Win10 update changed BIOS settings

Eric Stevens wrote:
On Sun, 19 Jan 2020 11:06:34 -0700, Ken Blake
wrote:

On 1/19/2020 9:38 AM, philo wrote:
On 1/19/20 4:52 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 17/01/2020 17.35, philo wrote:
My wife has a fairly new Lenovo laptop with Win10,

She had me check it last night because the function keys no longer
responded unless she presses the "Fn" key first.

She told me it happened immediately after the last update.


After seeing no tweak for that in the OS, I saw one bios setting had
changed and I reset it.
All working fine now.

There is zero chance my wife would have been fooling around in the BIOS.


I am puzzled how and update could change a BIOS setting though.
Because your laptop being "fairly new", you don't don't have BIOS. You
have UEFI. Even if you activated "legacy support" etc, it is still UEFI.

You should forget the word "BIOS".



The correct term is UEFI BIOS but I think most here understood what I meant

Sorry, that is *not* the correct term (although many people say it).
Although they do similar things, UEFI and BIOS are two different things.
Saying "UEFI BIOS" is like saying "zebra horse."

If you don't believe me, do a google search on "uefi."

And you will find it full of references to "UEFI BIOS". See
https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/...e-e078930b8c6e

UEFI is just a type of BIOS.


I like the term "UEFI BIOS", mainly so people will
understand what part of the process it plays. Rather
than being a "dictionary correct term". It's something
we deal with on "BIOS days", and it's the "UEFI flavor".

I mean, they've gone out of their way to use "uncomfortable
terminology" that doesn't help people understand it. It's
like the marketing department invented all the TLAs.
Firmware isn't the first thing I'm thinking of, when
I'm trying to change a few settings on my machine.
The terminology here, is intended to sell the concept
to developers, as "some kind of improvement", which it isn't.
Stuff like this only makes the job harder, as it adds yet
another layer that can break.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unifie...ware_Interface

It's sort of an OS.

But what it's doing, is also largely what a BIOS does,
only with different names and different implementations.

And, it's easier to break or "brick".

You can't brick a BIOS. You can "erase" a BIOS, using
an EEPROM flash program. But for the most part, you can
"clear CMOS" with the power off, and recover non-functional
sets of BIOS settings (I did that today on an old computer).
There might have been no BIOS brickage, if they would
only stop erasing the first stage loader on the BIOS. Whereas
other platforms with permanent loaders work as intended
(if you erase the larger code storage area, you can
still reload the firmware and recover the device). A
traditional BIOS has a nicer partitioning (you never have
to worry about what OS you've been running on the machine,
once the disk is disconnected, there's no side effects).
UEFI adds more "mush", where once you had "solid footing".

Paul

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:

I am puzzled how and update could change a BIOS setting though.

Because your laptop being "fairly new", you don't don't have BIOS. You
have UEFI. Even if you activated "legacy support" etc, it is still UEFI.

You should forget the word "BIOS".




The correct term is UEFI BIOS but I think most here understood what I meant


Sorry, that is *not* the correct term (although many people say it).
Although they do similar things, UEFI and BIOS are two different things.
Saying "UEFI BIOS" is like saying "zebra horse."

If you don't believe me, do a google search on "uefi."

And you will find it full of references to "UEFI BIOS". See
https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/...e-e078930b8c6e

someone using the term improperly in a question is not a reference.

UEFI is just a type of BIOS.

it is not, which you've been told before on several occasions.

On 20/01/2020 00.41, Eric Stevens wrote:
On Sun, 19 Jan 2020 10:38:29 -0600, philo wrote:

On 1/19/20 4:52 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 17/01/2020 17.35, philo wrote:
My wife has a fairly new Lenovo laptop with Win10,

She had me check it last night because the function keys no longer
responded unless she presses the "Fn" key first.

She told me it happened immediately after the last update.


After seeing no tweak for that in the OS, I saw one bios setting had
changed and I reset it.
All working fine now.

There is zero chance my wife would have been fooling around in the BIOS.


I am puzzled how and update could change a BIOS setting though.

Because your laptop being "fairly new", you don't don't have BIOS. You
have UEFI. Even if you activated "legacy support" etc, it is still UEFI.

You should forget the word "BIOS".




The correct term is UEFI BIOS but I think most here understood what I meant

BIOS stands for Basic Input Output System so that extent UEFI is still
a form of BIOS. Except that it ain't quite so basic.

It is not basic, it is orders of magnitude larger. They can do things
like move its configuration to the operating system (to Windows
effectively) so that the classical configuration display is minimal. It
can be bricked.

It has a proper name: UEFI. Just use it to stress the fact that it is
really different. If we use the "BIOS" name we are denoting we don't
know the difference between one and the other, that we are ignorant of
reality.

COF COF!

--
Cheers, Carlos.

"Char Jackson" wrote in message
...

On Sun, 19 Jan 2020 11:06:34 -0700, Ken Blake wrote:

On 1/19/2020 9:38 AM, philo wrote:
On 1/19/20 4:52 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 17/01/2020 17.35, philo wrote:
My wife has a fairly new Lenovo laptop with Win10,

She had me check it last night because the function keys no longer
responded unless she presses the "Fn" key first.

She told me it happened immediately after the last update.


After seeing no tweak for that in the OS, I saw one bios setting had
changed and I reset it.
All working fine now.

There is zero chance my wife would have been fooling around in the
BIOS.


I am puzzled how and update could change a BIOS setting though.

Because your laptop being "fairly new", you don't don't have BIOS. You
have UEFI. Even if you activated "legacy support" etc, it is still
UEFI.

You should forget the word "BIOS".




The correct term is UEFI BIOS but I think most here understood what I
meant


Sorry, that is *not* the correct term (although many people say it).
Although they do similar things, UEFI and BIOS are two different things.
Saying "UEFI BIOS" is like saying "zebra horse."

A 'zebra horse' is apparently more correctly referred to as a zorse. This
is something that I didn't know, so thank you for the heads up.

https://mymodernmet.com/zorse-animal-hybrid/
Striking Photos of Zorses Capture the Very Real Yet Rare Hybrid of a Zebra
and Horse

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cGtwI84KtnY
The Zebra Horse (0:48)

If you don't believe me, do a google search on "uefi."

I believe you.
Good one Char!!!
Hi Philo, great to see you are still around. I remember you a lot from many
years ago. You helped me a lot.
Thanks again,
--
Buffalo

On 1/19/2020 5:17 PM, Paul wrote:
Eric Stevens wrote:
On Sun, 19 Jan 2020 11:06:34 -0700, Ken Blake
wrote:

On 1/19/2020 9:38 AM, philo wrote:
On 1/19/20 4:52 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 17/01/2020 17.35, philo wrote:
My wife has a fairly new Lenovo laptop with Win10,

She had me check it last night because the function keys no longer
responded unless she presses the "Fn" key first.

She told me it happened immediately after the last update.


After seeing no tweak for that in the OS, I saw one bios setting had
changed and I reset it.
All working fine now.

There is zero chance my wife would have been fooling around in the BIOS.


I am puzzled how and update could change a BIOS setting though.
Because your laptop being "fairly new", you don't don't have BIOS. You
have UEFI. Even if you activated "legacy support" etc, it is still UEFI.

You should forget the word "BIOS".



The correct term is UEFI BIOS but I think most here understood what I meant

Sorry, that is *not* the correct term (although many people say it).
Although they do similar things, UEFI and BIOS are two different things.
Saying "UEFI BIOS" is like saying "zebra horse."

If you don't believe me, do a google search on "uefi."

And you will find it full of references to "UEFI BIOS". See
https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/...e-e078930b8c6e

UEFI is just a type of BIOS.


I like the term "UEFI BIOS", mainly so people will
understand what part of the process it plays. Rather
than being a "dictionary correct term". It's something
we deal with on "BIOS days", and it's the "UEFI flavor".

I mean, they've gone out of their way to use "uncomfortable
terminology" that doesn't help people understand it.



I'm with you entirely, I think "UEFI BIOS" would be a better term than
"UEFI," and just keeping the term "BIOS" would be better still.


--
Ken

On 1/19/20 5:41 PM, Eric Stevens wrote:

[snip]

BIOS stands for Basic Input Output System so that extent UEFI is still
a form of BIOS. Except that it ain't quite so basic.

In the same way IDE stands for Integrated Drive Electronics, and applies
equally well to PATA, SATA, SCSI, NVMe, and probably a lot of other
interfaces as well.

--
"Socrates: You are wise if you admit you know nothing. DeCartes: Only
the Wise can know Anything. Sart you're an asshole if you think you
are Wise."

In article , Sam E
wrote:


BIOS stands for Basic Input Output System so that extent UEFI is still
a form of BIOS. Except that it ain't quite so basic.

In the same way IDE stands for Integrated Drive Electronics, and applies
equally well to PATA, SATA, SCSI, NVMe, and probably a lot of other
interfaces as well.

other than pata, no.

On 20/01/2020 16.54, Ken Blake wrote:
On 1/19/2020 5:17 PM, Paul wrote:
Eric Stevens wrote:
On Sun, 19 Jan 2020 11:06:34 -0700, Ken Blake
wrote:

On 1/19/2020 9:38 AM, philo wrote:
On 1/19/20 4:52 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 17/01/2020 17.35, philo wrote:
My wife has a fairly new Lenovo laptop with Win10,

She had me check it last night because the function keys no
longer responded unless she presses the "Fn" key first.

She told me it happened immediately after the last update.


After seeing no tweak for that in the OS, I saw one bios setting
had changed and I reset it.
All working fine now.

There is zero chance my wife would have been fooling around in
the BIOS.


I am puzzled how and update could change a BIOS setting though.
Because your laptop being "fairly new", you don't don't have BIOS.
You have UEFI. Even if you activated "legacy support" etc, it is
still UEFI.

You should forget the word "BIOS".



The correct term is UEFI BIOS but I think most here understood what
I meant

Sorry, that is *not* the correct term (although many people say it).
Although they do similar things, UEFI and BIOS are two different
things. Saying "UEFI BIOS" is like saying "zebra horse."

If you don't believe me, do a google search on "uefi."

And you will find it full of references to "UEFI BIOS". See
https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/...e-e078930b8c6e


UEFI is just a type of BIOS.


I like the term "UEFI BIOS", mainly so people will
understand what part of the process it plays. Rather
than being a "dictionary correct term". It's something
we deal with on "BIOS days", and it's the "UEFI flavor".

I mean, they've gone out of their way to use "uncomfortable
terminology" that doesn't help people understand it.



I'm with you entirely, I think "UEFI BIOS" would be a better term than
"UEFI," and just keeping the term "BIOS" would be better still.

Then you are *not* at all with me :-P


--
Cheers, Carlos.

On 1/20/2020 11:14 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 20/01/2020 16.54, Ken Blake wrote:
On 1/19/2020 5:17 PM, Paul wrote:
Eric Stevens wrote:
On Sun, 19 Jan 2020 11:06:34 -0700, Ken Blake
wrote:

On 1/19/2020 9:38 AM, philo wrote:
On 1/19/20 4:52 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 17/01/2020 17.35, philo wrote:
My wife has a fairly new Lenovo laptop with Win10,

She had me check it last night because the function keys no
longer responded unless she presses the "Fn" key first.

She told me it happened immediately after the last update.


After seeing no tweak for that in the OS, I saw one bios setting
had changed and I reset it.
All working fine now.

There is zero chance my wife would have been fooling around in
the BIOS.


I am puzzled how and update could change a BIOS setting though.
Because your laptop being "fairly new", you don't don't have BIOS.
You have UEFI. Even if you activated "legacy support" etc, it is
still UEFI.

You should forget the word "BIOS".



The correct term is UEFI BIOS but I think most here understood what
I meant

Sorry, that is *not* the correct term (although many people say it).
Although they do similar things, UEFI and BIOS are two different
things. Saying "UEFI BIOS" is like saying "zebra horse."

If you don't believe me, do a google search on "uefi."

And you will find it full of references to "UEFI BIOS". See
https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/...e-e078930b8c6e


UEFI is just a type of BIOS.


I like the term "UEFI BIOS", mainly so people will
understand what part of the process it plays. Rather
than being a "dictionary correct term". It's something
we deal with on "BIOS days", and it's the "UEFI flavor".

I mean, they've gone out of their way to use "uncomfortable
terminology" that doesn't help people understand it.



I'm with you entirely, I think "UEFI BIOS" would be a better term than
"UEFI," and just keeping the term "BIOS" would be better still.

Then you are *not* at all with me :-P


You? I was replying to Paul.


--
Ken

"Ken Blake" wrote in message ...

On 1/19/2020 5:17 PM, Paul wrote:
Eric Stevens wrote:
On Sun, 19 Jan 2020 11:06:34 -0700, Ken Blake
wrote:

On 1/19/2020 9:38 AM, philo wrote:
On 1/19/20 4:52 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 17/01/2020 17.35, philo wrote:
My wife has a fairly new Lenovo laptop with Win10,

She had me check it last night because the function keys no longer
responded unless she presses the "Fn" key first.

She told me it happened immediately after the last update.


After seeing no tweak for that in the OS, I saw one bios setting had
changed and I reset it.
All working fine now.

There is zero chance my wife would have been fooling around in the
BIOS.


I am puzzled how and update could change a BIOS setting though.
Because your laptop being "fairly new", you don't don't have BIOS.
You have UEFI. Even if you activated "legacy support" etc, it is
still UEFI.

You should forget the word "BIOS".



The correct term is UEFI BIOS but I think most here understood what I
meant

Sorry, that is *not* the correct term (although many people say it).
Although they do similar things, UEFI and BIOS are two different
things. Saying "UEFI BIOS" is like saying "zebra horse."

If you don't believe me, do a google search on "uefi."

And you will find it full of references to "UEFI BIOS". See
https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/...e-e078930b8c6e

UEFI is just a type of BIOS.


I like the term "UEFI BIOS", mainly so people will
understand what part of the process it plays. Rather
than being a "dictionary correct term". It's something
we deal with on "BIOS days", and it's the "UEFI flavor".

I mean, they've gone out of their way to use "uncomfortable
terminology" that doesn't help people understand it.



I'm with you entirely, I think "UEFI BIOS" would be a better term than
"UEFI," and just keeping the term "BIOS" would be better still.


Glad you agree with long time newsgroup contributor PHILO !!
--
Buffalo

On 20/01/2020 19.28, Ken Blake wrote:
On 1/20/2020 11:14 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 20/01/2020 16.54, Ken Blake wrote:
On 1/19/2020 5:17 PM, Paul wrote:
Eric Stevens wrote:
On Sun, 19 Jan 2020 11:06:34 -0700, Ken Blake
wrote:

On 1/19/2020 9:38 AM, philo wrote:
On 1/19/20 4:52 AM, Carlos E.R. wrote:
On 17/01/2020 17.35, philo wrote:
My wife has a fairly new Lenovo laptop with Win10,

She had me check it last night because the function keys no
longer responded unless she presses the "Fn" key first.

She told me it happened immediately after the last update.


After seeing no tweak for that in the OS, I saw one bios
setting had changed and I reset it.
All working fine now.

There is zero chance my wife would have been fooling around in
the BIOS.


I am puzzled how and update could change a BIOS setting though.
Because your laptop being "fairly new", you don't don't have
BIOS. You have UEFI. Even if you activated "legacy support" etc,
it is still UEFI.

You should forget the word "BIOS".



The correct term is UEFI BIOS but I think most here understood
what I meant

Sorry, that is *not* the correct term (although many people say
it). Although they do similar things, UEFI and BIOS are two
different things. Saying "UEFI BIOS" is like saying "zebra horse."

If you don't believe me, do a google search on "uefi."

And you will find it full of references to "UEFI BIOS". See
https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/...e-e078930b8c6e


UEFI is just a type of BIOS.


I like the term "UEFI BIOS", mainly so people will
understand what part of the process it plays. Rather
than being a "dictionary correct term". It's something
we deal with on "BIOS days", and it's the "UEFI flavor".

I mean, they've gone out of their way to use "uncomfortable
terminology" that doesn't help people understand it.



I'm with you entirely, I think "UEFI BIOS" would be a better term
than "UEFI," and just keeping the term "BIOS" would be better still.

Then you are *not* at all with me :-P


You? I was replying to Paul.

Huh, sorry, I misread the graph.


--
Cheers, Carlos.

On 20/01/2020 19.12, nospam wrote:
In article , Sam E
wrote:


BIOS stands for Basic Input Output System so that extent UEFI is still
a form of BIOS. Except that it ain't quite so basic.

In the same way IDE stands for Integrated Drive Electronics, and applies
equally well to PATA, SATA, SCSI, NVMe, and probably a lot of other
interfaces as well.

other than pata, no.

Nor is UEFI only an input output system...


--
Cheers, Carlos.

On 19/01/2020 23:41, Eric Stevens wrote:
BIOS stands for Basic Input Output System so that extent UEFI is still
a form of BIOS. Except that it ain't quite so basic.


when you define the mnemonic, you should always define for anything that
is part of the conversation. Why did you not also say that UEFI stands
for:

"Unified Extensible Firmware Interface"

This would have avoided all the nutters talking rubbish with their
limited intelligence and knowledge.

--
With over 1.2 billion devices now running Windows 10, customer
satisfaction is higher than any previous version of windows.

In article , Carlos E.R.
wrote:

BIOS stands for Basic Input Output System so that extent UEFI is still
a form of BIOS. Except that it ain't quite so basic.

In the same way IDE stands for Integrated Drive Electronics, and applies
equally well to PATA, SATA, SCSI, NVMe, and probably a lot of other
interfaces as well.

other than pata, no.

Nor is UEFI only an input output system...

correct.

also, not all computers have uefi or bios.

On 20/01/2020 23.11, nospam wrote:
In article , Carlos E.R.
wrote:

BIOS stands for Basic Input Output System so that extent UEFI is still
a form of BIOS. Except that it ain't quite so basic.

In the same way IDE stands for Integrated Drive Electronics, and applies
equally well to PATA, SATA, SCSI, NVMe, and probably a lot of other
interfaces as well.

other than pata, no.

Nor is UEFI only an input output system...

correct.

also, not all computers have uefi or bios.

Well, in the context of Windows machines, I don't think that is possible
- otherwise, of course.


--
Cheers, Carlos.