Win8 on a laptop

I've been through most of the Windows variants over the last 20 years,
and still say XP was the best of a bad bunch. Now on 7 Home Premium on
desk and lap tops.

My neighbour (almost 60 years old) is about to take the plunge and get a
laptop - make, model, etc yet to be decided, and only has experience on
work based XP machines in a factory. So 3 questions:

1. What is the general opinion of Windows 8 (most likely the Home
edition) running on a non-touch-screen laptop? (I think I know the
answer, and I don't think I like it!)

2. Will I (over 65 years old) be able to teach him the basics of working
with Windows 8, having no experience whatsoever of that particular OS?

3. If I've managed to get older programs running on Win7, what are the
chances of them running on Win8? (MS Office 2000, Paint Shop Pro 9, for
instance.)

Thanks in advance?

jim

1. It runs fine.

2. Google for instructions on how to bring back the start button and
start menu, how to boot directly to the desktop, etc.

3. Just a WAG, but if they'll run on 7, they will probably run on 8.


jbm has written on 8/11/2013 11:39 PM:
I've been through most of the Windows variants over the last 20 years,
and still say XP was the best of a bad bunch. Now on 7 Home Premium on
desk and lap tops.

My neighbour (almost 60 years old) is about to take the plunge and get a
laptop - make, model, etc yet to be decided, and only has experience on
work based XP machines in a factory. So 3 questions:

1. What is the general opinion of Windows 8 (most likely the Home
edition) running on a non-touch-screen laptop? (I think I know the
answer, and I don't think I like it!)

2. Will I (over 65 years old) be able to teach him the basics of working
with Windows 8, having no experience whatsoever of that particular OS?

3. If I've managed to get older programs running on Win7, what are the
chances of them running on Win8? (MS Office 2000, Paint Shop Pro 9, for
instance.)

Thanks in advance?

jim

Juan Wei wrote:

1. It runs fine.

2. Google for instructions on how to bring back the start button and
start menu, how to boot directly to the desktop, etc.

3. Just a WAG, but if they'll run on 7, they will probably run on 8.


jbm has written on 8/11/2013 11:39 PM:
I've been through most of the Windows variants over the last 20 years,
and still say XP was the best of a bad bunch. Now on 7 Home Premium on
desk and lap tops.

My neighbour (almost 60 years old) is about to take the plunge and get a
laptop - make, model, etc yet to be decided, and only has experience on
work based XP machines in a factory. So 3 questions:

1. What is the general opinion of Windows 8 (most likely the Home
edition) running on a non-touch-screen laptop? (I think I know the
answer, and I don't think I like it!)

2. Will I (over 65 years old) be able to teach him the basics of working
with Windows 8, having no experience whatsoever of that particular OS?

3. If I've managed to get older programs running on Win7, what are the
chances of them running on Win8? (MS Office 2000, Paint Shop Pro 9, for
instance.)

Thanks in advance?

jim


in this instance youtube is your best friend. Youtube should be all you need
to get started. Once you get past the metro interface, win 8 is basicly the
same as win 7.

But remeber one thing win8.1 will be released some time this year. You can
download win8.1 preview and install that inside of virtualbox which is free
to download.

And then you and your freind can learn together before you and your friend
take the plunge.

On Mon, 12 Aug 2013 04:39:06 +0100, jbm wrote:

I've been through most of the Windows variants over the last 20 years,
and still say XP was the best of a bad bunch. Now on 7 Home Premium on
desk and lap tops.

My neighbour (almost 60 years old) is about to take the plunge and get a
laptop - make, model, etc yet to be decided, and only has experience on
work based XP machines in a factory. So 3 questions:

1. What is the general opinion of Windows 8 (most likely the Home
edition) running on a non-touch-screen laptop? (I think I know the
answer, and I don't think I like it!)

I'm 74 and managed with a Lenovo G780. My biggest problem was I
forgot my startup password and couldn't figure our that the
information on how to bypass it was also the key to press,
embarrassing for someone who played Adventure on S/360 at IBM's SRI.
The most important key is Fn, F6; it disables the mouse pad. I use a
wired Logitech mouse. Use the Microsoft key to get to the Start menu,
the other paths are for later in the learning curve; however I used
Windows 7 file recovery -- system image for backup often and early.

2. Will I (over 65 years old) be able to teach him the basics of working
with Windows 8, having no experience whatsoever of that particular OS?

3. If I've managed to get older programs running on Win7, what are the
chances of them running on Win8? (MS Office 2000, Paint Shop Pro 9, for
instance.)

Thanks in advance?

jim

On 8/12/2013 5:39 AM, jbm wrote:
I've been through most of the Windows variants over the last 20 years,
and still say XP was the best of a bad bunch. Now on 7 Home Premium on
desk and lap tops.

My neighbour (almost 60 years old) is about to take the plunge and get a
laptop - make, model, etc yet to be decided, and only has experience on
work based XP machines in a factory. So 3 questions:

1. What is the general opinion of Windows 8 (most likely the Home
edition) running on a non-touch-screen laptop? (I think I know the
answer, and I don't think I like it!)

2. Will I (over 65 years old) be able to teach him the basics of working
with Windows 8, having no experience whatsoever of that particular OS?

3. If I've managed to get older programs running on Win7, what are the
chances of them running on Win8? (MS Office 2000, Paint Shop Pro 9, for
instance.)

Thanks in advance?

jim

Laptops are available with Windows 7.

--
Alias

The only real problems are avarice, anger and stupidity.

On Mon, 12 Aug 2013 04:39:06 +0100, jbm wrote:

I've been through most of the Windows variants over the last 20 years,
and still say XP was the best of a bad bunch.

Next!

jbm wrote:
I've been through most of the Windows variants over the last 20 years,
and still say XP was the best of a bad bunch. Now on 7 Home Premium on
desk and lap tops.

My neighbour (almost 60 years old) is about to take the plunge and get a
laptop - make, model, etc yet to be decided, and only has experience on
work based XP machines in a factory. So 3 questions:

1. What is the general opinion of Windows 8 (most likely the Home
edition) running on a non-touch-screen laptop? (I think I know the
answer, and I don't think I like it!)

2. Will I (over 65 years old) be able to teach him the basics of working
with Windows 8, having no experience whatsoever of that particular OS?

3. If I've managed to get older programs running on Win7, what are the
chances of them running on Win8? (MS Office 2000, Paint Shop Pro 9, for
instance.)

Thanks in advance?

jim

The Windows 8 laptop, with OEM Windows, may have "downgrade rights"
to Windows 7. You might want to check into that. This is only for
OEM versions, and you want to be absolutely sure the option is
available, before planning to do it this way.

http://en.community.dell.com/support.../20304938.aspx

*******

There's a free introduction to W8 here. If you want to read about
it first. At least it shows some pictures of the "new Start screen"
with the tiles.

https://marketing.dell.com/Global/Fi...ws-8-ebook.pdf

*******

The Win 8.1 Preview has a license key good until Jan15, and you
can use this as a "demo device" for another user to play with.
The 8.1 only has a slight refinement of the 8.0 design, so
behaves largely the same (for someone who is only familiar
with WinXP).

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/w...eview-download

To give the neighbor a demo on your laptop:

1) Remove the existing Win7 hard drive.
Purchase a blank drive (SATA or IDE, your laptop is likely SATA),
making sure the drive thickness is appropriate for the drive bay
(9.5mm or whatever). With the blank drive screwed into place, insert
the DVD downloaded from above, and install the OS. Virtually any
SATA 2.5" you buy today, should have sufficient capacity for a
demo install.

2) Give the neighbor (and yourself) a demo.

3) If the neighbor doesn't like it, install ClassicShell or
Start8 or whatever, to add menus back in.

4) When you "want your good ole laptop back", unscrew the
temporary hard drive in the laptop, and put the Windows 7 drive
back.

My laptop makes drive swapping pretty easy. Not as easy
as my desktop, but easy enough.

If you thought for some reason, your Windows 7 laptop could
not run Windows 8, you can test first with this. The Upgrade
Assistant can warn you about hardware incompatibility.

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/w...e-to-windows-8

If no Windows 8 video driver is available (say, you loaded 8.1
on the neighbor's desktop machine), then the screen stays
"stuck at 1024x768". Which isn't the best demo vehicle for
Windows 8. My second best machine is stuck that way, and
needs a new video card.

So you do have the ingredients to do some testing
for yourself. Until Jan.15, when the preview license expires.

Paul

"jbm" wrote in message

I've been through most of the Windows variants over the
last 20 years, and still say XP was the best of a bad
bunch. Now on 7 Home Premium on desk and lap tops.

My neighbour (almost 60 years old) is about to take the
plunge and get a laptop - make, model, etc yet to be
decided, and only has experience on work based XP
machines in a factory. So 3 questions:
1. What is the general opinion of Windows 8 (most likely
the Home edition) running on a non-touch-screen laptop?
(I think I know the answer, and I don't think I like it!)

It is fine, laptop or desktop makes no difference. The main differences...

1. The sucker is HUGE! Sixteen gigs out of the box.

2. MS wants you to use their pretty "metro" screen...the one with all the
big icons that open everything full screen and which have no simple, obvious
way to minimize or close. Anyone that has ever used anything other than a
phone is likely to hate "metro". Fortunately, it is easy to get around it.

3. There is no start button or anything associated with it (though they are
accessible in other, convoluted ways).

4. It is much more nannyish than XP or its predecessors (can't say about
Vista or Win7, skipped over them). MS wants to protect us from
ourselves...MS knows best...what's good for Genetal Bullmoose is good for
the nation...

5. One can only have one taskbar on the desktop - once you get there -
rather than four

6. It is quite stable.
________________________

2. Will I (over 65 years old) be able to teach him the
basics of working with Windows 8, having no experience
whatsoever of that particular OS?

An OS is an OS. I'm 80 and had no problems. Especially after I installed
Classic Shell to bypass the log in and metro screens and stick up a start
button. There are other programs to do the same, CS is free, easy and works
well, can't say about the others.
_________________________

3. If I've managed to get older programs running on Win7,
what are the chances of them running on Win8? (MS Office
2000, Paint Shop Pro 9, for instance.)

MS says that if they work on Win 7 they'll work on Win 8
__________________________

Regarding the free update to Win 8.1, I'll be passing on it. My Win 8 is
working like and looks like Win XP; I have no reason to update and am not
about to take a chance that I'll have to tweak Win 8.1 to what I want.


--

dadiOH
____________________________

Winters getting colder? Tired of the rat race?
Taxes out of hand? Maybe just ready for a change?
Check it out... http://www.floridaloghouse.net

Per jbm:
1. What is the general opinion of Windows 8 (most likely the Home
edition) running on a non-touch-screen laptop? (I think I know the
answer, and I don't think I like it!)

Devil's Advocate Position: For a stone technophobe like my #2 daughter,
I can imagine the Metro interface might be a good thing.

Right now, I have her Windows 7 desktop set up functionally like the
Metro interface: just a few icons with self-explanatory labels ("Mail",
"Internet", and so-forth.

That being said, it's anathema to me and I wouldn't even think of buying
anything until 8.1 comes out.
--
Pete Cresswell

Hi, dadiOH.

jbm said:
My neighbour (almost 60 years old) is about to take the plunge and get a
laptop...

2. Will I (over 65 years old) be able to teach him...

You said:
...An OS is an OS. I'm 80 and had no problems....

I say:
Don't we get tired of seeing these young whippersnappers use AGE as an
excuse to stop learning? Or teaching? (I'm only 78.)

Problems that often come with age (failing eyesight, arthritis, other
physical or mental disabilities) are legitimate reasons, of course, but
those can happen to folks in their 30's or even earlier. Age itself is, in
my opinion, NOT an excuse to stop learning.

It might be nice to be only 60 - or 65 - again. But I've learned a lot
since then! When I turned 60 (July 1995), we were waiting for Windows 95
(August 1995). Win98, WinNT4, WinXP, Vista, Win7 - and now Win8/8.1 - were
still ahead of me. Plus things like dual-booting, DVDs, USB, SATA...and oh,
so many more. What do you suppose the next 20 years will bring us?

RC
--
R. C. White, CPA
San Marcos, TX

Microsoft Windows MVP (2002-2010)
Windows Live Mail 2012 (Build 16.4.3508.0205) in Win8 Pro


"dadiOH" wrote in message ...

"jbm" wrote in message

I've been through most of the Windows variants over the
last 20 years, and still say XP was the best of a bad
bunch. Now on 7 Home Premium on desk and lap tops.

My neighbour (almost 60 years old) is about to take the
plunge and get a laptop - make, model, etc yet to be
decided, and only has experience on work based XP
machines in a factory. So 3 questions:
1. What is the general opinion of Windows 8 (most likely
the Home edition) running on a non-touch-screen laptop?
(I think I know the answer, and I don't think I like it!)

It is fine, laptop or desktop makes no difference. The main differences...

1. The sucker is HUGE! Sixteen gigs out of the box.

2. MS wants you to use their pretty "metro" screen...the one with all the
big icons that open everything full screen and which have no simple, obvious
way to minimize or close. Anyone that has ever used anything other than a
phone is likely to hate "metro". Fortunately, it is easy to get around it.

3. There is no start button or anything associated with it (though they are
accessible in other, convoluted ways).

4. It is much more nannyish than XP or its predecessors (can't say about
Vista or Win7, skipped over them). MS wants to protect us from
ourselves...MS knows best...what's good for Genetal Bullmoose is good for
the nation...

5. One can only have one taskbar on the desktop - once you get there -
rather than four

6. It is quite stable.
________________________

2. Will I (over 65 years old) be able to teach him the
basics of working with Windows 8, having no experience
whatsoever of that particular OS?

An OS is an OS. I'm 80 and had no problems. Especially after I installed
Classic Shell to bypass the log in and metro screens and stick up a start
button. There are other programs to do the same, CS is free, easy and works
well, can't say about the others.
_________________________

3. If I've managed to get older programs running on Win7,
what are the chances of them running on Win8? (MS Office
2000, Paint Shop Pro 9, for instance.)

MS says that if they work on Win 7 they'll work on Win 8
__________________________

Regarding the free update to Win 8.1, I'll be passing on it. My Win 8 is
working like and looks like Win XP; I have no reason to update and am not
about to take a chance that I'll have to tweak Win 8.1 to what I want.


--

dadiOH

On Mon, 12 Aug 2013 08:53:21 -0400, "dadiOH"
wrote in Re Win8 on a laptop:

MS knows best

Yes, you can see that here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvsboPUjrGc
--
Web based forums are like subscribing to 10 different newspapers
and having to visit 10 different news stands to pickup each one.
Email list-server groups and USENET are like having all of those
newspapers delivered to your door every morning.

dadiOH wrote:
out of the box.

2. MS wants you to use their pretty "metro" screen...the one with all the
big icons that open everything full screen and which have no simple, obvious
way to minimize or close. Anyone that ever used anything other than a
phone is likely to hate "metro". Fortunately, it is easy to get around it.


Microsoft is trying to make Windows system like other devices in your
house like set-top boxes for TV, TV itself, HI-FI, Washing Machine etc
etc. People don't complain about these and they all use some software
of a kind. My Humax set-top box uses Linux OS but I don't need to know
anything about it; All I need is switches on my Remote or on the
set-top box; Same thing applies with TV that uses some software to make
RC work and changes channels and downloads TV programs..

Why should Windows system be different? All you need is switches to
browse the Internet, or to launch Microsoft Office. You don't need to
know anything about the OS as an ordinary user of Windows system. Use
it as another device that you need to get by to survive on this planet.
Nobody in the developed world can survive without a washing machine
or a TV.

Thanks for the prompt feed back folks. Much appreciated.

Doesn't seem there's too much to worry about, and if I sit down and
think hard enough, I should be able to get him started.

His main interests are Facebook (ugh!) to keep in touch with his (rather
large and well spread) family, and he has already told me (not asked)
that he is going to be borrowing most of my extensive music library!!!
For the former he'll have to find someone else to help him, and for the
latter I have all the hardware (a lot of it is still on R2R and
Shellac), software and expertise to get him up and running. I assume
installing programs is the same as Win7, straight forward so long as
they want to install on that OS!!!

jim

Don't we get tired of seeing these young whippersnappers use AGE as an
excuse to stop learning? Or teaching? (I'm only 78.)

Problems that often come with age (failing eyesight, arthritis, other
physical or mental disabilities) are legitimate reasons, of course, but
those can happen to folks in their 30's or even earlier. Age itself is,
in my opinion, NOT an excuse to stop learning.

This has been constantly forgotten by pros, geeks, and techies (because
such self-centered perception) - People have different interests and
priorities, and to many, if not majority, learning computer is not one
of them.

It's not they (I) don't want to learn and teach using computers; it's
that why we have to learn for doing the same things?

It's like people have to learn how to drive every 3-5 years for buying
and driving a new car?

We buy products for our own interests, not for "any company's vision" be
it Apple, Toyota, Samsung, Google or Microsoft.

You have every right to enjoy playing with computers, except you should
be "old enough" to know to respect others' interests and priorities.




On 8/12/2013 22:05, R. C. White wrote:
Hi, dadiOH.

jbm said:
My neighbour (almost 60 years old) is about to take the plunge and
get a laptop...

2. Will I (over 65 years old) be able to teach him...

You said:
...An OS is an OS. I'm 80 and had no problems....

I say:
Don't we get tired of seeing these young whippersnappers use AGE as an
excuse to stop learning? Or teaching? (I'm only 78.)

Problems that often come with age (failing eyesight, arthritis, other
physical or mental disabilities) are legitimate reasons, of course, but
those can happen to folks in their 30's or even earlier. Age itself is,
in my opinion, NOT an excuse to stop learning.

It might be nice to be only 60 - or 65 - again. But I've learned a lot
since then! When I turned 60 (July 1995), we were waiting for Windows
95 (August 1995). Win98, WinNT4, WinXP, Vista, Win7 - and now Win8/8.1
- were still ahead of me. Plus things like dual-booting, DVDs, USB,
SATA...and oh, so many more. What do you suppose the next 20 years will
bring us?

RC
--
R. C. White, CPA
San Marcos, TX

Microsoft Windows MVP (2002-2010)
Windows Live Mail 2012 (Build 16.4.3508.0205) in Win8 Pro

"jbm" wrote in message ...


I've been through most of the Windows variants over the last 20 years,
and still say XP was the best of a bad bunch. Now on 7 Home Premium on
desk and lap tops.

My neighbour (almost 60 years old) is about to take the plunge and get a
laptop - make, model, etc yet to be decided, and only has experience on
work based XP machines in a factory. So 3 questions:
1. What is the general opinion of Windows 8 (most likely the Home
edition) running on a non-touch-screen laptop? (I think I know the
answer, and I don't think I like it!)
2. Will I (over 65 years old) be able to teach him the basics of working
with Windows 8, having no experience whatsoever of that particular OS?
3. If I've managed to get older programs running on Win7, what are the
chances of them running on Win8? (MS Office 2000, Paint Shop Pro 9, for
instance.)


For the most part the neighbor will be fine.
1. Win8 is different but as with anything new after a short time easily
adaptable
- fyi (Win8 comes in two flavors for the general public on pre-built
machines Windows 8 and Windows 8 Pro, i.e. there is no Home Edition)
2. Likewise if you've never used Windows 8, you'll have a learning curve
prior to teaching anyone..once one understands the Win8 Modern Menu (Start
Screen) or using the Win8 Desktop mode then you'll both be fine. The Win8
Desktop mode provides the majority of the same options as Windows 7 and
prior o/s.
3. Older programs may or may not run on Win8 (if they do, not all features
may function)

....winston
msft mvp consumer apps