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Chaya Eve wrote:
On Fri, 16 Jun 2017 20:15:43 +1000, Lucifer Morningstar
wrote:

I have on a few occasions, helped people remove iTunes.
iTunes is necessary if you have an ipod/pad/phone.

I think what you're saying is that Apple users are extremely unimaginative.

What does iTunes do that "makes" it necessary for an iPod/iPad/iPhone?
I don't have iTunes, and I have all three devices on my network.

AFAICT, the _only_ thing you need iTunes for is to "initialize" an iPod.
After that go-to-jail penalty is paid, iTunes is just unnecessary.

If I'm wrong that iTunes is unnecessary (except to initialize iPods), then
you will be able to tell us why or how iTunes is "necessary" to use an
iPod, an iPad, or an iPhone, bearing in mind I use them all the time
without iTunes existing (thank God).

What does iTunes do that "makes" it necessary for an iPod/iPad/iPhone?

There seem to be some options for syncing.

http://www.techradar.com/news/the-be...tive-to-itunes

I don't have a music collection, so I don't know if any
of those is a complete solution or not. Or only half
a solution.

Paul

On Thu, 15 Jun 2017 20:44:41 -0500, Rene Lamontagne
wrote:

Purge itune and bonjour and issue resolves...




I agree 100 %.

Rene

I also agree.
http://www.zdnet.com/article/the-uno...out-bloatware/

I have iPods, iPads, and iPhones on my network and iTunes was only used to
initialize the iPods when they were bought new, and then instantly deleted
(which isn't so easily done since it's more than a half dozen separate
components, only some of which install where to told them to install).

Other than a 10KB program to initialize an iPod (which is an unnecessary
step in the first place, imposed by Apple to FORCE people to install iTunes
on Windows), the rest of the hundreds of megabytes of iTunes is the
canonical description of bloatware.

On Fri, 16 Jun 2017 12:49:23 -0400, Paul wrote:

There seem to be some options for syncing.

http://www.techradar.com/news/the-be...tive-to-itunes

I don't have a music collection, so I don't know if any
of those is a complete solution or not. Or only half
a solution.

My use model is to keep multiple devices, each with their own "library" of
songs and files, whether those devices are Android or Apple.

For an iPod, the SharePod freeware works just fine to "manage" that
library, and, in fact, SharePod allows me to connect, say, one of each
(iPod, Android phone, windows computer, etc.) and just copy songs back and
forth with zero restrictions.

That means I can collect all the iPods in the neighborhood, and connect
them at once to the network, and just share files at will.

How does iTunes do that simplest of all use models?

In article , Chaya Eve
wrote:

That means I can collect all the iPods in the neighborhood, and connect
them at once to the network, and just share files at will.

translated: you pirate music and movies.

Chaya Eve wrote:

iTunes was only used to initialize the iPods when they were bought
new
IMHO there are so many other mp3 player that do the job without
"special" software to initialize. Added benefit they are cheaper. Anyway
who uses mp3 players when they have their phone on them 24-7?

--
Take care,

Jonathan
-------------------
LITTLE WORKS STUDIO
http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com

Wolf K wrote:
On 2017-06-16 10:33, Jonathan N. Little wrote:
Lucifer Morningstar wrote:

It is vital that you turn off 'hide extensions for known file types.'

For an OS where that is vital to identifying media type the default
setting is just plain stupid. Especially now where rename initially only
selects the forward portion of the filename to assist newbies from
inadvertently changing the extension and breaking the file association.
MS would not recognize security if it where the size of Texas.

I suspect rather that MS noted that most of its users were (and are)
confused and annoyed by file-extensions. So MS gave the customers what
they wanted.


Which has led the sheep to slaughter still to this day with the time
honored double-extension-spoof attack.

--
Take care,

Jonathan
-------------------
LITTLE WORKS STUDIO
http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com

On Fri, 16 Jun 2017 14:58:44 -0400, "Jonathan N. Little"
wrote:

iTunes was only used to initialize the iPods when they were bought
new
IMHO there are so many other mp3 player that do the job without
"special" software to initialize. Added benefit they are cheaper. Anyway
who uses mp3 players when they have their phone on them 24-7?

I agree with you that the _only_ reason iTunes ever existed on my LAN was
to initialize iPods. Once initialized, iTunes does NOTHING of value.

I opened a separate thread on what iTunes does on Windows that has value.

So far, even the Apple apologists can't find _any_ value in iTunes for
Windows users.

Is there anything that iTunes does that is useful that better software
doesn't already do in a less bloatware and less constrained way?

On Fri, 16 Jun 2017 13:45:28 -0400, nospam wrote:

That means I can collect all the iPods in the neighborhood, and connect
them at once to the network, and just share files at will.

translated: you pirate music and movies.

Translated: You agree iTunes can't do the simplest of things.

In article , Chaya Eve
wrote:


That means I can collect all the iPods in the neighborhood, and connect
them at once to the network, and just share files at will.

translated: you pirate music and movies.

Translated: You agree iTunes can't do the simplest of things.

translated: you're lying about what i said and trolling.

itunes can do both simple and complex things. your problem is that you
can't see beyond your hatred.

On 2017-06-16, Paul wrote:
nospam wrote:

and the crashes you claim are pure fabrication anyway. roughly a
*billion* people use itunes without issue. it's one of the most
popular apps on windows (source: microsoft).

I have on a few occasions, helped people remove iTunes.

If you look at the package construction, it was an attempt to add
materials to the Windows ecosystem

"Ecosystem"? The iTunes for Windows installer copies materials to the
system, which is exactly what *every* installer does.

in an unnecessary way

Nah. The iTunes for Windows installer just installs multiple packages.
Obviously, Apple decided that to enable the entire iTunes user
experience (similar to the experience you get on macOS), it was
necessary to install several software components to enable features that
were missing from default Windows installations. They are bundled as
separate packages because they are designed in a modular way and so that
each can be updated independently from the others. I've had various
versions of iTunes installed on Windows systems for years without issue.
So I'm skeptical of people who make wild claims that iTunes causes
horrible problems on all Windows PCs. There are apparently some people
who have problems with iTunes and related software on Windows, but then
there are people out there who are so inept with computers they'd
actually do the world a favor if they just stayed away from them. So I
take random samples with a grain of salt.

Let's analyze the Apple position on QuickTime over time, to get some
idea of how the package is "opportunistic".

Initially the position was "Oh, Jesus, you need QuickTime on your
Windows computer, because... movies".

Actually, Apple's obvious position when deciding whether to bundle
QuickTime with the iTunes installer was simply that since iTunes already
relies on QuickTime, the user experience on Windows would be improved
with QuickTime installed.

The QuickTime would grab all the file associations away from Windows
existing solutions. Because... clever ecosystem play.

RealPlayer and other media players do the same thing. There are many
media apps that have file association settings. There is nothing evil or
nefarious about it. Generally, if you install a media player on a
system, it's because you want to play my media with it. So being able to
associate media files with a given media app is a good thing.

A bit more than a year ago, Apple decided to pull the plug on doing
security updates on the Windows QuickTime package. They decided to
remove QuickTime from the latest iTunes installer.

Apple has been moving away from QuickTime on all platforms, yes.

Bonjour is more of the same, and if you read the description here,
it's just more "we'll just add our crap to your ecosystem" play.

Bonjour is simply zero conf. Windows doesn't have it by default, and
iTunes works well with it, so Apple installs it with iTunes because it
improves the user experience. Apple's not trying to take over your
computer or anything of the sort. That's your bias showing.

The difference now, is Apple gives Bonjour away to third-party
developers, so they can be installing it, instead of Apple. And now
you have multiple vectors for getting it.

There's no reason to avoid it.

It should have been possible for the iTunes package to have just *one*
MSI in it, performing the iTunes functions.

There's no reason it should only be one package. You're picking on the
iTunes installer for a pretty illogical reason: it contains multiple
packages. Multiple-package installers are not a new thing on Windows.
You do know that, right?

--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

On 2017-06-16, Wolf K wrote:
On 2017-06-15 21:55, Jolly Roger wrote:
On 2017-06-16, Wolf K wrote:
On 2017-06-15 20:15, Jolly Roger wrote:
On 2017-06-16, Wolf K wrote:
On 2017-06-15 17:41, Jolly Roger wrote:
On 2017-06-15, Davoud wrote:
Wolf K:

Google Photos is an alternative to iCloud. It's a website,
accessible with any browser, no app needed. There are many such
services, eg, Photobucket. AFAIK, they all provide some levels
of privacy and control.

Google provides some level of privacy? Their very existence is
about selling our privacy.

+1

Pointless comment.

Nope. Google is literally in the business of collecting and selling
information about its users to advertisers and other special
interests for profit. That's the Google business model, like it or
not.

Sure, but not relevant

I disagree. It's completely relevant with things as intimate as
personal photos. You can learn quite a lot about people from their
photos combined with other metadata about them. You don't use *any*
Google service "for free". It has a cost, and with Google, probably
more than any other company whose business plan isn't to extract as
much salable information about you as possible to sell to the highest
bidder.

All true, but what's the point of moaning about it

You seem to have mistaken my merely pointing out that Google and privacy
should typically never be in the same sentence together as "moaning" -
yet you agree. Peculiar.

if you are unwilling to

How do you propose to know what I am willing or unwilling to do?

And why use any kind of photo (or file) storage service, such as
iCloud?

Probably because you appreciate the user experience it offers.

FWIW, I don't.

I do. I can start a drawing on my desktop computer, get up in the middle
of it, take my phone out of my pocket, and pick up my drawing right
where I left off. I can take and place phone calls through my cell phone
from any of my computers or mobile devices around me. The minute I take
a new photo on any of my devices, it shows up on all of my other
devices. There are a *ton of extremely useful features you get with
iCloud, free of charge.

--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

On 2017-06-16, Wolf K wrote:
On 2017-06-15 21:57, Jolly Roger wrote:
On 2017-06-16, nospam wrote:

except that jane kept copies and not only can jane look at them at
any time, but so can everyone else because she posted some of the
more incriminating ones to imgur and linked them in a reddit thread.

now dick is *really* angry with jane.

despite their spats, google continues to build its knowledge graph
of both dick and jane and everyone they know.

It bears repeating:

+1

As does the question: Why are you letting it happen?

Me? I'm not letting it happen. I rarely use Google for anything anymore.
That's a conscious choice I've made, and I'm happier for it.

--
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

On Fri, 16 Jun 2017 16:14:30 -0400, nospam wrote:

itunes can do both simple and complex things. your problem is that you
can't see beyond your hatred.

And yet you are still unable to list a _single_ functionality that iTunes
provides that Windows doesn't already have without it.

Jolly Roger wrote:

Bonjour is simply zero conf. Windows doesn't have it by default, and
iTunes works well with it, so Apple installs it with iTunes because it
improves the user experience. Apple's not trying to take over your
computer or anything of the sort. That's your bias showing.

Now nearly every one uses a router with dhcp enabled and running by
default. Why could they need zero-config? Been a long time since I have
seen someone try to connect to a printer on a LAN with just a hub via
link-local.

--
Take care,

Jonathan
-------------------
LITTLE WORKS STUDIO
http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com

In article , Jonathan N. Little
wrote:


Bonjour is simply zero conf. Windows doesn't have it by default, and
iTunes works well with it, so Apple installs it with iTunes because it
improves the user experience. Apple's not trying to take over your
computer or anything of the sort. That's your bias showing.

Now nearly every one uses a router with dhcp enabled and running by
default. Why could they need zero-config? Been a long time since I have
seen someone try to connect to a printer on a LAN with just a hub via
link-local.

dhcp and zeroconf are two very, very different things.