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#92
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Microsoft MVPs
"All of we" does not appear on that page. In this case the pronoun is the
object of the preposition "of" and so the accusative pronoun is required. According to the advice on the page, which is not bad, «decide which case fits by narrowing the sentence down to the subject and the verb. If your pronoun is neither of these then use "us".» Object of a pronoun, therefore "us". The rules are so simple... Now which use of Ken's is "correct"? He says "all of we" and "any of us" as if both were permissible. According to my quick Live Search results, one person out of 1699 agrees with the first use. The inconsistency is the part that tells me not to take this guy seriously. Learn to read, and if you post a link as evidence of your position, read it first. -- Earle Horton -- "Tom [Pepper] Willett" wrote in message ... Ken's use of "we" is correct. You can begin your basic studying he http://www.one-step-forward.net/2007...versus-we.html "Earle Horton" wrote in message ... : "All of us". That should kill the OP's hope of contacting any intelligent : live via this avenue. Live Search has 29,900,000 results using normal : grammar, and 17,600 using what you have. Do people actually talk like that? : I wouldn't have said anything, but you used the correct form later. : : -- : Earle Horton -- : -- Defender of the English language. : : "Ken Blake" wrote in message : ... : "Vodkasoda" wrote in message : ... : : It's a valid and interesting question, and judging by the 40+ responses : it : has rattled a few cages ... perhaps now that their cages have been : rattled : and they are awake, perhaps some of the MVPs (real and fake) might like : to : try and answer why Windows Live Messenger is crashing in Vista ... and if : they don't know then to raise the issue with people who might know or be : able : to find out ... : : : Three points: : : 1. All of we MVPs are volunteers : : 2. All of we MVPs know some things very well, others slightly, and still : others not at all. I, for example, have no interest in Windows Live : Messenger, know nothing about it, and can't help you regarding any : problems you have with it. : : 3. Some MVPs may have the ability to discuss certain types of problems : with the appropriate Microsoft employees; others don't. In many cases, we : wouldn't even know who to raise an issue with. Regarding Windows : Messenger, not only do I not know anything about it, but I don't even know : the name of a Microsoft employee who does. Moreover, this is not an : established method of getting problems solved, and even if I knew the : right person at Microsoft and asked him, there is no guarantee that it : would lead to a solution. : : : perhaps that mught be a more valuable use of their time than : arguing and whining, after all, isn't that supposed to be what they are : here : for ?!?!? : : : No, not at all. We are volunteers who each have knowledge in certain areas : only. It's for that reason that each of answers some questions and ignore : others, about which we know nothing (or at least not enough) entirely. : : : They're of no VALUE to me if they don't help resolve this issues I raise : !!! : : : Then feel free to ignore or even killfile all of us. There is no : requirement that any of us be of any value to you. : : : : |
#93
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Microsoft MVPs
Earle
You are having another bad day. Did you read the OP's post . Ken's reply was appropriate and correct(All of we) and in proper English be it British,Australian ,American , Canadian and etc. Might not have been in South African English but it was correct for all others -- Peter Please Reply to Newsgroup for the benefit of others Requests for assistance by email can not and will not be acknowledged. "Earle Horton" wrote in message ... "All of we" does not appear on that page. In this case the pronoun is the object of the preposition "of" and so the accusative pronoun is required. According to the advice on the page, which is not bad, «decide which case fits by narrowing the sentence down to the subject and the verb. If your pronoun is neither of these then use "us".» Object of a pronoun, therefore "us". The rules are so simple... Now which use of Ken's is "correct"? He says "all of we" and "any of us" as if both were permissible. According to my quick Live Search results, one person out of 1699 agrees with the first use. The inconsistency is the part that tells me not to take this guy seriously. Learn to read, and if you post a link as evidence of your position, read it first. -- Earle Horton -- "Tom [Pepper] Willett" wrote in message ... Ken's use of "we" is correct. You can begin your basic studying he http://www.one-step-forward.net/2007...versus-we.html "Earle Horton" wrote in message ... : "All of us". That should kill the OP's hope of contacting any intelligent : live via this avenue. Live Search has 29,900,000 results using normal : grammar, and 17,600 using what you have. Do people actually talk like that? : I wouldn't have said anything, but you used the correct form later. : : -- : Earle Horton -- : -- Defender of the English language. : : "Ken Blake" wrote in message : ... : "Vodkasoda" wrote in message : ... : : It's a valid and interesting question, and judging by the 40+ responses : it : has rattled a few cages ... perhaps now that their cages have been : rattled : and they are awake, perhaps some of the MVPs (real and fake) might like : to : try and answer why Windows Live Messenger is crashing in Vista .... and if : they don't know then to raise the issue with people who might know or be : able : to find out ... : : : Three points: : : 1. All of we MVPs are volunteers : : 2. All of we MVPs know some things very well, others slightly, and still : others not at all. I, for example, have no interest in Windows Live : Messenger, know nothing about it, and can't help you regarding any : problems you have with it. : : 3. Some MVPs may have the ability to discuss certain types of problems : with the appropriate Microsoft employees; others don't. In many cases, we : wouldn't even know who to raise an issue with. Regarding Windows : Messenger, not only do I not know anything about it, but I don't even know : the name of a Microsoft employee who does. Moreover, this is not an : established method of getting problems solved, and even if I knew the : right person at Microsoft and asked him, there is no guarantee that it : would lead to a solution. : : : perhaps that mught be a more valuable use of their time than : arguing and whining, after all, isn't that supposed to be what they are : here : for ?!?!? : : : No, not at all. We are volunteers who each have knowledge in certain areas : only. It's for that reason that each of answers some questions and ignore : others, about which we know nothing (or at least not enough) entirely. : : : They're of no VALUE to me if they don't help resolve this issues I raise : !!! : : : Then feel free to ignore or even killfile all of us. There is no : requirement that any of us be of any value to you. : : : : |
#94
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Microsoft MVPs
Twaddle....
_All of us_ is correct English. -- DSH Lux et Veritas et Libertas Vires et Honor "Peter Foldes" wrote in message ... Earle You are having another bad day. Did you read the OP's post . Ken's reply was appropriate and correct(All of we) and in proper English be it British,Australian ,American , Canadian and etc. Might not have been in South African English but it was correct for all others -- Peter |
#95
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Microsoft MVPs
MVPs ... apologies, I didn't know you were all volunteers. I would have
expected that on some private forum or discussion group, but when I have a problem with a Microsoft product & I come to a Microsoft site for help and advice, I expected to be helped by a Microsoft "expert" ... it's not as if they can't afford to pay the wages !!! Messenger ... This has happened on Vista since the last release, it worked fine before that. I know that there is a known problem & it's something to do with Flash, so I just expected that the new, Beta release, would deal with that problem. Perhaps I am just too optimistic and naiive !!!!! "Mike Hall - MVP" wrote: We are volunteers here just like anybody else.. Re Messenger, what version are you using? Try the latest one.. You might also try asking in microsoft.public.msn.messenger Bear in mind that many users of Messenger do not have this problem, and that it may be down to plugins or addons which you may have installed.. -- Mike Hall - MVP How to construct a good post.. http://dts-l.com/goodpost.htm How to use the Microsoft Product Support Newsgroups.. http://support.microsoft.com/default...help&style=toc Mike's Window - My Blog.. http://msmvps.com/blogs/mikehall/default.aspx |
#96
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Microsoft MVPs
Ken,
1. As just replied to Mike Hall, I didn't realise all MVPs on here were volunteers. I assumed (obviously foolishly) that a company that generates profits of a million dollars a second could afford to have real employees to deal with problems raised on their own forum !!! 2. Makes sense. 3. Perhaps Microsoft should do domething about this ?!? You say "There is no requirement that any of us be of any value to you." ... Now sorry, but this I disagree with 100%. If Microsoft create a forum such as this, where problems are going to be reported and solutions required, then they should ensure that knowledge and resources are available to answer and resolve said problems. "Ken Blake" wrote: Three points: 1. All of we MVPs are volunteers 2. All of we MVPs know some things very well, others slightly, and still others not at all. I, for example, have no interest in Windows Live Messenger, know nothing about it, and can't help you regarding any problems you have with it. 3. Some MVPs may have the ability to discuss certain types of problems with the appropriate Microsoft employees; others don't. In many cases, we wouldn't even know who to raise an issue with. Regarding Windows Messenger, not only do I not know anything about it, but I don't even know the name of a Microsoft employee who does. Moreover, this is not an established method of getting problems solved, and even if I knew the right person at Microsoft and asked him, there is no guarantee that it would lead to a solution. perhaps that mught be a more valuable use of their time than arguing and whining, after all, isn't that supposed to be what they are here for ?!?!? No, not at all. We are volunteers who each have knowledge in certain areas only. It's for that reason that each of answers some questions and ignore others, about which we know nothing (or at least not enough) entirely. They're of no VALUE to me if they don't help resolve this issues I raise !!! Then feel free to ignore or even killfile all of us. There is no requirement that any of us be of any value to you. |
#97
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Microsoft MVPs
"Vodkasoda" wrote in message
... Ken, 1. As just replied to Mike Hall, I didn't realise all MVPs on here were volunteers. OK. I assumed (obviously foolishly) that a company that generates profits of a million dollars a second could afford to have real employees to deal with problems raised on their own forum !!! 2. Makes sense. 3. Perhaps Microsoft should do domething about this ?!? You say "There is no requirement that any of us be of any value to you." ... Now sorry, but this I disagree with 100%. If Microsoft create a forum such as this, where problems are going to be reported and solutions required, then they should ensure that knowledge and resources are available to answer and resolve said problems. My point is simply this: I took umbrage at your comments, and told you that I don't need to help anybody, and I have no interest in even trying to help someone who insults me. "Ken Blake" wrote: Three points: 1. All of we MVPs are volunteers 2. All of we MVPs know some things very well, others slightly, and still others not at all. I, for example, have no interest in Windows Live Messenger, know nothing about it, and can't help you regarding any problems you have with it. 3. Some MVPs may have the ability to discuss certain types of problems with the appropriate Microsoft employees; others don't. In many cases, we wouldn't even know who to raise an issue with. Regarding Windows Messenger, not only do I not know anything about it, but I don't even know the name of a Microsoft employee who does. Moreover, this is not an established method of getting problems solved, and even if I knew the right person at Microsoft and asked him, there is no guarantee that it would lead to a solution. perhaps that mught be a more valuable use of their time than arguing and whining, after all, isn't that supposed to be what they are here for ?!?!? No, not at all. We are volunteers who each have knowledge in certain areas only. It's for that reason that each of answers some questions and ignore others, about which we know nothing (or at least not enough) entirely. They're of no VALUE to me if they don't help resolve this issues I raise !!! Then feel free to ignore or even killfile all of us. There is no requirement that any of us be of any value to you. |
#98
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Microsoft MVPs
On Wed, 12 Nov 2008 03:00:47 -0000, "D. Spencer Hines"
wrote: Twaddle.... _All of us_ is correct English. Right. So is "Let him who is without sin cast the first stone" An episode of Star Trek had the incorrect title "Let He Who Is Without Sin". Bad form. Some people find it hard to maintain the distinction between subject and object exemplified in the following biblical quotation: "he that seeketh findeth; and to him that knocketh it shall be opened." There are even people, like Hines himself, who think it's all right to say "All things come to he who waits." They think that the correct form -- "All things come to him who waits" -- is an attempt to impose German syntax on English. Hilarious! And to quote George Washington: I add no more than that you may ever count upon the friendly sentiments and best wishes of him who has the pleasure to subscribe himself James Hogg |
#99
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Microsoft MVPs
tinw
Earle You are having another bad day. Did you read the OP's post . Ken's reply was appropriate and correct(All of we) and in proper English be it British,Australian ,American , Canadian and etc. Might not have been in South African English but it was correct for all others "Earle Horton" wrote in message ... "All of we" does not appear on that page. In this case the pronoun is the object of the preposition "of" and so the accusative pronoun is required. According to the advice on the page, which is not bad, «decide which case fits by narrowing the sentence down to the subject and the verb. If your pronoun is neither of these then use "us".» Object of a pronoun, therefore "us". The rules are so simple... Now which use of Ken's is "correct"? He says "all of we" and "any of us" as if both were permissible. According to my quick Live Search results, one person out of 1699 agrees with the first use. The inconsistency is the part that tells me not to take this guy seriously. Learn to read, and if you post a link as evidence of your position, read it first. -- Earle Horton -- "Tom [Pepper] Willett" wrote in message ... Ken's use of "we" is correct. You can begin your basic studying he http://www.one-step-forward.net/2007...versus-we.html "Earle Horton" wrote in message ... "All of us". That should kill the OP's hope of contacting any intelligent live via this avenue. Live Search has 29,900,000 results using normal grammar, and 17,600 using what you have. Do people actually talk like that? I wouldn't have said anything, but you used the correct form later. -- Earle Horton -- -- Defender of the English language. "Ken Blake" wrote in message ... "Vodkasoda" wrote in message ... It's a valid and interesting question, and judging by the 40+ responses it has rattled a few cages ... perhaps now that their cages have been rattled and they are awake, perhaps some of the MVPs (real and fake) might like to try and answer why Windows Live Messenger is crashing in Vista ... and if they don't know then to raise the issue with people who might know or be able to find out ... Three points: 1. All of we MVPs are volunteers 2. All of we MVPs know some things very well, others slightly, and still others not at all. I, for example, have no interest in Windows Live Messenger, know nothing about it, and can't help you regarding any problems you have with it. 3. Some MVPs may have the ability to discuss certain types of problems with the appropriate Microsoft employees; others don't. In many cases, we wouldn't even know who to raise an issue with. Regarding Windows Messenger, not only do I not know anything about it, but I don't even know the name of a Microsoft employee who does. Moreover, this is not an established method of getting problems solved, and even if I knew the right person at Microsoft and asked him, there is no guarantee that it would lead to a solution. perhaps that mught be a more valuable use of their time than arguing and whining, after all, isn't that supposed to be what they are here for ?!?!? No, not at all. We are volunteers who each have knowledge in certain areas only. It's for that reason that each of answers some questions and ignore others, about which we know nothing (or at least not enough) entirely. They're of no VALUE to me if they don't help resolve this issues I raise !!! Then feel free to ignore or even killfile all of us. There is no requirement that any of us be of any value to you. |
#100
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Microsoft MVPs
You should know better with all your experience and education.
"Twayne" wrote in message ... tinw Earle You are having another bad day. Did you read the OP's post . Ken's reply was appropriate and correct(All of we) and in proper English be it British,Australian ,American , Canadian and etc. Might not have been in South African English but it was correct for all others "Earle Horton" wrote in message ... "All of we" does not appear on that page. In this case the pronoun is the object of the preposition "of" and so the accusative pronoun is required. According to the advice on the page, which is not bad, «decide which case fits by narrowing the sentence down to the subject and the verb. If your pronoun is neither of these then use "us".» Object of a pronoun, therefore "us". The rules are so simple... Now which use of Ken's is "correct"? He says "all of we" and "any of us" as if both were permissible. According to my quick Live Search results, one person out of 1699 agrees with the first use. The inconsistency is the part that tells me not to take this guy seriously. Learn to read, and if you post a link as evidence of your position, read it first. -- Earle Horton -- "Tom [Pepper] Willett" wrote in message ... Ken's use of "we" is correct. You can begin your basic studying he http://www.one-step-forward.net/2007...versus-we.html "Earle Horton" wrote in message ... "All of us". That should kill the OP's hope of contacting any intelligent live via this avenue. Live Search has 29,900,000 results using normal grammar, and 17,600 using what you have. Do people actually talk like that? I wouldn't have said anything, but you used the correct form later. -- Earle Horton -- -- Defender of the English language. "Ken Blake" wrote in message ... "Vodkasoda" wrote in message ... It's a valid and interesting question, and judging by the 40+ responses it has rattled a few cages ... perhaps now that their cages have been rattled and they are awake, perhaps some of the MVPs (real and fake) might like to try and answer why Windows Live Messenger is crashing in Vista ... and if they don't know then to raise the issue with people who might know or be able to find out ... Three points: 1. All of we MVPs are volunteers 2. All of we MVPs know some things very well, others slightly, and still others not at all. I, for example, have no interest in Windows Live Messenger, know nothing about it, and can't help you regarding any problems you have with it. 3. Some MVPs may have the ability to discuss certain types of problems with the appropriate Microsoft employees; others don't. In many cases, we wouldn't even know who to raise an issue with. Regarding Windows Messenger, not only do I not know anything about it, but I don't even know the name of a Microsoft employee who does. Moreover, this is not an established method of getting problems solved, and even if I knew the right person at Microsoft and asked him, there is no guarantee that it would lead to a solution. perhaps that mught be a more valuable use of their time than arguing and whining, after all, isn't that supposed to be what they are here for ?!?!? No, not at all. We are volunteers who each have knowledge in certain areas only. It's for that reason that each of answers some questions and ignore others, about which we know nothing (or at least not enough) entirely. They're of no VALUE to me if they don't help resolve this issues I raise !!! Then feel free to ignore or even killfile all of us. There is no requirement that any of us be of any value to you. |
#101
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Microsoft MVPs
"Vodkasoda" wrote in message ... MVPs ... apologies, I didn't know you were all volunteers. I would have expected that on some private forum or discussion group, but when I have a problem with a Microsoft product & I come to a Microsoft site for help and advice, I expected to be helped by a Microsoft "expert" ... it's not as if they can't afford to pay the wages !!! This isn't a Website. It's a public Usenet group. If you're using a Web browser to read it, you really should get a real news reader. There are quite a few free ones available. Outlook Express, Windows Mail and Windows Live Mail all have one built-in. Tom Lake |
#102
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Microsoft MVPs
Please reduce the needless crossposting. Thanks!
Tom Lake wrote: "Vodkasoda" wrote in message ... MVPs ... apologies, I didn't know you were all volunteers. I would have expected that on some private forum or discussion group, but when I have a problem with a Microsoft product & I come to a Microsoft site for help and advice, I expected to be helped by a Microsoft "expert" ... it's not as if they can't afford to pay the wages !!! This isn't a Website. It's a public Usenet group. If you're using a Web browser to read it, you really should get a real news reader. There are quite a few free ones available. Outlook Express, Windows Mail and Windows Live Mail all have one built-in. Tom Lake |
#103
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Microsoft MVPs
"Vodkasoda" wrote in message
... Ken, 1. As just replied to Mike Hall, I didn't realise all MVPs on here were volunteers. I assumed (obviously foolishly) that a company that generates profits of a million dollars a second could afford to have real employees to deal with problems raised on their own forum !!! Microsoft does have employees who provide support. However, that is not what these newsgroups were designed for; they are merely peer-to-peer. If you want an actual support person, you will need to pay for the support, either ahead of time (through a license) or after the fact (per incident). For what it's worth, I have found the quality of advice from the volunteers here very helpful. YMMV. Then again, I am intelligent enough to killfile impostors and other wannabees, so the noise level that I encounter is fairly low. 3. Perhaps Microsoft should do domething about this ?!? You say "There is no requirement that any of us be of any value to you." ... Now sorry, but this I disagree with 100%. If Microsoft create a forum such as this, where problems are going to be reported and solutions required, then they should ensure that knowledge and resources are available to answer and resolve said problems. You misunderstand the nature of Usenet and these peer-to-peer newsgroups. Are you interested in learning how to maximize your Usenet experience? |
#104
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Microsoft MVPs
"Daave" wrote in message
... "Vodkasoda" wrote in message ... Ken, 1. As just replied to Mike Hall, I didn't realise all MVPs on here were volunteers. I assumed (obviously foolishly) that a company that generates profits of a million dollars a second could afford to have real employees to deal with problems raised on their own forum !!! Microsoft does have employees who provide support. However, that is not what these newsgroups were designed for; they are merely peer-to-peer. If you want an actual support person, you will need to pay for the support, either ahead of time (through a license) or after the fact (per incident). For what it's worth, I have found the quality of advice from the volunteers here very helpful. YMMV. Then again, I am intelligent enough to killfile impostors and other wannabees, so the noise level that I encounter is fairly low. One does see actual MS employees in these groups, but that is very rare and your good luck if one actually is able to help you. It would be like if you walked out on the sidewalk in front of your house and one happened by. -- Earle Horton -- |
#105
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Microsoft MVPs
"Earle Horton" wrote in message ... "Daave" wrote in message ... "Vodkasoda" wrote in message ... Ken, 1. As just replied to Mike Hall, I didn't realise all MVPs on here were volunteers. I assumed (obviously foolishly) that a company that generates profits of a million dollars a second could afford to have real employees to deal with problems raised on their own forum !!! Microsoft does have employees who provide support. However, that is not what these newsgroups were designed for; they are merely peer-to-peer. If you want an actual support person, you will need to pay for the support, either ahead of time (through a license) or after the fact (per incident). For what it's worth, I have found the quality of advice from the volunteers here very helpful. YMMV. Then again, I am intelligent enough to killfile impostors and other wannabees, so the noise level that I encounter is fairly low. One does see actual MS employees in these groups, but that is very rare and your good luck if one actually is able to help you. It would be like if you walked out on the sidewalk in front of your house and one happened by. -- Earle Horton -- qp One does see actual MS employees in these groups, but that is very rare and your good luck if one actually is able to help you. /qp They come here looking for answers too. eg. -- ~Bruce |
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