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telephone hackers - can we upload something?



 
 
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  #46  
Old July 22nd 18, 06:01 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Brian Gregory[_2_]
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Posts: 166
Default telephone hackers - can we upload something?

On 20/07/2018 23:28, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
(This applies here in UK - probably there as well.) If only one party
hangs up, the connection remains open - for a time. I presume it's to


If the caller hangs up the call disconnects immediately.
But if the called person hangs up there is a timeout before the call
disconnects.


prevent _accidental_ termination of a call due to noise on the line, or
similar. (It _can_ even be useful - lets you hang up one 'phone and pick
up another, say if one handset's battery runs out, or you want to go to
another one next to your desk or something.) It _does_ time out
eventually, but after quite a lot of seconds. Banging on the rest
_sometimes_ clears it.


If you "bang on the rest" you're probably sending a recall which opens
another outgoing line ready to start building a three way call, or ready
to switch between the two calls.


Unfortunately, it's well known to be misused by evil folk: they'll ring
up pretending to be your bank or whatever, then suggest you hang up and
call the bank using a number _you_ choose. Unfortunately, they keep the
line open - even playing you a recording of the dial tone when you hang
up and pick up again, so you _think_ you're genuinely dialling.

Because of this, I think there are moves in place to force the
telecomm.s companies to prevent it, mainly I think by shortening the
timeout-on-one-party-hangup. In the meantime, the advice is - should you
receive such a call apparently from your bank, though this is unlikely -
that tells you to call them back, to first call some unrelated number,
such as a relative.



--

Brian Gregory (in England).
Ads
  #47  
Old July 22nd 18, 06:03 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Nil[_5_]
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Posts: 1,731
Default telephone hackers - can we upload something?

On 22 Jul 2018, "Mayayana" wrote in
alt.windows7.general:

I also suspect that such a service would only make
a small dent in the problem.


I keep a log of all junk phone calls, and I get a lot of them. I'd say
that Nomorobo catches about 85% of them. It used to do better but the
robocallers have gotten better at exploiting weaknesses in the system.

85% is still a big relief.
  #48  
Old July 22nd 18, 06:04 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Brian Gregory[_2_]
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Posts: 166
Default telephone hackers - can we upload something?

On 22/07/2018 17:18, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
In message , Brian
Gregory writes:
On 20/07/2018 14:22, Mayayana wrote:

[]
and will gladly keep you on the line for hours if there's
a chance of getting you hacked. In the meantime, it's
not really their time you're wasting. It's yours.


That's the rub. _If_ you have time to waste, yes, plenty of things you
can do to wind them up, but I CBA any more.
[]
IME they're mostly not trying to hack you. They're trying to convince
you that your PC is dying/seriously infected and that you need to pay
them money for them to fix it and look after it in the future.

It may differ from place to place and country to country. Certainly, I'm
pretty sure all the ones that have called me in the last year or several
have been criminals: the fact that my usual response of "hang on while I
get the police on the other line" makes them hang up ... plus, they
usually start with "your computer is malfunctioning" or something similar.


I never said they're not criminals. They are.

--

Brian Gregory (in England).
  #49  
Old July 22nd 18, 06:11 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Nil[_5_]
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Posts: 1,731
Default telephone hackers - can we upload something?

On 20 Jul 2018, Ed Cryer wrote in
alt.windows7.general:

I've used a technique with spam callers who start with something
like "Hello. And how are you today?"
It consists of completely monopolising the conversation. They're
paying for it; you can have a captive audience.

Oh, I'm feeling very down today. My dad died and left me all his
debts. And then my computer blew up, and shattered the house,
bringing down the partition wall with next door. And then an alien
flew in through the window, abducted me to a mother-ship in the
sky and implanted God knows what in me. I'm finding that I've
acquired extraordinary powers; such as I can fly like a bird, and
my eyes give out a beam of light which can cut through solid
objects like a laser beam, and there's a big S carved on my front,
and ... Hello, are you still there?


I used to toy with junk telemarketers until I realized that I was
wasting my own time, not theirs. But when I did, one of the most
effective tacks was to grab a book and start reading random sentances
from it at them in a conversational tone. It had the effect of
responding to their spiel with nonsense answers that sounded like they
should make sense. It rarely failed to keep them going for a good, long
time until they finally hung up in consternation.
  #50  
Old July 22nd 18, 06:19 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Mayayana
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Posts: 6,438
Default telephone hackers - can we upload something?

"NY" wrote

| My grandma used to invite JWs into the house if they called at the door.
| She'd go along with them and make it sound as if she was really interested
| and a possible convert. She also had a goof chat to them. Eventually she
| would come clean that she had no interest in religion at all, and was just
| doing it as a service to her neighbours in keeping them off the street to
| prevent them bothering anyone else.
|
| She said she got a fair amount of the sort of language that you wouldn't
| expect JWs to use :-)
|

I'll sometimes talk to them. They're sincere.
They mean well. Similarly with the Mormons. They
truly hope to save others. It might be naive, but
there's generosity there, twisted though it may be.


  #51  
Old July 22nd 18, 07:02 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Ken Blake[_5_]
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Posts: 2,221
Default telephone hackers - can we upload something?

On Sun, 22 Jul 2018 13:03:54 -0400, Nil
wrote:

On 22 Jul 2018, "Mayayana" wrote in
alt.windows7.general:

I also suspect that such a service would only make
a small dent in the problem.


I keep a log of all junk phone calls, and I get a lot of them. I'd say
that Nomorobo catches about 85% of them. It used to do better but the
robocallers have gotten better at exploiting weaknesses in the system.

85% is still a big relief.




As far as I know NoMoRoBo only catches robo-dialers, so other kinds of
junk calls get through. I haven't counted, but I'd guess that your 85%
is about what I experience with it.
  #52  
Old July 22nd 18, 07:05 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Ken Blake[_5_]
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Posts: 2,221
Default telephone hackers - can we upload something?

On Sun, 22 Jul 2018 13:11:16 -0400, Nil
wrote:

On 20 Jul 2018, Ed Cryer wrote in
alt.windows7.general:

I've used a technique with spam callers who start with something
like "Hello. And how are you today?"
It consists of completely monopolising the conversation. They're
paying for it; you can have a captive audience.

Oh, I'm feeling very down today. My dad died and left me all his
debts. And then my computer blew up, and shattered the house,
bringing down the partition wall with next door. And then an alien
flew in through the window, abducted me to a mother-ship in the
sky and implanted God knows what in me. I'm finding that I've
acquired extraordinary powers; such as I can fly like a bird, and
my eyes give out a beam of light which can cut through solid
objects like a laser beam, and there's a big S carved on my front,
and ... Hello, are you still there?


I used to toy with junk telemarketers until I realized that I was
wasting my own time, not theirs.



That's exactly right. If I get a telemarketer (or almost anyone who
calls me "Mr Blake" or "Kenneth" rather than Ken), I immediately say
"goodbye" and hang up.
  #53  
Old July 22nd 18, 07:10 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
NY
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 586
Default telephone hackers - can we upload something?

"J. P. Gilliver (John)" wrote in message
...
It may differ from place to place and country to country. Certainly, I'm
pretty sure all the ones that have called me in the last year or several
have been criminals: the fact that my usual response of "hang on while I
get the police on the other line" makes them hang up ... plus, they
usually start with "your computer is malfunctioning" or something similar.


I get a fair number that don't sound like scams but are simply organisations
offering to insulate my loft or walls, or to install solar cells.

But my view is that *any* organisation that phones me when I haven't asked
them to is guilty of the offence of "Pestering Me", irrespective of whether
they are scams. Since I say "no" on principle, I'm unlikely to get caught up
in a scam, but I resent having to stop what I'm doing to answer the phone to
someone who is trying to sell me something. Religious groups who knock at
the door tend to get a polite but very forceful "Go away, and don't bother
me or any of my neighbours or anyone else" sort of response: I make it very
clear that it isn't just what they are "selling" which I object to but the
whole concept of going door-to-door.

  #54  
Old July 22nd 18, 07:13 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
David E. Ross[_2_]
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Posts: 1,035
Default telephone hackers - can we upload something?

On 7/20/2018 1:51 PM, David E. Ross wrote:
On 7/20/2018 3:26 AM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
I had one of these calls yesterday - "your computer has stopped
communicating with the Windows server", or something like that.

I used my usual: "hang on while I get the police on the other line";
that usually makes them hang up pretty smartish.

However, thinking about it afterwards, I wondered: would it be possible
to devise something that could do something to their systems, while
pretending to do whatever they ask? I've never gone beyond the initial
call - I have always seen through them so far, it's not been difficult!
- so I don't know what they ask you to _do_.

I suspect it isn't likely to be possible, but it would be _so_
satisfying ... (-:

If I am sitting at my PC when the phone rings, I sometimes have my PC's
Fax application answer. I told my daughter that, if she calls and hears
Fax synchronization tones, she should hang up; wait a full minute; and
then call again.


By the way, I get many non-robo telemarketer calls, mostly from
home-improvement contractors. Sometimes, instead of merely hanging up,
I ask for the name of the contractor. Then I ask for the contractor's
liceense number. I live in California, where the law requires
contractors to provide their license number when requested if they are
soliciting customers. Usually, the caller hangs up instead of giving me
the number; but I already have the contractor's name.

Now it can be interesting. I go online to http://www.cslb.ca.gov/ and
do a search for the contractor, either by name or by license number. If
the search shows that the license has expired or been revoked by the
state, I file a complaint with the Contractors State License Board.

If the license is current, I file a complaint with the FTC's "Do Not
Call" registry. I also file a complaint with the Contractors State
License Board if the telemarketer fails to provide the license number.

I know the FTC will not start an investigation from my complaint alone.
However, an accumulation of complaints can indeed result not only in an
investigation but also in a fine against the telemarketer.

--
David E. Ross
http://www.rossde.com/

Attorney-General Sessions claims the bible favors imprisoning illegal
aliens. However, God repeatedly commanded us to welcome the stranger in
our land. For example, see the following:
Exodus 22:20 at
http://bible.ort.org/books/pentd2.asp?ACTION=displaypage&BOOK=2&CHAPTER=22#P2 131
Exodus 23:9 at
http://bible.ort.org/books/pentd2.asp?ACTION=displaypage&BOOK=2&CHAPTER=23#P2 151
Deuteronomy 10:19 at
http://bible.ort.org/books/pentd2.asp?ACTION=displaypage&BOOK=5&CHAPTER=10#P5 200
  #55  
Old July 22nd 18, 10:03 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Nil[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,731
Default telephone hackers - can we upload something?

On 22 Jul 2018, Ken Blake wrote in
alt.windows7.general:

As far as I know NoMoRoBo only catches robo-dialers, so other
kinds of junk calls get through. I haven't counted, but I'd guess
that your 85% is about what I experience with it.


No, the other junk calls that Nomorobo misses are almost all also
robocalls. The trick that gets them past Nomorobo seems to be that they
use fake local numbers and change them very often. Nomorobo's database
is national so if the spammer's campaign is regional and short,
Nomorobo is more likely to miss it.
  #56  
Old July 22nd 18, 10:15 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Nil[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,731
Default telephone hackers - can we upload something?

On 22 Jul 2018, "NY" wrote in alt.windows7.general:

I get a fair number that don't sound like scams but are simply
organisations offering to insulate my loft or walls, or to install
solar cells.


I get a few of those, too. Usually they want to "sweep my chimney"
(even though I don't have one) or "clean my air ducts". These calls are
just as illegal in my state as any other scammer. If I question them
they invariably hang up. If I call back the caller ID number, it's
usually not in service.

As I recall, the only legal calls are from services you've done
business with before, and charities and political calls. Anybody else
is a criminal by definition.
  #57  
Old July 22nd 18, 10:18 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Zaidy036[_5_]
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Posts: 427
Default telephone hackers - can we upload something?

On 7/20/2018 6:26 AM, J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:
I had one of these calls yesterday - "your computer has stopped
communicating with the Windows server", or something like that.

I used my usual: "hang on while I get the police on the other line";
that usually makes them hang up pretty smartish.

However, thinking about it afterwards, I wondered: would it be possible
to devise something that could do something to their systems, while
pretending to do whatever they ask? I've never gone beyond the initial
call - I have always seen through them so far, it's not been difficult!
- so I don't know what they ask you to _do_.

I suspect it isn't likely to be possible, but it would be _so_
satisfying ... (-:


Yes, have the Federal law changed to require that the telcos not allow
the calling number to be changed and that it must record the actual source.

--
Zaidy036
  #58  
Old July 22nd 18, 10:31 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Ken Blake[_5_]
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Posts: 2,221
Default telephone hackers - can we upload something?

On Sun, 22 Jul 2018 17:15:08 -0400, Nil
wrote:

On 22 Jul 2018, "NY" wrote in alt.windows7.general:

I get a fair number that don't sound like scams but are simply
organisations offering to insulate my loft or walls, or to install
solar cells.


I get a few of those, too. Usually they want to "sweep my chimney"
(even though I don't have one) or "clean my air ducts". These calls are
just as illegal in my state as any other scammer. If I question them
they invariably hang up. If I call back the caller ID number, it's
usually not in service.

As I recall, the only legal calls are from services you've done
business with before, and charities and political calls. Anybody else
is a criminal by definition.




I don't care what's legal and what's not. I don't want *any* calls
soliciting me for *anything*. That includes services I've done
business with before and charities and political calls.

If I want to do business with them again, make a donation or vote for
their candidate, I'll contact them.

It may be an overreaction, but there's so much of this kind of stuff
going on these days that I almost don't want to have a telephone
anymore.
  #59  
Old July 22nd 18, 11:24 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Nil[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,731
Default telephone hackers - can we upload something?

On 22 Jul 2018, Ken Blake wrote in
alt.windows7.general:

I don't care what's legal and what's not. I don't want *any* calls
soliciting me for *anything*. That includes services I've done
business with before and charities and political calls.

If I want to do business with them again, make a donation or vote
for their candidate, I'll contact them.

It may be an overreaction, but there's so much of this kind of
stuff going on these days that I almost don't want to have a
telephone anymore.


Any of the legal callers are obligated to respect your request to put
you on their own Do Not Call list. That's about all you can do about
that. But in practice, I almost never get a "legal" commercial call. A
few political calls around election time. My town sometimes makes
emergency robo-calls. I used to get a very occasional call from a
charity I give to, but I asked them to stop and they did. Otherwise
nothing but junk calls. My solution for those is:

1) Rely on Nomorobo to block most of them;

2) Use my phone service's limited blocking feature to block the few
numbers that call repeatedly (I have a "3 strikes yer out" policy.) But
really, robocallers rarely re-use numbers. They know better.

3) don't bother to answer the phone unless it's a Caller ID I
recognize. If it's someone I know, they will leave a message.

It's all a nuisance, but I manage to tolerate it.
  #60  
Old July 23rd 18, 01:45 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
J. P. Gilliver (John)[_4_]
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Posts: 2,679
Default telephone hackers - can we upload something?

In message , Nil
writes:
[]
they invariably hang up. If I call back the caller ID number, it's
usually not in service.

[]
Oh, you get faked CLIs in the US too, do you?

Isn't faking CLI illegal?

If it is, aren't the telco.s participating in the crime? I don't think
they can claim "common carrier" immunity; sure, any that _relay_ it
maybe can, but the ones where the call _originates_ must know it isn't
coming from the line it pretends to be. (And if they're from abroad,
then it's the one that handles the call where it enters the country.)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

You can believe it if it helps you to sleep. - Quoted by Tom Lehrer (on
religion, in passing), April 2013.
 




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