
|

They're all intellectual property, which is what
Microsoft claims to be licensing. Arguments like yours
always hinge on a technical interpretation: People
have to click the EULA button to use their computer.
Therefore they agree to anything in the EULA. But no
one can *honestly* claim Microsoft has the right to
access your computer without permission or change
the product they sold you, just because you clicked
a button that you were required to click in order for
your computer to work.

Don't need to honestly claim anything - install it, you agreed to any
and all MSFT requirements, including their right to revise them.

Let me know when you find another product or service EULA that supplants
the MSFT EULA - as noted before, comparisons among others including
other MSFT o/s are not relevant to each other.

Does Amazon have a right to watch while you
read Kindle books? Not by any normal standard of
common decency. If they do so it can only be
because it's non-confrontational and invisible. New
technology has made it possible.

Amazon doesn't license MSFT software. Comparison again not relevant.


Imagine that I come to your house to build a closet.
Instead of the typical 2-page building contract I
offer you a 50 page tome in tiny print. Buried in
that contract, in obscure language, are claims that
I have a right to advertise my business on your lawn,
use pictures of your house in my advertising, and
quote you in my advertising. No one can *honestly*
say you agreed to all that, even though a court
might rule otherwise. You thought you were agreeing
to pay me for some construction work.

Sign that 2 page contract ? - you agreed and waived your rights.

There was an interesting related case in 2012:

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/...man-joel-glass

A woman at an Orlando Magic game ended up with
a giant closeup photo, of herself cheering, being used
in ads on the sides of buses. She sued. She'd been
photographed with a telephoto lens as she watched
the game. The team claimed they had rights to profit
from her image in accord with the fine print on the
back of the ticket! The analysis is interesting.
Among other points is that since she's not famous her
likeness is not worth much money. If she were a movie
star she'd have a better case. Movie stars have more
rights than just plain folks.
I don't know how the case ended up. The team
stopped using the ads, but I haven't found any
news about who won the case. It's an interesting
case in two ways. It demonstrates how technology
is changing how things work. It also demonstrates
how public attitudes are gradually changing to regard
private intrusion (and the ubiquity of advertising) as
normal.

Iirc, you or another used this same 'NBA Team' snapshot in the past
attempting to make a point. It's applicability, whatever resolution was
agreed upon, is unique to that situation. If not resulting in a court
decision then any attempt to use as a precedent would be worthy of
discussion but not much else.

Public attitudes are changing..some even based on a false premise.

| Which 'private' files does MSFT 'look at' ?
|

Which ones don't they look at?
I thought you knew the answer.

https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/...=vs.85%29.aspx

http://www.zdnet.com/article/windows...metry-secrets/

http://lifehacker.com/what-windows-1...lly-1722267229

--
....winston
msft mvp windows experience

mike wrote:
On 3/14/2016 2:58 AM, Paul wrote:
mike wrote:
On 3/14/2016 1:28 AM, ...winston wrote:
Good Guy wrote:

2) go to Settings and change it to something like this:


Reschedule start of puter
http://s27.postimg.org/jdusuznur/2016_03_14_0128.png


There is evidence that this setting will ensure you don't get bothered
for months!!!

Nope.

That setting will continue to bother for reschedule or restart.

No evidence exists that configuring for a restart will prevent 'getting
bothered for months'

Windows Pro users have additional options to 'Defer'. Try comparing
Defer and Restart options. Once done, then let us know if evidence
exists on Restart ensuring 'you don't get bothered for months'

There are lots of reasons to restart while doing something.
My experience has been that ANY reboot will install updates, no matter
what you deferred. About all you can do is sit there so you can click
"continue" several places during the update. Having an hour or more
of lost productivity is not acceptable.


There are things you can do to make an Update go faster..

1) Open Services, and modify Windows Search. Change
the recovery options to "Take No Action" (all three)
on a failure, then click Stop. The SearchIndexer, even
in Paused state (because it senses the user is present),
wastes cycles and degraded performance. Turn it off.

2) Open the Windows Defender Control Panel, and disable
Real Time protection. This has a more muted effect
and doesn't do as much good.

Those two, can cut your run time in half.

During the restart, the handling of PendingDeletes,
I've got nothing to help with that. There could well
be interfering processes, but no interface you can
use to tame them.

Paul
Thanks for the input, I'll do that, but that's not the point.
Windows asked me when to schedule the update.
I told windows when to schedule the update.
Windows did NOT honor our agreement.
That's an easy fix at the MS end. One IF-statement
in the boot process?????

I should not have to jump thru hoops at my end.
Someone at MS needs to care about the massive
loss of productivity they're causing and do what
they can without interfering with their mandate to
INVADE MY machine.

The ability to schedule the restart is limited. The software, iirc, is
designed to allow a short term delay, but not indefinitely and only for
so many user configured delays.

Windows Pro, unlike Home, has more options including GPO settings.

--
....winston
msft mvp windows experience