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Random Step Forward/skip/fast forward delays win7 VLC .wtv files



 
 
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  #1  
Old September 22nd 17, 05:06 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
mike[_10_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,073
Default Random Step Forward/skip/fast forward delays win7 VLC .wtv files

Random Step Forward/skip/fast forward delays win7 VLC .wtv files

Win7 Ultimate
WMC
VLC
K-Lite Codec Pack
I've been using Media Center to record/time-shift 4 TV channels.
I play them back with VLC because it allows me to increase
the playback speed to 2X.
It's been working flawlessly for several years.

Recently, Avira AV went rogue and resisted all attempts
to uninstall it. I gave up and reinstalled the OS.

Now, I have a random symptom that I can't track down.
Playing the .wtv files with VLC.
If I try to skip forward, the first skip always works.
Subsequent skips may or may not have a 10 second or
more delay. The screen is frozen and nothing happens until
the delay expires. It's similar to a buffering problem, but the CPU
activity stays low and there's no obvious increased disk
activity.
This is file related. If the .wtv has the skip delay, it always
has the skip delay. If it skips correctly, it always skips correctly.
I initially suspected a codec issue, but that shouldn't be random.
Other recordings from that session may or may not have the
symptom. The symptom is unrelated to the selected
playback speed as long as I keep it below where the hardware
can't keep up.
There's a VLC setting "fast skip" that was not enabled.
I enabled it and the problem went away...until sometime
later when it started happening again.

..wtv files recorded before the system reload have never exhibited
the symptom.
Recorded files that exhibit the symptom continue to exhibit
the system when played at a later date. All files always play/skip
without delay when played with WMC.
I've copied the files to a different partition and the problem persists,
although it's somewhat random.
Rebooting doesn't help.
Defragmenting doesn't help.
Registry cleaners and unnecessary file deleters don't help.

The files play fine and skip fine using Media Center for playback,
but I haven't found a way to increase the playback speed with WMC.
That functionality is essential.

It sounds like it's mostly related to recording, so...
I picked a TV channel and restricted recording to one tuner.
Playback skip works fine.
I cycled thru all 4 tuners and all worked fine.
Since it's random, I still can't be sure that it's not a tuner driver or
configuration issue.

I copied a bad file to a different computer and it plays/skips
correctly in VLC. Same file played across the network with VLC
doesn't seem to have the problem, but the network speed limitations
to introduce a lesser delay in the skips.

If there were a way to increase the playback speed of WMC,
that would solve my problem. That's the only reason I
use VLC for playback.

I've reloaded WMC. I've reinstalled VLC. Nothing helps.
I've not found any log issues showing an error, but maybe
I'm not looking in the right place.

Any suggestions on what I might try to diagnose this random
symptom?


Ads
  #2  
Old September 22nd 17, 06:41 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
VanguardLH[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,881
Default Random Step Forward/skip/fast forward delays win7 VLC .wtv files

mike wrote:

Random Step Forward/skip/fast forward delays win7 VLC .wtv files

Win7 Ultimate
WMC
VLC
K-Lite Codec Pack
I've been using Media Center to record/time-shift 4 TV channels.
I play them back with VLC because it allows me to increase
the playback speed to 2X.
It's been working flawlessly for several years.

Recently, Avira AV went rogue and resisted all attempts
to uninstall it. I gave up and reinstalled the OS.

Now, I have a random symptom that I can't track down.
Playing the .wtv files with VLC.
If I try to skip forward, the first skip always works.
Subsequent skips may or may not have a 10 second or
more delay. The screen is frozen and nothing happens until
the delay expires. It's similar to a buffering problem, but the CPU
activity stays low and there's no obvious increased disk
activity.
This is file related. If the .wtv has the skip delay, it always
has the skip delay. If it skips correctly, it always skips correctly.
I initially suspected a codec issue, but that shouldn't be random.
Other recordings from that session may or may not have the
symptom. The symptom is unrelated to the selected
playback speed as long as I keep it below where the hardware
can't keep up.
There's a VLC setting "fast skip" that was not enabled.
I enabled it and the problem went away...until sometime
later when it started happening again.

.wtv files recorded before the system reload have never exhibited
the symptom.
Recorded files that exhibit the symptom continue to exhibit
the system when played at a later date. All files always play/skip
without delay when played with WMC.
I've copied the files to a different partition and the problem persists,
although it's somewhat random.
Rebooting doesn't help.
Defragmenting doesn't help.
Registry cleaners and unnecessary file deleters don't help.

The files play fine and skip fine using Media Center for playback,
but I haven't found a way to increase the playback speed with WMC.
That functionality is essential.

It sounds like it's mostly related to recording, so...
I picked a TV channel and restricted recording to one tuner.
Playback skip works fine.
I cycled thru all 4 tuners and all worked fine.
Since it's random, I still can't be sure that it's not a tuner driver or
configuration issue.

I copied a bad file to a different computer and it plays/skips
correctly in VLC. Same file played across the network with VLC
doesn't seem to have the problem, but the network speed limitations
to introduce a lesser delay in the skips.

If there were a way to increase the playback speed of WMC,
that would solve my problem. That's the only reason I
use VLC for playback.

I've reloaded WMC. I've reinstalled VLC. Nothing helps.
I've not found any log issues showing an error, but maybe
I'm not looking in the right place.

Any suggestions on what I might try to diagnose this random
symptom?


WTV (Windows Recorded TV Show) is a Microsoft proprietary file format.
It is a container using MPEG-2 compression and audio uses either MPEG-1
Layer 2 or Dolby Digital AC-3 compression. It may contain metadata
along with DRM (Digital Rights Management) control. If the show
contained ads, they might use DRM to make sure you see them when you
play the show so you cannot simply skip past them. If you are recording
shows using Windows Media Center, it uses the SBE (Stream Buffer Engine)
to create the .wtv file. Because you are capturing streamed media from
a server, quality can vary wildly and what the server delivers can
change if you re-stream later. WMC can be converted back to the older
..dvr-ms proprietary format but I don't know that will progressing
forward or backward regarding quality of content or resolve your
problem. Note: Microsoft abandoned the WTV media file format which
irritated many users encouraged by WMC to create WTV files. Since WMC
was intended as the only player for WTV files, and since WMC got dropped
by Microsoft in Windows 10, it's an orphaned media format. I went to
wiki.videolan.org and search on "wtv". Looks like it hasn't even been
mentioned since 2015 (and that was only to propose a mentor, or
proponent, of the media format to add support for it).

Aside: For capturing streaming media, the best that I've found, so far,
is Jaksta or Applian Replay Media Catcher (RMC, which is just a
rebranded Jaksta) but it is payware. They still have to frequently
update it to accomdate changes at sites regarding how they are
delivering streamed content. They do take user reports about capture
problems at sites (and forward them to Jaksta who actually develops the
program). I found WMC to be lots of glitz with lacking depth. So I
also went to VLC as a player and RMC for stream capture.

Also, the granularity of sync points (where you can skip forward/back)
might be greater than you had originally if the media is being retrieved
from a server rather than downloaded and stored locally, and granularity
might change between what you downloaded before and what you download
now for the same video. I see this all the time in VLC where I set it
to loop from A to B and repeat but a large granularity means I cannot
get the loop to start and stop exactly where I want.

After doing a fresh install of Windows, did you also proceed through all
the updates for Windows and other MS programs from Microsoft's Windows
Update site? Did you update all your hardware drivers, including for
the mobo's chipset? You might've done a lot of updating in all those
years of using VLC to play WTV files that you neglected in your fresh
Windows install.

After the fresh install of Windows 7, did you test before installing the
KLite Codec Pack to retest for the problem or did you install KLite
before testing? You did not say which KLite package you installed --
Basic, Standard, Full, or Mega -- or that you installed KLite after the
fresh Windows install. Hopefully you did not install their Beta package
if you installed KLite. In the past, I had installed the Mega pack but
since backed off the Full pack (plus I do a custom install since I don't
need all products in either, like the media players). Did you let the
KLite installer use the defaults for codecs on filetype or content type
or did you change the defaults?

Oops, just remember VLC won't use any codecs installed by KLite. When
using VLC, it doesn't use *any* codec in the OS, including those you
installed by KLite. VLC uses its own private repository of codecs that
it stores under its install path rolled into one, or more, DLL files.
Did you install the latest version of VLC to make sure you got its
latest private codec libraries? Don't use an old saved download of VLC.
Get the newest version, download it, and install that version. A lot of
functionality in VLC and other free players is the use of the ffmpeg
library. At one time, ffmpeg didn't work with WTV as it was Microsoft
proprietary. ffmepg is used for playback. The codecs are snippets of
code for the algorithms needed to decode a particular media file format.

You did not mention the bitwidth of your Windows 7. There is 32- and
64-bit. You also did not mention the bitwidth of the installed VLC
program. If it doesn't say, load VLC and check in Task Manager's
Processes tab. In x64 Windows, if the process name is followed by "*32"
then it is a 32-bit program. If "*32" is missing (no bitwidth appended)
then it is a 64-bit program. I use Windows 7 x64 and VLC x64 so the
process name is just "vlc.exe" (no *32 appended qualifier) in Task
Manager's Processes tab. I only see a single "Windows" download of VLC
so they might've rolled both 32- and 64-bit versions of VLC into the
same installer but you might get a choice during the install. If so,
pick VLC x64 if you are using Windows x64.

VLC comes with some plug-ins (aka extensions). Did you install all the
default ones during its installation?

Are these copyrighted WTV files? I don't know if VLC was setup to play
copyrighted (DRM'ed) content.

WTV format's popularity is pretty low. You might want to pick a
standard media coding when saving files, if permitted, or use a
converter to get away from WTV. WMC creates some obscenely huge WTV
files so you might save a lot of space by recording the stream into a
more efficient container.

Since the problem is with playback in VLC (you never mentioned WMC had
any problems playing the WTV files), you might want to inquire over at
VLC forums about problems with that program.

https://forum.videolan.org/

Searched there on "wtv" and "dvr-ms" (do an advanced search and group by
topic so you don't end up with a long list of posts which are each one
in each thread). Looks like support was added to VLC for those formats
but the reverse engineering did not produce a wholly compatible player
for WTV. It is unclear if you are trying to stream the same or
different WTV containered media streams or trying to play downloaded and
saved .wtv files (which are the entire media content and not some
pointer to a server). Since Microsoft abandoned the WTV container
format, not likely VideoLAN will invest much, if any, resources to fix
bugs with their code to support WTV.

For example, someone noted there the delay when trying to jump forward
or backward that you noted. See:

https://forum.videolan.org/viewtopic...6626&hilit=wtv

That "sometimes" the low granularity in choosing a play position is not
clear if the behavior is evident within the same WTV file (i.e.,
sometimes there is a lag and sometimes not) or one WTV has no lag while
a different WTV file does have lag (which could be due to granularity in
sync points).

Are you doing something non-typical that you did not mention, like using
an application to watch your video card's/chip's output across multiple
monitors? I've see one user, for example, that used The Maxifier
(http://www.mods.com.au/Maxifier/) who found that setting it to "fit to
screen" worked but "full screen" caused playback problems. Apparently
WMC itself can have performance problems with multiple monitors, like
those using the Aero theme and noticing disabling transparency removed
the problems.

I'd say dump the WTV format. It's abandoned. VLC's reversed engineered
implementation doesn't look complete or bug-free. If you are trying to
capture new streamed shows, use something better for stream capture (and
NOT screen capture tools which will record any window you accidentally
open over the playback window, your mouse crossing over the video, any
jerkiness due to buffering, and hiccups in playback due to network
hiccups, etc). If you have lots of .wtv files on your computer then
look at converting them to a non-Microsoft (aka standard) format.
  #3  
Old September 22nd 17, 07:43 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11,873
Default Random Step Forward/skip/fast forward delays win7 VLC .wtv files

mike wrote:
Random Step Forward/skip/fast forward delays win7 VLC .wtv files

Win7 Ultimate
WMC
VLC
K-Lite Codec Pack
I've been using Media Center to record/time-shift 4 TV channels.
I play them back with VLC because it allows me to increase
the playback speed to 2X.
It's been working flawlessly for several years.

Recently, Avira AV went rogue and resisted all attempts
to uninstall it. I gave up and reinstalled the OS.

Now, I have a random symptom that I can't track down.
Playing the .wtv files with VLC.
If I try to skip forward, the first skip always works.
Subsequent skips may or may not have a 10 second or
more delay. The screen is frozen and nothing happens until
the delay expires. It's similar to a buffering problem, but the CPU
activity stays low and there's no obvious increased disk
activity.
This is file related. If the .wtv has the skip delay, it always
has the skip delay. If it skips correctly, it always skips correctly.
I initially suspected a codec issue, but that shouldn't be random.
Other recordings from that session may or may not have the
symptom. The symptom is unrelated to the selected
playback speed as long as I keep it below where the hardware
can't keep up.
There's a VLC setting "fast skip" that was not enabled.
I enabled it and the problem went away...until sometime
later when it started happening again.

.wtv files recorded before the system reload have never exhibited
the symptom.
Recorded files that exhibit the symptom continue to exhibit
the system when played at a later date. All files always play/skip
without delay when played with WMC.
I've copied the files to a different partition and the problem persists,
although it's somewhat random.
Rebooting doesn't help.
Defragmenting doesn't help.
Registry cleaners and unnecessary file deleters don't help.

The files play fine and skip fine using Media Center for playback,
but I haven't found a way to increase the playback speed with WMC.
That functionality is essential.

It sounds like it's mostly related to recording, so...
I picked a TV channel and restricted recording to one tuner.
Playback skip works fine.
I cycled thru all 4 tuners and all worked fine.
Since it's random, I still can't be sure that it's not a tuner driver or
configuration issue.

I copied a bad file to a different computer and it plays/skips
correctly in VLC. Same file played across the network with VLC
doesn't seem to have the problem, but the network speed limitations
to introduce a lesser delay in the skips.

If there were a way to increase the playback speed of WMC,
that would solve my problem. That's the only reason I
use VLC for playback.

I've reloaded WMC. I've reinstalled VLC. Nothing helps.
I've not found any log issues showing an error, but maybe
I'm not looking in the right place.

Any suggestions on what I might try to diagnose this random
symptom?



I only got a tuner card a couple months ago, and what
impressed me the most about the .wtv files, was the
number of streams included in the recording. This
varies from channel to channel - not every TV channel
includes the same stream types, and it's not even certain
the labels on them are correct.

I would take one of the non-working cases, and use FFMPEG
to look for clues as to the nature of the problem.

*******

There are a couple playback possibilities on video.

Your VLC example, uses FFMPEG/LibAVCodec for playback.
That means, it doesn't need KLite to work. The codecs
are compiled into the library provided by FFMPEG. A person
can also download a build of FFMPEG, that includes
ffmpeg.exe (convert/massage), ffplay.exe, and
ffprobe.exe (packet extract).

(The nightly was broken when I tried to use it. Try
an older or release version.)

http://ffmpeg.zeranoe.com/builds/

When you use Windows Media Player, it would not have an
MPEG2 codec in it. WMP would use DirectShow and that
constructs a "graph" (GraphEdit) that defines a set of functional
blocks to decode the video. The file would be
demultiplexed into audio and video streams, and the
video stream type would need a CODEC. WMP doesn't have
a huge binary blob with "everything" in it like FFMPEG
would. DirectShow allows CODECs to have numeric
priority codes assigned (bias), and a third-party CODEC
that does the same job as an MS CODEC, if the bias was
set high, the constructed playback graph would stop
using the MS Codec and use the third party one. You could
have three MPEG2 decoders from their different CODEC packs,
and the bias value would decide which one "wins" and is used.

Generally, the third-party CODEC method is filled with
the potential for "land mines", due to how it is
constructed.

So when you're trying your two test cases (VLC versus WMP),
remember that their subsystems are separate from one another.
If both showed the exact same symptoms, that would mean a problem
with the content.

With FFPLAY, you can control which streams are used.

ffplay -ast 2 -vst 3 -x 704 -y 480 some.wtv

On two of my local TV channels, the stream numbers differ by one.
The second channel might be like this.

ffplay -ast 3 -vst 4 -x 704 -y 480 some.wtv

The recording software doesn't have to interfere with the
recording process. AFAIK, the baffling stream collection,
is being sent from the station itself, and Windows Media Center isn't
transcoding or "interpolating" something for you. But when you use
FFMPEG, you have the option of picking specific streams and
copying the content into a separate file.

Paul
  #4  
Old September 22nd 17, 10:19 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
NY
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 586
Default Random Step Forward/skip/fast forward delays win7 VLC .wtv files

"VanguardLH" wrote in message
...
WTV (Windows Recorded TV Show) is a Microsoft proprietary file format.
It is a container using MPEG-2 compression and audio uses either MPEG-1
Layer 2 or Dolby Digital AC-3 compression. It may contain metadata
along with DRM (Digital Rights Management) control. If the show
contained ads, they might use DRM to make sure you see them when you
play the show so you cannot simply skip past them. If you are recording
shows using Windows Media Center, it uses the SBE (Stream Buffer Engine)
to create the .wtv file. Because you are capturing streamed media from
a server, quality can vary wildly and what the server delivers can
change if you re-stream later. WMC can be converted back to the older
.dvr-ms proprietary format but I don't know that will progressing
forward or backward regarding quality of content or resolve your
problem. Note: Microsoft abandoned the WTV media file format which
irritated many users encouraged by WMC to create WTV files. Since WMC
was intended as the only player for WTV files, and since WMC got dropped
by Microsoft in Windows 10, it's an orphaned media format. I went to
wiki.videolan.org and search on "wtv". Looks like it hasn't even been
mentioned since 2015 (and that was only to propose a mentor, or
proponent, of the media format to add support for it).


The one big advantage that WTV and DVR-MS formats have over TS (the default
for most other recording software) is that it contains metadata for the
episode title, plot summary etc. Software that records to TS (*) doesn't do
this (maybe the TS standard doesn't allow metadata) so they solve the
problem by producing a separate XML file for the metadata, which means if
you rename the TS file you have to rename the XML to keep things together.

It's a shame that Win10 doesn't include Windows Media Centre (and that if
you update from Win 7, WMC is forcibly removed) because it was a good
program, even if it didn't allow multiple overlapping recordings on the same
multiplex which Next PVR does.



(*) eg NextPVR

  #5  
Old September 24th 17, 12:18 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
mike[_10_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,073
Default Random Step Forward/skip/fast forward delays win7 VLC .wtv files

On 9/22/2017 2:19 AM, NY wrote:
"VanguardLH" wrote in message
...
WTV (Windows Recorded TV Show) is a Microsoft proprietary file format.
It is a container using MPEG-2 compression and audio uses either MPEG-1
Layer 2 or Dolby Digital AC-3 compression. It may contain metadata
along with DRM (Digital Rights Management) control. If the show
contained ads, they might use DRM to make sure you see them when you
play the show so you cannot simply skip past them. If you are recording
shows using Windows Media Center, it uses the SBE (Stream Buffer Engine)
to create the .wtv file. Because you are capturing streamed media from
a server, quality can vary wildly and what the server delivers can
change if you re-stream later. WMC can be converted back to the older
.dvr-ms proprietary format but I don't know that will progressing
forward or backward regarding quality of content or resolve your
problem. Note: Microsoft abandoned the WTV media file format which
irritated many users encouraged by WMC to create WTV files. Since WMC
was intended as the only player for WTV files, and since WMC got dropped
by Microsoft in Windows 10, it's an orphaned media format. I went to
wiki.videolan.org and search on "wtv". Looks like it hasn't even been
mentioned since 2015 (and that was only to propose a mentor, or
proponent, of the media format to add support for it).


The one big advantage that WTV and DVR-MS formats have over TS (the
default for most other recording software) is that it contains metadata
for the episode title, plot summary etc. Software that records to TS (*)
doesn't do this (maybe the TS standard doesn't allow metadata) so they
solve the problem by producing a separate XML file for the metadata,
which means if you rename the TS file you have to rename the XML to keep
things together.

It's a shame that Win10 doesn't include Windows Media Centre (and that
if you update from Win 7, WMC is forcibly removed) because it was a good
program, even if it didn't allow multiple overlapping recordings on the
same multiplex which Next PVR does.



(*) eg NextPVR

Thanks, guys, for the inputs.
Summary...
I had a system that worked.
It's now broke.
I did my best to reload it the way it was.
I never installed any updates.
Repeating that and expecting a different result is
optimistic.
I doubt that it's the fault of any program. It's likely
an error in misconfiguration.

I have a second identical computer. I replaced some caps and it
now works. I think I'll have the option to go thru a lot of configuration
files pre and post rebuild to look for differences. I can diddle
it without messing up my active media computer.

The reason for media center is that it just works.
The interface is intuitive.
Tuner drivers exist for windows.
The issues with Rovi are minor compared to alternative
FREE program guides for USA ATSC broadcasts.
If you're time-shifting, the file size is irrelevant.
..wtv files seem to have fewer motion artifacts than
alternative compressed formats.
It just works...if you don't fork it up rebuilding the system.
  #6  
Old September 24th 17, 02:37 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
NY
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 586
Default Random Step Forward/skip/fast forward delays win7 VLC .wtv files

"mike" wrote in message
news
.wtv files seem to have fewer motion artifacts than
alternative compressed formats.


I'd have though that all off-air recordings, in DVR-MS, WTV and TS formats,
would be identical apart from the wrapper around the data. So I'd have
expected the same degree of motion and JPEG compression artefacts.

It just works...if you don't fork it up rebuilding the system.


Or if MS to fork it up for you by removing WMC if you upgrade to W10.


I agree that WMC has a nice UI, and seems to work with all devices that I've
tried. I've not tried it with multiple tuners, mainly because of cowardice:
I didn't want to mess up a system that was working well with one tuner.

WMC's only frustration is that you cannot schedule two overlapping
recordings *even if they are on the same multiplex*.

It has that advantage over NextPVR that you can ask it to look for
programmes that are not yet listed in the EPG: you can say (effectively)
"look out for the movie XYZ or the TV series ABC if it happens to the
scheduled any time in the future" whereas with Next PVR you can only
schedule programmes that are in the EPG (or add a manual LCN, date, times
recording).

  #7  
Old September 25th 17, 10:38 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
mike[_10_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,073
Default Random Step Forward/skip/fast forward delays win7 VLC .wtv files

On 9/24/2017 6:37 AM, NY wrote:
"mike" wrote in message
news
.wtv files seem to have fewer motion artifacts than
alternative compressed formats.


I'd have though that all off-air recordings, in DVR-MS, WTV and TS
formats, would be identical apart from the wrapper around the data. So
I'd have expected the same degree of motion and JPEG compression artefacts.


I think the point is that .wtv files aren't compressed. That's why they're
so huge. The off-air data just gets shoved onto the drive.
If you use some other storage format, it takes a lot of horsepower to get
the video onto the hard drive...and back off again.
I can record 4 channels and play a .wtv recording simultaneously with a
2.8GHZ dual core pentium. Virtually all the horsepower is consumed
by rendering the video.

The reduction in artifacts is due to the lack of compression.
I think the limit is the disk drive bandwidth. When the system is
busy, I sometimes see major pixellation on a scene change, but it
recovers quickly and the frame skip is pretty effective.

Only complaint I have is that I messed something up and can't seamlessly
skip forward any more.

It just works...if you don't fork it up rebuilding the system.


Or if MS to fork it up for you by removing WMC if you upgrade to W10.

That ain't gonna happen until there's something that I absolutely,
positively,
have to have that only works in win10. I've put the free upgrade on 18
systems justincase...but they are mostly reverted to win7.


I agree that WMC has a nice UI, and seems to work with all devices that
I've tried. I've not tried it with multiple tuners, mainly because of
cowardice: I didn't want to mess up a system that was working well with
one tuner.

If it works with either tuner, it should work with both. I have seen
reports
that you may have problems if you have two tuners that are exactly the same
so that the system can't tell which is which.

WMC's only frustration is that you cannot schedule two overlapping
recordings *even if they are on the same multiplex*.


Don't understand what that means. If you have only one tuner, how
could you record more than one stream? With multiple tuners, I record
overlapping broadcasts just fine.

It has that advantage over NextPVR that you can ask it to look for
programmes that are not yet listed in the EPG: you can say (effectively)
"look out for the movie XYZ or the TV series ABC if it happens to the
scheduled any time in the future" whereas with Next PVR you can only
schedule programmes that are in the EPG (or add a manual LCN, date,
times recording).

Tell me more. I haven't found ANY alternative FREE EPG that works on
US broadcasts.
But, that deficiency would make it a no-starter anyway.

  #8  
Old September 25th 17, 12:11 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
J. P. Gilliver (John)[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,679
Default Random Step Forward/skip/fast forward delays win7 VLC .wtv files

In message , mike
writes:
[]
an error in misconfiguration.

[]
As opposed to correct misconfiguration ... (-:
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Parkinson: "What caused your conversion to women - was it the love of a good
one?" George Melly: "No the love of several bad ones" (Lizbuff in UMRA
'01-4-25)
  #9  
Old September 25th 17, 03:34 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Char Jackson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,449
Default Random Step Forward/skip/fast forward delays win7 VLC .wtv files

On Mon, 25 Sep 2017 02:38:06 -0700, mike wrote:

On 9/24/2017 6:37 AM, NY wrote:
"mike" wrote in message
news
.wtv files seem to have fewer motion artifacts than
alternative compressed formats.


I'd have though that all off-air recordings, in DVR-MS, WTV and TS
formats, would be identical apart from the wrapper around the data. So
I'd have expected the same degree of motion and JPEG compression artefacts.


I think the point is that .wtv files aren't compressed. That's why they're
so huge. The off-air data just gets shoved onto the drive.
If you use some other storage format, it takes a lot of horsepower to get
the video onto the hard drive...and back off again.
I can record 4 channels and play a .wtv recording simultaneously with a
2.8GHZ dual core pentium. Virtually all the horsepower is consumed
by rendering the video.

The reduction in artifacts is due to the lack of compression.
I think the limit is the disk drive bandwidth. When the system is
busy, I sometimes see major pixellation on a scene change, but it
recovers quickly and the frame skip is pretty effective.

Only complaint I have is that I messed something up and can't seamlessly
skip forward any more.


Have you tried another player, something other than VLC and WMP? I've
tried VLC a few times over the years and it has always been prone to
crashes, so my preferred player is MPC-HC.

Here's a comparison of VLC versus MPC-HC, one of many:
https://www.techhive.com/article/2892383/which-is-the-better-free-video-player-mpc-hc-176-vs-vlc-22.html

The latest release of MPC-HC might be the last, but I'll use it until it
no longer works.
https://mpc-hc.org/2017/07/16/1.7.13...-and-farewell/

Get MPC-HC he
https://mpc-hc.org/downloads/


--

Char Jackson
  #10  
Old September 25th 17, 10:43 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11,873
Default Random Step Forward/skip/fast forward delays win7 VLC .wtv files

mike wrote:
On 9/24/2017 6:37 AM, NY wrote:
"mike" wrote in message
news
.wtv files seem to have fewer motion artifacts than
alternative compressed formats.


I'd have though that all off-air recordings, in DVR-MS, WTV and TS
formats, would be identical apart from the wrapper around the data. So
I'd have expected the same degree of motion and JPEG compression
artefacts.


I think the point is that .wtv files aren't compressed. That's why they're
so huge. The off-air data just gets shoved onto the drive.
If you use some other storage format, it takes a lot of horsepower to get
the video onto the hard drive...and back off again.
I can record 4 channels and play a .wtv recording simultaneously with a
2.8GHZ dual core pentium. Virtually all the horsepower is consumed
by rendering the video.

The reduction in artifacts is due to the lack of compression.
I think the limit is the disk drive bandwidth. When the system is
busy, I sometimes see major pixellation on a scene change, but it
recovers quickly and the frame skip is pretty effective.

Only complaint I have is that I messed something up and can't seamlessly
skip forward any more.


You have a strange model of what .wtv is doing.

This is just a paste of the teaser description from a Google search.
This is what my OTA reception here would be using.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8VSB

Throughput.

In the 6 MHz (megahertz) channel used for broadcast ATSC, 8VSB
carries a symbol rate of 10.76 megabaud, a gross bit rate of 32 Mbit/s,
and a net bit rate of 19.39 Mbit/s of usable data.

Using FFMPEG (ffplay), let's dump a .wtv recorded on my Hauppauge
DTV card. This to me, looks more or less like the TV station packet
stream has been put in a file, without re-encoding. The total
bitrate of all streams staying within the 8VSB bounds. This would
amount to 7 to 8GB per hour.
...
WM/WMRVExpirationSpan: 9223372036854775807
WM/WMRVInBandRatingSystem: 255
WM/WMRVInBandRatingLevel: 255
WM/WMRVInBandRatingAttributes: 0
WM/WMRVWatched : false
WM/MediaThumbWidth: 352
WM/MediaThumbHeight: 198
WM/MediaThumbStride: 1056
WM/MediaThumbRet: 0
WM/MediaThumbRatingSystem: 255
WM/MediaThumbRatingLevel: 255
WM/MediaThumbRatingAttributes: 0
WM/MediaThumbAspectRatioX: 16
WM/MediaThumbAspectRatioY: 9
WM/MediaThumbTimeStamp: 4643469047485227351
Duration: 00:37:57.13, start: 1.405622, bitrate: 18047 kb/s
Stream #0:0[0x2f](eng): Audio: ac3, 48000 Hz, 5.1(side), fltp, 384 kb/s
Stream #0:1[0x30](enm): Audio: ac3, 48000 Hz, stereo, fltp, 192 kb/s (visual impaired)
Stream #0:2[0x31](eng): Audio: ac3, 48000 Hz, stereo, fltp, 192 kb/s
Stream #0:3[0x32]: Video: mpeg2video, yuv420p(tv),
704x480, 16999 kb/s, 29.97 fps, 29.97 tbr, 10000k tbn, 59.94 tbc --- video
Stream #0:4[0x33]: Subtitle: eia_608
Stream #0:5[0xffffffff]: Video: mjpeg, yuvj420p(pc, bt470bg/unknown/unknown),
200x113 [SAR 96:96 DAR 200:113], 90k tbr, 90k tbn, 90k tbc
Metadata:
title : TV Thumbnail
No codec could be found with id 1664495672

You'll notice the bitrate of 18047 (goodput) stays with the transport 19390 limit.

I don't think there is any monkey business going on here at all!

And note that, if I change channels, there is a *different*
stream lineup. WMC is *not* defining the mix of streams. It's
taking the raw feed from the MPEG transport stream and dumping
it right into the file. This is another local channel. There is
one fewer audio stream here, so the stream numbers end up different.
The thumbnail and subtitle streams have switched places.

Duration: 01:04:56.91, start: 1.447051, bitrate: 16153 kb/s
Stream #0:0[0xc](eng): Audio: ac3, 48000 Hz, 5.1(side), fltp, 384 kb/s
Stream #0:1[0xd](enm): Audio: ac3, 48000 Hz, stereo, fltp, 192 kb/s (hearing impaired)
Stream #0:2[0xe]: Video: mpeg2video, yuv420p(tv),
704x480, max. 24000 kb/s, 29.97 fps, 29.97 tbr, 10000k tbn, 59.94 tbc
Stream #0:3[0xffffffff]: Video: mjpeg, yuvj420p(pc, bt470bg/unknown/unknown),
200x113 [SAR 96:96 DAR 200:113], 90k tbr, 90k tbn, 90k tbc
Metadata:
title : TV Thumbnail
Stream #0:4[0xf]: Subtitle: eia_608
No codec could be found with id 1664495672

*******

If you're seeing artifacts, your recording is damaged.

What happens to seek/skip on damaged content ? Hmmm.

Can you "fix" damaged content by re-encoding ? I'm not convinced.

And there is lots of damaged content out there. Download some
Microsoft BUILD video, and note how many errors the playback sees.
Lots of content is damaged, before you even get it.

I'm amazed at the DTV card I bought, compared to the STB I've used
previously. I don't know what the techie difference is, but this card
is a beast in terms of it's ability to pull a flawless stream out
of the pixel salad my STB (Zinwell) recovers. And right now,
they're running off a 1:2 splitter, using exactly the
same OTA signal. And the theory says it only takes 2dB of
process gain, to move from "flaky" to "flawless". The
waterfall is very sharp, and not at all like analog
TV was. The nice thing about analog, is you can be
so far out in fringe reception, the picture loses
sync and is snow, but you can still hear sound.
(That's how we used to get the news at the cottage.)
DTV won't do that. It would give a blue screen and
"Loss of Signal".

Paul
  #11  
Old September 26th 17, 08:55 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
mike[_10_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,073
Default Random Step Forward/skip/fast forward delays win7 VLC .wtv files

On 9/25/2017 7:34 AM, Char Jackson wrote:
On Mon, 25 Sep 2017 02:38:06 -0700, mike wrote:

On 9/24/2017 6:37 AM, NY wrote:
"mike" wrote in message
news .wtv files seem to have fewer motion artifacts than
alternative compressed formats.

I'd have though that all off-air recordings, in DVR-MS, WTV and TS
formats, would be identical apart from the wrapper around the data. So
I'd have expected the same degree of motion and JPEG compression artefacts.


I think the point is that .wtv files aren't compressed. That's why they're
so huge. The off-air data just gets shoved onto the drive.
If you use some other storage format, it takes a lot of horsepower to get
the video onto the hard drive...and back off again.
I can record 4 channels and play a .wtv recording simultaneously with a
2.8GHZ dual core pentium. Virtually all the horsepower is consumed
by rendering the video.

The reduction in artifacts is due to the lack of compression.
I think the limit is the disk drive bandwidth. When the system is
busy, I sometimes see major pixellation on a scene change, but it
recovers quickly and the frame skip is pretty effective.

Only complaint I have is that I messed something up and can't seamlessly
skip forward any more.


Have you tried another player, something other than VLC and WMP? I've
tried VLC a few times over the years and it has always been prone to
crashes, so my preferred player is MPC-HC.

Here's a comparison of VLC versus MPC-HC, one of many:
https://www.techhive.com/article/2892383/which-is-the-better-free-video-player-mpc-hc-176-vs-vlc-22.html

The latest release of MPC-HC might be the last, but I'll use it until it
no longer works.
https://mpc-hc.org/2017/07/16/1.7.13...-and-farewell/

Get MPC-HC he
https://mpc-hc.org/downloads/


from the review:
This was a tough call. Both players play normal speed and allow you to
skip anywhere you want in the material. But VLC has more granular speed
control; smoother slow speed playback; it stretches/compresses audio to
retain the original pitch, instead of simply speeding it up or down as
MPC-HC does;

That's a deal-breaker. The primary reason I want VLC is to play back
..wtv files at 1.7-2x speed depending on the material.
  #12  
Old September 26th 17, 09:20 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
mike[_10_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,073
Default Random Step Forward/skip/fast forward delays win7 VLC .wtv files

On 9/25/2017 2:43 PM, Paul wrote:
mike wrote:
On 9/24/2017 6:37 AM, NY wrote:
"mike" wrote in message
news .wtv files seem to have fewer motion artifacts than
alternative compressed formats.

I'd have though that all off-air recordings, in DVR-MS, WTV and TS
formats, would be identical apart from the wrapper around the data. So
I'd have expected the same degree of motion and JPEG compression
artefacts.


I think the point is that .wtv files aren't compressed. That's why
they're
so huge. The off-air data just gets shoved onto the drive.
If you use some other storage format, it takes a lot of horsepower to get
the video onto the hard drive...and back off again.
I can record 4 channels and play a .wtv recording simultaneously with a
2.8GHZ dual core pentium. Virtually all the horsepower is consumed
by rendering the video.

The reduction in artifacts is due to the lack of compression.
I think the limit is the disk drive bandwidth. When the system is
busy, I sometimes see major pixellation on a scene change, but it
recovers quickly and the frame skip is pretty effective.

Only complaint I have is that I messed something up and can't seamlessly
skip forward any more.


You have a strange model of what .wtv is doing.


OK, let me use more words...
Additional compression by the tuner or computer is not required.
The bitrates/filesizes are much greater than what I've experienced
with other recording formats.

This is just a paste of the teaser description from a Google search.
This is what my OTA reception here would be using.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8VSB

Throughput.

In the 6 MHz (megahertz) channel used for broadcast ATSC, 8VSB
carries a symbol rate of 10.76 megabaud, a gross bit rate of 32 Mbit/s,
and a net bit rate of 19.39 Mbit/s of usable data.

Using FFMPEG (ffplay), let's dump a .wtv recorded on my Hauppauge
DTV card. This to me, looks more or less like the TV station packet
stream has been put in a file, without re-encoding. The total
bitrate of all streams staying within the 8VSB bounds. This would
amount to 7 to 8GB per hour.
...
WM/WMRVExpirationSpan: 9223372036854775807
WM/WMRVInBandRatingSystem: 255
WM/WMRVInBandRatingLevel: 255
WM/WMRVInBandRatingAttributes: 0
WM/WMRVWatched : false
WM/MediaThumbWidth: 352
WM/MediaThumbHeight: 198
WM/MediaThumbStride: 1056
WM/MediaThumbRet: 0
WM/MediaThumbRatingSystem: 255
WM/MediaThumbRatingLevel: 255
WM/MediaThumbRatingAttributes: 0
WM/MediaThumbAspectRatioX: 16
WM/MediaThumbAspectRatioY: 9
WM/MediaThumbTimeStamp: 4643469047485227351
Duration: 00:37:57.13, start: 1.405622, bitrate: 18047 kb/s
Stream #0:0[0x2f](eng): Audio: ac3, 48000 Hz, 5.1(side), fltp, 384
kb/s
Stream #0:1[0x30](enm): Audio: ac3, 48000 Hz, stereo, fltp, 192
kb/s (visual impaired)
Stream #0:2[0x31](eng): Audio: ac3, 48000 Hz, stereo, fltp, 192 kb/s
Stream #0:3[0x32]: Video: mpeg2video, yuv420p(tv),
704x480, 16999 kb/s, 29.97 fps, 29.97 tbr,


704x1080
Isn't .wtv more than twice that?

10000k tbn, 59.94 tbc --- video
Stream #0:4[0x33]: Subtitle: eia_608
Stream #0:5[0xffffffff]: Video: mjpeg, yuvj420p(pc,
bt470bg/unknown/unknown),
200x113 [SAR 96:96 DAR 200:113], 90k tbr,
90k tbn, 90k tbc
Metadata:
title : TV Thumbnail
No codec could be found with id 1664495672

You'll notice the bitrate of 18047 (goodput) stays with the transport
19390 limit.

I don't think there is any monkey business going on here at all!

And note that, if I change channels, there is a *different*
stream lineup. WMC is *not* defining the mix of streams. It's
taking the raw feed from the MPEG transport stream and dumping
it right into the file. This is another local channel. There is
one fewer audio stream here, so the stream numbers end up different.
The thumbnail and subtitle streams have switched places.


Yep, that's annoying. I frequently have to choose a different audio
stream when I play a different recording with VLC.

Duration: 01:04:56.91, start: 1.447051, bitrate: 16153 kb/s
Stream #0:0[0xc](eng): Audio: ac3, 48000 Hz, 5.1(side), fltp, 384 kb/s
Stream #0:1[0xd](enm): Audio: ac3, 48000 Hz, stereo, fltp, 192 kb/s
(hearing impaired)
Stream #0:2[0xe]: Video: mpeg2video, yuv420p(tv),
704x480, max. 24000 kb/s, 29.97 fps, 29.97 tbr,
10000k tbn, 59.94 tbc
Stream #0:3[0xffffffff]: Video: mjpeg, yuvj420p(pc,
bt470bg/unknown/unknown),
200x113 [SAR 96:96 DAR 200:113], 90k tbr,
90k tbn, 90k tbc
Metadata:
title : TV Thumbnail
Stream #0:4[0xf]: Subtitle: eia_608
No codec could be found with id 1664495672

*******

If you're seeing artifacts, your recording is damaged.


Try this experiment where no recording is involved...just streaming.
The content is a football game.
Watch it on a cable source. Pick a scene where the player
is running and the camera is following him. Watch the BACKGROUND.
Watch the same play over ATSC over-the-air TV.
Compare the backgrounds.
This is an extreme case, but highlights the issue.
There are a huge number of pixels changing per frame.
The difference is quite noticeable to me. I wouldn't
call it a deal breaker. If the costs of ATSC vs Cable
were reversed, I'd settle for cable TV.

What happens to seek/skip on damaged content ? Hmmm.

Can you "fix" damaged content by re-encoding ? I'm not convinced.

And there is lots of damaged content out there. Download some
Microsoft BUILD video, and note how many errors the playback sees.
Lots of content is damaged, before you even get it.


Maybe, but you're fixated on damage. That's not the issue.
All my recordings play fine and skip forward fine via MediaCenter.
Same recordings play fine on VLC, but the skip forward works perfectly
sometimes and has huge lags other times. It's not entirely random.
Mostly a fresh recording plays in VLC without the skip issues.
After the system sleeps and records more stuff, the lag appears.
But, I also have some .wtv files recorded before the rebuild
They all play without the skip lag.
Kinda sounds like a buffering issue.
Something is funky in the new setup and I have no idea how to debug it.

I'm amazed at the DTV card I bought, compared to the STB I've used
previously. I don't know what the techie difference is, but this card
is a beast in terms of it's ability to pull a flawless stream out
of the pixel salad my STB (Zinwell) recovers. And right now,
they're running off a 1:2 splitter, using exactly the
same OTA signal. And the theory says it only takes 2dB of
process gain, to move from "flaky" to "flawless". The
waterfall is very sharp, and not at all like analog
TV was.

I built a 4-channel variable attenuator and adjusted the signal
strength for each card. Signal amplitude was quite critical.
AS tuners got better I was able to retire the attenuator.
Another big problem is multipath. If you're recording multiple
channels across multiple tuners with one fixed antenna direction,
things get messy really fast.

The nice thing about analog, is you can be
so far out in fringe reception, the picture loses
sync and is snow, but you can still hear sound.
(That's how we used to get the news at the cottage.)
DTV won't do that. It would give a blue screen and
"Loss of Signal".

Paul


  #13  
Old September 26th 17, 09:31 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
VanguardLH[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,881
Default Random Step Forward/skip/fast forward delays win7 VLC .wtv files

Char Jackson wrote:

Have you tried another player, something other than VLC and WMP? I've
tried VLC a few times over the years and it has always been prone to
crashes, so my preferred player is MPC-HC.

Here's a comparison of VLC versus MPC-HC, one of many:
https://www.techhive.com/article/2892383/which-is-the-better-free-video-player-mpc-hc-176-vs-vlc-22.html

The latest release of MPC-HC might be the last, but I'll use it until it
no longer works.
https://mpc-hc.org/2017/07/16/1.7.13...-and-farewell/

Get MPC-HC he
https://mpc-hc.org/downloads/


VLC does not use any codecs outside of its private libraries (DLL
files). It is an encapsulated player: it uses only the codecs from the
files stored within its install folder. The install of VLC does not
globally install the codecs (registry them) for use by any other
software, including VLC. Instead VLC uses a "private codec library".
As such, support of file formats is restricted to only those that VLC
chose to support (or those they chose to include that were written by
someone else). As such, you can install VLC and it will perform the
same regarding file format support; i.e., you don't have to be concerned
about what codecs got registered in the OS on the host where you happen
to run VLC.

MPC uses whatever codecs have been registered in the OS. It comes as
part of the Klite Codec Pack. That pack installs its codecs into the
global library by registering them in the OS. That means MPC and any
other app (that uses the globally registered codec and which excludes
VLC) can use all those codecs. The Klite Codec Pack has more codecs
than does VLC and why MPC can play more formats.

However, there are features missing in MPC that are available in VLC.
For example, I can customize VLC's GUI as to what tools I want showing
in its toolbar(s) (and where I can have 1, 2, or more toolbars). In
VLC, it has a tool that allows repeating playback of media at set points
that I can select - not just replay the entire video but just looping
from the A and B set points that I define. Are those features available
in MPC? From https://trac.mpc-hc.org/wiki/Manual, I cannot tell what
MPC has for features because that page is broken. What looks intended
to be links to redirect to articles or expand a section in the document
do not work. I just see text. Instead of using linked text strings,
they have a tiny almost invisible link hotspot at the right-end of the
text. When I hover the mouse over that, it turns into an icon
representing a clickable link. I click on it and nothing happens. When
I look at the object's code, it is an anchor that points to itself;
i.e., it doesn't do anything. I am blocking nothing on that page.
Looks like they never got around to providing documentation.

As for VLC getting stuck in a loop and hard to break often requiring
killing it, that's because of a flaw in the codec. Users think codecs
are some magic to understand the formatting in a media file. Codecs are
*code*, just like VLC, MPC, or other apps are code. That's why codecs
can be dangerous, like harboring malware, so installing or using them
should be handled just like executing any .exe, .com, .bin, .sys, or
other executable file. These same users don't realize that screensavers
are *code*. If the code is flawed then unwanted behavior occurs. Looks
like VLC expects the codecs in its private libs to work while MPC
probably does some response check to make sure the code progresses
properly instead of looping or for indefinite waits. I suspect MPC won
out because the codec its uses, like those installed by Klite, are
either better coded or there are more of them to cover a larger subset
of all audio and video file formats.

More often which is better is not by how many codecs a player will
support (which could be determine by which codecs have gotten registered
in the OS or which are included in a private library) but by the
features of the player. Either method of providing codecs often results
in covering most file formats that users will encounter. So it's the
player features that mostly count. MPC-HC is penned a lightweight
player which means it won't have a ton of features. VLC is a heavier
weight player meaning it has more features.

Of course, you could have both players and pick whichever performs the
job better and has the features you want at the time. Klite installs
the codecs so they're globally available, even to WMP, and its installer
includes MPC (you can opt-in or opt-out). I used to opt-in an include
MPC-HC in the install of Klite; however, after several years of doing so
but never using MPC-HC, I decided in later updates of Klite not to
bother including MPC-HC.
  #14  
Old September 26th 17, 10:48 PM posted to alt.windows7.general
Paul[_32_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11,873
Default Random Step Forward/skip/fast forward delays win7 VLC .wtv files

mike wrote:


Maybe, but you're fixated on damage.


I narrowed it down a bit.

ffmpeg -i C:\input.wtv -map 0:3 -vcodec copy D:\output.wtv

vlc D:\output.wtv

The ffmpeg command in that example, is used to select streams
from the source WTV and copy them to the destination WTV.

The "map" command selects the streams, as identified when
you use ffplay

ffplay C:\input.wtv # Note stream numbers...
# Press control-c in Command Prompt, to quit

You will need to modify the above command (add parameters to it),
to "-map 0:2" for the audio stream, use "-acodec copy" to specify
just copying the audio stream. I didn't test that. I was actually
snipping out the video stream so I could run FFProbe on it.

And your TV station stream numbers will be different than mine.
My suspicion is, you'll see the audio streams at the lowest
stream number, and the video one is one-higher.

The above copied the single stream, at 1600 frames per second.
Basically as fast as the hard drive would go. The ffmpeg
operation preserves the WTV metadata, and does not re-compress
the stream. It's virtually unmodified, except stuff your
player will trip over, gets removed.

Then go test your FF and Reverse again. Mine is smoother here.

*******

This is some very quick feedback from FFprobe. This is
ATSC, 30 FPS progressive I would guess, and typically the
GOP is set at about half a second worth. I have some
other video here (VOB), where the GOP is 12 frames. This stuff
is 15 frames. The longest GOP value is around 600 (I tried
that for fun once while re-encoding something).

size=181380 --- I-frame?
size=21520
size=26452
size=54251
size=70900
size=70901
size=70901
size=70901 GOP=15 frame cadence
size=70901
size=70901
size=70901
size=70901
size=70900
size=70901
size=70901
size=177348 --- I-frame?
size=23804
size=25455

GSpot information tool, the frame checker in there, thinks
it is seeing more detail. The labeling FFprobe uses is a little
bit suspect. It's a very peculiar result, and maybe because
the video is talking-heads in a news broadcast. Movie video
would have some packets with smaller sizes than that (because
the frame to frame delta is quite small). Why is there a delta
of 70901 bytes between frames, on "talking heads" ?

Also, when it says a packet is 70900 bytes, I'm finding
the end of the packet has an all zeros section of substantial
size. Like the packet is being padded to maintain the
data rate. And I didn't think that sort of thing was necessary.
I doubt the presence of the zeros matters, because somewhere that
packet has a length field, and they might well be filling zeros
after the length has expired. I don't think other video I've looked
at, did it that way. There were long and short packets, and they
never had big zeroed sections in them.

Paul
  #15  
Old September 27th 17, 01:05 AM posted to alt.windows7.general
Char Jackson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,449
Default Random Step Forward/skip/fast forward delays win7 VLC .wtv files

On Tue, 26 Sep 2017 15:31:10 -0500, VanguardLH wrote:

Char Jackson wrote:

Have you tried another player, something other than VLC and WMP? I've
tried VLC a few times over the years and it has always been prone to
crashes, so my preferred player is MPC-HC.

Here's a comparison of VLC versus MPC-HC, one of many:
https://www.techhive.com/article/2892383/which-is-the-better-free-video-player-mpc-hc-176-vs-vlc-22.html

The latest release of MPC-HC might be the last, but I'll use it until it
no longer works.
https://mpc-hc.org/2017/07/16/1.7.13...-and-farewell/

Get MPC-HC he
https://mpc-hc.org/downloads/


VLC does not use any codecs outside of its private libraries snip

....
MPC uses whatever codecs have been registered in the OS. snip


Yes, I know, thanks.


--

Char Jackson
 




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