Poor "Snit"

Peter Köhlmann wrote:

nospam wrote:

the real question is why anyone would willingly do that because by
doing so, they won't be able to use the vast amount of mac/windows
software that is not available in linux. it's a downgrade.

Whereas windows or Mac will never run more than a small part of linux
software. The little bit which is ported makes only a small portion of the
available software

It's an example of the closed, unimaginative mindset so typical of a
Mac fan. He can't think of any reason why anyone would need more
freedom.

--
"Apple knew when you "point to something", you used "1" finger, not
two, so the correct way is "1" button." - Oxtard

In article , Peter Köhlmann
wrote:

Some DEs do not have the New Folder hot key work on the desktop and
if you go fast with your pressing of hot keys they can get
"confused". Others, such
as most Gnome based ones, handle it better. But here is the issue
that was being discussed:

'tis the beauty of Linux. Don't like that DE, then pick another to
suit you. That is in contrast to MS or Apple where you are stuck with
whatever they tell you to have.

wrong.

How so?

neither apple nor microsoft stop anyone from running whatever they want.

Wrong

not wrong.

macos is unix under the hood and win10 has a bash shell which even
supports linux binaries. xwindows runs under it, as well as plenty
more.

Wrong again. The "windows bash shell" (as half assed as it is) will *never*
be able to "support" linux binaries. Those will not run under windows, no
matter what.

nonsense. it's not half-assed and supports linux binaries.

https://www.hanselman.com/blog/Devel...ndUsermodeUbun
tuLinuxBinariesOnWindows10.aspx
This isn't Bash or Ubuntu running in a VM. This is a real native Bash
Linux binary running on Windows itself. It's fast and lightweight and
it's the real binaries. This is an genuine Ubuntu image on top of
Windows with all the Linux tools I use like awk, sed, grep, vi, etc.
It's fast and it's lightweight. The binaries are downloaded by you -
using apt-get - just as on Linux, because it is Linux. You can
apt-get and download other tools like Ruby, Redis, emacs, and on and
on. This is brilliant for developers that use a diverse set of tools
like me.

the real question is why anyone would willingly do that because by
doing so, they won't be able to use the vast amount of mac/windows
software that is not available in linux. it's a downgrade.

Whereas windows or Mac will never run more than a small part of linux
software. The little bit which is ported makes only a small portion of the
available software

all linux software runs perfectly fine on a mac with the lone exception
of non-portable apps that assumes stuff specific to linux. those same
apps won't run on a generic bsd box either. blame the authors of the
apps, not apple.

In article , chrisv
wrote:

the real question is why anyone would willingly do that because by
doing so, they won't be able to use the vast amount of mac/windows
software that is not available in linux. it's a downgrade.

Whereas windows or Mac will never run more than a small part of linux
software. The little bit which is ported makes only a small portion of the
available software

It's an example of the closed, unimaginative mindset so typical of a
Mac fan. He can't think of any reason why anyone would need more
freedom.

there is no lack of freedom on a mac. anyone can do whatever the hell
they want with it.

there's actually *more* freedom with a mac because a mac can natively
run all mac, windows, linux and bsd apps, the widest choice of any
platform.

nospam wrote:

In article , chrisv
wrote:

the real question is why anyone would willingly do that because by
doing so, they won't be able to use the vast amount of mac/windows
software that is not available in linux. it's a downgrade.

Whereas windows or Mac will never run more than a small part of linux
software. The little bit which is ported makes only a small portion of
the available software

It's an example of the closed, unimaginative mindset so typical of a
Mac fan. He can't think of any reason why anyone would need more
freedom.

there is no lack of freedom on a mac. anyone can do whatever the hell
they want with it.

Wrong. Anyone can do with it what apple allows him to do
When apple once again decides to drop support for existing third party
programs, as they have routinely done with new OSX versions, the users can't
do absolutely nothing about that

there's actually *more* freedom with a mac because a mac can natively
run all mac, windows, linux and bsd apps, the widest choice of any
platform.

The Mac can run only a very small subset of linux programs. And not *all* of
them. That is simply a lie

nospam wrote:

there's actually *more* freedom with a mac

LOL

For some idiot's definition of "freedom".

"I got more commercial apps! End of story!"

Sheesh.

--
'once more : nearly all the OSS application SW which runs on Linux
runs on Windows too. And a lot more exists for Windows only. Which is
more freedom? less or more "free" SW?' - "True Linux advocate"
Hadron Quark

In article , chrisv
wrote:


there's actually *more* freedom with a mac

LOL

For some idiot's definition of "freedom".

"I got more commercial apps! End of story!"

freedom to find and use the best tool for a given task.

being able to change your desktop environment doesn't get work done.

linux has the least choice of any platform. it's the most restrictive.
that's why even at free, it can't compete.

In article , Peter Köhlmann
wrote:

the real question is why anyone would willingly do that because by
doing so, they won't be able to use the vast amount of mac/windows
software that is not available in linux. it's a downgrade.

Whereas windows or Mac will never run more than a small part of linux
software. The little bit which is ported makes only a small portion of
the available software

It's an example of the closed, unimaginative mindset so typical of a
Mac fan. He can't think of any reason why anyone would need more
freedom.

there is no lack of freedom on a mac. anyone can do whatever the hell
they want with it.

Wrong. Anyone can do with it what apple allows him to do

nonsense. apple does not limit what someone can do in any way. the only
limits are that of the user.

When apple once again decides to drop support for existing third party
programs, as they have routinely done with new OSX versions, the users can't
do absolutely nothing about that

more nonsense.

third parties support their own apps. it's no different on mac than any
other platform.

there's actually *more* freedom with a mac because a mac can natively
run all mac, windows, linux and bsd apps, the widest choice of any
platform.

The Mac can run only a very small subset of linux programs. And not *all* of
them. That is simply a lie

nonsense again. the only apps that won't work are linux-specific, and
therefore not portable. they won't work on *bsd either.

nospam wrote:

that's why even at free

LOL Macboi flaunts his "logic" skills.

Are you certain that there is no other explanation, Macboi?

Well, morons need computers, too, and Apple serves them well. Nothing
wrong with that.

--
"Your 'explanations' are just excuses. Both Android and ChromeOS have
found markets. Linux on the desktop hasn't." - Lying Lloyd Parsons

In article , chrisv
wrote:


Well, morons need computers, too,

you being the perfect example of that.

On 4/21/17, 1:07 AM, in article , "Peter Köhlmann"
wrote:

nospam wrote:

In article , Jonathan N. Little
wrote:


Some DEs do not have the New Folder hot key work on the desktop and
if you go fast with your pressing of hot keys they can get
"confused". Others, such
as most Gnome based ones, handle it better. But here is the issue
that was being discussed:

'tis the beauty of Linux. Don't like that DE, then pick another to
suit you. That is in contrast to MS or Apple where you are stuck with
whatever they tell you to have.

wrong.

How so?

neither apple nor microsoft stop anyone from running whatever they want.

Wrong

What program do you think Apple or MS stops me from running? Be specific.

macos is unix under the hood and win10 has a bash shell which even
supports linux binaries. xwindows runs under it, as well as plenty
more.

Wrong again. The "windows bash shell" (as half assed as it is) will *never*
be able to "support" linux binaries. Those will not run under windows, no
matter what.

the real question is why anyone would willingly do that because by
doing so, they won't be able to use the vast amount of mac/windows
software that is not available in linux. it's a downgrade.

Whereas windows or Mac will never run more than a small part of linux
software. The little bit which is ported makes only a small portion of the
available software

Why not list some of the software, say, you run which does not run on a Mac?

Keep in mind I, and other Mac users, can easily run Windows and Linux in
virtual machines.


--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They cannot
use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel somehow
superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.

https://youtu.be/H4NW-Cqh308

On 4/21/17, 5:11 AM, in article ,
"chrisv" wrote:

Peter Köhlmann wrote:

nospam wrote:

the real question is why anyone would willingly do that because by
doing so, they won't be able to use the vast amount of mac/windows
software that is not available in linux. it's a downgrade.

Whereas windows or Mac will never run more than a small part of linux
software. The little bit which is ported makes only a small portion of the
available software

It's an example of the closed, unimaginative mindset so typical of a
Mac fan. He can't think of any reason why anyone would need more
freedom.

If you use Linux because of the license I get that. I find it great.

But let us not pretend that the license makes it where you can get your work
done better. As even Stallman says, if people used open source software
(which he insists on calling "Free") then there is a good chance you would
not be able to get as much done but he is OK with that.

--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They cannot
use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel somehow
superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.

https://youtu.be/H4NW-Cqh308

On 4/21/17, 7:13 AM, in article ,
"nospam" wrote:

In article , chrisv
wrote:

the real question is why anyone would willingly do that because by
doing so, they won't be able to use the vast amount of mac/windows
software that is not available in linux. it's a downgrade.

Whereas windows or Mac will never run more than a small part of linux
software. The little bit which is ported makes only a small portion of the
available software

It's an example of the closed, unimaginative mindset so typical of a
Mac fan. He can't think of any reason why anyone would need more
freedom.

there is no lack of freedom on a mac. anyone can do whatever the hell
they want with it.

there's actually *more* freedom with a mac because a mac can natively
run all mac, windows, linux and bsd apps, the widest choice of any
platform.

I see both points of view: on a Mac you cannot see the code to the OS. You
cannot change it. If I want to make it so I see 100 recent files and only 5
recent servers I cannot hack the OS and make that change and Apple does not
have that as an option. Even if you can find work-arounds, this is a
limitation.

Of course, almost nobody is going to make such changes. Say you do on KDE or
Gnome or whatever. You update and your change is likely gone and you have to
re-patch. Or your program stops working. But maybe you get lucky and it does
not. It is possible.

But that is minor. Look at the actual usage. What benefits does Linux grant?
What tasks are done better and fast and more efficiently? Not many.

One of the things the Linux users love to brag about it portability of
programs -- a program made for one distro will work the same on another and
even the same on other UNIX systems. This means, by design, the GOAL is to
make programs that work to the lowest common denominator.

As a specific example, look at LibreOffice on macOS and Linux (a program
which is not really done well on the Mac in the first place):

LibreOffice on the Mac:

* A saved status indicator. At a glance know if your file is
changed.

* Right-click on name in title bar to get full path to the file.
This is an "active" list: click on any part of the path to get
there.

* Proxy icon to allow for copies or aliases (links) from the open
window, or to allow you to drag the file to email it or drag it
to another program

* Access to your media browser to help select an image directly
from whatever category you want: moments, collections, years,
places, or albums.

* Terms and placement and hotkeys for quitting and preferences
which are consistent with the system.

* Help system where you can type the name of any menu command and
easily find it, even if in a submenu.

* Full screen system which ties into the system's full screen /
workspace manager

* Recent items from the launcher... and it works even if the file
has been renamed or moved (though it does not show the correct
name in that case, it does still open the file)

* Print to PDF to any program you want... for example converting
it to a PDF and sending it to a mail program or chat client or
the like.

* You can close all the windows and not have to have the start
screen as a place holder.

* It shows not just recent files but currently open files in the
launcher.

* If you copy from it then close the program you can still paste
elsewhere.

* In the system itself you can use QuickLook to view files (in the
Finder, Mail, etc.).

* Ties into the standard system Print and File dialogs

* Drag and drop installer, and program can be moved easily (though Linux has
it tying into its installation system so maybe this is not as big of a deal)

LibreOffice on Linux:

* Window widgets (things such as window shade and keeping the window
on top)

* Copy on select (a mixed blessing)

To use Linux means you accept such limitations, at least for now. Maybe
someday that will change (and I and others are supporting that while the
"advocates" push back against such progress).



--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They cannot
use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel somehow
superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.

https://youtu.be/H4NW-Cqh308

On 4/21/17, 7:19 AM, in article , "Peter Köhlmann"
wrote:

nospam wrote:

In article , chrisv
wrote:

the real question is why anyone would willingly do that because by
doing so, they won't be able to use the vast amount of mac/windows
software that is not available in linux. it's a downgrade.

Whereas windows or Mac will never run more than a small part of linux
software. The little bit which is ported makes only a small portion of
the available software

It's an example of the closed, unimaginative mindset so typical of a
Mac fan. He can't think of any reason why anyone would need more
freedom.

there is no lack of freedom on a mac. anyone can do whatever the hell
they want with it.

Wrong. Anyone can do with it what apple allows him to do
When apple once again decides to drop support for existing third party
programs, as they have routinely done with new OSX versions, the users can't
do absolutely nothing about that

Why not talk about some tasks where you think this allows Linux users to be
able to do things better? Show some examples.

And also keep in mind that when YOU have limited resources and you consider
your needs and even possible needs you bring with you not just one but TWO
Macs, and you leave your Linux machines behind:

Peter Köhlmann:
-----
The last days I prepared 2 OSX machines I intend to take with me
to Berlin, where I will stay for some weeks starting in about 10
days. Reason: Too much luggage, so I will take only a apple laptop
and a iMac instead of the full featured linux rig.
-----

To be fair you did later change your story and say you were not really using
"OSX" but were running Linux on those machines... but those are your exact
words, above. And when you have been faced with them in the past you claim I
am lying because you claim I neglected to talk about how you considered your
needs (though I had, of course).

there's actually *more* freedom with a mac because a mac can natively
run all mac, windows, linux and bsd apps, the widest choice of any
platform.

The Mac can run only a very small subset of linux programs. And not *all* of
them. That is simply a lie

Why not talk about some of the ways this impacts your work. Maybe even show
a video of the benefits you get.

--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They cannot
use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel somehow
superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.

https://youtu.be/H4NW-Cqh308

On 4/21/17, 7:19 AM, in article ,
"chrisv" wrote:

nospam wrote:

there's actually *more* freedom with a mac

LOL

For some idiot's definition of "freedom".

"I got more commercial apps! End of story!"

Sheesh.

It is actually about getting work done. Why not talk about some of the tasks
you think are done better on Linux. Show examples.

Or maybe you use Linux because you like the license and do NOT claim it
actually works better than the competition. If that is the case then I have
no issue with it.

--
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They cannot
use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel somehow
superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.

https://youtu.be/H4NW-Cqh308

On 2017-04-21 10:13 AM, nospam wrote:
In article , chrisv
wrote:

the real question is why anyone would willingly do that because by
doing so, they won't be able to use the vast amount of mac/windows
software that is not available in linux. it's a downgrade.

Whereas windows or Mac will never run more than a small part of linux
software. The little bit which is ported makes only a small portion of the
available software

It's an example of the closed, unimaginative mindset so typical of a
Mac fan. He can't think of any reason why anyone would need more
freedom.

there is no lack of freedom on a mac. anyone can do whatever the hell
they want with it.

there's actually *more* freedom with a mac because a mac can natively
run all mac, windows, linux and bsd apps, the widest choice of any
platform.

He's referring to the freedom to choose your GUI as well as how the GUI
will function. Linux users have that, Mac users don't.


--
Silver Slimer
OpenMedia & EFF Member
Gab.ai: @silverslimer