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#166
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With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It
In article
"Mayayana" wrote: "Jonathan N. Little" wrote | Okay? Who told you that with Linux updates are somehow "forced" upon | you? No one. You're not listening because your shrill reactiveness gets in the way. Someone said that Linux is handy because one can have it handle installs and updates with no fuss. I said I don't want that. I want to manage things for myself and I don't want it to be feasible for anything to go online that I didn't instigate. Capiche? I never said I thought Linux was spyware or that it forces updates. | Updates do fix *security* issues as well as bugs | and add feature enhancements. Yes. And I often install them when I think it's appropriate. You allow all of your software to call home and update itself, willy nilly? And you assume those updates are improvements? To my mind that's an unstable design and an indefensible way to build software. The idea is that it's not supposed to be beta when it's released, so it doesn't have to be fixed on a regular basis. I use a number of programs that are rarely if ever updated. And I don't install Windows patches until they've been time-tested, if at all. I'm still using a lot of things that are 20 years old. Paint Shop Pro 5. Visual Studio 6. Other things may be 10 years old. Some things update more frequently, but rarely with noticeable changes. Some things arguably get worse with updates, like Firefox and Internet Explorer. But I expect your view is that of the majority. The public has generally been trained to think that if they turn off the dripfeed they'll be infested with malware "before sundown". That's part of the marketing of the service model. |
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#167
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With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It
In article
"Jonathan N. Little" wrote: Mayayana wrote: "William Unruh" wrote | I have no problem with downloading but I | don't want web installs. In other words, I want to | manage the system and know what I'm changing. | I don't want auto-updates, web installs, or anything | that requires going online. The software is installed. | Unless it's something like a browser there's no | excuse for it going online. | | Again this paragraph makes no sense. You do not have all possible programs and | updates on you own computer. Ie, you have to get them from somewhere, and | nowadays that somewhere is the net. I have not idea how you would get an | update for say Word from anywhere but the net. Thus you have to go online to | install or update. Now you may not have meant what you said, but perhaps you | could say what you mean in that case. | I thought I explained it several times. Yes, I have to go online to download updates, service packs, etc. But I don't have to enable Windows Update or "web installers". In other words, there's no reason I should need to allow anything to call out. There's no reason I should have to trust Microsoft, Google, or a Linux "package manager" to communicate between my machine and a remote location. I run XP SP3 and Win7 SP1. Neither has ever had Windows Update enabled. Neither has any networking services running. Neither has anything running that needs to, or is allowed to, go online -- aside from the obvious things like browser, email, FTP, etc that go online because I acted to make them do that. What's so hard to understand? I want to manage the system myself. I don't want to enable some unknown quantity to make unilateral decisions that change the system. I don't regard auto-updating as a reasonable design idea and never enable it for any software. There's a difference between me running Firefox and allowing it to go out to port 80, as opposed to having an unknown, non-transparent process going out and communicating data that I'm not aware of or in control of. snip more nonsense Okay? Who told you that with Linux updates are somehow "forced" upon you? It is not Windows... You can install from a full DVD and uncheck download updates during setup and then set Software & Updates to check for update to *never*. Updates do fix *security* issues as well as bugs and add feature enhancements. If you don't want to update, not the wisest choice in my opinion, but more power to you. -- Take care, Jonathan ------------------- LITTLE WORKS STUDIO http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com |
#168
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With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It
Nomen Nescio wrote:
In article Chris wrote: The Natural Philosopher wrote: On 01/08/18 20:36, Chris wrote: William Unruh wrote: On 2018-08-01, The Natural Philosopher wrote: There is nothing a fleet of dispatchable nuclear power plants cannot do that cannot be done worse and more expensively and with higher carbon emissions and more adverse environmental impact by adding intermittent renewable energy. The problem is that the manufacturers/operators of nuclear power plants have proven themselves incompetent at safety. Fukushima (lets put the emergency power for water pumps in the basement). Chernobile (lets run tests and override the emergeny failsafes). And the consequences of unsafe operation are pretty devestating. No one's going argue that Chernobyl wasn't a disaster. Fukushima was hit by series of catastrophic events, one after the other, affecting multiple backup systems and yet the reactor still didn't breach. The plant failed as designed for the worst case scenario. I can't imagine anything surviving a huge earthquake, subsequent tsunami and failure of the cooling systems unscathed. Let's not forget the tsunami killed 15,000 people. No-one has died as result of the radiation leak from the fukushima accident. https://www.popularmechanics.com/sci...e-years-later/ https://xkcd.com/radiation/ So yes, your statement is OK, but it is a bit likethe anti-greenouse crowd. It's the opposite as it's based on fact . There is nothing that a bunch of coal fired plants cannot do more cheaply than any other source, until the consequences destroy civilisation. Unfortunately consequences, including those of incompetence, because incompetence is a fixed feature of the physica world, are things that need to be taken into account in making decisions. And yet despite even the Chernobyl disaster, nuclear has been shown to be safer, cleaner and better overall than fossil fuel based power plants. Fossil fuel is unsustainable, destroying the planet and killing people at an ever increasing pace. https://www.newscientist.com/article...nuclear-power/ If its in New Scientist, it's probably false. Not sure where you're getting that from, but here's another source if you prefer. There are others. https://cen.acs.org/articles/91/web/...hs-Causes.html 3D printed guns save lives. Ha ha ha! That's a good one. Have you got other gems? |
#169
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With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It
In article
William Unruh wrote: On 2018-08-02, Mayayana wrote: "Dan Purgert" wrote I have no problem with downloading but I don't want web installs. In other words, I want to manage the system and know what I'm changing. I don't want auto-updates, web installs, or anything that requires going online. The software is installed. Unless it's something like a browser there's no excuse for it going online. Again this paragraph makes no sense. You do not have all possible programs and updates on you own computer. Ie, you have to get them from somewhere, and nowadays that somewhere is the net. I have not idea how you would get an update for say Word from anywhere but the net. Thus you have to go online to install or update. Now you may not have meant what you said, but perhaps you could say what you mean in that case. | It gets complicated. Mostly I just mean that I want to be free of data file restrictions. But the same restrictions I have no idea what that means. Certainly in Linux if you created the data file, then you will have full rights to it. Ie, no restrictions. If the system created that data file, then there may or may not be restrictions, depending on what the data file is. An often you can get access if you place yourself into the appropriate group. root, bin, daemon, admin, wheel, lp, are some of the key possible groups. |
#170
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With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It
Welcome to Administrative Audit unit office
Address: 11th Floor Federal Secretariat, Central Business District FCT Abuja, Nigeria Attention my dear Beneficiary In the course of our investigation, your email address were shortlisted among the first fifteen individuals yet to be paid their overdue Re-compensation funds worth US$2,800,000.00.The Re-compensation funds been successfully accredited in your favor through BANK SWIFT CARD which you can withdraw in any ATM Machine World wide nearest to you. However, we received a Complained today from Mrs. Christina Morgan that you are dead. According to her, you died in Road accidents as such your Fund should be ship to her as the apparent heir. If we fail to hear from you after 48 hours, it will be assumed that the complains of Mrs.Morgan is true and the fund will be delivered to her without further delay. Contact the Director of Audit to verify this from the Administrative Audit unit. And all the necessary documents of the delivery will hands over to her immediately. If we fail to hear from you after 48 hours, and she also wanted to paid the delivery fee of the ATM DEBITS CARD right now but we told her that we will investigation the matters weather true or lie. To avoid undue delay or delivery the fund to wrong individual, we have decided to contact you for confirmation.Your personal information is also required immediately as below which will be needed for confirmations before we transfer the funds to her. (A) Full name......... (B) country........... (C) Residential address....... (D) Active Telephone numbers...... (E) YOUR ID........ (F) Ocupation.......... we are waiting to hear from you soon, if you are still alive. best Regards: Barr. Alberto Lancioli Director audit unit EMail: EMail: |
#171
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With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It
In article
William Unruh wrote: On 2018-08-03, Mayayana wrote: "Jonathan N. Little" wrote | Okay? Who told you that with Linux updates are somehow "forced" upon | you? No one. You're not listening because your shrill reactiveness gets in the way. Someone said that Linux is handy because one can have it handle installs and updates with no fuss. I said I don't You are not listening because your shrill reactiveness gets in the way Linux is handy because one can have it handle installs and updates with no fuss. I said I don't That is up to you. You can do what you want. Why is that such a difficult concept for you to grasp. want that. I want to manage things for myself and I don't want it to be feasible for anything to go online that I didn't instigate. Capiche? I never said I thought Linux was spyware or that it forces updates. | Updates do fix *security* issues as well as bugs | and add feature enhancements. Yes. And I often install them when I think it's appropriate. You allow all of your software to call home and update itself, willy nilly? And you assume those updates are improvements? He never said that. You are erecting straw men and then furiously attacking them. To my mind that's an unstable design and an indefensible way to build software. The idea is that it's not supposed to be beta when it's released, so it doesn't have to be fixed on a regular That may be true, but it is almost impossible to actually impliment. There are simply too many corner cases to all have been tested. Welcome to Administrative Audit unit office Address: 11th Floor Federal Secretariat, Central Business District FCT Abuja, Nigeria Attention my dear Beneficiary In the course of our investigation, your email address were shortlisted among the first fifteen individuals yet to be paid their overdue Re-compensation funds worth US$2,800,000.00.The Re-compensation funds been successfully accredited in your favor through BANK SWIFT CARD which you can withdraw in any ATM Machine World wide nearest to you. However, we received a Complained today from Mrs. Christina Morgan that you are dead. According to her, you died in Road accidents as such your Fund should be ship to her as the apparent heir. If we fail to hear from you after 48 hours, it will be assumed that the complains of Mrs.Morgan is true and the fund will be delivered to her without further delay. Contact the Director of Audit to verify this from the Administrative Audit unit. And all the necessary documents of the delivery will hands over to her immediately. If we fail to hear from you after 48 hours, and she also wanted to paid the delivery fee of the ATM DEBITS CARD right now but we told her that we will investigation the matters weather true or lie. To avoid undue delay or delivery the fund to wrong individual, we have decided to contact you for confirmation.Your personal information is also required immediately as below which will be needed for confirmations before we transfer the funds to her. (A) Full name......... (B) country........... (C) Residential address....... (D) Active Telephone numbers...... (E) YOUR ID........ (F) Ocupation.......... we are waiting to hear from you soon, if you are still alive. best Regards: Barr. Alberto Lancioli Director audit unit EMail: EMail: |
#172
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With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It
"Mayayana" writes:
So Linux isn't popular because people are dumb? Over the past decade or so I've seen a lot of people move to Macs. They're expensive, restricted and limited, but they have one thing that Windows doesn't: stability provided by control of the hardware. Macs are also designed to do whatever Lord Jobs thought you should want to do, without providing other options. They are general purpose computers, you can run anything you like on them. -- https://www.greenend.org.uk/rjk/ |
#173
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With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It
In article
"Jonathan N. Little" wrote: mike wrote: My issue with that is that it's not always a complete installation. The gui says it's installed. OK, where the hell is it? How to I envoke it. Why isn't there an icon on the desktop, or in the start menu-adjacent list? Well, depends on the program and the distro and...and. You shouldn't have to remember and type in a command line to bring up a GUI configuration tool. That is pure BS. If you install an application from the distro's respective software repository it will setup the respective shortcuts for the desktop environment. That's true for all the main DEs, GNOME, Unity, KDE, LXDE, Xfce... -- Take care, Jonathan ------------------- LITTLE WORKS STUDIO http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com |
#174
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With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It
Mayayana wrote:
"Caver1" wrote | You are stuck in a rut. Don't want to learn anything new.... | As a software engineer not using the | commandline is very limiting. | And I'm the one stuck in a rut? I write software. I don't use command line. Maybe writing software *on Linux* needs command line. Nah, you can use an IDE, such as VS: Code or Eclipse or whatever. -- |_|O|_| Registered Linux user #585947 |_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert |O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5 4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281 |
#175
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With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It
Mayayana wrote:
"mike" wrote | Gambas was to enable my transition to linux. | I'd hoped to convert my VB6 programs to Gambas. | Learning C was out of the question. | What I found was a lot of, "this feature not yet implemented." | Over the years it didn't get much better. Not enough | of what I needed. I explored a similar option with WINE. It was interesting how much worked in WINE. But the winos were not willing to share anything like an API list. They wanted me to register as a bug hunter for my software and herd the bug until it was resolved. I was surprised and taken aback by the paramilitary pecking order of the whole thing. All the more so because I was assigned to be a lowest-level lackey. So the upshot was that there was no way for me to write to WINE and thus no reason to deal with it at all. Because one does not write *for WINE*. It is a compatibility layer between Windows-only programs (e.g. those games you seem to dislike strongly), and Linux-based computers. Essentially, it provides the Microsoft ABIs that these programs need to run - although not perfectly; and not all of them. | I remember the days when you could just type a command. | In this week's linux install/configure attempts, | the majority of my keystrokes have been "sudo" and typing | my password, only to find that the command no longer exists | in this version of that distro with the other desktop. That's the other glaring problem with Linux. Win98 is still a viable OS if one wants to write to it. Most software still works on XP. Yet when I tried Suse I think the support cycle was either 12 or 18 months. Constant churn of updated libraries and kernel. Haven't ever used them (Suse), but most distributions have several release cycles: - "LTS" - a 5 year plan that more or less is on par with Microsoft and Apple. For example, WinXP was 2001, WinVista was 2006, Win7 was '09 (although, IIRC, that was because Vista was so hated), and so on. - "non LTS" - anywhere from 6 to 18 month release cycle. Essentially "beta" releases for the next LTS release. In my case, relegated to test VMs. - "Rolling Release" - you install whatever version, and it continually gets full updates every howevermany months. I personally don't like these types of distro. As for the "churn" of updated libraries (etc.) - Microsoft does the same thing with Windows Updates. The real big difference is that if a non-Microsoft program wants to update, it whines at you when you start ie (or has a taskbar thing that whines about an update -- e.g. Java); whereas Linux distros tend to use the same update manager for everything. -- |_|O|_| Registered Linux user #585947 |_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert |O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5 4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281 |
#176
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With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It
In article
Dan Purgert wrote: Mayayana wrote: "Caver1" wrote | You are stuck in a rut. Don't want to learn anything new.... | As a software engineer not using the | commandline is very limiting. | And I'm the one stuck in a rut? I write software. I don't use command line. Maybe writing software *on Linux* needs command line. Nah, you can use an IDE, such as VS: Code or Eclipse or whatever. -- |_|O|_| Registered Linux user #585947 |_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert |O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5 4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281 |
#177
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With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It
In article
"Jonathan N. Little" wrote: Mayayana wrote: "Jonathan N. Little" wrote | mike wrote: | My issue with that is that it's not always a complete installation. | The gui says it's installed. OK, where the hell is it? How to I | envoke it. Why isn't there an icon on the desktop, or in the start | menu-adjacent list? Well, depends on the program and the distro | and...and. You shouldn't have to remember and type in a command | line to bring up a GUI configuration tool. | | That is pure BS. You're very good at insulting people. Do you really think he's making that up just to annoy you? Just calling it what it is. Me specifically? No, but awfully tired of "Linux issues" that are just patently false. Just as false as when Linux users say you can delete C:\Windows while running Windows and trash your system. This is an example of another big Linux problem: Identifying with the product. A misplaced, emotional sense of loyalty. You think he's making up criticism. You think I'm a "Windows fanboy". You feel under attack because you identify with Linux. That's your trip. It's not ours. We just want to use computers. It's not a religious issue for us. I use both. Not religious either, just maters if what is stated it true or not. What you don't get is that Windows doesn't engender the kind of vehement loyalty that happens with Macs and Linux. Whoa! No Windows trolls in Linux NG? Windows is the Ford Taurus of cars. Mac is a sports car -- pretty but limited. Linux is a custom build. Can be, depends on the distro. Some are pre-canned to run OOTB like Ubuntu, Mint, and many others. And others are more niche specific, Scientific Linux comes to mind. Others more like kits such as Slack and LFS Linux From Scratch But Windows is just a Taurus. People don't start Ford Taurus fan clubs. No one's trying to beat your team. We don't have a team. Or more like Henry's vision of the Model T where you can get it in any color also long as it is black. -- Take care, Jonathan ------------------- LITTLE WORKS STUDIO http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com |
#178
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With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It
Mayayana wrote:
"William Unruh" wrote | I have no problem with downloading but I | don't want web installs. In other words, I want to | manage the system and know what I'm changing. | I don't want auto-updates, web installs, or anything | that requires going online. The software is installed. | Unless it's something like a browser there's no | excuse for it going online. Again this paragraph makes no sense. You do not have all possible programs and updates on you own computer. Ie, you have to get them from somewhere, and nowadays that somewhere is the net. I have not idea how you would get an update for say Word from anywhere but the net. Thus you have to go online to install or update. Now you may not have meant what you said, but perhaps you could say what you mean in that case. I thought I explained it several times. Yes, I have to go online to download updates, service packs, etc. But I don't have to enable Windows Update or "web installers". In other words, there's no reason I should need to allow anything to call out. There's no reason I should have to trust Microsoft, Google, or a Linux "package manager" to communicate between my machine and a remote location. Then don't. Install everything manually from *deb (for Debian or Debian-derived distributions, such as Ubuntu, Mint, MX_Linux, etc.) or *rpm (RedHat or RedHat-derived distributions, such as Fedora, etc.). The package manager is merely the equivalent of "the app store" on iOS/Android/Win10 (Dunno if Mac has one of those). I run XP SP3 and Win7 SP1. Neither has ever had Windows Update enabled. Neither has any networking services running. Neither has anything running that needs to, or is allowed to, go online -- aside from the obvious things like browser, email, FTP, etc that go online because I acted to make them do that. That's kind of unsafe, what with the machines being connected to the internet. I mean, all it takes is one website having something malicious that can exploit your unpatched boxes. Unless you mean that you download the KBxxxx patch files direct from MS, rather than using Windows Update to grab / install them automatically? [...] There's a difference between me running Firefox and allowing it to go out to port 80, as opposed to having an unknown, non-transparent process going out and communicating data that I'm not aware of or in control of. If you're really that concerned about the updaters, the source code is available for aptitude (and derivatives) for Debian-based systems, as well as whatever redhat uses (yum?). Or, like with Windows, you can just turn off the update manager, and do everything by hand. High level way aptitude (etc.) work is as follows: 1. Download package metadata lists (headers) from the internet (nothing is sent out). 2. Use those new lists to update the "current version" information in your local package listing database. 3. Compare the "current version" to the "installed version" in said local database 4. Tell the user which package(s) have new versions. Stop and wait here for the user to confirm install (note, admin priveleges required to actually run installs). 5. If updates are wanted, user (admin) confirms and the tool downloads the packages via http, checks package gpg signatures, then installs. NOTE that aptitude and friends ONLY run when you want. Most distros also include an "update manager", which is pretty easy to keep from starting up (varies slightly with the distro, as it's usually a distro-specific program. Probably a bit stupid to not just have it come from the main upstream -- Debian or RedHat -- but they also seem to focus more on the "server" market; and well, auto-updates are horribly bad there ) If your only experience on computers is using a networked computer then I suppose it may be hard to understand the idea of a fully stand-alone system. Nah, makes perfect sense if that's what you want. But you've not described fully stand-alone systems. Ones I use are air-gapped from the rest of the world, and if you need to transfer something off, it's "burn it to optical media". (right pain that... I mean, I need to move 200KiB off, and need to waste a 700 MB CD -- I really miss those mini-CDs we used to get). People working for companies on an intranet are generally lackey users who only have control over their own personal folder. In that scenario, the network is trusted while the user is not. But for a SOHo user the reverse is true: There's little reason for networking functionality and lots of security reasons to disable it. The user is trusted while the network is not. I trust my (home) network more than I trust the users of it. Including myself. Stupid meatbag humans Honestly, in home networks, I would say that the users and network itself are equally untrustworthy. But that being said, it does make for convenience (and, let's be honest here - people tend to want that above all else). On Windows 10 that's even more relevant because the things calling home are spyware and an auto-update system that is using SOHo customers as unpaid beta testers for new changes, which corporate customers are then allowed to put off until the kinks have been worked out. Can you see that there's a fundamental difference between me downloading and installing Windows patch XYZ vs Microsoft coming onto my system and installing it without asking? And that's a difference with Linux distributions -- when they update, they tend to be somewhat "behind" the software devs. For example, openssh is currently version 7.7, but my "daily driver" system (MX_Linux, release 17) is only running 7.4p1. This is not a complex concept. Another example: Can you see how there's a fundamental difference between you inviting someone into your home vs that person coming in uninvited, without your knowledge? It's no difference with a computer. It's your desk and file cabinets. It's your personal property. I would have thought that was common sense. -- |_|O|_| Registered Linux user #585947 |_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert |O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5 4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281 |
#179
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With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It
"William Unruh" wrote
| | AGain, you overstate yourself and then have to backtrack. If you canuse a | browser then you are connected to the net and have networking services | running. | I meant Windows networking services. There are various services (daemons?) on Windows that are enabled by default because the default configuration is for corporate workstations. I disable anything that might need to go online through the services "shepherd", svchost.exe. I then can block svchost at the firewall. If I use a browser then, yes, I'm going online. I think we agree there. | | What's so hard to understand? I want to manage the | system myself. I don't want to enable some unknown | quantity to make unilateral decisions that change the | | That is fine. On Mageia the update tells you that there are updates available, | but it is up to you to actually initiate them. | And how did the updater figure that out? Did it call online? That's what I don't want. This is not a Linux issue. It's a privacy/security preference. If you give someone a key to your house then you have to trust that that person is honest and competent. This is just my personal preference. It has nothing to do with Linux. I only brought it up in the context of saying that I don't consider Linux "for dummies" features to be an improvement. But I think I've explained that a few times now. I'm not going to keep arguing the same point. |
#180
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With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It
On 03/08/18 12:44, Nomen Nescio wrote:
In article The Natural Philosopher wrote: On 01/08/18 11:02, Carlos E.R. wrote: On 2018-08-01 09:04, Chris wrote: nospam wrote: In article , Anssi Saari wrote: MS underestimated Android in the phone market. They might fail again with the desktop. Here's hoping (for Microsoft's demise). But I think it's more like a paradigm shift happened. Absolutely nothing threatens Microsoft on the PC desktop, quite a bit does. chromebooks are very strong in education and web apps (mainly google) are winning out over ms office. Not in the UK. Schools and universities are wall to wall MS. Which is particularly depressing given the lack of money in schools. I was in a classroom a few years back here (Spain), and the funny thing was that the school officially embraced free software; yet the teachers wrote their pieces on Word instead of LibreOffice, so the students did the same (without licenses). Someone really using LO had a bit of a problem because the formatting often is not accurately converted. I have found thats generally NOT an issue if the same fonts are installed Most of the people I saw used Windows and Office without licenses, so MS was getting nothing - except that the people got familiar with MS and demand MS products later. Mmm. But companies are just rubbish really. I mean would you believe a company that prints from WORD onto letterhead PAPER, scans the result and emails it as a PDF? Yes because some people aren't swift enough to construct a document template, or "It's always been done that way here". Scan the letterhead first, make a template, then type on it Luke. Wh uyou calling luke? Of course that is what they should do. Do they wabt to listen? -- “The fundamental cause of the trouble in the modern world today is that the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt." - Bertrand Russell |
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