8.1 nightmare

I'm struggling, trying to get a machine ready to lend to my daughter. It
has to work reliably.

I've been having trouble with getting an oldish tablet convertible to do
what I want, so thought I'd keep that one for a bit and lend her my oldish
Acer that I used to test 8 when it first came out. It's an Aspire 5102 and
was working OK when I last used it a few months back, so I dug it out and
fired it up.

It immediately wanted to update Defender, and then repeatedly failed, so I
went to Windows update and saw the 70-something updates waiting and
allowed them to start.
The banner then appeared saying download and install 8.1, so I foolishly
thought why not.

8.1 repeatedly said unknown error - try again. I did a few times, then
stopped that and set about letting the 8 updates flow through.

Then tried the 8.1 update, which worked, but blew away both ethernet and
wifi access. So no network or internet. Wifi is an Atheros 5005G, which
doesn't appear to exist on the Atheros site. Found the old 8 driver and
tried to install that and wifi appeared, but did nothing. Found a Czech
site with an 8.1 driver. Installed that, and the wifi disappeared, with
Device manager saying it couldn't be installed because the registry had
related parts that could not be deleted (!).

I'm thinking of trying an install of the 8.1 trial version to see if I can
get that to work, then going back and starting again with my paid for 8 +
media update that was working before.

Any better ideas?

And yes, I'm running Mint on other machines.

On 03/19/2014 02:14 PM, Bill wrote:
I'm struggling, trying to get a machine ready to lend to my daughter. It
has to work reliably.

I've been having trouble with getting an oldish tablet convertible to do
what I want, so thought I'd keep that one for a bit and lend her my oldish
Acer that I used to test 8 when it first came out. It's an Aspire 5102 and
was working OK when I last used it a few months back, so I dug it out and
fired it up.

It immediately wanted to update Defender, and then repeatedly failed, so I
went to Windows update and saw the 70-something updates waiting and
allowed them to start.
The banner then appeared saying download and install 8.1, so I foolishly
thought why not.

8.1 repeatedly said unknown error - try again. I did a few times, then
stopped that and set about letting the 8 updates flow through.

Then tried the 8.1 update, which worked, but blew away both ethernet and
wifi access. So no network or internet. Wifi is an Atheros 5005G, which
doesn't appear to exist on the Atheros site. Found the old 8 driver and
tried to install that and wifi appeared, but did nothing. Found a Czech
site with an 8.1 driver. Installed that, and the wifi disappeared, with
Device manager saying it couldn't be installed because the registry had
related parts that could not be deleted (!).

I'm thinking of trying an install of the 8.1 trial version to see if I can
get that to work, then going back and starting again with my paid for 8 +
media update that was working before.

Any better ideas?

And yes, I'm running Mint on other machines.





Try a system restore

In message , philo*
writes
Try a system restore

System Restore is now greyed out, and the "Protection" seems to have
been set to "OFF" on both partitions during the upgrade.

The machine was originally "XP Media Center Edition", so the restore
partition is for that. It came with an upgrade to Vista.
I could restore to either of these horrors or do a fresh install of 8,
but I don't want it to be in the hands of the daughter (who has a
responsible job) and have her continually ignoring the nagging to update
to 8.1.

Her primary use is to work with remote access to her company, so it has
to be Win7 or possibly 8. I was going to try this rather than pay for 7,
which would be stupid on an elderly machine like this.

I could lend her a Thinkpad, but I'm not sure how she would get on with
just having nipples.

--
Bill

philo wrote:
On 03/19/2014 02:14 PM, Bill wrote:
I'm struggling, trying to get a machine ready to lend to my daughter. It
has to work reliably.

I've been having trouble with getting an oldish tablet convertible to do
what I want, so thought I'd keep that one for a bit and lend her my
oldish
Acer that I used to test 8 when it first came out. It's an Aspire 5102
and
was working OK when I last used it a few months back, so I dug it out and
fired it up.

It immediately wanted to update Defender, and then repeatedly failed,
so I
went to Windows update and saw the 70-something updates waiting and
allowed them to start.
The banner then appeared saying download and install 8.1, so I foolishly
thought why not.

8.1 repeatedly said unknown error - try again. I did a few times, then
stopped that and set about letting the 8 updates flow through.

Then tried the 8.1 update, which worked, but blew away both ethernet and
wifi access. So no network or internet. Wifi is an Atheros 5005G, which
doesn't appear to exist on the Atheros site. Found the old 8 driver and
tried to install that and wifi appeared, but did nothing. Found a Czech
site with an 8.1 driver. Installed that, and the wifi disappeared, with
Device manager saying it couldn't be installed because the registry had
related parts that could not be deleted (!).

I'm thinking of trying an install of the 8.1 trial version to see if I
can
get that to work, then going back and starting again with my paid for 8 +
media update that was working before.

Any better ideas?

And yes, I'm running Mint on other machines.


Try a system restore

Yes, if you didn't make a full backup, before attempting
8.1, the System Restore is the next best thing. Look for a
restore point that predates the visit to Windows Update.

Windows 8 also has things like "Refresh" and "Reset"
options, but they're not really all that convenient.
For one thing, lots of research to do first, to understand
what they do.

http://www.verboon.info/2012/01/the-...ur-pc-feature/

http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/archive/2...t-your-pc.aspx

http://www.eightforums.com/tutorials...ndows-8-a.html

http://www.eightforums.com/tutorials...tion-disk.html

*******

For complicated procedures, I've made as many as four backups
along the way, as checkpoints (on the same day). You can never
have too many backups.

Paul

On 03/19/2014 02:56 PM, Bill wrote:
In message , philo writes
Try a system restore

System Restore is now greyed out, and the "Protection" seems to have
been set to "OFF" on both partitions during the upgrade.

The machine was originally "XP Media Center Edition", so the restore
partition is for that. It came with an upgrade to Vista.
I could restore to either of these horrors or do a fresh install of 8,
but I don't want it to be in the hands of the daughter (who has a
responsible job) and have her continually ignoring the nagging to update
to 8.1.

Her primary use is to work with remote access to her company, so it has
to be Win7 or possibly 8. I was going to try this rather than pay for 7,
which would be stupid on an elderly machine like this.

I could lend her a Thinkpad, but I'm not sure how she would get on with
just having nipples.



I'd just perform a fresh install of Win8 and once you conform that it
works...turn off Windows updates and tell her to leave that portion alone.

Then, if you want to have the Win7 GUI just install the free, Classic
Shell utility

On Wed, 19 Mar 2014 15:56:23 -0400, Paul wrote:

philo wrote:
On 03/19/2014 02:14 PM, Bill wrote:
I'm struggling, trying to get a machine ready to lend to my daughter.
It has to work reliably.

I've been having trouble with getting an oldish tablet convertible to
do what I want, so thought I'd keep that one for a bit and lend her my
oldish Acer that I used to test 8 when it first came out. It's an
Aspire 5102 and was working OK when I last used it a few months back,
so I dug it out and fired it up.

It immediately wanted to update Defender, and then repeatedly failed,
so I went to Windows update and saw the 70-something updates waiting
and allowed them to start.
The banner then appeared saying download and install 8.1, so I
foolishly thought why not.

8.1 repeatedly said unknown error - try again. I did a few times, then
stopped that and set about letting the 8 updates flow through.

Then tried the 8.1 update, which worked, but blew away both ethernet
and wifi access. So no network or internet. Wifi is an Atheros 5005G,
which doesn't appear to exist on the Atheros site. Found the old 8
driver and tried to install that and wifi appeared, but did nothing.
Found a Czech site with an 8.1 driver. Installed that, and the wifi
disappeared, with Device manager saying it couldn't be installed
because the registry had related parts that could not be deleted (!).

I'm thinking of trying an install of the 8.1 trial version to see if I
can get that to work, then going back and starting again with my paid
for 8 +
media update that was working before.

Any better ideas?

And yes, I'm running Mint on other machines.


Try a system restore

Yes, if you didn't make a full backup, before attempting 8.1, the System
Restore is the next best thing. Look for a restore point that predates
the visit to Windows Update.

Windows 8 also has things like "Refresh" and "Reset"
options, but they're not really all that convenient.
For one thing, lots of research to do first, to understand what they do.

http://www.verboon.info/2012/01/the-...ur-pc-feature/

http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/archive/2...nd-reset-your-
pc.aspx

http://www.eightforums.com/tutorials...ndows-8-a.html

http://www.eightforums.com/tutorials...set-windows-8-
without-installation-disk.html

*******

For complicated procedures, I've made as many as four backups along the
way, as checkpoints (on the same day). You can never have too many
backups.

Paul

Thanks, Paul. I've skim read those sites, but it seems to me that at the
stage I'm at, I might as well go straight for a fresh install.

I've tried refresh. It says files are missing, so it wants recovery media,
which is, of course 8 not 8.1.

My thinking behind installing the 8.1 trial was that I could see if that
OS will ever work on that machine without the ridiculous install 8, then
install 8.1 from the app store nonsense.

I have backups of anything important on the machine and it was only ever
used to play with Win8.

On 3/19/2014 4:29 PM, Bill wrote:
On Wed, 19 Mar 2014 15:56:23 -0400, Paul wrote:

philo wrote:
On 03/19/2014 02:14 PM, Bill wrote:
I'm struggling, trying to get a machine ready to lend to my daughter.
It has to work reliably.

I've been having trouble with getting an oldish tablet convertible to
do what I want, so thought I'd keep that one for a bit and lend her my
oldish Acer that I used to test 8 when it first came out. It's an
Aspire 5102 and was working OK when I last used it a few months back,
so I dug it out and fired it up.

It immediately wanted to update Defender, and then repeatedly failed,
so I went to Windows update and saw the 70-something updates waiting
and allowed them to start.
The banner then appeared saying download and install 8.1, so I
foolishly thought why not.

8.1 repeatedly said unknown error - try again. I did a few times, then
stopped that and set about letting the 8 updates flow through.

Then tried the 8.1 update, which worked, but blew away both ethernet
and wifi access. So no network or internet. Wifi is an Atheros 5005G,
which doesn't appear to exist on the Atheros site. Found the old 8
driver and tried to install that and wifi appeared, but did nothing.
Found a Czech site with an 8.1 driver. Installed that, and the wifi
disappeared, with Device manager saying it couldn't be installed
because the registry had related parts that could not be deleted (!).

I'm thinking of trying an install of the 8.1 trial version to see if I
can get that to work, then going back and starting again with my paid
for 8 +
media update that was working before.

Any better ideas?

And yes, I'm running Mint on other machines.


Try a system restore

Yes, if you didn't make a full backup, before attempting 8.1, the System
Restore is the next best thing. Look for a restore point that predates
the visit to Windows Update.

Windows 8 also has things like "Refresh" and "Reset"
options, but they're not really all that convenient.
For one thing, lots of research to do first, to understand what they do.

http://www.verboon.info/2012/01/the-...ur-pc-feature/

http://blogs.msdn.com/b/b8/archive/2...nd-reset-your-
pc.aspx

http://www.eightforums.com/tutorials...ndows-8-a.html

http://www.eightforums.com/tutorials...set-windows-8-
without-installation-disk.html

*******

For complicated procedures, I've made as many as four backups along the
way, as checkpoints (on the same day). You can never have too many
backups.

Paul

Thanks, Paul. I've skim read those sites, but it seems to me that at the
stage I'm at, I might as well go straight for a fresh install.

I've tried refresh. It says files are missing, so it wants recovery media,
which is, of course 8 not 8.1.

My thinking behind installing the 8.1 trial was that I could see if that
OS will ever work on that machine without the ridiculous install 8, then
install 8.1 from the app store nonsense.

I have backups of anything important on the machine and it was only ever
used to play with Win8.

Try to do a fresh install on to the system as it is right now. It is
possible if the install starts and completed every thing will be OK.

8.1 is a huge file and took me most of the day to get it completely
installed. If the internet burped, the install of 8.1 may pick up where
it left off.


ie your problem may be an incomplete 8.1 install

I had to do this to get 8.1 update to completely finish

On 19/03/2014 19:14, Bill wrote:

Any better ideas?




Franckly, I would buy her a new machine. She deserves better

On Wed, 19 Mar 2014 22:06:54 +0000, Good Guy wrote:

On 19/03/2014 19:14, Bill wrote:

Any better ideas?




Franckly, I would buy her a new machine. She deserves better

In fact, that was my thought, but I wasn't brave enough to say it :-)

--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)

Updates are for idiots. As long as the thing works there's no reason to
turn
schizophrenic and develop a lifelong complex over such a silly issue.

Bill wrote:

I'm struggling, trying to get a machine ready to lend to my daughter. It
has to work reliably.

I've been having trouble with getting an oldish tablet convertible to do
what I want, so thought I'd keep that one for a bit and lend her my oldish
Acer that I used to test 8 when it first came out. It's an Aspire 5102 and
was working OK when I last used it a few months back, so I dug it out and
fired it up.

It immediately wanted to update Defender, and then repeatedly failed, so I
went to Windows update and saw the 70-something updates waiting and
allowed them to start.
The banner then appeared saying download and install 8.1, so I foolishly
thought why not.

8.1 repeatedly said unknown error - try again. I did a few times, then
stopped that and set about letting the 8 updates flow through.

Then tried the 8.1 update, which worked, but blew away both ethernet and
wifi access. So no network or internet. Wifi is an Atheros 5005G, which
doesn't appear to exist on the Atheros site. Found the old 8 driver and
tried to install that and wifi appeared, but did nothing. Found a Czech
site with an 8.1 driver. Installed that, and the wifi disappeared, with
Device manager saying it couldn't be installed because the registry had
related parts that could not be deleted (!).

I'm thinking of trying an install of the 8.1 trial version to see if I can
get that to work, then going back and starting again with my paid for 8 +
media update that was working before.

Any better ideas?

And yes, I'm running Mint on other machines.

--
The Grandmaster of the CyberFROG

Come get your ticket to CyberFROG city

Nay, Art thou decideth playeth ye simpleton games. *Some* of us know proper
manners

Very few. Ya know ahh, ahhh I used to take calls from *rank* noobs but got
fired the first day on the job for potty mouth,

Bur-ring, i'll get this one: WHAT'S YOUR PROBLEM JERK!!? We're here to help
you dickweed, ok, ok give the power cord the jiggily piggily wiggily all the
while pushing the power button repeatedly now take everything out of your
computer except the power supply and *one* stick of ram. Subscriber asks will
that ****in' work? I guaranDAMtee it. Ok get the next sucker on the phone.

I'm not Sam Hong but we both hate Roxio. Sam Hong pulled Roxio's Dong!

There's the employer and the employee and the FROGGER and the FROGEE, which
one are you?

Hamster isn't a newsreader it's a mistake!

El-Gonzo Jackson FROGS both me and Chuckcar (I just got EL-FROG-OED!!)

All hail Chuckcar the CZAR!! Or in F-R-O-Gland Chuckcar laFROG laCZAR,
ChuckZar!!

I hate them both, With useless bogus bull**** you need at least *three*
fulltime jobs to afford either one of them

I'm a fulltime text *only* man on usenet now. The rest of the world downloads
the binary files not me i can't afford thousands of dollars a month

VBB = Volume based billing. How many bytes can we shove down your throat and
out your arse sir?

The only "fix" for the CellPig modem is a sledgehammer.

UBB = User based bullFROGGING

Colonel Debeers refuses to wrestle a black man
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3-o_dPhbGI)

Master Juba was a black man imitating a white man imitating a black man

Always do incremental backups of your data or you'll end up like the A To
Z(Zee)-Holes at DSL Reports. Justin says i made a boo-boo. Yeah boo-who.

Updates are for idiots. As long as the thing works there's no reason to turn
schizophrenic and develop a lifelong complex over such a silly issue.

You don't have to be "stink-bottomed" to post on this newsgroup

AIOE put can.internet.highspeed on the banlist to give other people a chance
to snag the "Furst Poast" of the day

Anyone who disagrees with me gets FROG tape over their yapper

Adrian "jackpot" Lewis is a mama's boy!

Jimmy Fricke is good for the game of poker

Using my technical prowess and computer abilities to answer questions beyond
the realm of understandability

Regards Tony... Making usenet better for everyone everyday

This sig file was compiled via my journeys through usenet

In message , Good Guy
writes
On 19/03/2014 19:14, Bill wrote:

Any better ideas?


Franckly, I would buy her a new machine. She deserves better

I take it you don't have a daughter, then.
--
Bill

On 3/19/2014 7:04 PM, Gene E. Bloch wrote:
On Wed, 19 Mar 2014 22:06:54 +0000, Good Guy wrote:

On 19/03/2014 19:14, Bill wrote:

Any better ideas?




Franckly, I would buy her a new machine. She deserves better

In fact, that was my thought, but I wasn't brave enough to say it :-)


I bought a Toshiba Satellite C-55 for just under $400. It has a 500 gb
harddrive, 4 gb of memory, and an Intel i3 64bit processor. It came
with Windows 8 installed, but today you can probably find one with 8.1.

In my opinion more that adequate for word processing, spreadsheets,
database application, web browsing and email. I also use it for my
photos, some photo manipulations, and budget management.

Since I do not do graphic intensive applications, I find it more that
satisfactory.

How much in time ($/hr) have you already spent on trying to get the old
machine operational. Besides it is more fun setting up an new machine
rather than trying to get an old one acceptable

I would recommend going with Windows 8.1 as you make the computer a
useable system by booting directly to the desktop and shutting off a
couple of other Windows 8's "Features"

In message , Keith Nuttle
writes
Try to do a fresh install on to the system as it is right now. It is
possible if the install starts and completed every thing will be OK.

8.1 is a huge file and took me most of the day to get it completely
installed. If the internet burped, the install of 8.1 may pick up
where it left off.


ie your problem may be an incomplete 8.1 install

I had to do this to get 8.1 update to completely finish

Well, that might be possible if I could get onto the internet with the
machine and then get into the app store, but wifi doesn't work and
ethernet doesn't work.

I'm not sure the App Store lets you have another go at installing 8.1
anyway.

It may well be that, because the installation of 8 wanted to update
Defender and also its updates while I was letting it start downloading
and installing 8.1, the download could have ended up in a mess.

It definitely said it had finished downloading and installing. I wonder
if it checks itself for validity or just hopes what has come down has
"all the right notes in the right order"?

I also wonder if the idiot who thought updates via an app store was
sensible is one of the MS employees who was cast aside recently. Hope
so.
--
Bill

On Wed, 19 Mar 2014 19:19:47 -0400, Keith Nuttle wrote:

On 3/19/2014 7:04 PM, Gene E. Bloch wrote:
On Wed, 19 Mar 2014 22:06:54 +0000, Good Guy wrote:

On 19/03/2014 19:14, Bill wrote:

Any better ideas?




Franckly, I would buy her a new machine. She deserves better

In fact, that was my thought, but I wasn't brave enough to say it :-)


I bought a Toshiba Satellite C-55 for just under $400. It has a 500 gb
harddrive, 4 gb of memory, and an Intel i3 64bit processor. It came
with Windows 8 installed, but today you can probably find one with 8.1.

In my opinion more that adequate for word processing, spreadsheets,
database application, web browsing and email. I also use it for my
photos, some photo manipulations, and budget management.

Since I do not do graphic intensive applications, I find it more that
satisfactory.

That's nice.

How much in time ($/hr) have you already spent on trying to get the old
machine operational. Besides it is more fun setting up an new machine
rather than trying to get an old one acceptable

None. I am not the one doing the task in question.

I don't understand the unit $/hr. That is usually a value for hourly
wages.

I would recommend going with Windows 8.1 as you make the computer a
useable system by booting directly to the desktop and shutting off a
couple of other Windows 8's "Features"

The computer I have W8 on works OK with W8's features intact.

--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)

On Wed, 19 Mar 2014 16:04:16 -0700, Gene E. Bloch wrote:

On Wed, 19 Mar 2014 22:06:54 +0000, Good Guy wrote:

On 19/03/2014 19:14, Bill wrote:

Any better ideas?




Franckly, I would buy her a new machine. She deserves better

In fact, that was my thought, but I wasn't brave enough to say it :-)

I just read Bill's reply to your post. I see that I was right to be
cautious...

--
Gene E. Bloch (Stumbling Bloch)