No USB3 after Cloning

Al Drake wrote:
On 7/1/2015 5:39 PM, Paul wrote:
Al Drake wrote:
On 7/1/2015 4:40 AM, Paul wrote:
Al Drake wrote:
On 6/29/2015 8:55 PM, JT wrote:
Al Drake wrote:

On 6/28/2015 8:53 PM, JT wrote:
Al Drake wrote:

On 6/28/2015 1:41 AM, JT wrote:
Al Drake wrote:

I fear I'm probably at the end of my limited knowledge - I
leave you in the expert hands of Paul (-:. Hope I helped
clarify a few things though.

On a final attempt I tried again to restore an image with
Macrium Reflect 6 to a Crucial SSD and got the same failed
results. I plugged in a second SSD inside a USB3 docking
station and watched it try to install the drive but fail. In
front of me now I am viewing a window that reports "Device
driver software was not successfully installed". I made sure
I shut down the PSU before installing the cloned SSD and
booting. In BIOS I can see this drive along with a USB Stick
but just not within Windows. It's looking more and more like
a fresh install onto my M.2 SSD when it arrives Monday.

It may be worth trying to re-install the Chipset drivers.
They can be found at the manufacturers website.

JT

I just looked at the SSD that doesn't see the UBS devices and used
UBS TREE VIEW http://www.uwe-sieber.de/usbtreeview_e.html

What I see are the driver locations with no indication that
anything is not working. The exact same as when I use that
application with the original SSD.

Everything looks good other than the fact that these drives don't
show and device manager shows them with the yellow explanation
mark.

I was refering to the motherboard chipset driver.
What make and model is the computer?

JT


It's a home brew Gigabyte Z97X-US5H motherboard with an i7 4790K 32
Gig of Crucial DDr3-1600.

USB drivers available he
http://www.gigabyte.com/products/pro...px?pid=4950#dl

Just choose driver and O/S version, the USB 3.0 driver is listed.

JT


Jt, I couldn't get that process to work after trying many times. At
the site I selected Rev1. I downloaded the USB driver package and
UnZipped it to a folder and in Device Manager I tried to reinstall
driver pointing to that directory but ths system found no drivers that
were accepted. I tried again and again with nothing happening. I also
tried running a setup file which only made things worse where another
device showed up in Device Manager with no driver attached and I
couldn't get rid of it. I simply must be doing something wrong. There
are some instructions in the unpacked folder that are simple which I
followed but the System seems happy with the drivers it has and won't
accept another. I tried removing the device but that also was
unsuccessful.

Now I'm trying another clone attempt using AOMEI where it
specifically says Copy sector to sector. I'll have to try this early
in the A.M. as it looks like it's going to take several hours.

I'll post back if I have any positive luck,

Thanks.

Al - I suspect what you'll find, is of the six USB3 ports,
two of the ports work, and the other four don't behave properly.

http://i58.tinypic.com/sgitg2.gif

The Z97 presents one USB3 port, which feeds a 1:4 hub chip.
It could be that hub chip causing the problem. I would expect
the two "direct connection" ports to work, while the four ports
running off the hub, will need the OS to install a hub driver.

There doesn't seem to be a driver for the 720210 that
I can find.

HTH,
Paul

Thanks Paul. I'll study every possibility carefully. All I can add at
this point is that with the original SSD in place everything seems
fine. I can leave the same UBS3 ports attached to the same devices and
use the cloned SSD and then starts the trouble so obviously any non
working ports are showing or not showing depending.

I keep wondering if it will be easier to fresh install on a Crucial
just for a raw backup. My trouble began when I went with Samsung. I'll
try again using different ports. I'm glad I still have the system
mounted on a test case.

http://www.thinkcomputers.org/tag/pc-test-bench/

Using your USB port viewing software, you may be able to
tell the difference between the ports as you plug stuff
in now (in working state). Of the three stacks on the
back of the machine, one stack probably has the working
pair, while the other two stacks, something happens.

What I don't like about this, is how that hub is supposed
to get a driver. I could understand on an OS with built-in
USB3 support, but I don't understand what that hub would
do on an older OS (and no driver available). AFAIK, Win7
shouldn't have a driver.

Paul

OK, I'm seeing a difference from the workable OS(Macrium) and the
Crucial(USB3 problems)

Macrium
+++++++++++++++++ Device Information ++++++++++++++++++
Device Description : USB Mass Storage Device
Device ID : USB\VID_0BC2&PID_3312\NA4KB7D1
Driver KeyName : {36fc9e60-c465-11cf-8056-444553540000}\0029
(GUID_DEVCLASS_USB)
Driver : C:\Windows\system32\DRIVERS\USBSTOR.SYS
(Version: 6.1.7601.17577 Date: 2006-06-21)
Driver Inf : C:\Windows\INF\usbstor.inf
Legacy BusType : PNPBus
Class : USB
Service : USBSTOR
Enumerator : USB
Location Info : Port_#0020.Hub_#0001
Location IDs : PCIROOT(0)#PCI(1400)#USBROOT(0)#USB(20)
Container ID : {c5d05e46-5542-58be-a22e-1961f1936ef8}
Manufacturer Info : Compatible USB storage device
Capabilities : Removable, UniqueID, RawDeviceOK,
SurpriseRemovalOK
Address : 20
Problem Code : 0
Power State : D0 (supported: D0, D3, wake from D0)
Child Device 1 : Disk drive
Device ID :
USBSTOR\DISK&VEN_SEAGATE&PROD_EXPANSION_DESK&REV_0 740\NA4KB7D1&0
Class : DiskDrive
Volume :
\\?\Volume{22b7c5d8-0acd-11e4-918a-ba9c130bc9dc}\
Kernel Name : \Device\HarddiskVolume3
Mountpoint : E:\


Crucial

+++++++++++++++++ Device Information ++++++++++++++++++
Device Description : USB Mass Storage Device
Device ID : USB\VID_0BC2&PID_3312\NA4KB7D1
Driver KeyName : {36fc9e60-c465-11cf-8056-444553540000}\0029
(GUID_DEVCLASS_USB)
Driver : C:\Windows\system32\DRIVERS\USBSTOR.SYS
(Version: 6.1.7601.17577 Date: 2006-06-21)
Driver Inf : C:\Windows\INF\usbstor.inf
Legacy BusType : PNPBus
Class : USB
Service : USBSTOR
Enumerator : USB
Location Info : Port_#0020.Hub_#0001
Location IDs : PCIROOT(0)#PCI(1400)#USBROOT(0)#USB(20)
Container ID : {c5d05e46-5542-58be-a22e-1961f1936ef8}
Manufacturer Info : Compatible USB storage device
Capabilities : Removable, UniqueID, RawDeviceOK,
SurpriseRemovalOK
Address : 20
Problem Code : 0
Power State : D0 (supported: D0, D3, wake from D0)
Child Device 1 : Disk drive
Device ID :
USBSTOR\DISK&VEN_SEAGATE&PROD_EXPANSION_DESK&REV_0 740\NA4KB7D1&0
Class : DiskDrive

As you can see the Crucial shows no "Mountpoint" among other
alterations but I have no idea why.

So it's not mounting it for some reason.

Since it knows it is USBStor, it almost looks like the PHY layer
is OK. It's making the connection OK.

OK, I know what it is :-) It's a "disk identifier problem". Your
cloning method did too good a job. There are multiple identifiers.
On some identifiers, it's OK for them to be the same. For example,
I can have two partitions with label "WinXP" if I want, and they
won't clash. But there is at least one identifier, that if it is
the same, you cannot mount the disk.

You should be looking in Disk Management right now. There
is an error message waiting for you :-) If you don't know
how to get there, run "diskmgmt.msc".

http://www.howtohaven.com/system/cha...ignature.shtml

"This disk is offline because it
has a signature collision with another disk"

"diskpart...
uniqueid disk ID=[NEW SIGNATURE]"

I think I've seen that problem here, at least once.

Your original description gave the impression the port
was not operational. But the above shows the PHY (physical layer)
is fine. And only the cloned disk should be invisible. Any disk
which has a signature collision with another connected
disk, is going to have problems.

Paul

On 7/1/2015 11:22 PM, Paul wrote:
Al Drake wrote:
On 7/1/2015 5:39 PM, Paul wrote:
Al Drake wrote:
On 7/1/2015 4:40 AM, Paul wrote:
Al Drake wrote:
On 6/29/2015 8:55 PM, JT wrote:
Al Drake wrote:

On 6/28/2015 8:53 PM, JT wrote:
Al Drake wrote:

On 6/28/2015 1:41 AM, JT wrote:
Al Drake wrote:

I fear I'm probably at the end of my limited knowledge - I
leave you in the expert hands of Paul (-:. Hope I helped
clarify a few things though.

On a final attempt I tried again to restore an image with
Macrium Reflect 6 to a Crucial SSD and got the same failed
results. I plugged in a second SSD inside a USB3 docking
station and watched it try to install the drive but fail. In
front of me now I am viewing a window that reports "Device
driver software was not successfully installed". I made sure
I shut down the PSU before installing the cloned SSD and
booting. In BIOS I can see this drive along with a USB Stick
but just not within Windows. It's looking more and more like
a fresh install onto my M.2 SSD when it arrives Monday.

It may be worth trying to re-install the Chipset drivers.
They can be found at the manufacturers website.

JT

I just looked at the SSD that doesn't see the UBS devices and
used
UBS TREE VIEW http://www.uwe-sieber.de/usbtreeview_e.html

What I see are the driver locations with no indication that
anything is not working. The exact same as when I use that
application with the original SSD.

Everything looks good other than the fact that these drives don't
show and device manager shows them with the yellow explanation
mark.

I was refering to the motherboard chipset driver.
What make and model is the computer?

JT


It's a home brew Gigabyte Z97X-US5H motherboard with an i7 4790K 32
Gig of Crucial DDr3-1600.

USB drivers available he
http://www.gigabyte.com/products/pro...px?pid=4950#dl

Just choose driver and O/S version, the USB 3.0 driver is listed.

JT


Jt, I couldn't get that process to work after trying many times. At
the site I selected Rev1. I downloaded the USB driver package and
UnZipped it to a folder and in Device Manager I tried to reinstall
driver pointing to that directory but ths system found no drivers
that
were accepted. I tried again and again with nothing happening. I also
tried running a setup file which only made things worse where another
device showed up in Device Manager with no driver attached and I
couldn't get rid of it. I simply must be doing something wrong. There
are some instructions in the unpacked folder that are simple which I
followed but the System seems happy with the drivers it has and won't
accept another. I tried removing the device but that also was
unsuccessful.

Now I'm trying another clone attempt using AOMEI where it
specifically says Copy sector to sector. I'll have to try this early
in the A.M. as it looks like it's going to take several hours.

I'll post back if I have any positive luck,

Thanks.

Al - I suspect what you'll find, is of the six USB3 ports,
two of the ports work, and the other four don't behave properly.

http://i58.tinypic.com/sgitg2.gif

The Z97 presents one USB3 port, which feeds a 1:4 hub chip.
It could be that hub chip causing the problem. I would expect
the two "direct connection" ports to work, while the four ports
running off the hub, will need the OS to install a hub driver.

There doesn't seem to be a driver for the 720210 that
I can find.

HTH,
Paul

Thanks Paul. I'll study every possibility carefully. All I can add at
this point is that with the original SSD in place everything seems
fine. I can leave the same UBS3 ports attached to the same devices and
use the cloned SSD and then starts the trouble so obviously any non
working ports are showing or not showing depending.

I keep wondering if it will be easier to fresh install on a Crucial
just for a raw backup. My trouble began when I went with Samsung. I'll
try again using different ports. I'm glad I still have the system
mounted on a test case.

http://www.thinkcomputers.org/tag/pc-test-bench/

Using your USB port viewing software, you may be able to
tell the difference between the ports as you plug stuff
in now (in working state). Of the three stacks on the
back of the machine, one stack probably has the working
pair, while the other two stacks, something happens.

What I don't like about this, is how that hub is supposed
to get a driver. I could understand on an OS with built-in
USB3 support, but I don't understand what that hub would
do on an older OS (and no driver available). AFAIK, Win7
shouldn't have a driver.

Paul

OK, I'm seeing a difference from the workable OS(Macrium) and the
Crucial(USB3 problems)

Macrium
+++++++++++++++++ Device Information ++++++++++++++++++
Device Description : USB Mass Storage Device
Device ID : USB\VID_0BC2&PID_3312\NA4KB7D1
Driver KeyName : {36fc9e60-c465-11cf-8056-444553540000}\0029
(GUID_DEVCLASS_USB)
Driver : C:\Windows\system32\DRIVERS\USBSTOR.SYS
(Version: 6.1.7601.17577 Date: 2006-06-21)
Driver Inf : C:\Windows\INF\usbstor.inf
Legacy BusType : PNPBus
Class : USB
Service : USBSTOR
Enumerator : USB
Location Info : Port_#0020.Hub_#0001
Location IDs : PCIROOT(0)#PCI(1400)#USBROOT(0)#USB(20)
Container ID : {c5d05e46-5542-58be-a22e-1961f1936ef8}
Manufacturer Info : Compatible USB storage device
Capabilities : Removable, UniqueID, RawDeviceOK,
SurpriseRemovalOK
Address : 20
Problem Code : 0
Power State : D0 (supported: D0, D3, wake from D0)
Child Device 1 : Disk drive
Device ID :
USBSTOR\DISK&VEN_SEAGATE&PROD_EXPANSION_DESK&REV_0 740\NA4KB7D1&0
Class : DiskDrive
Volume :
\\?\Volume{22b7c5d8-0acd-11e4-918a-ba9c130bc9dc}\
Kernel Name : \Device\HarddiskVolume3
Mountpoint : E:\


Crucial

+++++++++++++++++ Device Information ++++++++++++++++++
Device Description : USB Mass Storage Device
Device ID : USB\VID_0BC2&PID_3312\NA4KB7D1
Driver KeyName : {36fc9e60-c465-11cf-8056-444553540000}\0029
(GUID_DEVCLASS_USB)
Driver : C:\Windows\system32\DRIVERS\USBSTOR.SYS
(Version: 6.1.7601.17577 Date: 2006-06-21)
Driver Inf : C:\Windows\INF\usbstor.inf
Legacy BusType : PNPBus
Class : USB
Service : USBSTOR
Enumerator : USB
Location Info : Port_#0020.Hub_#0001
Location IDs : PCIROOT(0)#PCI(1400)#USBROOT(0)#USB(20)
Container ID : {c5d05e46-5542-58be-a22e-1961f1936ef8}
Manufacturer Info : Compatible USB storage device
Capabilities : Removable, UniqueID, RawDeviceOK,
SurpriseRemovalOK
Address : 20
Problem Code : 0
Power State : D0 (supported: D0, D3, wake from D0)
Child Device 1 : Disk drive
Device ID :
USBSTOR\DISK&VEN_SEAGATE&PROD_EXPANSION_DESK&REV_0 740\NA4KB7D1&0
Class : DiskDrive

As you can see the Crucial shows no "Mountpoint" among other
alterations but I have no idea why.

So it's not mounting it for some reason.

Since it knows it is USBStor, it almost looks like the PHY layer
is OK. It's making the connection OK.

OK, I know what it is :-) It's a "disk identifier problem". Your
cloning method did too good a job. There are multiple identifiers.
On some identifiers, it's OK for them to be the same. For example,
I can have two partitions with label "WinXP" if I want, and they
won't clash. But there is at least one identifier, that if it is
the same, you cannot mount the disk.

You should be looking in Disk Management right now. There
is an error message waiting for you :-) If you don't know
how to get there, run "diskmgmt.msc".

http://www.howtohaven.com/system/cha...ignature.shtml

"This disk is offline because it
has a signature collision with another disk"

"diskpart...
uniqueid disk ID=[NEW SIGNATURE]"

I think I've seen that problem here, at least once.

Your original description gave the impression the port
was not operational. But the above shows the PHY (physical layer)
is fine. And only the cloned disk should be invisible. Any disk
which has a signature collision with another connected
disk, is going to have problems.

Paul

Thanks again Paul.

I just read the article and everything registers but I'll still wait
until later in the day to attempt the procedure. I seem to have the same
problem with every USB device I mount so I'll try one at a time and note
all the signatures and write them down. I just had 4 connected and
assuming I am successful in the end I can't help but wonder if I
continue to add more devices will I have to repeat the process and if
this will go on as I have another disk to connect. I have countless SSDs
sitting on a shelf so by the time I'm partly finished I should be able
to do this in my sleep. To bad there wasn't an app for that.

This being the 4th of July weekend and the 4th also being my birthday
I'll have my Party App running most of the time.

Thanks again.

Regards.

Al.

On 6/29/2015 11:28 AM, Paul wrote:

I used to be able to generate diff patch files
in the past, that instantly showed me just the few
lines that were different between files. Lots of
modern stuff pretends to do diff, but offers
crap for output.

Have you tried Kdiff?

http://kdiff3.sourceforge.net/


--
Jack
Add Life to your Days not Days to your Life.
http://jbstein.com

On 7/1/2015 11:22 PM, Paul wrote:
Al Drake wrote:
On 7/1/2015 5:39 PM, Paul wrote:
Al Drake wrote:
On 7/1/2015 4:40 AM, Paul wrote:
Al Drake wrote:
On 6/29/2015 8:55 PM, JT wrote:
Al Drake wrote:

On 6/28/2015 8:53 PM, JT wrote:
Al Drake wrote:

On 6/28/2015 1:41 AM, JT wrote:
Al Drake wrote:

I fear I'm probably at the end of my limited knowledge - I
leave you in the expert hands of Paul (-:. Hope I helped
clarify a few things though.

On a final attempt I tried again to restore an image with
Macrium Reflect 6 to a Crucial SSD and got the same failed
results. I plugged in a second SSD inside a USB3 docking
station and watched it try to install the drive but fail. In
front of me now I am viewing a window that reports "Device
driver software was not successfully installed". I made sure
I shut down the PSU before installing the cloned SSD and
booting. In BIOS I can see this drive along with a USB Stick
but just not within Windows. It's looking more and more like
a fresh install onto my M.2 SSD when it arrives Monday.

It may be worth trying to re-install the Chipset drivers.
They can be found at the manufacturers website.

JT

I just looked at the SSD that doesn't see the UBS devices and
used
UBS TREE VIEW http://www.uwe-sieber.de/usbtreeview_e.html

What I see are the driver locations with no indication that
anything is not working. The exact same as when I use that
application with the original SSD.

Everything looks good other than the fact that these drives don't
show and device manager shows them with the yellow explanation
mark.

I was refering to the motherboard chipset driver.
What make and model is the computer?

JT


It's a home brew Gigabyte Z97X-US5H motherboard with an i7 4790K 32
Gig of Crucial DDr3-1600.

USB drivers available he
http://www.gigabyte.com/products/pro...px?pid=4950#dl

Just choose driver and O/S version, the USB 3.0 driver is listed.

JT


Jt, I couldn't get that process to work after trying many times. At
the site I selected Rev1. I downloaded the USB driver package and
UnZipped it to a folder and in Device Manager I tried to reinstall
driver pointing to that directory but ths system found no drivers
that
were accepted. I tried again and again with nothing happening. I also
tried running a setup file which only made things worse where another
device showed up in Device Manager with no driver attached and I
couldn't get rid of it. I simply must be doing something wrong. There
are some instructions in the unpacked folder that are simple which I
followed but the System seems happy with the drivers it has and won't
accept another. I tried removing the device but that also was
unsuccessful.

Now I'm trying another clone attempt using AOMEI where it
specifically says Copy sector to sector. I'll have to try this early
in the A.M. as it looks like it's going to take several hours.

I'll post back if I have any positive luck,

Thanks.

Al - I suspect what you'll find, is of the six USB3 ports,
two of the ports work, and the other four don't behave properly.

http://i58.tinypic.com/sgitg2.gif

The Z97 presents one USB3 port, which feeds a 1:4 hub chip.
It could be that hub chip causing the problem. I would expect
the two "direct connection" ports to work, while the four ports
running off the hub, will need the OS to install a hub driver.

There doesn't seem to be a driver for the 720210 that
I can find.

HTH,
Paul

Thanks Paul. I'll study every possibility carefully. All I can add at
this point is that with the original SSD in place everything seems
fine. I can leave the same UBS3 ports attached to the same devices and
use the cloned SSD and then starts the trouble so obviously any non
working ports are showing or not showing depending.

I keep wondering if it will be easier to fresh install on a Crucial
just for a raw backup. My trouble began when I went with Samsung. I'll
try again using different ports. I'm glad I still have the system
mounted on a test case.

http://www.thinkcomputers.org/tag/pc-test-bench/

Using your USB port viewing software, you may be able to
tell the difference between the ports as you plug stuff
in now (in working state). Of the three stacks on the
back of the machine, one stack probably has the working
pair, while the other two stacks, something happens.

What I don't like about this, is how that hub is supposed
to get a driver. I could understand on an OS with built-in
USB3 support, but I don't understand what that hub would
do on an older OS (and no driver available). AFAIK, Win7
shouldn't have a driver.

Paul

OK, I'm seeing a difference from the workable OS(Macrium) and the
Crucial(USB3 problems)

Macrium
+++++++++++++++++ Device Information ++++++++++++++++++
Device Description : USB Mass Storage Device
Device ID : USB\VID_0BC2&PID_3312\NA4KB7D1
Driver KeyName : {36fc9e60-c465-11cf-8056-444553540000}\0029
(GUID_DEVCLASS_USB)
Driver : C:\Windows\system32\DRIVERS\USBSTOR.SYS
(Version: 6.1.7601.17577 Date: 2006-06-21)
Driver Inf : C:\Windows\INF\usbstor.inf
Legacy BusType : PNPBus
Class : USB
Service : USBSTOR
Enumerator : USB
Location Info : Port_#0020.Hub_#0001
Location IDs : PCIROOT(0)#PCI(1400)#USBROOT(0)#USB(20)
Container ID : {c5d05e46-5542-58be-a22e-1961f1936ef8}
Manufacturer Info : Compatible USB storage device
Capabilities : Removable, UniqueID, RawDeviceOK,
SurpriseRemovalOK
Address : 20
Problem Code : 0
Power State : D0 (supported: D0, D3, wake from D0)
Child Device 1 : Disk drive
Device ID :
USBSTOR\DISK&VEN_SEAGATE&PROD_EXPANSION_DESK&REV_0 740\NA4KB7D1&0
Class : DiskDrive
Volume :
\\?\Volume{22b7c5d8-0acd-11e4-918a-ba9c130bc9dc}\
Kernel Name : \Device\HarddiskVolume3
Mountpoint : E:\


Crucial

+++++++++++++++++ Device Information ++++++++++++++++++
Device Description : USB Mass Storage Device
Device ID : USB\VID_0BC2&PID_3312\NA4KB7D1
Driver KeyName : {36fc9e60-c465-11cf-8056-444553540000}\0029
(GUID_DEVCLASS_USB)
Driver : C:\Windows\system32\DRIVERS\USBSTOR.SYS
(Version: 6.1.7601.17577 Date: 2006-06-21)
Driver Inf : C:\Windows\INF\usbstor.inf
Legacy BusType : PNPBus
Class : USB
Service : USBSTOR
Enumerator : USB
Location Info : Port_#0020.Hub_#0001
Location IDs : PCIROOT(0)#PCI(1400)#USBROOT(0)#USB(20)
Container ID : {c5d05e46-5542-58be-a22e-1961f1936ef8}
Manufacturer Info : Compatible USB storage device
Capabilities : Removable, UniqueID, RawDeviceOK,
SurpriseRemovalOK
Address : 20
Problem Code : 0
Power State : D0 (supported: D0, D3, wake from D0)
Child Device 1 : Disk drive
Device ID :
USBSTOR\DISK&VEN_SEAGATE&PROD_EXPANSION_DESK&REV_0 740\NA4KB7D1&0
Class : DiskDrive

As you can see the Crucial shows no "Mountpoint" among other
alterations but I have no idea why.

So it's not mounting it for some reason.

Since it knows it is USBStor, it almost looks like the PHY layer
is OK. It's making the connection OK.

OK, I know what it is :-) It's a "disk identifier problem". Your
cloning method did too good a job. There are multiple identifiers.
On some identifiers, it's OK for them to be the same. For example,
I can have two partitions with label "WinXP" if I want, and they
won't clash. But there is at least one identifier, that if it is
the same, you cannot mount the disk.

You should be looking in Disk Management right now. There
is an error message waiting for you :-) If you don't know
how to get there, run "diskmgmt.msc".

http://www.howtohaven.com/system/cha...ignature.shtml

"This disk is offline because it
has a signature collision with another disk"

"diskpart...
uniqueid disk ID=[NEW SIGNATURE]"

I think I've seen that problem here, at least once.

Your original description gave the impression the port
was not operational. But the above shows the PHY (physical layer)
is fine. And only the cloned disk should be invisible. Any disk
which has a signature collision with another connected
disk, is going to have problems.

Paul

Paul, I just got done with the attempt to "uniqueid disk ID" but none
of the diskpart features will work unless the disks are mounted. The
unmounted USB disks are not seen so it seems I'm back to square one.

????

snip

Paul

Paul, I just got done with the attempt to "uniqueid disk ID" but none
of the diskpart features will work unless the disks are mounted. The
unmounted USB disks are not seen so it seems I'm back to square one.

????


Al Drake, if you are willing to put up with one more try at cloning the
drive, try downloading and using XXClone which can be found here;

http://www.xxclone.com/index.htm

This program will not clone the uniqueid disk ID unless you specifically
go to the Cool Tools tab and request that it do so.

I suspect that a clone using this program may just get you backups that
will show up in your system since the Disk ID's will be different.

(One note, like you I had made clones that copied the Disk ID's. I had
to use a Live Linux CD to go and change the ID's on my backup device as
XXClone normally leaves them alone. If they are identical before
running XXClone they will still be identical resulting in the problem
you are seeing.) If you still have one fresh untried backup drive try
using that for your first attempt using XXClone so you do not run into
that problem.

The alternative is to run the Disk ID changing program on one of your
already created clones but from a different PC, to that the "C" drive's
ID will be different and allow you to mount and change the ID on the
problem clone device.

I'd try the free version first and see if it meets with your needs as it
does a complete clone and blocks the incremental from working. I use
the free version for just that, entire clone backups ready to run.

The program has a few options that take getting used to like going to
the Cool Tools tab and telling it to make the clone bootable but it's
worth a try at this stage.

The manual for the program is also online at the web site if you just
wanted to read about the features.

On 7/2/2015 7:17 PM, GlowingBlueMist wrote:
snip

Paul

Paul, I just got done with the attempt to "uniqueid disk ID" but none
of the diskpart features will work unless the disks are mounted. The
unmounted USB disks are not seen so it seems I'm back to square one.

????


Al Drake, if you are willing to put up with one more try at cloning the
drive, try downloading and using XXClone which can be found here;

http://www.xxclone.com/index.htm

This program will not clone the uniqueid disk ID unless you specifically
go to the Cool Tools tab and request that it do so.

I suspect that a clone using this program may just get you backups that
will show up in your system since the Disk ID's will be different.

(One note, like you I had made clones that copied the Disk ID's. I had
to use a Live Linux CD to go and change the ID's on my backup device as
XXClone normally leaves them alone. If they are identical before
running XXClone they will still be identical resulting in the problem
you are seeing.) If you still have one fresh untried backup drive try
using that for your first attempt using XXClone so you do not run into
that problem.

The alternative is to run the Disk ID changing program on one of your
already created clones but from a different PC, to that the "C" drive's
ID will be different and allow you to mount and change the ID on the
problem clone device.

I'd try the free version first and see if it meets with your needs as it
does a complete clone and blocks the incremental from working. I use
the free version for just that, entire clone backups ready to run.

The program has a few options that take getting used to like going to
the Cool Tools tab and telling it to make the clone bootable but it's
worth a try at this stage.

The manual for the program is also online at the web site if you just
wanted to read about the features.


Thanks for this. I'm willing to try anything I haven't tried as I've
tried many cloning applications I do have many times. I don't know if
you've followed this thread from the start but I tried cloning the OS
drive connected to another computer via USB and purchased a hardware
cloning device that doesn't need a computer or software. So far I'm
getting know where. I have several systems and over a dozen SSDs of
various manufactures and have successfully cloned more times than I can
remember. All was fine with the only difference being the new Samsung
850 PRO and 2 EVO models I went with on this new build.

I'll try a new SSD this time with XXClone.

Thanks again.

Al.

Al Drake wrote:
On 7/1/2015 11:22 PM, Paul wrote:
Al Drake wrote:
On 7/1/2015 5:39 PM, Paul wrote:
Al Drake wrote:
On 7/1/2015 4:40 AM, Paul wrote:
Al Drake wrote:
On 6/29/2015 8:55 PM, JT wrote:
Al Drake wrote:

On 6/28/2015 8:53 PM, JT wrote:
Al Drake wrote:

On 6/28/2015 1:41 AM, JT wrote:
Al Drake wrote:

I fear I'm probably at the end of my limited knowledge - I
leave you in the expert hands of Paul (-:. Hope I helped
clarify a few things though.

On a final attempt I tried again to restore an image with
Macrium Reflect 6 to a Crucial SSD and got the same failed
results. I plugged in a second SSD inside a USB3 docking
station and watched it try to install the drive but fail. In
front of me now I am viewing a window that reports "Device
driver software was not successfully installed". I made sure
I shut down the PSU before installing the cloned SSD and
booting. In BIOS I can see this drive along with a USB Stick
but just not within Windows. It's looking more and more like
a fresh install onto my M.2 SSD when it arrives Monday.

It may be worth trying to re-install the Chipset drivers.
They can be found at the manufacturers website.

JT

I just looked at the SSD that doesn't see the UBS devices and
used
UBS TREE VIEW http://www.uwe-sieber.de/usbtreeview_e.html

What I see are the driver locations with no indication that
anything is not working. The exact same as when I use that
application with the original SSD.

Everything looks good other than the fact that these drives
don't
show and device manager shows them with the yellow explanation
mark.

I was refering to the motherboard chipset driver.
What make and model is the computer?

JT


It's a home brew Gigabyte Z97X-US5H motherboard with an i7
4790K 32
Gig of Crucial DDr3-1600.

USB drivers available he
http://www.gigabyte.com/products/pro...px?pid=4950#dl

Just choose driver and O/S version, the USB 3.0 driver is listed.

JT


Jt, I couldn't get that process to work after trying many times. At
the site I selected Rev1. I downloaded the USB driver package and
UnZipped it to a folder and in Device Manager I tried to reinstall
driver pointing to that directory but ths system found no drivers
that
were accepted. I tried again and again with nothing happening. I
also
tried running a setup file which only made things worse where
another
device showed up in Device Manager with no driver attached and I
couldn't get rid of it. I simply must be doing something wrong.
There
are some instructions in the unpacked folder that are simple which I
followed but the System seems happy with the drivers it has and
won't
accept another. I tried removing the device but that also was
unsuccessful.

Now I'm trying another clone attempt using AOMEI where it
specifically says Copy sector to sector. I'll have to try this early
in the A.M. as it looks like it's going to take several hours.

I'll post back if I have any positive luck,

Thanks.

Al - I suspect what you'll find, is of the six USB3 ports,
two of the ports work, and the other four don't behave properly.

http://i58.tinypic.com/sgitg2.gif

The Z97 presents one USB3 port, which feeds a 1:4 hub chip.
It could be that hub chip causing the problem. I would expect
the two "direct connection" ports to work, while the four ports
running off the hub, will need the OS to install a hub driver.

There doesn't seem to be a driver for the 720210 that
I can find.

HTH,
Paul

Thanks Paul. I'll study every possibility carefully. All I can add at
this point is that with the original SSD in place everything seems
fine. I can leave the same UBS3 ports attached to the same devices and
use the cloned SSD and then starts the trouble so obviously any non
working ports are showing or not showing depending.

I keep wondering if it will be easier to fresh install on a Crucial
just for a raw backup. My trouble began when I went with Samsung. I'll
try again using different ports. I'm glad I still have the system
mounted on a test case.

http://www.thinkcomputers.org/tag/pc-test-bench/

Using your USB port viewing software, you may be able to
tell the difference between the ports as you plug stuff
in now (in working state). Of the three stacks on the
back of the machine, one stack probably has the working
pair, while the other two stacks, something happens.

What I don't like about this, is how that hub is supposed
to get a driver. I could understand on an OS with built-in
USB3 support, but I don't understand what that hub would
do on an older OS (and no driver available). AFAIK, Win7
shouldn't have a driver.

Paul

OK, I'm seeing a difference from the workable OS(Macrium) and the
Crucial(USB3 problems)

Macrium
+++++++++++++++++ Device Information ++++++++++++++++++
Device Description : USB Mass Storage Device
Device ID : USB\VID_0BC2&PID_3312\NA4KB7D1
Driver KeyName : {36fc9e60-c465-11cf-8056-444553540000}\0029
(GUID_DEVCLASS_USB)
Driver : C:\Windows\system32\DRIVERS\USBSTOR.SYS
(Version: 6.1.7601.17577 Date: 2006-06-21)
Driver Inf : C:\Windows\INF\usbstor.inf
Legacy BusType : PNPBus
Class : USB
Service : USBSTOR
Enumerator : USB
Location Info : Port_#0020.Hub_#0001
Location IDs : PCIROOT(0)#PCI(1400)#USBROOT(0)#USB(20)
Container ID : {c5d05e46-5542-58be-a22e-1961f1936ef8}
Manufacturer Info : Compatible USB storage device
Capabilities : Removable, UniqueID, RawDeviceOK,
SurpriseRemovalOK
Address : 20
Problem Code : 0
Power State : D0 (supported: D0, D3, wake from D0)
Child Device 1 : Disk drive
Device ID :
USBSTOR\DISK&VEN_SEAGATE&PROD_EXPANSION_DESK&REV_0 740\NA4KB7D1&0
Class : DiskDrive
Volume :
\\?\Volume{22b7c5d8-0acd-11e4-918a-ba9c130bc9dc}\
Kernel Name : \Device\HarddiskVolume3
Mountpoint : E:\


Crucial

+++++++++++++++++ Device Information ++++++++++++++++++
Device Description : USB Mass Storage Device
Device ID : USB\VID_0BC2&PID_3312\NA4KB7D1
Driver KeyName : {36fc9e60-c465-11cf-8056-444553540000}\0029
(GUID_DEVCLASS_USB)
Driver : C:\Windows\system32\DRIVERS\USBSTOR.SYS
(Version: 6.1.7601.17577 Date: 2006-06-21)
Driver Inf : C:\Windows\INF\usbstor.inf
Legacy BusType : PNPBus
Class : USB
Service : USBSTOR
Enumerator : USB
Location Info : Port_#0020.Hub_#0001
Location IDs : PCIROOT(0)#PCI(1400)#USBROOT(0)#USB(20)
Container ID : {c5d05e46-5542-58be-a22e-1961f1936ef8}
Manufacturer Info : Compatible USB storage device
Capabilities : Removable, UniqueID, RawDeviceOK,
SurpriseRemovalOK
Address : 20
Problem Code : 0
Power State : D0 (supported: D0, D3, wake from D0)
Child Device 1 : Disk drive
Device ID :
USBSTOR\DISK&VEN_SEAGATE&PROD_EXPANSION_DESK&REV_0 740\NA4KB7D1&0
Class : DiskDrive

As you can see the Crucial shows no "Mountpoint" among other
alterations but I have no idea why.

So it's not mounting it for some reason.

Since it knows it is USBStor, it almost looks like the PHY layer
is OK. It's making the connection OK.

OK, I know what it is :-) It's a "disk identifier problem". Your
cloning method did too good a job. There are multiple identifiers.
On some identifiers, it's OK for them to be the same. For example,
I can have two partitions with label "WinXP" if I want, and they
won't clash. But there is at least one identifier, that if it is
the same, you cannot mount the disk.

You should be looking in Disk Management right now. There
is an error message waiting for you :-) If you don't know
how to get there, run "diskmgmt.msc".

http://www.howtohaven.com/system/cha...ignature.shtml

"This disk is offline because it
has a signature collision with another disk"

"diskpart...
uniqueid disk ID=[NEW SIGNATURE]"

I think I've seen that problem here, at least once.

Your original description gave the impression the port
was not operational. But the above shows the PHY (physical layer)
is fine. And only the cloned disk should be invisible. Any disk
which has a signature collision with another connected
disk, is going to have problems.

Paul

Paul, I just got done with the attempt to "uniqueid disk ID" but none
of the diskpart features will work unless the disks are mounted. The
unmounted USB disks are not seen so it seems I'm back to square one.

????

I hope that is not true :-)

First of all, your first step is a visit to diskmgmt.msc .
Alternatively, Control Panels : Administrative Tools, and
the Disk Management is in there somewhere.

You want to get the warning message from Disk Management, that
there is a signature collision. This is necessary to verify
that uniqueid work is required.

Now, while in Disk management, note the order of
presentation of disk drives. It is important to verify
that there is a "row" for each disk drive in question.

In Diskpart program, you "list disk" to get the disk
numbers. The order of presentation in Diskpart is
the same order as in Disk Management. I find it
comforting to compare the two programs if possible,
so I know exactly what I'm doing. (Many times, I'm
running diskpart in recovery console, where I don't
have access to Disk Management, and then I have to be
more careful.)

For example, on my current computer, Disk Management shows

Disk 0 Four partitions...
Basic

Disk 1 Four partitions...
Basic

What is important, is I know there are physically two disks
connected to the computer, and Disk Management shows two rows.
So I know they're accounted for.

Now, if I run Diskpart in a Command Prompt window (this is WinXP),
it works interactively.

diskpart

DISKPART list disk

Disk ### Status Size Free Dyn Opt
-------- ------ ---- ---- --- ---
Disk 0 Online 1863GB 879MB
Disk 1 Online 466GB 0B

DISKPART select disk 0 --- here, I'm ready for action :-)
DISKPART exit --- Exit, to quit

So the important parts, are checking how many rows you
got in Disk Management, and seeing as many items in
diskpart. Notice that both my disks are Online. In
your case, something is Offline.

Good luck,
Paul

On 7/2/2015 8:29 PM, Paul wrote:
Al Drake wrote:
On 7/1/2015 11:22 PM, Paul wrote:
Al Drake wrote:
On 7/1/2015 5:39 PM, Paul wrote:
Al Drake wrote:
On 7/1/2015 4:40 AM, Paul wrote:
Al Drake wrote:
On 6/29/2015 8:55 PM, JT wrote:
Al Drake wrote:

On 6/28/2015 8:53 PM, JT wrote:
Al Drake wrote:

On 6/28/2015 1:41 AM, JT wrote:
Al Drake wrote:

I fear I'm probably at the end of my limited knowledge - I
leave you in the expert hands of Paul (-:. Hope I helped
clarify a few things though.

On a final attempt I tried again to restore an image with
Macrium Reflect 6 to a Crucial SSD and got the same failed
results. I plugged in a second SSD inside a USB3 docking
station and watched it try to install the drive but fail. In
front of me now I am viewing a window that reports "Device
driver software was not successfully installed". I made sure
I shut down the PSU before installing the cloned SSD and
booting. In BIOS I can see this drive along with a USB Stick
but just not within Windows. It's looking more and more like
a fresh install onto my M.2 SSD when it arrives Monday.

It may be worth trying to re-install the Chipset drivers.
They can be found at the manufacturers website.

JT

I just looked at the SSD that doesn't see the UBS devices and
used
UBS TREE VIEW http://www.uwe-sieber.de/usbtreeview_e.html

What I see are the driver locations with no indication that
anything is not working. The exact same as when I use that
application with the original SSD.

Everything looks good other than the fact that these drives
don't
show and device manager shows them with the yellow explanation
mark.

I was refering to the motherboard chipset driver.
What make and model is the computer?

JT


It's a home brew Gigabyte Z97X-US5H motherboard with an i7
4790K 32
Gig of Crucial DDr3-1600.

USB drivers available he
http://www.gigabyte.com/products/pro...px?pid=4950#dl

Just choose driver and O/S version, the USB 3.0 driver is listed.

JT


Jt, I couldn't get that process to work after trying many
times. At
the site I selected Rev1. I downloaded the USB driver package and
UnZipped it to a folder and in Device Manager I tried to reinstall
driver pointing to that directory but ths system found no drivers
that
were accepted. I tried again and again with nothing happening. I
also
tried running a setup file which only made things worse where
another
device showed up in Device Manager with no driver attached and I
couldn't get rid of it. I simply must be doing something wrong.
There
are some instructions in the unpacked folder that are simple
which I
followed but the System seems happy with the drivers it has and
won't
accept another. I tried removing the device but that also was
unsuccessful.

Now I'm trying another clone attempt using AOMEI where it
specifically says Copy sector to sector. I'll have to try this
early
in the A.M. as it looks like it's going to take several hours.

I'll post back if I have any positive luck,

Thanks.

Al - I suspect what you'll find, is of the six USB3 ports,
two of the ports work, and the other four don't behave properly.

http://i58.tinypic.com/sgitg2.gif

The Z97 presents one USB3 port, which feeds a 1:4 hub chip.
It could be that hub chip causing the problem. I would expect
the two "direct connection" ports to work, while the four ports
running off the hub, will need the OS to install a hub driver.

There doesn't seem to be a driver for the 720210 that
I can find.

HTH,
Paul

Thanks Paul. I'll study every possibility carefully. All I can
add at
this point is that with the original SSD in place everything seems
fine. I can leave the same UBS3 ports attached to the same devices
and
use the cloned SSD and then starts the trouble so obviously any non
working ports are showing or not showing depending.

I keep wondering if it will be easier to fresh install on a Crucial
just for a raw backup. My trouble began when I went with Samsung.
I'll
try again using different ports. I'm glad I still have the system
mounted on a test case.

http://www.thinkcomputers.org/tag/pc-test-bench/

Using your USB port viewing software, you may be able to
tell the difference between the ports as you plug stuff
in now (in working state). Of the three stacks on the
back of the machine, one stack probably has the working
pair, while the other two stacks, something happens.

What I don't like about this, is how that hub is supposed
to get a driver. I could understand on an OS with built-in
USB3 support, but I don't understand what that hub would
do on an older OS (and no driver available). AFAIK, Win7
shouldn't have a driver.

Paul

OK, I'm seeing a difference from the workable OS(Macrium) and the
Crucial(USB3 problems)

Macrium
+++++++++++++++++ Device Information ++++++++++++++++++
Device Description : USB Mass Storage Device
Device ID : USB\VID_0BC2&PID_3312\NA4KB7D1
Driver KeyName : {36fc9e60-c465-11cf-8056-444553540000}\0029
(GUID_DEVCLASS_USB)
Driver : C:\Windows\system32\DRIVERS\USBSTOR.SYS
(Version: 6.1.7601.17577 Date: 2006-06-21)
Driver Inf : C:\Windows\INF\usbstor.inf
Legacy BusType : PNPBus
Class : USB
Service : USBSTOR
Enumerator : USB
Location Info : Port_#0020.Hub_#0001
Location IDs : PCIROOT(0)#PCI(1400)#USBROOT(0)#USB(20)
Container ID : {c5d05e46-5542-58be-a22e-1961f1936ef8}
Manufacturer Info : Compatible USB storage device
Capabilities : Removable, UniqueID, RawDeviceOK,
SurpriseRemovalOK
Address : 20
Problem Code : 0
Power State : D0 (supported: D0, D3, wake from D0)
Child Device 1 : Disk drive
Device ID :
USBSTOR\DISK&VEN_SEAGATE&PROD_EXPANSION_DESK&REV_0 740\NA4KB7D1&0
Class : DiskDrive
Volume :
\\?\Volume{22b7c5d8-0acd-11e4-918a-ba9c130bc9dc}\
Kernel Name : \Device\HarddiskVolume3
Mountpoint : E:\


Crucial

+++++++++++++++++ Device Information ++++++++++++++++++
Device Description : USB Mass Storage Device
Device ID : USB\VID_0BC2&PID_3312\NA4KB7D1
Driver KeyName : {36fc9e60-c465-11cf-8056-444553540000}\0029
(GUID_DEVCLASS_USB)
Driver : C:\Windows\system32\DRIVERS\USBSTOR.SYS
(Version: 6.1.7601.17577 Date: 2006-06-21)
Driver Inf : C:\Windows\INF\usbstor.inf
Legacy BusType : PNPBus
Class : USB
Service : USBSTOR
Enumerator : USB
Location Info : Port_#0020.Hub_#0001
Location IDs : PCIROOT(0)#PCI(1400)#USBROOT(0)#USB(20)
Container ID : {c5d05e46-5542-58be-a22e-1961f1936ef8}
Manufacturer Info : Compatible USB storage device
Capabilities : Removable, UniqueID, RawDeviceOK,
SurpriseRemovalOK
Address : 20
Problem Code : 0
Power State : D0 (supported: D0, D3, wake from D0)
Child Device 1 : Disk drive
Device ID :
USBSTOR\DISK&VEN_SEAGATE&PROD_EXPANSION_DESK&REV_0 740\NA4KB7D1&0
Class : DiskDrive

As you can see the Crucial shows no "Mountpoint" among other
alterations but I have no idea why.

So it's not mounting it for some reason.

Since it knows it is USBStor, it almost looks like the PHY layer
is OK. It's making the connection OK.

OK, I know what it is :-) It's a "disk identifier problem". Your
cloning method did too good a job. There are multiple identifiers.
On some identifiers, it's OK for them to be the same. For example,
I can have two partitions with label "WinXP" if I want, and they
won't clash. But there is at least one identifier, that if it is
the same, you cannot mount the disk.

You should be looking in Disk Management right now. There
is an error message waiting for you :-) If you don't know
how to get there, run "diskmgmt.msc".

http://www.howtohaven.com/system/cha...ignature.shtml

"This disk is offline because it
has a signature collision with another disk"

"diskpart...
uniqueid disk ID=[NEW SIGNATURE]"

I think I've seen that problem here, at least once.

Your original description gave the impression the port
was not operational. But the above shows the PHY (physical layer)
is fine. And only the cloned disk should be invisible. Any disk
which has a signature collision with another connected
disk, is going to have problems.

Paul

Paul, I just got done with the attempt to "uniqueid disk ID" but none
of the diskpart features will work unless the disks are mounted. The
unmounted USB disks are not seen so it seems I'm back to square one.

????

I hope that is not true :-)

First of all, your first step is a visit to diskmgmt.msc .
Alternatively, Control Panels : Administrative Tools, and
the Disk Management is in there somewhere.

You want to get the warning message from Disk Management, that
there is a signature collision. This is necessary to verify
that uniqueid work is required.

Now, while in Disk management, note the order of
presentation of disk drives. It is important to verify
that there is a "row" for each disk drive in question.

In Diskpart program, you "list disk" to get the disk
numbers. The order of presentation in Diskpart is
the same order as in Disk Management. I find it
comforting to compare the two programs if possible,
so I know exactly what I'm doing. (Many times, I'm
running diskpart in recovery console, where I don't
have access to Disk Management, and then I have to be
more careful.)

For example, on my current computer, Disk Management shows

Disk 0 Four partitions...
Basic

Disk 1 Four partitions...
Basic

What is important, is I know there are physically two disks
connected to the computer, and Disk Management shows two rows.
So I know they're accounted for.

Now, if I run Diskpart in a Command Prompt window (this is WinXP),
it works interactively.

diskpart

DISKPART list disk

Disk ### Status Size Free Dyn Opt
-------- ------ ---- ---- --- ---
Disk 0 Online 1863GB 879MB
Disk 1 Online 466GB 0B

DISKPART select disk 0 --- here, I'm ready for action :-)
DISKPART exit --- Exit, to quit

So the important parts, are checking how many rows you
got in Disk Management, and seeing as many items in
diskpart. Notice that both my disks are Online. In
your case, something is Offline.

Good luck,
Paul

I don't see Disk Management in the Control Panel but I get there
through Computer Management. I see only two drives. The System drive and
the M2. Drive connected to the motherboard.

When I use Diskpart I also see only those two drives. The only proof I
have the USB drives connect is on BIOS.

Al Drake wrote:

I don't see Disk Management in the Control Panel but I get there
through Computer Management. I see only two drives. The System drive and
the M2. Drive connected to the motherboard.

When I use Diskpart I also see only those two drives. The only proof I
have the USB drives connect is on BIOS.

At this point, I'm guessing it's not a UniqueID problem.

If it was a signature collision, there should be a third black
bar in Disk Management, with an offline status.

If it doesn't show up at all, that doesn't make sense with
respect to the "USBSTOR" status in your other posting.
Surely, if it shows USBSTOR, the process of discovering
the disk drive "name" should be able to go forward.

If you look in Device Manager (devmgmt.msc), do you
only see two "Drive" entries there as well ?

I don't really know at this point, what other
utility I can throw at it, that will wring more
info from the hardware.

On Linux, you can look at "dmesg" output, as a means
to gain hints about setup steps that didn't work out
so well. For example, when my "SoundBlaster" card didn't
show up, I could see a complaint about some "checksum"
being wrong. So I could then put two and two together,
as to why the card was not detected. While Windows generates
some amount of "stuff" for Event Viewer, it isn't nearly as
detailed as the Linux stuff can be.

I would focus on Device Manager for the moment, to make
more sense of this. Because, with only the two rows
in Disk Management, we're not at the point where the
OS can entertain a "collision" on signatures.

And you're right, in that I don't know of a way to
select a disk that isn't there :-(

Paul

On 7/2/2015 9:04 PM, Paul wrote:
Al Drake wrote:

I don't see Disk Management in the Control Panel but I get there
through Computer Management. I see only two drives. The System drive
and the M2. Drive connected to the motherboard.

When I use Diskpart I also see only those two drives. The only proof
I have the USB drives connect is on BIOS.

At this point, I'm guessing it's not a UniqueID problem.

If it was a signature collision, there should be a third black
bar in Disk Management, with an offline status.

If it doesn't show up at all, that doesn't make sense with
respect to the "USBSTOR" status in your other posting.
Surely, if it shows USBSTOR, the process of discovering
the disk drive "name" should be able to go forward.

If you look in Device Manager (devmgmt.msc), do you
only see two "Drive" entries there as well ?

I don't really know at this point, what other
utility I can throw at it, that will wring more
info from the hardware.

On Linux, you can look at "dmesg" output, as a means
to gain hints about setup steps that didn't work out
so well. For example, when my "SoundBlaster" card didn't
show up, I could see a complaint about some "checksum"
being wrong. So I could then put two and two together,
as to why the card was not detected. While Windows generates
some amount of "stuff" for Event Viewer, it isn't nearly as
detailed as the Linux stuff can be.

I would focus on Device Manager for the moment, to make
more sense of this. Because, with only the two rows
in Disk Management, we're not at the point where the
OS can entertain a "collision" on signatures.

And you're right, in that I don't know of a way to
select a disk that isn't there :-(

Paul

I just booted to Linux Mint and all the drives were recognized. I need
to get more familiar with that OS to do anything. I was thinking of
running a cloning application but that will take me time to find one and
figure out how to download, install and run. At the moment I am about to
use XXClone to see if that does the trick.

On 7/2/2015 7:17 PM, GlowingBlueMist wrote:
snip

Paul

Paul, I just got done with the attempt to "uniqueid disk ID" but none
of the diskpart features will work unless the disks are mounted. The
unmounted USB disks are not seen so it seems I'm back to square one.

????


Al Drake, if you are willing to put up with one more try at cloning the
drive, try downloading and using XXClone which can be found here;

http://www.xxclone.com/index.htm

This program will not clone the uniqueid disk ID unless you specifically
go to the Cool Tools tab and request that it do so.

I suspect that a clone using this program may just get you backups that
will show up in your system since the Disk ID's will be different.

(One note, like you I had made clones that copied the Disk ID's. I had
to use a Live Linux CD to go and change the ID's on my backup device as
XXClone normally leaves them alone. If they are identical before
running XXClone they will still be identical resulting in the problem
you are seeing.) If you still have one fresh untried backup drive try
using that for your first attempt using XXClone so you do not run into
that problem.

The alternative is to run the Disk ID changing program on one of your
already created clones but from a different PC, to that the "C" drive's
ID will be different and allow you to mount and change the ID on the
problem clone device.

I'd try the free version first and see if it meets with your needs as it
does a complete clone and blocks the incremental from working. I use
the free version for just that, entire clone backups ready to run.

The program has a few options that take getting used to like going to
the Cool Tools tab and telling it to make the clone bootable but it's
worth a try at this stage.

The manual for the program is also online at the web site if you just
wanted to read about the features.

OK, I tried XXClone and got the same results so now I'm thinking it
may not be an ID issue. I'm looking at a mounting problem instead. I
think the fist thing I'll do now is try to reinstall drivers from the
Gigabyte disk. Something I should have tried a long time ago.

If that doesn't work and given the fact that restoring an image was no
help I'm looking at a fresh install and won't be doing it with a
Samsung. Maybe Intel this time.

Regards.

Al

On 7/2/2015 9:04 PM, Paul wrote:
Al Drake wrote:

I don't see Disk Management in the Control Panel but I get there
through Computer Management. I see only two drives. The System drive
and the M2. Drive connected to the motherboard.

When I use Diskpart I also see only those two drives. The only proof
I have the USB drives connect is on BIOS.

At this point, I'm guessing it's not a UniqueID problem.

If it was a signature collision, there should be a third black
bar in Disk Management, with an offline status.

If it doesn't show up at all, that doesn't make sense with
respect to the "USBSTOR" status in your other posting.
Surely, if it shows USBSTOR, the process of discovering
the disk drive "name" should be able to go forward.

If you look in Device Manager (devmgmt.msc), do you
only see two "Drive" entries there as well ?

I don't really know at this point, what other
utility I can throw at it, that will wring more
info from the hardware.

On Linux, you can look at "dmesg" output, as a means
to gain hints about setup steps that didn't work out
so well. For example, when my "SoundBlaster" card didn't
show up, I could see a complaint about some "checksum"
being wrong. So I could then put two and two together,
as to why the card was not detected. While Windows generates
some amount of "stuff" for Event Viewer, it isn't nearly as
detailed as the Linux stuff can be.

I would focus on Device Manager for the moment, to make
more sense of this. Because, with only the two rows
in Disk Management, we're not at the point where the
OS can entertain a "collision" on signatures.

And you're right, in that I don't know of a way to
select a disk that isn't there :-(

Paul

The latest things I've tried.

A fresh clone using XXClone
Reinstalling the UBS3 drivers from the Gigabyte disk. No help.
Plugging in the mouse and keyboard into USB3 posts. The both work as
before.
I attached a USB2 Hub to one of the USB 2 ports and connect all my
USB3 drives.
I can see all devices in BIOS. I make sure I shut off the PSU every
time I attach anything.
I boot into Windows and see a message that my devices will work faster
if I use a faster connection.

I still see no external devices. None of my several USBs drives in
USB3 enclosures and no USB2 Sandisk Cruzer Flash Drive. (Maybe it's a
USB3, I don't remember.)

I also tried plugging the flash drive into remaining USB2 port but it
doesn't see it there either.

If I look in Device Manager I see all the non working devices show
"This device cannot start (code10)

I searched Google and YouTube but all I see are the same old methods
of uninstalling and rebooting. That has never worked in this matter.

I did see a YouTube video showing someone editing the registry but
there was no sound and the whole thing was to fast to learn from one
viewing. Now it seems I need to learn more about any registry fix
knowing I need to be very careful. Maybe I can take a good look at the
registry in the good OS on the Samsung and compare it with the defective
Crucial clone.

On 7/3/2015 5:54 AM, Al Drake wrote:
On 7/2/2015 7:17 PM, GlowingBlueMist wrote:
snip

Paul

Paul, I just got done with the attempt to "uniqueid disk ID" but none
of the diskpart features will work unless the disks are mounted. The
unmounted USB disks are not seen so it seems I'm back to square one.

????


Al Drake, if you are willing to put up with one more try at cloning the
drive, try downloading and using XXClone which can be found here;

http://www.xxclone.com/index.htm

This program will not clone the uniqueid disk ID unless you specifically
go to the Cool Tools tab and request that it do so.

I suspect that a clone using this program may just get you backups that
will show up in your system since the Disk ID's will be different.

(One note, like you I had made clones that copied the Disk ID's. I had
to use a Live Linux CD to go and change the ID's on my backup device as
XXClone normally leaves them alone. If they are identical before
running XXClone they will still be identical resulting in the problem
you are seeing.) If you still have one fresh untried backup drive try
using that for your first attempt using XXClone so you do not run into
that problem.

The alternative is to run the Disk ID changing program on one of your
already created clones but from a different PC, to that the "C" drive's
ID will be different and allow you to mount and change the ID on the
problem clone device.

I'd try the free version first and see if it meets with your needs as it
does a complete clone and blocks the incremental from working. I use
the free version for just that, entire clone backups ready to run.

The program has a few options that take getting used to like going to
the Cool Tools tab and telling it to make the clone bootable but it's
worth a try at this stage.

The manual for the program is also online at the web site if you just
wanted to read about the features.

OK, I tried XXClone and got the same results so now I'm thinking it
may not be an ID issue. I'm looking at a mounting problem instead. I
think the fist thing I'll do now is try to reinstall drivers from the
Gigabyte disk. Something I should have tried a long time ago.

If that doesn't work and given the fact that restoring an image was no
help I'm looking at a fresh install and won't be doing it with a
Samsung. Maybe Intel this time.

Regards.

Al
Did you go into the Cool Tools section of XXClone and tell it to make
the clone bootable using all three options? Reason I ask is that
XXClone makes a copy or clone but not of the boot info unless you
request it do so in the Cool Tools section.

On 7/2/2015 9:52 PM, Al Drake wrote:
On 7/2/2015 9:04 PM, Paul wrote:
Al Drake wrote:

Having another thought and wondering what would happen if I exported
and imported the entire registry from one drive to another?

If I knew more I'd know exactly what section would be better rather
than the whole thing.

???

On 7/3/2015 9:11 AM, GlowingBlueMist wrote:
On 7/3/2015 5:54 AM, Al Drake wrote:
On 7/2/2015 7:17 PM, GlowingBlueMist wrote:
snip

Paul

Paul, I just got done with the attempt to "uniqueid disk ID" but none
of the diskpart features will work unless the disks are mounted. The
unmounted USB disks are not seen so it seems I'm back to square one.

????


Al Drake, if you are willing to put up with one more try at cloning the
drive, try downloading and using XXClone which can be found here;

http://www.xxclone.com/index.htm

This program will not clone the uniqueid disk ID unless you specifically
go to the Cool Tools tab and request that it do so.

I suspect that a clone using this program may just get you backups that
will show up in your system since the Disk ID's will be different.

(One note, like you I had made clones that copied the Disk ID's. I had
to use a Live Linux CD to go and change the ID's on my backup device as
XXClone normally leaves them alone. If they are identical before
running XXClone they will still be identical resulting in the problem
you are seeing.) If you still have one fresh untried backup drive try
using that for your first attempt using XXClone so you do not run into
that problem.

The alternative is to run the Disk ID changing program on one of your
already created clones but from a different PC, to that the "C" drive's
ID will be different and allow you to mount and change the ID on the
problem clone device.

I'd try the free version first and see if it meets with your needs as it
does a complete clone and blocks the incremental from working. I use
the free version for just that, entire clone backups ready to run.

The program has a few options that take getting used to like going to
the Cool Tools tab and telling it to make the clone bootable but it's
worth a try at this stage.

The manual for the program is also online at the web site if you just
wanted to read about the features.

OK, I tried XXClone and got the same results so now I'm thinking it
may not be an ID issue. I'm looking at a mounting problem instead. I
think the fist thing I'll do now is try to reinstall drivers from the
Gigabyte disk. Something I should have tried a long time ago.

If that doesn't work and given the fact that restoring an image was no
help I'm looking at a fresh install and won't be doing it with a
Samsung. Maybe Intel this time.

Regards.

Al
Did you go into the Cool Tools section of XXClone and tell it to make
the clone bootable using all three options? Reason I ask is that
XXClone makes a copy or clone but not of the boot info unless you
request it do so in the Cool Tools section.

I did the second and other times following even though it wasn't
needed to boot on the first try.