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What OS do most non-USA computers come with nowadays?



 
 
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  #16  
Old January 30th 17, 04:22 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Roger Blake[_2_]
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Posts: 536
Default What OS do most non-USA computers come with nowadays?

On 2017-01-30, Ann Dunham wrote:
In the USA, you get a computer with Windows. Period.
You don't get any other choice at a store.


That may be true at the big-box stores but is not necessarily the case
with small local computer shops building PCs from standard parts. A
friend ran one for years and would install anything that people wanted,
or sell the hardware with no OS if the customer wanted it that way. Most
people of course wanted Windows but I know some PCs went out the door with
other options.

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  #17  
Old January 30th 17, 04:36 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Ann Dunham
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Posts: 66
Default What OS do most non-USA computers come with nowadays?

Roger Blake replied:

That may be true at the big-box stores but is not necessarily the case
with small local computer shops building PCs from standard parts. A
friend ran one for years and would install anything that people wanted,
or sell the hardware with no OS if the customer wanted it that way. Most
people of course wanted Windows but I know some PCs went out the door with
other options.


At the big box stores, you will never get that option.

I wonder if it's the same at European big box stores though?

In the usa, in a big box store, it's Windows or Windows.

You'll never get the choice of Linux for example.
And you'll never get the choice of nothing (so you can DIY).

Is it the same in box stores in Europe?
  #18  
Old January 30th 17, 05:11 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Mayayana
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Posts: 6,438
Default What OS do most non-USA computers come with nowadays?

"Ann Dunham" wrote

| It's merely a business model question.
| You actually answered it using a business model answer.
|
| In Europe, do they use the same Windows or nothing business model?

I'm afraid I don't understand what you mean.
Windows or nothing? Do you mean 'do they pursue
a monopoly' in Eurpope? I live in the US, so I don't know
the European market. But MS have always made
their profits by monopoly. And they have a worldwide
monopoly on the only true productivity operating
system. So I don't see why they'd do things
differently in Europe than in the US.

For most of the past, only MS Office and
Windows made a profit. Everything else lost
money. Both are monopoly products, which
enables them to charge absurd prices for those
products. Their real product was and is monopoly.
(Yes, there's Libre Office and Linux, but the
business world uses almost exclusively Windows
and MS Office. And MS works hard to make it
very difficult for them to switch.)

Allegedly the MS cloud products are now turning
a good profit, but I don't know the details. I wonder
if anyone outside of MS *really* knows the details.

They also make something over $1 billion/year by
threatening Android phone makers with patent
lawsuits. Nearly all of them pay protection
money to Microsoft, even though, last I heard,
MS hadn't even said which patents they claimed
were being infringed. So Microsoft is making
more on Linux than on most of their own products!

http://www.businessinsider.com/micro...alties-2013-11

So.... Windows is primarily a monopoly product
but MS has been branching out and showing
themselves to be very resourceful. How will that
affect the Windows monopoly? That's hard to say.
Is there any reason that they might not find it
sensible at some point to drop Windows and just
run services over Linux kiosk devices? Maybe they
will do that, if it works out for them.

Bill Gates famously
tried to talk Warren Buffet into buying MS stock
with the argument that MS can't lose because they
get a "Windows tax" on every computer sold. Some
people may remember that back around 2000 MS
was actually threatening white box builders, claiming
that selling a box without an OS was tantamount
to software theft because anyone buying an empty
computer must surely be putting an illegal OS on it.
They were claiming that while they were also making
big money selling Windows disks at retail! The
intention was just to prevent people using Linux
without paying off MS. And later the cost of PCs
dropped, so that white box builders went out of
business, anyway.




  #19  
Old January 30th 17, 06:32 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
karebai
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Posts: 29
Default What OS do most non-USA computers come with nowadays?

As far as I know here in Australia, it is the same as US - new PC's
from stores here only supply Windows 10.

  #20  
Old January 30th 17, 08:04 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul[_32_]
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Posts: 11,873
Default What OS do most non-USA computers come with nowadays?

Nil wrote:
On 29 Jan 2017, Ann Dunham
wrote in alt.comp.os.windows-10:

Someone mentioned on the XP ng that all new non-Apple
decently-powered computers come with Windows 10 in the USA, which
I concur.


I concur. I have yet to see in any major commercial store for at least
the past year a Windows computer that *didn't* have Windows 10
installed.

A few refurbs persist that may come with Windows 8 or 7, but they are
increasing rare. Never XP any more.

Massachusetts USA.


The refurb PCs, if done right, actually have a "refurb OS"
installed. It's a separate SKU of OEM Windows, just for
refurbishers. As of November 2016 or so, that was the end
of legal deployment of refurbisher Windows, for anything
but Windows 10. Most of the stuff I was seeing advertised
up to that date, was Win7 Pro Refurbisher. The wheels just
seemed to fall off the refurbisher business model after
November. All the SKUs on Walmart went invalid, and so on.
(There is one big refurbisher, who uses Staples and Walmart
and similar, to sell their refurbished products.)

Will the refurbisher regroup, and deploy Win10 OEM ones ?
Maybe. If there were drivers for some of those old hulks.
It might cost them a new video card per box, and the
profit margins might not be there, even for something
as trivial as a stack of $40 video cards.

Paul
  #21  
Old January 30th 17, 10:27 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
VanguardLH[_2_]
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Posts: 10,881
Default What OS do most non-USA computers come with nowadays?

Mayayana on 2017/01/29 wrote:

Technically true, for the average person who thinks Best Buy is the
place to get a computer.


If you don't follow the lemmings that buy pre-builts and instead build
your own, you can put any OS on it (well, any OS that supports the
hardware you used).

If I'm building a Linux box, my hardware requirements are lower. If I'm
building a Windows box, my hardware requirements are higher hence the
box is more expensive. If I'm building a gaming box, it's a Windows box
(due to the dearth of Linux video games) but it doesn't have to be a
Win10 box. Just whatever the games demand. Typically I look at what I
want the OS to run and then choose the OS, not ass backwards and choose
the OS to then see what it will run.
  #22  
Old January 30th 17, 10:48 AM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
UnsteadyKen[_2_]
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Posts: 34
Default What OS do most non-USA computers come with nowadays?

In article , AnnDunham90210
@spammenot.gmail.com says...
If it's true that in the UK, the average Intel or AMD X86/X64
laptop/desktop does NOT come with Windows 10, that's interesting since
they're all Windows 10 in the USA


It is the same here as the rest of the world, Windows 10 rules the
roost.
Check it out at the biggest (Ithink) UK national PC chain..
http://www.pcworld.co.uk/



  #23  
Old January 30th 17, 01:45 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul[_32_]
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Posts: 11,873
Default What OS do most non-USA computers come with nowadays?

UnsteadyKen wrote:
In article , AnnDunham90210
@spammenot.gmail.com says...
If it's true that in the UK, the average Intel or AMD X86/X64
laptop/desktop does NOT come with Windows 10, that's interesting since
they're all Windows 10 in the USA


It is the same here as the rest of the world, Windows 10 rules the
roost.
Check it out at the biggest (Ithink) UK national PC chain..
http://www.pcworld.co.uk/


But the same site also sells Chromebooks, whatever those are.

http://www.pcworld.co.uk/gbuk/chrome...l?s=chromebook

Or, an Android Tablet (10.2" in this case).

http://www.pcworld.co.uk/gbuk/comput...47260-pdt.html

Chances are, Microsoft provides incentive money to make sure
there is a Windows section at your local store. But if you want
something else, it's hiding there.

Paul

  #24  
Old January 30th 17, 02:08 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Mayayana
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Posts: 6,438
Default What OS do most non-USA computers come with nowadays?

"VanguardLH" wrote

| If you don't follow the lemmings that buy pre-builts and instead build
| your own, you can put any OS on it (well, any OS that supports the
| hardware you used).
|
| If I'm building a Linux box, my hardware requirements are lower. If I'm
| building a Windows box, my hardware requirements are higher hence the
| box is more expensive.

I wouldn't entirely disagree, but... hardware is
so powerful these days that there's no need to
get more powerful stuff for anything other than
obsessive gaming. I just built a Win7 box for
about $650, including a 6-3.5 MHz-core AMD
CPU, an SSD and a regular hard disk. The graphics,
audio and network are all on the board, for $55.
The total included the overpriced Windows disk,
which would have been the only savings with Linux.
With a $100 CPU and a $55 board, there's not
much that can be trimmed from that cost. Yet
it's crazy powerful.


  #25  
Old January 30th 17, 02:11 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Paul[_32_]
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Posts: 11,873
Default What OS do most non-USA computers come with nowadays?

VanguardLH wrote:

If I'm building a gaming box, it's a Windows box
(due to the dearth of Linux video games)


It might all depend on whether you started with the
Linux box, and then went looking for the games.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_gaming

If a title was developed using OpenGL as the
graphics engine, there's a better possibility of
it being ported to both environments. I can remember
some game or games in Windows, where I was expected
to find a copy of "opengl32.dll" on the computer,
and throw that into the game folder :-)

Paul
  #26  
Old January 30th 17, 02:16 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Yousuf Khan[_2_]
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Posts: 2,447
Default What OS do most non-USA computers come with nowadays?

On 1/29/2017 7:55 PM, Ann Dunham wrote:
Someone mentioned on the XP ng that all new non-Apple decently-powered
computers come with Windows 10 in the USA, which I concur.

Sure, tablets exist, chromebooks exist, Linux and Macs exist, but that's
not the question.

The question is related to the fact that if you go to any "computer" store
in the USA (Costco, Best Buy, Frys, whatever), and you buy a computer (not
a tablet or chromebook), you're not going to get Windows-anything-but-10 on
it by default.

I'm just asking whether that's the same situation in the rest of the world.


In Canada, it's mostly Windows 10. The only time you can get something
other than Win 10 installed is if you build your own custom computer.
But typically, most OEM's as per their agreement with Microsoft will
only install Windows 10 by default.

Microsoft always expects new computers to get installed with their
latest OS's.

Yousuf Khan

  #27  
Old January 30th 17, 02:24 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Stephen Wolstenholme[_6_]
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Posts: 275
Default What OS do most non-USA computers come with nowadays?

On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 00:55:59 +0000 (UTC), Ann Dunham
wrote:

Someone mentioned on the XP ng that all new non-Apple decently-powered
computers come with Windows 10 in the USA, which I concur.

Sure, tablets exist, chromebooks exist, Linux and Macs exist, but that's
not the question.

The question is related to the fact that if you go to any "computer" store
in the USA (Costco, Best Buy, Frys, whatever), and you buy a computer (not
a tablet or chromebook), you're not going to get Windows-anything-but-10 on
it by default.

I'm just asking whether that's the same situation in the rest of the world.


It's basically the same here in the UK. All PC from retail outlets
come with W10 installed. Most of the online suppliers push W10 as
well. Some offer to supply other OS versions but usually charge more
because somebody has to do a bit of work.

Steve

--
Neural Network Software for Windows http://www.npsnn.com

  #28  
Old January 30th 17, 02:35 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Michael Logies
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Posts: 225
Default What OS do most non-USA computers come with nowadays?

Same situation in germany. Linux is a bit more used here than in the
US.

On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 00:55:59 +0000 (UTC), Ann Dunham
wrote:

Someone mentioned on the XP ng that all new non-Apple decently-powered
computers come with Windows 10 in the USA, which I concur.

Sure, tablets exist, chromebooks exist, Linux and Macs exist, but that's
not the question.

The question is related to the fact that if you go to any "computer" store
in the USA (Costco, Best Buy, Frys, whatever), and you buy a computer (not
a tablet or chromebook), you're not going to get Windows-anything-but-10 on
it by default.

I'm just asking whether that's the same situation in the rest of the world.


  #29  
Old January 30th 17, 02:45 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
Stephen Wolstenholme[_6_]
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Posts: 275
Default What OS do most non-USA computers come with nowadays?

On Mon, 30 Jan 2017 02:08:22 +0000, Good Guy
wrote:

On 30/01/2017 00:55, Ann Dunham wrote:


I'm just asking whether that's the same situation in the rest of the world.


You say you are just asking but if you are thinking of buying a new
machine then you should never go back to Windows 7 or 8 or 8.1. Windows
10 is here and you have to get used to it. There is nothing wrong with
Windows 10. In fact people I work with seems to love it and the
productivity has gone up.


I upgraded to W10 to make sure that the software that I write and sell
worked OK. All the software I produce worked OK.

While W10 was still loaded I ran a copy of my favourite game and found
it would not work. The game is Age of Mythology, the Titans expansion.
Apparently it's a driver problem that Microsoft has not fixed despite
the game being from Microsoft Game Studios.

Steve

--
Neural Network Software for Windows http://www.npsnn.com

  #30  
Old January 30th 17, 03:16 PM posted to alt.comp.os.windows-10
PAS[_2_]
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Posts: 83
Default What OS do most non-USA computers come with nowadays?

On 1/29/2017 11:11 PM, Mayayana wrote:
"Ann Dunham" wrote

| It's merely a business model question.
| You actually answered it using a business model answer.
|
| In Europe, do they use the same Windows or nothing business model?

I'm afraid I don't understand what you mean.
Windows or nothing? Do you mean 'do they pursue
a monopoly' in Eurpope? I live in the US, so I don't know
the European market. But MS have always made
their profits by monopoly. And they have a worldwide
monopoly on the only true productivity operating
system. So I don't see why they'd do things
differently in Europe than in the US.

For most of the past, only MS Office and
Windows made a profit. Everything else lost
money. Both are monopoly products, which
enables them to charge absurd prices for those
products. Their real product was and is monopoly.
(Yes, there's Libre Office and Linux, but the
business world uses almost exclusively Windows
and MS Office. And MS works hard to make it
very difficult for them to switch.)


I don't think I would agree that the cost of a Windows license is
absurd. People pay hundreds of dollars for licenses for software like
Photoshop and others. Is $120 an absurd price for the OS that you need
to run all of the other software on? I don't think so. The cost of MS
Office, that's another story.


Allegedly the MS cloud products are now turning
a good profit, but I don't know the details. I wonder
if anyone outside of MS *really* knows the details.

They also make something over $1 billion/year by
threatening Android phone makers with patent
lawsuits. Nearly all of them pay protection
money to Microsoft, even though, last I heard,
MS hadn't even said which patents they claimed
were being infringed. So Microsoft is making
more on Linux than on most of their own products!

http://www.businessinsider.com/micro...alties-2013-11

So.... Windows is primarily a monopoly product
but MS has been branching out and showing
themselves to be very resourceful. How will that
affect the Windows monopoly? That's hard to say.
Is there any reason that they might not find it
sensible at some point to drop Windows and just
run services over Linux kiosk devices? Maybe they
will do that, if it works out for them.

Bill Gates famously
tried to talk Warren Buffet into buying MS stock
with the argument that MS can't lose because they
get a "Windows tax" on every computer sold. Some
people may remember that back around 2000 MS
was actually threatening white box builders, claiming
that selling a box without an OS was tantamount
to software theft because anyone buying an empty
computer must surely be putting an illegal OS on it.
They were claiming that while they were also making
big money selling Windows disks at retail! The
intention was just to prevent people using Linux
without paying off MS. And later the cost of PCs
dropped, so that white box builders went out of
business, anyway.





 




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