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Backup Scheme for a New Laptop



 
 
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  #16  
Old July 12th 16, 06:00 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Alek
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 619
Default Backup Scheme for a New Laptop

Robert Brereton wrote on 7/12/2016 9:58 AM:
What backup scheme do you
think I should set up for her? She will have an external HD.


I do a complete image after each 'patch Tuesday' and back up data files to
an NAS drive and an external USB drive whenever they are changed. I also
copy the data to a secondary USB drive which gets ejected from the PC after
the backup and stored elsewhere each night.

A complete disk image is a very useful thing to have, because if the Hard
disk fails or gets corrupted it can be up and running in pretty short order,
instead of spending several days getting it back to the state it was in
before the problems.


I do that too.
Ads
  #17  
Old July 13th 16, 10:31 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Terry Pinnell[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 732
Default Backup Scheme for a New Laptop

"Robert Brereton" wrote:

What backup scheme do you
think I should set up for her? She will have an external HD.


I do a complete image after each 'patch Tuesday' and back up data files to
an NAS drive and an external USB drive whenever they are changed. I also
copy the data to a secondary USB drive which gets ejected from the PC after
the backup and stored elsewhere each night.

A complete disk image is a very useful thing to have, because if the Hard
disk fails or gets corrupted it can be up and running in pretty short order,
instead of spending several days getting it back to the state it was in
before the problems.


This is an instructive and timely thread for me, as I'm new to Win 10
(15 years with XP) and am in the early stages of getting my backup
methods organised. So rather than starting a new thread on a very
similar topic may I raise a few queries of my own please (which may
also prove helpful to Alek)?

On this desktop i7 PC, my OS, programs and as many data files as
possible are on C: which is a 256 GB SSD. Large data folders such as
Pictures, Video and Music are on my 4 TB internal HD, and that is also
my main intended backup target for C. Externally I have two HDs, G (3
TB) and H (2 TB).

So far I've been using my trusty backup program, Second Copy, backing
up C to D, and D (apart from the C b/u) to G. But after some reading,
reinforced by suggestions up-thread here, I'm considering changing
this to a mix of File History and/or Image Backup. (Any other
candidates?)

One point on which I'm still not clear is how I recover a backed up
file from an image, or indeed if it's possible at all. The following
about the 'System Image Backup utility' from
http://www.windowscentral.com/how-ma...kup-windows-pc seems to
contain a contradiction of itself:

"The downside is that you cannot choose to restore individual files.
It's meant to restore everything, bit-by-bit to the same (or
replacement) hard drive. (Though, you can easily access the backup
files and extract documents, photos, music, and other files, if you
need to.)"

Q1: So what is the practical distinction there, between restoring and
accessing? If I can access a file, can I not then simply save it in
the required restore location?

Q2: I tried an Image Backup, accepting the recommendation to save it
on D. That now contains several new folders (mixed in with my own data
folders): TERRY-2016, WindowsImageBackup and MediaID.bin, all of which
are 0 bytes in size according to their respective properties.

Q3. After doing a Win 10 Backup of C (or is it called Win 7?) I got a
report that there were skipped files, and the list displayed included
these:

Backup skipped backing up D:\Music as it is on the backup target.
Backup skipped backing up D:\Pictures as it is on the backup target.
Backup skipped backing up D:\Videos+Projects as it is on the backup
target.

So has Win 10 intelligently recognised that I've created new folders
with those names, leaving the original Music, Pictures and Video
default folders unused? Presumably it hasn't tried to backup any other
data files on D?!

--
Terry, East Grinstead, UK

  #18  
Old July 13th 16, 12:07 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Adrian Caspersz
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Posts: 21
Default Backup Scheme for a New Laptop

On 12/07/16 11:19, Alek wrote:
Adrian Caspersz wrote on 7/12/2016 5:27 AM:
On 11/07/16 18:25, Alek wrote:
My neighbor has decided to buy a new laptop. She is new to the idea of
making backups and is not computer literate. What backup scheme do you
think I should set up for her? She will have an external HD.


Dropbox


Dropbox is not a scheme in itself. :-)


That's an advantage. Nothing to do.

Just make sure her data is created in her dropbox sync'd folder, and the
backup is then automatic with different document revisions saved.

However, if she is using some database product (say, accounts package)
then this will not be idea. For that, traditional backup...


--
Adrian C
  #19  
Old July 13th 16, 12:37 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Alek
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 619
Default Backup Scheme for a New Laptop

Adrian Caspersz wrote on 7/13/2016 7:07 AM:
On 12/07/16 11:19, Alek wrote:
Adrian Caspersz wrote on 7/12/2016 5:27 AM:
On 11/07/16 18:25, Alek wrote:
My neighbor has decided to buy a new laptop. She is new to the idea of
making backups and is not computer literate. What backup scheme do you
think I should set up for her? She will have an external HD.

Dropbox


Dropbox is not a scheme in itself. :-)


That's an advantage. Nothing to do.

Just make sure her data is created in her dropbox sync'd folder, and the
backup is then automatic with different document revisions saved.


How does she do that?
  #20  
Old July 13th 16, 03:15 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Terry Pinnell[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 732
Default Backup Scheme for a New Laptop

Alek wrote:

Adrian Caspersz wrote on 7/13/2016 7:07 AM:
On 12/07/16 11:19, Alek wrote:
Adrian Caspersz wrote on 7/12/2016 5:27 AM:
On 11/07/16 18:25, Alek wrote:
My neighbor has decided to buy a new laptop. She is new to the idea of
making backups and is not computer literate. What backup scheme do you
think I should set up for her? She will have an external HD.

Dropbox

Dropbox is not a scheme in itself. :-)


That's an advantage. Nothing to do.

Just make sure her data is created in her dropbox sync'd folder, and the
backup is then automatic with different document revisions saved.


How does she do that?


An introduction to using Dropbox are here.
https://www.dropbox.com/en/help/65

Its practicality as her backup method is arguable IMO. Presumably she
would not want store ALL her files including the OS and system files
in Dropbox. (Even if Win 10 allows that, which I rather doubt.) So
assuming all that vital stuff was backed up by one of the other tools
under discussion (such as File History or Image Backup) and she
confined Dropbox exclusively to her own data, its size would have to
be limited.

The free version's 2 GB is obviously not in the running. The next
(big) step up to 1 TB for Dropbox Pro at £9.99/month or $90/year could
be OK. But that still leaves the need to backup her external HD,
probably where she archives video, photos or music, etc.

As usual, the devil is in the details...

--
Terry, East Grinstead, UK
  #21  
Old July 13th 16, 10:11 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 18,275
Default Backup Scheme for a New Laptop

Terry Pinnell wrote:


One point on which I'm still not clear is how I recover a backed up
file from an image, or indeed if it's possible at all. The following
about the 'System Image Backup utility' from
http://www.windowscentral.com/how-ma...kup-windows-pc seems to
contain a contradiction of itself:


You can Attach a VHD. You can view most files of that sort
(VHD, VHDX, VDI etc) with things like VirtualBox and a VM.

Macrium Reflect MRIMG, is just a VHD-style file format, with
a different header. You would be surprised how much backup
images share in common, in terms of their internal storage.
It's the header or trailer that is different, justifying
a different file extension.

Some utilities can do file type conversion in seconds,
by keeping the "body" of a 20GB source file, and just rewriting
or appending the necessary header or trailer. Of course,
for absolute safety, it's better to duplicate the file so
the original file remains available.


"The downside is that you cannot choose to restore individual files.
It's meant to restore everything, bit-by-bit to the same (or
replacement) hard drive. (Though, you can easily access the backup
files and extract documents, photos, music, and other files, if you
need to.)"

Q1: So what is the practical distinction there, between restoring and
accessing? If I can access a file, can I not then simply save it in
the required restore location?


With restoring, you walk away until it is done. It's
fully automated.

With accessing, that is an interactive function, requiring
your full and undivided attention.


Q2: I tried an Image Backup, accepting the recommendation to save it
on D. That now contains several new folders (mixed in with my own data
folders): TERRY-2016, WindowsImageBackup and MediaID.bin, all of which
are 0 bytes in size according to their respective properties.


WindowsImageBackup for whole OS images, there is no versioning. If
you want to "keep" a WindowsImageBackup, rename the folder.

A folder is "0 bytes", if you lack permission to enter :-)
(I knew you'd like that. Hahaha. No access to your own backup.)

A WindowsImageBackup can be pesky from a permissions perspective,
but stick with it and you'll get there... eventually. Expect
to find one VHD per partition. The smallest complete image you
can do, would have two VHD files, one for System Reserved
and one for C: . Since System Reserved does not have a
drive letter, Windows 7 Backup refers to it with a GUID
instead.

There is also a command line version of Windows Image backup,
but the exact capabilities and options changed from one OS
version to the next, and I'm not going to delve into it.
When we have Macrium Reflect Free, most of this stuff is
irrelevant.


Q3. After doing a Win 10 Backup of C (or is it called Win 7?) I got a
report that there were skipped files, and the list displayed included
these:

Backup skipped backing up D:\Music as it is on the backup target.
Backup skipped backing up D:\Pictures as it is on the backup target.
Backup skipped backing up D:\Videos+Projects as it is on the backup
target.

So has Win 10 intelligently recognised that I've created new folders
with those names, leaving the original Music, Pictures and Video
default folders unused? Presumably it hasn't tried to backup any other
data files on D?!


Those are Junction Points.

Programs can do one of three things:

1) Die horribly on a Junction Point. If you don't tell Robocopy to
ignore Junction Points, it will die on a "Path Too Long" error.
The Junction Point name keeps getting added to the temporary path
variable in memory, until the path is too long. A suitably humorous
error message is printed, leaving it to the user to equate "PAth too long"
with Oopsy, Hit a Junction Point.

2) A program can check for a Junction Point, and refuse to touch it.

3) A program can identify a Junction Point, then follow the user-specified
preference. To either follow every Junction Point, no matter where it
leads, and back up the data. Or, do (2).

A Junction Point is not a "recipe" to cause complete traversal
of a foreign disk. Only the tree under the Junction Point should
be accessed that way. But with enough effort, you might be
able to convince it to back up the whole thing. People who
lace file systems together like spaghetti, will always
find a way to do it.

*******

Macrium Reflect Free, can mount an MRIMG as if it was a disk
drive. You can retrieve random files that way.

Acronis has a similar function. Either a separate file
explorer, or a mount capability. As far as I know, files
are not "trapped in it".

Ghost might have had its own Ghost Explorer.

Win7 backup on Win7, makes VHD files.
Win7 backup on Win10, makes VHDX files.

VHD files can be mounted by some OSes (with an Attach option).
It's possible VHDX has that possibility, but I haven't
tested it. My early impression of a VHDX, is the format
was kind of an orphan. (Only really convenient on a machine
with Hyper-V? Not all machines have SLAT/EPT hardware support,
so that Hyper-V will install.)

The 7ZIP program can open a VHD file and navigate into
an NTFS partition. However, it may use your %temp% while
doing so.

Generally, just about everything has some sort of option,
but the recipes are more obscure for some than others.
For example, an NTBACKUP (.bkp) can be converted to TAR
and then read with 7ZIP.

I access backed up files in their "context". I reassure
myself I have the right one, by noting the other files
collected in the folder at the time. While I've looked
at the Previous Versions idea, it just doesn't appeal to me
as a concept.

*******

A backup program does not want or need to descend a Junction Point,
because the user could have the Junction Point, pointing at
another drive. It is up to the user to develop a "drive specific"
backup philosophy, or an "anything goes, follow that Junction Point"
philosophy. Even some system utilities do not descend Junction Points
properly, and it's not a given that older third-party software
will work right either.

In general, Windows doesn't work right with Junction Points
draped over D: . The next time the OS is upgraded (August 3, 2016
Anniversary Edition), your machine is going to explode :-) :-)
Good luck, Mr. Philips.

The defensive posture is this:

1) Humor the OS. Pretend to use C:\Photos or whatever.
Leave the Junction Points alone.
2) At regular intervals, manually move C:\Photos to D:\Photos.
Set the default Open location of any really clever programs,
to work in D:\Photos.
3) When an OS version upgrade comes along, you won't even notice
any side effects. The OS thinks "all your valuable stuff" is on
C: . And since the Junction Points are all "normal", there is
no reason for the installer to freak out.
4) Now, you backup D: when you want to back up those Photos.
You backup C: so that if malware strikes, the OS can easily
be put back. Because C:\Photos is "mostly empty", restoring
and trashing it, no longer matters.

While that isn't the most functional setup, it's safer.

See you after Aug3, 2016.

Paul
  #22  
Old July 14th 16, 12:38 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Char Jackson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10,449
Default Backup Scheme for a New Laptop

On Wed, 13 Jul 2016 17:11:06 -0400, Paul wrote:

The defensive posture is this:

1) Humor the OS. Pretend to use C:\Photos or whatever.
Leave the Junction Points alone.
2) At regular intervals, manually move C:\Photos to D:\Photos.
Set the default Open location of any really clever programs,
to work in D:\Photos.
3) When an OS version upgrade comes along, you won't even notice
any side effects. The OS thinks "all your valuable stuff" is on
C: . And since the Junction Points are all "normal", there is
no reason for the installer to freak out.
4) Now, you backup D: when you want to back up those Photos.
You backup C: so that if malware strikes, the OS can easily
be put back. Because C:\Photos is "mostly empty", restoring
and trashing it, no longer matters.

While that isn't the most functional setup, it's safer.


"Libraries" are a great way to get additional functionality, adding
automation to the manual step #2 described above.

Simply add D:\Photos (or the folder of your choice) to the Photos library
and set it as the 'default save location'. Now you can seamlessly open
photos from both folders, but anytime you save a new photo it automatically
gets saved to D:\Photos. No more remembering to manually move photos from C:
to D:


  #23  
Old July 14th 16, 10:48 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Terry Pinnell[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 732
Default Backup Scheme for a New Laptop

Paul wrote:

Terry Pinnell wrote:


One point on which I'm still not clear is how I recover a backed up
file from an image, or indeed if it's possible at all. The following
about the 'System Image Backup utility' from
http://www.windowscentral.com/how-ma...kup-windows-pc seems to
contain a contradiction of itself:


You can Attach a VHD. You can view most files of that sort
(VHD, VHDX, VDI etc) with things like VirtualBox and a VM.


Thanks Paul, but you're way over my head at the start! Virtual HDs and
virtual desktops are not facilities I want to use.
(I do appreciate that the comprehensive technical detail is not
necessarily or solely addressed to me.)

Macrium Reflect MRIMG, is just a VHD-style file format, with
a different header. You would be surprised how much backup
images share in common, in terms of their internal storage.
It's the header or trailer that is different, justifying
a different file extension.

Some utilities can do file type conversion in seconds,
by keeping the "body" of a 20GB source file, and just rewriting
or appending the necessary header or trailer. Of course,
for absolute safety, it's better to duplicate the file so
the original file remains available.


"The downside is that you cannot choose to restore individual files.
It's meant to restore everything, bit-by-bit to the same (or
replacement) hard drive. (Though, you can easily access the backup
files and extract documents, photos, music, and other files, if you
need to.)"

Q1: So what is the practical distinction there, between restoring and
accessing? If I can access a file, can I not then simply save it in
the required restore location?


With restoring, you walk away until it is done. It's
fully automated.

With accessing, that is an interactive function, requiring
your full and undivided attention.


Yes, digressing slightly, that's reinforced by my experience yesterday
with using File History for the first time. The backup was
straightforward enough (although it took several hours), but I found
the 'restoring' procedure non-intuitive and tedious. may not be doing
it justice (patience isn't one of my strong points!) so I'll revisit
later.

Anyway, I'm considering just sticking with my old but simple Second
Copy. Restoring is then just a matter of opening the copy, navigating
to the identical folder and target file(s), and dragging across. The
frequency choices are also far more practical for me than those in
File History, which range from a few minutes to a mere 12 hours.
Surely the lower end of that range is redundant? If I'm working on an
important spreadsheet I make a point of regularly saving it, I imagine
like most. In contrast, I have backups in 2ndCopy scheduled from
hourly (for a couple of INI files) to fortnightly (for most of my
data).

I'd supplement 2ndCopy with making frequent images. (Using your tip
below.)



Q2: I tried an Image Backup, accepting the recommendation to save it
on D. That now contains several new folders (mixed in with my own data
folders): TERRY-2016, WindowsImageBackup and MediaID.bin, all of which
are 0 bytes in size according to their respective properties.


WindowsImageBackup for whole OS images, there is no versioning. If
you want to "keep" a WindowsImageBackup, rename the folder.


Understood, thanks.

A folder is "0 bytes", if you lack permission to enter :-)
(I knew you'd like that. Hahaha. No access to your own backup.)


Understood, thanks.

A WindowsImageBackup can be pesky from a permissions perspective,
but stick with it and you'll get there... eventually. Expect
to find one VHD per partition. The smallest complete image you
can do, would have two VHD files, one for System Reserved
and one for C: . Since System Reserved does not have a
drive letter, Windows 7 Backup refers to it with a GUID
instead.


Hmm, sounds ominous.


There is also a command line version of Windows Image backup,
but the exact capabilities and options changed from one OS
version to the next, and I'm not going to delve into it.
When we have Macrium Reflect Free, most of this stuff is
irrelevant.


Definitely not for me.

--------------------


Guess my next move is to try Macrium, although I don't relish yet more
learning when I'm still trying to make sense of Win 10 itself ;-(



Q3. After doing a Win 10 Backup of C (or is it called Win 7?) I got a
report that there were skipped files, and the list displayed included
these:

Backup skipped backing up D:\Music as it is on the backup target.
Backup skipped backing up D:\Pictures as it is on the backup target.
Backup skipped backing up D:\Videos+Projects as it is on the backup
target.

So has Win 10 intelligently recognised that I've created new folders
with those names, leaving the original Music, Pictures and Video
default folders unused? Presumably it hasn't tried to backup any other
data files on D?!


Those are Junction Points.

Programs can do one of three things:

1) Die horribly on a Junction Point. If you don't tell Robocopy to
ignore Junction Points, it will die on a "Path Too Long" error.
The Junction Point name keeps getting added to the temporary path
variable in memory, until the path is too long. A suitably humorous
error message is printed, leaving it to the user to equate "PAth too long"
with Oopsy, Hit a Junction Point.

2) A program can check for a Junction Point, and refuse to touch it.

3) A program can identify a Junction Point, then follow the user-specified
preference. To either follow every Junction Point, no matter where it
leads, and back up the data. Or, do (2).

A Junction Point is not a "recipe" to cause complete traversal
of a foreign disk. Only the tree under the Junction Point should
be accessed that way. But with enough effort, you might be
able to convince it to back up the whole thing. People who
lace file systems together like spaghetti, will always
find a way to do it.

*******

Macrium Reflect Free, can mount an MRIMG as if it was a disk
drive. You can retrieve random files that way.

Acronis has a similar function. Either a separate file
explorer, or a mount capability. As far as I know, files
are not "trapped in it".

Ghost might have had its own Ghost Explorer.

Win7 backup on Win7, makes VHD files.
Win7 backup on Win10, makes VHDX files.

VHD files can be mounted by some OSes (with an Attach option).
It's possible VHDX has that possibility, but I haven't
tested it. My early impression of a VHDX, is the format
was kind of an orphan. (Only really convenient on a machine
with Hyper-V? Not all machines have SLAT/EPT hardware support,
so that Hyper-V will install.)

The 7ZIP program can open a VHD file and navigate into
an NTFS partition. However, it may use your %temp% while
doing so.

Generally, just about everything has some sort of option,
but the recipes are more obscure for some than others.
For example, an NTBACKUP (.bkp) can be converted to TAR
and then read with 7ZIP.

I access backed up files in their "context". I reassure
myself I have the right one, by noting the other files
collected in the folder at the time. While I've looked
at the Previous Versions idea, it just doesn't appeal to me
as a concept.

*******

A backup program does not want or need to descend a Junction Point,
because the user could have the Junction Point, pointing at
another drive. It is up to the user to develop a "drive specific"
backup philosophy, or an "anything goes, follow that Junction Point"
philosophy. Even some system utilities do not descend Junction Points
properly, and it's not a given that older third-party software
will work right either.

In general, Windows doesn't work right with Junction Points
draped over D: . The next time the OS is upgraded (August 3, 2016
Anniversary Edition), your machine is going to explode :-) :-)
Good luck, Mr. Philips.

The defensive posture is this:

1) Humor the OS. Pretend to use C:\Photos or whatever.
Leave the Junction Points alone.
2) At regular intervals, manually move C:\Photos to D:\Photos.
Set the default Open location of any really clever programs,
to work in D:\Photos.
3) When an OS version upgrade comes along, you won't even notice
any side effects. The OS thinks "all your valuable stuff" is on
C: . And since the Junction Points are all "normal", there is
no reason for the installer to freak out.
4) Now, you backup D: when you want to back up those Photos.
You backup C: so that if malware strikes, the OS can easily
be put back. Because C:\Photos is "mostly empty", restoring
and trashing it, no longer matters.

While that isn't the most functional setup, it's safer.

See you after Aug3, 2016.


Somewhere exciting?

(Maybe I'll have a better grasp of the above by then!)


--
Terry, East Grinstead, UK
  #24  
Old July 14th 16, 03:46 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 18,275
Default Backup Scheme for a New Laptop

Terry Pinnell wrote:

Guess my next move is to try Macrium, although I don't relish yet more
learning when I'm still trying to make sense of Win 10 itself ;-(


This doesn't cover installing it, but
this covers a Backup in more detail than
necessary. I never save a backup definition
from one run to the next, so some of the slides
here, I don't use those pages.

http://s22.postimg.org/gxz3fdbch/Macrium6_Backup.gif

I made that for Macrium 6 because it added an extra page,
which is a bit confusing the first time you see it.

I can no longer make images that big on postimg, as
the last time I tried, the site downsampled my image.
Even though a large GIF can be economical in terms of
bytes used.

Paul

  #25  
Old July 14th 16, 05:42 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Terry Pinnell[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 732
Default Backup Scheme for a New Laptop

Paul wrote:

Terry Pinnell wrote:

Guess my next move is to try Macrium, although I don't relish yet more
learning when I'm still trying to make sense of Win 10 itself ;-(


This doesn't cover installing it, but
this covers a Backup in more detail than
necessary. I never save a backup definition
from one run to the next, so some of the slides
here, I don't use those pages.

http://s22.postimg.org/gxz3fdbch/Macrium6_Backup.gif

I made that for Macrium 6 because it added an extra page,
which is a bit confusing the first time you see it.

I can no longer make images that big on postimg, as
the last time I tried, the site downsampled my image.
Even though a large GIF can be economical in terms of
bytes used.

Paul


Many thanks, looks like it might help me make progress. I installed
Macrium and opened it but found the opening screen, with defaults
untouched, largely incomprehensible.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...Macrium-01.jpg

As you see, I got no further than formulating the question I've shown.

Cutting to the quick, are those defaults configured for making an
image of the entire contents of both my OS disk (SSD, C and my
internal HD (4 TB D?

I'll study your nice GIF later in IrfanView. Hope it turns out to be
the no-brainer I need!

P.S. Another reason for my hesitation is that I'm rapidly accumulating
a lot of backups and images, the output of a combination of Second
Copy and Win 10's own tools. Wish I'd specified a second internal 4 TB
;-)

--
Terry, East Grinstead, UK
  #26  
Old July 14th 16, 05:58 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 18,275
Default Backup Scheme for a New Laptop

Terry Pinnell wrote:
Paul wrote:

Terry Pinnell wrote:

Guess my next move is to try Macrium, although I don't relish yet more
learning when I'm still trying to make sense of Win 10 itself ;-(

This doesn't cover installing it, but
this covers a Backup in more detail than
necessary. I never save a backup definition
from one run to the next, so some of the slides
here, I don't use those pages.

http://s22.postimg.org/gxz3fdbch/Macrium6_Backup.gif

I made that for Macrium 6 because it added an extra page,
which is a bit confusing the first time you see it.

I can no longer make images that big on postimg, as
the last time I tried, the site downsampled my image.
Even though a large GIF can be economical in terms of
bytes used.

Paul


Many thanks, looks like it might help me make progress. I installed
Macrium and opened it but found the opening screen, with defaults
untouched, largely incomprehensible.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...Macrium-01.jpg

As you see, I got no further than formulating the question I've shown.


*Every* disk has those two items underneath it.

Click the disk line you are interested in, like click
Disk 1 to highlight it. The two items "Clone..." and "Image..."
should be underneath.

AFAIK, a backup specification is for a single disk at a time.
So if you have a GPT disk with 22 partitions on it,
you can back up the whole disk, MBR, track 1 (for Linux booters),
GPT (128MB), then the 22 partitions. Then, as you follow the
recipe, you get to pick an output disk for the MRIMG file.


Cutting to the quick, are those defaults configured for making an
image of the entire contents of both my OS disk (SSD, C and my
internal HD (4 TB D?


That would be two separate backup runs. I'm not aware of a way
to chain them together, unless that's a feature of the paid version.
You can schedule them, but because you don't know when the
first one is finished, it might be hard to make that the
trigger for starting the second (pre-defined0 backup run.


I'll study your nice GIF later in IrfanView. Hope it turns out to be
the no-brainer I need!

P.S. Another reason for my hesitation is that I'm rapidly accumulating
a lot of backups and images, the output of a combination of Second
Copy and Win 10's own tools. Wish I'd specified a second internal 4 TB
;-)


And compression doesn't really help that much, so
don't go there :-) As long as you have N+1 disks
and one disk is a spare for decompression, you
could entertain compression as an approach. But
it isn't very practical.

Paul
  #27  
Old July 20th 16, 11:10 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Alek
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Posts: 619
Default Backup Scheme for a New Laptop

Keith Nuttle wrote on 7/11/2016 4:19 PM:
On 7/11/2016 1:25 PM, Alek wrote:
My neighbor has decided to buy a new laptop. She is new to the idea of
making backups and is not computer literate. What backup scheme do you
think I should set up for her? She will have an external HD.

Thanks.

The easiest back up for Windows 10 is the built in back up program File
History. Control Panel, System Security, File History.

It is quite easy to set up, just click Turn On and specify the drive you
want the back up to be placed. Whenever that drive is connected the
program will copy all new and revised files to the disk. (The back up
disk should be connected periodically, and the computer connected long
enough for the back up to be completed.)

Windows 10 File History will create its own system of folders on the
back up disk. As you add or modify files the new/revised file will be
added to the back up with the date appended to the file name.

You can access the back up using File Explorer as you do any other
folder on a hard drive. As said above the original file will be
present followed with the file with the date appended to the original
file name. Using File Explorer you can scroll through the backups of
the file and select the date of the file you want to open.

I use File History on my desktop and sync my laptop to my desktop with a
third party program. I can easily retrieve all of the revision of all
files on the back up disk.


Once File History is turned in and the initial backup is made, can I
just leave it on, disconnect the external HD and back out of Control Panel.

When I next connect the HD, will it copy the new/revised files
automatically?

Thanks.

  #28  
Old July 20th 16, 11:16 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Alek
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 619
Default Backup Scheme for a New Laptop

Alek wrote on 7/20/2016 6:10 PM:

Once File History is turned in and the initial backup is made, can I
just leave it on, disconnect the external HD and back out of Control Panel.

When I next connect the HD, will it copy the new/revised files
automatically?

Thanks.


Answered my own question. No.

Start Control Panel File History
Run now

Great!!

Thanks again.
  #29  
Old July 21st 16, 03:28 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Ant[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 554
Default Backup Scheme for a New Laptop

Robert Brereton wrote:
What backup scheme do you
think I should set up for her? She will have an external HD.


I do a complete image after each 'patch Tuesday' and back up data files to
an NAS drive and an external USB drive whenever they are changed. I also
copy the data to a secondary USB drive which gets ejected from the PC after
the backup and stored elsewhere each night.


A complete disk image is a very useful thing to have, because if the Hard
disk fails or gets corrupted it can be up and running in pretty short order,
instead of spending several days getting it back to the state it was in
before the problems.


I do them before the big updates just in case the updates frak things up
and had a whole month to know if it is good enough to save an image. My
data backups are more often.
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