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With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It



 
 
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  #346  
Old August 6th 18, 08:16 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc
Chris
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Posts: 832
Default With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It

Caver1 wrote:
On 08/05/2018 06:17 PM, nospam wrote:
In article , Caver1
wrote:

Just as I was saying. Apple is starting to open up to what apps you can
install. Never use to be this way.


absolutely wrong. in fact, the opposite is true.

Even with OSX unless you change a privacy & security setting you can
only load apps from he Apple store.


also wrong.


the default is app store *and* known developers (outside the app store).


How to enable installation of non-Mac App Store apps on OS X
https://ioshacker.com/how-to/enable-...e-apps-on-os-x
https://www.cultofmac.com/224876/saf...mac-os-x-tips/
If it also includes known developers without changing this setting then
you need to point out to these Apple centric sites that they need to
correct this.

that's for security, since malware authors are highly unlikely to sign
up for a legitimate developer account because they could easily be
tracked down.

the setting easy to disable, but it's a very bad idea, as the computer
is less secure.

unfortunately, there are bad people in this world and security is
*very* important.


That is why the repositories are push in Linux.


Nope. Updates are polled on daily or weekly basis by apps like Software
Updater. On debian like distros you always need to 'apt-get update' to get
the list of available updates.

At the same time you
don't have to change any settings in Linux to install apps from elsewhere.


False. Third party programs like virtualbox need additional repos to be
enabled (including a signed key) before they can be installed.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a huge advocate of linux (used it at home and work
for the last 15 years), but making stuff up isn't helping anyone.

Ads
  #347  
Old August 6th 18, 12:15 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.os.linux
Dan Purgert
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Posts: 281
Default With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It

Chris wrote:
Caver1 wrote:
If Apple didn't care that setting wouldn't be
there because there would be nothing in the OS to stop you from
installing from anywhere.
Windows at the same time is starting to try to restrict from where
something is installed from.


Yup. Every time you install something outside of the Microsoft store it
brings up a warning pop-up. There is a toggle to remove it.

It is not massively different from having to enable the "restricted" repos
in Linux for installing things like nvidia drivers and mp3 playback.


Actually, the "non-free" ("restricted") repos are usually marked as such
because the software contained therein does not have a "free" (libre)
license. Although, you really only run into this if you choose to use
distributions that put an effort into segregating packages like that
(Debian used to); OR if you're using "OEM Media" to install the initial
system image.


--
|_|O|_| Registered Linux user #585947
|_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert
|O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5 4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281
  #348  
Old August 6th 18, 12:23 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc
Dan Purgert
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Posts: 281
Default With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It

Caver1 wrote:
On 08/05/2018 06:17 PM, nospam wrote:
unfortunately, there are bad people in this world and security is
*very* important.


That is why the repositories are push in Linux. At the same time you
don't have to change any settings in Linux to install apps from
elsewhere.


Depends on the distro. "Newbie-friendly" distros (or rather, the
communities that surround them) push the repos because they're "easy",
and are unlikely to get you into dependency hell.

Other distros expect you to compile some (or all) programs from source.

--
|_|O|_| Registered Linux user #585947
|_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert
|O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5 4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281
  #349  
Old August 6th 18, 12:42 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc
The Natural Philosopher[_2_]
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Posts: 133
Default With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It

On 05/08/18 22:37, Caver1 wrote:
Even with OSX unless you change a privacy & security setting you can
only load apps from he Apple store.


????

Its been a long time since I used OS/X but it never used Apple store at all.

https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb...ll-firefox-mac


suggest that installation is still as it was last time I used it.
Download a .dmg and run it


Only IOS uses the Apple Store.


--
"A point of view can be a dangerous luxury when substituted for insight
and understanding".

Marshall McLuhan

  #350  
Old August 6th 18, 01:26 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc
Caver1
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Posts: 335
Default With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It

On 08/06/2018 07:42 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 05/08/18 22:37, Caver1 wrote:
Even with OSX unless you change a privacy & security setting you can
only load apps from he Apple store.


????

Its been a long time since I used OS/X but it never used Apple store at
all.

https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb...ll-firefox-mac


suggest that installation is still as it was last time I used it.
Download a .dmg and run it


Only IOS uses the Apple Store.



Then why is there instructions for OSX to enable you to install non app
store apps?

--
Caver1
  #351  
Old August 6th 18, 01:49 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc
The Natural Philosopher[_2_]
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Posts: 133
Default With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It

On 06/08/18 13:26, Caver1 wrote:
On 08/06/2018 07:42 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 05/08/18 22:37, Caver1 wrote:
Even with OSX unless you change a privacy & security setting you can
only load apps from he Apple store.


????

Its been a long time since I used OS/X but it never used Apple store
at all.

https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb...ll-firefox-mac


suggest that installation is still as it was last time I used it.
Download a .dmg and run it


Only IOS uses the Apple Store.



Then why is there instructions for OSX to enable you to install non app
store apps?

where are these 'instructions' on the page I linked to?



--
The biggest threat to humanity comes from socialism, which has utterly
diverted our attention away from what really matters to our existential
survival, to indulging in navel gazing and faux moral investigations
into what the world ought to be, whilst we fail utterly to deal with
what it actually is.

  #352  
Old August 6th 18, 02:03 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc
Caver1
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 335
Default With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It

On 08/06/2018 08:49 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 06/08/18 13:26, Caver1 wrote:
On 08/06/2018 07:42 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 05/08/18 22:37, Caver1 wrote:
Even with OSX unless you change a privacy & security setting you can
only load apps from he Apple store.

????

Its been a long time since I used OS/X but it never used Apple store
at all.

https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb...ll-firefox-mac



suggest that installation is still as it was last time I used it.
Download a .dmg and run it


Only IOS uses the Apple Store.



Then why is there instructions for OSX to enable you to install non
app store apps?

where are these 'instructions' on the page I linked to?






How to enable installation of non-Mac App Store apps on OS X

https://ioshacker.com/how-to/enable-...e-apps-on-os-x

https://www.cultofmac.com/224876/saf...mac-os-x-tips/

--
Caver1
  #353  
Old August 6th 18, 02:13 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc
The Natural Philosopher[_2_]
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Posts: 133
Default With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It

On 06/08/18 14:03, Caver1 wrote:
On 08/06/2018 08:49 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 06/08/18 13:26, Caver1 wrote:
On 08/06/2018 07:42 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 05/08/18 22:37, Caver1 wrote:
Even with OSX unless you change a privacy & security setting you
can only load apps from he Apple store.

????

Its been a long time since I used OS/X but it never used Apple store
at all.

https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb...ll-firefox-mac



suggest that installation is still as it was last time I used it.
Download a .dmg and run it


Only IOS uses the Apple Store.



Then why is there instructions for OSX to enable you to install non
app store apps?

where are these 'instructions' on the page I linked to?






How to enable installation of non-Mac App Store apps on OS X

https://ioshacker.com/how-to/enable-...e-apps-on-os-x


https://www.cultofmac.com/224876/saf...mac-os-x-tips/


Yeah. I looked. Its trivially easy by many methods to install 3rd party
apps. It's about as secure as Linux needing you to enter your password
to do any installation anyway.

Or adding a PPA.

In short its no different from amything else, a lightweight barrier to
make sure you didnt install what *might* be malware by *mistake*.

Had the same issue installing something on android. Just downloaded it
from 3rd party site, clicked on it 'Are you syre'

etc etc.

AFAIK the real bugger is IOS

https://lifehacker.com/how-to-instal...jai-1749519150

Thta is seriously nasty hackery.



--
“I know that most men, including those at ease with problems of the
greatest complexity, can seldom accept even the simplest and most
obvious truth if it be such as would oblige them to admit the falsity of
conclusions which they have delighted in explaining to colleagues, which
they have proudly taught to others, and which they have woven, thread by
thread, into the fabric of their lives.”

― Leo Tolstoy
  #354  
Old August 6th 18, 02:37 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc
Mayayana
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Posts: 6,438
Default With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It

"Wolf K" wrote

| cite where apple officially claimed that. "news sources that i read"
| isn't going to cut it.
|
| Sure, if I'd know you wanted a citation, I would have kept a file folder
| bulging with newspaper and magazine clippings.
|

To talk with nospam is to slap yourself in the face.
You might want to quit while you're behind.

On Apple and Intel, I don't know anything about
what Jobs might have said, but I do remember the
ads showing an Intel CPU as a snail. And I remember
the fervent AppleSeeds telling me that a 300 MHz
Motorola could run circles around an Intel 900 MHz.
Doubtless that was the party line from Apple. The
devotees were not allowed to doubt. If you were
using Macs at the time you were probably
susceptible to Jobs's carnival barking.

I guess that was probably happening when Apple
was frustrated with Motorola's lack of development
but didn't want to quit them. So they made
overcompensating ads that tried to show Intel
CPUs as inherently faulty. Any reasonable person
could have interpreted that to mean that Jobs was
digging in and standing by Motorola. So I can see
how you would have got that idea.
Then again, Jobs's pronouncements meant
little. Would you ask P. T. Barnum what "egress"
means? Jobs was a salesman. Worse, he was
a preacher who probably believed his own spiel.


  #355  
Old August 6th 18, 02:54 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,718
Default With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It

In article , The Natural Philosopher
wrote:

Then why is there instructions for OSX to enable you to install non
app store apps?

where are these 'instructions' on the page I linked to?


How to enable installation of non-Mac App Store apps on OS X

https://ioshacker.com/how-to/enable-...c-app-store-ap
ps-on-os-x

https://www.cultofmac.com/224876/saf...ore-apps-on-yo
ur-mac-os-x-tips/


Yeah. I looked. Its trivially easy by many methods to install 3rd party
apps. It's about as secure as Linux needing you to enter your password
to do any installation anyway.

Or adding a PPA.

In short its no different from amything else, a lightweight barrier to
make sure you didnt install what *might* be malware by *mistake*.


exactly.

Had the same issue installing something on android. Just downloaded it
from 3rd party site, clicked on it 'Are you syre'


yep.

android, which has linux under the hood, requires the user to change a
setting to sideload.
  #356  
Old August 6th 18, 02:54 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,718
Default With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It

In article , Wolf K
wrote:

the same time, Apple swore up and down that they would never - NEVER!-
use Intel chips.
they never said anything remotely close to that.
Well, according to the news sources I read, they did.
i don't know what you read, but steve jobs actually hinted at it:

from 2002:
https://www.computerworld.com.au/article/33425/apple_set_intel_switch_/
At Macworld Expo, analysts quizzed Apple CEO Steve Jobs. Jobs was
asked if there was a possibility of the company switching to Intel
chips. He said: "First of all, we have to complete the operating
system transition. Then we would have options. And we like to have
options."

But thanks for the info on the PowerPC chip.
no problem.
Yeah, but that was after Apple "officially" claimed that it wasn't going
to do that. IIRC, reports of that "hint" was the first I heard of the,
er, transition.

cite where apple officially claimed that. "news sources that i read"
isn't going to cut it.


Sure, if I'd know you wanted a citation, I would have kept a file folder
bulging with newspaper and magazine clippings.


fortunately, the internet has kept a (virtual) folder of far more than
just that and without any of the bulges, and google and other search
engines have indexed it to help you quickly find it.

note that i found a citation from 2002, sixteen years ago, which shows
that they said the *opposite* of what you claim they did.

it also doesn't matter what they said. the change in processors had
little to no effect on end users, other than new macs were faster.
powerpc macs didn't suddenly stop working and apple worked very hard so
that existing powerpc software continued to work without issue on intel
macs and made it easy for developers to create universal apps that ran
on both.

contrast that to windows mobile 6, where users were left in the cold.
  #357  
Old August 6th 18, 02:54 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,718
Default With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It

In article , Mayayana
wrote:


On Apple and Intel, I don't know anything about
what Jobs might have said, but I do remember the
ads showing an Intel CPU as a snail. And I remember
the fervent AppleSeeds telling me that a 300 MHz
Motorola could run circles around an Intel 900 MHz.
Doubtless that was the party line from Apple. The
devotees were not allowed to doubt. If you were
using Macs at the time you were probably
susceptible to Jobs's carnival barking.


directly comparing clock speeds of two totally different processor
architectures is bogus.
  #358  
Old August 6th 18, 03:29 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc
Caver1
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 335
Default With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It

On 08/06/2018 09:13 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 06/08/18 14:03, Caver1 wrote:
On 08/06/2018 08:49 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 06/08/18 13:26, Caver1 wrote:
On 08/06/2018 07:42 AM, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 05/08/18 22:37, Caver1 wrote:
Even with OSX unless you change a privacy & security setting you
can only load apps from he Apple store.

????

Its been a long time since I used OS/X but it never used Apple
store at all.

https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/kb...ll-firefox-mac



suggest that installation is still as it was last time I used it.
Download a .dmg and run it


Only IOS uses the Apple Store.



Then why is there instructions for OSX to enable you to install non
app store apps?

where are these 'instructions' on the page I linked to?






How to enable installation of non-Mac App Store apps on OS X

https://ioshacker.com/how-to/enable-...e-apps-on-os-x


https://www.cultofmac.com/224876/saf...mac-os-x-tips/


Yeah. I looked. Its trivially easy by many methods to install 3rd party
apps. It's about as secure as Linux needing you to enter your password
to do any installation anyway.

Or adding a PPA.


It's not quite the same thing. Yes you need a password to install
anything in Linux, at the same time you are not limited to the distros
repos for the installation of apps.


In short its no different from amything else, a lightweight barrier to
make sure you didnt install what *might* be malware by *mistake*.

Had the same issue installing something on android. Just downloaded it
from 3rd party site, clicked on it 'Are you syre'

etc etc.


Yes there is a setting to change just like in OSX. Simple but you have
to know it's there.

AFAIK the real bugger is IOS

https://lifehacker.com/how-to-instal...jai-1749519150


Thta is seriously nasty hackery.


I won't own an iPhone and am seriously considering getting rid my
android phone also. Only use it as a phone, so why keep paying the added
expense of having one.

You said;
Only IOS uses the Apple Store
Its been a long time since I used OS/X but it never used Apple
store at all.


So I posted two links from sites that were Apple centric that stated
that it did.
You commented;
Yeah. I looked.


The only way you can install non Apple store apps is to change a setting
in OSX. You don't have to change any settings in the distros that I have
used to do this.
I have since found out that you can install apps from Apple approved
devs also without changing these settings.
These devs do have to pay a fee to become Apple approved.
So it is still Apple controlled.
So now my question is does the common Apple user even know that setting
is there? Maybe they do I don't know. The many I know I seriously doubt
they do.
Heck you didn't even know OSX used the Apple store.
It's funny that you mention that this blocking is there to stop malware.
All of the Apple users I know think OSX or even IOS is impervious to
malware.
I have helped several of the OSX users I know with their computer
problems. Software and hardware. I'm not totally ignorant but there is
a lot I don't know as I don't use it.
There is choice so choose what you like best.


--
Caver1
  #359  
Old August 6th 18, 03:33 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc
Caver1
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Posts: 335
Default With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It

On 08/06/2018 09:54 AM, nospam wrote:
In article , The Natural Philosopher
wrote:

Then why is there instructions for OSX to enable you to install non
app store apps?

where are these 'instructions' on the page I linked to?


How to enable installation of non-Mac App Store apps on OS X

https://ioshacker.com/how-to/enable-...c-app-store-ap
ps-on-os-x

https://www.cultofmac.com/224876/saf...ore-apps-on-yo
ur-mac-os-x-tips/


Yeah. I looked. Its trivially easy by many methods to install 3rd party
apps. It's about as secure as Linux needing you to enter your password
to do any installation anyway.

Or adding a PPA.

In short its no different from amything else, a lightweight barrier to
make sure you didnt install what *might* be malware by *mistake*.


exactly.

Had the same issue installing something on android. Just downloaded it
from 3rd party site, clicked on it 'Are you syre'


yep.

android, which has linux under the hood, requires the user to change a
setting to sideload.


The Linux kernel that android use has been modified to Googles liking.
Just like Apple modifying BSD for it's OSs.
They are both based upon but not.

--
Caver1
  #360  
Old August 6th 18, 04:00 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10,alt.os.linux,comp.os.linux.misc
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,718
Default With DaaS Windows Coming, Say Goodbye To Your PC As You Know It

In article , Caver1
wrote:

The only way you can install non Apple store apps is to change a setting
in OSX.


once again, that's false.

only apps from *unknown* developers require a setting change, which is
very, very easy to do.

You don't have to change any settings in the distros that I have
used to do this.
I have since found out that you can install apps from Apple approved
devs also without changing these settings.


there is no approval process.

all that's needed is to sign up as a developer, which is very easy and
anyone can do it.

These devs do have to pay a fee to become Apple approved.


so what? if a developer can't be bothered to pay $99 to become a
registered developer then their software isn't worth using.

that's cheap compared to certain other companies:
https://visualstudio.microsoft.com/vs/pricing/

So it is still Apple controlled.
So now my question is does the common Apple user even know that setting
is there? Maybe they do I don't know. The many I know I seriously doubt
they do.


the default setting *does* allow non-store apps, so it doesn't matter
whether they do or not.

Heck you didn't even know OSX used the Apple store.
It's funny that you mention that this blocking is there to stop malware.
All of the Apple users I know think OSX or even IOS is impervious to
malware.


it mostly is.

the weak point is the user, regardless of platform, who can be tricked
into installing something bad, especially when users blindly enter in
their admin password whenever asked.

I have helped several of the OSX users I know with their computer
problems. Software and hardware. I'm not totally ignorant but there is
a lot I don't know as I don't use it.


perhaps not totally, but definitely quite a bit.
 




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