Technical & legal background using copyrighted fonts in custom road signs in PowerPoint

On Sun, 10 Sep 2017 12:29:22 -0400, Alan Browne
wrote:

Troll confirmation.

Dude. You're the troll here, you Alan Browne moron!
Plonk!

On 2017-09-10 13:01, Dan Jenkins wrote:
On Sun, 10 Sep 2017 12:29:22 -0400,Â* Alan Browne
wrote:

Troll confirmation.

Dude. You're the troll here, you Alan Browne moron!

ROFL!

Chaya Eve wrote:
On Sun, 10 Sep 2017 06:32:21 -0400, Paul wrote:

http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/Typog...roperty21.aspx

Font properties extension 2.30

http://download.microsoft.com/downlo...9f5e/setup.exe

requirements - Windows XP or later (32-bit only)
use - 'Right click' on a font file (TrueType or OpenType)
and choose properties from the menu.

Example:

https://s26.postimg.org/9nskxef21/Mi..._Extension.gif

It looks like the license info is right in the TTF file, but without
the properties extension, may not be (normally) visible in Windows.

Hi Paul,

How the heck did you get that extension to work on Windows 10?
http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/Typog...roperty21.aspx

I had already tested that "Microsoft Font properties extension, version
2.30" shell extension on Windows 10, where it did absolutely nothing, even
after a reboot.

This is your result on Windows 10 on the Roadgeek font:
https://s26.postimg.org/9nskxef21/Mi..._Extension.gif

This is my result on Windows 10 on the Roadgeek font:
http://wetakepic.com/images/2017/09/10/roadsign_1.png

How the heck did you get the Microsoft font properties extension to work?

I tested it on WinXP SP3, because I wanted it to work :-)

For starters, it's 32 bit. Did you test it on Win10 32 bit ?
Not too many people run the 32-bit version. And that still
doesn't *guarantee* it's going to work. I don't think
the Microsoft Typography department gets paid to keep
that working, so it's YMMV as far as that goes.

https://s26.postimg.org/esit5ktyx/wo..._win10_x86.gif

*******

If you run Virustotal on the file, you can get some
similar info in the "Details" tab.

https://www.virustotal.com/#/file/f7...eced00/details

CompatibleFontName Roadgeek 2005 Series 3B

License This font may be freely distributed and
used provided copyright notifications
remain intact

But that method doesn't spell out the details in
quite the same way as the Microsoft method.

Paul

On Sun, 10 Sep 2017 13:47:02 -0400, Paul wrote:

I tested it on WinXP SP3, because I wanted it to work :-)

For starters, it's 32 bit. Did you test it on Win10 32 bit ?

I hear you.
I tested on 64-bit Win10.
It didn't work.

I'm glad it worked on 32-bit WinXP though, so we know what it does.
Thanks.

On 9/9/2017 11:37 PM, ATANARJUAT wrote:
On Sat, 9 Sep 2017 18:37:51 -0400, PeterN wrote
in response to PeterN

Pay a good lawyer, who specializes in copyright issues. While in general
you may sometimes get common sense answers, there is more to legality
than good faith.

That's the dumbest answer anyone gave here yet.

Here's a similar platitude for you.

If someone asks how to tie their shoelaces, tell them that it can only be
done at the dealer by a professional trained in tying shoelaces.


Good to know you are an expert.

--
PeterN

On Sun, 10 Sep 2017 16:51:12 -0400, PeterN wrote
in response to PeterN

Good to know you are an expert.

A platitude means you told him/her nothing everyone already didn't know.

The guy/gal is using a very common well known free font for God's sake.

It's clear to everyone reasonable but you that all he/she needs to do is
state the copyright when distributing the font with the document.

On 2017-09-10 08:50:00 +0000, Tim Streater said:
In article , Your Name
wrote:
On 2017-09-10 05:12:10 +0000, Tony Cooper said:
On Sun, 10 Sep 2017 16:48:46 +1200, Your Name
wrote:
On 2017-09-10 03:37:31 +0000, ATANARJUAT said:
On Sat, 9 Sep 2017 18:37:51 -0400, PeterN wrote
in response to PeterN

Pay a good lawyer, who specializes in copyright issues. While in general
you may sometimes get common sense answers, there is more to legality
than good faith.

That's the dumbest answer anyone gave here yet.

Here's a similar platitude for you.

If someone asks how to tie their shoelaces, tell them that it can only be
done at the dealer by a professional trained in tying shoelaces.

Or by many five year olds. ;-)

The five year-olds are too busy explaining how to take photos on their
phone to older people.

Not any more. Some busy-bodies stuck their noses in and now you have to
limit the amount of "screen time" kids have .. which pretty much
destroys the ideas of other busy-bodies who are trying to get "computer
coding" as a necessity in kindergartens and junior schools.

You don't learn "computer coding" by farting about on a phone.

I never said you did. I said that pushing for less "scrren time" is
contrary to the push for kids to learn coding ... although you can do
some of the planning for coding "offline".

Having said that, apps like Swift Playground are design exactly to
allow kids to learn coding by "farting about on a phone".

On 2017-09-10 13:34:13 +0000, Chaya Eve said:
On Sun, 10 Sep 2017 11:45:33 +0100, Andy Burns wrote:

It's a pain and it's ridiculous but there is no other viable option.

What's dictating that this should use powerpoint?

That's a good question, where if you have a better answer, I'm all ears.

You're right that it could just as well be Microsoft Word since what's
dictating the software is that there should be zero learning curve and it
should already be on everyone's system, both Mac & Windows.

Microsoft Office isn't guaranteed to be on everybody's computer.
Although it is bundled with many (but not all) Windows PCs, it's
certianly not a defult on Macs.



But what other slide oriented software do you know of that everyone already
has on their computer and that they are comfortable using that is
compatible on Mac & Windows?

There's nothing that is guranteed to be on every computer.

In article , Your Name
wrote:

It's a pain and it's ridiculous but there is no other viable option.

What's dictating that this should use powerpoint?

That's a good question, where if you have a better answer, I'm all ears.

You're right that it could just as well be Microsoft Word since what's
dictating the software is that there should be zero learning curve and it
should already be on everyone's system, both Mac & Windows.

Microsoft Office isn't guaranteed to be on everybody's computer.
Although it is bundled with many (but not all) Windows PCs, it's
certianly not a defult on Macs.

all macs can read microsoft office documents by default, and *without*
any additional third party software needed. it's part of mac os.

But what other slide oriented software do you know of that everyone already
has on their computer and that they are comfortable using that is
compatible on Mac & Windows?

There's nothing that is guranteed to be on every computer.

pdf.

On Mon, 11 Sep 2017 09:40:18 +1200, Your Name
wrote:


Microsoft Office isn't guaranteed to be on everybody's computer.
Although it is bundled with many (but not all) Windows PCs,


Actually it isn't. It used to be common, but it no longer is.

These days many Windows PCs come with a trial version of Microsoft
Office, but I wouldn't call that "bundling."

On 09/09/2017 21:34, nospam wrote:
In article , David B.
wrote:

We also know who you are.

https://www.mylife.com/...

no.

http://al.howardknight.net/msgid.cgi?ID=150508126500

--
“Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick
themselves up and hurry off as if nothing ever happened.� (Winston S.
Churchill)

In article , David B.
wrote:

We also know who you are.

https://www.mylife.com/...

no.

http://al.howardknight.net/..

no.

"Your Name" wrote

| There's nothing that is guranteed to be on every computer.
|

HTML. And fonts can be embedded, base 64 encoded.
There may be a size limit. I'm not sure about that.

MS Office is certainly not guaranteed. Many people have
MS Word, but typically it's only students and people who
work in offices. Fewer have Powerpoint.

I assumed it had to be Powerpoint. Why else would
anyone use such a limited format with such limited
support? But that's typical of people who use MS Office:
They're usually people who think their computer *is*
MS Office, so they assume *everyone* uses MS Office,
so even if they just need to save a phone number in
a text file they fire up MS Word and save it as a 100
KB DOC file.

In article ,
Chaya Eve wrote:

On Sun, 10 Sep 2017 10:53:02 -0400, Alan Browne
wrote:

Isn't there some included PowerPoint font that is usable and not
encumbered with copyright issues?

We want to teach these kids how to do the job right.

It's a good question because there are two kinds of people.
* Those who don't (and almost always can't) do a good job.
* Those who do the job right (which takes intelligence).
It takes attention to detail to do the job right.

It's a good question because there are two kinds of results.
* Results that are only useful for a single use.
* Results that are useful for all similar uses.
It takes intelligent thinking to optimize the results.

WHY does a sign-specific font exist?
* They are tested for readability under horrid lighting situations.
* The spacing & character sizes are optimized for short lines.
* The character selection (e.g., arrows) meets NHTSA standards.

However, as you noted, no sign font is perfect.

If you think choosing a font for signs is easy, then read this article:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/12/ma...12fonts-t.html

In summary, any idiot can easily do a crappy job.
It takes intelligence and attention to detail to do the job right.

We want to teach these kids how to do the job right.

I downloaded the font in question. If you want to teach the kids how to
'do the job right' this font is really not a good choice. The quality of
the outlines is horrible. Plus Mac OS already includes a well-designed
font specifically designed for signs (DIN), so why not just use that
instead?

Andre

--
To email remove 'invalid' & replace 'gm' with well known Google mail service.

"Your Name" wrote

| The five year-olds are too busy explaining how to take photos on their
| phone to older people.
|
| Not any more. Some busy-bodies stuck their noses in and now you have to
| limit the amount of "screen time" kids have .. which pretty much
| destroys the ideas of other busy-bodies who are trying to get "computer
| coding" as a necessity in kindergartens and junior schools.
|

I'd like to think that's true, but there are an awfully
lot of idiots who think the way to make kids intelligent
is to give them anything digital. I recently came across
one of those dawn-breaks-on-Marblehead studies where
some bright bulbs concluded that iPads alone don't
necessarily increase learning! And this week I came
across a very dangerous looking phenomenon:

https://xqsuperschool.org/

Their presentation is unreadable jargon about curing
the old-fashioned design of schools. It seems to be
connected to Bill Gates and his breathtakingly arrogant
drive to not only get MS products into schools but also
to tell educators how to teach. The fact that he knows
nothing about it doesn't deter him. He thinks he's a
genius who understands everything better than anyone
else.

It astonishes me that people might think a 5 year old
should use a computer when they're still learning to use
their senses and to relate to other people. It astonishes
me that anyone could be so simple-minded as to just
assume that more digital is more smart. I'd hate to be
raising kids these days. They're not brilliant with computers.
They're well trained by commercial interests to use
commercial services through digital media. It's no different
from kids a generation ago who never left the TV set.
And parents then thought their kids were geniuses because
they were so adept with the remote control. Now the
kids shop, play idiotic games and follow celebrity Twitter
accounts on digital devices their parents think it's STEM
education.