Backing up multple generations

Most backup software keeps only one generation of backup. But for
reasons explained ealier, for some folders, I'd like to keep more than
one generat4ion. Today's backup, yesterday's, the day before's. Any
recommendations?

On Thu, 25 Jun 2020 09:11:07 -0400, micky wrote:

Most backup software keeps only one generation of backup. But for
reasons explained ealier, for some folders, I'd like to keep more than
one generat4ion. Today's backup, yesterday's, the day before's. Any
recommendations?

Imaging backup software such as Macrium or Clonezilla make unique
backups, a single file for Macrium, a directory for Clonezilla. For
windows use Macrium.
If file backup software doesn't offer an option, just rename directory in
which backup is stored.

On 6/25/2020 9:34 AM, dave61430 wrote:
On Thu, 25 Jun 2020 09:11:07 -0400, micky wrote:

Most backup software keeps only one generation of backup. But for
reasons explained ealier, for some folders, I'd like to keep more than
one generat4ion. Today's backup, yesterday's, the day before's. Any
recommendations?

Imaging backup software such as Macrium or Clonezilla make unique
backups, a single file for Macrium, a directory for Clonezilla. For
windows use Macrium.
If file backup software doesn't offer an option, just rename directory in
which backup is stored.

The native Windows 10 File History does that. You can set the number
of backup that you want to keep. You do a complete restore, or select
the back up of the individual file you are interested in.

micky wrote:
Most backup software keeps only one generation of backup. But for
reasons explained ealier, for some folders, I'd like to keep more than
one generat4ion. Today's backup, yesterday's, the day before's. Any
recommendations?


https://web.archive.org/web/20130124...?TOPIC_ID=4988

"{IMAGEID}-xx-yy.mrimg

Both pairs of numbers have a very specific purpose.

'xx' is the increment number.

00 - Full image
01 - first incremental/differential
02 - Second incremental/differential
....

'yy' is the file number and is always sequential. 00, 01, 02, 03... .

Note: This will be different to the increment number if files have been split.
This can happen if files larger than 4GB are saved to a FAT32 file system,
you are saving an image to multiple DVDs or a 'Maximum' file size is
specified when creating the image."

It is possible for backup software to label each
days work in a unique way.

You can also set a policy to delete the oldest backup,
when the new backup cannot "find space". In the case
of incremental backups, they might choose to delete
a "backup set" for consistency.

Full backups, backup all the partitions in the set
in a complete and independent way. 5TB of data in partitions
takes 5TB of space, for each complete set. Thus, full
backups are best on "small" C: drives :-) You don't
want to be making Full backups of your Movies partition
daily. A lower frequency of backup is likely sufficient
for the Movies partition.

With Incremental, the first backup in a set is a Full.
We'll call this Sunday. On Monday, just the files
that have changed since Sunday are put in a .mrimg file.
On Tuesday, only the files that changed since Monday
are backed up. This is the most economical way of
tracking changes. But, it does require that to
restore the Friday backup, Sun-Mon-Tues-Wed-Thurs cannot
be corrupted, or the restore will fail. It's a kind
of domino effect for incrementals. You can define the
duration of incrementals, like make a backup set be
a week long, and mainly use the most space for the
Sunday (starter) backup. The other days of the week,
don't need very much space. Then, the most files needed
to do a restore, is seven files.

To solve the "reliability" problem, differentials require
only the Full at the beginning, plus the Differential
for the day of the week. To restore Wednesday, requires
the Full made on Sunday, plus the Differential on Wednesday,
a total of two files. The odds of either of those files
being toast, is less bad than doing, say, a really really
long string of incrementals. Obviously, the difference
computed on Wednesday when the Differential backup was made,
takes more space, and is less efficient than the
Incremental scheme.

The Incremental scheme is in the paid version of Macrium.
Other products that offer a Free version, do this too,
put the Incremental flavor in the paid software version.

*******

Sync software, like "robocopying the folder", only keep
the one version, and keep it up to date. Like say, running
the Robocopy /MIR option to achieve a Sync solution.

So sync by itself, is not the function you're looking for.

However, if the word "sync" is not involved...

robocopy C:\src\ D:\dest-06252020
robocopy C:\src\ D:\dest-06262020
robocopy C:\src\ D:\dest-06272020

you can certainly make dailies of just a folder, manually.
All what you need there, is a little scripting to print
a date like in the example :-)

*******

Windows also has various File History options, and while
these options are "cute", it requires a lot of trust
on the part of the user. The idea in the previous section
appeals to many people because it is visceral and obvious.
And when you need to do space management, it's immediately
obvious what to delete. Because the items are dated and
are complete sets.

File History operates continuously, and tries to save
*every* generated file. If you save your "dear diary"
file 20 times a day, then expect File History to have
a ****load of versions.

I certainly recommend experimenting with File History,
just so you can see what it's like. One neat feature
is, if you delete a file, then you might think "****,
I have no history now". However, if you navigate above
the folder, and "ask for the old version of that folder",
the deleted file, a previous version of course, will
be in the folder, and you've still only lost a days
work or so. But having to "think of clever ways to
get your **** back", is not something users appreciate
having to do. Nobody wants to have to do calculus,
to keep their bank book balanced.

File History dumps to an external drive. It does not
throw a hissy fit, if the external is not connected.
It maintains a cache, and when the cache is full enough,
a notification will appear asking you to connect the
external so the cache can be transferred to the external.
It's still a nuisance, but not a "constant" nuisance.
Of course, you have to label the drive which is your
file history drive, if you are forgetful like me
about which drive it was set up for.

*******

And some software, like Windows 7 backup, you won't know
how versioning works, until you test it :-) I can't keep
track of every burp and fart of these things, which ones
keep only one copy, versus which ones keep a dated folder.
I seem to remember that one hard drive can be used to back
up more than one computer - the folder labels are specific
enough to allow sharing one drive with N computers.

Paul

knuttle wrote:
On 6/25/2020 9:34 AM, dave61430 wrote:
On Thu, 25 Jun 2020 09:11:07 -0400, micky wrote:

Most backup software keeps only one generation of backup. But for
reasons explained ealier, for some folders, I'd like to keep more than
one generat4ion. Today's backup, yesterday's, the day before's. Any
recommendations?

Imaging backup software such as Macrium or Clonezilla make unique
backups, a single file for Macrium, a directory for Clonezilla. For
windows use Macrium.
If file backup software doesn't offer an option, just rename directory in
which backup is stored.

The native Windows 10 File History does that. You can set the number
of backup that you want to keep. You do a complete restore, or select
the back up of the individual file you are interested in.

I was going to mention File History, but it doesn't keep "Today's
backup, yesterday's, the day before's." as micky mentioned, but just
multiple versions of your files, so you cannot - or at least not easily
- restore 'yesterday's' backup.

Also, File History only backs up the 'Libraries' (i.e. Documents,
Music, Pictures and Videos) on your system, not the rest. So if you put
stuff in 'non-standard' places, File History won't back them up.

The software I use - Cobian Backup - can do daily backups, but it is
not for the faint of heart, so I don't think micky will be helped by it.
(FWIW, I *also* use File History.)

On 6/25/2020 11:53 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
knuttle wrote:
On 6/25/2020 9:34 AM, dave61430 wrote:
On Thu, 25 Jun 2020 09:11:07 -0400, micky wrote:

Most backup software keeps only one generation of backup. But for
reasons explained ealier, for some folders, I'd like to keep more than
one generat4ion. Today's backup, yesterday's, the day before's. Any
recommendations?

Imaging backup software such as Macrium or Clonezilla make unique
backups, a single file for Macrium, a directory for Clonezilla. For
windows use Macrium.
If file backup software doesn't offer an option, just rename directory in
which backup is stored.

The native Windows 10 File History does that. You can set the number
of backup that you want to keep. You do a complete restore, or select
the back up of the individual file you are interested in.

I was going to mention File History, but it doesn't keep "Today's
backup, yesterday's, the day before's." as micky mentioned, but just
multiple versions of your files, so you cannot - or at least not easily
- restore 'yesterday's' backup.

Also, File History only backs up the 'Libraries' (i.e. Documents,
Music, Pictures and Videos) on your system, not the rest. So if you put
stuff in 'non-standard' places, File History won't back them up.

The software I use - Cobian Backup - can do daily backups, but it is
not for the faint of heart, so I don't think micky will be helped by it.
(FWIW, I *also* use File History.)

I have the files I want backed up and they are not just the ones that
that MS thinks is needed. I do not use and do not back up the MS files
Music, Video, etc. In some folders I only back up some of the sub folders.

Also when you need to restore a file, each copy of the file has its
original name plus the date that it was backed up. So if you sort the
Name column all of your backups will be grouped together so you can look
at the date part of he backup file name and select the backup you want.
You do not need to restore the file in the traditional sense, but can
copy the backup file backup to the original directory.

On 2020-06-25 11:27 a.m., knuttle wrote:
On 6/25/2020 11:53 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
knuttle wrote:
On 6/25/2020 9:34 AM, dave61430 wrote:
On Thu, 25 Jun 2020 09:11:07 -0400, micky wrote:

Most backup software keeps only one generation of backup.Â*Â* But for
reasons explained ealier, for some folders, I'd like to keep more than
one generat4ion.Â* Today's backup, yesterday's, the day before's.Â* Any
recommendations?

Imaging backup software such as Macrium or Clonezilla make unique
backups, a single file for Macrium, a directory for Clonezilla. For
windows use Macrium.
If file backup software doesn't offer an option, just rename
directory in
which backup is stored.

The native Windows 10 File History does that.Â*Â* You can set the number
of backup that you want to keep.Â* You do a complete restore, or select
the back up of the individual fileÂ* you are interested in.

Â*Â* I was going to mention File History, but it doesn't keep "Today's
backup, yesterday's, the day before's." as micky mentioned, but just
multiple versions of your files, so you cannot - or at least not easily
- restore 'yesterday's' backup.
Â*Â* Also, File History only backs up the 'Libraries' (i.e. Documents,
Music, Pictures and Videos) on your system, not the rest. So if you put
stuff in 'non-standard' places, File History won't back them up.

Â*Â* The software I use - Cobian Backup - can do daily backups, but it is
not for the faint of heart, so I don't think micky will be helped by it.
(FWIW, I *also* use File History.)

I have the files I want backed up and they are not just the ones that
that MS thinks is needed.Â* I do not use and do not back up the MS files
Music, Video, etc.Â* In some folders I only back up some of the sub folders.

Also when you need to restore a file, each copy of the file has its
original name plus the date that it was backed up.Â* So if you sort the
Name column all of your backups will be grouped together so you can look
at the date part of he backup file name and select the backup you want.
You do not need to restore the file in the traditional sense, but can
copy the backup file backup to the original directory.

Macrium Reflect will let you keep up to a maximum of 999 full ,
differential or incremental backups. (not that you would), you would
need many huge HDs for that/

Rene

micky wrote:

Most backup software keeps only one generation of backup. But for
reasons explained ealier, for some folders, I'd like to keep more than
one generat4ion. Today's backup, yesterday's, the day before's. Any
recommendations?

I've not heard of backup software that wipes a prior backup when a new
backup job is ran. Just what backup software are YOU using?

Rene Lamontagne wrote:
On 2020-06-25 11:27 a.m., knuttle wrote:
On 6/25/2020 11:53 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
[...]
I was going to mention File History, but it doesn't keep "Today's
backup, yesterday's, the day before's." as micky mentioned, but just
multiple versions of your files, so you cannot - or at least not easily
- restore 'yesterday's' backup.

Also, File History only backs up the 'Libraries' (i.e. Documents,
Music, Pictures and Videos) on your system, not the rest. So if you put
stuff in 'non-standard' places, File History won't back them up.

The software I use - Cobian Backup - can do daily backups, but it is
not for the faint of heart, so I don't think micky will be helped by it.
(FWIW, I *also* use File History.)

I have the files I want backed up and they are not just the ones that
that MS thinks is needed.* I do not use and do not back up the MS files
Music, Video, etc. In some folders I only back up some of the sub folders.

Also when you need to restore a file, each copy of the file has its
original name plus the date that it was backed up.* So if you sort the
Name column all of your backups will be grouped together so you can look
at the date part of he backup file name and select the backup you want.
You do not need to restore the file in the traditional sense, but can
copy the backup file backup to the original directory.

Macrium Reflect will let you keep up to a maximum of 999 full ,
differential or incremental backups. (not that you would), you would
need many huge HDs for that/

Image backup - i.e. Macrium Reflect - will use much more storage than
file-level backup, because it doesn't only backup the changed files, but
also the rest of the sectors around those files and - if the disk has
been defragmented - will backup moved sectors, even if the files in them
haven't changed.

That's why I use less frequent image backup - for disaster recovery -
plus frequent file backups.

But if you have the diskspace and don't mind the extra time the backup
takes, then just using image backup is fine as well.

On Thu, 25 Jun 2020 12:27:56 -0400, knuttle
wrote:

I have the files I want backed up and they are not just the ones that
that MS thinks is needed. I do not use and do not back up the MS files
Music, Video, etc. In some folders I only back up some of the sub folders.

Also when you need to restore a file, each copy of the file has its
original name plus the date that it was backed up. So if you sort the
Name column all of your backups will be grouped together so you can look
at the date part of he backup file name and select the backup you want.
You do not need to restore the file in the traditional sense, but can
copy the backup file backup to the original directory.

Which file backup solution are you using? You probably mentioned it but I
missed it.

On 6/25/2020 2:08 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Thu, 25 Jun 2020 12:27:56 -0400, knuttle
wrote:

I have the files I want backed up and they are not just the ones that
that MS thinks is needed. I do not use and do not back up the MS files
Music, Video, etc. In some folders I only back up some of the sub folders.

Also when you need to restore a file, each copy of the file has its
original name plus the date that it was backed up. So if you sort the
Name column all of your backups will be grouped together so you can look
at the date part of he backup file name and select the backup you want.
You do not need to restore the file in the traditional sense, but can
copy the backup file backup to the original directory.

Which file backup solution are you using? You probably mentioned it but I
missed it.

I am sorry, I realized the I did not clarify what back up software I am
used. I am using MS File History and since I did not specify what
software I was using I have also paraphrased my original post.

It has been sometime since I set up the backup routine, and I believe I
had to create an object in the Library folder, (or used and existing
library folder that I edited)


As I said I have selected only those folders that I want backed up and
removes any subfolders that I don't want backed up.

The name of all backup files is the original name plus a date and time
with the original extension. It is a simple task to sort the files and
select find the file you are looking for and select the date of the
backup you want to use. You can either restore, of copy the back up
file to the original directory.

File Format:

Original file name: Finances.qpw

Backup file name: Finances (2020_03_12 14_11_09 UTC).qpw

On Thu, 25 Jun 2020 16:47:03 -0400, knuttle
wrote:

On 6/25/2020 2:08 PM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Thu, 25 Jun 2020 12:27:56 -0400, knuttle
wrote:

I have the files I want backed up and they are not just the ones that
that MS thinks is needed. I do not use and do not back up the MS files
Music, Video, etc. In some folders I only back up some of the sub folders.

Also when you need to restore a file, each copy of the file has its
original name plus the date that it was backed up. So if you sort the
Name column all of your backups will be grouped together so you can look
at the date part of he backup file name and select the backup you want.
You do not need to restore the file in the traditional sense, but can
copy the backup file backup to the original directory.

Which file backup solution are you using? You probably mentioned it but I
missed it.

I am sorry, I realized the I did not clarify what back up software I am
used. I am using MS File History and since I did not specify what
software I was using I have also paraphrased my original post.

It has been sometime since I set up the backup routine, and I believe I
had to create an object in the Library folder, (or used and existing
library folder that I edited)


As I said I have selected only those folders that I want backed up and
removes any subfolders that I don't want backed up.

The name of all backup files is the original name plus a date and time
with the original extension. It is a simple task to sort the files and
select find the file you are looking for and select the date of the
backup you want to use. You can either restore, of copy the back up
file to the original directory.

File Format:

Original file name: Finances.qpw

Backup file name: Finances (2020_03_12 14_11_09 UTC).qpw

Cool, thanks for the quick update.

On 2020-06-25 17:18:29 +0000, Frank Slootweg said:

Rene Lamontagne wrote:
On 2020-06-25 11:27 a.m., knuttle wrote:
On 6/25/2020 11:53 AM, Frank Slootweg wrote:
[...]
I was going to mention File History, but it doesn't keep "Today's
backup, yesterday's, the day before's." as micky mentioned, but just
multiple versions of your files, so you cannot - or at least not easily
- restore 'yesterday's' backup.

Also, File History only backs up the 'Libraries' (i.e. Documents,
Music, Pictures and Videos) on your system, not the rest. So if you put
stuff in 'non-standard' places, File History won't back them up.

The software I use - Cobian Backup - can do daily backups, but it is
not for the faint of heart, so I don't think micky will be helped by it.
(FWIW, I *also* use File History.)

I have the files I want backed up and they are not just the ones that
that MS thinks is needed.* I do not use and do not back up the MS files
Music, Video, etc. In some folders I only back up some of the sub folders.

Also when you need to restore a file, each copy of the file has its
original name plus the date that it was backed up.* So if you sort the
Name column all of your backups will be grouped together so you can look
at the date part of he backup file name and select the backup you want.
You do not need to restore the file in the traditional sense, but can
copy the backup file backup to the original directory.

Macrium Reflect will let you keep up to a maximum of 999 full ,
differential or incremental backups. (not that you would), you would
need many huge HDs for that/

Image backup - i.e. Macrium Reflect - will use much more storage than
file-level backup, because it doesn't only backup the changed files, but
also the rest of the sectors around those files and - if the disk has
been defragmented - will backup moved sectors, even if the files in them
haven't changed.

Macrium is much more than a full image backup tool. It does partial,
incremental and full grandfathering of backups.

It also does file/folder level backups.

It's probably the ideal tool for the OP.

On Thu, 25 Jun 2020 13:08:58 -0500, Char Jackson wrote:

On Thu, 25 Jun 2020 12:27:56 -0400, knuttle
wrote:

I have the files I want backed up and they are not just the ones that
that MS thinks is needed. I do not use and do not back up the MS files
Music, Video, etc. In some folders I only back up some of the sub folders.

Also when you need to restore a file, each copy of the file has its
original name plus the date that it was backed up. So if you sort the
Name column all of your backups will be grouped together so you can look
at the date part of he backup file name and select the backup you want.
You do not need to restore the file in the traditional sense, but can
copy the backup file backup to the original directory.

Which file backup solution are you using? You probably mentioned it but I
missed it.

Windows much-improved file backup system:
Settings - Update & Security - Backup - More Options - (detailed
folder/file choices)
- highly useful when I unaccountably lost all my VirtualBox image
files recently!

In article , says...

Most backup software keeps only one generation of backup. But for
reasons explained ealier, for some folders, I'd like to keep more than
one generat4ion. Today's backup, yesterday's, the day before's. Any
recommendations?

The backup utility which came with XP (Professional) did all of this, and worked really well.
Ntbackup.exe. I still have it scripted to run daily "differential", weekly "incremental" and
monthly "baseline" backups on a customer's site which uses an XP machine as an (offline) file-
server. I wonder if the executable would work on Windows 10? The Windows-7 backup is still
available on 10.

Of course, File History works so well, that people actually use it! Make sure you have some
storage space accessible, then set and forget - until you need a file back. And the file is
just there when you need it!! Backs up anything you've bothered to include in a Library, plus
the standard places.

--

Phil, London